# Onkyo NR818 vs NR1010



## Andre (Feb 15, 2010)

Is the NR1010 worth the $500+ premium IF you are not going beyond 7.1


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Andre said:


> Is the NR1010 worth the $500+ premium IF you are not going beyond 7.1


Hello,
Unless you are using or planning on using dual subwoofers, there really is little to justify the added expenditure. The 1010 offers SubEQ HT which is great for integrating dual subwoofers.

That being said, if you can find a TX-NR3009 for anywhere close to the 818, I would seriously consider that as it offers things like multichannel analog inputs, SubEQ HT and more.
Cheers,
J


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## JQueen (Jan 11, 2012)

To piggy back what JJ said you can get the 3009 on a4l cheaper then the 1010 

http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...-Plus-3-D-9.2-Channel-Network-Receiver/1.html


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

*Other than Dual Subs, these features are found in the 1010 but not the 818:*








_VLSC (vector linear, proprietary Onkyo signal circuit- said to make digital sound natural)_







*Push-Pull Amplifier*







Front panel Toslink







*HDMI Support for- 3D video, Audio Return Channel, DeepColor, x.v.Color, LipSync, CEC *







Upscaling on the 1010 uses HQV Vida vs Marvell Qdeo on the 818







Zone 2 HDMI output (good for viewing MP3 playlists on a small monitor with out turning on your big TV)







The 1010 features Pure Audio and Direct Mode where as the 818 only has direct. Pure Audio mode is great on the Multi-chanel analog input. I find it reveals a more detailed track.







*Bluetooth Ready via USB*







*Digital Crossover Processing Network*







_5 watts more power in the 1010._ 

Highlighted in black are the reasons I would go 1010 over the 818. The extra 5 watts are nice but not necessary. I presume teh HQV Vida is better than the Qdeo for upscaling.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

8086 said:


> Other than Dual Subs, these features are found in the 1010 but not the 818:
> 
> _VLSC (vector linear, proprietary Onkyo signal circuit- said to make digital sound natural)_
> *Push-Pull Amplifier*
> ...


Hello,
The 818 actually does offer the HQV Vida/Marvell Qdeo tandem as well. It also supports 3D, ARC, and others like x.v Color even though I know of few applications for it.

Undeniably the 1010 is a nicer AVR, but it really comes down to whether the juice is worth the squeeze. Personally, I do think the 3009 is better than all but the 5010. And I could easily be swayed about the 3009 offering more functionality than the 5010.
Cheers,
J


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

I would consider stepping up to the TX-NR3010 for the power supply alone. It can be found online for $1600-1700. The improved HDMI, especially the (wife pleasing) convince of CEC would be enough make the leap to the 1010 or 3010.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

That is a picture of a 5010 as the 3000 Series do not use a Torodial Transformer using EL Core's for all transformers. The 5000 Series use one relatively large Toroidal Transformer and 3 EL Core's.


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

Jungle Jack said:


> That is a picture of a 5010 as the 3000 Series do not use a Torodial Transformer using EL Core's for all transformers. The 5000 Series use one relatively large Toroidal Transformer and 3 EL Core's.


The 3010 does have the 4 independent transformers.

As a lower cost but equally good alternative might be the Yamaha Advetage RX-A2010, which can be found for $999 online. Or the Adventage RX-A3010 which goes for about $1300. Both feature HQV video processing. I have an older Yamaha and just love it.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

8086 said:


> The 3010 does have the 4 independent transformers.
> 
> As a lower cost but equally good alternative might be the Yamaha Advetage RX-A2010, which can be found for $999 online. Or the Adventage RX-A3010 which goes for about $1300. Both feature HQV video processing. I have an older Yamaha and just love it.


I am aware of that. I have owned 2 different 3000 Series AVR's and while tempted by the 5000 Series, I just could not justify the added expense. Especially considering that I do not use the internal amplifiers.

