# Parasound or emotiva



## Slyder01

I've been looking at amps for about a month now and i narrowed it down to either the parasound 5250 or the emotiva xpa-5. Is there really much difference between the two besides price and wattage.
I might wait for an xpr-7 if it's worth it
Thanks

My system
Yamaha rxa 2000
polk csi5 center
polk rt16 mains
polk fxia5 surrounds
paradigm micro pro rear backs
onkyo front presence (for now)
PSW 450 front sub
DSR micro pro 2000 rear sub


----------



## taoggniklat

Parasound makes some wonderful products and I think Emotiva's best (ie best value) products are their amplifiers. Either one should work just fine for your system, but personally I would choose the Emotiva if only for the price savings. The difference in sound between the two brands will be minimal.


----------



## GranteedEV

taoggniklat said:


> Parasound makes some wonderful products and I think Emotiva's best (ie best value) products are their amplifiers. Either one should work just fine for your system, but personally I would choose the Emotiva if only for the price savings. The difference in sound between the two brands will be minimal.


I essentially agree with this, however some of Emotiva's multichannel amps do have a bit more crosstalk than the parasound stuff.

The XPR-7 on the other hand will use separate modular approach like the old emotiva amps (MPS-1, MPS-2 and IPS-1) and thus will not suffer from the same crosstalk. Of course its price is around $2500 !

Which mind you is still cheaper than the next best thing, the ATI 3007 B-Stock which would run $2800 and $5000 retail.


----------



## Jungle Jack

Hello,
I would go with the Parasound provided the additional expense does not cause any impact on other aspects of your HT.
Cheers,
JJ


----------



## ojojunkie

It's a tough choice between 2 fine gears. I haven't heard either of the two so I will leave it to your personal choice that fits to your pocket and ears. If possible to take time to audition them and other names around your area.


----------



## Guest

I can't way what is better then the other, but both seem to have a 5 year warranty. The main difference is, Parasound has retailers and Emotiva is direct. I guess it would come down too, is Parasound that much better? I'm sure Emotiva isn't the best of the best, but per dollar, is an upgrade really worth any small gains that would come from it?

I don't have any Emotiva amps, just the pre-amp and 12" sub. I guess its each to their own, but I'm at a point were I feel it would be silly to spend more, or attempt to upgrade. The gains at some point are so small, its just not worth it. For me anyway. To each their own...

I can safely say that Emotiva's customer support is by far the best I've ever experienced. That along with their prices, warranties, and quality equipment have got me hooked.


----------



## Slyder01

Thanks for the responses guys, much appreciated.
I did get to hear the parasound hooked up to a sony es avr running focal speakers and i did like the sound, but it's not my system. I have to do some research to see if anyone is in my area running an emotiva. I've been on the emo forums and there is all good reviews on there amps and the people have do have them love them. And yes i'v read many times over about their customer support and how great it is. The money i save with a emo i could put elsewhere.

The reason i'm looking into another amp is the cleaner sound at higher volumes. Don't get me wrong, i think my system sound awesome now, especially since i upgraded from the yammy rxv630 to the rxa 2000,,, but I believe my center would sound much better with an external.

I believe i'm catching that bug... some call it the GAS, the WAF,, or any other letters that could be put together meaning a crazed audiophile! lol


----------



## Jungle Jack

Hello, 
As would be expected, on Emotiva's Website, any true dissent will not be on there for long. That being said, Emotiva makes excellent Amplifiers. I am particularly fond of the XPA-1 and XPA-2.

In truth, most Parasound Products are a good bit more expensive. While some of this added cost is from them not being Internet Direct, some of it is them using larger Power Transformers and Capacitor Banks. Moreover, the Halo line was Designed by John Curl who truly is a legendary Designer.

However, just to give a comparison, for a few hundred dollars more than an XPA-5 it is usually possible to find a used HCA-2205a or 2205AT. The HCA Series is pretty much what the current Halo Series is and almost all of the Amplifiers were Designed by John Curl.

The XPA-5 uses a 1.2 kVA Toroidal Transformer and 60,000uf of total Capacitance. In comparison, the 2205 uses a 2.0 kVA Toroidal Transformer and 150,000uf of Capacitance. It must be pointed out that the 2205a originally retailed for 2500 Dollars and the AT for 2000 Dollars. However, the used prices are pretty close to an XPA-5.

Even more interesting is that the 2205 is unbelievably close in Design to the 4500 Dollar Halo A51. The A51 uses a 2.2 kVA Transformer and 164,000uf of Capacitance. Also the A51 offers XLR Connectors and to many more attractive Industrial Design. However, internally they are kissing cousins.

While some have concern about purchasing used Amplifiers, I have had my 2205 for almost a decade and the 3500 for around 8 years and both have been on 24/7 with no issues to speak of. (I literally knocked on wood while typing that)
Cheers,
JJ


----------



## bambino

I was going to point out that the Tranformer and the Capacitance have a great deal to do with how strongly an amp will perform. That being said i have no experiance with any other brand then Emotiva and have found that they are some true performers especially at there price point and there customer service is also second to none as i have dealt with them a few times and they are always more then helpful.


