# Help with Audyssey, did it mess up?



## jeffmule (Nov 13, 2011)

I ran Audyssey. I have 2 Eenrgy rc-30s and a Klipsch sub sw 350 (waiting for Rytmik F12 to arrive)


I ran Audyssey and the settings seem wrong to me.


Speaker config:

Front: small
Subwoofer:yes 

* (seems right)*



Bass setting:

Subwoofer: LFE
LPF for LFE: 120 hz 


*(is this right?, I set my sub on "bypass")*



Distance:

Front L: 7.2ft
Front R: 7.0ft 
Subwoofer: 11.3 


*(my sub is right next to my Front L, so why does it say 11.3? it is not that far away, is this normal or should I change it?)*


Channel level:

Front L: -1.0db
Front R: -4.0db
subwoofer: -10db

*(why are they all such different levels when they are pretty even distance from me? Is this right?)*




Thanks to anyone that can help. I really want this to sound as good as possible


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## TypeA (Aug 14, 2010)

I wouldnt be surprised if it messed up, very well documented that the results wont always be accurate. 

Ive always gone behind with a helper and tape measure manually verifing exact speaker distances (from _my_ seat ), yes adjust your speaker distance settings to exactly what you measure. My theater is small and I can get away with measuring from one seat but I would still note Audyssey results, before changing settings, and see if your manual adjustments make an adverse results in other seats in _your_ theater. 

After you make note of the Audyssey results dont hesitate to tinker with your speaker levels, especially channels that seem unusually low. Put in a movie youre familiar with and spend some time listening, I usually bring my center up just slightly. If you end up making adjustments you dont like you can always fall back on the original settings Audyssey created because you noted them before you started adjusting to your preference. I have always adjusted my sub levels by ear, sometimes drastically. So far Ive always found that if the remaining speakers need adjustment, its little if any. A radio shack sound level meter will make it official for about $40, handy but not absolutely necessary unless you tend to be OCD.


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## robbo266317 (Sep 22, 2008)

Does your sub have low pass filter settings? if so try it on 80 HZ, 100 Hz and 120 Hz and compare the differences. If you have REW and the appropriate hardware it will tell you a lot more about your setup.

The distance to the sub is really adjusting the phase to make it match in better with your mains. Also, do you have phase control available on your sub?

The levels could be due to room interactions and/or sub interaction. Try with the sub disconnected and see if it changes. If it does try moving the sub to another location.

I would thoroughly recommend getting REW or similar as it will tell you a lot more about what is going on in the room.

Cheers,
Bill.


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## phreak (Aug 16, 2010)

jeffmule said:


> I ran Audyssey.
> Front: small
> Subwoofer:yes
> 
> ...


This all looks ok to me. I usually readjust speaker levels manually with a SPL meter, but that is my preference and not required. If Audyssey set your Sub level at -10 that may be minimum trim which means that you should turn down the gain (level or volume) on your sub and run Audyssey again. Distances can be manually set with a tape measure, but the software may have adjusted them for issues related to phasing (especially sub) and reflections. If your room is perfectly symmetrical and your speakers are perfectly centered and aimed the left right distances should match, but most of us don't live in a perfect world.


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## jeffmule (Nov 13, 2011)

Thanks for the advice guys. I further listened to some music and movies and the right speaker sounded TERRIBLE, like it was muddy. I looked behind it and what do ya know, it was out of phase! I corrected it, ran audyssey again, and the settings are now correct! Phew....thought i blew a speaker or something....


I will update this thread when my Rythmik F12 arrives because I don't know how set up sub with this system and will need help to make sure it is used right. Thanks again for all your help!


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

jeffmule said:


> I ran Audyssey. I have 2 Eenrgy rc-30s and a Klipsch sub sw 350 (waiting for Rytmik F12 to arrive)
> 
> 
> I ran Audyssey and the settings seem wrong to me.
> ...


There is nothing out of line here. If you are uncomfortable, you can repeat the measurements but I see no reason to do so.

Kal


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Just out of curiosity how many positions did you read when you ran Audyssey?


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
The Subwoofer tends to be the transducer that Audyssey gets the distance wrong the most. And while my ML Vantages are rated down to 34hz, they were still set to 60hz or something. Also you want the LPF of LFE set to 120hz. For some strange reason, many Onkyos used to have this set at 80hz by default. I think the x09 and I am pretty sure my 3008 had it changed to 120 as a default.

