# New Construction installing new system Help



## nsternberg

I am sure their are numerous posts such as this one but here goes; I am building a new house and plan on having a theater like quality sound and video in the large living area. I have a equipment closet in the master bedroom that will hold all of the equipment. I plan on three zones in the house, living room, mstr bedroom and a future zone upstairs. I am hoping to install pretty good inwall speakers in the living room, mid-range inwall speakers in the bedroom. I plan on a Pioneer PDP-6010FD KURO 60" 1080p Flat Panel HDTV Plasma Monitor (belive it is a very good unit?),
I need recomendations on Speakers, wire to use, receivers. I need a remote that can operate from any place.
Suggestions needed.
Thanks,
Neal


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## tonyvdb

Hi Neil, Welcome to the Shack.

First of all its going to be hard to get a good theater quality system if your going to go with "in wall" speakers. Is there any way that we can talk you out of that plan?


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## nsternberg

Possibly, the original plan was to have the living space with no noticible equipment, thats why we are building the equipment room. Solid Drive allegedly has quality hidden speakers, but the are very costly. The Theater space is in our "great room" vaulted ceiling, all glass exposure on the front wall, kitchen opens to the room. 25x 26ft. I have a layout I could share.


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## salvasol

nsternberg said:


> Solid Drive allegedly has quality hidden speakers, but the are very costly...


Here is a couple of ideas....if you're handy, it will be cheap to build them (I think :whistling


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## nsternberg

Any Comments regading Solid Drive speakers?


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## hddummy

I've never heard of them, but after a quick visit to their website I only see the transducers that you attach to the back side of the drywall. If that is what you are talking about, I can say assuredly that you are setting up for disappointment. Those things are just a big gimmick and will not perform consistently or accurately. What's worse, is you are introducing the sound directly into the structure of your house. You will be able to hear the noise all over the house. Sorry to be such a buzz kill. If you want in wall speakers, look at conventional in-wall speakers.


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## nsternberg

Thanks, I will take your advice, any suggestions for those?


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## SierraMikeBravo

Hi,

I thought I would chime in here. I have actually heard the SolidDrives (as well as played with them) and I can firsthand tell you they are incredible...for what they are. They would actually be quite good for zone music. I would stop short of saying they are something I would use in a dedicated home theater, but for ambiance music, they would be quite good and a very simple solution. They definitely will generate some talk. 

Regarding in wall speakers, depending on your room dimesnion and restrictions, they may be your best bet. There are some excellent, excellent in wall companies out there...including the company that makes the SolidDrives. You can have a very high quality theater using in-walls. I know, I have designed and implemented them in theaters as well as calibrated. It just depends on the company and the amount of money you want to spend. In addition, there are some very sound physical principles for using in-walls. especially if you don't have the room for conventional speakers as most people don't.

Hope this helped!
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

HAA/THX Video Certified Calibrator
Audyssey Professional Installer/Technician


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## SierraMikeBravo

hddummy said:


> I've never heard of them, but after a quick visit to their website I only see the transducers that you attach to the back side of the drywall. If that is what you are talking about, I can say assuredly that you are setting up for disappointment. Those things are just a big gimmick and will not perform consistently or accurately. What's worse, is you are introducing the sound directly into the structure of your house. You will be able to hear the noise all over the house. Sorry to be such a buzz kill. If you want in wall speakers, look at conventional in-wall speakers.



Absolutely 100% untrue. I have heard (in many applications) and actually played with at the factory these very transducers. They will actually blow your mind. I think your opinion would do a 180 if you actually heard them.


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## nsternberg

Yikes.. a variety of opinions. I have uploaded the floor plan, little space for speakers especially on the nose of the house. Any placement or equipment suggestions are welcome


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## SierraMikeBravo

Neal,

Can't make heads or tails of that floorplan, but if you are implying you are going to stick speakers in that "nose" corner...well...you might want to look at a flea market for your speakers.  Did you get my PM?


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## nsternberg

The nose of the hose would not tolerate a speaker so I would use a 5.1 system with no side speakers. It is going to be a difficult space to deal with, 19ft cathedral ceiling, I did get your email.


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## tonyvdb

SierraMikeBravo said:


> Absolutely 100% untrue. I have heard (in many applications) and actually played with at the factory these very transducers. They will actually blow your mind. I think your opinion would do a 180 if you actually heard them.


For a theater room they would not sound good at all as they are very non directional and now a days movies use channel separation to its fullest particularly the front LCR speakers. I highly doubt that Neil is going to spend 3 times the money on the good quality in walls or transducers.

You can make a floor stander and bookshelves fit the decor nicely without being in the way and get a far better sound stage for the money.


