# If you have a suggestion - Receiver



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

I am worn out. We drove 180 miles today to pick up a receiver but they had none in stock after telling us they did. I am also worn out because after hours of reading reviews here and there, no one ever makes real recommendations - they ether praise a 10 year old receiver they still have, pray that the new one was the right decision or restate something over and over without any verifiable evidence. After spending the last 2 days trying to make a decision what to buy for a new receiver it just seems easier to turn on the old one and listen to it until it dies. Then stop watching movies and TV. Here is the problem - like many in the USA we have an older big screen as well as DVD player which equals we still have COMPONENT VIDEO. And the world has moved to HDMI. I thought maybe it was time to start upgrading the system starting with the receiver so I asked some questions on this forum. Answers were nice. But they were in someone else's thread and I don't want to hijack them so I will start over here because the hunt for a new receiver isn't over. Lord I long for the days of simple audio-visual connections. I used to see Sansui, Pioneer, Denon, Harmon-Kardon, Marantz etc., it was so simple then - no meters to set up equipment - you let your ears tell you what sounded best. Now my ears ain't so good anymore. 

I had decided this morning on an Onkyo NR-818 based on price ($700), performance and name. Our last two receivers have been Onkyo and yes, they do have gremlins in them but nothing serious. However after driving 180 miles today to find they (Fry's) lied about having new ones in stock, I returned home and unfortunately found some threads online indicating that maybe some NR-818 are starting to have HDMI card failures like previous models - nothing I could verify - just a couple people going back and forth with Onkyo technical support. Onkyo says "no that is not true, we are not having problems with the NR-818," and the supposed users say yes it is but they get rid of the units rather than fix them so maybe they are competitor plants - who knows. Can anyone with an NR-818 give their experiences with theirs? A new one is $700 so does anyone else have suggestions on a similar priced unit that would be comparable and has a good reputation for lasting? I like to keep things a long time. In fact if all the new TV's and BlueRay weren't sold today with HDMI, we would not be upgrading this older Onkyo TX-SR703. 

Lots of other threads here begin with someone asking for help choosing a receiver and then go on for pages without anyone doing anything more than telling stories about a 10 year old unit they miss. If you respond can you please focus for this 60's year old fellow slowly going deaf as to what receivers can be trusted to get the job done today? We currently run 15" KLH ported 3-ways as our main speakers and some 12" JBL 4-way copies as the sides plus dual rear and a cc. I plan to upgrade to the ARX A5's when money allows or perhaps Klipsch RF 62 or 82's.


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

I found one thread with 280+ pages of comments on the NR-818 in another forum. No need for anyone to comment on it now after reading all those pages. I still have no idea if it is a reliable receiver or not. It is beginning to look a lot like the argument between Ford's, Chevy's and Dodges. One person says don't buy it you'll regret it and another says I've had mine replaced 3 times. Someone else says mine is two years old and it has never skipped a beat, my brother has one too and it works perfect. Someone says the problems has been fixed with software upgrades and someone else says it is capacitors - another says it is the chip or heat. One person swears that Marantz is the way to go and someone else says Sony. Then someone steps in and says they work for a dealer don't get Sony but go with Denon. A fellow with a Denon steps in and complains he got rid of his last week after it failed for the 4th time. On and on it goes. I was really hoping someone here with much more recent empirical data and experience than I could have given me some guidance on what a good reliable model might be. Someone else said they are all made in China who cares. 

See ya round. I don't think anyone here is going to be able to answer my questions without bias.


----------



## seanpatrick (Apr 16, 2013)

sgkent said:


> I found one thread with 280+ pages of comments on the NR-818 in another forum. No need for anyone to comment on it now after reading all those pages. I still have no idea if it is a reliable receiver or not. It is beginning to look a lot like the argument between Ford's, Chevy's and Dodges. One person says don't buy it you'll regret it and another says I've had mine replaced 3 times. Someone else says mine is two years old and it has never skipped a beat, my brother has one too and it works perfect. Someone says the problems has been fixed with software upgrades and someone else says it is capacitors - another says it is the chip or heat. One person swears that Marantz is the way to go and someone else says Sony. Then someone steps in and says they work for a dealer don't get Sony but go with Denon. A fellow with a Denon steps in and complains he got rid of his last week after it failed for the 4th time. On and on it goes. I was really hoping someone here with much more recent empirical data and experience than I could have given me some guidance on what a good reliable model might be. Someone else said they are all made in China who cares.
> 
> See ya round. I don't think anyone here is going to be able to answer my questions without bias.


