# Noob with budget



## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Looking for a budget system, preferabley build my own but HTIB I guess if its upgradeable. dont care if its 2.1 for now for I want the best bang for the buck and can always upgrade. Looking for something that sounds good for not only movies but the stereo/cd's. Would like a reciever/speakers/and CD player. Do not at this time have a blue ray or DVD player worth a either so if possible would like that too, if works as CD player then wont need that the DVD/blue ray would work. What are my best bets for around a grand?? I've heard the avs systems are good and reasonabley priced also the Yambeka 5-speaker system. But as I said I dont need the 5.1 as of yet unless it fits in the budget. Would rather spend more on two speakers and a center. Would also like to add 2 speakers on another channel for the patio, nothing fancy just so have music there for BBQ darts etc... Thanks guys

If it helps have a 61A650 on the way and Time warner HD/DVR,
Old school Pioneer Reciever
thats about it everything else is junk. 

Thanks again!!


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

First of all ... Welcome :wave:



Go_Ducks said:


> Looking for a budget system, preferabley build my own but HTIB I guess if its upgradeable. dont care if its 2.1 for now for I want the best bang for the buck and can always upgrade...


After comparing HTIB the only systems that are decent are this  Onkyo's  ... they don't come with a DVD/CD player, but you can get one cheap for less than $100 or a BluRay for around $250 :yes:

Good thing is that you can upgrade the speakers without changing the receiver (like some other HTIB systems where you need to replace everything) :yes:

Your other option will be to get an AVR, a pair of speakers and DVD/CD ... in my opinion, you'll be better getting an HTIB to start and upgrade little by little :yes:



> ... I've heard the avs systems are good and reasonabley priced also the Yambeka 5-speaker system.


I read a lot of good things about SVS sytems (don't own any of them), Yambeka are okay, but I still go with the Onkyo (you'll get AVR and sub, and a better frequency response too) :yes:



> Would also like to add 2 speakers on another channel for the patio, nothing fancy just so have music there for BBQ darts etc...


Will you be playing movies and music at the same time??? ... if you say yes, the Onkyo HTIB won't work because the AVR doesn't have a Zone 2 amp (you'll need a different AVR); but if you say no ... you'll be okay, but you'll need a speaker selector for the outside speakers, and in this case you can run 4-8 pair of speakers depending on the selector :yes:


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Hello Brian, Welcome to the Shack!

Well, my personal recommendation is to go with an Onkyo 806 Receiver. It offers the best bang for buck right now and is very future proof. 
For speakers and a sub have a look at SVS, SVS right now has hnds down the best subs for the money on the market and there speakers are very good as well.
Now of course it really depends on your budget so lets find out what you want to spend first.

On a side note HTIB systems offer little bang for buck and you will be wanting to upgrade very soon after. Plus they usually don't have HDMI inputs.


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

tonyvdb said:


> Now of course it really depends on your budget so lets find out what you want to spend first.


Here you go ...


> What are my best bets for around a grand??


 ... and he needs a DVD/CD or BluRay player too :yes:



> ... Plus they usually don't have HDMI inputs.


and no Zone 2 ... he wants to add a pair of speakers to the outside :yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

> Will you be playing movies and music at the same time??? ...


No but always a plus I guess



> ... and he needs a DVD/CD or BluRay player too


This mean a BluRay wont play cd's??


> Your other option will be to get an AVR, a pair of speakers and DVD/CD ... in my opinion, you'll be better getting an HTIB to start and upgrade little by little


I guess right now I could use the old reciever, when I get home Ill let you know what it is, all I remember is that its pioneer, has a laser disk option so probally pretty old, those lasted what a week befor DVD took over lol. Has A/B channels for speakers up to 5.1 I think, cant remember if you can hook up a sub or not. If I can guess I could use it for now, no HDMI but guess I can wait for that, would it be better to try and use the reciever I have and buy better speakers now and a DVD/Blueray and what about upconverting, I heard it dont matter cause the TV does it anyway. 

If not what would be my best for just a reciever and speakers. 2.1 is fine but would prefer 5.1, around a grand.

Thanks


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

If your on a small budget then I would recommend getting a good receiver and maybe two good speakers and a center channel for starters. Then add a sub next and finally the surround speakers last.

Here is why I dont think HTIB systems are worth it.


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Tony



> Here is why I dont think HTIB systems are worth it.


I've read that, that is actually why I became a member, to find out "What" Reciever and speakers to buy.

