# xs15se or xv15se? for a 2400 cf room



## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

Hi, If you have to choose one of these subwoofer for a 2400 cf dedicated room what would be your choice? 90%movies usually at - 10db from reference. Thanks.


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## bkeeler10 (Mar 26, 2008)

If you're getting a single sub, and you're mostly movies, I would go with the ported sub. You'll get more output (especially in the 16-25 Hz range, according to the specs on the website). Though you may not be able to dig as deep.

Now, if you were going with multiples I might be changing my mind. At two subs, I'm not sure which way I'd go. However, at four subs I'd go with the sealed units in that room and I bet it would be awesome! You wouldn't have an output problem and you'd be digging a little lower in frequency.

Keep in mind that I haven't heard either one of these subs.


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## Blacklightning (Nov 22, 2011)

jonapv said:


> 90%movies usually at - 10db from reference. Thanks.


Ported... I don't see any reason to go sealed.


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## RTS100x5 (Sep 12, 2009)

lddude:Just FYI on the subject of dual subs - at parts express that $800 will get you 2 x Ultimax 15's and a Crown 1500w amp to drive them - + $100 worth of MDF add a few hours of blood, sweat and paint - you've got 2 KILLER 15in subs ....

You could also go with the Behringer NU3000DSP iNUKE 3000 @ $100 less than the Crown XLS 1500 .....


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## chas (Jan 28, 2007)

Here's an interview with Tom Vodhanel in which he discusses ported vs sealed for various sized rooms:

http://www.soundandvision.com/content/tom-vodhanel-president-power-sound-audio


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

chas said:


> Here's an interview with Tom Vodhanel in which he discusses ported vs sealed for various sized rooms:
> 
> 
> 
> That's was a great reading thanks...


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

Thanks to all, I ended up buying the xs15se.


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## chas (Jan 28, 2007)

jonapv said:


> Thanks to all, I ended up buying the xs15se.


Here at HTS theJman sure gave it a great review...let us know what you think of yours.


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

Sure I will, but I am from Costa Rica so it will take a few days to get the subwoofer down here.


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

I just received my subwoofer xs15se I can't wait to test it tonight...


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

I am having a hard time set it up, I didnt notice the night/day difference that everybody is talking about, I am in contact with Tom from PSA to help me figure whats is wrong, I will post my comments after the sub is at it best.


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## Blacklightning (Nov 22, 2011)

Night and day difference compared to what?


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

Polk psw505 but I didn't notice it.


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## jamesfrazier (Jul 24, 2011)

jonapv said:


> Polk psw505 but I didn't notice it.


There should definitely be a night and day difference there. Hope you get it figured out..


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## Blacklightning (Nov 22, 2011)

The only thing I can think of is that maybe it's your room that is the limiting factor.

Do you have an SPL meter or test software?


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## jreb14 (Feb 18, 2015)

I have the xv-15 in room of that size and it can shake the whole house. The sub is powerful and tight. The Polk is not near as tight or articulate. I think there is something wrong in the setup. Try to unhook RCA on Polk and hook the PSA into the same connection and do an A/B comparison with 2 subs switching the cable between the 2 subs. The 15" woofer will move a ton more air and the growl is not a boom but more life like. It will tickle your fancy for bass if it is properly connected and configured.


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

I did the a/b test and the xs is lacking in the mid and upper bass. It goes deeper for sure but something is not right. During a concert with both subs running if you turn off the xs nothing happens but if turn off the polk you notice right away that something is missing.


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

Here is a frequency response from rew with audessey on and off from the main listening position


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

I would like to change it for an xv15se but Tom V thinks that is not going to help.


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## Blacklightning (Nov 22, 2011)

And what does the graph with the Polk look like? I also do not think the v model will do much. I have a feeling that the polk level was a lot higher to compensate for the lack of low bass so the mid and high bass was a lot higher than your speakers


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

I sold the polk the day after I received the xs so could not take the graphic from the polk. I set the gain in both subs independently until audessey was -10db in the polk and - 10db with the xs15 and them connect both subs with the matching gain. And the polk was always better in the mid and upper bass. That's why I think something is not right with the sub.


