# HK 254 EZSET/EQ and REW



## test4echo101 (Jul 27, 2011)

Hi Guys!

Well today I tried to embarked on a new challenge. That being measuring my HK 254's EZSET EQ's Freq response versus a manual setup.
I don't have a BFD so I decided to give the AVR another chance now that I know how to use REW.

Right off the bat I ran into trouble because it seems that you cannot use your measuring Mic in place of that cheap ezset/eq mic HK provides.

Is there anyway around this? Why is it one cannot use a better mic for the ezset/eq measurements? Ugg.

So I let the cheap mic calibrate the AVR and measured later with my good mic and REW.

I didn't save the results because they were atrocious. I can tell you that the auto calibration took my manual fairly flat freq response and killed it. Instead slight dips and peaks I got ginormous dips and peaks.

So, Using EZSET/EQ is out of the question.

My question is this:

Are there any 3rd party firmware flashes that would allow a user to gain access to the EQ part of the AVR?

I mean, why buy a BFD if the AVR has the ability to adjust EQ? Why does HK limit access to it?

On a more general topic, is there any possibility that REW would ever be able to interface with EZSET/EQ or audyessy so we could manually manipulate the filters already existing in the AVRS?

Thanks!


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

test4echo101 said:


> Right off the bat I ran into trouble because it seems that you cannot use your measuring Mic in place of that cheap ezset/eq mic HK provides.
> 
> Is there anyway around this? Why is it one cannot use a better mic for the ezset/eq measurements? Ugg.


OF course not. There is no way to load a correction curve and that, alone, makes this impossible. Note that, afaik, absolutely no AVR/processor that has an inbuilt EQ function permits access to it for other programs or mics. All are closed systems. 



> So, Using EZSET/EQ is out of the question.


Worked for me.


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## test4echo101 (Jul 27, 2011)

Kal Rubinson said:


> OF course not. There is no way to load a correction curve and that, alone, makes this impossible. Note that, afaik, absolutely no AVR/processor that has an inbuilt EQ function permits access to it for other programs or mics. All are closed systems.
> 
> Worked for me.


Thanks Kal.
Makes sense.

I will post here later today some graphs between EZSET and manual setup.

For some reason no matter what I do EZset seems to always sound worse than not using it at all.

Hopefully posting some comparisons will reveal why.


Test,


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## test4echo101 (Jul 27, 2011)

Hi Guys,

Well, here are the preliminary results of the HK 254's EZSET/EQ On and off.

First off, I realize I have a giant hole at around 50Hz. I'm working on solving that best I can with placement/treatments before I buy a BFD.

I'm a little shocked by the results because its obvious which are the better graphs. YET....It doesn't "sound" better to me. :scratch:
Maybe I've heard bad for so long I don't know the difference anymore....lol







































Its almost as if the EZSET/EQ does Eq the room ok but the "Imaginary house curve" for it sucks.
With EZSET/EQ off the room is not eq'd well but has a better more pleasing "Imaginary house curve".

By "Imaginary House Curve" I mean that with EZSET/EQ on it sounds DEAD. No life to it. Like a flat response with NO house curve.
With it Off, things sounds much brighter, livelier like it has a house curve.



Any input would be great!

Test,


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## rajzol (Feb 16, 2012)

Hello all,

i am a beginner on this, but bought a HK 255 receiver + JBL ES80 5.1 speakers for home cinema and rock music, some months ago.I did the michrophone test and used the amp with EZSET/EQ : ON setting.
The sound of the movies was OK, but I was not satisfied with the sound of music (mp3, CD) at all. It sounded like the instruments were under the sea or sounded from an iron tube, so the sound was grey and poor. (Stereo mode with some Tone control).
Yesterday i looked after the settings and switched OFF the EZSET/EQ… the music suddenly started to live, for the first time I felt the the music really coming out from the speakers. The difference was significant !
I tried it with a movie as well (Star Wars dts), with OFF setting the sound is better, in the movie also. Cleaner sounds, more bass, simply better. (not as much improvement as in music, but better)

Anybody experienced the same ?
Is it possible that i should re-make the mic test (because i’ve been told the this test should improve the sound) ?