It's too bad Fry's did that to you!.. I'd be livid after spending that time and effort ( and gas ) driving out to get something only to have them say " oops! ". I'm frankly surprised they didn't offer you some form of compensation for your efforts. In any case, it's true that there are a lot of fanboys of their respective receivers. Anyone who offers you advice can only do so based off their own experience. Mine has included Denon receivers, and I haven't had any problems. That being said, I'm sure other people have - forums are the main place people go ( besides tech support ) to try to get answers / gripe about their products. So you might see 100 posts about Onkyo boards failing, which seems like a lot, but that's out of 25000, many of which have happy owners. I don't think you can go wrong with a Denon, Onkyo, Yamaha, Marantz, or for that matter, the last two years of Sony products ( stay away before that ). The 818 is an informed decision, and was what seemed to be the clear winner in the cost / feature department last year. I'd trust your gut - just make sure whatever you get is from an authorized dealer, so if an error does occur, you're covered. Good luck though - I hope you can get your hands on a spiffy new receiver without any trouble soon!


----------



## pddufrene (Mar 14, 2013)

I recently purchased a Yamaha rx 573 which is slash years model if you want to call it that. It has 4 hdmi connections, buy also still includes all of the old school connections to. I still have a vcr that we use for my son to watch all the old Disney cartoons we have. I did a lot of research before making my purchase, to make sure to avoid having to get repairs frequently. I'm like u once I buy something, it will be used for many years to come. It's a suggestion as to something you can look into, I'm not a fan boy of no particular brands. Just someone who also wanted something that would last.


----------



## hjones4841 (Jan 21, 2009)

Many of our members purchase factory refurbished receivers from Accessories4less. Big $ savings and you would be hard pressed to notice any difference from factory fresh other than the shipping box. I have purchased two Denons from them and have been very pleased.

I am not sure if you need component switching or not. Here is a very nice Denon that may be a good choice for you:

http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...etwork-A/V-Surround-Receiver-w/AirPlay/1.html

Stepping up the Denon line is their latest flagship receiver here:

http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...-Flagship-Home-Theater-Receiver-150wpc/1.html

I have never owned Onkyo, but all the Denon gear I have owned over the past 20 years has been rock solid.

Whatever you select, I suggest downloading the user manual to make sure that the connections and switching will do what you need.

As far as setting up with meters, almost every receiver has automatic setup that only takes a few minutes with an included microphone. Actually pretty intuitive and only has to be done once unless you change or move the speakers.

Good luck and let us know what you select.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

HDMI board failures is something that has been discussed many many times and it is also known that it happens in many other brands not just Onkyo. I would highly recommend this Onkyo 929 from accessories4 less
http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...O-TX-NR929-9.2-Ch-Network-A/V-Receiver/1.html


----------



## Dougme57 (Sep 4, 2013)

+1 on accessories4less, bought a refurb Onkyo from them 2 years ago and it has been flawless. I us a Denon in my den setup and the Onkyo in my big rig. it is my first Onkyo but I love it. I have had 3 Denons also and I have never had a receiver problem. My brother still uses my 1988 Denon stereo receiver (dr425) I think. Both great products in my mind.


