# Question about sub placement



## jason1234567 (Apr 11, 2014)

Hi i was wondering when everyone says they put their sun in the corner. Do you turn it around and face the front into the corner?


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

Most say corner placement it's best however, it also can be an area that excites in the room and can sound boomy. Are you having your avr calibrate the system?
The front could face the corner.


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## jason1234567 (Apr 11, 2014)

No i don't have the device to auto calibrate so i'm just moving both subs around to find the best spot.. i just put the polk facing the corner and i haven't had the chance to really test it out but i'm watching golf and it does seem to hit a little deeper.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

Get an spl meter and from the listening position calibrate each speaker and sub to around 75db. Then see how it sounds. You can try moving the subs around until you find what works for you.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Sub placement is very room specific so what works for one persons space will not nessisarally work in another. Because you have two this gives you the ability to smoth out the response in the room so this will give great results. I personally like placement along the front wall under the display or along the side walls one on either side but the only way you can really know is to try. The front of the sub should alway be facing out into the room.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

tonyvdb said:


> The front of the sub should alway be facing out into the room.


I always thought that until I got the Kreisel. Ken recommends to place it forward facing with driver facing the wall or place sideways with driver facing the wall.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

That's more because of his design, normally this is not ideal. Of course on a down firing sub this is also design to have it fire at the floor.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

tonyvdb said:


> That's more because of his design, normally this is not ideal. Of course on a down firing sub this is also design to have it fire at the floor.


Yeah just like he recommends stacking with his subs because of his design but some would still disagree with that too.


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## jason1234567 (Apr 11, 2014)

Here's where i am so far. This is my bedroom and it's fairly small.. as soon as you open the door my full size bob o pedic to my right. Looking forward against the wall i have a dresser and a table that takes up the whole length of the wall.. on the dresser i got my turntables and other Dj equipment on the table i have the receiver With my center speaker resting on the back of the receiver and my 42" jvc led on top of the speaker.. idk if thats a bad idea but hey it works. Under the table i have the polk sub and a few crates of records.. to the right of my bed i have a small leather recliner, behind that is where i have my onkyo sub.. so if i'm laying in my bed the sub is facing me. My front speakers are close to my tv so their close to the center speaker.. idk is that's bad or what. Should i put them further away from the tv? I've been moving the polk around and i think i found a good spot.. the bass is going through me just watching tv at a low volume. i know my equipment is not too good but hey to me it sounds pretty good. I never got to hear anything better so. I'm just learning about sound quality and stuff so i hope i can learn enough to in a few years have a real system.


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## Almadacr (May 5, 2011)

Take a look at this video from Axiom .


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## jason1234567 (Apr 11, 2014)

Thanks for the video.. i learned some valuable knowledge there. i don't think i have enough open floor space in my room to try it..lol.. it's pretty tight in here.. i'm gonna give it a try tho. Thank you


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## tesseract (Aug 9, 2010)

jason1234567 said:


> Hi i was wondering when everyone says they put their sun in the corner. Do you turn it around and face the front into the corner?


I've seen several systems, and had a few myself, that sound/measure better when the subs are turned. 

I've had them fire into a side or rear wall, canted at 45 degree angles and even firing sideways. It changes the boundary distance, so it does have an effect.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...460-2-channel-picture-gallery.html#post464118


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## yoda13 (Feb 14, 2012)

asere said:


> I always thought that until I got the Kreisel. Ken recommends to place it forward facing with driver facing the wall or place sideways with driver facing the wall.


That's what I do. Got rid of a nasty null I had between 50Hz and 80Hz. I got them facing inward towards my entertainment unit.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

yoda13 said:


> That's what I do. Got rid of a nasty null I had between 50Hz and 80Hz. I got them facing inward towards my entertainment unit.


Ken also told me to never place a sub in the middle of a front wall because that creates many standing waves.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

asere said:


> Ken also told me to never place a sub in the middle of a front wall because that creates many standing waves.


I dont think that is the case for everyone. I placed my PB13u in that location and it sounds fantastic. I get great results with REW.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

tonyvdb said:


> I dont think that is the case for everyone. I placed my PB13u in that location and it sounds fantastic. I get great results with REW.


I can agree with you. I also have mine in the middle front wall and sounds fantastic. I haven't done REW but for me it sounds better there.
I am sure it has to be with his design but design or not all rooms are different.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

asere said:


> I can agree with you. I also have mine in the middle front wall and sounds fantastic. I haven't done REW but for me it sounds better there. I am sure it has to be with his design but design or not all rooms are different.


If it ain't broke...
I think it's way too broad a statement to say never/always put your sub anywhere. You are right asere,


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

willis7469 said:


> If it ain't broke... I think it's way too broad a statement to say never/always put your sub anywhere. You are right asere,


(oops hit send)
All rooms and situations are different. Once you find what works in your space, it can most likely be the best place any sub. But I still think the only real way to know for sure is experiment. And of course, REW!!!


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## sdurani (Oct 28, 2010)

asere said:


> Ken also told me to never place a sub in the middle of a front wall because that creates many standing waves.


Placing a subwoofer against a boundary will excite all the standing waves perpendicular to that boundary. For example, if the sub is on the front wall OR back wall, it will emphasize all the length modes in the room. 

