# AVR Opinions Please



## HughACA (Aug 25, 2010)

I'm helping a friend to put together a budget setup.

I found some info on Denon 1911 and it seems to be a good enough avr.

What do you guys think?

Thanks,


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## Steve_Vai_rules (Jun 22, 2010)

Hugh said:


> I'm helping a friend to put together a budget setup.
> 
> I found some info on Denon 1911 and it seems to be a good enough avr.
> 
> ...


the denon is nice, dont discount the stuff from onkyo or harman kardon. 

Personally I think the harman stuff sounds quite nice, and there is a bit of a trickle down effect considering the size of harman and the vast array of audio companies (and thus technologies) under it's umbrella..

Just my 2 cents.


Matt


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## tthurman (Jan 7, 2010)

My brother in law just finished his setup a few months ago. He had to have a HTIB and it had to come from Best Buy. After swaying him away from the real cheap brands he went with a Boston Acoustics set that is actually pretty nice. It came with what translated to a 1610 and it gets the job done if all your looking for is basic features. The 1911 should be a little more feature rich but I would image similar sound wise.

From what I've read the 2311 is the sweet spot in the current line up but it's also upwards to $300 more.


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## cdy2179 (Mar 2, 2008)

That's a nice AVR, personally I'd get a mid-priced AVR with PRE-OUTS with all the options you want.... Later on or now....match it up with an Emotiva XPA-3 or 5 and for the same money as those high-end AVRs you'll have a AVR/amp combo that'll spank the pricey AVRs around with ease. Not sure if the 1910 has Pre-outs but this would be my biggest make or break spec...Room for future upgrade of you amps is a must IMO. But it may not be too big of a deal for your friend...of course he may want more power later!

Don't worry about upconverting video AVRs and all that.... it's a waste of money (unless your TV has a ****** upconverter in it) All high def TVs will upconvert or down convert all material to fit the native resolution of your screen.


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

The Pioneer receivers are fantastic and super cheap online, I'd go for one of those over anything else unless having pre-outs is a sticking point. The new versions out (for under $400) also have decent video upconversion. They have plenty of options and amazing sound quality for the price.


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

I would skip the Denon to avoid it's complicated remote control and setup menu. You'd have to learn a third language to understand the Denon. I had a headache trying to setup a friend's Denon 1909.

A second vote for the Pioneer. Get one with pre-outs for future amp(s).

And if your friend is old like you, which I'm guessing is the case , he may have older components that would need upconversion (or is it transcoding) to HDMI. So you might consider one that can do analog to HDMI conversion.

Oh yea, get a Logitech remote control, too. You know who to talk to if you want to go with Onkyo. Their features and ease of use is very nice, but I'm not crazy about their SQ.


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## dvenardos (Sep 27, 2008)

My experience with the budget receivers is the biggest sound quality upgrade comes from going with an external amp. If you can get something cheaper with pre-outs and then fit in at least a two-channel external amp that would make a big difference. What other components will he be using?


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

dvenardos said:


> My experience with the budget receivers is the biggest sound quality upgrade comes from going with an external amp. If you can get something cheaper with pre-outs and then fit in at least a two-channel external amp that would make a big difference. What other components will he be using?


The actual rated wattage of the included amps rarely meets the specs manufacturers claim. It's certainly improved over the years, but sensitivity of the speakers can often determine the necessity of an external amp. External amps certainly make little sense in a 'budget' setup though where speakers should comprise most of the budget.


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## sandbagger (Oct 10, 2009)

I will vote for Pioneer also, just hooked one up for a friend and was pretty happy with it


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## Mike_WI (Feb 26, 2009)

I'm also looking for an AVR.
I just need a 2ch AVR with HDMI switching.
Just for my gym setup to use WAF-1's and avoid using stereo speakers.

I was consider this:
Pioneer VSX-520-K Audio/Video Receiver
$200 at Amazon

Thoughts?

Mike


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## HughACA (Aug 25, 2010)

Thanks guys,

What Pioneer model do you recommend?


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

Start with the Elite model. I was thinking that it would have to start with the VSX23 to have pre-outs, but looking at the Pioneer site, the base Elite model (VSX21) does have pre-outs:

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/P...AV-Receivers/EliteReceivers/ci.VSX-21TXH.Kuro

I can't tell if the not-yet-released top-of-the-line non-Elite model (1120) has multi-channel pre-outs or just L/R outs:

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/P...Receivers/PioneerReceivers/ci.VSX-1120-K.Kuro

The Elites come with 2-year warranty vs. the regular model's 1-year warranty.


