# what kind of AVR do you have?



## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Just curious. From reading around on the forums it seems most people have Onkyo. Myself, i've got a Denon 3808ci, so it just got me to wondering what everyone is using. Oh, and maybe why you chose what you've got.

My appologies in advance if their is already a thread about this topic.


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## Ares (Nov 23, 2009)

I have a Denon 1910 it was not what I wanted originally, it was either get a good set of speakers or get the AVR I wanted, I chose the speakers look at Sig


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## stevez11 (Nov 24, 2008)

I have a Yamaha RX-Z11 that I'm using now. I was a big fan of the Onkyo avr's owning 3 but after my last one. I will not ever own another one.


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## Tonto (Jun 30, 2007)

Guess I'm old school, I'm still using a Yamaha RXV-795a. This was (still is) a solid AVR in its day. Doesn't have all the bells & whistles like todays models. But like I have always said, buy what you need. It's 5.1. many years old & still jams! Theater build going on now, will have to research when I get the AVR for that.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

I purchased an Onkyo tx sr805 over two years ago due to its amazing build quality. Some have said that it was and still is the very best receiver ever built for the money as it has a huge power supply and amplification section weighing 52lbs (this is heavier than most receivers that cost three times as much today) It has never let me down and this is one well made unit.


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## tcarcio (Jun 27, 2007)

Pioneer Elite because of performance and it looks great.


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

+1 for the Pioneer..
I needed to buy a new AVR recently and was tossing up between the Onkyo, Denon and Pioneer..
The Pioneer won, mainly because of the MCACC EQ..Absolutely brilliant!!


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## Dale Rasco (Apr 11, 2009)

Pioneer Elite SC-05. Love the ICE power. :hsd:


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## jrayton (Mar 5, 2010)

Marantz SR5003. Love the sound. Owned Marantz since 1978.


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

HUGE Onkyo fan here; won't buy another brand, just out of preference...love the units' looks, faceplates, build quality...

Running a 605 and it hasn't shut down on me yet. Before that, had a TX-SR600...


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## recruit (May 9, 2009)

Onkyo took a nice chunk of the market due to the fact that they were first to the scene with all the new HD codecs, that is why got one and it was the 905 and it served me well for a couple of years and that is probably how long it took other manufacturers to catch up, they represent excellent VFM for what you get and I would not hesitate in recommending there AVR's, a friend has just bought a new 3007 and it has every feature under the sun but it would not be any good if it did not sound good but it does!


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

recruit said:


> Onkyo took a nice chunk of the market due to the fact that they were first to the scene with all the new HD codecs, that is why got one and it was the 905 and it served me well for a couple of years and that is probably how long it took other manufacturers to catch up, they represent excellent VFM for what you get and I would not hesitate in recommending there AVR's, a friend has just bought a new 3007 and it has every feature under the sun but it would not be any good if it did not sound good but it does!


I completely agree, recruit, and it's the reason I bought my 605 specifically -- because it was the first on the scene with the new codec support (the reason 99.9 percent of 605 owners did as well) and it didn't require a second mortgage...

I gotta check out that 3007...sounds like a beast...:hsd: :yikes:


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

Wow...here's the house killer right here:

http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=TX-NR3007&class=Receiver&p=i

Now _that's_ a receiver......

I wish I could afford one of these; isn't this the second-in-line to their flagship?

You know what isn't cool about AVRs, though? If you want to spend on a really expensive high powered one, many of its features in some years will be obsolete (like new codec support). I know Onkyo was supposed to have "fixed" this with some kind of "adaptable nodules" that snap in and out of the rear of their top shelf receivers so you didn't need to buy a new AVR every time a new technology arrived, but I don't know if that ever took off...

That is what specifically stops me from even considering a very expensive AVR, or saving up for one.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Osage_Winter said:


> Wow...here's the house killer right here:
> 
> http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=TX-NR3007&class=Receiver&p=i
> 
> ...


Yes, the 5007 is the top of the line for Onkyo however Integra still has nicer models.

I have a friend who just bought the 3007 and I will be going over this week to help him set it up:bigsmile: looking forward to it.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Osage_Winter said:


> Wow...here's the house killer right here:
> 
> http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=TX-NR3007&class=Receiver&p=i
> 
> ...


Well, now i'm thinkin Onkyo for my next setup. looks like good stuff. And always read good reviews:T


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

tonyvdb said:


> Yes, the 5007 is the top of the line for Onkyo however Integra still has nicer models.