----------



## gdstupak

GranteedEV said:


> Which mind you is still cheaper than the next best thing, the ATI 3007 B-Stock which would run $2800 and $5000 retail.


I have and recommend the ATI AT1506. 6ch amp that I use bridged into 3ch.
Bought it app. 7yrs ago and still running great. Use/abuse it every day, 7 days a week, the only time that it's not on is when I'm sleeping or not home.
It was about $1200.

I don't know how it compares to the Emotiva or Parasound, maybe it's not even in the same league. Just a suggestion.


----------



## GranteedEV

gdstupak said:


> I have and recommend the ATI AT1506. 6ch amp that I use bridged into 3ch.
> Bought it app. 7yrs ago and still running great. Use/abuse it every day, 7 days a week, the only time that it's not on is when I'm sleeping or not home.
> It was about $1200.
> 
> I don't know how it compares to the Emotiva or Parasound, maybe it's not even in the same league. Just a suggestion.


As good as either. Any differences would again be miniscule assuming we're talking about the same general wattage ratings. The only thing that really makes it inferior to the XPR-7 IS the wattage ratings...

The XPR-7 for reference will be 7 x 400w into 8 ohms and ~650w into 4 ohms... ALL CHANNELS DRIVEN O_O;

To get that kind of insane wattage you would of course need a lot of current on tap from the house line... preferably a 220V 30a line (the kind used with electric stoves and washing machines)
The ATI 3007 however is rated at something like 300w/450w respectively. It's essentially the same amplifier as the $3500 Outlaw 7900 (ATI OEMs for Outlaw).

You can purchase a B-Stock 3007 right here:
http://classicaudioparts.com/store/ATI-AT3007-Seven-Channel-x-300-Watt-Amplifier-B-Stock-120V.html
with full warranty and made in North America unlike the made in china Emotivas.


IMO 450w into 4 ohms is more than any sane person will need in-home, and for all seven channels it's absolutely amazing and should drive even the most brutal loads. The XPR-7, like the XPA-1, is the definition of overkill... and we love it 

My personal choice for amplification though?
DIY Hypex UCD700 x 3 + UCD400 x 4 - It's class D so it's a bit more efficient than even these Class H designs are. And it's DIY so you have a bit more control over whatever you like. I would probably put the rear four channels on a single toroidal transformer and power supply, and have the front three be invidual Monoblocks (using the same chassis that Seymour AV does for his very pretty ICE Power amps)


----------



## Slyder01

I am skeptical on used equipment, especially things having to do with electronics, but i do understand if someone has that much money invested in an amp they are going to take care of, especially a hobby enthusiast.. This is going to be my first time buying an external amp so these inputs are very appreciated.

Heres a question, I know there's a lot of talk about wattage and what it means and the difference in power from cheaper to better quality. My yammy rxa2000 has 130 watts, now would the parasound or emo at equivalant wattage produce the same sound level or would it be more powerful. I dont know the specs of the yammy but i believe it has good amps in it.


----------



## GranteedEV

Slyder01 said:


> I am skeptical on used equipment, especially things having to do with electronics, but i do understand if someone has that much money invested in an amp they are going to take care of, especially a hobby enthusiast.. This is going to be my first time buying an external amp so these inputs are very appreciated.
> 
> Heres a question, I know there's a lot of talk about wattage and what it means and the difference in power from cheaper to better quality. My yammy rxa2000 has 130 watts, now would the parasound or emo at equivalant wattage produce the same sound level or would it be more powerful. I dont know the specs of the yammy but i believe it has good amps in it.


Yamaha's current generation of amps looks great. Audioholics raved about the RX-A3000's amps and made it seem better than the UPA-7 into 2 channels (Although the UPA-7 won very easily in all channels driven).

In my opinion, you're only ever improving upon an amplifier if you've effectively

1) Gone from an amp that can't handler lower impedances to one that can
2) Doubled up on wattage

so on that note I don't think the Emotiva or Parasound equivalent would give you much "audible" improvement although having an external amp does take a load off of your receiver and let them power the surrounds. The right choice for you may be simply to get three Emotiva UPA-1 or Outlaw 2200 Monoblocks, and take advantage of the quality amps on your yamaha to really drive your surround speakers.


----------



## Slyder01

thanks,, originally i was going to get the xpa-3 to p0wer my front 3 when they had the holiday special, but some said i would have room to grow with the xpa-5. Maybe i sould have just gotten the xpa3 since it was a of a deal at 529.00 with free shipping


----------



## bambino

Slyder01 said:


> thanks,, originally i was going to get the xpa-3 to p0wer my front 3 when they had the holiday special, but some said i would have room to grow with the xpa-5. Maybe i sould have just gotten the xpa3 since it was a of a deal at 529.00 with free shipping


Still not too bad of a deal but when looking at the XPA-3 compared to something with better power (even used) then you may find a better deal on a different brand especially now that Emotiva's prices have gone up.


