# REW and DIRAC



## fschris (Oct 31, 2009)

Send me to school here. Have a EMOTIVA XMC1 and looking to learn about calibration. I know this will be a long process. First off... The emotiva offers DIRAC. Is this the same as REW? Is one better than the other and how do you load files from REW into the XMC1? I ran DIRAC a couple times and it loads them automatically. 

Should you run DIRAC or REW for a 2ch set up and a 7 Channel set up depending on what you are listening too?

fschris


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

@Lumen. 'Lil help here!!!
REW is a measurement system that show you what your room sounds like. Dirac is actually the EQ that will adjust the sound(think audyssey). I think you can upload REW results into Dirac and select EQ curves etc, or use Dirac to measure and apply EQ by itself. Lumen has been through it too many times to count. Hopefully he, or anyone smarter n I am can help you.


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

willis7469 said:


> [MENTION=174858]I think you can upload REW results into Dirac and select EQ curves etc, or use Dirac to measure and apply EQ by itself.


_You cannot upload the results of REW or any other measurement program to Dirac. _Apparently, this may not be true but I have not seen this.

DiracLive measurements taken under different configurations or settings can be swapped in/out.

The major value of REW for DL users is to provide independent confirmation of DL's performance.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

Thanks Kal. I knew someone would explain. For some reason I was thinking dirac allowed something similar to using a bfd and a midi connection and using target curves and corrections etc. From REW measurements.


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## RTS100x5 (Sep 12, 2009)

REW room correction files can be uploaded into DIRAC under PEQ tab > advanced > Import....


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

RTS100x5 said:


> REW room correction files can be uploaded into DIRAC under PEQ tab > advanced > Import....


Really!? I had not heard of this.

I do not see a PEQ tab or any input option in DIRAC calibration tool nor do I see DIRAC listed as a filter-type in REW. Can you explain?


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

willis7469 said:


> @Lumen. 'Lil help here!!!
> REW is a measurement system that show you what your room sounds like. Dirac is actually the EQ that will adjust the sound(think audyssey). I think you can upload REW results into Dirac and select EQ curves etc, or use Dirac to measure and apply EQ by itself. Lumen has been through it too many times to count. Hopefully he, or anyone smarter n I am can help you.


Thanks for the vote of confidence! Sorry for the delayed response (I was engaged with another hobby).



Kal Rubinson said:


> _You cannot upload the results of REW or any other measurement program to Dirac. _Apparently, this may not be true but I have not seen this.
> DiracLive measurements taken under different configurations or settings can be swapped in/out.
> The major value of REW for DL users is to provide independent confirmation of DL's performance.


Not that you need my input, Kal, but that's correct. Dirac Live (for PC) may have other features, but Dirac Live LE (for Emotiva XMC-1) accommodates only one calibration at a time. Dirac Live LE also offers no PEQ either before or after calibration.


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

fschris said:


> Send me to school here. Have a EMOTIVA XMC1 and looking to learn about calibration. I know this will be a long process. First off... The emotiva offers DIRAC. Is this the same as REW?


Hi, fschris!
As explained by @willis7469 and @kal_Rubinson, Dirac is room correction (RC) software like Audyssey. REW is measurement software that can be used either before or after RC. REW will also generate PEQ filters for upload to a wide selection of equalizers/processors/AVRs. The difference between Dirac Live LE and REW filters is how they're generated and uploaded to the XMC-1.
REW Before RC - Used to find problems, so they can be corrected to make the RC software's job easier. That's beneficial because it uses fewer PEQ filters, which has a better effect on audio.
REW After RC - Used to verify that RC performed as expected, and if not, to analyze problems for another RC calibration (iterative process).
REW Used as RC - Manual interpretation of measurements and semi-automatic PEQ filter generation. 



fschris said:


> Is one better than the other


The term "better" is highly subjective in this case and could be argued either way. I personally haven't used Audyssey, so have no direct experience, but @AudiocRaver conducted controlled comparisons which concluded that Dirac was superior for 2ch sound stage and imaging. Dirac also yields superior results with much greater ease than Audyssey. See Post #1 and Post #51 of thread *Audyssey XT32 vs. Dirac Live Listening Comparison*



fschris said:


> ...and how do you load files from REW into the XMC1? I ran DIRAC a couple times and it loads them automatically.


