# Cheap receiver solution until UMC arrives?



## vince0312 (May 24, 2009)

Hi guys, 
I think I am one of the people who wait on the Emotiva UMC-1 here(/wave). Unfortunately my receiver could not wait for that, it broke down on me yesterday and I am in need of a new receiver to fill in the gap(processors are too much to pay for just for temporary solution). Here's the list of what I am looking for:

HDMI(my bluray and HTPC solely relies on that for transferring audio and video)
No video processing(I believe my Oppo BD83 and pioneer plasma can do better video processing than the low end receiver)
Pre-out(have Parasound 5100 amp)
5.1 is sufficient
1coaxial/optical input for fitting the old PS2 and computer but not absolutely required(since this is only temporary)

So basically I would need a processing units that takes in the signals and deliver them to my units and keep the system working. As this is only temporary, I think the lower price the more desirable for me. I am trying to keep it to sub $200 but a little bit higher than that is acceptable. Any suggestions? Thanks!

Life without sound is more than just frustrated :help:


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
This was actually kinda a difficult task primarily because almost all budget AVR's have no provisions for preamp outs. However, I think I found your best choice the Marantz SR4002.
Here is the link:http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...r-80w-x-7ch-HDMI-home-theater-surround/1.html
Actually, here is the model up for the same price as well. 800 Dollar MSRP:
http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...r-90w-x-7ch-HDMI-home-theater-surround/1.html
Within 100 Dollars of your stated goal, HDMI 1.3 and preamp outputs.
Cheers,
JJ


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## eugovector (Sep 4, 2006)

Yep, you'll be hard pressed to find pre-outs for better than $300 on the Marantz.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Ya, that is a great price! Good find JJ:T


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## Txgrizzly (Jul 17, 2009)

wow, that looks like a great deal on that MARANTZ, with some good chip amps that would make a great start for a budget HT setup...


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
I actually was surprised I was even able to find a HDMI 1.3 AVR with preouts for under 300 Dollars. I spent about 30 minutes looking around until I found the Marantz's. Again, almost all budget AVR's lack preouts. Crazy considering they are the ones that most benefit from outboard amplification.

The SR5002 is definitely the way to go. 63% off MSRP with a warranty. 
I did not even see the 5002 until after I posted the 4002 initially. I cannot believe they are the same price. That is a awesome deal. I have used Accessories4less before and actually picked up a 875 at their HQ in Orlando. Really nice people and fully authorized for what they sell. In addition has a Warranty. The SR5002 really is a no brainer.
Here is a review for the 5002:http://www.avguide.com/review/marantz-sr5002-av-receiver
Cheers,
JJ


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

If I lived in the US I would even snap up that deal. My Yamaha in my livingroom is getting long in the tooth.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
D'oh. While reading more, I see that the SR4002/5002 have a HDMI 1.3 repeater, but are not 1.3. That is no bitstreaming of True HD or DTS-MA. No matter really considering you can configure the OPPO to handle it all and send a PCM via HDMI. And according to the vast majority, there is no sonic difference between the BDP doing the True HD/DTS-MA decoding as opposed to the AVR.
Cheers,
JJ


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## eugovector (Sep 4, 2006)

*EDIT: Nope, Lies, Ignore that. Let me read a moment before I post.*

EDIT 2: Jack is right. You'll get in through HDMI anything supported by 1.1, and can pass along anything 1.3. So yes to PCM, no to Bitstream.

_Actually, in that case, the AVR won't get any audio over HDMI. It simply functions as a video switch. You'll have to run separate optical/co-ax digital to get sound.

Knew it was too good to be true._


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Shoot! Thats a sad loss, Then really the only other option is to go with the Onkyo 706 however I cant seem to find one for less than $425 at the Shack store.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Again, as a temporary solution, it will be fine. You will still get the lossless formats. The decoding will simply be done by the player. Identical to when you use a pre PS3 Slim PS3 which did not offer bitstreaming, but decoded True HD and DTS-MA internally. And again, the vast majority of people heard no difference between bitstreaming and PCM.
Cheers,
JJ


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## eugovector (Sep 4, 2006)

Okay, go to ebay and hit up the seller "harmanaudio". This is the authorized HK reseller with refurb AVRs routinely going for ~$200. For instance, yesterday an HK 247 went for $168 shipped.

