# Marantz AV 7702



## fbczar (Apr 2, 2010)

Does anyone own a Marantz AV 7702? Can you comment on the unit itself and the differences, especially sound quality, in the unit it replaced or those you might have considered in the selection process?


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## selden (Nov 15, 2009)

The AV7702 only just became available, so very few people have them yet.

FWIW, I have the SR7009, the equivalent receiver, which replaced an AV8003. I really didn't want to buy more amps, which is one of my reasons for not waiting for the AV7702. Besides my impatience  I had a 5.1 configuration and had been thinking about upgrading to 11.1 for a couple of years. The availability of Atmos pushed me over the edge.


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## fbczar (Apr 2, 2010)

fbczar said:


> Does anyone own a Marantz AV 7702? Can you comment on the unit itself and the differences, especially sound quality, in the unit it replaced or those you might have considered in the selection process?


How does it sound? Can you compare it to another receiver or processor?


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## selden (Nov 15, 2009)

fbczar said:


> How does it sound? Can you compare it to another receiver or processor?


I'm not sure I can give you the answer you want: I have found that roomEQ produces a better result in my room than unmodified sound does.

The SR7009 sounds significantly better to me than the AV8003 did, primarily because it has Audyssey MultEQ XT32. The AV8003 had only MultEQ. Using the new Dolby Surround upmixer and the overhead speakers add substantially to the experience, too, both for movies and CDs. 

I'm not a purist and do not insist on listening to 2 channel audio with just the front speakers. That experience seems just too "flat" to me when compared to the envelopment that the new upmixer provides. In particular, I've compared the Elektra CD of _Powaqqatsi_ with Criterion's 5.1 Blu-ray. I discovered that I enjoyed the upmixed CD sound to either the straight 5.1 or even the upmixed 5.1. In other words, I don't entirely agree with the way the revised mixing was done. The differences didn't seem major, but they were there.


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## fbczar (Apr 2, 2010)

selden said:


> I'm not sure I can give you the answer you want: I have found that roomEQ produces a better result in my room than unmodified sound does.
> 
> The SR7009 sounds significantly better to me than the AV8003 did, primarily because it has Audyssey MultEQ XT32. The AV8003 had only MultEQ. Using the new Dolby Surround upmixer and the overhead speakers add substantially to the experience, too, both for movies and CDs.
> 
> I'm not a purist and do not insist on listening to 2 channel audio with just the front speakers. That experience seems just too "flat" to me when compared to the envelopment that the new upmixer provides. In particular, I've compared the Elektra CD of _Powaqqatsi_ with Criterion's 5.1 Blu-ray. I discovered that I enjoyed the upmixed CD sound to either the straight 5.1 or even the upmixed 5.1. In other words, I don't entirely agree with the way the revised mixing was done. The differences didn't seem major, but they were there.


Selden, Thanks for the comments. I have been told that the basic sound quality of the AV7702 is actually an improvement over the AV 8801. If so, I must be a very fine processor. Your comments on up mixing are very helpful. When you bought the AV7702 did you give any consideration to waiting until DTS-UHD? Technology seems to be in a big transition. any advice?


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## selden (Nov 15, 2009)

Don't forget I have the AVR version, SR7009, not the AV7702. I decided I didn't want to add more external amps to what I already have. (For details, you can click on the "My System" dropdown to the left of this post.) I also was impatient and didn't want to wait another month. 

I didn't see any reason to wait for DTS UHD (or whatever they decide to call it). My understanding is that D+M very likely will be providing a firmware upgrade to add DTS UHD to all of their Atmos-capapable equipment, similar to how they're providing an upgrade to add Auro3D in December. Rumors suggest that DTS UHD won't be finalized for another year, though.


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## fbczar (Apr 2, 2010)

selden said:


> Don't forget I have the AVR version, SR7009, not the AV7702. I decided I didn't want to add more external amps to what I already have. (For details, you can click on the "My System" dropdown to the left of this post.) I also was impatient and didn't want to wait another month.
> 
> I didn't see any reason to wait for DTS UHD (or whatever they decide to call it). My understanding is that D+M very likely will be providing a firmware upgrade to add DTS UHD to all of their Atmos-capapable equipment, similar to how they're providing an upgrade to add Auro3D in December. Rumors suggest that DTS UHD won't be finalized for another year, though.


Selden, I am no expert on DTS-UHD. I hope you are correct about a firmware update being possible. However, I read that it was first shown as part of a new cirrus logic chip. The only other concern I have about the AV7702 is HDCP 2.2 copy protection. Of course, the sound quality is the big thing.


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## selden (Nov 15, 2009)

The Cirrus chip was just their initial demo, almost a year ago. My understanding is that firmware for it will be available from all of the DSP manufacturers, including Analog Devices (what D+M uses) and TI (what Onkyo, Pioneer and Yamaha are using).