As for the Aventage, I quite like the A3010 and is an excellent alternative. I do slightly favor the 3009/3010
due to XT32/SubEQ HT. However, the Aventage's have been quite reliable and I also really like that you can switch HDMI sources when the AVR is on standby.


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

Jungle Jack said:


> I am aware of that. I have owned 2 different 3000 Series AVR's and while tempted by the 5000 Series, I just could not justify the added expense. Especially considering that I do not use the internal amplifiers.
> 
> As for the Aventage, I quite like the A3010 and is an excellent alternative. I do slightly favor the 3009/3010
> due to XT32/SubEQ HT. However, the Aventage's have been quite reliable and I also really like that you can switch HDMI sources when the AVR is on standby.



The Yamaha Adventage RX-A3010 is definitely my pick out of this litter. If he's not going beyond 5.1, then there is little need for dual sub EQ. 

I would have suggested, Pioneer Elite SC-68 and _the only way to get it cheap_ is to go online. However, there are _reports from owners_ that Pioneer is now only honoring warranties and providing support to owners who purchased from authorized brick and mortar retailers. Online purchases, even from authorized dealers with websites are now said to have a voided warranty.

EDIT: Now that I think about it- Yamaha is kind of like the Porsche of the Audio world: Mass market, high performance, reliable (the every day super car), available to most working men, and even though both are well engineered machines designed by passionate men in their respective markets with their sales numbers are bit of an underdog compared to some of their competitors. And both are bought by very dedicated and loyal (often fanatical) customers whom understand the philosophy behind the design who believe solid (cutting edge) engineering, finesse, and performance are what matter.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

If Yamaha is a Porsche in your estimation, what would Denon/Marantz be? To me, it would be hard not to think of a Japanese brand like Toyota/Lexus such that Yamaha has been so heavily into myriad DSP Modes for so long. Things like trying to recreate the sound of The Roxy Theater, Village Gate, Warehouse Loft, Cellar Club, Freiburg Cathedral and so forth.


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

Jungle Jack said:


> If Yamaha is a Porsche in your estimation, what would Denon/Marantz be? To me, it would be hard not to think of a Japanese brand like Toyota/Lexus such that Yamaha has been so heavily into myriad DSP Modes for so long. Things like trying to recreate the sound of The Roxy Theater, Village Gate, Warehouse Loft, Cellar Club, Freiburg Cathedral and so forth.


Porsche learns to build cars from their racing and racing is the company's main focus. Yamaha learns to build audio electronics from building musical instruments and music is the company's focus; after all the Yamaha logo is a trio of tuning forks. 


Denon and Marantz were part of D&M holdings whom once were part of McIntosh. I think Fiat might be the closest? They own Ferrari, Maserati, Fiat (of course), and Chrysler. Maserati is similar to a Ferrari but with luxury comfort instead of the balls out F1 performance being the main focus of Ferrari. 

Maserati = McIntosh and their Etched Glass?
Ferrari = Marantz
Denon with all it's horsepower could be closest to an American Muscle Car.

Sony is another company big in to Hall and Concert DSP. As far as DSP effect modes go, I've never been a big fan but of them. But I think Yahama does the best job at it. When you use those Yamaha DSP modes you are also supposed to have front effect speakers hooked up (which i've never done). I'd like to try it one day and use a recording that was made in one of those places like Freiberg, Village Vanguard, etc and use the matching DSP mode to see how it turns out.


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## JQueen (Jan 11, 2012)

Feels good to know I have Ferrari bc my regular car is nowhere close


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

fftopic2:
In all honesty, I don't think there is an automotive analogy that fits Denon and Marantz. General Electric or Whirlpool is about as close as I can think of. Whirlpool bought Maytag and still sells them as a distinct premium brand. Much like GE whom has a separate brand for ultra cheap appliences (forgot the name), as well as regular GE, GE Profile, and another uber high end Label they use (forgot that too).


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

Can I get a receiver of similar qualities of let's say a Ford F-150?