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## SierraMikeBravo

HI Tony,

Not to jump on you, but if you read my post you would have seen that I said I would stop short on recommending them for home theater for exactly the reason you have stated. Otherwise, they are very good and useful tools. Trust me...we did a lot of playing in numerous venues...offices, bathrooms, desks, windows, large rooms...you name it. I think I have a pretty good handle on what the SolidDrives can and cannot be used for. :T


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## hddummy

Call me traditional. While it is true I have never heard these units, I see absolutely no benefit to their implementation over a traditional speaker other than perhaps aesthetics. I can see why it is attractive to have a completely hidden device if your goal is to not see any evidence of a sound system. I am not against SolidDrive specifically, I believe that in-wall transducers are a fundamentally flawed design and are pretty much a big scam.

First of all, even in an ideal situation, these things cannot reproduce full range frequency response. The goal of any speaker is first and foremost to faithfully reproduce the input signal without coloration or tonal changes and with frequency response that is as flat and smooth as possible. Conventional speakers have a hard enough time of doing this at a reasonable cost and they are a consistently repeatable fixed, controlled design.

Now...lets look at how a transducer works. There is a voicecoil that interacts with relatively heavy mass to produce an overall vibration in anything the unit is attached too. You are relying on the wall itself to vibrate a small amount produce the sound. There are SOOOO many variables in home construction that there is ABSOLUTELY no way these things can produce accurate or consistent sound. I am not talking just from home to home, I'm talking about from each individual transducer...each one is going to have a different installation situation. These variables will cause frequency response peaks, nulls and shifts all over the audio spectrum.

Maybe worse yet is the problem of sound transmission to other rooms in the house. In a conventional situation, the sound is mostly contained within a room. However, a small amount of vibration energy is transmitted into the house structure and propagates to other spaces through the structure. Now...instead, lets take a weight and attach it directly to the wall....and shake the whole thing to the point where it can produce enough vibration for an acceptable listening volume:hsd:. What do you think is happening on the other side of that very same wall.....IT'S SHAKING ALMOST AS MUCH:duh:. Sound has a relatively difficult time of transmitting from air into structure, but if you start by vibrating structure, the noise transmission into other parts of the house is going to be multiple times worse than regular speakers in a regular room.

I'm sorry to Neal for turning his thread into a rant, but I hate to see people get ripped off and it is my opinion that in-wall transducers are just that.


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## tonyvdb

SierraMikeBravo said:


> HI Tony,
> 
> Not to jump on you, but if you read my post you would have seen that I said I would stop short on recommending them for home theater for exactly the reason you have stated. Otherwise, they are very good and useful tools. Trust me...we did a lot of playing in numerous venues...offices, bathrooms, desks, windows, large rooms...you name it. I think I have a pretty good handle on what the SolidDrives can and cannot be used for. :T


If it is not good for Home Theater then why would anybody want to use it for Music? With music it is even more important to have good channel separation and transducers DO NOT give you that.
Like hddummy said aesthetics is they only advantage to using them and you sacrifice sound quality.


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## SierraMikeBravo

^^^^^

Are you understanding what I am trying to say????? The SolidDrives are NOT and I repeat NOT...I'll say it one more time...NOT...just for those who still don't get it...good for anything that requires critical listening. They ARE and I repeat ARE good for background music...for example the bathroom...where the wife is putting makeup on in the morning or taking a shower...or the hallway as you are walking through...or a dining room during dinner, etc. In other words...zoned audio not affiliated with any critical listening area.


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## hddummy

Hey man...we're not aiming at you. We're just saying they'd make good door stops, paper weights and book ends...:scratchhead:


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## SierraMikeBravo

I just have a hard time understanding your position when you have never seen, touched or listened to this product. You didn't even know what it was until you looked it up on the website for the first time the other night...and then made an unwarranted assumption based solely on your opinion and not fact. I guess I just have an issue with anyone who passes judgement on something they know nothing about. That is where some serious issues lie within this hobby...unwarranted predispositions. Your statement is just that...opinion. Nothing more. My statement is also opinion, but one based on experience and not conjecture.


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## salvasol

SierraMikeBravo said:


> That is where some serious issues lie within this hobby...unwarranted predispositions. Your statement is just that...opinion. Nothing more. My statement is also opinion, but one based on experience and not conjecture.


So.....if I understand right; your position is that Neil (original poster) can use the SolidDrives on his project but only for music and not for the HT, Right???

I don't think anybody is trying to make a big issue about the speakers, We're here to share our experiences and the final decision is on Neil hands...we just want to give him enough information to make his decision :T


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## hddummy

SierraMikeBravo said:


> I just have a hard time understanding your position when you have never seen, touched or listened to this product. You didn't even know what it was until you looked it up on the website for the first time the other night...and then made an unwarranted assumption based solely on your opinion and not fact. I guess I just have an issue with anyone who passes judgement on something they know nothing about. That is where some serious issues lie within this hobby...unwarranted predispositions. Your statement is just that...opinion. Nothing more. My statement is also opinion, but one based on experience and not conjecture.


Incorrect. I may not be a professional installer, but I'm not a newbie either. I have heard in-wall transducers...I just had never heard of SolidDrive or heard their product specifically. Okay, I'll get down off my soap box now. Sorry for taking up so much space in your thread Neal.


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