# Use 4 speakers for side surrounds???



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

Hello Everyone,

Has anyone done this and is it completely acceptable to take the side surround signal from the receiver, run it to its own 4 or 2 channel amplifier, and use 2 pairs of monopole speakers instead of one pair? I want to do this to solve the typical theater seating problem when having to rows of seats; where do I put the side surrounds? Do I put them to the side of the front row, back row, or middle? Every setup diagram always shows the side surrounds to be directly to the right or left of the listener, but this cant be done with two rows of seating. By using 2 pairs and putting them beside and above both rows seems reasonable, but maybe not. What do you guys think? Kind of how a real movie theater does it. Of course there will also be one pair of monopole rears to match.

Also, if this is acceptable, whatwould be the best way to hook them up and power them?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

It depends on how far apart the spacing is between each speaker. You will have lots of problems with cancellation if they are too close together (less than 3'). I'm not sure what you mean with "_typical theater seating problem when having to rows of seats"_as 7.1 configurations were designed for this purpose.


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

They will actually be about four feet apart. Do you think this will be very good or do you not think it is worth it?


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

They are line array surrounds. What if I had two of them closer together one one wall but aimmed the tweeters from one way and the tweeters from the other the other way. Would that sort of give me a really excellent dipole setup? The surrounds I am speaking of our the MDESIGN ones located here: http://www.mdesignlife.com/productPage.asp?pin=2233#


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

It will work as you mentioned by using an external amp to power them but you may introduce more issues than solving. Theaters can get away with this because of the shear size of the rooms and they use special processors with proper delays.

You would probably be better of using bipoles (one on each wall to give you "better" coverage.


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

So you think there will be delay problems? If you look at the way these speakers are made, it would be very easy to put two of them side by side with the tweeters pointed in different directions at the front and back row. This would solve the delay problem because it would essentially be one speaker. They also wouldnt cancel each other becasue they would be pointed different dirsctions. What do you think?


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

Any speaker experts want to give me some advice?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Yes it could be done with those speakers but in my opinion way overkill. Just buy some bipole speakers and be done with it.


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

Or this is another idea. What if I put two of these the horizontal way, end to end, say 3-4 feet above the listener's heads? So essentially it would be a long sound bar six feet long. Would I have cancellation problems or delay with that?


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

Yes but my problem is that I have the MDESIGN seven foot front towers, the MDESIGN center channel, I have MDESIGN five foot towers for the rears, and now I want to figure out what to do with the sides. Shouldn't I have them all match? I also thought of just one of these speakers per side but then the fronts and the rears are much larger, so I thought why not two per side?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Matching is very important across the front but the sides and rears not so much. Does MDESIGN not make a proper biploe or even triploe?


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

no they dont. Which setup do you think would be best. Do them adjoining in sort of a dipole setup, do them end to end horizontally, or do them vertically but 4 feet apart?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

I really dont think either way is a good option but I'm no expert in this area I PMed a fellow Shackster and hopefully he will have a better answer for you when he comes on line.


----------



## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
I agree with Tony that Movie Theaters use many pairs of Monopole Speakers placed high up on the side walls throughout the Theater. They can get away with this due to sheer scale. Also, on the whole Movie Theaters try to get things done as cheaply as possible. Not all Movie Theaters are created equal.

How big is your HT? Placing 2 pairs of Monopoles within a couple of feet in a HT might cause more harm than good. As to setting them up side to side, it might not give the Speakers the space they need to sound their best.

Unless your room is enormous, you really might want to look at Dipoles or Tripoles as THX recommends for Surround Speakers.
Cheers,
JJ


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Thanks Jack, thats what I thought. And you made me learn something. Ive always called dipoles bipoles :doh: 
I also dont think turning speakers that are designed to be vertical on there sides is a good idea either. It affects the sound from the highs.


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

Actually with MDESIGN, the center channel is the exact same speaker as the surrounds so I thnik they can be installed either way. What about installing them end to end horizontally. Would it not just act as one large speaker or am I missing something?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

We had one member do that with his mains and he seemed to get good results (have not seen him around recently) but as a general rule this is not recommended.


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

Well then I could just buy center channels instead of the surrounds if I want to mount them horizontally. I can't believe that no one has tried to use 4 speakers for the side surrounds instead of two.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Oh people have tried, with poor results. By having speakers too close that usually cancels each other out over some of the frequency range. This is why dipoles and tripoles were designed.


----------



## rf5000 (Mar 13, 2010)

What is the difference between a dipole and a tripole? Do you know of any high end ones that would match these speakers well?


----------



## chadnliz (Feb 12, 2010)

Well now your current rears are going to be sort of a waste as they will be rear surrounds and dont get that much info but you have them so use them. I would just get a speaker like a Klipsch that fires from each side at an angle and place then between the 2 rows, front row wil get sound from 2 ft behind them rear row from 2 ft in front...problem solved.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

ALmost all good speaker manufacturers make dipoles, SVS has some SSS-01 coming out very soon and for the money I doupt that you will find better. B&W, Monitor audio, Klipsh, Paradigm and many others also make good ones.


----------



## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
As to the Monopole versus Dipole or Trpole, check out this article: http://www.hometheatermag.com/bootcamp/25/#

I have always been a believer in using Dipoles for Surrounds. As is always the case, whatever sounds best to you is the best decision I suppose.
Cheers,
JJ


----------