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## JQueen (Jan 11, 2012)

JBrax said:


> Can I get a receiver of similar qualities of let's say a Ford F-150?


Are we talking king ranch or base model


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

JQueen said:


> Are we talking king ranch or base model


Let's go XLT mid range.


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## JQueen (Jan 11, 2012)

JBrax said:


> Let's go XLT mid range.


Lets go with Harmon Kardon


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

JQueen said:


> Lets go with Harmon Kardon


Hmm…


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## menace2society (Jan 26, 2011)

Somebody's been smoking bud:sneeky::rofl2::rofl2:


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

JBrax said:


> Can I get a receiver of similar qualities of let's say a Ford F-150?


fftopic2:


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## Andre (Feb 15, 2010)

Thanks folks,

I won't get involved in the vehicle off topic part of the thread but I will try to bring it back...

I was looking at the NR818 because of the price (under 1k) and that it has Audessey XT32. The 3009 is still over 1.3k in Canada and A4L does not ship receivers to Canada.

I remember drooling in anticipation for the Emotiva MC-200 before it came out, thinking it would be a reciever killer. Unfortuately this did not come to pass in my opinion.

I currently own a Yamaha (RC-1400) and though "surround enhanced" is ok I find the mic room correction to not work very well in my opinion. 

I also thought of the lower end Anthem receivers since some said their ARC correction software is highly comparable to the Audessy, but again price became a issue.


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

Andre said:


> Thanks folks,
> 
> I won't get involved in the vehicle off topic part of the thread but I will try to bring it back...
> 
> ...


Yamaha's low priced, mass market goods are not in the same class as their top tier flagship models; which is why I think they have made a new Adventage label. I've heard those low end units and I own their former flagship model. The difference is night and day. Chevy Caviler vs Chevy Corvette. Also, your unit is at least 8 or 9 years old, technology has progressed since then.


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## Andre (Feb 15, 2010)

8086 said:


> Also, your unit is at least 8 or 9 years old, technology has progressed since then.


This is very true though it begs the question "how much technology do I need?"

It is highly doubtful I would use any of the additional DPS modes on the receiver other then those related to Dolby, DTS movie.

I would not use the internet or satellite extras. Though the I may in time hook the receiver up wirelessly to my home network once I upgrade it to gigabit transfer medium later on this year or next. I would like to view online video on my big screen (e.g. Crackle)

I do appreciate upgrades in amplifiers, 4 or even 2 ohm stability, Torodial transformers, digital crossovers, though I wonder at what point my mid level Axiom speakers and non golden hearing will cease to perceive a difference.

My theater is not big enough to use front wide or high presence speakers so going beyond 7.1 is fairly useless for me. I have other music zone in the house but those are powered but my last receiver (currently a 20 year out Denon which will be retired and replaced by the current Yamaha)

I appreciate a dock for my Ipod though I wonder if the internal DAC are used for it and if it is optimized for compress music.

I appreciate ISF calibrations. I have seen the difference on my DLP rear projections even though I am color blind. Though I am not sure I would see a difference between the current generation of processors (DVDO, HQV, Marvell)

I don't understand having 7 HDMI inputs, OPPO Bluray, Cable, maybe a PS3, but what else normally?

Again if the Omotiva had the processing capabilities of an NR818 including Audessey and minus bugs I would probably go with their separates, but alas.

I would be nice to be able to custom build a receiver or separates like you can an computer (no not a Mac), this way you can spend extra to upgrade the features you really want by removing those you don't care for.


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## JDEaston (Dec 30, 2011)

8086 said:


> Yamaha's low priced, mass market goods are not in the same class as their top tier flagship models; which is why I think they have made a new Adventage label. I've heard those low end units and I own their former flagship model. The difference is night and day. Chevy Caviler vs Chevy Corvette. Also, your unit is at least 8 or 9 years old, technology has progressed since then.


While I agree with what you said, the same could be said for every other big name manufacturer. Features are nearly the same between mid and high end avr's, with room correction being the difference there. The amplifier stage is the big difference, however most people in the market for a $500 avr, do not need the amplification that a $1500 avr offers anyway. 

