# Onkyo 876 Problem



## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

About 3 weeks ago my Right Front Polk Audio R50 took a great tumble and was knocked over rather hard. AT first it was working fine and everything. However, it started to be spotty and work sometimes, and other times not at all. I attributed it could be the fall. But today my Left Front Polk Audio R50 stopped working. I thought it was weird, and since the wife was the one who knocked over the Right one, I thought she may have switched them so I wouldn't notice the right side not working sometimes. Well, WHen I tried with the connections on the back, it turned off my Onkyo 876. I use Banana plugs for my connections, and have an idea it may be one problem. And now my Onkyo is blinking the Standby light on the front, and won't stay on.

Any ideas?

Also, last night my fuse box got tripped and had to reset the fuse for that section, could that be a possibility? I have a surge protector for the Stereo and rest of the equipment


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Have you tried to unplug the receiver from the power and let it sit for about 10 min and plug back in.
disconnect the two front speakers before you plug it back in and see what happens.


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## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

I unplugged it for 10 minutes, and than unplugged the main's, at the speaker level, and it still turned off after turning on.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

it sounds like a fault and is shutting down. Unplug the receiver again and unhook all the speakers at the receiver end (yes I know this is a pain) plug the receiver back in and try again.


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## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

Man, this 876 is so heavy and large that my TV stand has to have it on the bottom shelf...and sticking out like a good 2 inches. getting it out is kinda a pain because i only have about 3 to 4 inches clearance over the onkyo. so i have to pull it nearly completely out, than push the wires back.


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## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

So I unplugged it yet again, than disconnected the speakers. After 10 minutes or so, i plugged it back in where it still turned off after i turned it on


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Thats not a good sign, You should give Onkyo's customer service a call and see what they say. I suspect something got damaged inside.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

I did some searching and it seems that if this happens you may need to unplug everything from the back of the receiver and then power it up again as some other piece of equipment could be causing this issue as well particularly anything using HDMI. The flashing standby light means that it is in "protect mode".
I do think that something is shorting out inside the Polk that got knocked down and that in turn has caused some sort of issue with the 876.


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## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

Ha, I did unplug everything from the 876. Even the HDMI out, the inputs, all outs...still nothing.

I sent a note to Onkyo Support. Hopefully I will get a response


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## Lordoftherings (Feb 8, 2009)

Brock, you never mentioned if you're Bi-Amping your two front Polk R50 main speakers?
I see that you are using your system as a 5.1-channel configuration.


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## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

Yes, its a 5.1 configuration. But no, they are not bi-amped. 

I sent it in to a local service center. But its a 40 mile drive...and it was during rush hour. A 40 min drive took almost 2 hours...and a lot of cutting people off and taking the carpool lane here and there to get there in time. I got there 4 min before it closed.

*whew*


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## Lordoftherings (Feb 8, 2009)

Glad you made it in the neck of a time Brock. 

* And also glad that you don't try to bi-amp either, it's not the right way to do things with that receiver and your speakers anyway.
You are much better off to simply use the two additional amps for a second zone, or for Back surrounds eventually.

Please, keep in touch for the latest developments regarding your receiver.

Good luck,
Bob


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## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

Yeah.

Well, also...i couldnt find my original sales reciept. Although, the AVR hasnt even been released for 2 years yet, i had to email the invoice to them to get confirmation of it being purchased under warranty.

I did that, and hope it will go well. They said it might have to be sent to my regional service center 1000 miles away. But thats good for me, the shipping is covered by them. WHile for me, it was around 60$ for ground shipping of it, and over 250 for most other forms of shipping.


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## Lordoftherings (Feb 8, 2009)

Over 250 for most other forms of shipping???


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## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

Yea, UPS, FedEx and USPS all quoted me around 200-320$ to ship it. Its mainly because the cost of the product itself, when I claimed it as at least 1000$, and over 50lbs, every shipping choice possible was over 50$, only one was under 100$, and 80% of the rest were over 250$.

Quite a nightmare I thought


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## Lordoftherings (Feb 8, 2009)

Indeed, this is outrageous! I will try to contact Onkyo and see what they can do about this.
It just don't make sense at all, as your 876 is still under warranty.

Bob


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## the_rookie (Sep 30, 2008)

When I called them, they said I had to pay for shipping to them, parts, labor and shipping back would all be covered.

But If i wanted I could take to a local service center, I could and then it would all be on them to ship around if needed.


