# Im Lost in the world of sound



## lonelistener (Oct 12, 2013)

All,

I have been reading these forums over and over and made calls to all the dealers in my area. I am looking to add audio to my dedicated home theater(13x24)basement. all the dealers and forums are all over the place and I require legit advise. Now I know speakers are all about the listener but I need a good starting point. My home theater is all about atmosphere and room filling sound if possible. Like everyone else I want this to be "theater replica" sounding.
I am treating the room and taking all the precautions necessary. The following are the options I have gotten from my research.(screen is 120 inch with a projector) Im going for 5.1 or 7.1 depending. The main thing is I hate bright!
These receivers seem to tone down the speakers to a tolerable pitch. I have a budget of $5,000.00

Receivers....

Cambridge 615
Nad 758
or Marantz


The reason im choosing these is due to true sound dedication... That's what iv been told.

Speakers.....
B&W tc 700 7.5-7.4 (all around)(5.1)
B&W 683's + sub & bookshelf rears(5.1)
Focal 816 + center (the rest in ceiling)(7.1)

sub.....

depends on speakers


Thanks for any help guys......


----------



## Tonto (Jun 30, 2007)

Hey & welcome to the Shack, where you're never alone (pardon the pun). If you care to read a bit more, we recently finished a $1000 speaker evaluation. We spent some quality time with these speakers in a treated HT and posted our results. Sounds like they are in your price range.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/two-channel-audio/69421-official-1-000-speaker-evaluation-home-audition-event-results.html


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Hello and welcome aboard the HTS!

To be truthful most dealers are going to try to sell you their product because that's how they make money for a living and are not usually looking at your best interest. Although the receivers mentioned are not bad you pay a premium for them and the returns in investment are not there.

It's the speakers that really make the sound good or bad, room acoustics and size play a huge part in what you will hear. Sound quality from one receiver to another makes very little difference however the implementation and type of auto room correction can be a game changer. Audyssey is regarded to be the best but again there are different levels, multi EQ XT and multi EQ XT 32 are the best.

I would highly recommend this Onkyo 929
http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...O-TX-NR929-9.2-Ch-Network-A/V-Receiver/1.html

For speakers I would seriously look at the Focal choruse 814 from here
http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...al-6-Floorstanding-Speakers-BLACK-pair/1.html
That price is going to be hard to beat.

As far as a sub it has no barring on what speakers you get so if someone told you that you need to match a sub that's false. You want to get the best sub you can afford and size does matter. I really like subs from SVS 
https://www.svsound.com/
You get far more sub for your money when you buy from a company that only sells on line as they have far less overhead costs so you get much more.


----------



## Tonto (Jun 30, 2007)

Agree with Tony, that's why I link'd you the thread on our speaker evaluation. They will have the biggest impact on your sound. 

The AVR you pick should meet your needs feature wise (also try to future proof it/what you may want in the next few years). Room correction is a must, we recommend Audessey with XT 32.


----------



## nova (Apr 30, 2006)

Welcome to the Shack. I pretty much agree with the good advice you have already received. 
Have you had a chance to audition speakers yet?


----------



## lonelistener (Oct 12, 2013)

Gents,

Thank you for the responses. Yes I have auditioned the focals, the question I have is with the Onkyo , will it deliver the same sound as the nad or Cambridge? im not much for bells and whistles as much as pure clean sound and power. I have been told these 2 recievers cant be beat. now if there is a separate that I canadd like a ferman or parasound power conditioner then cool. does that onkyo come with audessey 32? And 1 dinal question the focals...in ceiling a good compliment there with the focal sub or go with a sub that was recommended above?

btw you guys rock thanks for the responses!


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

I would no go with a focal sub, the SVS subs would do far better. What size is your room and what is the budget you have for the sub?
The Onkyo will preform just as well as the receivers you have above in your first post. Yes the Onkyo does have xt32
The Onkyo weighs 41 lbs and that's a good indication that the amps and power supply are a good size. It also have the very best video processor available ideal for when you have a video source that's not HD and it needs up conversion. It also allows for independent video adjustment for each input. The 929 also has pre outs allowing you to add an external amp for just the front or all channels.


----------



## fmw (Aug 11, 2013)

lonelistener said:


> Gents,
> 
> Thank you for the responses. Yes I have auditioned the focals, the question I have is with the Onkyo , will it deliver the same sound as the nad or Cambridge?


Yes but possibly not the same reliability.



> im not much for bells and whistles as much as pure clean sound and power. I have been told these 2 recievers cant be beat.


