# Samsung BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player



## Vader

Lets hope Samsung corrected all of the flaws of their G1 player...

Product News | July 25, 2007 | by Arlen Schweiger

Do you go Blu-ray or HD DVD? Perhaps you just want to throw your arms up and take ‘em both? One option you’ll be able to do that with coming soon is the BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player from Samsung.

After showing up on the radar back in the spring, Samsung today revealed some of the specifics of its first dual-format HD optical disc player.

One of the trendy items is support for the formats’ interactivity technologies (HDi and BD-Java), which up the ante on the traditional type of extras that come with your standard DVDs these days. The HD DVD camp certainly touts its use of an Ethernet port for such goodies, and the Duo HD Player includes one.

Here are some other technical goodies:

* Blu-ray playback at content native HD resolution of 1080p/1080i/720p and 1080p 24Fs/ 60Fs
* HD DVD playback at 1080p/1080i/720p
* HQV (Hollywood Quality Video) video selectable up-conversion processing 720p/1080i/1080p
* Stereo and 7.1-channel audio outputs
* Coaxial and optical digital audio outputs
* Dolby Digital Plus, DTS HD, MP3 audio decoding, Dolby TrueHD
* HD DVD/BD-ROM/ DVD-ROM, DVD-+/R, DVD-+/RW, CD, CD-R and CD-RW
* HDMI 1.3 digital interface (1080p/1080i/720p)
* MPEG-2, VC-1, H.264, HD JPEG decoding
* 12-bit/216 MhZ video D/A converter; 24-bit/192KHz audio D/A converter
* HDMI, Component Video, S-Video and Composite video outputs
* HDMI CEC
* Local Storage
* Picture-in-picture

The BD-UP5000 is due out in Q4 of this year with an MSRP of $1,049. Go to www.samsung.com for more.

Source: Electronic House Article

If so, I am soooo there!:devil:


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## Sonnie

*Re: Samsungs new BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player announced!*

That could definitely be the one... :T

Seoul, Korea – April 13, 2007 : Samsung Electronics Co., LTD., a leader in consumer electronics and digital media technologies, and the first company to introduce a Blu-ray disc player will introduce a dual format High-Definition (HD) optical disc player in time for the holidays.

Samsung’s Duo HD player (BD-UP5000) will fully support both HD-DVD and Blu-ray Disc formats and their interactive technologies, HDi and BD-Java. With the Duo HD consumers can enjoy additional studio content such as trailers, director’s comments, more elaborate interactive menus and behind the scene footage. The new Duo HD joins Samsung’s next generation DVD line-up which includes Samsung’s second generation Blu-ray player available at retail this month. Together, these two models offer the consumer a strong line of High-Definition players to match Samsung’s award winning, and best selling, line of HDTVs.


"We welcome Samsung's Duo HD player as another solution in the marketplace that will help reduce consumer confusion and buyer hesitancy towards HD media," said Ron Sanders, President of Warner Home Video. "This is an innovative product that can move us closer to mainstream consumer adoption of HD technologies."

We are very pleased to announce the upcoming release of our Duo HD player. Consumers are hungry for more HD content but are currently confused about competing formats. Samsung’s Duo HD player will allow consumers access to every HD movie title available regardless of the authoring format. Samsung is committed to making life simpler through technology and will market next generation DVD products which will satisfy the consumer and market requirement. This is a big win for the consumer.


As a member of the DVD Forum and contributor to the DVD Industry, we recognize that both HD-DVD and BD formats have merits. As such, we have decided to market a dual format player. Samsung is flexible to market a stand-alone HD-DVD player whenever consumers demand it. Our main concern is not technology but consumer choice” said Dongsoo Jun, Executive Vice President of the Digital AV Division at Samsung Electronics.

About Samsung Electronics

Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd. is a global leader in semiconductor, telecommunication, digital media and digital convergence technologies with 2006 parent company sales of US$63.4 billion and net income of US$8.5 billion. Employing approximately 138,000 people in 124 offices in 56 countries, the company consists of five main business areas: Digital Media, Telecommunication Network, Semiconductor, LCD, and Digital Appliance. Recognized as one of the fastest growing global brands, Samsung Electronics is a leading producer of digital TVs, memory chips, mobile phones, and TFT-LCDs. For more information, please visit www.samsung.com.


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## Sonnie

*Re: Samsungs new BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player announced!*

The more I read about this unit... the more I'm liking it. It appears the street prices may be around $800, which wouldn't be all that bad. I suspect 6-8 months after release the price will be down considerably.











Samsung’s BD-UP5000 is the world’s first true Blu-ray and Hi-Def HD DVD Duo player. The BD-UP5000 offers Blu-ray Disc™ playback at an amazing 1080p resolution. A 32-tap adaptive up-scaler offers brilliant Blu-ray image detail. And picture quality adjustments let you set sharpness and noise reduction to your liking. With HQV and Full HD+1080p, you'll enjoy the truest image reproduction – just like the original HD video source. Discover unprecedented clarity with HD DVD, a new optical disc format that delivers up to six times the picture resolution of normal DVDs.

*Key Features:*

Blu-ray and HD DVD playback at content native HD resolution of 1080p/1080i/720p
HQV video upconversion processing - HD video (1920x1080)
 Selectable DVD upconversion via HQV processor (720p/1080i/1080p)
 HDMI version 1.3, Component Video, S-Video and Composite video outputs
 BD-ROM, BD-RE, BD-R, HD DVD, DVD-ROM, DVD-R, DVD-RW, Audio CD, CD-R, CD-RW
 1080p 24fps playback on Blu-ray
 Full HDI capability via HD DVD
 Dolby® Digital, Dolby®Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD, dts-HD
 MPEG2, VC-1, H.264, HD JPEG decoding
 Stereo and 5.1/7.1-channel audio outputs (8 channel uncompressed)
 Anynet+ (HDMI-CEC)
 Ethernet port
 Coaxial and optical digital audio outputs
 12-bit/216MhZ video D/A converter; 24-bit/192KHz audio D/A converter
 BD Java
 *Features:*
*Hollywood Quality Video *
Enjoy Hollywood quality pictures. The BD-UP5000 uses the same video-processing power (one trillion operations per second) that is widely used in Hollywood’s post production. It employs the world’s first 32-tap adaptive up-scaler to produce exquisite, delicate picture quality. The BD-UP5000 also delivers full four-field motion adaptive video de-interlacing, temporal-recursive noise reduction, automatic multi-cadence detection, and pixel-based detail enhancement.

*HD DVD *
HD DVD (High-Definition Digital Versatile Disc) is a new optical disc format. It uses a blue laser, which allows for more data density per disc and HD DVD delivers six times the picture resolution of normal DVDs, up to 7.1 channels of high-resolution audio, amazing interactivity and more bonus content.

*Picture Quality Adjustment *
You’re in control with optional picture quality adjustment. Previously available only in higher end products, the BD-UP5000 lets you set sharpness and noise reduction. You view pictures refined to your own taste.

*CD & DVD Compatible *
Samsung’s Blu-ray Disc Player offers state of the art viewing with full CD and DVD playback compatibility. Even as you take advantage of the latest video and audio advances, you can still enjoy all your existing media content. The BD-UP5000 features full backward compatibility. It’s the perfect way to enjoy all your favorites!

*1080p with 24fps Video Output on Blu-ray *
View scenes as they were meant to be seen. The Blu-ray movie title’s original source (1080p/24fps) output and Full HD+ with HQV ensure that the quality of the original content is what you see on your screen. That means you’ll enjoy film picture quality.

*Dolby Digital Plus and Dolby TrueHD *
Immerse yourself in sound. The BD-P2400 supports the new Dolby Digital Plus Audio format — the next generation in sound. It also supports uncompressed PCM Audio and Legacy dts 5.1 Dolby Digital. Dolby® TrueHD is Dolby’s next-generation lossless technology developed for high-definition disc-based media. Dolby TrueHD delivers tantalizing sound that is bit-for-bit identical to the studio master, unlocking the true high-definition entertainment experience on next-generation discs. When coupled with highdefinition video, Dolby TrueHD offers an unprecedented home theater experience that lets you enjoy sound as stunning as the high-definition picture.