I've been down the whole Onkyo/Integra route, but I have to say Onkyo's higher-tiered models offer better bang-for-the-buck and comparable specs/performance; that isn't to say that their Integra line doesn't offer perhaps some more "premium customization" features for professional installs/multi-zoning, etc. 



> I have a friend who just bought the 3007 and I will be going over this week to help him set it up:bigsmile: looking forward to it.


Nice! Please report back to us with some input on how the install went, if you ended up using "IntelliVolume" input trim levels, etc. and even if you can post some pics, that would be awesome! :T


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> Well, now i'm thinkin Onkyo for my next setup. looks like good stuff. And always read good reviews:T


Nice, Bambino! Good thinking!

Shopping in the "affordable" range of receivers -- and of course, these brands have flagship models that approach "unaffordable" very quickly -- I always recommend Onkyo and Denon. I probably wouldn't hesitate to suggest Marantz as well. I don't have much experience with Yamaha or Pioneer units, but I wouldn't buy any low-priced Pioneer, that's for sure, and I would stay FAR away from Sony's non-ES lineup. :nono:


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Osage_Winter said:


> Nice, Bambino! Good thinking!
> 
> Shopping in the "affordable" range of receivers -- and of course, these brands have flagship models that approach "unaffordable" very quickly -- I always recommend Onkyo and Denon. I probably wouldn't hesitate to suggest Marantz as well. I don't have much experience with Yamaha or Pioneer units, but I wouldn't buy any low-priced Pioneer, that's for sure, and I would stay FAR away from Sony's non-ES lineup. :nono:


Any idea what the 2 top of the line models cost, and best place to shop for them?:sn:


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Accessories4Less is your best place or have a look at the Shack store.


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## Derry (Apr 10, 2010)

I have a Marantz SR9600,, one of a AVR,, 

running at a -25db on the volume offers a easy 100+ db when the manure hits the fan in Master & Commander,, 

Derry


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

HK AVR 247

It does the job, but the software is terrible. Got it to get money for my subs amp. I had an Onkyo 705 before. It was fantastic.


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## waldo563 (Apr 26, 2009)

I have been buying Onkyo equipment for some time and have been very happy with them until recently. When I bought a 606, I had some problems with the HDMI circuitry causing hum with 1080P input and Dynamic EQ. This is a problem that was experienced by many owners but was not acknowledged by Onkyo. To make a long story short, I was not pleased with the Onkyo support and bought a Denon AVR-1910 as a replacement. The Denon did not exhibit the problem with the same setup and ran much cooler as well. I recently was in the market to upgrade again for more power to drive my Polk RTi A7 fronts and for pre-outs. I ended up giving Onkyo another chance and getting a TX-NR807 mainly because of the feature set for the price. I am generally happy with this receiver but have had some problems with the internet radio feature which I haven't had any luck getting resolved by Onkyo support. Also it runs pretty hot which seems to be a trademark of Onkyo receivers these days.
Due to what seems to be a decline in Onkyo's product testing and customer support, I will seriously consider other brands such as Denon, Yamaha, and Marantz for my next purchase.


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> Any idea what the 2 top of the line models cost, and best place to shop for them?:sn:


Whose top two models -- Onk or Denon?


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

waldo563 said:


> I have been buying Onkyo equipment for some time and have been very happy with them until recently. When I bought a 606, I had some problems with the HDMI circuitry causing hum with 1080P input and Dynamic EQ. This is a problem that was experienced by many owners but was not acknowledged by Onkyo.


Hmmm...interesting...I don't have any such experiences with my 605 and I am running only HDMI IN/HDMI OUT...was this something prone just to the 606s?



> To make a long story short, I was not pleased with the Onkyo support


Well, that's not surprising...their customer support sucks...and it's notorious for being so...



> and bought a Denon AVR-1910 as a replacement. The Denon did not exhibit the problem with the same setup and ran much cooler as well.


Again, not surprising; the Onkyos are also notorious for being stand ins for nuclear heaters when they're on...



> I recently was in the market to upgrade again for more power to drive my Polk RTi A7 fronts and for pre-outs. I ended up giving Onkyo another chance and getting a TX-NR807 mainly because of the feature set for the price. I am generally happy with this receiver but have had some problems with the internet radio feature which I haven't had any luck getting resolved by Onkyo support. Also it runs pretty hot which seems to be a trademark of Onkyo receivers these days.


