# new system for around 3 to 4 K



## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

I have a frien who had a Bose and he is now ready for something better.
What would you recommend for around 3 to 4 k.

room size 12X19X7.5
stickly for home theater and wants good base
receiver + 5.1 speakers
and no he does not want to build his sub


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

informel said:


> I have a frien who had a Bose and he is now ready for something better.
> What would you recommend for around 3 to 4 k.
> 
> room size 12X19X7.5
> ...


Hello,
Before going too far on this, is there any possible way your friend can purchase the gear in the US? Be it Dollars or Loonies, we can certainly help you put together something nice. That being said, it would be easier if he/she had a way to purchase it in the US.
Cheers,
J


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

yes we are close to the border


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Gotcha. I will put something together. I do not think I will be able to post links and complete it before tomorrow morning as I am about to go out. 
J


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Thanks Jungle Jack for your quick response
I also started another tread because he saw a used system for 3K containing the following

DENON AVR2808C1 110 Watts / canal x 7 --
Speakers Klipsch
2 RF62
1 CENTRE RC62
2 RS52
1 sub RW12D 825 WATT

But I beleive the amp was out in 2008 and I think the sub is not the greatest (Iknow he wants big and deep base) and would prefer him to go toward new equipment, he could probably spend more (only depend on its mood, he is well financially:spend.

I know he also listen to Martin Logan, but I told him it is not in the same price range.

Read more: what do you think of this system for 3000$ - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

I know JJ will make an excellent suggestion - in the meantime, I would check out the SVS closeout sale. I do not recall the specifics off the top of my head, but you can do a search in this forum for "SVS" and you will find a number of threads with the info.

They are really good speakers and are being offered right now at amazing prices. This would allow him to put more toward a sub - or even 2!


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

ALMFamily said:


> I know JJ will make an excellent suggestion - in the meantime, I would check out the SVS closeout sale. I do not recall the specifics off the top of my head, but you can do a search in this forum for "SVS" and you will find a number of threads with the info.
> 
> They are really good speakers and are being offered right now at amazing prices. This would allow him to put more toward a sub - or even 2!


thanks for the suggestion, I was just looking at their subs, more specifically at the PB13 ultra as I know he will wqnt a sub that would be at least equivalent tomy Velodyne DD-15, so he may have to increase the investment to at least 5K if not more


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Well, if he is open to a used sub, I was able to find my pair of PB-13 Ultras on Audiogon and got them for $2500 for the pair. Also, take a look at the new PSA offerings or the Chase subs. Dale did a review of the Chase subs a while ago and the early reviews on the PSA look promising.


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

ALMFamily said:


> Well, if he is open to a used sub, I was able to find my pair of PB-13 Ultras on Audiogon and got them for $2500 for the pair. Also, take a look at the new PSA offerings or the Chase subs. Dale did a review of the Chase subs a while ago and the early reviews on the PSA look promising.


He has no problem with used equipment, my friend is good financially but he also like a hat is whygood bargain (maybe t he good financially).

He just bought that Bose system probably because somebody told him it was the greatest and probably tought of it for .... 30 secondes.

I was he would have talked to me first, but anyway I did not say anything when he showed it to me. Somebody else must have told hime that there are better things for cheaper and now he want to change NOW.

He had that system for no more 6 months and is ready to change it :spend::spend:, but I know it is not going to hurt is wallet


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## rab-byte (Feb 1, 2011)

The Logan motion speakers with a basic amp will fall in his price range and IMO are hard to beat for clarity.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

informel said:


> Thanks Jungle Jack for your quick response
> I also started another tread because he saw a used system for 3K containing the following
> 
> DENON AVR2808C1 110 Watts / canal x 7 --
> ...


Hello,
The 2808CI is a fairly dated AVR. That being said, the x08 Series is one of my favorite Denon Series only behind their x805 Series which includes the utterly gonzo AVR-5805.

This is my speaker recommendation:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882780082
These speakers retail for $1500 a pair and are available for $600 a pair. In addition they are insanely efficient and the Denon will be able to power them to Reference Levels without breaking a sweat. I recommend using a pair for the Mains (fronts) and for Surrounds.
And here is the matching Center Channel:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882780086
It retails for $500 and is available for $300 off.

So for $1400, you would have a fantastic sounding 5 Channel array that retails for $3500. For a Subwoofer, I would go with the HSU Research VTF-3 MKIV, It sounds utterly fantastic and is available for $659. ($40 off)
Here is the link for the HSU:http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3mk4.html
The VTF-3 MKIV is so unbelievably good that your friend will be thanking you for years.