If sound quality is the yardstick, then stop worrying about it. It is the same on all modern receivers. Choose for reliability and the features you want and will use.



> now if there is a separate that I canadd like a ferman or parasound power conditioner then cool. does that onkyo come with audessey 32? And 1 dinal question the focals...in ceiling a good compliment there with the focal sub or go with a sub that was recommended above?
> 
> btw you guys rock thanks for the responses!


I'll let you research the features for yourself. But I will mention that what matters in a modern audio system are speakers, subs and room acoustics. With subs the more the merrier. Everything else is unimportant - even trivial in the view of some. So my advice is to get the speakers and sub that wind your clock and then spend whatever is left over on the electronics.


----------



## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

http://www.soundandvision.com/content/nad-t-757-av-receiver-ht-labs-measures 
The 758 is pretty much a renamed 757
http://www.soundandvision.com/content/cambridge-audio-azur-551r-av-receiver-ht-labs-measures 
http://www.soundandvision.com/content/test-report-cambridge-audio-azur-751r-av-receiver-page-3 
Could not find bench numbers on the 615

Neither boutique brand fares any better on the bench than Denon, Pioneer, Onkyo, Marantz....
Neither boutique brand even comes close to the features the others offer at this price point.

I personally think there is very little difference in the way AVRs sound when all processing is turned off, the advantage the mass market AVRs have over the Cambridge and the NAD is the option to use processing if desired.

The speakers affect the way the system sounds much more than the electronics, my speaker preference leans to the bright so there is probably nothing I like that you also would enjoy.

I had never bought any speaker without listening to it until I took the leap of faith and bought an Outlaw LFM1EX subwoofer.
It is a terrific subwoofer and would work great in your space.
Hsu and SVS are also well established companies with a solid track record.
Rythmik would also be a solid choice for a sub.


----------



## lonelistener (Oct 12, 2013)

you gents are a great help and will heed your advise I do like the onkyo's options. I believe I am goin to go this route...


Focal 816V Floor standing speaker (pair)

Focal IC 106 In-Ceiling 2 way speaker(4)

Focal CC800V Center channel speaker

either hsu or other sub(probably 2)

and the onkyo

hopefully this will give me the sound of a MOVIE theater....and pray it wont be bright or harsh sounding. will the amp handle it? and are there any that are not refurbs?(not that it is mandatory.)


----------



## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Refurbished is just as good as new, in fact it can be even better as the "issue" has been addressed and there likely is not going to be another problem. I've bought many refurbished audio gear and never had an issue.


----------



## lonelistener (Oct 12, 2013)

So for an average listener this setup will be room filling and not harsh to the ears?


----------



## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

I have never heard a Focal branded speaker, so I do not know their sound signature.
If you have listened to the speakers with the Cambridge or NAD AVR and you like them, but you are concerned that the Onkyo will make them sound different (worse, harsh, lifeless) .... It won't.
The speakers will certainly sound different in your home than in the show room but that is to be expected.
Your room will almost certainly be a different size as well as being more or less reflective than the show room, and this will affect the sound.
In my living room which is nothing special I think my speakers sound better than they did when I auditioned them, but each situation is different.
If you are buying the speakers based only on reviews you have read, I would recommend purchasing from a place that has a good return policy (that is probably a good idea anyway).
13x24 is not a very large space, a single Hsu VTF3 or even a VTF2 will do very well in that space.
Good luck and please post again when you have the system setup.


----------



## fmw (Aug 11, 2013)

chashint said:


> I have never heard a Focal branded speaker, so I do not know their sound signature.
> If you have listened to the speakers with the Cambridge or NAD AVR and you like them, but you are concerned that the Onkyo will make them sound different (worse, harsh, lifeless) .... It won't.
> The speakers will certainly sound different in your home than in the show room but that is to be expected.
> Your room will almost certainly be a different size as well as being more or less reflective than the show room, and this will affect the sound.
> ...


+1. I've heard some of the Focal/JM Lab speakers. I liked them. I thought they were detailed and accurate.


----------



## lonelistener (Oct 12, 2013)

will do, the theater is in bare studs at the moment I need to finish insulating and looking for a drywaller. its crawling along.....


----------



## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

If you are still at the stud wall make sure you put wire everywhere.
It will need to be rated for in wall use.
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10239&cs_id=1023902&p_id=2821&seq=1&format=2 
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10239&cs_id=1023901&p_id=3844&seq=1&format=2 
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10255&cs_id=1025506&p_id=9432&seq=1&format=2


----------

