# New Receiver Advice!



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

I am in the market for a new Receiver and looking for some advice. My current Pioneer SC25 died and need to replace it. It was a band-aid from my old B&K days. Now that the kids are older and I can "crank it up" again (not that the Pioneer was a slouch) but I am trying to maximize my old equipment with current technology.
I currently run a 5.1 set-up in a challenging room that has vaulted ceilings that opens up to the kitchen. My speaker line-up is; Sonus Faber Grand Piano front 3 (6ohm), Klipsch dipoles (8ohm), and a huge SVS pb-12 plus2 subwoofer. Using a 60"LG plasma, sony Blueray, apple tv, direct tv hd dvr, sony ps 3, and a wii. Still have a B&K AV5000 series II amp that runs 125 X 5 (and that is conservative) that should be sufficient to run my 5.1 set-up better than most on board amps at my price point. Also, if needed to power a separate zone I have an Adcom GFA 535 that should handle any of that if necessary.
Based on the equipment that I posses what recommendations are out there?
I have been somewhat swayed to either the Denon x4000 and use the B&K as the main amp and use the Denon for the Zones 2&3. Or perhaps go with a Marantz 7008 and possibly let it do everything. 
I am somewhat limited to what I can get as I have $1,000 Best Buy dollars for my failing Pioneer SC25 (replacement warranty), so it would best to go through them, naturally. I have not mentioned the Pioneers or Yamaha's because I have been persuaded that the equalization by Audyssey is superior especially the XT32 version (and I need help with Bass management with this system) and Onkyo due to the HDMI situation. I have also been persuaded away from separates due to diminishing returns. 

I have a thread on AVS forums but still in need of advice. 

Thanks


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Come on people, isn't this a recommendation forum??:foottap:


----------



## Tonto (Jun 30, 2007)

Sorry, guess I was day dreaming. Since you have the B&K (which is a great amp), there is no need to spend $ on an AVR. Instead get a pre-amp that meets your needs. We need to know what you need it to do. How many/what kind of inputs, room correction, etc. We are glad to help.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

would like it to perform well for Action type movies and of course sound decent in 2 channel. I also like to power 2 separate zones with 2 ch stereo. I like it to work with both android and Ios since we have a divided house (think I have that solved with an apple tv and recently purchased Chromecast). I also like a receiver that can do a good job sending 2 channel to all speakers for parties and working around the house. I think I have narrowed it down to an Onkyo 929, Denon x4000, Pioneer sc67, and a Yamaha yet to be determined. I would go pre-pro but have been persuaded away, and also like the Marantz 7008 along with the Denon 4250 but unwilling to got that high in price. I have been lately leaning towards anything with Audyssey XT32 as well


----------



## pddufrene (Mar 14, 2013)

moodyda said:


> would like it to perform well for Action type movies and of course sound decent in 2 channel. I also like to power 2 separate zones with 2 ch stereo. I like it to work with both android and Ios since we have a divided house (think I have that solved with an apple tv and recently purchased Chromecast). I also like a receiver that can do a good job sending 2 channel to all speakers for parties and working around the house. I think I have narrowed it down to an Onkyo 929, Denon x4000, Pioneer sc67, and a Yamaha yet to be determined. I would go pre-pro but have been persuaded away, and also like the Marantz 7008 along with the Denon 4250 but unwilling to got that high in price. I have been lately leaning towards anything with Audyssey XT32 as well


I love my Yamaha, but as you mentioned YPAO isn't on par with audyssey, even thou the sound quality on the Yamaha is excellent. As you stated I'd go with one that has XT32 all the brands you listed are good minus onkoyo, they have way to many issues. If I were you I'd just pick the receiver that has the features u really want and roll with it. You really can't go wrong, they are all good receivers.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

OK thanks. But some like that Onkyo and say that their HDMI issues are now behind them.


----------



## pddufrene (Mar 14, 2013)

moodyda said:


> OK thanks. But some like that Onkyo and say that their HDMI issues are now behind them.


Well it may be true, it's just my opinion that there sound quality just isn't as good as other receivers. But as I said that's just my opinion, the one thing good about Onkoyo is that for the price you won't find as many bells and whistles on those other receivers as theirs. Maybe if you buy one of the THX certified receivers the sound quality will be much better than the ones I've heard. Beings that THX has very high standards as to what they certify as suitable to wear their seal of approval.


----------



## Tonto (Jun 30, 2007)

XT32 in my opinion is a must. Also, not sure of your budget or if refub is an option. A4less has a solid reputation here (manufacturer repaired, option for up to 5 year warrenty).