So for $2059 your friend would have an utterly brilliant 5.1 Speaker Array. So is the Denon already purchased? If not, I would go with the Denon AVR-3312CI available for $599 ($1100 MSRP) 

Grand total with the Denon would be $2658 and is honestly comparable to HT's costing up to $7000. There will be Shipping Charges for the Klipschs and the HSU, but not the Denon. Regardless, it will still come up well under $3000.
Cheers,
JJ


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## ironglen (Mar 4, 2009)

Sounds good to me. JJ offers good advice, someone may have an alternate view, but rarely, if ever finds error. Anytime I seen threads like this, it makes me wish I could go back before I built my system and take his advice!

That said, some people have mentioned a dislike to how Klipsch's tweeters sound. If the future owner could listen to a pair, that might be of help before purchasing.


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Thanks a lot JJ
Wow excellent system for the price

Only one question 
How does the VTF-3 MKIV compare to the PB13 Ultra ? (because I know he wants to be impress with the SUB.

and no he did not bought anything yet (I phoned him this morning, because I know he is like a kid when he wants somthing, "I want it now and money is no object")


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

informel said:


> Thanks a lot JJ
> Wow excellent system for the price
> 
> Only one question
> ...


My pleasure. In truth, he actually needs to act on the Klipschs as they are only On Sale for a few days. While I am a huge fan of the PB13 Ultra, it retails for $2000 and I would imagine even used it would be at least $1000 and probably closer to $1200. The VTF-3 is an amazing subwoofer for the money and honestly compares to $1500 subwoofers that are available from brick & mortar stores. The HSU and SVS are Internet Direct and are available to maximize the value as there are no middlemen and dealer network.

While I believe the PB13 to be superior for Music, I do think the VTF-3 can more than hold its own with Movies. In addition, thanks to HSU's Variable Tuning System, you can almost approximate a Sealed Enclosure while still being able to get maximum extension by removing the bungs (Port Plugs). In addition, I would personally prefer dual VTF-3's over a single PB13.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Here are some Professional Reviews for the VTF-3 MKIV
http://www.hsuresearch.com/reviews/vtf3mk4WSR.pdf
http://www.hsuresearch.com/reviews/hometheaterSound.pdf
http://www.hsuresearch.com/reviews/vtf3mk3rew.pdf
http://www.hsuresearch.com/reviews/hometheaterSound.pdf


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Jungle Jack said:


> In addition, I would personally prefer dual VTF-3's over a single PB13.


Thanks a lot for the suggestion, in fact I already told him about the benefit of 2 subs.

He is suppose to call me later today and see how it goes

Again thanks a lot


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

informel said:


> Thanks a lot for the suggestion, in fact I already told him about the benefit of 2 subs.
> 
> He is suppose to call me later today and see how it goes
> 
> Again thanks a lot


No worries amigo. Sorry I was not able to post it last night as I ended up staying out quite late.


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Jungle Jack said:


> No worries amigo. Sorry I was not able to post it last night as I ended up staying out quite late.


Don`t be sorry, you are doing a lot for this community (I see your post everywhere on this forum) and I really appreciate the fact that you are taking your time to help perfect strangers.

One more question
As the sub goes what would be the next step up (I mean for something that would really make a difference, not something a bit bettter)


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

informel said:


> Don`t be sorry, you are doing a lot for this community (I see your post everywhere on this forum) and I really appreciate the fact that you are taking your time to help perfect strangers.
> 
> One more question
> As the sub goes what would be the next step up (I mean for something that would really make a difference, not something a bit bettter)


What is being used for the display? Aside from speakers/subwoofers, the TV/Projector is the other thing I ascribe the highest importance to.


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Jungle Jack said:


> Here are some Professional Reviews for the VTF-3 MKIV
> http://www.hsuresearch.com/reviews/vtf3mk4WSR.pdf
> http://www.hsuresearch.com/reviews/hometheaterSound.pdf
> http://www.hsuresearch.com/reviews/vtf3mk3rew.pdf
> http://www.hsuresearch.com/reviews/hometheaterSound.pdf


Nice review indded


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Jungle Jack said:


> What is being used for the display? Aside from speakers/subwoofers, the TV/Projector is the other thing I ascribe the highest importance to.


He has an 85 in. TV (do not know the make and model) that he just bought, so this one stays.


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

My friend seemed to be eager to change his system ASAP, but then he decided to sell his Bose system first (kind of make sense).

He asked for advise, but then he saw a system with an Onkyo TX-NR818 with Sinclair tower 460T for the front and 260T for the back at a very good price, my friend is like that he buys stuff;then find out it does not suite his need, resell it not long after for half the price and buy another one

The TX-NR818 is very good that I know, the Sinclair look pretty good on paper, I did not listen to them (I do have the Sinclair smaller model 40B for surrounf) and there are very few reviews, does anyone have audition those high towers


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> The 2808CI is a fairly dated AVR. That being said, the x08 Series is one of my favorite Denon Series only behind their x805 Series which includes the utterly gonzo AVR-5805.
> 
> This is my speaker recommendation:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882780082
> ...