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

seanpatrick said:


> It's too bad Fry's did that to you!.. I'd be livid after spending that time and effort ( and gas ) driving out to get something only to have them say " oops! ". I'm frankly surprised they didn't offer you some form of compensation for your efforts. In any case, it's true that there are a lot of fanboys of their respective receivers. Anyone who offers you advice can only do so based off their own experience. Mine has included Denon receivers, and I haven't had any problems. That being said, I'm sure other people have - forums are the main place people go ( besides tech support ) to try to get answers / gripe about their products. So you might see 100 posts about Onkyo boards failing, which seems like a lot, but that's out of 25000, many of which have happy owners. I don't think you can go wrong with a Denon, Onkyo, Yamaha, Marantz, or for that matter, the last two years of Sony products ( stay away before that ). The 818 is an informed decision, and was what seemed to be the clear winner in the cost / feature department last year. I'd trust your gut - just make sure whatever you get is from an authorized dealer, so if an error does occur, you're covered. Good luck though - I hope you can get your hands on a spiffy new receiver without any trouble soon!


Thank you - I appreciate the advise and honesty. Steve


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

hjones4841 said:


> Many of our members purchase factory refurbished receivers from Accessories4less. Big $ savings and you would be hard pressed to notice any difference from factory fresh other than the shipping box. I have purchased two Denons from them and have been very pleased.
> 
> I am not sure if you need component switching or not. Here is a very nice Denon that may be a good choice for you:
> 
> ...


Thank you. I came from the 1970's audio industry and am familiar with refurbished units. Some are excellent buys being units simply returned because the owner could not read instructions. In some industries the initial stock used to start the refurbish swap may even be unopened "A" box units. The only fear is that one ends up with an intermittent unit. My current Onkyo unit has defective circuitry for auto adjusting the sound levels. I lived with it but with the amount of money being spent now to replace it, I'd like to make sure I get a zero defect unit. Not possible in reality but certainly something to strive for. I will seriously consider your suggestions. Steve


----------



## tcarcio (Jun 27, 2007)

I agree with Tony on the Onkyo. I own the 809 and I will say when I was in the market I was just like you. So many to choose from and so many opinions. I will only say that I decided on the onkyo and I have been very happy with it for a year now. Also A4L backs up there products and although my Onkyo was new I did own a Marantz refurb from them and it too was a great performer. Refurb to me just means that the unit was completely gone over and is in perfect working condition. Good luck....:wave:


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

tonyvdb said:


> HDMI board failures is something that has been discussed many many times and it is also known that it happens in many other brands not just Onkyo. I would highly recommend this Onkyo 929 from accessories4 less
> http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...O-TX-NR929-9.2-Ch-Network-A/V-Receiver/1.html


Thank you. The 929 was more money that I initially wanted to spend, and if we were to buy it we would wait a year for the price to fall. The Denon AVR-X4000 appears to be a comparable unit and I have already found it advertised at $915 new "A" stock. It lists at the same price point as the NR-929. Very few stores here in Sacramento have the NR-929 yet, probably because of price, but I expect that like all electronics gear if one waits 6 - 12 months the price will fall by 30% to 40%. I am considering it although it may be more than we need. The NR-818 would work too at $700 if I can ever get my head around the risk of HDMI failure. Frankly from what I have read, there still are too many opinions on why they fail. Some appear to make it out to be a firmware issue that has been fixed while others see it as a failure in the actual chip. Thank you again - Tony, your advise is well taken as your experience and number of posts show you are very active in this forum and knowledgeable with this equipment. 

Steve


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

Dougme57 said:


> +1 on accessories4less, bought a refurb Onkyo from them 2 years ago and it has been flawless. I us a Denon in my den setup and the Onkyo in my big rig. it is my first Onkyo but I love it. I have had 3 Denons also and I have never had a receiver problem. My brother still uses my 1988 Denon stereo receiver (dr425) I think. Both great products in my mind.