Thanks it was very informitive. I did forget about the wait on a sub though. so what 3 speakers and a reciever does everyone recomend?


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Go_Ducks said:


> Tony
> 
> 
> 
> so what 3 speakers and a reciever does everyone recomend?


Right now SVS has some of the best subs for the money, They sell only on line and because of this you get a much better sub for the money. SVS also makes some nice speakers and so far is getting great reviews.
The Onkyo 806 is my choice for a receiver, its very future proof and has everything you can ask for.


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Is the onkyo 606 and dv-sp405 a good reciever and dvd?

Found them for 389.99

accessories4less make-a-store/item/SR606SP405KIT/Onkyo/TX-SR606-Receiver-DV-SP405-HDMI-DVD-Player-BLACK/ 

It wont let me link it not enough post lol


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

bumb


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

there that was five

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/SR606SP405KIT/Onkyo/TX-SR606-Receiver-DV-SP405-HDMI-DVD-Player-BLACK/1.html

maybe with the SVS system??


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

> It wont let me link it not enough post lol


To increase your post count ... go  here 



Go_Ducks said:


> Is the onkyo 606 and dv-sp405 a good reciever and dvd?
> 
> Found them for 389.99


I got a better price for you .... here


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

How much diff is that one from the 806?? They are both HDMI and 1.3 correct?


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

http://www.hometheatershack.com/electronics-retailer/speakersystems-172571-B0011YZ018-Klipsch_Quintet_SL_Home_Theater_System_Set_of_Five_Black.html

These speakers with the 606?? Or can I get better speakers for 650? I think this brings me to right around a grand, but no sub


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

I forgot :innocent:

 BluRay players  and  upconverting DVD players 

With the 606, a BluRay or DVD player and SVS system you'll have a :yay: experience :yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

> With the 606, a BluRay or DVD player and SVS system you'll have a experience



everyone think SVS over the Klipsch Quintet SL Home Theater System? Is the http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/SR606SP405KIT/Onkyo/TX-SR606-Receiver-DV-SP405-HDMI-DVD-Player-BLACK/1.html not upconverting? I dont think it is but what do I know. Guess I will need that too then, I can through that in another budget I think lol, so whats a good BR or upconverting?


I think Im starting to get the "idea" lol, but not positive. I ask alot of questions lol, thats how I learn I guess.

And I was just looking at the HT-S6100 but for a little more looks like I get ALOT more


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> These speakers with the 606?? Or can I get better speakers for 650? I think this brings me to right around a grand, but no sub


Take a look at this specifications ....compare them and decide if is worth it the extra $300 for the sub and better response :yes:

Features:
• Five piece surround sound home theater system 
• 0.75" aluminum dome tweeters and horn-loaded technology delivers lifelike performances 
• 3.5" high-output woofers deliver room-filling bass 
• Power handling: Quintet SL LCR: 50 watts (200 watts peak), Satellite: 50 watts (200 watts peak) 
• Each speaker features easy keyhole wall mounting or place on a bookshelf using the pedestal feet 

then look at this ...  SVS


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Might be able to swing the 5.0 system and then add the sub later. Whats the diff in the SBS and SCS?


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> ... so whats a good BR or upconverting?


Sorry I keep confussing you ... you need either a BluRay or an upconverting DVD not both (unless you want to spend more) :hide:

BluRay is around $250-$300 ... or you can get an upconverting DVD player for less than $100 is opt to you and your wallet (that's why I gave you the two options :bigsmile



> I ask alot of questions lol, thats how I learn I guess....


That's the way I learned too :yes:



> And I was just looking at the HT-S6100 but for a little more looks like I get ALOT more



That's the point Tony was making when he started the thread about "HTIB's" ...:yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

> Sorry I keep confussing you ... you need either a BluRay or an upconverting DVD not both (unless you want to spend more)
> 
> BluRay is around $250-$300 ... or you can get an upconverting DVD player for less than $100 is opt to you and your wallet (that's why I gave you the two options )


I knew it was one or the other. Is BR that much better and what should I look for in both of them? There are so many BR players and Upconverting players with a huge price diff.

also was reading a review on the SVS SYSTEM

At 100 Hz and 100 dB, the woofer produced a little less than 4% THD. Small woofers do that. It's one of the reasons you should cross these speakers over to the subwoofer at a reasonably high frequency.

Thats simple to do yes??