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

Mike_TX said:


> I'm also looking for an AVR.
> I just need a 2ch AVR with HDMI switching.
> Just for my gym setup to use WAF-1's and avoid using stereo speakers.
> 
> ...


That's interesting...I didn't think HDMI and 2-ch go together  That would be quite useful for those of us with just 2 speakers in the bedroom. Sounds like a pretty good price...but 20 lbs? One of the cages for my new Melody mono block weighs more than that


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

Ooops...I didn't see those rinky-dink speaker terminals  I thought it was just a stereo receiver and was wondering why they were advertising 5.1 speaker sets with it


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## Mike_WI (Feb 26, 2009)

PhenomeNhan said:


> That's interesting...I didn't think HDMI and 2-ch go together  That would be quite useful for those of us with just 2 speakers in the bedroom. Sounds like a pretty good price...but 20 lbs? One of the cages for my new Melody mono block weighs more than that





PhenomeNhan said:


> Ooops...I didn't see those rinky-dink speaker terminals  I thought it was just a stereo receiver and was wondering why they were advertising 5.1 speaker sets with it


Remember my qualifier as just looking for something for HDMI switching and sound better than my TV speakers -- that part should be easy.

I don't need 5.1/7.1, Audyssey, etc. but a lot of stuff comes with that even if not needed.

Mike


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

Pioneer, non-elite models, 919/1019 were last year's models...I forget the new ones. They use very high quality A/B chipamps that measured really well and have super low crossover distortion. The Elite models will give you extra features and more power (I think), but really aren't worth the extra money unless you have power hungry speakers. Wasting that much on a budget setup really makes no sense. Spend where the money gets you something...speakers.


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## HughACA (Aug 25, 2010)

Agreed.

As far as speakers are concerned, I'm dumping my av123's on them. 

At least, I'll make some money instead of discarding them to the landfill.


Cujobob said:


> Pioneer, non-elite models, 919/1019 were last year's models...I forget the new ones. They use very high quality A/B chipamps that measured really well and have super low crossover distortion. The Elite models will give you extra features and more power (I think), but really aren't worth the extra money unless you have power hungry speakers. Wasting that much on a budget setup really makes no sense. Spend where the money gets you something...speakers.


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> Pioneer, non-elite models, 919/1019 were last year's models...I forget the new ones. They use very high quality A/B chipamps that measured really well and have super low crossover distortion. The Elite models will give you extra features and more power (I think), but really aren't worth the extra money unless you have power hungry speakers. Wasting that much on a budget setup really makes no sense. Spend where the money gets you something...speakers.


Having pre-outs and an extra year warranty is something to think about. If the non-elites do not have pre-outs there's no way to upgrade to an external amp in the future. But this is a moot point if this is not a requirement for Hugh, which he never confirmed, btw


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## rygher3 (Jan 8, 2009)

I'm sure the 1120 has pre-outs. The 1020 and lower do not.


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## imported_edward (Jan 31, 2009)

Hugh said:


> Agreed.
> 
> As far as speakers are concerned, I'm dumping my av123's on them.
> 
> At least, I'll make some money instead of discarding them to the landfill.


Ohhh that even hurt me.
After i stopped laughing that is.
Man thats just....
WOW.. gotta be the Post of the Week.
Oh oh here comes the laughter again...


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## dvenardos (Sep 27, 2008)

I was trying to find your post on those receivers. I am a big tripath fan and bet that would sound great.
Here are the links to the 919/1019 on Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001UA6OLS/?tag=googhydr-20&hvadid=4760553015&ref=pd_sl_654f6ndqgi_e
http://www.amazon.com/Pioneer-VSX-1...r-Black/dp/tech-data/B001UADEPC/ref=de_a_smtd


Cujobob said:


> Pioneer, non-elite models, 919/1019 were last year's models...I forget the new ones. They use very high quality A/B chipamps that measured really well and have super low crossover distortion. The Elite models will give you extra features and more power (I think), but really aren't worth the extra money unless you have power hungry speakers. Wasting that much on a budget setup really makes no sense. Spend where the money gets you something...speakers.


