# Do I need to calibrate my new tv?



## brian711

I recently purchased a Samsung PN58C8000 Plasma from Best Buy and they informed me that after I logged in 100 viewing hours, it was imperative to get the tv calibrated. They informed me that their Geek Squad could do the calibration for $200. My question is: Is this a needed service? Will it really increase the quality of a what I think an already good quality picture? Are there other companies that can provide this service for a better price? Can I do this calibration myself or do I need pricey equipment that would be over $200?

Any help would be appreciated!


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## nholmes1

Is it needed? Only if you want the best picture possible from your tv, they never come set correctly and your viewing environment plays a huge part of achieving the best possible picture. You can get semi-close yourself via the various DIY calibration discs, however you need test equipment to be as close as possible to optimum, my set of test equipment cost close to 18k.

Geek squad will be cheaper than most independent calibrators but they also aren't nearly as thorough with the calibration as an independent calibrator will be when performing the service.


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## Dale Rasco

nholmes1 said:


> Is it needed? Only if you want the best picture possible from your tv, they never come set correctly and your viewing environment plays a huge part of achieving the best possible picture. You can get semi-close yourself via the various DIY calibration discs, however you need test equipment to be as close as possible to optimum, my set of test equipment cost close to 18k.
> 
> Geek squad will be cheaper than most independent calibrators but they also aren't nearly as thorough with the calibration as an independent calibrator will be when performing the service.


Thank you for saving me the time to type that. Agree completely.


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## brian711

How do you go about finding an independent tv calibration contractor?


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## nholmes1

http://www.imagingscience.com/

or 

http://www.isfforum.com/

Main place to check though there are others including THX.


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## Fastslappy

nholmes1 said:


> Is it needed? Only if you want the best picture possible from your tv, they never come set correctly and your viewing environment plays a huge part of achieving the best possible picture. You can get semi-close yourself via the various DIY calibration discs, however you need test equipment to be as close as possible to optimum, my set of test equipment cost close to 18k.
> 
> Geek squad will be cheaper than most independent calibrators but they also aren't nearly as thorough with the calibration as an independent calibrator will be when performing the service.


 Ok with that said.
how much is a fair & going price one should pay & what should one look for when hiring a calibration tech . Not wanting to be ripped off :spend:by some teenager with a small tool box IE:BB:rofl:.......... L O L ..


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## lcaillo

Pricing will vary with the calibrator, location, type of equipment, etc. What is a fair price depends upon what you expect and what the service provides. You should interview potential calibrators before deciding and discuss price, along with what they do. The service can vary quite a bit. The best will spend a great deal of time working with you to be sure that you are getting everything you expect out of your system and educating you on the process.

I strongly suggest that anyone with your questions get a copy of one of the test disks and learn how to adjust the basics visually. Once you have a better idea of what your display might be capable of providing, you will be much better able to make a smart decision regarding professional calibration.

Pass on the BB option, IME. Stick with the guys in the links provided. The ones that are members of the ISF Forum are often the best choices, as they communicate with many other pros to share experience and information about various displays.

Don't hesitate to post your questions here, however. There are some very experienced professional calibrators here, as well as lots of hobbyists who will be very helpful.


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## nholmes1

Fastslappy said:


> Ok with that said.
> how much is a fair & going price one should pay & what should one look for when hiring a calibration tech . Not wanting to be ripped off :spend:by some teenager with a small tool box IE:BB:rofl:.......... L O L ..


Each calibrator does charge what they want, that said the average cost for a calibration is starting somewhere in the $250-$350, depending on the number of components in the system and what the difficulty of the set being calibrated.

Not all tv sets can be calibrated fully, or correctly, others take longer to make adjustments. Contact the local calibrator and ask if they have worked with your set or any specific components you may have.


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## nholmes1

Ya what he said 

Feeling better?


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## lcaillo

Yes, Thanks, Nick. Still got some crud, but I have mostly joined the living again.


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## ojojunkie

is it calibration part of extended after sales service of the dealer at minimal cost ? ...


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## lcaillo

Almost never. Most dealers are not even aware of what calibration means. Most of the professionals with the proper equipment and experience are independent of dealers, though they may work through some dealers at times. Once upon a time some dealers would have offered such service as part of the sale. Those days are mostly gone.


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## Mika75

*dennisthomsen.dk - Samsung PN63C8000 review and settings*


The above calibration settings are what I use on my 58" :T


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## Alan Brown

This brings up a stubborn and pervasive fallacy in the home theater hobbyist community. Copying settings from even a fully calibrated display is NOT calibration. All that such foolishness will get you is a TV picture that might look a little like someone else's TV (which you have likely never seen). Then again, it might not. How do you know your viewing environment conditions will be identical? Will you also insist that they used the same DVD/BD player that had its picture options menu set the same as yours? Some basic "picture modes" may be superior on certain displays. These can be used in common for better performance, but actual picture adjustment values can vary significantly.

Electronic component tolerances used in consumer TVs and source components are not very precise (+/- 10% or worse). Such devices are not built to military spec or for aerospace. Because these tolerances are so imprecise, two samples of TV can come off the same assembly line and require very different picture settings to look near the same. The latest, state of the art, reference professional video monitor from Dolby Labs, is a 42" LED LCD that weights 150 lb. and cost $55k. It still requires calibration, by the way.

I was called in as an image quality analysis consultant for one of the largest national cable TV companies. They were doing a research project, using three new higher-end Panasonic 50" plasmas of the same model, and set up in ideal viewing conditions. Their engineers had gone over the picture settings on each display and set the menu items all identically. Two of the plasmas looked nearly like each other (still not identical), but the third one obviously looked quite different.

