# Went to a home theater store last night....



## lucky53s (Mar 20, 2012)

I went in and explained to the guy (it was fairly small so he may be the owner) that I'm just setting up my first surround sound system and didn't want to go with some HTIB because I want to expand it to better speakers later and I want to use the zone 2 hookup for a few sets of houe speakers. I told him that I would most likely be using an Onkyo 709 receiver. Then came the problem with my experience, I told him that I "only" wanted to spend 500-600 dollars on speakers..... He looked at me like I was wasting his time. 

So here comes my question: Is it like that at all home theater/stereo places? Am I wasting my time to try to go in and hear anything before I buy it if that is my budget? I understand that this is south Florida and some people go in and drop 5k like it's not big deal but I am not that guy. I am the guy that does his research and tries to make sure I'm getting a good product without just ordering something online.

If anyone lives between Stuart and Ft Lauderdale Florida and knows of a good place that will treat me right I would love for you to send me the name and address. PM me if it is against the rules to post it, that would be fine by me. Thanks.


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## sub_crazy (Nov 17, 2007)

It's too bad he treated you that way, every customer should be treated with respect.

I recently went into a HT store as well and was looking for an installer as I already have all the equipment and just need some speaker wire run and connections for a projector. I could also tell the owner was not too pleased but at the same time it was during normal business hours and his door was locked until I knocked on the door. He talked about how busy they were, yeah right, but that he would try and fit me in in a few weeks. I didn't hear back from him until a month later but I had already moved on and will use someone who actually wants the work.

In the $500 to 600 range you might just want to look into internet direct speakers. It's sad to say but just finding a brick and mortar dealer is tough enough these days and the ones that are still open are usually custom installers that specialize in big installs. At least that's the case here in S. California, most stores now only open for appointments only.


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## nova (Apr 30, 2006)

Not a very good way to treat a customer. It may well be that he does not carry anything that fits into your current budget, but if treated right you may have come back in the future. Sounds like he may have burned a bridge with you.

I also think the best value for your budget is going to be internet direct. Kinda hard to audition them first but most have very good return policies and you can work with them if your are not pleased.


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## D Bone (Feb 23, 2012)

Depending on what you want (floor/bookshelf) newegg has great prices on the Klipsch Icon series (WB-14 for $200/pair) and there is always NHT SuperZero 2.0's for the same.


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## theJman (Mar 3, 2012)

As the others have suggested it might be advisable to choose something on-line instead. There are actually quite a number of good options available, but you'll need to supply some additional info before anyone can provide much in the way of assistance.

What size is your room? Are you looking for 5 speakers, or will 3 (left/center/right) do for now? Do you want towers/floorstanding or bookshelf? Any preferences, like wood finish or small sizes?


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

What place was this? He can move a couple speakers and build a relationship for the future. 

That said I will chime in. 

Take a look at them. 
http://www.ascendacoustics.com/pages/products/speakers/cmt340m/cmt340m.html

You might also try a Pair of Energy CF-30s


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## lucky53s (Mar 20, 2012)

Nova: You are right, even if you can't come in on my budget, you could show me something a little above, get me interested, makke me want to come back and buy them from you when I am ready to upgrade. And maybe you have a suggestion of what/where I should be looking. 

DBone and Jman: The room is 16 x 16 with and open on the left side (from the viewing location). The viewing distance will most likely be around 12 feet as the couch isn't all the way back. I am most likely going to end up with bookshelf fronts and the rears will be mounted up high, so must be something small/light enough as to not pose a huge problem. I would like go with 5.1. That being said, I know my budget limits quality for that many speakers so I am willing to go with 5 surrounds (as long as something gives me at least some bass) or 3.1 and add the rears later. I do like the look of the WB-14 speakers. I just like to hear things when spending money on something that I am ideally going to keep for a while.


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## D Bone (Feb 23, 2012)

I have an Onkyo 709, and a 5.1 system comprised of 4 Klipsch WB-14s and a Klipsch WC-24, as well as a Cadence CSX-12 Mark II sub. My room is 23'x16'x8' and my system sounds awesome. I bought the Klipsch setup based on these professional reviews, and am VERY glad I did! 

http://www.hometheater.com/content/klipsch-icon-wb-14-speaker-system
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/home-theater-speakers/782-klipsch-icon-w-system.html


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

The problem with most boutique audio stores is they mark up everything in order to pay the rent on the space and the sales people usually make not only a decent wage but commission on top of it. I learnt my lesson early on that you dont always get what you pay for when shopping there.
There are many on line storefronts that sell great quality speakers for within your budget although finding a good sub will be hard.


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## theJman (Mar 3, 2012)

You've gotten some very good suggestions thus far. Although slightly outside your price range, here are a few others that might be worth considering...