Supposedly HDMI chipsets which support HDCP v2.2 at 18GHz won't be available until late spring, 2015, too late for this year's equipment. There are rumors that the AV8802 (expected to ship in the spring, so just a little too early) *might* get a board-swap upgrade, but I think that's very unlikely. Traditionally D+M only update their pre/pros every two years, so I wouldn't expect the AV7703 & AV8803 to be available with it until winter 2016/2017. The 4K-capable AVRs that'll be available in late 2015 will be sure to have the upgraded HDMI chipsets, though.


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## fbczar (Apr 2, 2010)

selden said:


> The Cirrus chip was just their initial demo, almost a year ago. My understanding is that firmware for it will be available from all of the DSP manufacturers, including Analog Devices (what D+M uses) and TI (what Onkyo, Pioneer and Yamaha are using).
> 
> Supposedly HDMI chipsets which support HDCP v2.2 at 18GHz won't be available until late spring, 2015, too late for this year's equipment. There are rumors that the AV8802 (expected to ship in the spring, so just a little too early) *might* get a board-swap upgrade, but I think that's very unlikely. Traditionally D+M only update their pre/pros every two years, so I wouldn't expect the AV7703 & AV8803 to be available with it until winter 2016/2017. The 4K-capable AVRs that'll be available in late 2015 will be sure to have the upgraded HDMI chipsets, though.


Please correct me if I am wrong. If I buy the AV7702 their is a reasonable likelihood that DTS-UHD will be available by firmware, but HDCP 2.2 will never be available for the present AV7702. Therefore, if I upgraded to a 4K projector I would need to buy a new processor, to replace the AV7702 or somehow connect the projector directly to a new 4K capable BluRay player because the AV7702 would not be capable of passing thru or processing an HDCP 2.2 copy protected BluRay. Right?


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## selden (Nov 15, 2009)

That's my understanding. 

It is expected that there will be 4K players available with dual HDMI outputs, though: one for video which requires HDCP v2.2 and one for audio, which doesn't. I.e. one output could be connected directly to a projector or TV for video and the other to an AVR or pre/pro for audio.


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## fbczar (Apr 2, 2010)

selden said:


> That's my understanding.
> 
> It is expected that there will be 4K players available with dual HDMI outputs, though: one for video which requires HDCP v2.2 and one for audio, which doesn't. I.e. one output could be connected directly to a projector or TV for video and the other to an AVR or pre/pro for audio.


Well Oppo already has two HDMI outputs on their 103D and 105D so it is a good bet a 4K Oppo player would have two as well, I suppose. In such a case the processor controls the Audio and the video simply comes on when you turn on the projector. Looks like the only concern is HDCP 2.2, but if you were using a 4K Oppo player with HDCP 2.2 and two HDMI outputs the processor having HDCP 2.2 would not matter, right? 

Of course there is still the need for a DTS-UHD upgrade. Oh, one other thing is the USB 2.0 on your receiver fully 2.0 compliant?


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## selden (Nov 15, 2009)

fbczar said:


> Well Oppo already has two HDMI outputs on their 103D and 105D so it is a good bet a 4K Oppo player would have two as well, I suppose. In such a case the processor controls the Audio and the video simply comes on when you turn on the projector. Looks like the only concern is HDCP 2.2, but if you were using a 4K Oppo player with HDCP 2.2 and two HDMI outputs the processor having HDCP 2.2 would not matter, right?


Right.



> Of course there is still the need for a DTS-UHD upgrade. Oh, one other thing is the USB 2.0 on your receiver fully 2.0 compliant?


 I dunno. What feature(s) were you wondering about? 

I've been able to play stereo DSD files off a USB V2 thumb drive, for what that's worth, although that's irrelevant to the actual USB version.


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## fbczar (Apr 2, 2010)

selden said:


> Right.
> 
> I dunno. What feature(s) were you wondering about?
> 
> I've been able to play stereo DSD files off a USB V2 thumb drive, for what that's worth, although that's irrelevant to the actual USB version.


Sorry, I meant to say HDMI 2.0 instead of USB 2.0. I understand that the full HDMI 2.0 specification calls for 18Gbs in Bandwidth, which is the necessary bandwidth for 4K, 60Hz. Of course it may not matter since full 4K, 60Hz will likely only work with HDCP 2.2 in place. Basically no receiver/processor in existence today has HDMI and HDCP so to do 4K, 60Hz in the future will require the two HDMI work around you mentioned.


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## selden (Nov 15, 2009)

fbczar said:


> Sorry, I meant to say HDMI 2.0 instead of USB 2.0. I understand that the full HDMI 2.0 specification calls for 18Gbs in Bandwidth, which is the necessary bandwidth for 4K, 60Hz. Of course it may not matter since full 4K, 60Hz will likely only work with HDCP 2.2 in place. Basically no receiver/processor in existence today has HDMI and HDCP so to do 4K, 60Hz in the future will require the two HDMI work around you mentioned.


 Right. We'll have to wait until next summer for the full bandwidth HDCP implementation. 

FWIW, you need to be careful not to confuse "HDMI V2.0" with 4K support. The 4K video specs are only a small part of HDMI v2.0. It includes many other features, most of which are optional and not required. For example, I don't know of any implementation which supports 32 audio channels yet.


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