Thank you for the suggestion and vote for a refurbished unit. I am considering it. Steve


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

tcarcio said:


> I agree with Tony on the Onkyo. I own the 809 and I will say when I was in the market I was just like you. So many to choose from and so many opinions. I will only say that I decided on the onkyo and I have been very happy with it for a year now. Also A4L backs up there products and although my Onkyo was new I did own a Marantz refurb from them and it too was a great performer. Refurb to me just means that the unit was completely gone over and is in perfect working condition. Good luck....:wave:


Thank you. In the 1970's I managed a store like a Best Buy / Fry's owned by Teledyne for 8 long years. Most audio gear sold then saw a 5% to 15% return rate. Some manufacturers allowed the stores to choose whether they wanted no warranty (self-warranty) or factory warranty. If one went no warranty you deducted say 15% from the invoice assuming 15 / 100 units would fail. Then if they failed the customer was given a new unit and the old one went out as-is defective for el cheapo. With a warranty the factory replaced or repaired the unit at their cost. We were a warranty station also for many of the audio lines we are discussing so I am also familiar with the process of repair. Normally when items fail they do it on a pattern so there are bulletins that state when xyz happens replace transistor, chip, capacitor #ABC etc., and that fixes it. Unfortunately boards today are much harder to work on than they were 40 years ago because of the thin traces and multiple layers. If the factories are replacing a daughter board or pair of caps, then the repair is probably quite good. All that said what scares me most today about repairs is the state of mind of audio technician. We are a society that replaces things and frankly I am not that convinced that technicians today have the skills needed to get the job done in an A+ way. But I will consider a refurbished unit as it is ecologically friendlier than smelting one back down and easier on the pocket book. I did see one thread where a fellow had 3 bad units in a row from a site like y'all are suggesting so there is an internal struggle on accepting a refurbished unit sight unseen. I would feel better if I knew what repairs were completed on an individual unit. Maybe I am turning into a control freak with the lack of quality we have experienced with so many things around us. - Thank you again - Steve


----------



## tcarcio (Jun 27, 2007)

Interesting, I wonder if there is a way to find out what was wrong with a refurb unit or if it was just a return.


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

tcarcio said:


> Interesting, I wonder if there is a way to find out what was wrong with a refurb unit or if it was just a return.


It would certainly make it more palatable. We restored a 1977 VW bus and kept photos of the entire process so that any future owner could decide for themselves if the item was repaired to their satisfaction. 

Selling factory refurbished units in the 1970's even then we found that only about 70%+/- of them were good repairs or visually "A" units as I recall. If we got 100 units there would be 10 that ended up on the junk bin for people who wanted to pay a couple of bucks to take a chance at repairing it themselves, and probably 15 to 20 that looked pretty beat up visually - more like well used demos. 

Maybe I will call the store and see if they buy them from the factories repaired or if they repair them and resell them. 

Can anyone tell me if today the warranty on most refurbished units is extended to that of a new unit, or longer, to compensate for the risk, or is it reduce to say 90 days etc.?

Steve


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

sgkent said:


> Can anyone tell me if today the warranty on most refurbished units is extended to that of a new unit, or longer, to compensate for the risk, or is it reduce to say 90 days etc.?
> 
> Steve


With accessories4less you get a one year warranty and you can go to Onkyo and buy another 2 years if you wish.


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

tonyvdb said:


> With accessories4less you get a one year warranty and you can go to Onkyo and buy another 2 years if you wish.



Thank You Tony. If they mark the warranty down from 2 years to 1 year when they are repaired it effectively says the lower price is in part the result of a lower commitment from the factory to support the unit after the repair. 


I think one of these is the path to go for us based on what y'all are saying and what I have read.


a Denon AVR-X4000 for $915 plus sales tax based on big box store price matching polices, new "A" stock locally or over the Internet if they won't price match.

a Onkyo NR-818 for $699 off the Internet from a reputable seller , new "A" stock

a Onyko NR-929 factory refurbished unit for $999 or a new "A" stock one for $1299 (or wait for price to drop).

Please feel free to vote/advise and a brief why you feel that way.

Steve


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Steve, may I ask what you will be using for speakers in your room?
The only downfall I see to the Denon 4000 is it's weight is almost 15 lbs lighter than the onkyos all the receivers you have listed are using AB switching amps so the weight (larger power supply) difference may be something to consider as the amps will struggle is the PS can't power them fully.