*HDMI V1.3 *
Experience richer color and sound. The BD-UP5000 offers HDMI v1.3, which enables broader bandwidth AV data transmission. It supports deep color, higher resolution and new compressed audio formats.

*HDi on HD DVD *
HDi interactivity is what allows for on-screen video commentaries via PIP, for the pop up, in movie menus and enhanced interactivity.

*Anynet+ Ready TV (HDMI-CEC) *
You're in full command with the BD-UP5000. Anynet+ delivers streamlined, onetouch control over all your connected devices such as the TV, AV Receiver, and Home Theater. You can operate all of them with a single remote control that enables commands to be passed among devices within the system. A true “plug and play” product, it comes with a Consumer Electronics Control (CEC) feature that lets you operate Samsung HDMI products with a single remote control.
​ *Specifications:*

*Player*

*Blu-Ray Disc™ and Hi-Def HD DVD Duo Player*
*HDMI (High-Definition Multimedia Interface)* transfers hi-definition (720p1080i/1080p) video and audio from your Blu-ray Hi-Def HD DVD player to your TV, Home Theater, or other digital AV components. Simply connect your Blu-ray Hi-Def DVD player to your Home Theater System with a single cable for the high quality pictures and sound.
*HDMI-CEC — Anynet+* function allows all products in the system to discover and communicate with each other.
*Selectable DVD Upconversion via HQV* (720p/1080i/1080p)
*BD/HD DVD/DVD/CD Playback*
*Full Multi Format DVD Playback* 
BD-ROM, HD DVD, DVD-ROM, DVD-R (V mode only), DVD-RW (V/VR mode), Audio CD, CD-R, CD-RW
 *General*

MPEG2, VC-1, H.264, HD JPEG decoding
Dolby® Digital, Dolby Digital Plus decoding, dts® HD, TrueHD
 12-bit/216 MHz video D/A converter; 
24-bit/192KHz audio D/A converter
 * Terminals*

*Video*
HDMI: 1
Composite: 1
Component video out: 1
S-Video: 1

*Audio*
Audio in: 1
Audio out: 1
Coaxial: 1
Optical: 1
Ethernet port

 *Box Contents:*

BluRay Duo HD Disc Player (BDUP5000)
Remote Control
Batteries
 AV cable
User’s Manual
Quick Start Guide.
 *Approximate Dimensions:*

*Width:* 16.9"
*Height:* 3.1"
*Depth:* 12.8"
 *Approximate Weight:*

*Unit:* 9.3 lbs
*Shipping:* 15 lbs
 *Download Files (.pdf):*
*Warranty Information:*

*Manufacturer Warranty (authorized online retailer):* 
1 year parts and 90 days labor
 _All features and specifications are preliminary and are subject to change without notice.
Non-metric weights and measurements are approximate._


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## SteveCallas

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Hmm, no SACD? :scratch:


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## Sonnie

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

I believe Blu-ray is attempting to produce their own multi-channel audio format.


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## Wayde

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

It's already got TrueHD and DTS HD, what more does it need? 8 channels of high bitrate sound in a lossless format.

I wonder if the new format will use Sony's Direct Stream Digital process?

If BD comes up with its own more power to it. But a lot of SACD fans believe SACD imparts a distinctive sonic characteristic because of it's DSD modulation process. I'm not sure if any high bit PCM process will suffice for the hardcore SACD faithful (of which I am not... I'm just sayin'):daydream:


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## Sonnie

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Do any of the HD players play SACD?


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## SteveCallas

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Probably not, seeing as it is Sony-backed if I'm not mistaken. The PS3 and newest Oppo are two of the only players I know of that can transmit SACD output over HDMI instead of 8 coaxial cables. That means a processor that can accept audio over HDMI should be able to manipulate the playback however you want (crossovers, distance settings, etc) without any extra D/A or A/D conversions, which isn't the case with standard aalog tranmission. All that said, I only have one SACD disk, so.....:R


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## MrPorterhouse

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*



Sonnie said:


> I believe Blu-ray is attempting to produce their own multi-channel audio format.


Yes, its Profile 3 of Blu-ray players, which is an audio only spec. Having enjoyed SACD and DVD-Audio both, I'd rather see video along with the audio, which is somewhat what DVD-Audio did. I can further say that a good Blu-ray concert in lossless audio is the ultimate way to go.


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## bobgpsr

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*



Sonnie said:


> I believe Blu-ray is attempting to produce their own multi-channel audio format.


They should (it is profile 3) since HD DVD has an audio only disc spec that does not require use of a video display. Better than what DVD Audio did (which mostly needed a video display to operate right). With Dolby TrueHD the same lossless audio codec (Meridian Lossless Protocal -- MLP) is used as was used on DVD Audio.


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## bobgpsr

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

More news on this Samsung. It uses the new Broadcom all in one SoC:
http://www.digitalmediaasia.com/default.asp?ArticleID=26678


> Broadcom, a global player in semiconductors for wired and wireless communications, has announced that its integrated Blu-ray and HD DVD system-on-a-chip (SoC) has been selected by Samsung Electronics to power the dual format BD-UP5000 Duo high definition (HD) player.
> 
> By combining Blu-ray and HD DVD formats into one SoC platform (BCM7440), Broadcom enables media player manufacturers to provide universal high definition DVD players that can playback all HD movie titles regardless of the authoring format.
> 
> Available in mass production, the Broadcom BCM7440 is a solution whose multiple processor cores fully support both Blu-ray and HD DVD standards in a single SoC, including support for next generation interactive technologies (i.e. BD-Java and HDi) that are being incorporated into Hollywood's latest title releases.
> 
> The BD-UP5000 fully supports both Blu-ray and HD DVD formats as well as their interactive technologies, HDi and BD-Java.


I'll bet that it ends up being BD-Live (Profile 2.0) compliant. :T


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## HDBeat

*Samsung's BD-UP5000 HD DVD / Blu-ray combo player gets previewed*

[img]http://www.engadget.com/media/2007/09/9-15-07-up5000.jpg[/img]
The folks over at _HDGuru_ managed to spend a few quality minutes with Samsung's forthcoming hybrid player, and initial impressions look to be pretty positive. Granted, their BD-UP5000 was a pre-production sample, but they were mighty impressed with the BD-Java / HDi support, HDMI 1.3 functionality, and the Reon scaler chip within. During limited time with the player, the assortment of HD DVDs and Blu-ray films that they got to view "all looked spectacular, with every image appearing clean, crisp and sharp as a tack," and the "faster chapter changes and quicker entry into other menu functions" compared to previous generation units were highly praised, too. Overall, it seems that we've got a respectable combo player on the horizon for those not willing to choose a side, so be sure and give the read link a visit if you're too impatient to wait for a full-on review.

Read | Permalink


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## Wayde

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Can't wait!

I'm saving my pennies for one of these the moment it's available.


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## Guest

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

No support for DVD +R. Why would they leave that out? Almost all of my burned movies are on DVD +R. I was really hoping to take advantage of the REON upscaling.


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## bobgpsr

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*



doubleb said:


> No support for DVD +R. Why would they leave that out? Almost all of my burned movies are on DVD +R. I was really hoping to take advantage of the REON upscaling.


My Toshiba XA1 and XA2 players do not spec DVD+R, yet they work anyway. The reason DVD+R is often not spec'd is because it is not a DVD Forum spec. We will have to wait and see if they work on the Samsung anyway.


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## Sonnie

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Looks like we have pre-orders at $799.99 via the Shack Store with free shipping!


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## Josuah

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Any reasons why this would be better than the LG BH200? Look almost the same, even in price.


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## khellandros66

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*



Josuah said:


> Any reasons why this would be better than the LG BH200? Look almost the same, even in price.