My friend sometime ask for advise, but he is not exactly a good "listener"
So he really liked my Onkyo TR-NX709 and found a really good deal on a 809 and he bought it, so this is it for the receiver

now for the speakers
I checked the price and they have not move too much in price.
But he listened to some Sinclair (company in Montreal, produce I beleive in China, that company belong to Erikson and this one is part of Jam Industries)460T for main and 250T for surround, I looked at the spec of the 460T and they are really impressive, but did not find too many review, also the center that goes with it is the 25CC and to me it does not look like a match for the 460T.

What are your thought


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

I just found that Erikson owned a lot of company like: Harman/Kardon, Infinity, JBL, Arcam, Mark Levinson, Lexicon, Cerwin Vega, Mission, ... so maybe those Sinclair speakes are worth a try?


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

While I am at it, he was told by a big store that because he has carpet, that the sub should be front firing. I does make sense to me, but I would like an advise from the experts in this forum


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

informel said:


> While I am at it, he was told by a big store that because he has carpet, that the sub should be front firing. I does make sense to me, but I would like an advise from the experts in this forum


Hello,
That is interesting about the Front Firing Carpet advice. It does make some sense, but I have never read any manufacturer every say anything like this or Professional Review for that matter.

I am not familiar with Sinclair, but if he and you like them then go for it.
Cheers,
JJ


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Jungle Jack said:


> I am not familiar with Sinclair, but if he and you like them then go for it.
> Cheers,
> JJ


I have not listen to them as I am away for work until sept 14, the 460T goes up to 40Khz because of a ribbon tweeter.
He said he was impressed, but he was also impressed with the Bose system.

The Sinclair may be good, but I am going to try to steer him toward the Klipsch because they have a solid reputation and they are so efficient that the 809 will drive them with very little power


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

Jungle Jack said:


> In addition, I would personally prefer dual VTF-3's over a single PB13.


looks like he will go over budget and buy at least one PB13 Ultra, maybe even 2:spend::hsd:. That would smooth the response but also extend the low end right?

I Also want him to stick with the Klipsch speakers that you suggest as I do not find too many review on the Sinclair and would rather play safe on this


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

informel said:


> looks like he will go over budget and buy at least one PB13 Ultra, maybe even 2:spend::hsd:. That would smooth the response but also extend the low end right?
> 
> I Also want him to stick with the Klipsch speakers that you suggest as I do not find too many review on the Sinclair and would rather play safe on this


Dual PB13 Ultras would be awesome. The Klipschs are an excellent speaker and an outstanding bargain.


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

OK 
so the receiver is bought (TX-NR809)
sub is bought PB13-ultra will see if a second one is needed or wanted.
now for the speakers, he has some cash money and want to use it so he is not going to buy online.

So he saw at FS the Klipsch RF800B, but could not find anything on the web, looks like this model is only for FS, so I told my frien that I could not recommand it because there is not info on the internet, so I saw that the RF-82 is on special, so I think those are decent speaker right?

The center channel RC-52 is also on special 199$ I beleive, but the RC-62 is not and sell for 649$ everywhere in Canada (not even a penny of diiference from different sites).

The 62 is really a better match for the 82, but I do not see much of a difference btw the RC-52 and RC-62 by looking at the spec


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

The rc-52 would work just fine but if money is no object then the 62 is what I would go with. To be completely honest the rc-64 is the top of the line but is quite a bit more expensive. It's a massive center channel and sounds amazing but probably mates better with the rf-7. Many options…


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

JBrax said:


> The rc-52 would work just fine but if money is no object then the 62 is what I would go with. To be completely honest the rc-64 is the top of the line but is quite a bit more expensive. It's a massive center channel and sounds amazing but probably mates better with the rf-7. Many options…


I saw the RC-64 and think it is a bit too much for the RF-82, I beleive it is like 1500$ in Canada


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

It's not much cheaper here but can be found from time to time in the $1000 range. If you do decide to go with the Reference series I would go with the rc-62. I have one and am quite happy with it.


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

JBrax said:


> It's not much cheaper here but can be found from time to time in the $1000 range. If you do decide to go with the Reference series I would go with the rc-62. I have one and am quite happy with it.


thanks for the info


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

My friend bought 2 Klipsch RB-61 for 330$, I think the guy at FS did a mistake:bigsmile:, good for my friend.
Those are kind of heavy and a need a good braket to attach them to the wall


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## rab-byte (Feb 1, 2011)

informel said:


> My friend bought 2 Klipsch RB-61 for 330$, I think the guy at FS did a mistake:bigsmile:, good for my friend.
> Those are kind of heavy and a need a good braket to attach them to the wall


If build a shelf for them. Don't want to have to drill into the cabinet.


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## informel (Jun 21, 2011)

rab-byte said:


> If build a shelf for them. Don't want to have to drill into the cabinet.


I would not be surprise he does that.

He already bought the shelf, did not saw them, he is a very impulsive guy, so it is not easy to have him follow recommandation.


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