# Subwoofer Riser ... What will it do for my situation???



## Pianist718 (Sep 8, 2014)

Hi all ... my first post here...

My room is very bad in terms of acoustics. 
See my gallery here
http://www.blu-ray.com/community/gallery.php?member=bizmord

One thing that's helping is a big sectional rug that covers 70% of the room floor. My walls are bare, there is absolutely no acoustic treatment in the room. Even my Sub is actually standing on the hardwood floor.

So I was thinking .... since the sub is currently standing on a bare hardwood floor .... what will a riser do for me?

On Amazon I read lots of positive reviews. People saying that adding a riser was like getting a new sub.

I am thinking about this one
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DI5AXNI/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER


Comments?

thank you


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## Andre (Feb 15, 2010)

If you live in an apartment and the neighbor complain about the noise a isolation platform can help. As for making the sound of the sub "better" it depends on what you are looking for. A sub can vibrate the floor, some people like that characteristic, other feel the can hear the floor "buzzing". Test it out by putting the sub on a pieces of thick foam insulation. You may also prefer to have the sub in More coupled to the floor (which will require spikes). However, you BEST option for your sub is to find its optimum location in the room, try the subcrawl


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

submitted by accident... not sure how to delete


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

Pianist718 said:


> <snip> .... since the sub is currently standing on a bare hardwood floor .... what will a riser do for me?
> 
> On Amazon I read lots of positive reviews. People saying that adding a riser was like getting a new sub.
> 
> ...


What's crossover point are you using? Most (if not all) of the really low bass is still going to pass through the riser/isolator, unless it's made of thick concrete and decoupled from the rest of the floor. Why do you feel a need to upgrade your sub? What exactly is wrong with the bass in your room?

Your pictures show the sub in close contact with the equipment cabinet. It may help to move it away an inch or so. Your center channel could be picking up those heavy vibrations causing muddy dialogue. On a side note, I think speech intelligibility would greatly improve if you moved the center channel flush with the cabinet's front edge (eliminating reflections). And finally, move the guitar out of the corner! It resonates by nature of its design, and the corner is the best place for all your room modes to make it sing. A floor-to-ceiling bass trap would work wonders in that location for clearing up problems you may not be aware of. 

If you're still itching to try the riser, Amazon has a liberal return policy, making it low-risk. To make the comparison fair, be sure the sub is in the same location (with fractions of an inch) both on and off the platform.


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## jaguar717 (Sep 8, 2014)

I've used the practice hockey puck hack, and can vouch for the reduction in vibrations. It's also not going to stop the low bass signals, so I think it's worth doing.


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## Pianist718 (Sep 8, 2014)

BlueRockinLou said:


> What's crossover point are you using? Most (if not all) of the really low bass is still going to pass through the riser/isolator, unless it's made of thick concrete and decoupled from the rest of the floor. Why do you feel a need to upgrade your sub? What exactly is wrong with the bass in your room?
> 
> Your pictures show the sub in close contact with the equipment cabinet. It may help to move it away an inch or so. Your center channel could be picking up those heavy vibrations causing muddy dialogue. On a side note, I think speech intelligibility would greatly improve if you moved the center channel flush with the cabinet's front edge (eliminating reflections). And finally, move the guitar out of the corner! It resonates by nature of its design, and the corner is the best place for all your room modes to make it sing. A floor-to-ceiling bass trap would work wonders in that location for clearing up problems you may not be aware of.
> 
> If you're still itching to try the riser, Amazon has a liberal return policy, making it low-risk. To make the comparison fair, be sure the sub is in the same location (with fractions of an inch) both on and off the platform.



Thanks for the comments

I crossover at 80 and LFE is set to 120. 
Good point about the guitar but lately with the arrival of the baby, I am using probably 20% of volume available on my system, so maybe vibration is not even an issue. I do have a bookshelf in that corner and I know books provide a pretty OK sound damping environment.

Center channel ... yea, I always had it on the edge of that cabinet but had to move it towards the wall so that the baby doesn't stick her fingers into the speaker.  I do have it slightly lifted at the edge to point up a bit.

The riser ... my sub sounds great, but if this riser will make it sound even more cleaner and eliminate some bass that my neighbor hears, I'll be happy.

I do think that I need to put those 2 inch thick ATS panels on my walls ASAP.


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

Andre said:


> <snip>...However, you BEST option for your sub is to find its optimum location in the room, try the subcrawl
> 
> Axiom Audio - Subwoofer Crawl - YouTube


Hello again, Pianist718! Andre's advice is spot-on. Have any neighbors complained? Your options for isolating bass may be reduced to turning down the volume, or limiting your viewing to daylight or prime-time hours. But since you've had a baby, you probably already do that. To keep bass from leaking out, you need to reinforce your floor and walls--something your landlord won't appreciate.

Keep in mind that 2 inch thick panels will be good for taming reflections in mid and upper frequencies, but they won't do anything for the bass. For that you need large traps. Once again, looking at your setup, the window on the right is a good place to start. For lifestyle issues, I'd make a removable window covering by fastening acoustic material to some cardboard or MDF, then cover that with a thick acoustic/theater drape. Also, I'd hang a couple panels between the speakers and TV screen. There's too much reflective area back there.

To further improve your room sound, have you experimented with L/R speaker locations? Having them so close to the front wall takes advantage of room gain, increasing bass, but at the expense of imaging and soundstage. I realize yours options may again be limited, but even an inch or two can make a big difference. You want to get your speaker positions set first, because that determines your first-reflections points, which you can then effectively treat with sound absorption.