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## jreb14 (Feb 18, 2015)

I understand what you are trying to explain? High end subs do not have the 50hz boom like lower end subs provide. Your ears may not be used to this sound. It may actually be a shock to what you are expecting to experience. I find it it sounds more like live music. 
What kind of speakers are your front and center? What frequency are you crossing the front speaker over at? I tried you some live music with my PSA using firetv and youtube. The bump you will hear is more acurate and faster that thump that people expect hear.
Wait until you use it with a movie. I think tight bass is something hard to explain it is subtle. It is not boomy you actually feel it in the chest, butt everywhere. Your ears will not fatigue as easy you will be more drawn into the music. I have a Carver Sunfire and JBL EON Pro system that is more boomy like your Polk. They will absolutely thunder during rock but it does not have a ambiance that the PSA provides. Try some bass tests with youtube if you can. Your speakers maybe to efficient for the sub and the sub need to be turned up quite a bit. I do not always trust Audessy. I can usually get withing the same distances by closing my eyes and listening to the levels of the speakers. 
I have seen many higher end subs with cross over at 50-80hz. Mid Bass start at 80hz. I would run both subs if you can. The Polk may be a great filler sub. Test you phase it may also help. You can also stand next to the closest speaker between you and PSA and turn phase control see if bass moves from sub to speaker. I prefer bass moving toward the speakers. I would also move around room to find out were the bass sounds loudest. This is were standing waves are needing to be addressed. I love the PSA for rock it is super accurate. Remember much live music is over 90db's and that is real loud in a house. I am not a big graph guy sorry I am not much help there. The Polk does fall off at 40hz and that were the PSA is really strong all the way down to 20hz. I hope this will help.


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## jonapv (Feb 9, 2015)

My fronts are polk rtia5 tower and the center polk csi a6, fxia6 for surround and rtia1 for backs. 
For movies yes the xs for sure but for music something is lacking. 

All channels crossover at 80 and the sub at 120.


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## jreb14 (Feb 18, 2015)

Try crossing over the Polk rtia5 at 40hz and the sub at 80hz. That will give you some over lap. I think you are crossing the sub over too high and not low enough on the towers. I run at 80hz on sub and 40hz fronts with my Tekton's and they blend really good. I also have sub at 0db on levels. it is real subtle but something is missing when it shuts off. I can listen at 55 db's with this sub and everything is so clean. Try some music like Lord Royals pr SAIL - AWOLNATION and see if you can keep things on wall at 100db. It will shake the house. I wonder if the subs is just backed down -10db and crossed over too high 120hz.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

He's not crossed at 120. His LFE is set for 120. That's what the LFE channel contains. 3hz-120hz. Won't effect music at all since LFE is only built into movies as a separate track. (.1)


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## jreb14 (Feb 18, 2015)

My system utilizes the subwoofer even in stereo. It may not be true LFE but it does filter frequencies at the crossover point. I recommend the SUB and receiver are to be set up to the same frequency. Many people do not realize that and the sub is crossed over at a different then the receiver. There is a electronic coverage gap of frequencies if the receiver and sub are not matched in frequency. I really thought it was waste of time cross over sub at 80hz until I realized that is where the sub is best. Many tower speakers can did down to 40hz just fine.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

Are you referring to the crossover adjustment on the sub? Normally the LFE input is used instead of the L/R high level inputs, bypassing the subs internal crossover for the one in the avr. Setting the crossover in the avr at say, 60hz for example won't do anything for the LFE channel that he said is at 120hz.(normal) That is an LPF. Not a crossover. (He said, crossover at 80 LFE at 120). If the sub doesn't have an LFE input, you'd turn the subs crossover all the way up so you can use the one in the avr. Almost all AVRs use the subs in stereo mode. Some music gets down into the 20s and low 30s. This isn't handled by the "LFE"(.1) channel, its just sent to the subs because it's lower than the crossover point. You said "I recommend the SUB and receiver are to be set up to the same frequency". Not sure I follow?


