# Dual purpose bonus room HT



## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Unfortunately I don't have the space to build a dedicated HT room so I have to make some compromises.

I have never owned a projector so I am not 100% sure what to expect and I am looking for design/planning feedback.

My main requirements are to be able to use this room for both HT and as a room my wife can crash in after a long day. I realize these sound like they could be one and the same but I don't think she will like watching TV in the dark. I would like to be able to use all video sources on either Tv or projector but the surround sound only needs to work with the projector.

I also have 4 kids so we need quite a bit of seating. But I don't think they care as much as I do about sound.

My bonus room is ~16'x18' but has some slanted ceiling. There is currently a ceiling fan and I don't think I can get rid of it. I will however redo the lighting (remove the ceiling fan light and put cans in the ceiling). Projector throw will be ~16'. Here is an image of my current plan:


































The screen is ~130" diagonal. This is the size needed to hide the window behind it. There are also a few other windows in the room but I will put up heavy blinds.

The Tv hanging on the wall is a 50" 720p plasma that I already have. It currently is our main HT TV.

The general idea is on most nights the room will be used as it is currently: a place to chill with the lights _on._

On fri/sat nights it will be family movie time.

And during some afternoons the kids will probably want to play halo on the huge screen .

I plan on doing the following major changes to the room:

Remove ceiling fan light as it would interfere with the projector's path. Replace lighting with cans in the ceiling. Some locations will be challenging as the roof slopes and there is very little room above.
Relocate al of the AV equipment and run all wires through the walls. I am aiming for 7.2 sound. Note 3 sides are exterior walls .
Build a DIY screen and place it in front of an existing window.
Paint walls but not a terribly dark color.
I plan on buying a new receiver and blu ray player. Dual HDMI out would be nice but is there any real benefit to having it in the receiver vs buying a switch? Note my Tv is 720p but the new projector will be 1080p. I am not sure how this effects the HDMI out decision. What will the AVR choose as the output signal if it sees different capability displays connected?
New furniture. Although I have couch and a chase that I would like to work into the mix as they are comfy and in good condition.

Some things that are not worked out:

Do I care about 3D? One of my kids gets motion sick. Maybe he will like 3D? Maybe he will puke so none of us will watch 3D.
Which projector to buy? We will game on the projector so input lag matters. Otherwise I would be buying an Epson 3020. The new BenQ 1070 looks like a good fit but it doesn't have enough zoom for 16' placement. I may be able to swing the cash for a Panasonic AE8000 but that is really pushing it.
Where to put the AV equipment? There will be room under the screen for a low/wide cabinet (which I can make). There will also be room by the closet. I do not have room in the closet without moving an interior wall as it is very narrow. Plus I know there will be a n XBox and a blu ray player and I don't want them hard to access. Another possible placement location is by the closet. This is easiest to pull cables into from the attic.
Should I try an acoustically transparent screen? I can build the speakers into the screen this way and save some floor space and keep it neat.
Should I do a black widow screen and live with challenging center channel speaker placement?

Budget? Yes there is one . But I know it will be pretty expensive as we will be replacing/adding furniture as well.

Current equipment:

Pioneer 5070 plasma
BFD/Crown amp for my DIY sub
5x DIY speakers but I don't mind rebuilding them to be on-wall designs.
VCR (yes I need to keep this )
HTPC running Win7 Media Center
HDHomeRun for pulling ATSC Tv

As for skills I can do the wiring, painting and cabinet making (I build furniture and speakers as a hobby).

I know this is a very long message with many questions in it  but I do appreciate any/all input!
Thanks!
Salem


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## bamabum (Dec 7, 2012)

This look like a good plan. Any before pics?

I am going for the false wall but I can say that I haven't had any issues with the center being below the screen currently. The false walls do eat a lot of floor space as well. If you are on a budget you can build an awesome wall screen for < $100 and save the > $1000 (screen material and wall build out) AT screen for later.


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Arg pictures of how the room looks today?! 

Ok here is a panoramic:










The window you see is the one I will be hiding with a screen.

The whole room is currently oriented toward the wall with the closet where the plasma currently sits on my av cabinet (which will be getting the boot).