See my above comments about the heat; I too would like to upgrade the power for a pair of Polk RTi12's I am now running with my 90 watt per channel 605, but I just can't bring myself to buy a very expensive receiver for the "being outdated and obsolete" reasons I outlined earlier. How is your 807's power output? Are you happpy with it?

Aren't your RTi A7's the new equivalent to the RTi12's? Or are the A9's the new equivalent?



> Due to what seems to be a decline in Onkyo's product testing and customer support, I will seriously consider other brands such as Denon, Yamaha, and Marantz for my next purchase.


Would you venture into higher shelf models from the likes of NAD, Rotel, Cambridge, etc?


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Osage_Winter said:


> Whose top two models -- Onk or Denon?


ONKYO:R


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## corock (Sep 7, 2009)

I have a Denon 4308ci. I've always had Denon and have always been happy with them. Upgraded to the 4308ci because it was early into the 1.3 HDMI market and networking. When I first got the 4308 it ran very hot, my components are in closed quarters. Added a SpeakerCraft ESC-1 fan box on top of it and it barely gets warm now.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

corock said:


> I have a Denon 4308ci. I've always had Denon and have always been happy with them. Upgraded to the 4308ci because it was early into the 1.3 HDMI market and networking. When I first got the 4308 it ran very hot, my components are in closed quarters. Added a SpeakerCraft ESC-1 fan box on top of it and it barely gets warm now.


I love my 3808 but i'm always open for options. The Denon is my first suround receiver since they came out with suround before that it was a yamaha (not sure what model) that lasted almost 15 YRS (stereo of coarse).

Actually it still works, just has a little fuzz due to a bad input dial :huh:

now that i think about it 18 YRS. (ouch!, don't feel or act as old as i am).


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> ONKYO:R


Ahhhh....okay. Well, I know you're not going to really find their top two receivers for under $2K U.S., but I'm not sure about the exact pricing. Someone else may know; check Onkyo's webiste for their suggested list prices...

www.onkyousa.com


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

corock said:


> I have a Denon 4308ci. I've always had Denon and have always been happy with them. Upgraded to the 4308ci because it was early into the 1.3 HDMI market and networking. When I first got the 4308 it ran very hot, my components are in closed quarters. Added a SpeakerCraft ESC-1 fan box on top of it and it barely gets warm now.


Indeed, Corock; everyone I have spoken with have either gone with a Denon or Onk. :T


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> I love my 3808 but i'm always open for options. The Denon is my first suround receiver since they came out with suround before that it was a yamaha (not sure what model) that lasted almost 15 YRS (stereo of coarse).
> 
> Actually it still works, just has a little fuzz due to a bad input dial :huh:
> 
> now that i think about it 18 YRS. (ouch!, don't feel or act as old as i am).


Bambino,

Forgive me if this has been answered earlier, but do you have a current AVR with HDMI 1.3a capability and onboard decoding for the lossless formats?


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Osage_Winter said:


> Bambino,
> 
> Forgive me if this has been answered earlier, but do you have a current AVR with HDMI 1.3a capability and onboard decoding for the lossless formats?


You know i honestly am not sure i am assuming the Denon 3808ci has 1.3a capability and the other stuff, it's pushing 2 years old now though so really not sure. Why do you ask?:dontknow:


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> You know i honestly am not sure i am assuming the Denon 3808ci has 1.3a capability and the other stuff, it's pushing 2 years old now though so really not sure. Why do you ask?:dontknow:


Because you were mentioning your model and it appeared as though it was a bit outdated; the new receivers all boast the HDMI 1.3 spec, which allows for video pass through of up to 1080p video resolution and audio decoding for the newer surround codecs (Dolby's TrueHD and DTS' Master Audio). 

Are you sure you aren't positive about your receiver's specifications? Do a quick Google search on it.

Do you want to upgrade to Blu-ray and the advanced audio formats? IMO, they're not as impressively "better" than the standard Dolby Digital/DTS versions on DVDs, but if you haven't heard them yet, getting a new AVR with these features is imperative.


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## waldo563 (Apr 26, 2009)

Osage_Winter said:


> Hmmm...interesting...I don't have any such experiences with my 605 and I am running only HDMI IN/HDMI OUT...was this something prone just to the 606s?


I believe it was primarily associated with the 606 but may have read of some occurrences with the 605. However, I think it was related to room characteristics and the use of Audyssey Dynamic EQ since I only noticed it after moving the receiver to my basement from the family room. Disabling Dynamic EQ significantly reduced the hum but did not completely remove it.