Denon: This one will do everything you stated except I don't know about the Android.
1) http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/DENAVR3313CI/DENON-AVR-3313CI-7.2-Networking-Receiver-w/AirPlay-3D-4K-Ready/1.html#!warranties

2)Denon: Last one in stock!
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/DENAVRX4000/DENON-AVR-X4000-7.2-4K-Ultra-HD-Networking-Receiver-w/AirPlay/1.html

3) Marantz: Again a solid bargin.
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/MARSR7005/MARANTZ-SR7005-3D-Ready-7.2-Home-Theater-Networking-Receiver/1.html

4) Onkyo: 5 year total protection warranty for another $50
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/ONKTXNR709/Onkyo-TX-NR709-7.2-Channel-3-D-Ready-Network-A/V-Receiver/1.html

Yamaha does not have XT32, Pioneer has been getting some less than stellar feedback from forum members lately, seems people are getting shy of them. Again don't know if these are of interest.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

I'm confused. You say that XT32 is a must, yet you only recommend one with it of the 4 you listed. Am I missing something?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

HDMI board failures are happening with every brand of receiver out there not just Onkyo. It's caused by many different things including poor ventilation, static discharge if you unplug and plug in hdmi cables a lot and bad parts. 
The lower end pioneer models have there issues but I would not discount the higher end ones. If you can get the Onkyo 818 that is a great receiver for the money. Do you have two subs?


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

No I have only one massive sub.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Then the Onkyo 818 is the best option for you. It's got a great amplification section and a lot of very useful features including the very best video processor available, thx certification and multi EQ XT32


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Cannot get that particular Onkyo. It is unavailable now at Best Buy (shame too listed for 799). So what would be your next choice.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

The Onkyo 929


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

so you would rate the 929 better than the Denon x4000?


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Very similar specs with the Onkyo being 9.2 as opposed to Denon's 7.2.


----------



## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

The Onkyo weighs 14 pounds more than the Denon which indicates a much beefier power supply.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Yes, one of the biggest issues is the weight difference between the two receivers. The Denon weighs 27lbs, the Onkyo is 40lbs the Onkyo uses a much larger power supply meaning a much better amplification section.

Edit: Jeff you beat me to it LOL


----------



## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

tonyvdb said:


> Yes, one of the biggest issues is the weight difference between the two receivers. The Denon weighs 27lbs, the Onkyo is 40lbs the Onkyo uses a much larger power supply meaning a much better amplification section.


41 pounds according to the specs on Amazon.


----------



## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

I knew it was coming.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

I get the weight difference and that makes sense to me. But the ratings listed are what they are. Other than 7.2 vs 9.2 how do you account for that?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Ratings are very hit and miss, Onkyo has always done very well in real bench tests. Sadly many companies don't do real tests and only do the minimum requirements and that is a 1kHz test tone or two channels driven20-20,000Hz I can promise you without hesitation that the extra size of the power supply will give better results.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Also I noticed on the Amazon post that Zone 2 and 3 are not controllable other than volume when using the on board amps...ie tone control. And it was stated that the sound would come out tinny. True or user issue?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Minimal control is normal with all receiver companies on zones. Tinniness would likely be caused by poor quality speakers or bad placement. The sound sent to the other zones would be flat with no EQ I would take reviews on amazon with a grain of salt.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

OK TY


----------



## tcarcio (Jun 27, 2007)

Onkyo TX-nr809......http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...NR809-7.2-Channel-Network-A/V-Receiver/1.html


----------



## Tonto (Jun 30, 2007)

Moodyda wrote:



> I'm confused. You say that XT32 is a must, yet you only recommend one with it of the 4 you listed. Am I missing something?


All those models have XT32 (just checked the X4000, the last one sold last night). The real issue is how many & what kind of connections will you need & a budget for us to work with.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Would it matter weather I went with the Onkyo or Denon if using my B&K amp. Does the onkyo 809 have xt32?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

No, the 809 does not have xt32 still a very good receiver
I would still go with the 929 over any other receiver.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

On the Onkyo 929 when the Audyssey is set are you able to control or tweak the tone settings?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Not directly with audyssey but there are tone controls available for bass and treble for each input. The audyssey pro kit add on you can tweak all you want


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Maybe I am not understanding Audyssey. With Pioneer ican run the set-up and modify to my liking from there. Is it not like that with Audyssey. And what is an audyssey pro kit add on? And what is the cost?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Audyssey is known to be the industry recommended room EQ, once done correctly the only adjustments you can make are speaker distance, levels and crossover settings. It locks out any adjustments of EQ filters and some other things as the designers are confident you won't have any need to adjust those and understandably so as a person with no true understanding of what they are doing will mess it up and make it worse than just letting the software do it's intended job.
Pioneers room EQ is far less capable than audyssey is particularly below 63hz as they do not have any filters below that. That's where Audyssey really shines.
The pro kit mentioned is software for the PC that let's you adjust everything but is an added cost of about $300 if I remember right.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Ok got that, but what about overall system tone once the calibration is set.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

That's a open ended question that will give you lots of different opinions however xt32 is far better than anything else out there that's available in a receiver so it would be hard to dispute that the end result would be very pleasing.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Sorry not what I meant. I want to know if I can have control of some minor tone tweaks once Audyssey is in place. I am an EQ nut (Probably why I first left apple for android).


