# To THX or not in this modern time?



## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

Is it good to use THX processing for example with TrueHD, DTS HD MASTER, Atmos or is THX processing a thing of the past and while some modern receivers still carry it with todays new codecs is it best to leave it OFF?


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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

asere said:


> Is it good to use THX processing for example with TrueHD, DTS HD MASTER, Atmos or is THX processing a thing of the past and while some modern receivers still carry it with todays new codecs is it best to leave it OFF?


If you buy a piece of Equipment that is THX Certified it means it is able to meet certain performance specs...not an issue anymore as most of the equipment you buy anymore meets the specs now.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

ellisr63 said:


> If you buy a piece of Equipment that is THX Certified it means it is able to meet certain performance specs...not an issue anymore as most of the equipment you buy anymore meets the specs now.


 That is correct, however THX receivers have THX processing with ReEq on/off. I was not asking about if it is able to meet certain performance specs but more on the subject of engaging THX mode to use THX processing.


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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

asere said:


> That is correct, however THX receivers have THX processing with ReEq on/off. I was not asking about if it is able to meet certain performance specs but more on the subject of engaging THX mode to use THX processing.


Yes that is true, but the processing is also a spec that I think is no longer needed when you use Audyssey, YPAO, Dirac, etc..


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

THX processing changes how the sound is distributed to the speakers by giving a more immersive environment making it sound more like a large theater, Audyssey does not do this. In 5.1 mixes it also up-mixes it to 7.1 if you have the extra two speakers and does a much nicer job than Dolby PLIIx


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

tonyvdb said:


> THX processing changes how the sound is distributed to the speakers by giving a more immersive environment making it sound more like a large theater, Audyssey does not do this. In 5.1 mixes it also up-mixes it to 7.1 if you have the extra two speakers and does a much nicer job than Dolby PLIIx


I've always been on the fence in using THX Cinema because it seems the sound disappears if it makes any sense. Like it is less bright. I'm sure that's the intent though. 


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Yes, it does roll off the highs slightly but that is the intent as it makes the soundtrack seem less concentrated to one speaker thus filling the room better. THX recommends only using it in larger rooms (over 3000cuft) I think.
I think its also dependent on the speakers your using as they must meet THX standards.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

tonyvdb said:


> Yes, it does roll off the highs slightly but that is the intent as it makes the soundtrack seem less concentrated to one speaker thus filling the room better. THX recommends only using it in larger rooms (over 3000cuft) I think.
> I think its also dependent on the speakers your using as they must meet THX standards.


If I use Cinema and not Ultra because my set up is 5.2 is Cinema compatible with a 5100cf room or for a room the size of mine do I need Ultra?


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Here:
http://www.thx.com/consumer/home-en...ter/thx-certification-performance-categories/


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

tonyvdb said:


> Here:
> http://www.thx.com/consumer/home-en...ter/thx-certification-performance-categories/


Thanks based on the info you provided if its Ultra for 3000 cf in size Cinema/Ultra should work. In my case 5100cf or so that's a game changer for THX Ultra exceeding the 3000cf. At the same time the seating distance plays a role so Cinema should work with the 5100cf since I sit roughly 13ft from the screen.


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## Dolus (Jul 31, 2013)

http://hometheaterhifi.com/volume_13_1/feature-article-thx-1-2006-part-1.html
This is a good but long explanation about all things THX.


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## Blacklightning (Nov 22, 2011)

I myself have an old THX AVR and I can tell you that I did use the THX button with my THX DVD's from time to time. But the more I know about Audio the less I use it.


> THX Certified AV receivers and pre-amplifiers feature a number of proprietary technologies, all designed to accurately present movie, music and game soundtracks in the home.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My AVR does this and the logic of the above sounds spot on but today's sound tracks are re-mastered for home use. We no longer get the straight to home (Cinema mix). This feature is useless now.



> Timbre Matching
> Your ears hear different tonal qualities in sounds coming from different directions. Timbre Matching restores the frequency balance between your front and surround speakers—ensuring seamless and smooth panning between the front to back of the room.


My AVR does not have this but I do not get the logic of this. A plane or any object flying around you in real life produces the same sound and your ears/brain hear a different sound because things like your head and the shape of your ears change the sound. I would want an AVR to make the same sound all the way around you so it sounds like real life. I think it would sound artifital if the sound of an object sounded the same coming from in front as it did from behind.



> Boundary Gain Compensation (BGC)
> Sitting near a wall may result in distorted bass response. BGC corrects the way low frequency sound is perceived when seated near a wall. This results in a more true and accurate bass response.


My AVR does not have this but I think this is useless. THX has no idea what your room setup is, how would they know what to do with the curve. :rant:



> Adaptive Decorrelation
> Adaptive Decorrelation changes one surround channel’s time and phase relationship with respect to the other surround channel, expanding the listening position and creating the same spacious audio experience at home as in a movie theater.


