# Soundcard problem



## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

First time user of REW calibrating Realtek sound card on laptop
Measuring card reports Very low signal level with max volume just -60.8
Tried default and direct selecting sound card with same result
Any suggestions as I have checked what system requested ?


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## glaufman (Nov 25, 2007)

Do you have a loopback cable connected from output to input?


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## bclare (Dec 22, 2009)

What about the sound card enhancements in the driver properties?

Are they enabled? It is best to disable them


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

Thanks for the replies
I had the input and output connected together with red phono plugs (Right Channel ) nothing else was connected.
Will be looking at the cable setup instructions again in case I have made a mistake.

I think I had enhancements selected off , but will recheck

I believe it is the input that is causing the problem as I got a warning that it did not support the correct format
PCM etc etc

Any further info suggestions appreciated

Regards
Andy


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## glaufman (Nov 25, 2007)

Try to send a pic of the soundcard connections and a screenshot of the calibraiton settings.


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

Couple of screen shots
One with Input & Output Connected & balanced at -15 going to -14 it goes red
One with result warning which happens everytime
There was an option to select Realtek output to speakers but that ended up with a clipping warning


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

Photos Of Card and connections as requested


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## laser188139 (Sep 19, 2009)

lesmor said:


> ... There was an option to select Realtek output to speakers but that ended up with a clipping warning ...


I suspect you want to go back to the output to speakers option and solve the clipping warning. It now appears you are using the digital output, which should be a different connector than the analog output to which you have connected the cables. 

You may have to experiment with which side of the Y splitters is right and left. 

Bill


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

laser188139 said:


> I suspect you want to go back to the output to speakers option and solve the clipping warning. It now appears you are using the digital output, which should be a different connector than the analog output to which you have connected the cables.
> 
> You may have to experiment with which side of the Y splitters is right and left.
> 
> Bill


Hi Bill
Thanks for the tip
Seems to work 
After selecting speaker output option
Tried reducing the output level , still clipped
Then reduced Input level and looks like it worked
Have attached sceen shot , if someone could confirm that it looks good I'll select MakeCal
Thanks again I was going crazy


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## laser188139 (Sep 19, 2009)

That looks fine to me as a soundcard calibration.


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

Don't know what happened with that last screenshot , but can't replicate the result
Unfortunately didn't save as cal file , and if I load it it fails on clipping so back to square one
Tried again and this is the best I can get , so again guys any suggestions?:crying:


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

Loaded Cal file I saved yesterday and managed to run it without clipping , did a measure but graph looks straight so suspect this is not correct?
Any guidance appreciated


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## laser188139 (Sep 19, 2009)

That is a bizarre horizontal range, 2-20Hz, not kHz. Regardless, that is the correct result if you are now performing a measurement of the loopback connection with the soundcard loaded. As the soundcard cal file compensates for the unevenness in the soundcard's response, the end result should be flat. 

If you thought you had your mic connected and were measuring the room, this is what you will see with the inverted Y connectors like I have causing you to read the left channel when you think you are reading the right. 

Bill


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

Well I have moved forward and did a level check , calibrated SPL meter and tried to do first measure.
Did a level check which reported OK , did a measure and received a clipping warning , reduced volume did measure , now says volume too low.
Have tried adjusting card and sub volume and can't get the balance between clipping and volume too low
Did a measure with level too low and this is the result graph.
This is direct into my sub woofer.
My sound card has 2 volume controls
One on the inlet ,one on the outlet
If you adjust the inlet it controls the volume on the outlet meter
If you adjust the outlet volume it adjusts the Right meter ?
Just about giving up


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## JohnM (Apr 11, 2006)

Change the graph extents so that the SPL range is 45 to 105 and the frequency range is 15 to 200Hz.

From the description of the effect of the volume controls the windows output mixer has not been set up correctly, sounds like the line in is feeding into the output. Go to Control panel -> Hardware and Sound -> Sound, choose the Playback tab, select Speakers and click Properties, then select the Levels tab. Below the main output level slider there are sliders for other sources that feed into the output, make sure the Line In level is muted.


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

JohnM said:


> Change the graph extents so that the SPL range is 45 to 105 and the frequency range is 15 to 200Hz.
> 
> From the description of the effect of the volume controls the windows output mixer has not been set up correctly, sounds like the line in is feeding into the output. Go to Control panel -> Hardware and Sound -> Sound, choose the Playback tab, select Speakers and click Properties, then select the Levels tab. Below the main output level slider there are sliders for other sources that feed into the output, make sure the Line In level is muted.


Thanks for the guidance John
I have now changed the graph settings
I am using Vista Operating System.