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> Might be able to swing the 5.0 system and then add the sub later. Whats the diff in the SBS and SCS?


SBS has a single woofer and SCS has two woofers ... and frequency response I think :yes:

To finance your purchase maybe you can sell some of you old stuff :bigsmile:



> ... Is BR that much better and what should I look for in both of them? There are so many BR players and Upconverting players with a huge price diff


I don't own a BR yet (just HD DVD) ...I think to notice a big difference you need to play the same movie in BluRay and SD DVD to see it :huh:

If you're in a tight budget ... my suggestion upconverting player now and BR in the future :yes:

You can even get used or refurbished DVD players ... I got a couple of DVR's for less than $40 :whistling:


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> At 100 Hz and 100 dB, the woofer produced a little less than 4% THD. Small woofers do that. It's one of the reasons you should cross these speakers over to the subwoofer at a reasonably high frequency.
> 
> Thats simple to do yes??


Most of us use the crossover @ 80Hz ...but depending on the speakers you can go lower :yes:, there's some AVR's that let you choose a different crossover to each set of speakers, maybe the 606 is one of them :yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

> I don't own a BR yet (just HD DVD) ...I think to notice a big difference you need to play the same movie in BluRay and SD DVD to see it
> 
> If you're in a tight budget ... my suggestion upconverting player now and BR in the future
> 
> You can even get used or refurbished DVD players ... I got a couple of DVR's for less than $40


probally will do the Upconvering, any suggestions?? I have also heard that you dont need one if your TV converts to 1080p anyway, Is this true. Getting a samsung 61a650, ordered it from VANNS its on the way.

As far as the BR, The lucky kids will be getting a PS3 for X-mas, guess I could just move it when I wanted BR lol. Its going in the Garage on the old RP toshiba with Rockband.


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

So sounds good, looks like Im going to try and talk the wife into the 606 and the SVS system. She is going to want CD's though maybe I should screw the DVD and go with a changer. Guess now I have to ask what a good CD changer would be. 

SO the 606 and the AVS system-- UNLESS SOMEBODY HAS A BETTER CHOICE FOR EITHER THE RECIEVER OR THE SPEAKERS.


Thanks again Sal, you've been a big help. I'm sure Ill be asking you more Q's, like the CD Changer

Also the SVS is good for music yes?? I know some SS arent that good with music.


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

If you're lucky and hurry ... maybe you can grab the one in the next few hours on ebay (tip: wait until the last minute because is when they start bidding) ...


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> She is going to want CD's though maybe I should screw the DVD and go with a changer. Guess now I have to ask what a good CD changer would be....


Any DVD player will play CD's ... I used a Sony before but is broken; I'm using a Sony CD recorder; I'm sure they're plenty of changers if you need one :yes:

Don't need to thank me ... that's why we're here and are the friendly forum on the net :bigsmile:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Well thank all then, I posted on the AVS forum too, thats where I decided about what TV to get, but I have had zero responses on the HT system. They do have a forum dedicated to the AVS system though, pretty good I read most of it. Everyone seems happy with it.

Probally going to have to wait a lil while to make the wife happy, I just conned myself a 1300 dollar tv lol.


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

I rarelly visit AVS (just the Official JBL Owners thread) ... I also posted a couple of questions in other areas with "zero" responses too ...:blink:



Go_Ducks said:


> Probally going to have to wait a lil while to make the wife happy, I just conned myself a 1300 dollar tv lol.


Yeap ... you better do some :kiss: . raying: . :hail: . :hissyfit: . :bigsmile:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

> Yeap ... you better do some . . . .


YEP ****

Probally shouldnt have started looking yet, cause now I really want a HTS lol. Especially with the new TV comming


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

So the 606 gets bad reviews on the Video upconverting or whatever, why does this matter dosent the TV do it itself anyway. Can you bypass the video 1080p upconvert and let the TV do it itself?

I also posted a question in the svs forum if you could answer

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/svsound/13723-svs-speaker-help.html


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> So the 606 gets bad reviews on the Video upconverting or whatever, why does this matter dosent the TV do it itself anyway. Can you bypass the video 1080p upconvert and let the TV do it itself?