Thanks!


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

eyekode said:


> Unfortunately I don't have the space to build a dedicated HT room so I have to make some compromises.
> 
> I have never owned a projector so I am not 100% sure what to expect and I am looking for design/planning feedback.
> 
> ...


I like the layout you have come up with - comfy arrangement and none of the seating is locked to a wall where you could experience boomy sound. As far as the dual HDMI question, I am not sure - I would suggest posting that question in the receivers forum to get a more experienced opinion.



eyekode said:


> Some things that are not worked out:
> 
> Do I care about 3D? One of my kids gets motion sick. Maybe he will like 3D? Maybe he will puke so none of us will watch 3D.





I also have a son who gets motion sickness easily (I do as well) - he does not like 3D as it does get to him. I would opt for no on a 3D projector.



eyekode said:


> [*]Which projector to buy? We will game on the projector so input lag matters. Otherwise I would be buying an Epson 3020. The new BenQ 1070 looks like a good fit but it doesn't have enough zoom for 16' placement. I may be able to swing the cash for a Panasonic AE8000 but that is really pushing it.


Sorry - cannot help here either as I did not research projectors that work well with gaming. Again, try posting in the projectors forum for more experienced opinions.



eyekode said:


> [*]Where to put the AV equipment? There will be room under the screen for a low/wide cabinet (which I can make). There will also be room by the closet. I do not have room in the closet without moving an interior wall as it is very narrow. Plus I know there will be a n XBox and a blu ray player and I don't want them hard to access. Another possible placement location is by the closet. This is easiest to pull cables into from the attic.


I personally did not like the idea of putting equipment below the screen as I was worried about the distraction of the lights while watching the screen. I would opt for by the closet for two reasons - out of direct line of sight for the screen as well as easiest to pull cables.



eyekode said:


> [*]Should I try an acoustically transparent screen? I can build the speakers into the screen this way and save some floor space and keep it neat.


While I love the look of a clean front wall (again, less distraction while viewing), in most builds I have seen you would need to allow about 3' behind an AT screen for speaker placement and I do not think you have that space available. I had to settle for a non-AT DIY screen as I did not have the room either and I have found that the speakers are not as distracting as I originally thought they would be.



eyekode said:


> [*]Should I do a black widow screen and live with challenging center channel speaker placement?



I do not know if you would need to go the Black Widow route - an OTS gray might work just fine. Mech and Harp are the experts there - check out the DIY screen forum.



eyekode said:


> Budget? Yes there is one . But I know it will be pretty expensive as we will be replacing/adding furniture as well.
> 
> Current equipment:
> 
> ...


Looking forward to following along with a new build! :clap:


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Looks like I need to break these questions into their appropriate forums .

But as for the screen I think I could do an AT screen and use up only 6" or so deep. Something like this: http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...yle-baffle-walls-screens-2.html#axzz2JJgqPnTs

I have all the equipment to measure and design speakers. So I am really only limited by the depth of the speaker basket. I will see what I can draw up.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

eyekode said:


> Looks like I need to break these questions into their appropriate forums .
> 
> But as for the screen I think I could do an AT screen and use up only 6" or so deep. Something like this: http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...yle-baffle-walls-screens-2.html#axzz2JJgqPnTs
> 
> I have all the equipment to measure and design speakers. So I am really only limited by the depth of the speaker basket. I will see what I can draw up.


Yeah, some of the more experienced people who really know the answers to those questions you posed do not frequent the Construction forum that often - it really is the best way to get answers to your questions a bit more timely.

I had not read that thread before - very interesting! Seems like it would work depending, as you said, on the speaker design. Would definitely like to see what you come up with!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

A little bit of progress:

I bought an Epson 8350 projector and built a screen so I could get an idea of how it all fits in the space I have. I have watched quite a few movies with this setup and I am reasonably sure the room orientation and screen size will work.

I also finished up a soffit design that matches the rest of my house aesthetically:









I was thinking about putting some crown up to hold rope light:









Next up I would like to figure out the lights. My first idea was adding recessed lighting to the soffit. One 6" can in each of the 4 corners. And two 4" cans between each of the larger cans for a total of 4x6" and 8x4".