Which brings us back to room correction and features. Feature set is pretty much the same across the board, though room correction can vary quite a bit. I think RC is overated because I remember the days where a proper calibrated avr, with properly placed speakers, would sound just as good if not better than anything on the market today. It's just a matter of whether you are willing to put the time and effort into properly calabrating your system manually. 

Another thing as far as room correction goes, it seems a lot of people are pro-audyssey and don't even give anything else a chance. I don't put much into reviews, but a recent review I read states that the entry level of ypao, is better than entry level audyysey. Personally I think how good room correction is depends on speaker placement and room acoustics. There isn't an automatic eq available that will fix poorly placed speakers, or bad acoustics, without a lot of help.


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

Andre said:


> This is very true though it begs the question "how much technology do I need?"
> 
> *It is highly doubtful I would use any of the additional DPS modes on the receiver other then those related to Dolby, DTS movie.*
> 
> ...




I'm totally with you on the DSP, it's mostly a gimmick to me. I never use DSP modes on any of my AV recievers (except for Onkyo's channel steering) I'm suggesting Yamaha for its awesome amplifier build quality and nice price. In my opinion, over all build build quality is higher than Onkyo delivers at the same price point. 

Every Onkyo dock I've ever seen has included a Toslink connector with an [RI] jack for control.

You can always do an Onkyo Processor with an Emotiva Amplifier and get the best of both worlds.


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## Andre (Feb 15, 2010)

The only Yammy that is comparable in price (still 200 over, as least what I can find online in Canada) is the RX-A1020.

Nobody has done a side by side of the newer YPAO R.S.C vs Audyssey XT32. Shout Out to All the HTS reviewers..:hissyfit:

I wonder if you need something special with respect to the receiver in order to stream online video or even just view YouTube via its Ethernet port? I don't have an HTPC. Would be nice to just walk into the theater with your tablet (mine is android) and stream what you are watching on it to the big screen.


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## 8086 (Aug 4, 2009)

Andre said:


> The only Yammy that is comparable in price (still 200 over, as least what I can find online in Canada) is the RX-A1020.
> 
> Nobody has done a side by side of the newer YPAO R.S.C vs Audyssey XT32. Shout Out to All the HTS reviewers..:hissyfit:
> 
> I wonder if you need something special with respect to the receiver in order to stream online video or even just view YouTube via its Ethernet port? I don't have an HTPC. Would be nice to just walk into the theater with your tablet (mine is android) and stream what you are watching on it to the big screen.


The RX-A2010 and RX-A3010 or any other USA "only" receiver is avialble to you via a company called ShipTo.com. You send them your online or catalog orders and when you are ready, for small fee they will box it in to one package and forward it to your home in Canada, Britain, Germany,etc.

You don't neceearilly need an HTPC. You can use a regular laptop. I stream stuff from my desktop to the Popcorn Hour, Xbox or PS3, etc.. All you will need is some type of Media Center software with DLNA capabilities. 
If you don't feel like tying up your only computer for these tasks, a lot of older computers can be cheaply adapted to HTPC use.


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## sfdoddsy (Oct 18, 2007)

Andre said:


> The only Yammy that is comparable in price (still 200 over, as least what I can find online in Canada) is the RX-A1020.
> 
> Nobody has done a side by side of the newer YPAO R.S.C vs Audyssey XT32. Shout Out to All the HTS reviewers..:hissyfit:
> 
> I wonder if you need something special with respect to the receiver in order to stream online video or even just view YouTube via its Ethernet port? I don't have an HTPC. Would be nice to just walk into the theater with your tablet (mine is android) and stream what you are watching on it to the big screen.


There are some measurements of YPAO compared to Anthem ARC, Emotiva UMC-200 and XT32 in this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1435060/rew-measurements-for-room-correction-systems-ypao-arc-audyssey-etc

YPAO doesn't do a great deal.


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