Absolutely! The HQV REON is an amazing chip, it is the same league as the ABT VP20/30/50 which go for $1500-3000.. I would say the the Samsung is CHOICE in terms of playback and upconversion of SD-DVDs. :yay:

~Bobby


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## Scuba Diver

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

I just knew something new would end up coming out before I bought my HD player. Now I am tempted to spend more than I wanted to on an HD player.


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## Sonnie

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Looks like this has been delayed until January 15. :hissyfit:


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## Wayde

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Ugh!!! Sickening! 

Isn't LG building another combo player too?


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## Scuba Diver

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

Well, to be honest I wasn't going to buy one until then anyway. Now, I have a better excuse to leave the money in my pocket until after X-mas. :spend:


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## Sonnie

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*

I wonder will it be delayed again and why the delay? I've not been able to find any news on it yet.

Not sure on the LG model. :dontknow:


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## Sonnie

Looks like this has been delayed yet again until February 1, 2008.

However, I have read reports that some have been successful at ordering these through Best Buy Business for $799 less 10% discount using the coupon code SURVSAVE.


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## Scuba Diver

I see that the Samsung is in stock at Best Buy and Circuit City stores.


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## Sonnie

There may be some stores that have them locally, but they are all sold out online and there are none available in any of our local stores here. 

I ordered one through BBB, but not sure if I'll actually get one or not.


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## Scuba Diver

Good luck.....

Just wondering did you end up getting one?


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## tnargs

Why is a combo player better than a PS3 and a HDDVD player (quite cheap) for the same price? 

Get great video, play cool games, and when one format wins the war, upgrade that player to a high performance model and keep the other for occasional obsolete discs?

I already have a good upsampling DVD player Oppo 981, plays DVD and SACD and DVD-A, also HDCD, CD and MP3. Can't see a high-def player replacing this.

I haven't decided yet: combo or twins?

P.S. was there a big market for VHS/Beta combo players? :demon:


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## imbeaujp

Combo player have a big advantage : one single ThruHD analog 5.1 audio output and one single HDMI video output. Much easy to hook up on your system and get free space on your rack !


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## Scuba Diver

Of course if the equipment is on a rack that is only 1 or 2 extra cables.

I have watched movies on the PS3 it works just fine. As an upscaler it also does a fine job. If you are a gamer then I don't see anything wrong with a setup that consists of two players. 

For me I rent all my movies from BlockBuster and they only carry BluRay. It was a no brainier for me to pick the format they carry. As for waiting till the format war is over. Well..... Hope you aren't holding your breath.


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## Sonnie

I have not received it yet, but it is schedule to ship on 1/18.

I only have room for one player in my dedicated HT room. I have HD-DVDs and BDs and I want to be able to play both. If BD wins out, which it's looking that way, then I'll still be able to play the HD-DVD discs that I have from now on. Although I have considered selling the HD-DVDs and just buying SD-DVDs of those few movies and upconvert them on a BD player.

I don't play games, so I have no use for a PS3... and our daughter already has an XBox 360. I have a couple of XBox games that I picked up when we go the Xbox for her, but I've never even opened them up.


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## Scuba Diver

I understand the reason behind one player, I just don't think it is necessary for everyone. If the player breaks you are out an HD player and a Blu-ray player. If you have two players it is unlikely they will both die at the same time. With that said I think one player would do a great job of keeping things simple and clean on the AV shelf.


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## denisincalif

*Re: Samsungs BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player Announced!*



Wayde said:


> It's already got TrueHD and DTS HD, what more does it need? 8 channels of high bitrate sound in a lossless format.
> 
> I wonder if the new format will use Sony's Direct Stream Digital process?
> 
> If BD comes up with its own more power to it. But a lot of SACD fans believe SACD imparts a distinctive sonic characteristic because of it's DSD modulation process. I'm not sure if any high bit PCM process will suffice for the hardcore SACD faithful (of which I am not... I'm just sayin'):daydream:


I have one of these on order, so I downloaded the user's manual and have been reading it. There are some odd things, like an HDMI set up menu that gives you a choice of saying the HDMI is going to a TV or to a monitor, but nowhere does it say what the actual difference is between these two settings. In fact there are several places where the manual raises more questions than it answers.

But here is the most disturbing thing I have found. On page 10, in a table titled "Logos of discs that can be played", the Dolby TrueHD logo has an asterisk. Below the table is the following:

"When playing a Dolby TrueHD disc, audio will only be heard over the front left and right speakers."

What is going on here? TrueHD supports 7.1 sound (in fact it supports more channels than that). Does this player throw away six channels?


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## Sonnie

I haven't read anything anywhere that indicates this is happening, but then I haven't read everything there is to read. That would seem rather strange.


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## Wayde

Hey guys.

I am currently working on a "first look" review of the UP5000 and there are a lot of 'issues'.

Needless to say the statements attributed to me in the past are based on either legend or pre-release info on the UP5000.

The truth is yes... Dolby TrueHD is capable of 7.1 but at present the 5K isn't capable of it. Nor is it capable of DTS-HD, which makes the player a deal breaker as far as I'm concerned.

However. Samsung maintains they will fix this in a firmware update that is due to be released in May. If you trust Samsung then you have a winning player.

There is some controversey because Samsung has already announced another upcoming dual format HD-player with a model number of UP5500 (I think that's the correct model) - many people are assuming this is the replacement to the 5000 and believe Samsung will ditch any efforts to fix the UP5000 problems audio problems.

I want to say that's not likely. The new player Samsung announced is a slightly lower-end player designed to compete with LG's new combo player. The new player (like the LG BH200) lacks 5.1 or 7.1 analog outputs. It doesn't promise any internal decoding.

Samsung has been saying all along that the UP5000 will be capable of decoding TrueHD and DTS-HD internally as well as streaming it through HDMI to be decoded at your AVR. 

However, should Samsung reneg on their promise to update the 5K to perform this way, it'll be one of the *biggest scandals in consumer electronics *I've heard about in a very long time! I personally don't believe a company like Samsung would do this. 

If Samsung skipped out on the high-res codecs for the 5K, I think a class action lawsuit would be in order.

If you want to play it safe - don't buy until the firmware that updates the codecs is released. 

So far, I've found it to be a nice player and a great answer for anyone like me who wants both players in one... I know I just don't have the space for two separate players.

I'll fill you in soon on what I consider the *Ultimate* setup configurations for this player that I have found so far.


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## denisincalif

> I am currently working on a "first look" review of the UP5000 and there are a lot of 'issues'.
> 
> The truth is yes... Dolby TrueHD is capable of 7.1 but at present the 5K isn't capable of it. Nor is it capable of DTS-HD, which makes the player a deal breaker as far as I'm concerned.
> 
> . . . . . . . . (some text deleted here)
> 
> However. Samsung maintains they will fix this in a firmware update that is due to be released in May. If you trust Samsung then you have a winning player.
> 
> Samsung has been saying all along that the UP5000 will be capable of decoding TrueHD and DTS-HD internally as well as streaming it through HDMI to be decoded at your AVR.


Wayde---I am eagerly looking forward to your review.

I had been assuming that this machine would at least stream the TrueHD and DTS-HD audio when set to bitstream mode, and that the firmware update was only required to enable internal decoding and output over the analog jacks. What you just said sounds like it can't even do that much, and a firmware update is required even if your AVR can decode TrueHD and DTS-HD. Is this true? If it is, I have a big decision to make in the next few days. There is still time to cancel my order. But I really *want* to trust Samsung, because I don't see any near-term alternative to this player.


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## Wayde

Hey denisincalf

It's confirmed by several users that the 5000 cannot stream high-res audio formats through HDMI at present. That's going to be part of the upcoming patch.

To anyone interested...

I've collected a lot of notes from forums around the web, anyone with a specific complaint about the UP5000 I've noted so I can try to recreate their issue. So far, I haven't been able to reproduce most of what is being said is wrong with the player.