But I am afraid this plan would leave the center of the room dark. I am not sure if I will get any effective contribution from the rope lights.

My initial thinking is to use a GRX-3106 to control the lights. The image above lists the different zones. The rope light is not pictured but it would be on a separate zone.

This would allow me to setup the following scenes:
1) Lights on: lights adjusted to give relatively even illumination through the room.
2) Movie: Red lights off. Green/Yellow lights very low ~5%? Blue lights at ~10-15%.
3) Pause: All lights up 20 ~25% or so.
4) TV: Yellow lights off (as they are over the location of the TV) and all the others adjusted down to a comfortable level.

This would leave me with one free zone. Maybe add two cans in the center of the room?

Any suggestions?
Thanks!
Salem


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

It has been a while but I have made progress! I have the framing done and I am almost ready for my rough-in inspection.

I can't believe I am going to show this but... a panoramic of the current condition:









All the old furniture is in the middle of the room along with all kinds of other including a sleeping dog if you can find him .

Here are some pictures of the soffit:

















The projector mounted using a Peerless PRGUNV (which I think is great!):

















The TV mount (a Monoprice unit that was ~18$ and it seems fine to me):









I am using power bridges for both the projector and the TV. I am running the following to each display device:
- 2 HDMI cables (one for a spare)
- 2 Cat6 cables (to hopefully future proof. I will have to rip up sheetrock to pull cables again)

For the TV I am also running one RG6.

The wires I have pulled coming into the closet (I still need to pull speaker cables):









I am also using a Grafik Eye to control the lights. I debated for quite some time how to do this install. I am not an electrician so I don't recommend you do anything I do . But just for grins here is the progression:

To mount the masonry box I added spacers so I could screw it firmly on both sides.

















































I bought a 6 zone QS version and the blue cable is PLEV for IR. Here it is ready to be hooked up. I think there is enough room and I have the bends right so it will not involve any forcing:
















As an FYI I tied all the neutrals and grounds together using these: http://www.amazon.com/Ideal-30-1034...66794&sr=1-1&keywords=ideal+push+in+connector
I wish I could have found the connectors that join 8 wires locally but oh well. I used 3 of these jumpered together for both neutral and ground.

I plan on having it inspected on Fri. Wish me luck!
Salem


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Great progress mate! Good luck with the inspection.

Oh, and I found the sleeping dog!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Well I passed the rough in inspection . I powered up the circuit in my closet and that works well. Now on to getting the grafik eye into the box!

PS: It looks like almost all circuits now require AFCI breakers. There goes another 80$ .


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

eyekode said:


> Well I passed the rough in inspection . I powered up the circuit in my closet and that works well. Now on to getting the grafik eye into the box!
> 
> PS: It looks like almost all circuits now require AFCI breakers. There goes another 80$ .


Congrats mate - good to hear everything passed well!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

I also wired in those expensive breakers and got my Grafik Eye up and running! I will have to take it out again to do some drywall repair but I couldn't help myself. I had to see it work!


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

eyekode said:


> I also wired in those expensive breakers and got my Grafik Eye up and running! I will have to take it out again to do some drywall repair but I couldn't help myself. I had to see it work!


Yay! Nice job mate!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

A little progress... er anti-progress?
At any rate I hung my tv at my wife's request:


















Other items that have been resolved:
- installed power bridge for projector.
- pulled cable for 4 rear channels.
- pulled/spliced cat-5 into the closest for a switch.
- wired for RG6 in the closet (and to the TV).

What is up next?
- redo cables for front 3 channels.
- run one (or two) more sub channels (for a total of 7.2 or 3).
- drywall the soffit (arg!!!)
- paint... everything (arg arg!!!)
- build 2 new subs (buyout bravox 15's)
- build 4 surround speakers
- build 3 new mains
- relax?


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## lcjr71 (Jan 8, 2013)

Great room so far. I like the list of remaining things to do because I'm sure if you love this kind of stuff like i do, then this list really isn't a list. If you know what i mean. When you're doing something you love it takes on an entirely different feeling. A awesome sense of accomplishment. So yeah, when you get to the relax part of your list, RELAX and enjoy the fruits of your labor. Cant wait to see it finished.