5 Ascend Acoustics HTM-200 SE. This would be your center too.
4 Aperion Audio Intimus 4B and 1 Intimus 4C
4 Definitive Technology ProMonitor 800 and 1 ProCenter 1000
4 NSG NXPRO 41 and 1 NXPRO 42
I just bought the NXG setup myself, and I can personally attest to the fact that they're worth a lot more than what I paid for them.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Home Theater Stores run the gauntlet. There are some Stores like you described where they expect you to spend $600 on Speaker Cables. Especially in South Florida. When looking for a Store, check out the Brands they carry. A Mark Levinson, Krell, Focal, etc establishment will be more likely to have the reaction you described. 

That being said, many High End Stores carry brands like Paradigm where there are Speakers available for $600. Even less for that matter, but also going up close to $10,000 with their Signature Series. However, there are some Stores where they carry nothing but ultra exclusive brands and you live in an area where it can be supported. On the other side of the Peninsula, we too have Stores like this. All the same, sorry you had such an experience. The good news is there are other Stores that do carry Speakers for $600 and less.
Do a Search for Paradigm, Infinity, PSB and others.
J


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## lucky53s (Mar 20, 2012)

I have to say, I am skeptical about the NX speakers for $25. For that it is almost worth getting them just to see what they actually sound like......


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## lucky53s (Mar 20, 2012)

Jungle Jack said:


> Do a Search for Paradigm, Infinity, PSB and others.
> J


He mentioned that he may be able to come close with a pair of PSB B4's. But made it sound like it would be an inconvenience to show them to me.


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## SAC (Dec 3, 2009)

While i agree with many of the opinions voiced, I think you can also see why he probably feels the way he does.

Almost everyone has advised you to go online, and the odds are he may be tired of doing the leg work only to watch as his efforts are rewarded by folks then going online and sourcing them for a price below what he can do as he must cover his overhead.

So while in an ideal world everyone would be treated equally, remember that as you go to the Internet and explore value pricing from someone without the same overhead who has provided you no hand-holding.

In other words, if you are going to avail yourself of his (or anyone else's) services, buy the product from them as well.


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## D Bone (Feb 23, 2012)

SAC said:


> While i agree with many of the opinions voiced, I think you can also see why he probably feels the way he does.
> 
> Almost everyone has advised you to go online, and the odds are he may be tired of doing the leg work only to watch as his efforts are rewarded by folks then going online and sourcing them for a price below what he can do as he must cover his overhead.
> 
> ...


I totally agree with you on why it's tougher now on brick-n-mortar stores then ever before. However, that's why they have to go out of their way with kindness and professionalism to prevent that customer from walking out of their store, and making their way to the nearest computer.


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## theJman (Mar 3, 2012)

lucky53s said:


> I have to say, I am skeptical about the NX speakers for $25. For that it is almost worth getting them just to see what they actually sound like......


I did that very thing myself; I picked up 4 of the satellites and a center. Total, with shipping, was about $240, and personally I think they're worth a lot more than that. Solid build, gorgeous paint and very nice sound.


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## lucky53s (Mar 20, 2012)

SAC said:


> In other words, if you are going to avail yourself of his (or anyone else's) services, buy the product from them as well.


I am all about buying where I find something I like. I am an avid cyclist (Lance Armstrong style) and I always support local bike shops. I have paid $120 a tire for something i could have gotten for $100 including shipping to keep the brick and morter store in business. But I don't think I should have to beg for some professionalism from the guy.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

SAC said:


> While i agree with many of the opinions voiced, I think you can also see why he probably feels the way he does.
> 
> Almost everyone has advised you to go online, and the odds are he may be tired of doing the leg work only to watch as his efforts are rewarded by folks then going online and sourcing them for a price below what he can do as he must cover his overhead.
> 
> ...


I totally understand the sentiment. However, the OP did not say he was going to purchase Online. That being said, it is a huge problem for Brick and Mortar Stores to stay in business due to the Online Stores. This is why Paradigm, B&W, Rotel, and others are unbelievably strict about transshiping (smaller Authorized Dealer making a huge order and selling a large part of it to an Internet Dealer to make money and or to sell enough of a line to remain an Authorized Dealer)

It is because of this that more and more Stores are going the Custom Installation route and getting rid of Showrooms where a large number of Speakers, AVR's, Amplifiers, etc are setup. It is rare to find this anymore. With Sound Advice/Tweeter/HiFi Buys going OOB, Magnolia HT is pretty much the only National Chain that has quality equipment On Display. While there are a few still standing. Most cater to the High End where $600 Speakers do not lie.