Widely respected professional calibrators, who have aligned thousands of consumer and professional displays in their careers, agree on this point. Here's an excellent example. The only way to reliably attain a more accurate image from any consumer display is to use reference test signals, NOT another display's settings. At minimum, read the manual, use a calibration DVD/BD on YOUR player, to adjust YOUR television, follow the tutorial instructions, set the picture controls for YOUR viewing environment conditions, and learn something from the experience. The simplest remedy is to hire a professional. Excellence in any endeavor requires extra effort. The learning curve for competent video system calibration, plus the investment in instruments, is substantial. Copying others' work on your display equipment is a poor substitute for alignment using test signals, with no assurance of improvement.

Best regards and beautiful pictures,
Alan Brown, President
CinemaQuest, Inc.
A Lion AV Consultants Affiliate

"Advancing the art and science of electronic imaging"


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## eugovector

Start by putting your TV in its "Movie" mode (as opposed to "dynamic" or "standard"). This will get you 50% of the way there. Watch it for a couple days.

Grab a calibration disc. You may already have one for free called "THX optimizer". This can be found in the "setup" section of many DVDs like Pirates of the Caribbean. This will get you 70% of the way there. You can also get a more professional disc like Spears and Munsil, DVE, or Disney's WOW for about $30 (the Disney disc seems to be best for beginners). This will get you 85-90% of the way there.

A professional calibration will get you to 100%

The percentages are arbitrarily assigned, BTW. AFAIK, there is no actual "TV Perfection" scale measured in percentages from 1-100.


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## Mika75

Alan Brown said:


> Copying settings from even a fully calibrated display is NOT calibration.


That's made quite clear as it's his calibration on his 63" panel (for the record my picture looks very realistic...but then without a proper calibration I could just be imagining things :rubeyes

He also clearly states:


> Please note that every panel has differences so using these settings will not give you a correct calibrated image. *However they will probably bring you closer than using the default Movie Mode.* I will post some new settings when the panel has a few more hours on it. The colour settings are for HD material (but can be used for regular PAL SD also).


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## lcaillo

The point is that you simply never know whether you will get closer than default settings or not when copying other's values.

For basic picture parameters likel contrast, brightness, and assorted processing modes, one is more likely to move in the right direction with copied settings than with gray scale and color management. With these latter, more complex and critical adjustments, you can easily end up going in the wrong direction.

The issue keeps coming up over and over. In many cases people may get improvements, in others they may just note a difference and sales experience demonstrates clearly that differences are often interpreted to be improvements when they are not. It just IS a hit and miss proposition. Pros like Allan and I have experimented many times with the matter. If there were such consistency we could save lots of time in calibration by starting with the numbers that we would know work for a given model. The fact is that it just does not work most of the time. One truly is better off adjusting visually to one's preference than copying settings beyond the most basic options ande processing.


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## Fastslappy

Soo how do I ,
When I've got a prospective calibration tech on the phone , know if "he knows" what he is doing ? 
It seems that they all want to do an phone interview with you before they come out. Which is fine by me ,but I do like to qualify people before I invite anyone unknown to me into my home.addle: 
So to know what to say to "the tech" & what they "the tech" should say to me is the Big Unknown to me ?:dontknow:
Where as cash is tight :spend:these days, I want to at least feel comfortable that a good job will be preformed:foottap:


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## brian711

Thanks for all the info. From the posts above, will not be going with BB. Will research and find an independent source.


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## nholmes1

Ask about the calibrators experience with your brand and market, ask what equipment they will use, ask what programs or hardware they will use. Any good calibrator should be able to easily answer these questions without any stammering or stuttering.

Again check the websites I listed before, isfforum specifically has minimum requirement of having verified equipment to be listed, ISF main website lists anyone who has taken the course and passed the test, atleast within the last 5 years.

Finally ask for a referral, just like with any contractor they should have a list of happy clients.


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## Fastslappy

nholmes1 said:


> Ask about the calibrators experience with your brand and market, ask what equipment they will use, ask what programs or hardware they will use. Any good calibrator should be able to easily answer these questions without any stammering or stuttering.
> 
> Again check the websites I listed before, isfforum specifically has minimum requirement of having verified equipment to be listed, ISF main website lists anyone who has taken the course and passed the test, atleast within the last 5 years.
> 
> Finally ask for a referral, just like with any contractor they should have a list of happy clients.


Thank you !
It's just the not knowing what to ask really puts one at a disadvantage with dealing with a contractor . with the guide lines you have stated, that gives me what I need to know. Soo I feel I can converse with confidence :T
i'll do some more reading up on ISF web site to understand even more

agin Thank You !

Mike


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## Alan Brown

The following link is to the ISF Forum site's listing of independent practitioners who service your area: http://www.isfforum.com/sobi2/ISF-Forum-Calibrators/Americas/United-States/California.html . The most experienced among them are from Lion AV and Avical. This non-public site is also contributed to by manufacturers who do not want information about the inner workings of their displays to be accessed by novices. It is populated by calibrators who pay an annual fee for access to their fellow ISF grad community, who have invested in instrumentation, garnered experience in the field, and who counsel one another regarding display specific techniques, quirks, problems and service codes.

This link is to a listing of THX Certified Calibrators: http://www.thxvideotech.com/forum/showthread.php?542-THX-Certified-Video-Calibrator . Many are also ISF trained, but all are graduates of the more thorough THX course. They have proven, by submitting for review at least 10 calibration reports, that they own and have mastered superior instrumentation that meets sufficient standards to enable them to work on any type of display technology. THX grads also are privy to a non-public calibrator forum community, administered by the course instructors, that offers expert counsel pertaining to specific display models.

Best regards and beautiful pictures,
Alan Brown, President
CinemaQuest, Inc.
A Lion AV Consultants Affiliate

"Advancing the art and science of electronic imaging"


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