# Need some input on new reciever.



## Tavek101 (Nov 7, 2010)

Hello, 1st post here. 
Currently I was looking to get a new receiver, and figure this is my best bet, was curious if anyone had it, its 7.1 but need to get some hands on info if you peeps got it. Otherwise can someone recommend a better one, (ofcourse onkyo is up there but they seem over kill for my needs)
It can be 5.1 but mostly need 1.3hdmi, and blue ray ready (dts & DB hd). The other thing that sold me to it is HDMI Standby Pass-Through. Just being able to have 2 or 3 hdmi on the reciever to tv without an audio issue is a cool feature. 

Sony STRDH810

I currently have a sony ddw 700, its great for 2 channel play on all 5 speakers but plan on putting that in the bedroom . MY current tv is Sony Bravia xbr4 42 inch hd tv, but later on planning on a 2011 model next summer. 
Oh and my current speakers are Polk RM20 5.1 speaker set using the ddw700 subwoofer, it sounds good so far in my apartment, but figure with hd and blueray, time to upgrade the living room. 
SO far my needs are 
xbox 360 (wanting to truly use the 5.1 sound)
Play blue ray using my stand alone blue ray player
And the occasional TV surround sound from cable tv.
Will a 7.1 reciever be ok or is there some feature that let sme go from 7.1 to 5.1?

Thnx.


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

I've gone from a 100wpc (2 x 100 w + 2 x 50 w... 4 channel Dolby Pro Logic)Sony receiver to a 100wpc (100 wpc x 2, 50 wpc x 7) Marantz receiver before, and I can tell you that the difference in sound quality was very audible. Where bass was once muddy, the marantz brought control. Where the mids were once tough to hear, Audessey brought clarity and detail. Where low volumes had some hiss, low volumes became clear and defined. Where sounds once came from "just left of center" and "just right of center" they now came from "left" and "right" more distinctly. Where the transition from quiet to loud back to quiet was once "quiet to loud slowly back to quiet" it now much more dynamic - more precise.

The sony was a powerful receiver. I believe it was most of that claimed 100wpc into 8 ohms. But it was ultimately lacking something. 

I'm truly a proponent of the idea that well-built amplifiers and receivers shouldn't have a different sound. This to me implies that the sony was poorly designed. Granted that was a 1990s receiver and this is a 2007 receiver, but these differences were not a placebo effect. 

Companies like Marantz, Onkyo, Denon, Pioneer, Yamaha, Emotiva - these companies make receivers more expensive than the Panasonics, Samsungs, JVCs, and Sonys of the world - but in return bring a certain focus. My advice? Shop at accessories4less or ecost and get refurbs for example. The receiver shouldn't be one of the most expensive parts of the audio picture, but it shouldn't be a bottleneck. Maybe I'm biased to some extent and I shouldn't be judging a piece I haven't heard, and maybe you don't really need much more than that, but I truly believe that "Onkyo is overkill" isn't true. "Parasound is overkill" maybe.

Anyways a great choice, but certainly not your only choice, would be this guy:

http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...ueHD-/-dts-HD-Master-Audio-AV-Receiver/1.html



> Will a 7.1 reciever be ok or is there some feature that let sme go from 7.1 to 5.1?


7.1 receiver is capable of 2.0, 2.1, 5.0, 5.1 discrete, 5.1 matrixed, 7.1 matrixed etc - it may take 15-30 minutes to setup initially but ultimately they're capable of knowing what you have and adapting to it.


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## Tavek101 (Nov 7, 2010)

Thnx for the reply, yeah I should have articulated more on the overkill part, I was trying more to say as in I don't need 5 or more hdmi inputs and more features then I need to pay for is I hardly will use em.
Everything now is just research so when I am 100% ready I will buy with confidence.
So yes mostly blue ray movies, occasional regular DVD's, and especially xbox 360.


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## taoggniklat (Mar 30, 2010)

Tavek101 said:


> Thnx for the reply, yeah I should have articulated more on the overkill part, I was trying more to say as in I don't need 5 or more hdmi inputs and more features then I need to pay for is I hardly will use em.
> Everything now is just research so when I am 100% ready I will buy with confidence.
> So yes mostly blue ray movies, occasional regular DVD's, and especially xbox 360.


What is your budget? Also don't under estimate how many HDMI you might need. (Digital Camera, Network A/V player, etc etc) More and more things are using HDMI now.

Marantz, Pioneer Elite, Onkyo, Rotel etc (depending on the models) will all be a step up in audio quality from the Sony.