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

These problems with Onkyo receivers seem to be popping up a lot lately. Yours is another problem I've heard of. This is why I no longer recommend their products. It looks to me like they have reliability problems. I hope you get this straightened out.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

lsiberian said:


> These problems with Onkyo receivers seem to be popping up a lot lately. Yours is another problem I've heard of. This is why I no longer recommend their products. It looks to me like they have reliability problems. I hope you get this straightened out.


As with all consumer end electronics there will be bad units floating around. Yamaha, Denon, Sony, Marantz and Pioneer all have problems if you look around hard enough. Look at the so called Onkyos catching Fire report, so far not one member on the Shack has had an issue with that and it was reported to be a wide spread problem. Its just fear mongering if you ask me because of one bad customer.


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## glaufman (Nov 25, 2007)

tonyvdb said:


> Its just fear mongering if you ask me because of one bad customer.


That's all too common. Especially when one competitor is eating another's lunch in a given segment, any ***** in the armor will get highly publicized. 

It's good if you can get it to a local center. Most MFRs I've dealt with and worked for make returning warranty repairs the expense of the customer so they're not liable for insane costs if you take it into the wilderness. So what they're telling you about covering the costs once you get it into their hands doesn't sound unreasonable to me at all.


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## Lordoftherings (Feb 8, 2009)

lsiberian said:


> These problems with Onkyo receivers seem to be popping up a lot lately. Yours is another problem I've heard of. This is why I no longer recommend their products. It looks to me like they have reliability problems. I hope you get this straightened out.


"Popping up a lot lately"? Excuse me, I don't think so amigo.

You want hear horror stories about Harman Kardon, Denon, Marantz, Pioneer, Yamaha, Sony, Sherwood, NAD, Rotel...?

Come on lsiberian, be realistic here, get your info straight up, and don't start false rumors.


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## Lordoftherings (Feb 8, 2009)

the_rookie said:


> When I called them, they said I had to pay for shipping to them, parts, labor and shipping back would all be covered.
> 
> But If i wanted I could take to a local service center, I could and then it would all be on them to ship around if needed.


Ok, that's more like it now.


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

I am a first time poster but have been browsing the forums for many months. Including help in researching for a new receiver back in december of 09.

Well six months later and what i thought was a good choice has turned out to be a bummer. I also have problems with my 876

i'm very dissapointed in this top of the line piece. Never purchased an onkyo before and decided to give them a shot. I've always been into high end audio from car to home use. I can't believe this thing stopped working after 6months. Bought this when they were $800 (brand new not refurbished) so there was a big discount and luckily it was through an authorized dealer.

Amp protecting mode has kicked on and i have no way of resetting it without taking it to an authorized dealer. Tried all the tricks from unplugging to clearing and nothing has worked. I would understand if i did something wrong, but i was listening with it on at a low level (it was late at night and i live in an apartment). Went to turn it off with the remote to go to bed, and i heard a bad click when it turned off (the whole noisy relay clicking sound when it turns on/off which seems to be normal has somewhat bothered me since day one). 

I noticed in one of the replys they mentioned about bi-amping. I am bi-amping since my front speakers are capable of doing this. They have the jumper bars for doing this. Not sure if this could be the cause of the problem, but now i feel like i will have to baby this thing when i get it back. Definately not what i was expecting when paying that kind of money. This thing should be built like a tank.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

indytta said:


> They have the jumper bars for doing this. Not sure if this could be the cause of the problem, but now i feel like i will have to baby this thing when i get it back. Definately not what i was expecting when paying that kind of money. This thing should be built like a tank.


Hi and welcome to the Shack!

You did remove the jumpers between the two sets of speaker binding posts before you hooked them up right?
A major cause of this is usually a loose strand of wire touching the opposite terminal and happens allot more than you think.


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

tonyvdb said:


> Hi and welcome to the Shack!
> 
> You did remove the jumpers between the two sets of speaker binding posts before you hooked them up right?
> A major cause of this is usually a loose strand of wire touching the opposite terminal and happens allot more than you think.


Yep, i did remove the jumper bars. I've also used banana plugs to help with the possibility of touched wires on the back. But it could be a possibility still.

I'm wondering if its somekind of signal conditioning thing. Maybe when i turned of the air conditioner something happened. Even though they are not plugged into the same outlet.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

indytta said:


> I'm wondering if its somekind of signal conditioning thing. Maybe when i turned of the air conditioner something happened. Even though they are not plugged into the same outlet.


very unlikely, it could be a problem with the speakers themselves. Given the receiver is only 6 month old its under warranty so I would contact Onkyo and tell them your issue do not say anything about bi-amping or anything like that just get to the point and say it just went into protect mode and now will not work at all.