> See my above comments about the heat; I too would like to upgrade the power for a pair of Polk RTi12's I am now running with my 90 watt per channel 605, but I just can't bring myself to buy a very expensive receiver for the "being outdated and obsolete" reasons I outlined earlier. How is your 807's power output? Are you happpy with it?


The 807 brings out a noticeable increase in dynamic range with my RTi A7's over the Denon AVR-1910 so I'm pretty happy with the power output.



> Aren't your RTi A7's the new equivalent to the RTi12's? Or are the A9's the new equivalent?


The RTi A9's would be the equivalent to the RTi12's so the A7's would be similar to the RTi10's. How do you like your RTi12's? I assume from your post that you are also finding a 90 watt receiver to be running out of headroom with your speakers.



> Would you venture into higher shelf models from the likes of NAD, Rotel, Cambridge, etc?


Definitely...assuming I can swing it. But what I will probably do next is buy a two-channel amp to drive my front speakers from the Onkyo pre-outs.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

:spend:


Osage_Winter said:


> Because you were mentioning your model and it appeared as though it was a bit outdated; the new receivers all boast the HDMI 1.3 spec, which allows for video pass through of up to 1080p video resolution and audio decoding for the newer surround codecs (Dolby's TrueHD and DTS' Master Audio).
> 
> Are you sure you aren't positive about your receiver's specifications? Do a quick Google search on it.
> 
> Do you want to upgrade to Blu-ray and the advanced audio formats? IMO, they're not as impressively "better" than the standard Dolby Digital/DTS versions on DVDs, but if you haven't heard them yet, getting a new AVR with these features is imperative.


Yeah, I'm pretty sure they don't make the 3808 anymore i'll do a search in the morning gotta get to bed been along night my wife and i sent the twins to grandparents and had our selfs a good night on the town. I'll post back when i know more. thanks for the info. I am looking forward to somthing new and with a bit more power and features not that the 3808 is lacking much, i just am the type that always wants more.:spend:


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

waldo563 said:


> I believe it was primarily associated with the 606 but may have read of some occurrences with the 605. However, I think it was related to room characteristics and the use of Audyssey Dynamic EQ since I only noticed it after moving the receiver to my basement from the family room. Disabling Dynamic EQ significantly reduced the hum but did not completely remove it.


Again, interesting. I am personally not running Audyssey at all, as I just didn't like the results I was getting with it, nor did my first installer who assisted me with the 605's install in my previous system before we moved to this new house; in fact, he couldn't even get any readings with the mic plugged in after several tries. This could have been because of ambient noise, but at any rate, I have always dialed in my own calibration and distance settings.

I don't prefer the way Audyssey on my 605 pegged most of the settings when I re-ran them over the years anyway; the system always found my Polk R20 bookshelves as "Large" which they shouldn't have been ran at (or Full-Range) and made some other distancing mistakes and such. I have heard a good deal of horror stories regarding people's experiences with Onkyos and Audyssey, many of which can be read over at AVS and which included, amongst others, a limited volume issue in which owners complained about their receivers not getting "anywhere near loud enough" when Audyssey was engaged, and then effectively correcting the situation when Audyssey was off. These alone were enough to make me just adjust my receiver manually...



> The 807 brings out a noticeable increase in dynamic range with my RTi A7's over the Denon AVR-1910 so I'm pretty happy with the power output.


How many watts did your 1910 put out?

I may need to eventually upgrade to a better receiver, which brings me to this:



> The RTi A9's would be the equivalent to the RTi12's so the A7's would be similar to the RTi10's. How do you like your RTi12's? I assume from your post that you are also finding a 90 watt receiver to be running out of headroom with your speakers.


Right -- the A7's were more like the RTi10's. As far as my situation, no, I am not finding a lack of headroom at all with my RTi12's -- I haven't even been able to get the volume on my 605 that high yet. Perhaps my comments about "needing a new receiver" were a bit misleading; I'm actually not experiencing any problems so far with the 605 powering the 12's. I am just going by the raw specs which say these things can handle 500 watts RMS! 

But I spoke with Polk's customer folks, and they assured me that I can feed the RTi12's the "90 watts per channel" from my 605 and it would be OK because they're not really difficult speakers to run as they're 8 ohms and they have a 90dB sensitivity, and due to the fact, additionally, that they can take anywhere from 50 to 500 watts. Would a 250 watt-plus power amp really wake them up? Sure. Can I afford that now? No...:rolleyesno: addle: :crying: :hissyfit: :hissyfit: :hissyfit:



> Definitely...assuming I can swing it. But what I will probably do next is buy a two-channel amp to drive my front speakers from the Onkyo pre-outs.