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## callas01 (Oct 24, 2010)

I have a Sony now, and while its basically an entry level ES, the lower end models are something to be desired. While I am a firm believer that nothing in the sub $500 price range is very good, I would think if you shopped on www.accessories4less.com you could find a Refurb Marantz 5003 for nearly the same price and be much happier. The problem is, and its with any receiver company, is that at that price range there has to be compromises, and that usually comes in to play in the power department. Bad Power supplies, bad amps, and $13 DACs.... as long as you understand that and are ok with it, then so be it, however, a refurbed marantz would give you so much more in the long run.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Why do you think the Onkyo is more then you need, just curious.:huh:


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

The Marantz 4002 or Onkyo 706 would all do the job just fine.


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## Tavek101 (Nov 7, 2010)

Budget =$400 tops, anything more then 4 hdmi imo is too much for needs, so 4 is fine. Onkyo 706 is looking good, 



Key needs
xbox360
Blue ray standalone
Play without having to turn on receiver or worry about separate audio


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## callas01 (Oct 24, 2010)

Tavek101 said:


> Budget =$400 tops, anything more then 4 hdmi imo is too much for needs, so 4 is fine. Onkyo 706 is looking good,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...Truehd/Dts-hd-Master-Audio-Av-Receiver/1.html

best $379 you could spend on a receiver.

has exactly 3 hdmi inputs for all your needs.


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## Tavek101 (Nov 7, 2010)

best $379 you could spend on a receiver.

has exactly 3 hdmi inputs for all your needs.[/QUOTE]
Marantz Sr5003 

@= callas01
Thnx, so this is the one that can 
1- Play without the need of a separate audio (everything plays with the hdmi)
& 
2 - The receiver can be off and I can still use the xbox 360 or blue ray as if it was directly to the tv?

If so then good as gold.


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

Tavek101 said:


> 2 - The receiver can be off and I can still use the xbox 360 or blue ray as if it was directly to the tv?


No, it won't do this. But why should it need to? Turning a receiver on takes a grand total of 2 seconds.


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## Tavek101 (Nov 7, 2010)

I thought some units let you do that?
Still this receiver looks good.

A little searching I found the Marantz SR5005, this sucker looks REAL NICE!


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

Tavek101 said:


> I thought some units let you do that?
> Still this receiver looks good.
> 
> A little searching I found the Marantz SR5005, this sucker looks REAL NICE!


,,,yeah, it looks nice. But no, the AV7005 paired with an Emotiva XPR-7 is what I would say looks REAL NICE :bigsmile:

Anyways I don't believe any receiver does this.

I think what you're refering to as HDMI Pass-Through is wrong. HDMI Pass-Through is where it doesn't upscale the video with its own video processing. The Marantz can indeed pass through HDMI video without touching it.


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## ZeosPantera (Sep 12, 2009)

As much as I love Onkyo I still prefer the Denon's. Their setup just seems easier and sound quality is outstanding.
http://www.abesofmaine.com/itemB.do?item=DNAVR791&id=DNAVR791&l=FROOGLE

Denon owns Marantz interestingly enough.


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

I think the Marantz is the way to go. My motto is get the cheapest thing with pre-amp outs. Normally it will be a great receiver.


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

GranteedEV said:


> ,,,yeah, it looks nice. But no, the AV7005 paired with an Emotiva XPR-7 is what I would say looks REAL NICE :bigsmile:
> 
> Anyways I don't believe any receiver does this.
> 
> I think what you're refering to as HDMI Pass-Through is wrong. HDMI Pass-Through is where it doesn't upscale the video with its own video processing. The Marantz can indeed pass through HDMI video without touching it.


Nah I'd much prefer a Yamaha RX-v2600(best pre-pro receiver I've seen) with a stack of Yamaha P2500 pro amps. 

You'd never clip.


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## Trick McKaha (Oct 7, 2009)

I sure like the idea of limiting the cost for a new receiver to $400, but if possible getting HDMI 1.4 might be good. I know, that would be some kind of investment in the future rather than benefit right now, but if you get the choice without too much additional expense, it might pay off later if you ever do go 3D.


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## taoggniklat (Mar 30, 2010)

When I was shopping for a new AVR last spring, the major requirements I had were:

1. Must have pre-amp outputs for all channels (allows the use of external power amps)
2. Price
3. HDMI

After that it was pretty much a moot point as most AVR"s these days have similar features and quality.

I ended up with a Pioneer VSX-9040TXH (same unit as the VSX-21TXH Elite). I got it on Amazon for just over $400 and it has worked great.

For your budget range, I think the best thing for you to do is just go try the different brands out at a local store. Each brand has a different feel in the menu system, and operation. Pick the one that suites you best and meets your needs.

Marantz, Pioneer, Onkyo, Denon, Yamaha all have AVR's in your budget that will more than likely meet your needs. I have owned them all and each have their own strengths and weakness, especially at that price point.