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

tonyvdb said:


> Steve, may I ask what you will be using for speakers in your room?
> The only downfall I see to the Denon 4000 is it's weight is almost 15 lbs lighter than the onkyos all the receivers you have listed are using AB switching amps so the weight (larger power supply) difference may be something to consider as the amps will struggle is the PS can't power them fully.


Thank you Tony. Excellent question.

The room is small with the house built in 1979. It was intended to be a dining, children's play, TV area next to the kitchen where the kitchen is an open island/counter half-wall on the side to the left of the viewers/listeners. The right side is a glass slider and 1/2 wall window with curtains. The TV is on a full wall (drywall) and another full wall (drywall) is behind the listeners/viewers. The room is 11' wide x 14.5' deep with the listeners ears about 9' - 12' from the speakers and TV. Ceiling is cottage cheese style. 

Currently:
FM are KLH 15" 3-way ported mains 8 ohm about 8' apart center to center
CC is Infinity like 5" dual - one may be passive I don't know but I just found the foam is going so this will change
SS. are JBL 12" 4 way ported knockoffs 8 ohm. Made in the JBL factory but sold locally in Los Angeles under another name
rear is 2x Polk Audio 5" bookshelf speakers 8 ohms. Right now down low rather than right behind viewers heads due to size of room. 

Proposed next spring will be to move the 15" to the sides or sell them and buy a pair of ARX A5's or Klipsch RF62, maybe 82. I don't think we have enough room to go wide also. 

I am 63, my hearing is suffering and it is critical I get as much clarity as I can from the system. Many of the current movies with younger actors when they talk really low to one another I cannot hear what they are saying. I wear hearing aids but it doesn't help much. My doctor tells me that lots of people complain about the same issues these days as people no longer speech clearly to one another, especially in social situations - mumble is in if you don't have perfect hearing which I don't any longer. Older movies I have no problems hearing the actors. Someone like a Jimmy Stewart or a John Wayne is quite clear when they speak. Someone on Star Trek is not when they whisper to one another. 

I have given you more than you asked for, if it is too much forgive me. I trust this forum more than talking with a salesperson in a store. We had a good relationship with Good Guys when they were here, and even the staff at Circuit City was good to work with but Best Buy and Fry's aren't very well informed when we have talked with them. More a sales pitch than direct answers. 

Thanks again - Steve


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Kind of a mixed bag right now and none of them I would say being very efficient but once you get the Klipsch and or the Arx's that will help. I good centre channel is crucial for clear dialog so focus on that first. I'm partial to Onkyo as my 805 that's now going on 6 years old has never failed me. I was a big Yamaha fan prior but after upgrading to the Onkyo I will never go back. The sound quality difference was night and day.


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

tonyvdb said:


> Kind of a mixed bag right now and none of them I would say being very efficient but once you get the Klipsch and or the Arx's that will help. I good centre channel is crucial for clear dialog so focus on that first. I'm partial to Onkyo as my 805 that's now going on 6 years old has never failed me. I was a big Yamaha fan prior but after upgrading to the Onkyo I will never go back. The sound quality difference was night and day.


Thanks Tony - We are on our 2nd Onkyo and while the midrange seems a bit muddy on them to me over the years compared to the Pioneer and Sansui receivers I've had in years past, however overall the Onkyo units had lots of features for the money and we have been happy with them. We bought this one with XM from Circuit City. It was a demo and they paid for our XM for five years or so, we made money on that one. It was a real bargain  . 

Frankly, Denon never impressed me in the 1970's as their units then were over-priced and lacked depth in sound as I recall so considering one is a big step itself for me. We wouldn't even be considering upgrading the existing Onkyo unit other than it doesn't have HDMI and without that we can't even plug in a blue ray unless we look for a used or refurbished unit with component out. The TV will die someday not too far ahead as it is a nice cathode ray projection TV but we had to repair it last year, fortunately HomeTheaterShack helped us with that too. When it goes next time we will replace it and HDMI will be needed there too so that leaves us in a quandary. At any rate I see we must buy a center channel today as that is probably cheaper then sending two drivers off to be re-foamed.

I guess I have a decision to make. You've answered all my questions.