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## mcoghill (Jan 27, 2010)

You may have a short circuit internal to the speaker that was knocked over. Disconnect it from your system and see what happens. You will need to look at the Onkyo manual or talk to their tech support to see how it deals with a shorted a output, and how to reset it. If you have a ohm meter put it across the speaker's input terminals after you have disconnected it and see what it reads, should be greater than 4 ohms. Good luck!

MC


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

tonyvdb said:


> very unlikely, it could be a problem with the speakers themselves. Given the receiver is only 6 month old its under warranty so I would contact Onkyo and tell them your issue do not say anything about bi-amping or anything like that just get to the point and say it just went into protect mode and now will not work at all.


Thanks, just dropped it off at the service center right now. Getting checked by authorized service center.

I'm guessing i should be able to check speakers by hooking up an ohmeter to them? They are Paradigms that i've had for about 8yrs. I have a sub but thats connected but hardly ever used since i live in an apartment. 

Strange coincidence but i have had car audio problems lately also. Subwoofer was blown but luckily my amp still works. Why are home amps so finicky with protection? Car audio amps seem to be able to handle rough environments a lot better (temperature, shorts, low impedeance etc).


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Yup, check them with an ohm meter and see what you get. My honest opinion is bi-amping with most speakers using the internal amps of a receiver yields little to no difference in performance particularly a receiver like the 876 as its got plenty of headroom.
Car amps are able to draw power at a much higher amperage and this can sometimes give a more stable trouble free system but that said its really hit and miss. you have to remember that a receiver like the 876 has far more processing power and features than most if not all car audio systems so fare more possibilities of something going wrong.


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

tonyvdb said:


> Yup, check them with an ohm meter and see what you get. My honest opinion is bi-amping with most speakers using the internal amps of a receiver yields little to no difference in performance particularly a receiver like the 876 as its got plenty of headroom.
> Car amps are able to draw power at a much higher amperage and this can sometimes give a more stable trouble free system but that said its really hit and miss. you have to remember that a receiver like the 876 has far more processing power and features than most if not all car audio systems so fare more possibilities of something going wrong.


When i get this thing back i'm probably not going to bi-amp it. But i have misplaced the jumper bars. Can i just use some wire to jumper? Would i just tie the two black connectors together and the red connectors together?


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

indytta said:


> But i have misplaced the jumper bars. Can i just use some wire to jumper? Would i just tie the two black connectors together and the red connectors together?


Yes that all you need to do


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

tonyvdb said:


> Yes that all you need to do


So, i measured the speakers with an ohmeter.

The paradigms say impedance compatable with 8ohms, so i had configured the onkyo for greater the 6ohms option. But when i measure the front speakers, they measure 4ohms when the posts are jumpered together, and when i measure the 2 posts unjumpered the top post is open and the bottom post is 4ohms. Not sure what this means. Both the front and left read the same thing.

The rear surrounds which are also paradigm read 9ohms.


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

Okay, so i finally got my receiver back after being repaired. Although i have been noted that it was abuse.

They put a couple of notes on it.

1) Could have been due to overheating (ventilation).
2) Damaged Speakers
3) Or playing to loud.

I'm ruling out number 3 because i live in a apartment and don't play the stereo loud.

So i either have a damaged speaker or its overheating. I'm trying to figure out if my paradigms are damaged but the things only say compatable with 8ohms so not sure what i should be measuring with the ohmeter.

My backs Left/Right measure 9.4 ohms and my fronts measure 4ohms. Anybody have any ideas? Really don't want to reconnect until i found out the speakers are ok. 

For all i know maybe the amp overheated and damaged the speakers.


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## lcaillo (May 2, 2006)

From these options, I would assume you had a problem in the output stage or power supply. They leave out the most common problem, shorted speaker wires, or strands touching from positive to negative at the terminals.

Who did the service, what did they end up changing to fix it? If you post more detail, it may be helpful to others in the future.


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

I was thinking it could be a shorted wire somewhere also so i bought some better bannana plugs (got the closed screw instead of open screw). I've had them hooked up for awhile so didn't think that could have been it but who knows. Maybe i had too much wire sticking through the holes.