Personally, the first thing I do after running Audyssey is to set all my speakers to 80hz even though only my CC is set to that after Audyssey. Then I bring out the SPL Meter and calibrate all channels to 75db's if not already. XT32 actually came super close to this on the Mains and Center, but the Surrounds were set well below. And finally I calibrate my Subwoofers to 80db's. If the Subwoofer Distance is massively off, you can always change it to a more accurate distance. Unlike some Room EQ's, Audyssey allows you to do these things without disabling it. Trinnov will not allow any changes for instance.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> The Subwoofer tends to be the transducer that Audyssey gets the distance wrong the most.


You are presuming that, if it does not match what your tape measure tells you, that it is wrong. However, the issue is not just distance but latency. Many subs have a significant processing latency which must be dealt with and it is expressed in an increased "distance" by the audio processing and Audyssey.



> Personally, the first thing I do after running Audyssey is to set all my speakers to 80hz even though only my CC is set to that after Audyssey.


I hope that means you are setting them higher than Audyssey recommends since, otherwise, you are leaving a band that is uncorrected as Audyssey only corrects to its measured -3dB point.



> Then I bring out the SPL Meter and calibrate all channels to 75db's if not already. XT32 actually came super close to this on the Mains and Center, but the Surrounds were set well below.


Depends on how you are doing this. In general, I trust the sweep tones of the Audyssey (and some other systems) more than I do pink noise and the typical RS SLM.



> Unlike some Room EQ's, Audyssey allows you to do these things without disabling it. Trinnov will not allow any changes for instance.


And for good reason, in the case of Trinnov, since the 2D and 3D virtual re-imaging of the speakers is dependent on the calculated values.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Kal Rubinson said:


> You are presuming that, if it does not match what your tape measure tells you, that it is wrong. However, the issue is not just distance but latency. Many subs have a significant processing latency which must be dealt with and it is expressed in an increased "distance" by the audio processing and Audyssey.
> 
> I hope that means you are setting them higher than Audyssey recommends since, otherwise, you are leaving a band that is uncorrected as Audyssey only corrects to its measured -3dB point.
> 
> ...


Kal,
Indeed all of my speakers are set lower by XT32 and thus they are being filtered. As I said, aside from the Surround Speakers, XT32 was bang on with my SPL Meter. However, my Surrounds measured around 65db's when I ran the SPL. I am not sure if it has something to do with using Electrostatic Hybrids.

I do understand why Trinnov does not allow you to change any values. Moreover, I have been quite impressed with Trinnov via the Sherwood/Newcastle R-972. I recently had a chance to hook one up to my HT and it really is impressive. All the same, I do appreciate that I can adjust my speakers up to 80hz with Audyssey as Trinnov only set my Center Channel to Small. As I am using 2 quality Subwoofers, I just prefer that they handle the Bass. I suppose I should have made my statements more clear about adjusting the XO set initially by Audyssey.

As for Subwoofer Distance, I have not gotten any deviation from actual distance. However, this is something I have read about with other folks countless times. It well might be that I have a relatively decent sized Room as I sit about 16 Feet from my Mains and Display.
J


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

JJ-

I appreciate that you are well informed and what you do is justifiable. My comments were specifically in the context of this thread because beginners might take what you do as completely generalizable and that might be misleading.

And, wow, you have a bigger collection of players than I do.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Kal,
I am so glad that you take the time to Post here. I truly meant it when I said I should have made it more clear that my Speakers are capable of going lower than 80hz. Your insights and background are hugely appreciated by me personally and I am a huge fan of your "Music in the Round" Column in Stereophile.
Cheers,
JJ


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## jeffmule (Nov 13, 2011)

Ok guys, I reran Audyssey now that my Rythmik arrived (which btw MURDERS me previous sub).


Current settings are dead on it seems, I just ONE more question

It is settings my Rythmik F12 to 40hz. With my Rythmik paired with my Rc-30s, should it be set at 40hz like Audyssey wants, or should I set it to 60hz? Thanks!


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Jeff,
If your Mains are being rated down to 40hz, you can go all the way to 80hz without sub localization issues. (in theory) I would adjust up to where you are most pleased b/w 40-80hz.
Cheers,
J


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## tcarcio (Jun 27, 2007)

Jungle Jack said:


> Jeff,
> If your Mains are being rated down to 40hz, you can go all the way to 80hz without sub localization issues. (in theory) I would adjust up to where you are most pleased b/w 40-80hz.
> Cheers,
> J


I would think if your mains are rated to go down to 40hz you should be good to go down to 60 at a minimum no?????


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

tcarcio said:


> I would think if your mains are rated to go down to 40hz you should be good to go down to 60 at a minimum no?????


Depends. Rated FR is not the same as power capabilities at the low end. OTOH, it is worth a try.


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