I always connect the video signal directly to TV and audio to AVR to avoid the conversion of signals ... and also, to avoid the usage of the AVR all the time :bigsmile:


Like you said, I'm sure your TV will auto convert any signal it gets ... so don't worry about the bad review on the 606; and when the time comes ... just try both set ups (directly to TV and through AVR) and see if you notice any difference :yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Will do, was going to hook up with HDMI but your way sounds better with the sound to the AVS and video straight to the TV


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

So will I be able to get by using my old pioneer VSX-454 and just buy speakers for now, would giv eme more $ for speakers if I could do this. Or just buy less speakers and the Onkyo 606?


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> So will I be able to get by using my old pioneer VSX-454 and just buy speakers for now, would giv eme more $ for speakers if I could do this. Or just buy less speakers and the Onkyo 606?


Well it depends ....

If you get a BluRay, you need an AVR that can decode TrueHD and DTS HD ... if you keep your VSX-454 I'm sure you'll be able to use just Dolby Digital (I remember reading that is not a big difference :dontknow ... and, if you get a regular DVD player you can still use the VSX 454 no need for the 606 :yes:

I have an HD DVD player and few HD movies, my AVR doesn't decode TrueHD or DTS HD ... I use DD and I'm happy with the sound :yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Might just use it for now then and get the 606 later, then I can get more speakers now lol.

I dont have the remote for it and I dont see it on Harmony's website, will I still be able to program the harmony, might know more when the remote, and TV for that matter get here on WED. Cant wait for that!!

So how do I go about hooking all this up? will have the TV, HD/DVR and the AVS? Will just run my shitty speakers for now and order some SVS soon. Was just gong to use HDMI but the AVS dont have it. Also what do I listen to it in? 3 channel logic? Will only have the front three, two old pioneer towers and a denon center for now.

Thanks again SAL you have been a big help


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> I dont have the remote for it and I dont see it on Harmony's website, will I still be able to program the harmony, might know more when the remote, and TV for that matter get here on WED. Cant wait for that!!


If you got an Universal remote ... I'm sure you can programm it for the AVR :yes:



> So how do I go about hooking all this up? will have the TV, HD/DVR and the AVS? .... Was just gong to use HDMI but the AVS dont have it. Also what do I listen to it in? 3 channel logic? Will only have the front three, two old pioneer towers and a denon center for now...


I'm trying to find the manual for your AVR online ... but no luck :wits-end:

What options Do you have???? ..... I'm sure your TV will have all options (composite, S video, component, HDMI and audio RCA's and if you're lucky opticals); HD/DVR has the same as TV; WHat about the AVR??? ... What options do you have besides RCA's (red and white)????

What surround options your AVR has??? ... Dolby Prologic, Dolby Digital, DTS, etc.


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

> What surround options your AVR has??? ... Dolby Prologic, Dolby Digital, DTS, etc.


I believe just Dolby prologic, dolby 3ch logic. dont see anything else, think it was made in 1995 lol



> What options Do you have???? ..... I'm sure your TV will have all options (composite, S video, component, HDMI and audio RCA's and if you're lucky opticals); HD/DVR has the same as TV; WHat about the AVR??? ... What options do you have besides RCA's (red and white)????


TV/hd/dvr Im sure have all of them. The AVS just has RCA's I think, I looked jsut see red, white, yellow. So not good I guess, might have to make it work for now though. What do you see as my best hook up option.

calbe box to the TV for video and then cable box to AVS to TV for sound? and how would I do that lol

Thanks yet again


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> .... might have to make it work for now though. What do you see as my best hook up option. Calbe box to the TV for video and then cable box to AVS to TV for sound? and how would I do that lol


Sorry to say this ... but you'll need to get the 606 and the speakers to get the best experience (or at least a used AVR with DD and DTS decoders; maybe you can get one for little $$$ or strech your budget and spend the $350 for the 606)

In the mean time... use one HDMI from DVR and one from DVD player (if you get one) to TV; then from TV use the audio out (red and white) to a source on VSX 454 (video 1, AUX, etc) ... use the Dolby 3 channel :yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Pretty much figured it was'nt worth keeping when I looked at the back of it. Oh well. guess I'll just get a 3.1 system for now. SVS front three and a sub with the 606


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> Pretty much figured it was'nt worth keeping when I looked at the back of it. Oh well. guess I'll just get a 3.1 system for now. SVS front three and a sub with the 606


:T ... Don't forget to share your opinions after you set up the system :yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

SAL,

lol, ok now I am wondering how much different the 606 is to the AVS in the htib 6100b, looks to be the same except zone 2 options. Would it be worth buying this now so I had HT and save up for the full AVS system and add it to this AVS later? Then I could just move the speakers out in the garage on the kids game TV. As long as that AVS is comparable I could get HT now and not have to wait. I can find it under 400$

Thanks yet again


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> ...how much different the 606 is to the AVS in the htib 6100b, looks to be the same except zone 2 options.