Update: Think we have decided on an Onkyo. Either a new 818 or a refurbished 929.


----------



## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
There are some truly wonderful ideas and very good questions posited on this thread. At this point, HDMI is a necessary evil if truly interested in getting the most from current HT technology. While in many ways I believe HDMI to be a trojan horse taken in offering vastly simpler connections all the while introducing vastly increased content protection. 

While I have no problem with content protection, I do have issues with HDMI's implementation. If I had a nickel for every HDMI Handshaking issue thread that I have responded to I would have been able to match Bose and Monster's marketing budget nickel by nickel providing a point/counterpoint to many of their fantastical claims. That or market an iPhone external speaker that can outmuscle a Klipsch Horn... I digress.

If pretty sure that Klipschs are going to be the speaker used in the near future, I would lean more towards Denon, Yamaha, and Pioneer Elite. While I am quite fond of Onkyo and have used many of their AVR's in the HDMI era, I do think their amplifier stages are what often gives them a leg up over competing brands. With speakers like Klipschs that can pump out the jams with a clock radio, what is usually the primary concern for most scenarios is simply not here. I do agree that Denon charges a premium over other brands. I will say that having my 4520 being built in Japan makes the premium easier for me to justify.
Cheers,
Jack


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> There are some truly wonderful ideas and very good questions posited on this thread. At this point, HDMI is a necessary evil if truly interested in getting the most from current HT technology. While in many ways I believe HDMI to be a trojan horse taken in offering vastly simpler connections all the while introducing vastly increased content protection.
> 
> While I have no problem with content protection, I do have issues with HDMI's implementation. If I had a nickel for every HDMI Handshaking issue thread that I have responded to I would have been able to match Bose and Monster's marketing budget nickel by nickel providing a point/counterpoint to many of their fantastical claims. That or market an iPhone external speaker that can outmuscle a Klipsch Horn... I digress.
> ...


Hi Jack - thank you for your sincerity. 

We were unaware that the the 4520 was still Japan made and would have pulled the trigger on that. Unfortunately I pulled the trigger on a NR-818 last night and hope I won't regret it in a year or two. I am not completely satisfied with Onkyo sound quality nor the HDMI issue, however at the price point of $700 it seemed more reasonable than spending double that. We can put the extra money into speakers and a new TV when the one we have dies.

I will admit that one of my biggest pet peeves is the over-engineering of additional features and the under-engineering of user friendliness / performance. Looking back, I was much happier with sound quality when there were just two channels and a slide bar equalizer to trim the sound. We just turned XM off on several radios because their desire to add 23,547 new stations (fictitious number but it seems like it) has resulted in compression algorithms that allow what feels like 100 ~ 3500 Hz frequency response at our ears - more like listening to a concert in a sea shell or pop bottle. I only hope all the features in the NR-818 don't come at the same kind of price long term.


----------



## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Ain't no shame in your game! I am quite fond of the 818 and truly think it to be an absurd value. I love that Onkyo uses such excellent video processing in the 800 Series and the aforementioned amplifier stage is great. I truly believe the 818 has a stronger amplifier stage than my 4520. However, I run the Denon in Preamp Mode Only and have never even connected speaker cables to the Denon's binding post. I probably should just to make sure the internal amplifiers are copacetic. Simply add the Onkyo extended warranty and all should be well. My experience with Onkyo has been overwhelmingly positive. A TX-SR805 that I sold to a friend in Florida is still even going strong.


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

Jungle Jack said:


> Ain't no shame in your game! I am quite fond of the 818 and truly think it to be an absurd value. I love that Onkyo uses such excellent video processing in the 800 Series and the aforementioned amplifier stage is great. I truly believe the 818 has a stronger amplifier stage than my 4520. However, I run the Denon in Preamp Mode Only and have never even connected speaker cables to the Denon's binding post. I probably should just to make sure the internal amplifiers are copacetic. Simply add the Onkyo extended warranty and all should be well. My experience with Onkyo has been overwhelmingly positive. A TX-SR805 that I sold to a friend in Florida is still even going strong.