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## Pianist718 (Sep 8, 2014)

BlueRockinLou said:


> Hello again, Pianist718! Andre's advice is spot-on. Have any neighbors complained? Your options for isolating bass may be reduced to turning down the volume, or limiting your viewing to daylight or prime-time hours. But since you've had a baby, you probably already do that. To keep bass from leaking out, you need to reinforce your floor and walls--something your landlord won't appreciate.
> 
> Keep in mind that 2 inch thick panels will be good for taming reflections in mid and upper frequencies, but they won't do anything for the bass. For that you need large traps. Once again, looking at your setup, the window on the right is a good place to start. For lifestyle issues, I'd make a removable window covering by fastening acoustic material to some cardboard or MDF, then cover that with a thick acoustic/theater drape. Also, I'd hang a couple panels between the speakers and TV screen. There's too much reflective area back there.
> 
> To further improve your room sound, have you experimented with L/R speaker locations? Having them so close to the front wall takes advantage of room gain, increasing bass, but at the expense of imaging and soundstage. I realize yours options may again be limited, but even an inch or two can make a big difference. You want to get your speaker positions set first, because that determines your first-reflections points, which you can then effectively treat with sound absorption.



Thanks for great feedback. I am soon have to wall mount those speakers .. once baby starts leaning against the speaker stands. 

Regarding panels ... yea, I am looking into ATS Panels to place on wall behind the couch and maybe behind speakers. Also looked into placing my sub on a riser as some say it does help. We'll see I guess.

I can't cover up the window. Maybe better thicker drapes, that's about it. Hopefully my corner bookshelf is doing something positive for the sound.


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

Igor, congrats on the new arrival. And good for you for still being able to watch anything with her there! Our son is 14 months now, and we're just starting to get the movies going again. 

I think the effects of a SubDude are hard to predict without some kind of test first. Give it a try with something similar underneath that will support the weight... hockey pucks, yoga mat, foam building blocks if your daughter has those yet... see if you can hear any difference. I do think the best place to start is with the subwoofer crawl. If you have the option of optimizing placement, it will go a long way.


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

Hello, I put subdudes under both of my SVS PB12-NSD's and it helped immensely with the vibrations. I still get some window rattle but the floor no longer feels as though it's going to collapse. It was a good investment for me.


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## Pianist718 (Sep 8, 2014)

Owen Bartley said:


> Igor, congrats on the new arrival. And good for you for still being able to watch anything with her there! Our son is 14 months now, and we're just starting to get the movies going again.
> 
> I think the effects of a SubDude are hard to predict without some kind of test first. Give it a try with something similar underneath that will support the weight... hockey pucks, yoga mat, foam building blocks if your daughter has those yet... see if you can hear any difference. I do think the best place to start is with the subwoofer crawl. If you have the option of optimizing placement, it will go a long way.


I know exactly what you mean.  
Our sound doesnt go above 85db on SPL meter probably. Such a shame :-(


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## Pianist718 (Sep 8, 2014)

JBrax said:


> Hello, I put subdudes under both of my SVS PB12-NSD's and it helped immensely with the vibrations. I still get some window rattle but the floor no longer feels as though it's going to collapse. It was a good investment for me.


Hmm, ok but I never run my sound so loud ... does it make sense to use for not loud sound?


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## Pianist718 (Sep 8, 2014)

On a similar subject ........

before I go ahead and buy 3 of these Auralex SonoLite 24 x 24 x 3 Inches Bass Traps .... (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008BOPL38/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER)

I am curious ... if I place those in the corners, what will it really do? Maybe better question will be ... what should I look for once I place these? I was thinking to place one right behind the sub, two in the opposite corners and one in the far side wall, near the corner. Actually right behind the upright piano.


Here is my set up http://www.blu-ray.com/community/gallery.php?u=263096

Any feedback will be much appreciated. 
Is it worth spending $200?

thank you.


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## Pianist718 (Sep 8, 2014)

so, I got some updates .... 

*I've purchased both, Auralex SubDude and AmpDude*. Even though I think AmpDude was designed for an Amp and not a sub... still gave it a try.

To keep it pure, I decided to test out the 3 options (no riser vs subdude vs ampdude) using my SACD player music running in EXT-IN setting .. meaning pure pure. So, no audyssey correction or anything.

This was a good workout. About 7 times had to lift my 50lb or so Sub. Going back and forward with the same 2 songs.

*Results ... It works !!!*
I do lots if A/B testing with equipment. It's not always 100% scientific as I only use my ear to judge, but this one was one of the easiest A/B testing I've done.

Keep in mind, my sub was on the wood floor. So, going from wooden floor to a riser helped.

When I placed it on the Subdude ... sound became a bit easier on the ear. Floor vibration calmed down a bit but was still there. To me, it was somewhat an improvement. However, once I placed the sub on the AmpDude ... now it became very pleasant to my ear. Eliminated floor vibration probably by 50%. Good enough for me. It seems like it eliminated the unpleasant hum, or whatever you may call it. Bottom line ... bass was now a part of music instead of vibration. 

*Keep in mind*, my Sub is pretty decent. Rythmik F12 (almost a thousand bucks). Some people said that risers work only for cheap subs. I disagree now.

Anyway ... I have yet to test the sound now with Audyssey on some hard hitting movies but I am assuming that now I'd need to rerun the room correction software before I proceed. 

Again, going by just pure source from SACD player ... bass became much much nicer to feel.

I now wonder what those ATS 2 in panels will do for me once I start covering my bare walls.


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