One surprise is that Ben Drawbaugh from Endgadget HD is caught up in some of the web-wide anti-BDUP5000 furor. I mean no disrespect - but I don't see why?

His post with his complaints is linked in my notes but all of his problems with the unit are retracted by his own "update". 

The UP5000 has had troubles with a lot of Blu-ray discs but a recent patch to the firmware fixed those issues. Notably *3:10 to Yuma *wouldn't work in the player. This is resolved! You must update the UP5000 immediately when you get it or you will have troubles with certain discs.

*Review notes on BD-UP5000*

_Originally Posted by Fatawan 
******UPDATE******

I received another call back. The spokesperson dug deeper after I voiced my concerns, and was able to contact Korea directly. This is much better news and I will update my original post as well:

1) Regarding 1.1--the 5000 will be 1.1 compliant after the May firmware upgrade.

2) Here's the good part--for Dolby TrueHD, as well as DTS-HD HR AND MA, the May firmware upgrade will enable multichannel capabilities via both the analog outs AND digitally to a compatible receiver/pre-pro via HDMI. 

I was very happy to hear this. I had actually started the RMA process, but _

Bitstream refers to the raw (unprocessed) data including PCM stereo, PCM multichannel (HDMI) , Dolby Digital legacy, Dolby Digital Plus/TrueHD (HDMI 1.3), DTS legacy and DTS-HD High Resolution/Master Audio (HDMI 1.3).

When the player is set to PCM, all non-PCM formats are converted to PCM (Stereo or Multichannel for HDMI and stereo only for coaxial/toslink).

Audio drop outs and visible “grain”. 

Also “judder” in Transformers at 24p
Seems like your seeing the same thing on Transformers that I am, try switching off 24p and see if that makes it go away. Also, on disc two, check out "Autobots roll out" with 24p on and see if the judder is so bad it is unwatchable (this also works fine when 24p is off)

*4:3 *
Test 4:3 SD-DVD through HDMI and Component see if 4:3 issues go away through component.

bitstream audiophile if you want, but there are issues with audioi dropouts with standard DVD's.
you should always pick the uncompressed PCM track if it's available. This is the only lossless track that can currently be handled.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/01/12/samsungs-bd-up5000-is-failing-to-deliver/


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## tonyvdb

Wayde said:


> Hey denisincalf
> 
> It's confirmed by several users that the 5000 cannot stream high-res audio formats through HDMI at present. That's going to be part of the upcoming patch.


If your talking about the DTS HD 7.1 and TruHD audio I find it strange that it would not do this right out of the box? What is Samsung thinking? My 1400 does it and its an older generation, by now that should be standard.


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## Wayde

This just keeps getting better and better...

Apparently the BD-UP5000 is to be discontinued in May. 

Samsung says it'll continue to support it via firmware updaes and has no plans to reneg on its promise to do full Profile 1.1 and high-res audio codecs in the May patch. 

But based on a product being discontinued it sounds like Samsung isn't happy with it and that it's going to fail on some promises. 

I am getting suspicious considering this is a flagship model.

There are two new Samsung combo players coming, the 5500 and 6500. The 5500 is to be the lower-end machine with no analogue outputs the 6500 is likley the upper end designed to replace the 5000 - it'll be due out later this year.

It's interesting. Samsung released the 5000 after the Blu-ray Disc Association's mandate that all players be profile 1.1. So, it's likely it'll either patch with firmware or there would be some legal recourse available - from whom I'm not sure, either the BDA or customers.

However, the advanced audio codecs aren't part of the profile, so they really aren't bound to update this at all.

It's a bit of a risk to be sure. If I can't access the advanced codecs I might as well look for an LG BH100 being sold cheap and use it until something better comes along. Or just buy a bargain basement BD player and keep playing back HD DVD on my Xbox 360 add-on.


----------



## denisincalif

Wayde,

This is turning out to be a real down day! As you pointed out, discontinuing the BD-UP5000 is a very bad sign for people counting on the firmware upgrades to support advanced audio.

I followed the link in your earlier post to engadgethd.com and traced through some of the posts there. There is speculation (no confirmation) that the BD-UP5000 cannot play TrueHD or DTS-HD *no matter how hard Samsung tries with firmware updates*, because the Broadcom chip inside the player has bugs. Unless Samsung comes out with an official announcement within a few days clarifying all this, *fully committing* to the firmware upgrades that have been promised, and specifying a realistic date for the firmware release, I will be canceling my order for the BD-UP5000.

I really, really want a good dual-format player. But right now I am having trouble believing such a thing will ever come to pass.

As far as the BD-UP6500 is concerned, given the state of the Blu-Ray/HD-DVD war, I think the 6500 is just a pipe dream. There has been no official announcement from Samsung about plans for it---just an unsubstantiated quote from a Samsung rep at the CES.


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## denisincalif

Wayde,

I see that in the new poll regarding Blu-Ray players you have voted for the Samsung BD-UP5000. Does that mean that, in spite of the discussions the last two days, you are still confident that Samsung will come through with the audio codec firmware update? I must admit that my confidence level is low right now. If it weren't for that uncertainty I would vote for the BD-UP5000 too. Without any assurance from Samsung I don't feel comfortable risking $800. If I give up on the Samsung I will probably wait several months to see what comes along in the pure Blu-Ray world. At the moment none of the Sony or Panasonic Blu-Ray players look all that great to me.


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## Sonnie

I just made the decision to send this one back... unopened box, so Best Buy for Business is even paying for return shipping. I just don't feel good about spending $730 on an already outdated product that isn't even fully functional at the moment. As far as upconversion, I've got the XA2, which does a wonderful job. I think I'm going to opt for the cheap route on the 1400 for now.


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## Wayde

It's just my own decision. I don't consider it necessarily best for Sonnie. Believe me, I’ve thought a lot about it. Prepare for a long one…

I only have space for one player. I already have a lot of HD DVDs and Blu-ray discs, there's no turning back for me being format neutral. I've waited long enough to have a combo player and I have tested just about every Blu-ray player available - including Samsung's 1400. I’ve been using the Xbox 360’s HD DVD add-on.

Worst case scenario…

The UP5000 never gets the firmware updates that provide the audio codecs I want. But, it's still a combo player capable of all the standard audio formats I've enjoyed for years. Yes, I want the lossless codecs badly! 

The standalone BD 1.0 players I've played with they're all pretty bad. The best one was the Pioneer which performed like a dream compared to the others and it costs about the same as the UP5000. 

The others have bad quirks and lock up problems. They take forever to load, you have to be careful about pressing forward through trailers too quickly or it might lock up and you have to restart it. I’d sacrifice TureHD to not ever have to load a blu-ray disc into a Samsung BD1400 again!

I timed a BD load time recently on the BD1400 (Samsung's current BD player) It took almost five minutes before I'm watching the first frame of a movie from the time you push the drawer in. The UP5000 only takes two mintues for the same disc. And that’s not a knock on the 1400 per-se, Sony’s is the same way.

_As for the troubles.... discontinued in May etc._

It's a risk, I know. I'm paying $800 for a disc player I might keep have for a year. 
By all accounts Samsung said it intends to release the fix that will make it the ultimate player. I’ll hold out hope that it will. 

_If it doesn’t what’s the alternative? _

A lot of the source for the loss of faith is that Samsung may discontinue this product in May and might replace it with a 6500 nobody knows anything about yet. If the delays and time it took to get the UP5000 to market are any indication - I can just about guarantee this new player is a year away.

The only alternative is to keep using the Xbox 360 HD DVD add-on with no lossless codecs etc. And buy a <$500 BD player that I know for certain I’ll be replacing within the year. I don’t see HD DVD closing up shop anytime soon and I believe it’ll see more exclusive Universal releases. 

*Kicking a player when he’s down*

I believe the AVforums and AVSforums, where most of the anti-UP5000 frenzy has occurred, was the result of a kind of knee-jerk mob mentality. Everybody has their reasons for buying/not buying and it’s personal. I mean no disrespect to anyone passing along the things they heard or rumors and subsequent insights. But… you could see the owner’s thread on AVforums getting more and more anti-Samsung as a single day progressed. It was like a feeding frenzy. I think a lot of people were convinced to jump ship just because they read others were. 