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Yes but only bass and treble nothing more. It's a separate adjustment in a different menu.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

Well then that settles it. This is the best AVR for under 1500 for me and my needs. 

Thanks


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

One last thing. Can you run bluetooth into zone 2 & 3


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

moodyda said:


> One last thing. Can you run bluetooth into zone 2 & 3


If the Bluetooth is a dedicated input then I don't see why not. But I can't be sure of that as I don't have that option on my current receivers.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

OK. New question. If you were to go above the 929 would it be best to go with the Onkyo 3010, Marantz 7008, or the Denon 4520ci?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

The Denon 4520ci would be my fist choice and the Onkyo 3010 second


----------



## bkeeler10 (Mar 26, 2008)

Since we're talking about receivers up to $1500, the Anthem MRX500 (or the newly announced MRX510) is certainly worthy of consideration. Someone mentioned that MultEQ XT32 is the best room correction available in a receiver, but there are certainly people who disagree and find Anthem's ARC system better still. The Anthems are not as feature-laden as the Japanese brands, but if it has what you need then it may be a good option. I don't own one myself, but it will be my next receiver.


----------



## moodyda (Sep 27, 2013)

I have heard that Anthem _is not very impressive_ What else


----------



## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

I think whoever told you Anthem (if you heard) was not very good, may have misled you. I have read a lot of good things about Anthem and there are a lot of happy Anthem owners. The question might be is it worth the price tag when you compare it to the Onkyo 929 and Denon 4520.

Here is a link I have coveted for a while... wishing we could come up with something like this:

AV Receiver Reviews from Sound & Vision

They have actually tested a lot of these receivers and show a lot of good information. Two of the Anthem receivers are in there too. The 300 and 700 are on page 4. Obviously reviews are not the end all of decision makers, but they can help provide a lot of useful info.

I own the Denon 4520 and like it, although I have actually been thinking about giving the Anthem receiver a shot. I have an Anthem Integrated 225 coming for our $2,500 speaker evaluation event. 

I just recently had to redo my XT32 and here is what I got after my first go around:

 

There isn't a lot of tweaking you can do there that will help that much. The low end is where you are going to notice the most significant differences and where XT32 really shines.


----------



## pddufrene (Mar 14, 2013)

Wow Sonnie that is impressive, my Yamaha won't get no where in the ballpark with those kind of readings. A buddy of mine brought his laptop and mini DSP to my house when he came down from Texas and we ran it to get measurements on my system and it looked more like av really fun roller coaster! Lol, which is not what I was hoping to see.


----------



## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

Yeah... I was able to get better results with the manual PEQ on the Yamaha 3010 than what it was giving me with the auto-eq.

XT32 is the ticket, no doubt.


----------



## pddufrene (Mar 14, 2013)

Sonnie said:


> Yeah... I was able to get better results with the manual PEQ on the Yamaha 3010 than what it was giving me with the auto-eq.
> 
> XT32 is the ticket, no doubt.


I might have to do a upgrade if I can't get this thing worked out manually. I'm gonna have to look into getting the REW program and a Mic and see what kind of damage I can do.


----------



## gregsdouglas (Feb 20, 2013)

I have had experience with the TX-NR818 and 929 receivers as well as the Yamaha RX-A3030. All three have been in my home theater and I ultimately went with the TX-NR929 as my receiver of choice. 

It seems to have everything the Yamaha has and more, with XT32 and much (much much) better menus/OSD setup. One thing to note, if the video processing is important to you - the 929 dropped the HQ Vida chip and runs solely with Qdeo. What that did for me was change the menus for noise reduction and scaling, but the biggest change I noticed was latency. 

I have a NAS server and a Popcorn Hour A-400 I use to stream my ripped Blu-rays at full lossless quality. The HQ Vida chip could NOT keep up and there was a lot of lag and issues with Lip Sync. I had to manually adjust it for almost every movie. 

With the 929 this is absolutely not an issue. I just set Lip Sync to auto and have had ZERO issues with that very annoying problem. I actually thought it was a problem with my streamer, but it ultimately proved to be an issue with the receiver's video chipset. 

As you mentioned "action movies" being important (as they are with me) I thought I would mention this as I had not ever put this concern on my radar. 

I am completely happy with the Onkyo TX-NR929 and am confident in its capabilities. Cheers.

Sent from my iPhone using HTShack


----------