----------



## q2bon2b

You could get the Emotiva amp first, try it out to see if you like it. Call Emo to see if they have B-stocks. Could save you some bucks while still having luxury of the 5-year warranty. I had a b-stock XPA-5 which arrived indistinguishable from a brand new one.

And you may well catch the ubiquitous upgrade bug like many of us poor inflicted HT and AV souls. Then you could upgrade to a pricier amp, either Emo, Parasound, ATI, Aragon or others. 

Personally, I have no qualms about buying used amps, especially those from reputable manufacturers. Bought a few used amps myself and they all do fine for me.

Good lucks and enjoy the amp arrives at your abode.


----------



## q2bon2b

GranteedEV said:


> You can purchase a B-Stock 3007 right here:
> http://classicaudioparts.com/store/ATI-AT3007-Seven-Channel-x-300-Watt-Amplifier-B-Stock-120V.html
> with full warranty


GranteedEV,

Thanks for the useful info on ATI B-stock and the link. Another good future source for quality amp at B-stocks price. Now my interest is perked on a few of their other B-stock offerings.:T

Just wondering, anyone knows generally what is the mark-down from MSRP, if any, for the street price for A-stock ATI amps? Just curious to determine how attractive the B-stock pricing is.


----------



## Jungle Jack

Hello,
I am a big fan of ATI Amplifiers and it is a wonderful thing to have a Warranty. That would be an excellent choice as well.
Cheers,
JJ


----------



## GranteedEV

q2bon2b said:


> Just wondering, anyone knows generally what is the mark-down from MSRP, if any, for the street price for A-stock ATI amps? Just curious to determine how attractive the B-stock pricing is.


original MSRPs are shown, crossed out, on the Classic Audio Parts website, right above the B-Stock price.

The only caveat is that an MSRP is not the same thing as a street price and to keep that in mind.


----------



## q2bon2b

GranteedEV said:


> original MSRPs are shown, crossed out, on the Classic Audio Parts website, right above the B-Stock price.
> 
> The only caveat is that an MSRP is not the same thing as a street price and to keep that in mind.


Yes, I saw that. I was asking what is the usual discount from MSRP, if any, for street prices on ATI *A-stock *amps. Just wanted to do a price comparison between A-stock and B-stock first before deciding.


----------



## bambino

From some reading i was doing on the Emotiva Forum last night there price differance isn't that significant from B-stock to A-stock but that could be different from company to company.


----------



## q2bon2b

bambino said:


> From some reading i was doing on the Emotiva Forum last night there price differance isn't that significant from B-stock to A-stock but that could be different from company to company.


Last year I bought a B-stock Emotiva XPA-5 at $100 discount to MSRP, which was similar to their Thanksgiving sales discount. The B-stock amp I received was mint, smell mint and not one scratch. I was a happy camper.

The ATI B-stock discounts, from that available on Classic Auto Parts website, seem more substantial. Now that's I like a lot.


----------



## Slyder01

i'm not to keen on used or refurbished equipment as it seems i dont have luck with it. I like knowing i have a warranty, nothing worse than buying something new and then turning around and dumping money into if it breaks 6 months later.


----------



## GranteedEV

Slyder01 said:


> i'm not to keen on used or refurbished equipment as it seems i dont have luck with it. I like knowing i have a warranty, nothing worse than buying something new and then turning around and dumping money into if it breaks 6 months later.


I dunno about Emotiva but the ATI B-Stock being discussed has a full 7 year warranty just like a brand new product. It might have a scratch or dent but it will be fully covered. And since it's made in america, Canadians like myself don't pay duty, whereas something like the Emotiva would be made in China and subject to duties.


----------



## Slyder01

something like that i wouldnt have a problem with. I bought a open box tv from circuit city yrs ago, it came with a warranty like that. Is "B" stock something that someone owned or could it be that it got damaged a bit during shipping.


----------



## GranteedEV

Slyder01 said:


> something like that i wouldnt have a problem with. I bought a open box tv from circuit city yrs ago, it came with a warranty like that. Is "B" stock something that someone owned or could it be that it got damaged a bit during shipping.


Dunno, B-stock could be various things.

-It could just be a scratch and dent that didn't pass quality control but was otherwise functional.
-It could be factory refurbished
-It could be a demo unit that was returned to the factory for whatever reason
-It could be a customer 30-day type return / open box
-It could have been damaged during shipping like you suggested
-It _could_ even be perfectly brand new. Remember that Classic Audio Parts sells online and what appears to be manufacturer direct, so there's no dealer markup. To justify selling it at such a deep discount they might just have to _label_ it as B-stock to keep the regular dealers happy (as ATI is a dealer-distributed brand). We've seen in the past that some B&M speaker companies have made separate internet direct brands to keep their dealers satisfied and protected (RBH forming EMP, Boston Acoustics forming The Speaker Company to name two). 

Sometimes you will never figure out "what could have been wrong"


----------



## Slyder01

thanks for clarifying that. I see a lot of people talking B stock but wasnt sure exactly what it entailed. Either way it sounds like the equipment is fairly new


----------