People were making outrageous claims about the UP5000 on that thread. There are all these reports of problems that… let’s just say I could never replicate.

Grainy picture? Audio cut-outs? Video tearing and judder? No subtitles on a foriegn language HD DVD?

I did head to head evaluations yesterday of the video comparing the UP5000 and BD1400 and saw virtually no difference. At least none that I could detect.

The so-called 4:3 issues are only limited to HDMI too. It’s not really an ‘issue’ per-se. If you want your SD DVDs of old TV shows to show up without its aspect ratios stretched to 16:9, you can’t use HDMI you have to connect to your HDTV using component. I just use both now so I can watch my old TV shows, it’s not really a big deal to me and the amount of 4:3 SD-DVD’s I am liable to watch is almost not even worth the cost of the component cables. Besides I can just watch that stuff in the bedroom.

*Inside scoops – broadcom etc*

Yes, the Broadcom chip might not be the best solution. Broadcom was probably building its next gen chip before the one used in the UP5000 was finished. Product life cycles are short… welcome to Consumer Electronics. Samsung has made no official announcement about a replacement for the UP5000 yet nor that it’s discontinued. 

I don’t think it’s underhanded or dirty business that someone from Samsung didn’t hold a press conference yesterday because four to seven guys on AVforums are complaining that it’s not May yet.

Samsung is a big business and they have a lot of testing to do before they decide the UP5000 is indeed flawed and won’t perform as they promised. And if that turns out to be the case they won’t get away with simply shoving it under the rug and forgetting about it. I personally won’t let them!

If the worst case scenario happens, I have a very good disc player that does both formats, can do lossless-multi-channel only in PCM and can still pipe the same old DD and DTS I’ve been enjoying for years to my AVR. It provides world class upscaling of SD-DVD via Reon chip. 

Oh, one more thing - even if the product is discontinued in May doesn’t mean Samsung doesn’t continue to support it. I’ve heard the BD-P1000 is still being supported and still gets firmware updates so it can support new discs. 

I’d be very surprised if Samsung poops the bed on this one. Cross-town rival LG wants to work its way into the high-end HT crowd too and there are legendary rivalries across the Sea of Japan between Samsung and Sony/Panasonic.

This ain’t Apex we’re talking about here. These companies have a lot invested in their name to be utterly disgraced. If they did provide no support and no offer of recourse, Samsung would lose a customer in me for the future and I would write about it to anyone willing to read.


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## denisincalif

Wayde,

Nice post. I will probably follow your lead and keep my BD-UP5000 order intact. It is supposed to ship February 5. I like your suggestion of connecting to the TV using both HDMI and component, so you can watch 4:3 SD DVD's from old TV shows without geometric distortion. I have a number of those, including a recently-purchased second season of Saturday Night Live, which I don't want to view warped.

At the moment I have no high definition DVD player of any kind. I have no Xbox 360, let alone its HD add on. And I have no PlayStation. As I said before, I have not seen a Blu-Ray-only player that looks good to me. So I guess I either go with the 5000 or wait about a year. And I am too impatient to wait. If I wind up having to replace this thing in less than three years, I can only hope my wife will understand.

I, like you, cannot believe that Samsung would voluntarily drop the firmware updates, because support for the advanced audio has been promised on all the product brochures and Samsung's web site. But I do have a nagging fear that no updates will work because of the Broadcom chip's *rumored* problem.


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## tonyvdb

Wow Wayde, thats quite the writeup. Thanks for the info. 
Do you think that the 1400 will get more FW updates as the last one was almost 4 months ago that fixed the problem with it playing Fox BluRay dvds.
I'm still taken back at the fact that they would even release the 5000 without it supporting the HighRez formats right out of the box. I'm not impressed.

I might also add the the 1400 does not support playback of DVD+r discs I have two that I have tried and it refuses to recognize them but the play fine in my Toshiba A2


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## Wayde

I can't say for the 1400 - any firmware updates I've seen far for both the 1400 and the 5000 were to fix disc loading issues - as far as I know. 

A pre-update 1400 won't load Live Free or Die hard (that's the trouble I had), but will load 3:10 to Yuma.

A pre-update 5000 won't load 3:10 to Yuma... go figure??

I think the future updates will be for specific discs they find won't load. It seems Samsung has been pretty good about observing major releases that aren't working in its players.

I too am not impressed by the lack of support hi-res audio out of the box. I :explode: don't approve of releasing products before their ready.

*denisincalif* hope you're not being lead astray I am not responsible for any future shifty business decisions of Samsung!

I'd be equally screwed out of an $800 player and will have a tough time ever justfiying spending that kind of money on one again. 

If/when the next universal player comes out, if I'm still in the market I'll probably just keep an eye on it for a year or two and wait for its price to come down before I replace the 5000. 

Hmm... or maybe not.


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## tonyvdb

Wayde said:


> I too am not impressed by the lack of support hi-res audio out of the box. I :explode: don't approve of releasing products before their ready.


This is clearly Samsungs mess up, They rushed it off the assembly line and now they are going to loose potential buyers. It seems from what I have read the 1400 does as good a job with playback of Bluray (I'm happy with mine) as the 5000 so it doesn't seem to be a good choice to spend $800 when you can just spend $300 on the 1400 and $150 on a A3 and have the best of both worlds.


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## Wayde

Hey Tony, if you're good with a Profile 1.0 BD only player - the 1400 is probably fine. Slowness notwithstanding, once it's loaded the audio and video quality are great. I've been using the 1400 for the last month. 

I wanted to add this here and see what you guys think ... I did a post this morning on my own blog... I don't want to be a blatant self-promoter but I'll place a link to it here. 

Samsung could face class action suit over HD DVD, Blu-ray comb-player BD-UP500

My blog is picked up by Google News and this post is doing particularly well as it has been viewed over 800 times so far today. 

It may be a fantasy and I don't mean to pretend to be important, but given the climate on the message boards, I wanted to do my small part to add heat to the fire of Samsung to get this resolved and/or take care of its customers.

I was just checking my inbound links... that's a list of the links or URLs that a visitor was on that got them to my blog post... well, I am now seeing a few from a Samsung.net/.../inbox/,,, which leads me to believe that it's making a round within the Samsung corporation.

I could be delusional but... I wanted to do whatever I can to let Samsung know how serious an issue this is.

I am also working on the 'first look' review for Audioholics.com and will certainly raise these issues on that site. Also, Ben from EngadgetHD has his review of the unit coming out sometime next week which will do the same. 

So, I guess it's fair to say that a lot of voices on the web are trying to hold Samsung to task. I hope it can result in good things for this product and those of us who bought in. I truely believe this product truly gives us home theater enthusiasts what we want.

If... for some reason the product quietly dissapears because Samsung has decided that the Broadcom chip is just not cutting it. Samsung had BETTER not leave us in the cold. I would hope if the product is considered faulty, Samsung will give us the option of trading it in for the replacement. 

But then it could just be the beer.


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## Sonnie

You forgot your blog link. :dontknow:


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## Wayde

It's there, a hyperlink to this page...

http://www.gizmorepublic.com/access...over-hd-dvd-blu-ray-comb-player-bd-up500-2760


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## Sonnie

There is no hyperlink in that post... you might want to double check it if you meant to link something.


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## denisincalif

> denisincalif hope you're not being lead astray I am not responsible for any future shifty business decisions of Samsung!


Wayde,

Of course I won't blame you if this Samsung player turns out badly. I bought the thing with my eyes wide open.

When I ordered it Amazon estimated the shipping date would be February 5. But it came early and arrived last night (January 31). I unpacked it last night and hooked it up this morning, and now have a tale of woe for everyone to think about.