Anyways it was warranted so didn't pay anything. It was a authorized repair facility 30 minutes from where i live.

they replaced the following
1) 1 - 1B170564-1E Power Amp PCB
2) 2 - 2202843 Transistor
3) 2 - 2202833 Transistor
4) 4 - 453532294T Resistor
5) 2 - 40000233S Resistor
6) 4 - 415471014T Resistor 

If it did overheat, i'd be pretty disappointed. Don't they have a mechanism to shutdown from overheating before anything gets damaged?


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## lcaillo (May 2, 2006)

Most do, but repeatedly running a unit with a short or an overheating condition will eventually take out the output devices or power supply.

It is curious that they replaced the board AND all the parts listed.

Post the details of your connections to the unit and the load it is driving. Perhaps someone will recognize a problem.


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

I had Paradigm Monitor 5's in the front bi-amped, APD170's in the rear, and a CC370 for the center.

I'm somewhat bothered by the fact that i measure 4ohms in the front and i had my amp configured for greater than 6 ohms. 

I understand that its only DC resistance i'm measuring, but something isn't right for something to go wrong with it so soon.

And the amp never shut off due to overheating or any such other thing before this happened. There actually wasn't even any sound coming through the speakers as i had my headphones on and turned off the radio when i heard a bad pop. Tried to turn it back on and thats when it went into protect mode.

I came across this with somebody else running into problems bi-amping with paradigm speakers
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=275279&page=2

I know i won't be bi-amping it when i get it connected, but i've yet to connect anything because i'm a little paranoid about the readings i'm getting with the speakers. Should i be so worried.


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## lcaillo (May 2, 2006)

It is completely normal for a speaker rated for 8 ohms to read resistance of 4 ohms or less. Impedance is a much more complex value, composed of the resistance, inductive reactance, and capacitive reactance of the speaker system. Impedance is not one value, but changes across frequency.

Your problem was likely that you had the amp set for higher impedance and had it bridged at the same time. Over time you likely just cooked it. I have never been a fan of bridging most products anyway, and in a receiver, it is likely a bad idea. 

Just use it without bridging, give it better ventilation, and note the temperature. If it gets too hot to comfortably put your hand on the top and keep it there, you likely have a problem. Be very careful about your connections to the speakers and be sure that you have no strands misplaced that might cause a short. I doubt that this last suggestion was a problem because you did not trigger the protection in the amp. The fact that it cooked the board indicates operating the unit just below where the thermal protection would activate for a long time, i.e. a marginal application.


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

lcaillo said:


> It is completely normal for a speaker rated for 8 ohms to read resistance of 4 ohms or less. Impedance is a much more complex value, composed of the resistance, inductive reactance, and capacitive reactance of the speaker system. Impedance is not one value, but changes across frequency.
> 
> Your problem was likely that you had the amp set for higher impedance and had it bridged at the same time. Over time you likely just cooked it. I have never been a fan of bridging most products anyway, and in a receiver, it is likely a bad idea.
> 
> Just use it without bridging, give it better ventilation, and note the temperature. If it gets too hot to comfortably put your hand on the top and keep it there, you likely have a problem. Be very careful about your connections to the speakers and be sure that you have no strands misplaced that might cause a short. I doubt that this last suggestion was a problem because you did not trigger the protection in the amp. The fact that it cooked the board indicates operating the unit just below where the thermal protection would activate for a long time, i.e. a marginal application.


Thanks for the help. Gonna try hooking it up this weekend again.

Guess i have to realize that the days are long gone where things were built tough and simple. These things are just more complex and fragile. Growing up i remember messing around with my dads Sansui receiver trying to get many speakers connected to it. It would just shut off and you could turn it back on without a problem. The thing still works after 30yrs.

I also have to realize that car audio stuff is a little different also. Bridging in car audio is almost common place.


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## indytta (Jul 16, 2010)

Well, i finally got around to hooking this thing up. After more research i'm guessing it could have been a ventiallation problem. Ended up getting a new stand to help with it.

Before i had a little over 2 inches on the top. The back of the cabinet was open. The side had very little room. I guessed it would be okay because my previous receiver i had in their had a little more room and had been in their for about 6 yrs without a problem.

These things get hot. My new cabinet is not even a cabinet anymore. It is a rack where i have it mounted on a glass shelf with openings all around. The shelf on top if it is about 4" away. The manual specifies 8":yikes:. Why don't these guys put a fan in these things.

Going to by this thing to help with it
http://www.buyextras.com/evavcoblfanf.html

I noticed a lot of the reviewer use onkyos also


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