Speakers properties only has sliders for Realtec HD Audio Output ,and PC Beep , so I have muted the PC Beep.
I have found the Line In level Slider comes under Recording devices , so I have now muted that as suggested.
I think I will go right back to the beginning and setup again.
Will report back my progress
Thanks for taking the time to help out a newbie
Andy


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

lesmor said:


> Thanks for the guidance John
> I have now changed the graph settings
> I am using Vista Operating System.
> 
> ...


With Input slider muted you cannot get a reading on the right channel meter?
Anyway tried yet again and only way I can geet a satisfactory report of adequate volume is with the right channel and output meters full scale.
even then when measuring the sound card the system reports that there is not enough volume , but at least there seems to be an acceptable cal file, which I have accepted.
See screen shots of meter readings , and sound card measurement report.


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## laser188139 (Sep 19, 2009)

It's not surprising that you are seeing the clipping level in the right channel input, -2.3dB peaks, when you are seeing such high levels in the output, -2.0dB peaks. You need to reduce the output level so it is ~ -12dB. 

If I am interpreting your screen correctly where it says "Low signal level on reference", this warning is about your left channel, not your right. My guess is you have the "Use Loopback as Timing Reference" box checked in Preferences -> Analysis, but you have no loopback connection attached to the left channel. If you don't want absolute timing information, uncheck the box. If you do want absolute timing information, you need to connect the left channel as a loopback, similar to what you did with the right channel when you built the soundcard. 

Bill


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

laser188139 said:


> It's not surprising that you are seeing the clipping level in the right channel input, -2.3dB peaks, when you are seeing such high levels in the output, -2.0dB peaks. You need to reduce the output level so it is ~ -12dB.
> 
> If I am interpreting your screen correctly where it says "Low signal level on reference", this warning is about your left channel, not your right. My guess is you have the "Use Loopback as Timing Reference" box checked in Preferences -> Analysis, but you have no loopback connection attached to the left channel. If you don't want absolute timing information, uncheck the box. If you do want absolute timing information, you need to connect the left channel as a loopback, similar to what you did with the right channel when you built the soundcard.
> 
> Bill


Hi Bill
I had been running the output level at -12/ -15 previously, the screenshot I sent was the first time I had the right channel and output so high , probably in frustration.
Your suggestion that the "Low signal level on reference", warning was for the left channel was interesting ,I have cleared / reset preferences and will start yet again so thanks for the info.


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

Hi
I have now taken some readings in my room , I have 2 subs one on the front wall right , one on the left
My subs have a switch +/- Phase which I am having a problem deciding which is the best position so I have taken readings with both positions.
I would appreciate some comments on the readings so I can learn how to interpret them.
Also suggestions how to improve the results , my subs do not have onboard EQ.
Meter was calibrated to 73db
Edit 
1st graph left sub neg phase, 1225mm from front wall ,100mm from Sidewall, meter position 1820mm from back wall
2nd graph left sub pos phase, 1225mm from front wall ,100mm from Sidewall, meter position 1820mm from back wall

3rd graph right sub neg phase , 1225mm from front wall ,875mm from alcove,meter position 1820 from back wall
4th graph right sub pos phase, 1225mm from front wall ,875mm from alcove , meter position 1820mm from back wall


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## glaufman (Nov 25, 2007)

It would help if you told us the difference between each graph. But it looks like you have a big suckout
in the room around 40Hz... try moving the listening position.


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

glaufman said:


> It would help if you told us the difference between each graph. But it looks like you have a big suckout
> in the room around 40Hz... try moving the listening position.


Apologies for lack of detail I thought the attachment text would show up so have now edited the original.
The graphs are

1st graph left sub neg phase, 1225mm from front wall ,100mm from Sidewall, meter position 1820mm from back wall
2nd graph left sub pos phase, 1225mm from front wall ,100mm from Sidewall, meter position 1820mm from back wall

3rd graph right sub neg phase , 1225mm from front wall ,875mm from alcove,meter position 1820 from back wall
4th graph right sub pos phase, 1225mm from front wall ,875mm from alcove , meter position 1820mm from back wall

Thanks for the feedback and suggestion which is exactly what I was looking for ,I will carry out and remeasure.
Regards
Andy


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## glaufman (Nov 25, 2007)

Another thing... are these dis-similar subs? that will perpetually be an issue.


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## lesmor (Dec 30, 2009)

glaufman said:


> Another thing... are these dis-similar subs? that will perpetually be an issue.


Hi Both subs are the same MX-350's
unfortunately my room is not rectangular and has a bay window on left hand side , there is an alcove on the front wall right hand side ,where the right hand sub is hence the difference in positioning From the sidewalls ,so cannot have the subs or speakers symmetrically placed.
could post pics of my room if that would help with suggestions?


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## glaufman (Nov 25, 2007)

That could help, but I'm wondering why the one sub seems to roll off so early?


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