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## tcarcio (Jun 27, 2007)

You have had some good advice so far but why not just wait a little and save a little more and get something you will be happy with for at least a year or two. I have some speakers that cost just a hair over $1000 for the front 3 speakers and I am very happy with them. Don't force yourself into something that you won't like just to have something "right now" and I think you will be happier in the end. Just my 2 cents....:T


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## D Bone (Feb 23, 2012)

theJman said:


> I did that very thing myself; I picked up 4 of the satellites and a center. Total, with shipping, was about $240, and personally I think they're worth a lot more than that. Solid build, gorgeous paint and very nice sound.



After reading your post, I searched google for reviews, but every one that came up was from you!


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## sub_crazy (Nov 17, 2007)

D Bone said:


> I totally agree with you on why it's tougher now on brick-n-mortar stores then ever before. However, that's why they have to go out of their way with kindness and professionalism to prevent that customer from walking out of their store, and making their way to the nearest computer.


Great post.

Brick-n-mortar stores need to sell service as they usually can't compete on price. That said some won't discount at all, not even 10% with items that they have a 40% mark-up on. I had one dealer tell a friend of mine on a $2,300 item that he can take 5% off but then he can't offer him any service if something goes wrong. I had dealt with this dealer before on occasion as well and got the same "Well that's the price and if you don't like it get out here" kind of attitude. Personally I wouldn't buy a iPod dock from this guy if he was the last source on earth because of his arrogance. 

What's wrong with providing excellent service and providing a small discount to your customers if your still going to make 20 to 30%? 

I can understand there frustration but to then treat potential customers poorly makes no sense.


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## theJman (Mar 3, 2012)

D Bone said:


> After reading your post, I searched google for reviews, but every one that came up was from you!


Really? Perhaps I should get some type of royalty then. :bigsmile:

It's odd; NXG has been around for a while, yet it seems none of their products have much in the way of reviews. I found little myself. Strange too, because if the rest of their stuff is similar in quality to what I have now they certainly make worthwhile speakers.


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

I think an Onkyo 709 is out of proportion with a $500 speaker budget. 
An entry level AVR @ $200 and speakers @ $800 makes a lot more sense to me


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

A $200 avr is going to have little to offer and horrible amplification. Even cheep speakers will sound good if driven with a good amp with low distortion.


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## D Bone (Feb 23, 2012)

tonyvdb said:


> A $200 avr is going to have little to offer and horrible amplification. Even cheep speakers will sound good if driven with a good amp with low distortion.


I agree. 5 NHT SuperZero 2.0s would by a smige under $500, and would sound great with the 709. Of course a sub is needed, but that is the case in 99% of home configurations anyway.


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

To the OP, I recommend not bothering with 5.1 surround sound on your budget. Consider just a pair of $5-600 front speakers and you can always expand in the future.

These are currently on sale:

http://www.emptek.com/e55ti_mm.php


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## theJman (Mar 3, 2012)

Another option might be to get a complete Dayton Audio 5.1 system. That should leave you plenty left over for a receiver.


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## lucky53s (Mar 20, 2012)

Chashint- I want something that is expandable. I know a 5.1 system may not be feasible but there is no reason to throw away $200 now on something that I would replace in a year or two.


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## spurdarren (Jan 11, 2012)

It is too bad you had that kind of experience. I bought most of my speakers from a local Klipsch dealer. He was great to deal with. He had about the best prices around and then I mentioned I would make the purchase with cash and the price got even better. I have since purchased a tv through him too. He has earned my business for a long time to come.


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

The Klipsch WB14 speakers were mentioned earlier, at Newegg they are $199/pr.
Very nice speakers at that price.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...bcat494-_-flashstorefront-_-bookshelfspeakers 
Add one of these http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/stf-2.html for $392 to the door.
You will have a very nice 2.1 starter set that you can build on.


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## ratm (Sep 17, 2010)

Sound and Cinema is in West Palm on Dixie just north of Southern Blvd. Audio Advisors is in West Palm also on Palm Beach Lakes almost to Okee. And Atlantic Smart Technologies is in Jupiter on Indiantown road.

I will say, however, that I am not sure if these places have things in the price range your looking for, but it cant hurt to check it out/


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## lucky53s (Mar 20, 2012)

ratm said:


> Sound and Cinema is in West Palm on Dixie just north of Southern Blvd. Audio Advisors is in West Palm also on Palm Beach Lakes almost to Okee. And Atlantic Smart Technologies is in Jupiter on Indiantown road.


I was at one of these places..... But that leaves two more to try! 

Chashint - I have had my eye on those Wb-14 speakers for a few days now. I may end up with them, a sub, and a center to begin with. I don't need huge booming bass so I'm not sold on a sub yet. Then I can pick up a small set of surrounds later, I hear they don't have to be *superior* quality. From what I'm told it's really the front set up that provides most of the sound.