So glad I went with Minis instead of Rockets. 


Hugh said:


> Agreed.
> 
> As far as speakers are concerned, I'm dumping my av123's on them.
> 
> At least, I'll make some money instead of discarding them to the landfill.


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

PhenomeNhan said:


> Having pre-outs and an extra year warranty is something to think about. If the non-elites do not have pre-outs there's no way to upgrade to an external amp in the future. But this is a moot point if this is not a requirement for Hugh, which he never confirmed, btw


My point is this: With the additional money needed to upgrade to a model with pre-outs and the price of an additional amp combined...where are you sitting at now? $700+ I would wager. Now, how much are the speakers themselves worth? Since we can likely all agree that speakers make the biggest performance improvement as you go up the scale, buying a very high quality $300-ish dollar receiver frees up that much more money towards improving the sound where it counts...with the speakers. Hugh's giving him speakers, so perhaps this is pointless...but personally, I'd buy the highest quality inexpensive receiver I could find (which I believe the Pioneer to be), and mate the highest quality speakers I could afford to pair with the unit.

Once you spend several thousand dollars on speakers, then electronics start making sense for upgrades. But $700+ allows you to step into a whole new tier of sound with speakers that'd only be marginally better by going with a better amp. IMHO, of course... sorry to rant in this thread Hugh...mostly just bored


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> My point is this: With the additional money needed to upgrade to a model with pre-outs and the price of an additional amp combined...where are you sitting at now? $700+ I would wager. Now, how much are the speakers themselves worth? Since we can likely all agree that speakers make the biggest performance improvement as you go up the scale, buying a very high quality $300-ish dollar receiver frees up that much more money towards improving the sound where it counts...with the speakers. Hugh's giving him speakers, so perhaps this is pointless...but personally, I'd buy the highest quality inexpensive receiver I could find (which I believe the Pioneer to be), and mate the highest quality speakers I could afford to pair with the unit.
> 
> Once you spend several thousand dollars on speakers, then electronics start making sense for upgrades. But $700+ allows you to step into a whole new tier of sound with speakers that'd only be marginally better by going with a better amp. IMHO, of course... sorry to rant in this thread Hugh...mostly just bored


I would agree with the exception of adding an amp to a $300-ish receiver making marginal improvements, based on my personal experience with an $800-1000 receiver. 

Until Hugh provides more requirements about what he's looking for, I think some of the stuff we mentioned are moot  Maybe he can accomplish what he needs with a $300 receiver, but I am only throwing in an Elite model as an option to all the other receivers mentioned. The price is also based on his mention of the Denon 1911. A Pioneer Elite 21 would be a little more expensive than the 1911, and the option for pre-outs and an extra year of warranty plus probably better resale value would be something to think about.
Also, I think the amp section is better, as the 1020 weighs a scant 27 lbs, vs. 43 for the Elite VSX21.

Knowing Hugh, he is probably going to push this friend toward more music listening. I don't think the friend can easily get rid of the Rocket, so the next best thing would be to upgrade the amp (again, no other requirements are known at this point). Maybe we should make Hugh fill out a requirements form before answering any more questions


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

Weight is a non-factor for the chipamp-based Pioneer models (at least 9xx and 10xx). Personally, I'd never again buy an $800+ receiver simply due to all of the upgrades we're seeing each year and the extremely low SQ upgrade. Most of the inexpensive receivers have been junk...some are quite good now.

I happen to use a $300 receiver with my mains that cost over $3,500 (95 db sensitivity though)...I've also tried them with higher-end stuff. SQ is right there with them and an added EQ to boot.

We seriously need to see more 93+ db speakers hit the market for newbies...

I'm honestly considering buying a new Pioneer receiver since this year's models have some nice new features and bumping my 919 to another room. The advantages of cheap receivers are many :rock:


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## HughACA (Aug 25, 2010)

So who's offering the best prices on line?

Btw Dave, it's 100% cool with me so please carry on.


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## cdy2179 (Mar 2, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> My point is this: With the additional money needed to upgrade to a model with pre-outs and the price of an additional amp combined...where are you sitting at now? $700+ I would wager. :


Yea it's a little pricey if you buy them at the same time...I paid $400 for my Yamaha NEW with Pre-outs, almost bought a Sony ES for $450 with Pre-outs. Emotiva B-stock $499 XPA-3. Total around 1k...but it'll kill any $2k AVR out there...the ability to "*be able*" to upgrade is "*priceless*".