Somewhat useless. I have seen/heard about this "trick" back in the day. Switch the (-) and (+) on one of your side speakers and your get a wider sound but it just creates other problems. This was used for 5.1 systems.

All in all I think THX is very old school and should not be taking into account for anything but a nice sticker.


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## primetimeguy (Jun 3, 2006)

I still much prefer the THX Cinema mode (with Re-Eq off) for movies. It gives you the large theater venue feeling compared to the basic mix.


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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

primetimeguy said:


> I still much prefer the THX Cinema mode (with Re-Eq off) for movies. It gives you the large theater venue feeling compared to the basic mix.


My Yamaha AVP has the same effects IMO with their different DSPs.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

I have noticed with Deadpool for example being a modern movie THX on or off sounds the same. 
THX must be a thing of the past for older movies as others have mentioned. A nice badge though 

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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

asere said:


> I have noticed with Deadpool for example being a modern movie THX on or off sounds the same.
> THX must be a thing of the past for older movies as others have mentioned. A nice badge though
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


It doesn't hurt to have it, as it does make the manufacturer meet requirements to get the Logo.


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## primetimeguy (Jun 3, 2006)

asere said:


> I have noticed with Deadpool for example being a modern movie THX on or off sounds the same.
> THX must be a thing of the past for older movies as others have mentioned. A nice badge though
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


Or your hearing is just going if you can't hear the high frequency roll-off.


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

primetimeguy said:


> Or your hearing is just going if you can't hear the high frequency roll-off.


I can hear it but not on all movies. 

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## primetimeguy (Jun 3, 2006)

asere said:


> I can hear it but not on all movies.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


Interesting, I wonder why that is. A 4db drop in treble is always there when it is on. 

Oh well, use when and if you want and only if you like it.


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

I do not claim to be a THX expert. From what I know of it and have heard of it, it seems to be beneficial mainly to those whose audio systems and rooms are not finely tuned. With a well-treated room and well-tuned system, it would be detrimental to frequency response and to soundstage and imaging. That said, personal preference always rules. If you like it, use it.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

For me, sound modes and sound shaping modes have never been useful. Re-EQ could have potential in the right room I guess. On my onkyo I've never liked the thx modes. Just always sounded off. When I bought it, the THX part that I cared about was the power and output capabilities. The 808 has bench tested very well for a receiver. I would say nowadays the THX badge doesn't hold the same meaning .


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

I may be all-wet, but I believe the THX moniker was adopted by some as a mere marketing gimmick. Having the THX logo emblazoned on equipment faceplates imparts a sense of exclusivity that can influence buying decisions. A company may pay have to pay more for licensing rights and additional engineering costs to modify their designs, but the bottom line cost can be weighed against traditional advertising necessary to penetrate the market to a similar level. And it never hurts to perpetuate the spec wars, does it?


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

Lumen said:


> I may be all-wet, but I believe the THX moniker was adopted by some as a mere marketing gimmick. Having the THX logo emblazoned on equipment faceplates imparts a sense of exclusivity that can influence buying decisions. A company may pay have to pay more for licensing rights and additional engineering costs to modify their designs, but the bottom line cost can be weighed against traditional advertising necessary to penetrate the market to a similar level. And it never hurts to perpetuate the spec wars, does it?


Like in Onkyo's case. In this day and time they should have saved by dropping the THX badge and kept the Audyssey instead.

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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

asere said:


> Like in Onkyo's case. In this day and time they should have saved by dropping the THX badge and kept the Audyssey instead.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


I agree. When I first purchased my Onkyo I used THX Cinema mode. The more I listened to it the less I liked it. I would much rather hear the movie as the director intended.


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## primetimeguy (Jun 3, 2006)

JBrax said:


> I agree. When I first purchased my Onkyo I used THX Cinema mode. The more I listened to it the less I liked it. I would much rather hear the movie as the director intended.


Except your environment at home is very different than the mix stage environment.


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

primetimeguy said:


> Except your environment at home is very different than the mix stage environment.


I understand it's a completely different environment. To some they may find it pleasing to the ears. At one time I was among that crowd. After spending more time tinkering and reading I decided I didn't want the highs rolled off. In the end it sounded better to my ears in my room.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

It is a different environment. That's why there is a "mode" in the first place. To better recreate the vision of intent. I've never liked thx modes and again, the main thing for me was that the receiver stayed closer to rated power specs. 


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## asere (Dec 7, 2011)

the main thing for me was that the receiver stayed closer to rated power specs. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]

Do you think the THX badge is really legit or another gimmick? Other receivers don't have it yet the amp meets or exceeds THX standards.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

asere said:


> the main thing for me was that the receiver stayed closer to rated power specs.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Do you think the THX badge is really legit or another gimmick? Other receivers don't have it yet the amp meets or exceeds THX standards.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]



At the time that I bought mine, the thx logo seemed like the only thing that kept it close to specs. On bench testing, most avr's would drop quite significantly when pushed to the limits. In MY experience, I don't agree that most avr's hold their ratings very well. 
Thx logo? I don't think it means as much today as it did then. I wouldn't say it means nothing but I guess I wouldn't let it be the deal maker/breaker, as long as it benched good. 