Now that you know that REW and Dirac are separate, here's the story:

REW helps you measure your room/system and next helps you generate PEQ filter settings, which must then be manually entered into the XMC-1.
Dirac Live LE also measures the room/system, but results are automatically uploaded to the XMC-1. No manual PEQ is offered before or after upload, *BUT* speaker sizes and sub slope should be selected before and left alone afterward.



fschris said:


> Should you run DIRAC or REW for a 2ch set up and a 7 Channel set up depending on what you are listening too?


I'm not sure why you'd want to do that. During calibration, measurements are taken of individual speakers and of individual speakers + sub. So calibration accounts for all logical speaker combinations. Playback using the loaded calibration will be valid for 2-channel or multi-channel. 

OTOH, separate calibrations for each would be an interesting experiment, and wouldn't hurt to try. You could create and enter separate RCs for both types. REW calibrations will be easier to compare because the XMC-1 has two programmable presets. Dirac Live LE calibrations would have to be uploaded from a PC each time.

So if you'd still like to try independent calibrations for stereo or multichannel, just disable the speakers that aren't used by setting them to NONE. For REW, the XMC-1 menu location is SETUP > SPEAKERS > PRESET x > SIZE/DISTANCE. For Dirac Live LE, the XMC-1 menu location is SETUP > SPEAKERS > DIRAC LIVE > LR/C/Sub > LARGE/SMALL.


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

Lumen said:


> Not that you need my input, Kal, but that's correct. Dirac Live (for PC) may have other features, but Dirac Live LE (for Emotiva XMC-1) accommodates only one calibration at a time. Dirac Live LE also offers no PEQ either before or after calibration.


I am not talking about the LE for Emotiva. I have the DiracLive for PC and, while it can have 4 calibrations live for swapping and can access any number of stored calibrations, I do not see any way to upload *REW *files calibrations to any version of DL, as referred to below:



RTS100x5 said:


> REW room correction files can be uploaded into DIRAC under PEQ tab > advanced > Import....


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## FargateOne (Mar 3, 2015)

Kal Rubinson said:


> I am not talking about the LE for Emotiva. I have the DiracLive for PC and, while it can have 4 calibrations live for swapping and can access any number of stored calibrations, I do not see any way to upload *REW *files calibrations to any version of DL, as referred to below:


Neither do I but I am not an expert. The only thing I think of if for the house curve file which is not a calibration file. If you can tailor one with REW ( I know it is possible but I never did) then you can copy the coordinates of each point of your slope in a note pad file and copy it in a new target curve file for Dirac.


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

fschris said:


> ...how do you load files from REW into the XMC1? I ran DIRAC a couple times and it loads them automatically.


The XMC-1 has three PEQ presets. One is dedicated to Dirac Live LE and gets generated automatically when running the software. The other two are for whatever you like. One could be used to store filters generated by REW. The other could be used to store personal preferences. If setting up one of the presets for REW:
Take an REW measurement at the LP of the speaker(s) you wish to correct (e.g. L+R+Subs)
Select the XMC-1 in REW > EQ_WINDOW > EQ_SETTINGS > EQUALIZER_PANEL
Generate the REW filters for the XMC-1 by clicking on the EQ_FILTERS button in the EQ_WINDOW. 
For each of the filters listed in Step-3 above, repeat the following XMC-1 menu sequence (up to a maximum of 11 filters per speaker):