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## sub_crazy (Nov 17, 2007)

You need a sub especially if you use the WB-14 speakers as they only extend down to 70hz. It's not about booming bass, it's about having any kind of bass at all.


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## sub_crazy (Nov 17, 2007)

You could even go for a sub like this: http://www.lavasubs.com/10_inch/powered_home_subwoofer.html

I have the 12" version and it is an excellent performer for the price.


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

I know Lava has its following but they really aren't very good subs.
The WB-14 speakers used to sell for close to MSRP before they were discontinued.
With the level of AVR that has been chosen a sub at the Hsu VTF2-MK4 level is not out of line at all.


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## csweep44 (Feb 20, 2012)

I think the Best Buy in Stuart has a Magnolia Home Theater in it. I know the Mag by me has very friendly people in it, always glad to demo some speakers for you. I would bring a CD so you can listen to what you are used to.


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## sub_crazy (Nov 17, 2007)

chashint said:


> I know Lava has its following but they really aren't very good subs.
> The WB-14 speakers used to sell for close to MSRP before they were discontinued.
> With the level of AVR that has been chosen a sub at the Hsu VTF2-MK4 level is not out of line at all.


Is the Hsu twice as good as the Lava? Because it is more than double the price and the OP isn't interested in spending a lot of money. He also mentioned about not having a sub so for the price the Lava is a nice starting point.

I have had Velodyne HGS-18, JL Audio F113, Revel Sub-15 and a ton more commercial subs including the HSU TN-1225 pair and SVS CS-Ultra pair. I have also had a pair of DIY LMS Ultra's, pair Maelstrom X 18's and a single Mael-X 21" sub. Needless to say my username is Sub_Crazy for a reason:bigsmile: I only bring this up as I was fortunate to win a Lava LSP-12 and I was impressed with the performance. Now it's not going to replace my Mael-X subs but it's at least as good if not better than any other sub I have heard in it's price range.

If the Lava sub wasn't good I would have no problem agreeing with you but that was not the case for me. I also don't find it fair to compare it to a sub that costs twice the price, compare apples with apples.


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## KenC (Mar 30, 2012)

What you got was “ATTITUDE”.

Now, a real store is a hard thing to come by anymore. 

What I’ve done is taken a few road trips. Yep, it’s time consuming and expensive. If they treat you good from the start, when you’re wrapping things up, tell the salesperson… you treated me right and if you have a competitive price; when I’m ready to purchase, I’ll buy from you and NOT off the internet to save a few bucks.

It’s about relationships. It takes some time to develop one, but I think it is worth it in the long run. 

Move on to someone else worthy of your hard earned dollar. Your budget should NOT determine if the proprietor treats you with respect. 

As for the gear itself, I’ll let others be your guide.


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## kenbola (Jan 24, 2012)

The onkyo 609 and 709 are both nice and both have powered zone 2. The remote is a bit unfriendly until you get used to it. You might like Crutchfield for speakers and their great customer service.


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## smally21 (Apr 24, 2012)

unfortunately, that is my experience every time i go into those stores. gettin the gears from some arrogant kid behind the counter who couldn't afford any of the stuff he claims to know all about.

i wonder what high end theatre system he has in his mom's basement?? cant stand it I dont even bother going in.
educate yourself online thru forums and reviews, buy and trade used with trustworthy guys and end up with way better stuff..

just my 2cents but i dont get along well with salespeople in general, could be my attitude that starts it!!

plus you gotta give him something to work with, 5-600 is pretty tough..but should still not have his nose in the air. how quickly everyone forgets where they started..


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

smally21 said:


> unfortunately, that is my experience every time i go into those stores. gettin the gears from some arrogant kid behind the counter who couldn't afford any of the stuff he claims to know all about.
> 
> i wonder what high end theatre system he has in his mom's basement?? cant stand it I dont even bother going in.
> educate yourself online thru forums and reviews, buy and trade used with trustworthy guys and end up with way better stuff..
> ...


Hello,
I am truly sorry your experience has been like this. Brick and Mortar AV Stores are in such a difficult situation with so many people doing their research and shopping Online while still wanting to audition the gear at a Store prior. It makes many of the Sales Staff jaded when people come in. Especially when asking about a specific Model, often the Staff thinks the worst.

It is for this reason that more and more AV Stores are switching to not having a Showroom with AV Separates and instead have moved to Custom Installation with usually a example Home Theater if anything at all. For those lucky enough to have a real Stereo and HT Store in their area, realize just how blessed you truly are. By having a long term relationship with such Stores, you can get great discounts and also the advantages of loaner equipment should yours need repair, etc..
Cheers,
JJ


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