You know something? That's what I was thinking -- I think in my next upgrade, I will get something like an Emotiva three-channel amp to power the front three channels, and let the receiver power the surrounds...so a true 5 channel amp isn't really necessary. BUT, in order to do this, I need to first get a receiver with pre outs as the 605 doesn't have any...:rolleyesno: :foottap:


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> :spend:
> 
> Yeah, I'm pretty sure they don't make the 3808 anymore i'll do a search in the morning gotta get to bed been along night my wife and i sent the twins to grandparents and had our selfs a good night on the town. I'll post back when i know more. thanks for the info. I am looking forward to somthing new and with a bit more power and features not that the 3808 is lacking much, i just am the type that always wants more.:spend:


No problem. Get some sleep, and let us know what you find out when you check back in! :wave:


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## waldo563 (Apr 26, 2009)

Osage_Winter said:


> How many watts did your 1910 put out?


The 1910 is rated at 90 watts per channel.



> You know something? That's what I was thinking -- I think in my next upgrade, I will get something like an Emotiva three-channel amp to power the front three channels, and let the receiver power the surrounds...so a true 5 channel amp isn't really necessary. BUT, in order to do this, I need to first get a receiver with pre outs as the 605 doesn't have any...:rolleyesno: :foottap:


To be perfectly honest, the pre-outs on the 807 were more of a reason for my receiver upgrade than the increase in power was. I am also thinking my next upgrade would be either a 2 or 3 channel Emotiva amp as well. Leaning towards a 2 channel since I think the Onkyo 807 should have enough power at 135 watts per channel to handle the center and surrounds (rear surrounds are not being used right now).


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

waldo563 said:


> The 1910 is rated at 90 watts per channel.


Just like my Onkyo 605...and you're saying you perceive a definite increase in dynamics when you stepped up from the 1910?



> To be perfectly honest, the pre-outs on the 807 were more of a reason for my receiver upgrade than the increase in power was. I am also thinking my next upgrade would be either a 2 or 3 channel Emotiva amp as well. Leaning towards a 2 channel since I think the Onkyo 807 should have enough power at 135 watts per channel to handle the center and surrounds (rear surrounds are not being used right now).


Makes sense. Good plan. My situation will probably be similar, in that I'll get a three channel (or two channel as you said) amp just to power the front stage, as I believe most receivers do just fine for surround information; after all, they're there just for effects support and such.

What is all the hype behind Emotiva? I see them all over the internet, but what is the big thing about this company's amps? Is it the pricing? Are there any other brands you would consider in terms of outboard power amplification?

I wish Onkyo would get into the multichannel amp game beyond their two-channel offerings in the "M" series; I would buy one of their multichannel units in a heartbeat if they made one. They would most likely be affordable, and they'd look great underneath one of their receivers acting as a pre/pro...:T


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## waldo563 (Apr 26, 2009)

Osage_Winter said:


> Just like my Onkyo 605...and you're saying you perceive a definite increase in dynamics when you stepped up from the 1910?


The operative word being "perceived" since I don't have any measurements to back it up. It did seem as though the 1910 was a bit strained at higher volumes. With a 50% increase in rated power I would expect some difference but who knows...maybe I am unconciously justifying the upgrade.



> What is all the hype behind Emotiva? I see them all over the internet, but what is the big thing about this company's amps? Is it the pricing? Are there any other brands you would consider in terms of outboard power amplification?


The main reason I am considering Emotiva is that they seem to provide pretty good value and appear to use quality components but I would be open to considering other brands which can provide equivalent value and don't require a second mortgage. There does seem to be some hype associated with Emotiva but apparently some who hold some pretty negative opinions as well. I really haven't done enough research to make up my mind either way.



> I wish Onkyo would get into the multichannel amp game beyond their two-channel offerings in the "M" series; I would buy one of their multichannel units in a heartbeat if they made one. They would most likely be affordable, and they'd look great underneath one of their receivers acting as a pre/pro...:T


And another benefit would be that you could turn off your furnace when running an Onkyo amp. Based on the amount of heat produced by these 90-135 watt receivers, I would hate to see what a 250 or 500 watt amplifier would put out...possibly single-handedly accelerating or bringing on (depending on your position on the subject) global warming.


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## nova (Apr 30, 2006)

Denon 3805
Mostly cause I got a great deal on it and because it was the "it" receiver at the time.