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

A little more progress:
I have almost finished insulating and hanging the drywall. This is my first time doing drywall and I am dreading all the corners I have made for myself!


















I also solved one of my last technical issues: where to put the surrounds? There are good places for the surround backs on the rear slanted wall but for 7.x THX recommends the surround left/right to be 90 degrees from the listener.

I ended up building a ~1cu ft box into the soffit. The design will be a horizontal MTM with RS150's and SB29RDCN tweeters. The two RS150's should give a good amount of headroom and the SB29RDCN is small but can be crossed low to avoid bad lobing.










I also am about 50% done with my equipment rack. I will post pictures when done!
Salem


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Vacation and life have intervened but all the sheetrock is finally hung and I will start mudding this weekend.

I have also been working on building a rack out of plywood for the closet. I got about 70% done when a screaming deal on a Middle Atlantic 35RU rack came up:









75$!!
Salem


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## Horrorfan33 (Jun 11, 2013)

Everything is looking great!!..Looking forward to your progress!


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## B- one (Jan 13, 2013)

Everything is looking good. Great score on the rack!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

So most of the mudding is done. And I learned a couple (obvious) things in a visceral way: It is difficult to sheetrock over bad framing. It is difficult to tape over bad sheetrock joints. Is even more difficult to mud over bad taped joints .

The moral of the story: make your framing "perfect"! The further down the line the more difficult to fix .

But here is how it looks today:









And here is my rack in place (not much room to take pictures!):








And finally the rack I made (oak ply, sapele trim):

















I should be able to start trim during this holiday vacation!

Oh, and merry christmas/happy new year!
Salem


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

Good progress, eyekode. And for the record, your rack looks like it would have come out great! I probably would have stuck with it, but maybe that's just me and my love of nice wood. Keep it up!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Thanks the wood rack did turn out great! And I can always use the extra space so I am glad I have both!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

A little more progress: I began the trim/crown lighting.

The plan is to run LED rope lighting around the perimeter of the soffit. Here is a cross sectional view:









I don't have any help so I built a simple jig to hold the molding at the desired height (1.5" up from the edge):

























The molding was hung with brads first and then when everything looked good I used 15ga nails to make it rock solid.

After the molding went up I ripped some 2x4 stock at 38 degrees to hold the crown:









And here is where I am now:









I plan on painting the top of the ledge up to the ceiling in a flat white paint. Then I will hang the crown. But I am quite worried about all the inside corners. Most say to cope inside corners (of which I have 8 in this room!) but that would interfere with the LED light unless I also left some clearance for it.

This is also the first time I have done crown and I am a little worried that I will do a job trying to miter all those inside corners!

Wish me luck .
Salem


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Some bad news . My washing machine flooded my downstairs and filled my HVAC with water. 80% of my hardwoods are ripped up. And all the stuff in the pantry has been moved into my someday-to-be-theater!

But I do have one progress update. I bought some 12v SMD5050 RGB tape light to play with. Mostly because I could not decide between white and soft white 120v rope light. And I am glad I did! I really like RGB control. Now I cannot decide if I want red or blue . And I don't have to! I will lose the cool dimming effect the Lutron provides for scenes but I will gain the ability to change colors on a whim.

And those SMD5050's are really bright! Only real downside is the 12v tape max length is 5M. So I need 3 tapes 18A at 12v (I will use 3 6A power supplies). And (at least) 2 data repeaters. This is much more wiring then just plugging in a single 120v rope. But the end effect should be really cool.


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## bamabum (Dec 7, 2012)

Sorry to hear of the flood. Whats the electronic angle tool on your saw blade?


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Google "Wixey wr300". Well worth the cost !!
Make sure your throat plate is dead level with the table too. Otherwise the accuracy of the angle finder doesn't matter!


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

bamabum said:


> Sorry to hear of the flood.


+1 - hope you can get it squared away quick so you can get back to the theater...