Cujobob said:


> Since we can likely all agree that speakers make the biggest performance improvement as you go up the scale:


Treating your room will make the biggest improvement by far (first reflections)...no comparison... not even close..IMO.... followed by YES... the speakers..and 3rdly power (lots of headroom).


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

cdy2179 said:


> Yea it's a little pricey if you buy them at the same time...I paid $400 for my Yamaha NEW with Pre-outs, almost bought a Sony ES for $450 with Pre-outs. Emotiva B-stock $499 XPA-3. Total around 1k...but it'll kill any $2k AVR out there...the ability to "*be able*" to upgrade is "*priceless*".
> 
> 
> 
> Treating your room will make the biggest improvement by far (first reflections)...no comparison... not even close..IMO.... followed by YES... the speakers..and 3rdly power (lots of headroom).


Treating the room is very important, agreed, though I'd put that after speakers (it also largely depends on how bad the room is normally). My speakers ignore first reflection points, actually.

Well you have $950 invested into amplification. If you were to buy a receiver for $300-320 like the Pioneer I bought (it's price has gone up and down a bit, I bought it in the low $300s), you'd have 600+ extra dollars. If you have very high quality speakers, then that might not be enough to make a substantial difference, but if you had something like AV123 speakers...$600ish dollars can often be the difference between an X-Statik home theater and an ELT525 home theater.

The XPA-3 has plenty of power, if that's what you need, but it probably doesn't measure as well as the Pioneer 919 chipamp does. However, that point is moot if the speakers take more power than the chipamp provides. Certainly, there are variables, I won't deny this. In some cases, it makes sense....the Emotiva power amps are high-value home theater amps, though not the highest quality amps around for two-channel. Myself, I'd look into other options...like Gainclones, ClassD amps, etc....if I were forced into going external.


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## cdy2179 (Mar 2, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> . My speakers ignore first reflection points, actually.


:no clue:??? If you're speakers are ignoring reflection points try turning on your AVR....Just Kidding...I couldn't help it.eekaboo:

if your speakers produce sound they're affected by reflections...sound doesn't ignore reflection points..If you have X-statik IB speakers they are no different...(a sound wave is a sound wave) every first relection point will send audio at your ears after the original sound hit you comming from the speaker...this kills clarity and makes words hard to understand... instead of hearing a sound or word from your center once you hear that word of sound 4 or 5 times (off side walls, ceiling, hardwood floors, rear walls) all at different times (milliseconds apart)after the original sound hit you directly from the speaker.....lots of NOISE.

I sit 14' from my Rocket RS850s so to get to Reference or even close I need more power than an AVR can give me. At this distance even more sensitive speakers will need more to single handedly output reference SPLs.... before I got my Emotiva my 93.5db sens. Rockets would sometimes shutdown my AVR.


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

Constant directivity speakers when aimed in can ignore sidewall first reflection points. I treat the floor bounce with a heavy trap and have some stuff on my back wall and behind the speakers. Sidewalls are the biggest issue and the area behind the speakers is very important as well.


A lot of AVRs don't meet their specs...it's important to buy speakers that can live within a good inexpensive AVR's capabilities IMHO.


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## tesseract (Aug 9, 2010)

Cujobob said:


> Constant directivity speakers when aimed in can ignore sidewall first reflection points. I treat the floor bounce with a heavy trap and have some stuff on my back wall and behind the speakers. Sidewalls are the biggest issue and the area behind the speakers is very important as well.


Don't forget the ceiling! I also have a 24"x24"x2" acoustical foam panel that I use for music listening that perfectly covers the front on my old CRT. That made a big difference for 2 channel listening. Cover your televison.

Someday... a dedicated 2 channel room. :jiggy:


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## cdy2179 (Mar 2, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> Constant directivity speakers when aimed in can ignore sidewall first reflection points. I treat the floor bounce with a heavy trap and have some stuff on my back wall and behind the speakers. Sidewalls are the biggest issue and the area behind the speakers is very important as well.
> 
> 
> A lot of AVRs don't meet their specs...it's important to buy speakers that can live within a good inexpensive AVR's capabilities IMHO.