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## jreb14 (Feb 18, 2015)

Tight high quality bass sounds considerably different then low end subs or even mid level subs. It is subtle and accurate. I have had sloppy or boomy bass and tight bass. Tight Bass sounds different and people who spend lots of money on sub-woofer are expecting something different. I really think PA style bass like a Yamaha DSR118W Active Sub-woofer or QSC KW181 is more the kind of bass non audiophiles type people are expecting. These PA subs are high quality and will play up to mid 130 decibels, but do not ask these to go down to subsonic ranges they only play down to 40hz and drop off quickly after that. They absolutely rock with dance music. It is a different application. They have handles and wheels. This kind of sub will blow home style subs away in an outdoor event or large public event. They will be sound empty and will suck in deep bass movies. It is a different application. These PA subs are your boom boom sound. My JBL EONS with dual QSC KW181 is way louder @ 130db then my Home Theater system with a PSA XV-15 sub and both system play really clean. It is a different application. One is used outdoors for fireworks shows and one is private home use. 
I just just sharing my opinion on this. I was just trying help to think in a different direction. I have a similar setup and I was trying to share what worked for me. I have been in the same boat of getting a new sub and felt it was not performing.


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## jreb14 (Feb 18, 2015)

My thinking was the that the POlk rtia5 are really strong and can play to lower frequency 30Hz-27kHz. I thought it was just cutting off semitones and ambience of midbass that the would help clean the sound up and make the bass stronger. I feel 80hz is a better frequency then 120HZ for the LFE. I fell subs are better at 60 to 80 hz then 120 hz and it will clean up the sound better at a lower crossover point.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

I totally agree about pa subs and applications being what you said. I also agree with accurate bass and how it is different with a better sub. This does take some getting used to, and based on the sweep he made with audyssey on, I'd think it would sound good in his room. 
I'm very familiar with the Polk sub he replaced. It's ok, but a little tubby, and it falls of early. I wonder if he ran the psa a little hot until getting used to proper bass would help feed his expectations. I was just trying to be clear on your suggestion. Not sure how to cross the mains at 40 and the sub at 80. Do you mean use the crossover in the avr, and the crossover on the sub too? It sounded like you meant for him to treat the LPF as a crossover.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

jreb14 said:


> I feel 80hz is a better frequency then 120HZ for the LFE. I fell subs are better at 60 to 80 hz then 120 hz and it will clean up the sound better at a lower crossover point.


 But changing the LFE is not the same as changing crossover. Movies contain a separate LFE track(3-120hz) This is not effected by the crossover at all. By taking the LPF from 120 to say, 60. It only takes the top 60 hz off the signal. It doesn't send it to the mains like a crossover.


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## jreb14 (Feb 18, 2015)

My owners manual refers to crossover points of speakers so this is the context I was using.
TX-NR626 pg 57 of manual
crossover frequencies.
■Subwoofer
&#56256;&#56416;Yes
&#56256;&#56416;No
■Front
&#56256;&#56416;Full Band
&#56256;&#56416;40Hz to 100Hz, 120Hz, 150Hz, 200Hz
Note
• If the “Subwoofer” setting is set to “No”, the “Front” setting
is fixed at “Full Band”.
■Center*1, Surround*1
&#56256;&#56416;Full Band
&#56256;&#56416;40Hz to 100Hz, 120Hz, 150Hz, 200Hz
&#56256;&#56416;None
■Front High*1*2*3*5
&#56256;&#56416;Full Band
&#56256;&#56416;40Hz to 100Hz, 120Hz, 150Hz, 200Hz
&#56256;&#56416;None
■Surround Back*1*2*3*4
&#56256;&#56416;Full Band
&#56256;&#56416;40Hz to 100Hz, 120Hz, 150Hz, 200Hz
&#56256;&#56416;None

LPF of LFE
(Low-Pass Filter for the LFE Channel)
&#56256;&#56416;80Hz, 90Hz, 100Hz, 120Hz
&#56256;&#56416;Off:
Low-Pass Filter is not applied.
With this setting, you can specify the cutoff
frequency of the LFE channel’s low-pass filter
(LPF), which can be used to filter out unwanted
hum. The LPF only applies to sources that use the
LFE channel.
■Double Bass
&#56256;&#56416;On
&#56256;&#56416;Off
Turn this setting on to boost bass output by feeding
bass sounds from the front left, right, and center
channels to the subwoofer. Default setting: “- - - -”


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