[*]SPEAKERS > PRESETS > PRESET1 > SETUP_SPEAKERS_EQ > SPEAKER_x > Filter_x > LEVEL/WIDTH/FREQ​


*Example of REW-generated PEQ filter list for a DSP1124P equalizer *








*Example of REW-generated PEQ filter list for a GENERIC equalizer *








*XMC-1 Menu Structure for Manual PEQ Entry (1 of 2)*








*XMC-1 Menu Structure for Manual PEQ Entry (2 of 2)*


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

FargateOne said:


> Neither do I but I am not an expert. The only thing I think of if for the house curve file which is not a calibration file. If you can tailor one with REW ( I know it is possible but I never did) then you can copy the coordinates of each point of your slope in a note pad file and copy it in a new target curve file for Dirac.


Yes but not only is that tedious but it is limited to the frequency domain. I do not know how one could copy a convolution or filter set into Dirac. More likely would be to copy those directly into Roon.


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

Lumen said:


> The XMC-1 has three PEQ presets. One is dedicated to Dirac Live LE and gets generated automatically when running the software. The other two are for whatever you like. One could be used to store filters generated by REW. The other could be used to store personal preferences.


Thanks. That will be helpful for those with XMC-1s but it does not involve DIRAC as far as I see it.


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## Flak (Nov 15, 2013)

Kal Rubinson said:


> Yes but not only is that tedious but it is limited to the frequency domain. I do not know how one could copy a convolution or filter set into Dirac. More likely would be to copy those directly into Roon.


Yes :smile:

miniDSP whose DSPs can use both solutions has published the following document about some differences (REW vs Dirac):
https://www.minidsp.com/applications/digital-room-correction/dirac-live-vs-rew

Flavio


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

Flak said:


> Yes :smile:


I hope this means what I'd like it to mean.


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## Flak (Nov 15, 2013)

Kal Rubinson said:


> I hope this means what I'd like it to mean.


It means that you are correct as usual and expected, what else?

Flavio


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

Flak said:


> It means that you are correct as usual and expected, what else?
> 
> Flavio


0


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## fschris (Oct 31, 2009)

this thread has some super info for me not really knowing much about calibration and all the tools available and how they interact so thanks to everyone... 

so let me ask this... So you know I have a XMC 1 and I ordered a UMIK so I have that covered. I also have a MINI DSP 2x4 and I am using 2 subs..... 

How do I set up the MINI DSP during a DIRAC calibration ? Do I even need a MINI DSP when using DIRAC? 

I ask this because I just plugged everything up and trying to get my SUBS to make any sound with the mini DSP something was not set correctly so I took it out and ran DIRAC and they had the normal amount of output id expect.


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## AustinJerry (Apr 2, 2010)

fschris said:


> this thread has some super info for me not really knowing much about calibration and all the tools available and how they interact so thanks to everyone...
> 
> so let me ask this... So you know I have a XMC 1 and I ordered a UMIK so I have that covered. I also have a MINI DSP 2x4 and I am using 2 subs.....
> 
> ...


You may find this guide useful:

MiniDSP 2x4 implementation


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## AustinJerry (Apr 2, 2010)

Kal Rubinson said:


> Yes but not only is that tedious but it is limited to the frequency domain. I do not know how one could copy a convolution or filter set into Dirac. More likely would be to copy those directly into Roon.


The OP has been talking about Dirac on the XMC-1. I have the MiniDSP 88A with the bass management plugin. On the 88A utility program, PEQ can be applied to each of the output channels downstream of the Dirac filters. The advanced tab on the PEQ configuration has an Import button, as shown in the attached screenshot. The User Guide does not specifically describe what the import button does, and I have not experimented with it myself, but my assumption is that it will import text files created by the REW EQ tool.

While this may not be importing "into Dirac" per se, I believe it would accomplish what we have been talking about.


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## fschris (Oct 31, 2009)

Austin... thanks for the Link I will be reading this today


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

AustinJerry said:


> While this may not be importing "into Dirac" per se, I believe it would accomplish what we have been talking about.


Delete the "per se" and I agree.


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