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

waldo563 said:


> The operative word being "perceived" since I don't have any measurements to back it up. It did seem as though the 1910 was a bit strained at higher volumes. With a 50% increase in rated power I would expect some difference but who knows...maybe I am unconciously justifying the upgrade.


Well, I'm not saying that you have concrete evidence to make these claims, nor holding you to anything of the sort -- I just wanted to know if it seemed as if you were getting more power and a much more involving surround experience, as this will dictate if I should upgrade my 605 to one of Onkyo's higher powered models, and then add an amp from there if I'm not happy because whatever new model I get, there WILL be pre outs...

When you say your 1910 was a bit "strained" at higher volumes, what kinds of characteristics was it putting out...distortion? Fatigue? Metallic "edgyness"?

I can't get my 605 half way up when the wife is in the HT because she thinks it's just way too loud...I don't think I'll ever get to upgrade to a nice beefy power amp or flagship receiver...:hissyfit: 



> The main reason I am considering Emotiva is that they seem to provide pretty good value and appear to use quality components but I would be open to considering other brands which can provide equivalent value and don't require a second mortgage. There does seem to be some hype associated with Emotiva but apparently some who hold some pretty negative opinions as well. I really haven't done enough research to make up my mind either way.


I hear you; I wouldn't even know which brand of multichannel amp to buy aside from Emotiva anyway, except for maybe Outlaw or something...there is just SO much talk of Emotiva on all the forums; it seems like they just came right out of nowhere with their amps...



> And another benefit would be that you could turn off your furnace when running an Onkyo amp. Based on the amount of heat produced by these 90-135 watt receivers, I would hate to see what a 250 or 500 watt amplifier would put out...possibly single-handedly accelerating or bringing on (depending on your position on the subject) global warming.


Well, that's possibly true, but I'd still like them to get into the multichannel amplification game. :T


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

nova said:


> Denon 3805
> Mostly cause I got a great deal on it and because it was the "it" receiver at the time.


Thanks, Mark!

Do you still have the 3805? I assume you must because this is a "What Kind of AVR Do You HAVE" thread!!

Is it up to date with HDMI 1.3 and onboard decoding for the lossless formats?

I, too, purchased my Onkyo 605 because it was definitely the IT receiver when it was launched; everyone was buzzing about it because it was the first on the block to decode TrueHD and Master Audio, and cost under $500 on the street.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Osage_Winter said:


> Bambino,
> 
> Forgive me if this has been answered earlier, but do you have a current AVR with HDMI 1.3a capability and onboard decoding for the lossless formats?


I checked the Denon web site and it says somthing like now updated with HDMI 1.3a. So now i'm kind of don't think it does. What is pass through anyways and what does it mean?


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> I checked the Denon web site and it says somthing like now updated with HDMI 1.3a. So now i'm kind of don't think it does. What is pass through anyways and what does it mean?


Are you not running a Blu-ray player yet?

"Pass Through" means that an audio/video receiver will simply pass a 1080p video signal (from a Blu-ray or DVD player) straight through to a TV/display with no degredation or issues; why this comes into play is this: Blu-ray players that bitstream (natively transmit) the high resolution surround formats (Dolby TrueHD/DTS Master Audio) AND pass full 1080p high definition video over ONE HDMI cable need to send the audio and video over one cable, so some kind of "splitting" device must come into the chain so audio can get to the receiver (for decoding) and video can get passed to the display -- that's where PASS THROUGH comes into play with an AVR. 

Since 1080p and the high resolution audio formats are mainly transmitted over HDMI, this one cable is sending audio AND video direct to a receiver, which must then pass off the video signal to a display.

Did I confuse you more than before??!! :dontknow:


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Osage_Winter said:


> Are you not running a Blu-ray player yet?
> 
> "Pass Through" means that an audio/video receiver will simply pass a 1080p video signal (from a Blu-ray or DVD player) straight through to a TV/display with no degredation or issues; why this comes into play is this: Blu-ray players that bitstream (natively transmit) the high resolution surround formats (Dolby TrueHD/DTS Master Audio) AND pass full 1080p high definition video over ONE HDMI cable need to send the audio and video over one cable, so some kind of "splitting" device must come into the chain so audio can get to the receiver (for decoding) and video can get passed to the display -- that's where PASS THROUGH comes into play with an AVR.
> 
> ...