Horns and waveguides definately help, I've had a few sets in the room.... I personally don't think they negate the use of panels.... the only trick to really kill reflections off side walls (without panels) is to mount them into the corner.... There's a DIY kit manufacturer Pie (something or other ???) that makes horns for this application... but of couuse it only helps for the side wall the speaker is against... not the opposite wall or rear, ceiling, floor.

Ditto on the AVR, I have a hefty AVR (for the price range it's in), Power consumption is pretty good...I figure it puts out around 70wpc not the 105w the specs say...pretty much the norm for most mid-priced AVRs. The Rockets played loud with just the AVR... hitting reference from 14' is another story. Adding an amp did much more than give them headroom, even at lower volumes they sound much more dynamic and even imaging and seperation improved.


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

cdy2179 said:


> Horns and waveguides definately help, I've had a few sets in the room.... I personally don't think they negate the use of panels.... the only trick to really kill reflections off side walls (without panels) is to mount them into the corner.... There's a DIY kit manufacturer Pie (something or other ???) that makes horns for this application... but of couuse it only helps for the side wall the speaker is against... not the opposite wall or rear, ceiling, floor.
> 
> Ditto on the AVR, I have a hefty AVR (for the price range it's in), Power consumption is pretty good...I figure it puts out around 70wpc not the 105w the specs say...pretty much the norm for most mid-priced AVRs. The Rockets played loud with just the AVR... hitting reference from 14' is another story. Adding an amp did much more than give them headroom, even at lower volumes they sound much more dynamic and even imaging and seperation improved.


If the horn/waveguide is designed for narrow directivity, it is extremely easy to accomplish.

Rockets and Line Source speakers seem to take a lot of juice...despite their solid efficiency ratings and (I believe) decent impedance...

Maybe it's the greater number of drivers and extra wiring. The need for high power was one of the big reasons I shyed away from going with Line Source speakers.


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> If the horn/waveguide is designed for narrow directivity, it is extremely easy to accomplish.
> 
> Rockets and Line Source speakers seem to take a lot of juice...despite their solid efficiency ratings and (I believe) decent impedance...
> 
> Maybe it's the greater number of drivers and extra wiring. The need for high power was one of the big reasons I shyed away from going with Line Source speakers.


Not sure if the LS requires that much power. I'm running them with a couple of 21 Watt mono-block tubes (Class A) right now, and they can get pretty loud with the pre-amp's volume knob at 11 o'clock.

Perhaps some of the Rockets were outfitted with Parts Unknown? eekaboo:oke:


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## cdy2179 (Mar 2, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> If the horn/waveguide is designed for narrow directivity, it is extremely easy to accomplish.



Most people want a wide 60 deg or more horizontal dispertion... especially in HT rooms where you have a wide row of seating or a couch... you want good dispersion for all the seats not just yours. the closer you sit the wider the dispersion needs to be... Having a very narrow dispertion isn't practical. For speakers we use...even with constant directivity speaker....panels will greatly improve the clarity...



I used to not put too much merit into panels....then I built my own and was floored!:dizzy:


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## cdy2179 (Mar 2, 2008)

PhenomeNhan said:


> Not sure if the LS requires that much power. I'm running them with a couple of 21 Watt mono-block tubes (Class A) right now, and they can get pretty loud with the pre-amp's volume knob at 11 o'clock.
> 
> Perhaps some of the Rockets were outfitted with Parts Unknown? eekaboo:oke:


Ha.. who knows...I really like the Rockets...all the company problems aside they are great speakers..they have the ability to play much louder than my Paradigms 90db sens. even with the AVR only...it just takes a lot of juice to hit reference at 14' with a 93.5db speaker... even if my AVR truley put out 105w...it still wouldn't do it.

I have a feeling the Pro-10's are gonna kick the Rockets out of the HT and into the living room...i really don't want to sell them...Hopefully I'll never have a problem with them...and if I do and AV123 is still around...hopefully I can get parts (I won't hold my breath)...the crossover I could always repair myself...drivers (other than the Vifa) will be another story.


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

PhenomeNhan said:


> Not sure if the LS requires that much power. I'm running them with a couple of 21 Watt mono-block tubes (Class A) right now, and they can get pretty loud with the pre-amp's volume knob at 11 o'clock.
> 
> Perhaps some of the Rockets were outfitted with Parts Unknown? eekaboo:oke:


Even Danny has said that they work best with more power. When the LS9 (even higher sensitivity) were paired with the Red Rock (IIRC) 50 watt tube monos (like $50,000), everyone at the show said they sounded terrible.