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## ZeosPantera (Sep 12, 2009)

lsiberian said:


> My motto is get the cheapest thing with pre-amp outs.


I agree with this philosophy. Hard to accomplish at this budget. I still can't figure out why these companies don't just sell us (us crazy people) processors with no amps for less then the receivers WITH amps. There should be ~$300 ampless processors for sale somewhere, but there aren't.


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## nholmes1 (Oct 7, 2010)

Yamaha units can pass thru the last selected HDMI input while off, I know the 1065 from last years series do this as well as the A1000 above can provide that feature.


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

ZeosPantera said:


> I agree with this philosophy. Hard to accomplish at this budget. I still can't figure out why these companies don't just sell us (us crazy people) processors with no amps for less then the receivers WITH amps. There should be ~$300 ampless processors for sale somewhere, but there aren't.


Most people don't even like the concept of a receiver. Pre-pros are for the dedicated, who in turn are few and far between.

It's easy to profit off a 500 dollar receiver that cost you 300 to make, if you sell 100 of them.
Not so much to profit off a 300 dollar pre that cost you 200 to make, if you sell about 15. The only justification for even making it is if you can ramp up the price and make people want it.

With that said, though, it's nice to see Marantz bring out a pre that costs less than equivalent receiver. It could be a trend-setting move. Or backfire badly. I'd like to think it's the former.


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## ZeosPantera (Sep 12, 2009)

GranteedEV said:


> With that said, though, it's nice to see Marantz bring out a pre that costs less than equivalent receiver. It could be a trend-setting move. Or backfire badly. I'd like to think it's the former.


http://us.marantz.com/Products/2317.asp

$2600.00 is slightly more then I would be willing to dish out. I'd expect at least HDMI 1.4 and more then four of them for that money. 

The Amplifiers should be the most expensive parts of a reciever. Removing them leaves about 10 lbs of cheap circuit boards as there would be no need for heat sinks or a High cap power supply. As for the 500-300-100 Vs 300-200-15 I think your numbers are off. It's more like 500-150-8500 vs 300-75-250 which is 3million Vs 50K. You don't actually think it costs them $300 for them to put a $500 receiver together.:rofl2:


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## nholmes1 (Oct 7, 2010)

While the circuit boards and such may be cheap (in reality the chips used are not cheap, at least not as cheap as you are suggesting) there is still quite a bit licensing and program code that goes into the processing of any audio receiver or pre-amp. 

The AV8003 is technically the older pre-amp, Granteed was talking about the AV-7005 which retails for $1499 while the SR-7005 retails for $1599 which includes 7 channels of amplification.


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## callas01 (Oct 24, 2010)

GranteedEV said:


> Most people don't even like the concept of a receiver. Pre-pros are for the dedicated, who in turn are few and far between.
> 
> It's easy to profit off a 500 dollar receiver that cost you 300 to make, if you sell 100 of them.
> Not so much to profit off a 300 dollar pre that cost you 200 to make, if you sell about 15. The only justification for even making it is if you can ramp up the price and make people want it.
> ...


Most $500 receiver cost less then $300 to make...


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

ZeosPantera said:


> I agree with this philosophy. Hard to accomplish at this budget. I still can't figure out why these companies don't just sell us (us crazy people) processors with no amps for less then the receivers WITH amps. There should be ~$300 ampless processors for sale somewhere, but there aren't.


My reciever was around 230 shipped with amps and pre-amp outs, but it's crazy buggy. 

Look up the HK AVR 247 on ebay if you really want to go cheap on a pre-amp out receiver.


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

ZeosPantera said:


> http://us.marantz.com/Products/2317.asp
> 
> $2600.00 is slightly more then I would be willing to dish out. I'd expect at least HDMI 1.4 and more then four of them for that money.


The AV8003 isn't the most current pre. the AV7005 is. It costs less than the equivalent SR7005.


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## ZeosPantera (Sep 12, 2009)

GranteedEV said:


> The AV8003 isn't the most current pre. the AV7005 is. It costs less than the equivalent SR7005.


http://www.crutchfield.com/s_642AV7005/Marantz-AV7005.html?tp=181

$1,500 is now only slightly more then I would be willing to pay. The 3 figure mark is so close. Six 1.4a HDMI's is much more reasonable.


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

ZeosPantera said:


> http://www.crutchfield.com/s_642AV7005/Marantz-AV7005.html?tp=181
> 
> $1,500 is now only slightly more then I would be willing to pay. The 3 figure mark is so close. Six 1.4a HDMI's is much more reasonable.


1500 MSRP. 

Accessories4less ought to have a few b-stocks that will probably get into 3-figures eventually.


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