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

test4echo101 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> Well, here are the preliminary results of the HK 254's EZSET/EQ On and off..............................................................
> 
> ...


The EZSET/EQ looks better to me. Little change in FR magnitude but a huge increase in decay uniformity and, especially in the bass, a huge reduction in modal response. Now, you may prefer the "livelier" sound with its reverberation and, if that is your preference, OK. 

Kal


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## SAC (Dec 3, 2009)

The 'corrected' response circa 2k and 6k is anything but 'livelier'. This would definitely contribute to the perceived 'dead-ness' of the result.

Not sure what it is doing, as whatever is happening does not seem to be bandwidth limited...e.g. modal control limited to LF bass modes!

Plus as it appears to be a measurement with several drivers driven, it is difficult to see what is really happening in the system itself independent all of the 'noise' introduced by superposition sourced comb filtering due to the interaction of multiple sources.


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## Wayne A. Pflughaupt (Apr 13, 2006)

Sorry Kal, but I don’t see any evidence of increased decay uniformity or decreased reverberation. And SAC, even a severely comb-filtered signal will show some evidence of decay. 

In reality, there is little functional difference between the “on” (red) and “off” (magenta) waterfalls. The main difference is that there was some kind of low-level, steady-state, broadband noise evident in the magenta graph, which is kind of unusual. This is more typically seen as 60-cycle electrical noise (that shows up on a waterfall at 60 Hz with a less-severe 120 Hz harmonic, as seen here), not a broadband signal.

Ignoring the background noise, the “on” and ”off” are virtually identical, except for a couple of things: The “on” graphs shows a less-severe trough in the 55 Hz region (low-freq graphs), but a more severe trough at about 3 kHz (full-range graphs).

Regards,
Wayne


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

Wayne A. Pflughaupt said:


> Sorry Kal, but I don’t see any evidence of increased decay uniformity or decreased reverberation. And SAC, even a severely comb-filtered signal will show some evidence of decay.


I am looking at the decay in the 350-500ms range, particularly in graphs 1 and 2, and I see a significant reduction in decay, e.g., at 40Hz. Same for the full range graphs 3 and 4, where it is apparent from 100Hz to about 3kHz. 

Now, if you are ascribing this to the presence/absence of a broad-band noise source, that might be the cause but, if it is, it is obscuring our ability to see any significant differences and fairly dismisses the value of all the graphs. That leaves it up to the OP to determine source of the noise and to redo the measurements.

Kal


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## PTAaron (Feb 16, 2012)

rajzol said:


> Hello all,
> 
> i am a beginner on this, but bought a HK 255 receiver + JBL ES80 5.1 speakers for home cinema and rock music, some months ago.I did the michrophone test and used the amp with EZSET/EQ : ON setting.
> The sound of the movies was OK, but I was not satisfied with the sound of music (mp3, CD) at all. It sounded like the instruments were under the sea or sounded from an iron tube, so the sound was grey and poor. (Stereo mode with some Tone control).
> ...


I recently discovered that I had accidentally left my EZSet/EQ set to ON for one of my devices with my HK 3600, and the blu-ray music disc I was listening to sounded like until I turned it off. Same experience as you are describing. I think my problem is that when I ran EZSET/EQ I had completely different much smaller satellite speakers - so it was compensating for the excessive treble. That is actually the reason I downloaded REW - so I could figure out exactly what EZSet/EQ was doing to the sound, since I've asked before on a different forum and got no answers.


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## Wayne A. Pflughaupt (Apr 13, 2006)

Kal Rubinson said:


> I am looking at the decay in the 350-500ms range, particularly in graphs 1 and 2, and I see a significant reduction in decay, e.g., at 40Hz. Same for the full range graphs 3 and 4, where it is apparent from 100Hz to about 3kHz.
> 
> Kal


I'm not sure we're using the same parameters for judgement. There might be some decay differences in those ranges, but it isn't significant, and it certainly isn't enough to be audible.

Regards,
Wayne


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## rajzol (Feb 16, 2012)

The speakers all the same at me, ES80 front, ES30 satellite, ES25C, E250 sub
Still do not understand why is it sounds *very poor with EZSET/EQ : ON*
i will try to re-make the Mic test, when nobody in the house but me, in order to reduce every enviromental noises...


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