This is a long post, so here is a short summary:
1) The unit is defective. It will play standard definition DVD's, but won't play *any* high definition disk, Blu-Ray or HD DVD.
2) Samsung customer service seems to consist (based on the four people I interacted with today) of friendly people who want to help. They speak good (slightly accented) English. But they know next to nothing.
3) Samsung customer service was surprisingly fast. There was almost no time spent on hold.
4) They are trying to honor the warranty. The machine will be repaired at no cost for parts, labor, or shipping. (Estimated time is two to three weeks.)
5) If it comes back with any problems at all (other than the known problem of missing advanced audio support) I will insist on a refund. I will report back here when I get the unit back.


UPS delivered the player at 6:00 p.m. yesterday. I was too wiped out from work to do much more than unpack it. I did copy the serial number off the back of the machine and registered it on Samsung's web site. Today is my day off. So this morning I hooked it up. The first thing I noticed was that they include composite video/audio cables. Why on earth would anyone want these with this player?

I started by going through the system setup menus. I noticed that the available choices for network throughput included DSL/cable up to (but no higher than) 768 Kbps, some ISDN settings, dial-up modem settings, T1 at 1.5 Mbps, and "LAN" for 10 Mbps and up. My system is DSL at 3 Mbps. I wasn't sure whether it was best to use the highest DSL setting or the fastest setting below my actual speed (the T1 choice). So I called Samsung to ask. The lady I talked to was very nice, but had no clue what I was talking about. I wound up going with DSL at 768.

Perhaps unwisely, the next thing I did was *not* play a disk. Instead, knowing that a disk-compatibility firmware update came out one or two weeks ago, I had the machine check for an available update. Sure enough, one was there. So I clicked on "Start" and almost never took my eyes off the screen during the entire process.There was no hint of any problem. It took about 20 minutes to download the file. Then about 30 seconds went by while it validated the file. Processing took 3 or 4 minutes. Then a message came up saying updating was complete. A few seconds later the machine powered down. I am confident that this firmware update worked, and had nothing to do with what happened next.

I put in "Cars". After about a minute up came the message "This disk cannot be played". I was in a state of shock. But I knew that there are some disks the machine has trouble with, so I decided to try "Chicago" Same problem. Next I tried the first Pirates of the Caribbean. Still no luck. By this time I was certain the machine was useless. But I tried the HD DVD disk "Trading Places". Failure again. So three Blu-Ray and one HD DVD disk could not be played, and no disk I tried had worked. Just to help Samsung diagnose the problem, I next tried a standard DVD. It worked fine.

So I called Samsung again. The first person I talked to, after hearing about the firmware update, told me to reset the machine by holding the "Fast Forward" button down for 5 seconds. I did so, but it didn't help. The lady immediately passed me on to a second tier person.

The second tier person was a man. His first statement to me was that the firmware update had probably been unnecessary because the machine was probably up to date when it was delivered. And updating the firmware when it wasn't needed had caused the problem. This made no sense to me. The update wasn't released until mid-January and my machine was manufactured in December. The update process only proceeds if the firmware on-line is newer than what is in the machine. There was no indication of any error during the update. And even if the machine had already been updated, how can updating it again cause a problem? Writing over a file with the same contents wastes time, but can't change anything unless an error occurs during the overwriting.

Next he asked me if I had done the update over the Internet or if I had used a disk with the update burned on it. When I told him "Internet", he said that was good, because _using a disk risks having an erroneous file because it is a copy of a copy_. *Unbelievable!!!* The man seems to think firmware updates are analog! But in spite of his incompetence, he did have the courtesy to write up a repair order so I can get the machine serviced free of charge.

Thankfully I live in a big metropolitan area, and there is an approved service area 30 miles from my house. I drove over to the service center and dropped it off today, saving three or four days and the hassle of repacking it and shipping it. The check-in clerk was amazed by what I brought in. He not only had never seen this model before---he *didn't even know it existed*. Doesn't that inspire confidence? But he is not the actual repair person. I can only hope someone in the Samsung organization knows more than the four nice but clueless people I dealt with today.

When I get the machine back in two or three weeks I will check back in with the results.

Another (possibly unrelated) problem involves the serial number. The first lady I spoke with (about the throughput) asked me for it. I gave it to her, but she told me that number is not a valid one! Later, the second tier guy also asked for the serial number. I told him about the problem. He had me look at the box the player came in. It also had a serial number. It was different from the one on the machine. It was also invalid! So I have no idea what the serial number of this defective unit is. I am wondering if the unit I received was not, in fact, new. I wonder if it had been returned (because it was defective) and it got repacked in the wrong box. Regardless of why the box's number and the machine's number are different, I am flabbergasted that *neither* was valid!

One possibility which would explain the symptoms (no high definition playback possible, but standard definition works) would be if my TV was not HDCP-compliant. The cryptic error message "This disk cannot be played" sounds like something that might be generated by a failed HDCP check. But my TV is a 2006 model Mitsubishi DLP TV which says right in its owner's manual that it *is compliant*. And I have a friend with a slightly older Mitsubishi DLP TV and a Sony Blu-Ray player. They work together just fine (using HDMI, as I am). I am a little surprised that the second tier guy didn't mention this as a possibility. I have seen discussions over at AVS regarding the fact that many people with the BD-UP5000 have reported a variety of problems that are inconsistent. That is, given a particular Blu-Ray or HD DVD disk, most can play it but some can't. Different people had different problems with different movies. Finally someone mentioned that maybe the problem isn't due just to the player, but might involve a whole host of TV, disk, or even A/V cable compatibility issues. I am hoping that my problem is not due to some error in Samsung or Mitsubishi's implementation of HDCP. If it is, the BD-UP5000 would be a no-go for me. Actually, this explanation feels unlikely to me. But the symptoms and the error message are consistent with an HDCP problem.


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## Sonnie

That does not sound so good there Denis... but you seem to be pretty patient about it all.


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## denisincalif

In my previous post I promised to check back in when my 5000 came back from the repair shop. It just arrived yesterday, 19 days after I dropped it off. *It works!*

I haven't had time to thoroughly test it out, but I did play one HD DVD and one Blu-Ray last night, and both looked spectacular. I had no problems with audio drop outs or freeze ups. Obviously I will have to play a lot more discs before I can be sure all is well. But so far so good.

A lot sure has happened since I sent the machine in for repair! Three weeks ago we all knew HD DVD was in trouble. But I am amazed at how fast all support for HD DVD collapsed. As far as I know, Microsoft is the only company that hasn't officially dropped out of the HD DVD business. I have to assume that they will do so shortly.

I haven't taken a careful look at a standard DVD with the 5000 yet. I am anxious to see for myself if all the hype about the Reon chip is justified. If it is, and if Samsung comes through with the audio codec firmware upgrades as promised, then I will have one sweet machine which should last me until Blu-Ray machine prices have come down and standards have stabilized. Maybe, if satellite delivery services of 1080p movies succeeds and matures fast enough, I will never need another DVD player! (See XStreamHD web site.)

Of course, there is still no guarantee Samsung will support this machine all the way. If they don't I will be extremely upset, since I have come so close to something I have wanted for a very long time.


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## htaddikt

Any more news on this player? I am considering it with recent price drops (<$450 new). I understand Samsung is planning another firmware update in May.
It will bring the player fully up to 1.1 profile. AFAIK this player will never make it to 2.0. I get mixed reviews going around the web, but overall great picture and good audio with a few bugs apparently in work.


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## jeffreybehr

htaddikt, I've had mine since January and love it. I did one firmware upgrade painlesly but have NOT done the latest one as I understand there are problems with it.

For video, I use HDMI straight to the TV, a Samsung 67" DLP RPTV. For audio, I use the 6-channel analog outputs into my conrad-johnson MET1 preamp. Mine will NOT decode Dolby TruHD but will decode everything else.


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## htaddikt

Yes, the 1.2 upgrade was to fix a problem with the previous upgrade, from what I understand. Had to do with the ethernet fix.

Also, probably the last update is due in May for the codecs.