Thx for the support - Steve


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

I would like to thank everyone who helped me decide on the new receiver. Your answers meant a lot to me, and in the end I feel confident that the NR-818 at $700 gives me the best for my money right now. The difference between it and the others is almost double which I will use to buy a new pair of speakers. 

Edit: Used part of the difference to pull the trigger on a pair of used RF-62, and a RC-52 center today. Can anyone guess which would be the best sound?

1) 
Wide front: RF62
Front: full spectrum KLH 15" 3-way

2) 
Wide front: full spectrum KLH 15" 3-way
Front: RF-62


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

anyone on the last question?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

The RF62 as your main front hands down. A much better speaker


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

Thank you - will do. Steve


----------



## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

What Tony said. The Klipschs are great HT speakers and their efficiency makes them all AVR's best friend.


----------



## hjones4841 (Jan 21, 2009)

I have been a Kllpsch fan for over 40 years and I do prefer them over other brands. However, I rarely listen to other brands anymore to compare . PWK used to say that the midrange is where we live, so that was the design criteria, at least while he was running the company. Based on the sound of my Klipsch Reference setup in the master bedroom, I think that is still the philosophy.

One of the best center channel speakers I ever heard, and owned for a while, was a Klipsch Academy. I sold mine, regrettably, to help pay for my Klipschorns and Belle center channel. Many times I wish I had kept it, but I never dreamed I would have more than one surround setup in the house. My how times have changed...


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

hjones4841 said:


> I have been a Kllpsch fan for over 40 years and I do prefer them over other brands. However, I rarely listen to other brands anymore to compare . PWK used to say that the midrange is where we live, so that was the design criteria, at least while he was running the company. Based on the sound of my Klipsch Reference setup in the master bedroom, I think that is still the philosophy.
> 
> One of the best center channel speakers I ever heard, and owned for a while, was a Klipsch Academy. I sold mine, regrettably, to help pay for my Klipschorns and Belle center channel. Many times I wish I had kept it, but I never dreamed I would have more than one surround setup in the house. My how times have changed...


Thank you. We have the NR-818 set aside for Christmas so I hooked the RF-62's up to the current receiver as the front mains with the 15" KLH as the wide speakers until I can afford a subwoofer and better wide speakers. The RC-52 is the center now too. The sound is great. Really enjoyed some music, part of a musical on TV and some just basic plain ole TV. The voices and instruments are clear and crisp. The are harmonics in the instruments and a piano sounds like a piano again. Y'all gave me wonderful advice and I appreciate it. Thank you.


----------



## jrlorenzen (Nov 28, 2013)

All, 

I have really enjoyed reading your posts. It is been very helpful and informative. The suggestions have been honest and detailed.

Recently my home theater in a box system has died. I don't want to repeat the same mistake and buy an integrated system that must be replaced when one component dies. I am interested in starting my home theater by buying a receiver. I don't want to get something that needs to be upgraded every 2 to 3 years. However, my wife has placed a 500-700 limit on this purchase. I want to buy something in the next 24-36 hours for Black Friday. 

Here is what I need it to do:
- Airplay or Wifi streaming
- streaming of Netflix
- 4-5 HDMI inputs for ROKU, iPad, Blu-Ray and Wi-II
- iPhone interactive app
- 2 or more zones for when we build our new home. 

I want this to be a solid system that I can build around for the next couple years. 

PS. I am open to using the discount refurbished website so your recommendations can be posted as links to their current listings

Thank you. God bless you! Happy Thanksgiving.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Have a look at this Onkyo 818, it fits your budget and is very feature rich and has a great amplification section.
It will be good for many years as it has almost all the latest features available.


----------



## jrlorenzen (Nov 28, 2013)

tonyvdb, thank you for the useful and timely input. You are an asset to this forum.

The NR-818 is the solution that sgkent settle on too. I am a value buyer, not the cheapest or most expensive. I want to get the best feature set and product that my purchasing power can get. 