However, placement at the midpoint of the front wall (i.e., midpoint of room width) can prevent odd-order (1st, 3rd, etc) room modes from resonating, minimizing some big nulls across the seating area.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

sdurani said:


> Placing a subwoofer against a boundary will excite all the standing waves perpendicular to that boundary. For example, if the sub is on the front wall OR back wall, it will emphasize all the length modes in the room.
> 
> However, placement at the midpoint of the front wall (i.e., midpoint of room width) can prevent odd-order (1st, 3rd, etc) room modes from resonating, minimizing some big nulls across the seating area.


I once had the sub at midpoint of room (midpoint for me was in a front corner next to the 4ft wall that separates the family room and kitchen) and sometimes it was too much and did not sound right.


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## vidiot33 (Dec 12, 2013)

Experimentation is always key, but according to an article I read by Dr. Floyd Toole regarding subwoofer placement, he said the best spot was midway between the side walls and the second best spot was in the corner, with the corner having the benefit of more output and greater efficiency. For me, the corner placement really woke the subs up ( I have two), but as always, YMMV..


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

vidiot33 said:


> Experimentation is always key, but according to an article I read by Dr. Floyd Toole regarding subwoofer placement, he said the best spot was midway between the side walls and the second best spot was in the corner, with the corner having the benefit of more output and greater efficiency. For me, the corner placement really woke the subs up ( I have two), but as always, YMMV..


Ive read works by Dr. Tools also. Very interesting stuff. Seems to me you are right about his notes. But what I can't remember is if he covered rooms connected to kitchens, stairs and hallways! My options are limited, but luckily stuffing my subs in the rear corners works best. LOTS of experiments though!


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## vidiot33 (Dec 12, 2013)

Cool... Glad to hear the corners are working for you. I don't remember Toole addressing room openings so it's fortunate that yours work out in the rear corners. I think that charges the corners can make the bass sound too boomy stems from 2 issues: inferior subs and not properly adjusted the volume...


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

vidiot33 said:


> Cool... Glad to hear the corners are working for you. I don't remember Toole addressing room openings so it's fortunate that yours work out in the rear corners. I think that charges the corners can make the bass sound too boomy stems from 2 issues: inferior subs and not properly adjusted the volume...


Indeed! Luckily I don't suffer from either. But just to know for sure, before rew, I plotted my charts manually with tones and graph paper. ...glutinous, whew! The second sub actually smoothed it out just like it's supposed to also. Now I'm workin on 2 more. Guess I like my WAF right at redline!


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

willis7469 said:


> Ive read works by Dr. Tools also. Very interesting stuff. Seems to me you are right about his notes. But what I can't remember is if he covered rooms connected to kitchens, stairs and hallways! My options are limited, but luckily stuffing my subs in the rear corners works best. LOTS of experiments though!


I'm not sure but from one online article about Dr Toole they make it seem like he speaks only of symmetrical rectangular rooms.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

asere said:


> I'm not sure but from one online article about Dr Toole they make it seem like he speaks only of symmetrical rectangular rooms.


That's what I thought. So the majority of can toss it out! J/k. There's a lot of useful info in his writings.


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## vidiot33 (Dec 12, 2013)

willis7469 said:


> Indeed! Luckily I don't suffer from either. But just to know for sure, before rew, I plotted my charts manually with tones and graph paper. ...glutinous, whew! The second sub actually smoothed it out just like it's supposed to also. Now I'm workin on 2 more. Guess I like my WAF right at redline![/QUOTE
> 
> With 4, you'll really be optimized. If I remember correctly, one of Dr. Toole's conclusions is that you don't benefit from more than 4 subs in a room, and he experimented with subs well into double figures.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

Here is were I have mine. Before like I mentioned it was were the lamp is now which is next to the 4ft wall that opens to kitchen.


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## vidiot33 (Dec 12, 2013)

asere said:


> Here is were I have mine. Before like I mentioned it was were the lamp is now which is next to the 4ft wall that opens to kitchen.


You made it work, well done!:sn:


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## BeeMan458 (Nov 25, 2012)

jason1234567 said:


> No i don't have the device to auto calibrate so i'm just moving both subs around to find the best spot..


Have you taken the time to download, install and get a freeware copy of REW up and running? If you haven't already, in doing so you'll be able to measure the acoustics in the room and can see how the subwoofers interact with each other and then be able to get the best out of subwoofer placement as sadly, moving subs around the room and measuring each placement is the only way to go. If you don't know already, anything else is wishing, hoping and guessing as nobody's ears are better then accurate measurements.


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## Mike0206 (Jul 14, 2013)

I have found so far that in my room, one in front right corner and the other down the right side wall at the midpoint is where they work best. Both up front creates a nasty dip at 40hz and the one at the midpoint seems to help that out quite a bit. It doesn't get rid of it but that's what I'm working on currently to eq that out or maybe move subs just a tad.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

So what one needs is something like this
http://www.amazon.com/Behringer-UCA...538&sr=8-2-spell&keywords=bringher+audio+card
and an spl meter and set up the meter and sound card and then use REW?


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