I'm just going on what people have said on forums, to be honest. The amount of wiring in those speakers is much greater than a two-way, for example, though I've never really seen the effect that'd have on the wattage necessary.


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## HughACA (Aug 25, 2010)

Nhan is running his LS6 with Melody M845 Monos.

I never personally heard the Red Rock so I can't comment otherwise. 


Cujobob said:


> Even Danny has said that they work best with more power. When the LS9 (even higher sensitivity) were paired with the Red Rock (IIRC) 50 watt tube monos (like $50,000), everyone at the show said they sounded terrible.
> 
> I'm just going on what people have said on forums, to be honest. The amount of wiring in those speakers is much greater than a two-way, for example, though I've never really seen the effect that'd have on the wattage necessary.


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> Even Danny has said that they work best with more power. When the LS9 (even higher sensitivity) were paired with the Red Rock (IIRC) 50 watt tube monos (like $50,000), everyone at the show said they sounded terrible.
> 
> I'm just going on what people have said on forums, to be honest. The amount of wiring in those speakers is much greater than a two-way, for example, though I've never really seen the effect that'd have on the wattage necessary.


I'm not sure why the LS9s sounded bad with those Red Rock amps. I don't think anyone really tried to get to the bottom of that.

Amp quality (and system synergy) rather than pure wattage numbers should be the driving force behind what makes speakers sound good. I don't know the physics behind how much wires go into connecting drivers and what effects they have on the net power delivered.

Arthurs' amps are 300watt tube mono-blocks beasts, but he was seriously thinking about giving them up for a pair of 100 watt solid state amps we heard in Vegas in January. They were that good.


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## HughACA (Aug 25, 2010)

Synergy is the key. 


PhenomeNhan said:


> I'm not sure why the LS9s sounded bad with those Red Rock amps. I don't think anyone really tried to get to the bottom of that.
> 
> Amp quality (and system synergy) rather than pure wattage numbers should be the driving force behind what makes speakers sound good. I don't know the physics behind how much wires go into connecting drivers and what effects they have on the net power delivered.
> 
> Arthurs' amps are 300watt tube mono-blocks beasts, but he was seriously thinking about giving them up for a pair of 100 watt solid state amps we heard in Vegas in January. They were that good.


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## tesseract (Aug 9, 2010)

Hugh said:


> Synergy is the key.


You know, I keep telling people this... :no clue:


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## Cujobob (Feb 12, 2008)

Synergy generally translates to impedance matching or damping factor, I'd imagine. Some systems likely exploit amplifiers with high distortion near their point where they switch from Class A to Class B, as well. The word 'synergy' in audiophile terms just sounds like some sort of magic or voodoo to me when it's likely very easy to explain.


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## PhenomeNhan (Mar 4, 2008)

Cujobob said:


> Synergy generally translates to impedance matching or damping factor, I'd imagine. Some systems likely exploit amplifiers with high distortion near their point where they switch from Class A to Class B, as well. The word 'synergy' in audiophile terms just sounds like some sort of magic or voodoo to me when it's likely very easy to explain.


I'm sure that's a large part of it from the physics side, but when you deal with listening preferences and how we all differently interpret the sound we hear, this is something beyond physics.


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## tesseract (Aug 9, 2010)

Cujobob said:


> Synergy generally translates to impedance matching or damping factor, I'd imagine. Some systems likely exploit amplifiers with high distortion near their point where they switch from Class A to Class B, as well. The word 'synergy' in audiophile terms just sounds like some sort of magic or voodoo to me when it's likely very easy to explain.


It goes much deeper than merely amplifier classes, matching impedance (which is very important BTW), or damping factor. I don't know how you can match damping factor, you need so much, and anything past that does no good. Damping factor at higher frequencies should be looked at more... But we are talking power in this thread, and low switching distortion is important too, especially in light of the fact that most affordable receivers are A/B.

A system with synergy uses components that complement each other. Some components may be covering for flaws in other ancillaries to achieve this, YMMV. The goal is to build something you can live with. For awhile. Until the the upgrade bug bites. 

:bite me:


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