Well not just zone 2 ... the AVR on the HTIB doesn't have HDMI connectors :yes: (to get the best out of BluRay, you need to use HDMI).

EDIT: If you're not planning to get BluRay soon ... just get an AVR with HDMI, DolbyDigital, DTS, etc. and upgrade when you save more $$$ (you can even look for used AVR's too)


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

> Well not just zone 2 ... the AVR on the HTIB doesn't have HDMI connectors (to get the best out of BluRay, you need to use HDMI).


Thats what I thought. But what you think, seems alot like it, this is just one review off CNET. If its that close to the 606 I could just buy this now and save for the AVS system. then move it into the garage

Key features of the Onkyo HT-S6100:


7.1 channels, 130 watts per channel 
Seven satellite speakers plus a subwoofer 
4 HDMI 1.3 inputs 
Onboard decoding for Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio 
1080i upconversion for analog signals, using Faroudja DCDi Edge video processing 
Audyssey 2EQ automatic speaker calibration 

As we said before, these HTIBs include real, separates-style AV receivers. Having a real AV receiver is great because it makes it easier to upgrade your speakers in the future or add additional components, which can be problematic on the AV receiver/DVD player combos that are included with many HTIBs. Even better, the included AV receivers are pretty well-featured, including four HDMI inputs, onboard decoding for Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio and HDMI upconversion for analog sources. Videophiles should take note, however, that we weren't exactly satisfied with the analog-to-HDMI video performance of the similar TX-SR606, which also featured the same Faroudja DCDi Edge video processing.


Let me know what everyone thinks, I know the speakers wont be the greatest, but if the reciever is good I can upgrade later, still be better than the TV speakers right?


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> ... these HTIBs include real, separates-style AV receivers. Having a real AV receiver is great because it makes it easier to upgrade your speakers in the future or add additional components, ... I know the speakers wont be the greatest, but if the reciever is good I can upgrade later, still be better than the TV speakers right?


Where did I get the idea that the 6100 AVR didn't have HDMI's ... :duh:

Get it, like you said is better that your TV speakers; and the frequency response is acceptable ... not like other HTIB's ...:yes:

About the second zone for the patio, you can overcome this with a speaker selector like  this  ..... you can connect up to four pairs of speakers (for the whole house maybe???? ... I'm using two to power seven pair of speakers :bigsmile


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

> About the second zone for the patio, you can overcome this with a speaker selector like this ..... you can connect up to four pairs of speakers (for the whole house maybe???? ... I'm using two to power seven pair of speakers )


Thanks again SAL, think I might do it this way so I can get it sooner lol, The AVS dosent seem that different than the 606, still reading on that though. The zone two thing, It has zone two, just cant have two sources from what I understand like the 606, so couldnt watch tv with the surround on and have the stereo on the patio, at least thats how I read it.


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Go_Ducks said:


> ... It has zone two, just cant have two sources from what I understand like the 606, ...


What is zone 2 on the 606 is speaker B on the 6100 HTIB (they're in the same place); if you're not planning on using two souces at the same time ... don't worry about it :yes:


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Pretty much what I figured, I thought the 606 had it so you could have two sources but I could be wrong. 

So you think its a bad Idea to go this route? I know how everyone feels about HTIB LOL. Think it will cost a little more in the long run, but I can take longer to do it, and end up with surround in the garage with the speakers from the 6100 after I get my SVS sytem in the future


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## Go_Ducks (Oct 17, 2008)

Thanks again for all your help! Probally would have ended up with some if I wouldnt have posted on here.

Get my TV today WOOT WOOT, you know anything about Harmony 670's lol, I'm sure I will have a few Q's lol.


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## SkiSmuggs (Oct 21, 2008)

Go_Ducks said:


> Will do, was going to hook up with HDMI but your way sounds better with the sound to the AVS and video straight to the TV


Consider this: I have my Toshiba HD-A3 and OPPO 981 upconverting DVD player connected to my Onkyo 606 with HDMI. I connect my Dish Net HD DVR to the 606 with HDMI and to the TV with component video and composite audio. That way I can bypass the AVR for most TV watching, but I never want to watch a movie without surround sound.


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