Do you have any insight on the main differences between NR-818 and the NR-828? Do you feel that there are any other systems that if you paid an additional $100 or so dollars you would have a better feature set/overall value?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

The 828 is a step down in a fair way as it has a lesser level of room correction as well as lower power output and also does not employ the HQV video processor.


----------



## sgkent (Aug 19, 2012)

my research led me to believe also the NR-828 is step down even though the numbering remains consistent. The NR-929 came closest to the NR-818 in my research however we could not afford the $1299 at this time. The NR-818 is discontinued and few places have new in the box ones. Amazon and Crutchfield were the only places I could find who still had new ones. You can buy a factory refurbished NR-929 for $929 from accessories for less. Our NR-818 arrived from Crutchfield and while we have not hooked it up yet until Christmas or we are done painting the inside of the house, which ever comes first, it is new in the box so I have every reason to believe it is an "A unit.


----------



## jrlorenzen (Nov 28, 2013)

Are there any advantages to the NR-828? Connectivity? Software Interface? Why the step to the NR-828? Accessories4less does not have any of the NR-828.


----------



## jrlorenzen (Nov 28, 2013)

Gentlemen, Okay. I have the Onkyo NR-818 in my cart and am ready to pull the trigger. However, I have another questions. I am upgrading my home theater and trying to do it on a budget. I am thinking my best bet would be to get a new sound bar and subwoofer. 

Can you confirm that this a the best bang for the buck and most impactful? What would you recommend? Thank you again and God bless.

P.S. tonyvdb, I checked out the pictures in your photo album. Your home theater is amazing. How many years did you spend building up your theater and system?


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

My room and system has taken years, I started building it in about 2008 and had some of the audio gear already from my previous place but never had a dedicated Theater. I originally had an old Sanyo 720p projector and upgraded to the fixed screen and the current Panasonic projector I have now. It's a fun hobby but it can take a toll on your pocketbook if not carful 

Regarding the sound bar and sub to be honest I don't think they offer very decent bang for buck. What is your budget on that?


----------



## jrlorenzen (Nov 28, 2013)

tonyvdb, 

I have (had) a Home Theater in a Box that was a "Network Blu-Ray Home Theater" LHB975 from LG. It was great for the first two years. Then the wireless receiver and wireless subwoofer both went out, that left us with basically 2.1 sound. In the last two months the Blu-Ray player has gone to absolute . I have to open and close the disc tray 6-8 times to get it to take some movies and Blu-ray movies, and some movies it will never play but just errors out. 

So I am ordering the Onkyo NR-818. This will be my first singular component AV purchase. I was planning on using the existing speakers that came with the LHB975 until I could purchase some good quality speakers. I thought a good sound bar would be a stop gap measure that could then be used as the center channel for a future speaker upgrade.

I figure I have $300-500 for speaker/sound bar purchases. Just not sure what to do. I have a stand alone Blu-ray player, ROKU, iPad and Wii that I will be running through the AVR. This will be our only entertainment and music system.

Thoughts? Trying to be smart in how I proceed.

Blessings.

J.R.

P.S. I have five kids... ages 9, 7, 5, 3, 2. So I need to wall mount, ceiling mount or secure my sound options in some manner to avoid tampering and damage.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

The sound bar won't function as a centre channel so not a good choice for a stop gap. Pioneer makes a good system minus the sub here
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Speakers/Home+Theater+Speakers
They would be a good choice if budget is a concern. 
For a sub that's where you need som cash in order to get anything decent. This sub from HSU is the cheapest I would recommend
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/stf-2.html


----------



## jrlorenzen (Nov 28, 2013)

Tonyvdb,

What is the pioneer package? The link took me to an overall speaker page.


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Yes, that's right, you can pick and choose what speakers you want/afford. They are good quality for what they cost.


----------



## Dougme57 (Sep 4, 2013)

I agree on the soundboard. I personally have not heard one I really liked. Yes, let us know your budget and I think we can head you in a better direction. There is some very good economically priced stuff out there. Sorry, chiming in here and can not recall the whole post. Were you doing 5.1 now?


----------