I acctually bought a PS3 for blu-ray when i got the AVR and my wife wanted the american idol game so i thought we'd both come out ok if i just got that. So since then i've accumulated way more blu-rays then i ever intended, my AVR does show different indicator lights for some of the different movies i put in. I've got my system hooked up as follows HDMI from PS3 and cable box to AVR, HDMI from AVR to TV. So i always have to have the AVR on to watch Blu-Ray or cable. Thanks for the info.


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> I've got my system hooked up as follows HDMI from PS3 and cable box to AVR, HDMI from AVR to TV.


That seems to be the correct connection. Just make sure in your PS3 (not sure if you have a first or second generation console) that you have BITSTREAM selected for output and that your Denon has the listening modes set up to decode TrueHD/Master Audio, if the receiver decodes them.

You're welcome for the info.


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## nova (Apr 30, 2006)

Yes, I still have it. Also have a Kenwood VR-507. The Denon 3805 is just as it came out of the box. No HDMI. No upgrades or updates of any kind.


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## waldo563 (Apr 26, 2009)

Osage_Winter said:


> Well, I'm not saying that you have concrete evidence to make these claims, nor holding you to anything of the sort -- I just wanted to know if it seemed as if you were getting more power and a much more involving surround experience, as this will dictate if I should upgrade my 605 to one of Onkyo's higher powered models, and then add an amp from there if I'm not happy because whatever new model I get, there WILL be pre outs...


I think the difference in power has significantly added to my listening experience.



> When you say your 1910 was a bit "strained" at higher volumes, what kinds of characteristics was it putting out...distortion? Fatigue? Metallic "edgyness"?
> 
> I can't get my 605 half way up when the wife is in the HT because she thinks it's just way too loud...I don't think I'll ever get to upgrade to a nice beefy power amp or flagship receiver...:hissyfit:


Fortunately I have my setup in the basement and can listen at whatever level I like...most of the time. As for the 1910, I would characterize it as "edgyness". I'm not sure how to describe it other than it just seemed like it was working too hard. Half the time I have no idea what the reviewers are saying with some of the terms they throw around to describe the listening experience...kind of like a wine enthusiast describing the characteristics of a wine when to me it's a glass of fermented grapes.



> Well, that's possibly true, but I'd still like them to get into the multichannel amplification game. :T


If they stayed with their "Bang for the Buck" strategy I would probably consider Onkyo for an amp as well since, despite the problems, they still seem to be the feature leader.


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

nova said:


> Yes, I still have it. Also have a Kenwood VR-507. The Denon 3805 is just as it came out of the box. No HDMI. No upgrades or updates of any kind.


So, you don't use it for Blu-ray playback? Decoding, etc...


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

waldo563 said:


> I think the difference in power has significantly added to my listening experience.


Great...



> Fortunately I have my setup in the basement and can listen at whatever level I like...most of the time. As for the 1910, I would characterize it as "edgyness". I'm not sure how to describe it other than it just seemed like it was working too hard. Half the time I have no idea what the reviewers are saying with some of the terms they throw around to describe the listening experience...kind of like a wine enthusiast describing the characteristics of a wine when to me it's a glass of fermented grapes.


Gotcha...

And I'm jealous that you have a basement for a HT...



> If they stayed with their "Bang for the Buck" strategy I would probably consider Onkyo for an amp as well since, despite the problems, they still seem to be the feature leader.


Indeed...


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## nova (Apr 30, 2006)

Osage_Winter said:


> So, you don't use it for Blu-ray playback? Decoding, etc...


Well,... sorta. I have a Panasonic DMP-BD80 that has analog outputs that are connected to the 3805's analog inputs. So the Panny decodes and the Denon powers the speakers.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Osage_Winter said:


> That seems to be the correct connection. Just make sure in your PS3 (not sure if you have a first or second generation console) that you have BITSTREAM selected for output and that your Denon has the listening modes set up to decode TrueHD/Master Audio, if the receiver decodes them.
> 
> You're welcome for the info.


I believe thats how i have it set in the PS3 (doublecheck though), It's the fat one by the way. Thanks again,you really know your stuff.:T


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## Dale Rasco (Apr 11, 2009)

I believe bitstreaming of HD audio codecs wasn't available until the PS3 slim model. You can still bitstream but DTS Master Audio will register as DTS.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## corock (Sep 7, 2009)

Yes the Fat PS3 can't bitstream HD audio so you have to set the PS3 to "pcm". That just means your PS3 will decode the HD codecs and pass it to the Denon already decoded. Bambino, your 3808 should show "multi-channel in" on its display. Push the select button on the PS3 controler and the info thats displayed in the top right will show "DTS Master HD" or "Doldy True HD" if everything on the PS3 is set up right and you've selected a HD playback on the blu-ray you're playing.