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## phillihp23 (Mar 14, 2012)

Looks like this build is coming right along. Look forward to seeing it all completed. Always great to see how creative people can be. Many a people have taken unique rooms, and created some very nice results. Keep up the great work, the enjoyment later will be well worth it.


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## yluko (Dec 6, 2012)

Neat go along pics. Almost makes me wish I had a house to do the same.


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## david yurik (Feb 17, 2013)

eyekode said:


> Wish me luck .Salem


holy mackeral you didn't mention you were a crown molding framing expert!! nicely done!

bummer about the flood. good thoughts your way.

dave


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Flood is in the past! Here are some pictures of my new floors 










And this weekend I finally got around to putting up the complicated crown!

First I did the outside corners:









This left me with a double-cope for all the "long" pieces:

























I chiseled away the inside corner to make sure the joint looks tight at the bottom:

























And I put up some of the LED's. I went with 12v SMD5050's, 300 lights per 5M strand. They are quite bright! I will probably replace the controller so with one that can dim to a lower brightness!









It is starting to look good but I have a TON of work left to do!!!


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Nice job on the moulding - that is one that I still struggle to get clean-looking, and you nailed yours - looks great!


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

The new floors look great, eyekode. And good job with the crown. I had my first experience with it last year, and while it can be a huge pain, it can also make a really nice difference in a room.


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

Very nicely done!..It looks good..:T
I have SMD 5050's also..I'll be very interested to hear If you can find a controller that will dim them right down..


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## B- one (Jan 13, 2013)

Nice work on everything but I really like the floor color.


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

I finally started painting! Whew it has been a while


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Painting is almost done (a little bit of trim/door to paint). And our sofa finally got here. It is a monster but is very comfortable! My wife helped with picking out curtains etc. We have not yet settled on carpet. I also blacked out all the windows with blackoutez. The blackout worked pretty well but some edges still show a little bit of light. It is a huge improvement though! We can watch a movie in the middle of the day no problem. The dark front wall does a great job of disappearing when the lights go out too. It gives a much more immersive experience.

Untitled by eyekode, on Flickr

With all that seating this is where the dog went first 

Untitled by eyekode, on Flickr

Still a ton of work to do on the speakers but I have _almost_ passed the wife's "it's done" milestone .
Salem


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Really starting to take shape mate - looking really good!

Makes me glad I have big chocolate labs!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

An update! I finished my surround speakers that are built into the soffit. They are DIY and I did the measurements/crossovers using Holm Impulse, Arta, and WinPCD. They are quite sensitive but are a 4ohm load (which my Pioneer 1222 seems to handle with no problem).

The boxes are 1cu ft and most of it is hidden in the soffit. The exposed portion is wrapped in cherry.

Pictures or it didn't happen right?

Some stereo listening to verify the final crossover:


And installed:




Now on to the surround backs which will use similar drivers but will be inwall completely.

Thanks for reading!
Salem


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

Nice work on those speakers, eyekode. Good compromise to have some hidden above, and not give up internal volume. The exposed enclosure looks great, and the angled baffles allow you to direct the sound well. Thumbs up!


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Thanks for the comments!
I am happy with the result. The true test was my wife. After ~7 days of her coming into the room to hang out and watch movies just last night she said: "Hey your new speakers look good! I only noticed because the holes in the soffit are gone."
Perfect as I really don't want the equipment to be the focus of the room. And they blend well sonically, I have only localized them audibly in a couple scenes. Hopefully when I finish the rear surrounds it will blend even better. The rear surrounds will be in wall as well instead of the pair of klipsch kg 3.5's I have sitting behind the couch right now.


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## eyekode (Jan 19, 2008)

Finally an update! I finished my rear speakers with some RS150/RS28A in wall MTM's.
Here is a picture looking back into the room:


Full crossover details etc can be found over at the partsexpress forum:
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?244392-In-wall-RS-MTM-s

A couple more pics:




The rear sound stage is much more convincing then with my old kg 3.2's behind me on the floor . They blend well with the in soffit MTM's and are not blocked by the couch.

In hindsight I probably should have stuck with black baffles. The soffit mounted speakers disappear in the room. These do not!

Now on to some sonosubs!


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