So getting standard Dobly 5.1 out to optical or coax is no problem, right?
That's always my fallback with no TrueHD..my receiver can only do video over HDMI not audio. But I do have 5.1 analog inputs too.


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## jeffreybehr

htaddikt said:


> So getting standard Dobly 5.1 out to optical or coax is no problem, right?


I have no idea; I don't use ANY digital-audio outs; I use only the 6-channel analog outs.


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## htaddikt

As long as it always outputs over analog, that is certainly a good option.
I guess bass management, etc. is limited though, within the player.


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## denisincalif

As I described earlier in this thread, I received my player from Amazon in late January. It was mostly non-functional. But since getting it back from the repair shop (costs covered by the warranty of course) I have been very happy with it. Video quality on HD DVD and Blu-Ray is excellent. So is the upconverting on standard DVD's.

I am not as qualified to comment on audio. I am waiting for the promised May firmware upgrade before I buy my sound system. At the moment I have both video and audio coming from my TV via a direct HDMI connection. I have also avoided buying and playing the known "trouble" discs, such as Sunshine. Everything I have played has played perfectly and there have been no issues regarding use of menus, fast forwarding, and chapter hopping that have been noted by some users. My impression is that the trouble discs are mostly very recent BD Profile 2.0-compliant discs. Such discs are supposed to be downward compatible, so that a 1.0 or 1.1 player can play the movie and the special features, just not do the interactive stuff. But the standard is so new and apparently unstable that many players (the BD-UP5000 among them) stumble on these discs and require firmware upgrades to be played properly.

Another problem seen by many users is short audio drop outs (a split second up to one or two seconds per event). These drop outs are especially common on standard DVD's. But I have never experienced any such problem. The audio performance of the 5000 on the lossy codecs varies all over the map. Many have lots of drop outs. Many others (like me) have none. Some have speculated that the problem is not in the player but in other components in the users' systems. Others speculate that the problem is simply bad quality control by Samsung. Nobody knows for sure.

As for the new lossles codecs (True HD and DTS HD MA), the 5000 as it stands today cannot handle them. It doesn't matter what audio output you use. This is the problem the May firmware upgrade is supposed to fix. But no one is sure whether the fix will be to allow straight bitstreaming of these codecs, permitting a receiver to decode them, or whether full decoding in the player will be provided. One feature that really bugs a lot of people is the fact that some discs provide *only* TrueHD as a *selectable* track. In such cases, if the player can't handle TrueHD a *hidden* lossy track is present and the player is supposed to use it. But the 5000, whose specs say that it handles TrueHD, "handles" it by providing TrueHD output in just two channels! It never looks at or uses the back-up 5.1 "hidden" track.

There have been three firmware upgrades released so far. The first, labeled 1.0, fixed a number of playback and navigation problems on some discs (such as Ratatouille). The next one, 1.1, was supposed to fix a few more playback problems including Sunshine. But it disabled the player's ability to connect to the Internet! Within a few days version 1.2 was released. It was identical to 1.1 (I think) except that Internet connectivity was restored. Reviews of the 1.2 firmware are mixed. I have not installed it myself, but will do so the first time I encounter playback problems with any disc.

This player has enormous potential. At $450 or so it is a steal, as long as you feel you do not need Blu-Ray 2.0 compliance and as long as you trust Samsung to come through with the May upgrade as promised. If Samsung fulfills its promises, you will have an HD DVD player as good as the best Toshiba ever sold, plus a Blu-Ray 1.1 player in the same box.


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## htaddikt

I really appreciate your analysis, Denis...very in-depth and complete.

By they way, my comment implying falling back on optical/coaxial or 5.1 analog was only respective to Dolby 5.1, not any lossless audio reproduction.
I understand the limitations in that regard, as far as the player (less any changes in May) and my own AVR's capabilities.

By the way, I had read on another forum that the 1.2 fix was to 'FIX' the 1.1 update.


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## htaddikt

UPDATE:
Have my new player... one freeze on BD movie 'Hit Man'.
I've had a similar freezes on my XA1, not common though.
Need to see if it will do it again, maybe the disk?
Tried assorted disks, all formats (but for Hit Man did not play them all the way through). 
Not a single glitch.


Can not get internet access. Don't know why. Did the latest firmware upgrade (3/10/08) by burning an ISO Image from downloaded Sammy file.

On the plus side, machine is about twice as fast loading as my old XA1. Audio I am restricted to 're-encoding' which puts it out as DTS 5.1. Sounds fine though. Picture quality is excellent!
I would give it a notch above my HD DVD player.
So far so good.... 
will report more... build date: 01/08


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## jeffreybehr

denisincalif said:


> As for the new lossles codecs (True HD and DTS HD MA), the 5000 as it stands today cannot handle them. It doesn't matter what audio output you use.


As I've written elsewhere, my 5000 decodes and passes on EVERY audio codec but DolbyTrueHD. I have 20 hi-def discs with DTS HDMLA and it plays every one of them when I select that soundtrack. I'm using the analog outputs.


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## Guest

Before I bought it I've spent much time at sources like TestFreaks and read a lot of reviews and previews of this model. I purchased Samsung BD-UP5000 for $524.00 a couple of weeks ago and couldn't be more pleased.
Every format I've tried has looked wonderful. SD upscaling is beautiful.
Hd and BD are fantastic. I have had nary a glitch and I have found the load times to be fairly quick...and I tend to be impatient. It has performed admirably even without the update. I did download it but I'm afraid to take a chance on screwing things up if I install it. So far so good. I'll update this review if things change.


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## htaddikt

Re-played Hit Man today for a friend. No problem at all this time.
Player is quite sweet, hopefully future updates will keep it that way.


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## bobgpsr

jeffreybehr said:


> As I've written elsewhere, my 5000 decodes and passes on EVERY audio codec but DolbyTrueHD.


It decodes the two channel layer of TrueHD at this moment and may later do 5.1 TrueHD with a firmware upgrade.


> I have 20 hi-def discs with DTS HDMLA and it plays every one of them when I select that soundtrack. I'm using the analog outputs.


I understand that it just extracts the lossy core legacy 1.5 Mbps 5.1 channel dts portion that is always there -- not the lossless Master Audio layer yet. Yep you get 5.1 sound -- but once again you need a possible future upgrade to get the dts-HD MA in its full lossless glory.


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## htaddikt

seledka said:


> Before I bought it I've spent much time at sources like TestFreaks and read a lot of reviews and previews of this model. I purchased Samsung BD-UP5000 for $524.00 a couple of weeks ago and couldn't be more pleased.
> Every format I've tried has looked wonderful. SD upscaling is beautiful.
> Hd and BD are fantastic. I have had nary a glitch and I have found the load times to be fairly quick...and I tend to be impatient. It has performed admirably even without the update. I did download it but I'm afraid to take a chance on screwing things up if I install it. So far so good. I'll update this review if things change.


My experience is similar. The WEP setting on my ethernet wireless converter was corrupted, now internet access is enabled.
One glitch during a playback of a BD (Hit Man) which I could never get to repeat.
I've only had this puppy 3 days, so a lot more disks to shove into it. But have done a sampling of all formats. Jury is out if the upconversion is as good as my Toshiba XA1, but since there is a lot variability in disk quality, that may take a little longer to assess.

FWIW, my recommendations so far:

Leave "Anynet+" disabled.
Leave off any enhancements.
I use the re-encode setting for audio, to process everything as DTS.
I have the 5000 programmed to power up last in my Harmony macro. Some say this precludes a possible
HDMI handshake problem.

I did the update (via disk, ethernet was not working at the time) and did not do enough playing around before to notice any differences.
Functionally, this player is 100%, and the video presentation is very impressive!


build date 1/08


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## denisincalif

Another bonus, which is extremely important to me and a few other people, is the ability of the 5000 to play DVD-R and DVD+R disks. You may think this ought to be automatic in this day and age, but it isn't. Several of the Sony BD players can't do it, for example.