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

nova said:


> Well,... sorta. I have a Panasonic DMP-BD80 that has analog outputs that are connected to the 3805's analog inputs. So the Panny decodes and the Denon powers the speakers.


OK, gotcha.

I had the Panny BD10A, the first generation BD player, and replaced it with the OPPO BDP-83. I had the Panny going HDMI OUT for everything, but since it didn't support Master Audio at all, I kept the DTS output to bitstream, and since it didn't bitstream TrueHD, I kept it to PCM to internally decode TrueHD...


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> I believe thats how i have it set in the PS3 (doublecheck though), It's the fat one by the way. Thanks again,you really know your stuff.:T



You got it.

If you have the first generation PS3, as others have said above, then I don't think you can bitstream TrueHD nor even support Master Audio -- in that case, your Master Audio soundtracks will be "downrezzed" to a "core DTS" stream on the disc, which will still sound great (I actually do NOT hear any difference between Master Audio and core DTS since getting my new OPPO BD player which bitstreams full Master Audio tracks) but it all depends on how you set your PS3 up...no need to sweat this, though, as this is how I was running my first generation Panasonic player and core DTS sounded the same to me as full Master Audio does now on my new OPPO...absolutely NO difference. 

If you set your DTS output to "Bitstream," the PS3 will send, over HDMI or digital coax/optical, the core DTS stream from the MA soundtrack. If set to "PCM," the PS3 will internally decode the core DTS stream and send that as multichannel PCM over to your receiver, either over HDMI or multichannel analog cables.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

corock said:


> Yes the Fat PS3 can't bitstream HD audio so you have to set the PS3 to "pcm". That just means your PS3 will decode the HD codecs and pass it to the Denon already decoded. Bambino, your 3808 should show "multi-channel in" on its display. Push the select button on the PS3 controler and the info thats displayed in the top right will show "DTS Master HD" or "Doldy True HD" if everything on the PS3 is set up right and you've selected a HD playback on the blu-ray you're playing.


Yep thats what it does, Just sounds like it's time for an upgrade on some of my equipment. Although everything serves me fine still wouldn't mind haveing the latest stuff. allthough it seems everytime you upgrade, something else comes out to replace it.:dontknow:


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## corock (Sep 7, 2009)

bambino said:


> allthough it seems everytime you upgrade, something else comes out to replace it.:dontknow:


can you say 3D!


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

If it doesn't happen, it doesn't happen, but I'm holding out until we _don't_ need glasses for 3D...:rolleyesno::rubeyes:


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

corock said:


> can you say 3D!


3D :yikes:


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## waldo563 (Apr 26, 2009)

Osage_Winter said:


> If it doesn't happen, it doesn't happen, but I'm holding out until we _don't_ need glasses for 3D...:rolleyesno::rubeyes:


I'm with you on that...it just seems to me that it won't be a true 3D experience until we can dispense with the glasses...besides that will give me time to recover from my last series of upgrades.


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

waldo563 said:


> I'm with you on that...it just seems to me that it won't be a true 3D experience until we can dispense with the glasses...besides that will give me time to recover from my last series of upgrades.


TOTALLY agreed, Waldo...

My wife already made it clear that she's not putting on another set of glasses just to sit and watch everything come at us in the third dimension at home. I have to agree.

And the cost of my last series of upgrades...and the pain of losing the cash in my wallet? Forget it -- I'm totally with you, too...

I didn't even get around to buying the titles I wanted on DVD...let alone Blu-ray...and now we have to TRIPLE DIP, possibly, for our favorite titles coming out in 3D? I simply cannot do it...:dumbcrazy: :rant:


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## waldo563 (Apr 26, 2009)

Osage_Winter said:


> TOTALLY agreed, Waldo...
> 
> My wife already made it clear that she's not putting on another set of glasses just to sit and watch everything come at us in the third dimension at home. I have to agree.
> 
> ...


There must be a law that would prevent these electronics manufacturers from preying on us totally helpless (hapless?) addicts...yet they keep feeding the habit.


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## Osage_Winter (Apr 8, 2010)

LOL...

I know...


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## Dunedain (Apr 12, 2010)

Our HK receiver recently broke after 10 years of very regular use listening to music and watching movies on DVD with that great DD 5.1 sound (a good receiver), so had to get a new one. Just got a Denon 3310CI. It's very nice; looks great, good clean sound quality, and supports most any surround sound format you might want.


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