The 254 offers Dolby TrueHD/DTS processing and pre-out and should come in around $250 shipped, less if you're lucky.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
That is not a bad idea. I have a bias against H/K and purposely omitted them even though I had knew about the smoking deals on Ebay from H/K direct.
Cheers,
JJ


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## eugovector (Sep 4, 2006)

I've never purchased an AVR from them (via ebay or otherwise), but the speakers I picked up from them on ebay looked brand new and performed well for many years. I only recently sold them to lighten my load and finance our move.


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## vince0312 (May 24, 2009)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> D'oh. While reading more, I see that the SR4002/5002 have a HDMI 1.3 repeater, but are not 1.3. That is no bitstreaming of True HD or DTS-MA. No matter really considering you can configure the OPPO to handle it all and send a PCM via HDMI. And according to the vast majority, there is no sonic difference between the BDP doing the True HD/DTS-MA decoding as opposed to the AVR.
> Cheers,
> JJ





eugovector said:


> Okay, go to ebay and hit up the seller "harmanaudio". This is the authorized HK reseller with refurb AVRs routinely going for ~$200. For instance, yesterday an HK 247 went for $168 shipped.
> 
> The 254 offers Dolby TrueHD/DTS processing and pre-out and should come in around $250 shipped, less if you're lucky.


Thanks Jack and eugovector 
I'm gonna spend more time to look into 5002 and H/K receivers. For the price and features H/K seems taking over the Marantz. But I heard H/K receiver is doing horrible job on pre-amp section couple years back. Is that still holds true to the H/K nowadays?

I am not really keeping up with the HDMI technology..... Marantz 5002 has HDMI1.3 switching and 1.1 repeater built-in. Does it mean I can use the HTPC to send thru both audio and video signal via HDMI(1920x1080 regular 2channal/DTS/DD)? :dizzy:

Thanks again!


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
I have never used a HTPC, but with say the OPPO BDP-83 connected to the Marantz, you would get both loseless codecs by the OPPO decoding internally and sending the AVR a PCM bitstream. In theory, there should be no loss in SQ.
Cheers,
JJ


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## brent_s (Feb 26, 2007)

If you can live without the HTPC temporarily, why not connect the BD83 directly to the Parasound. The Oppo is capable of doing bass management, level adjustment, and delay processing. 

If you can get similar DD/DTS->analog decoding from the HTPC, you could use something like this to switch analog 5.1 sources into the Parasound for $20.

-Brent


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Brent that is an interesting solution. I do wonder if the OPPO has the voltage to run as a preamplifier.
Most Parasound's do have volume control knobs on each channel however. In addition to being able to adjust the levels on the OPPO. Very interesting.
Cheers,
JJ


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## brent_s (Feb 26, 2007)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> Brent that is an interesting solution. I do wonder if the OPPO has the voltage to run as a preamplifier.
> Most Parasound's do have volume control knobs on each channel however. In addition to being able to adjust the levels on the OPPO. Very interesting.
> Cheers,
> JJ


A quick Google found a couple of different posts, including one from Neuromancer at AVS, putting the BDP83's multichannel analogs at 2v for a 0dBFS signal. That's also consistent with the Stereophile benchtests I found of an Oppo 970, which also offers full analog processing for its supported formats.

I couldn't find a Parasound 5100, but did find a 5125. It's a THX certified amp, which means it has 29dB of gain per THX spec...1v input = 100 watts @ 8 ohms output. The 5125 needs 1.6v to reach full rated output. Most amps hover around the THX gain standard with some, like the ICE module based amps, having only 27dB of gain ([email protected]) and Emotiva's XPA series on the other end having 32dB of gain and needing a bit less than 1v to hit 100 watts. IOW, the BDP83 shouldn't have any trouble driving a modern amp directly from its analog outputs, especially when we're talking about an interim solution.

Getting into the realm of TMI, it's worth remembering that the master volume control on a preamp provides both attenuation and gain to the source signal. For example, the Cirrus CS3318 volume control used in the Onkyo 805, and presumably other models/mfgs, provides 96dB of attenuation and only 22dB of gain. 

-Brent


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