The odd thing is that the 5000 specs explicitly mention DVD-R support, but do not mention DVD+R. Yet it plays DVD+R just fine. Apparently this is a common phenomenon with many modern DVD players. But I know that several years ago DVD+R was often not supported even when DVD-R was. I wonder why many manufacturers ignore DVD+R when listing what their machines can play.:dontknow:


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## Wayde

Is anyone still using the 5000? I hear the patch is out and that people are using it with the new lossless audio codecs. From what I gather it's not outputting the decoded lossless audio over the analog outputs though, only bitstream to a receiver through HDMI... or maybe it's decoding it and sending it through HDMI in PCM, I'm not sure. 

I still have like 20 HD DVDs. If this unit works as promised I might consider looking for one again someday.


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## htaddikt

Wayde said:


> Is anyone still using the 5000? I hear the patch is out and that people are using it with the new lossless audio codecs. From what I gather it's not outputting the decoded lossless audio over the analog outputs though, only bitstream to a receiver through HDMI... or maybe it's decoding it and sending it through HDMI in PCM, I'm not sure.
> 
> I still have like 20 HD DVDs. If this unit works as promised I might consider looking for one again someday.


Seems to work as promised through analog 5.1 on the last TrueHD disk I played.


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## jeffreybehr

Wayde said:


> Is anyone still using the 5000? I hear the patch is out and that people are using it with the new lossless audio codecs. From what I gather it's not outputting the decoded lossless audio over the analog outputs though, only bitstream to a receiver through HDMI... or maybe it's decoding it and sending it through HDMI in PCM, I'm not sure.
> 
> I still have like 20 HD DVDs. If this unit works as promised I might consider looking for one again someday.


"Is anyone still using the 5000?" Huh? I imagine there are tens of thousands of us out here who are still using--and loving--their 5000s. I installed the update--quickly and painlessly--a couple weeks ago and my 5000 is operating perfectly. Those few discs I have with DolbyTrueHD that wouldn't play ANY audio from that track are sounding excellent, as are the DTS-HDMA tracks...as are ALL others. I use only the 6-channel-analog outputs.

BTW I've read in the last couple days that several retailers are closing out their 5000s for under $500.


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## Wayde

Wow... that's pretty cool! <500 might push me over the edge. But I am pretty happy with my Panny BD player. 

It's either try to firesale my HD DVD discs or get the combo player... eventually. I still have the Xbox 360 add-on, but I don't know how long I'm going to want to put up with that - no hi-res audio at all!


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## tbase1

Does this player output bitstream across blu-ray and hd-dvd in true-hd and dts-hd?


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## Guest

Got the 5000 in July and love it. Was able to find a refurbished one on ebay and everything works great from what I can tell.

I updated the firmware right off the bat and have had no trouble with Audio. I'm just not sure I have the best method of connection.

Currently I'm using HDMI straight to the TV for Video and Coax Digital to the receiver for Audio. I have the option of using HDMI to the Receiver for Audio and Video, or analog 5.1 or Optical. My receiver isn't set to decode True-HD as it was made before HD DVDs came out. I only have a 5.1 set up right now since my apartment isn't big enough for the 7.1 or even 6.1. I'm using the Bitstream Audiophile Option with the Coax Digital and from what I can tell - it sounds great. I just wasn't sure if I'd get better clarity or options by going a different route.

The only problems I've noticed is doing the Speaker Test from the Set-Up uses only the L and R speaker. But movies don't seem to have that problem and using the Audiophile option has all Sound coming through labeled as DTS on my Receiver.

Set Up includes 
Samsung 50" DLP
Onkyo 602 7.1 Receiver

Thanks for any suggestions!


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## imbeaujp

Hello, 

My Toshiba HDDVD player does not have the 7.1 analog output so I plan to replace it with the Samsung BD-UP5000 to access to Dolby True HD and also start using bluray discs...

I can find the BD-UP5000 for 299 here, is it a good move ??

Thanks !


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## htaddikt

I can only comment on my experience with the 5000 which has been very good. Keep in mind Samsung is just releasing a new player that does most all decoding on-board but still has 7.1 analog outputs. The 2550. probably around $400.
And Oppo Digital is releasing their first BD player that will have DVD-A and SACD capability.
I doubt it will be less than $500 for starters.
Of course, neither of those will play HD DVDs.
Back to your original question, I think it's still a good buy at $300..I might consider an extended warranty..I got one for $29 for 2 years on mine. Only because Samsung's labor warranty was only 3 months.


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## imbeaujp

Thanks !


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## tbase1

Just bagged one of these off fleabay from a second hander for $238.00 to replace my tosh. a20 and sony s300. I might keep my second room dual format setup ( a30 and s301) or buy the lg bh200. What say you guys about both the sammy and LG?


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## barmic

Bought the BD-UP5000 in October. It plays dvds and hd dvds fine, no problems at all. 
Bluray was another story. Player came with firmware 1.2. Tried to watch Stargate. Film fails 2/3 of the way in. Watched Indiana Jones 4 after several loading attempts, finally played after 5th or 6th attempt. Watched Cars after 2-3 loads. Watched POTC 2 & 3 with no problems. upgraded to firmware 1.3. Tried Iron Man, POTC 1,2,3, ratatouile, Fifth Element, Mamma Mia, Cars, etc. NO Bluray will load. upgraded to firmware 1.4 still no loading of bluray. other formats no problems. Talked to Level 2 tech, he promises an upgrade "in about 2 weeks" as of Dec 15. Still no upgrade. I have down-and-upgraded between 1.3 and 1.4 3 times with discs burned on 3 different PCs. no Luck. IMO this player was rushed to production. I bought a Panasonic DMP-BD35 for BD play. NICE little player! I will keep the BD-UP5000 for HDdvd play for now, and hope the NEXT firmware update works. I got it fairly cheap so I am hopeful....otherwise i will be very leery of samsung in future. I have a panasonic TV and LOVE IT. So I guess I am becoming brand-loyal to panny considering the nice BD player I just got.


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## htaddikt

barmic said:


> Bought the BD-UP5000 in October. It plays dvds and hd dvds fine, no problems at all.
> Bluray was another story. Player came with firmware 1.2. Tried to watch Stargate. Film fails 2/3 of the way in. Watched Indiana Jones 4 after several loading attempts, finally played after 5th or 6th attempt. Watched Cars after 2-3 loads. Watched POTC 2 & 3 with no problems. upgraded to firmware 1.3. Tried Iron Man, POTC 1,2,3, ratatouile, Fifth Element, Mamma Mia, Cars, etc. NO Bluray will load. upgraded to firmware 1.4 still no loading of bluray. other formats no problems. Talked to Level 2 tech, he promises an upgrade "in about 2 weeks" as of Dec 15. Still no upgrade. I have down-and-upgraded between 1.3 and 1.4 3 times with discs burned on 3 different PCs. no Luck. IMO this player was rushed to production. I bought a Panasonic DMP-BD35 for BD play. NICE little player! I will keep the BD-UP5000 for HDdvd play for now, and hope the NEXT firmware update works. I got it fairly cheap so I am hopeful....otherwise i will be very leery of samsung in future. I have a panasonic TV and LOVE IT. So I guess I am becoming brand-loyal to panny considering the nice BD player I just got.


Actually, I just sold my BD-UP5000 and it was still working flawlessly. I no longer needed a player for HD DVD as I had only a few disks that I owned.
I picked up the Panny BD55 as I needed 5.1 analog outputs. Excellent player, though the bass management and general setup for analogs is poorly executed both in the menu and explaining it in the manual. Performance-wise it is excellent for PQ/AQ.

Kind of a reverse situation, I am feeding a Samsung plamsa and love the picture. The 5000 worked out well for me, although I am aware some had a few hiccups with these players or updates. So much for duo players. They do (or did) serve their purpose.


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## tbase1

both of my players work with no prblems, but I'm the lucky one. I own to many hd-dvd's and will not replace them for nothing...I'm also buying them for less then 10 bucks a pop.


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