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

asere said:


> the main thing for me was that the receiver stayed closer to rated power specs.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Do you think the THX badge is really legit or another gimmick? Other receivers don't have it yet the amp meets or exceeds THX standards.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]

At one time the THX logo had some validity. Not saying it's worthless but that badge isn't free and that cost is passed onto the consumer. Had Onkyo invested that money into better HDMI boards maybe it would still be in my rack.


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## primetimeguy (Jun 3, 2006)

JBrax said:


> I understand it's a completely different environment. To some they may find it pleasing to the ears. At one time I was among that crowd. After spending more time tinkering and reading I decided I didn't want the highs rolled off. In the end it sounded better to my ears in my room.


I use the cinema mode but turn off re-eq.


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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

JBrax said:


> Do you think the THX badge is really legit or another gimmick? Other receivers don't have it yet the amp meets or exceeds THX standards.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


At one time the THX logo had some validity. Not saying it's worthless but that badge isn't free and that cost is passed onto the consumer. Had Onkyo invested that money into better HDMI boards maybe it would still be in my rack.[/QUOTE]

It def cost money to have the equipment display the badge, and the equipment I believe also had to pass tests, but sadly I don't think reliability was one of them. Was it worth it? It def was an easy way to find out if the equipment met the THX specs or not from verified testing. This by no means meant that the THX Equipment was better performing than other brands...just that they paid the fees, and had the equipment tested in hope that people would pay more for the badging. I think it was a good idea, and I believe it set a standard for other brands of equipment to increase their performance to compete with THX.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Although I agree that some of the THX certification levels are meaningless there was some validaty to the higher level tests such as THX ultra 2. When I was going through many bench tests of different brands of receivers back a few years ago it was clear that the THX certified receivers did preform better, even the ones with only the select level receivers got better results than ones without that fell in the same price range. 
One surprising thing I noticed was that Sony receivers preformed aweful across the board compared to the same price range receivers. There were even some Denon, Yamaha, Marantz and Pioneer that were poor performers.
So to say that the THX process is meaningless may be a little premature.


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

Again, not saying they're meaningless tests. What I'm saying is had Onkyo invested more into quality HDMI boards and less into badging maybe public perception is different. To be honest my priorities in what I expect from my AVR have changed. I value sound, reliability, and high quality internal parts over WPC and power supplies. I let my Emotiva do the heavy lifting now anyway.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

Ok Jeff. I've got one. How do know the hdmi failure was cheap boards vs a design flaw?


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

willis7469 said:


> Ok Jeff. I've got one. How do know the hdmi failure was cheap boards vs a design flaw?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I would categorize it as a combination of both. From the research I've gathered Onkyo used caps that weren't able to withstand the heat created inside the AVR. To make matters worse the warranty fix is using the same inferior parts so failures are happening again. My Brother in law has had the warranty work done and has had the failure again. Onkyo will no longer return his calls or respond to his emails. They have forever lost my business because of this.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

I was lucky I guess. Mine was fixed about three years ago and is still good. I've always heard their cs was terrible but was amazed when they pulled through. I will search elsewhere in the future too. I just thought I'd throw the question. 


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

willis7469 said:


> I was lucky I guess. Mine was fixed about three years ago and is still good. I've always heard their cs was terrible but was amazed when they pulled through. I will search elsewhere in the future too. I just thought I'd throw the question.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I understand things can happen and electronics break. Then Onkyo stepped up and extended warranties for the known issue and I thought well now that's impressive. One day out of the blue my B.I.L. calls me and says his Onkyo is doing the exact same thing but they told him sorry there's nothing we can do for you. He tried to escalate and Onkyo won't even respond now. So to me the fix was actually a PR fix and not an actual fix. His failed for the second time in 14 months and yes it's well ventilated. I contacted Onkyo about mine but also inquired as to what the process was for another failure in a short period. Let's just say I was given a very poor response.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

I'm surprised they won't respond. Even just to say, sorry Charlie. Fwiw my friend had a Marantz with an hdmi board failure. A4L warrantied it but it failed again and marantz sent him a refurb. 
I still think the thx thing is less important now than it was before, but at the time when it mattered to me, as Tony and I mentioned before, it seemed to hold merit in that non thx certified avr's just didn't hold to the power specs. That used to make a big difference since my space is huge and needs power.(and people shouldn't be misled) Nowadays I don't care as much since I have external amplification and adding more external power is much less expensive then buying an avr that benches well. The thx sound modes are useless to me except re-EQ which can tame brightness in a smaller room. 


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## JBrax (Oct 13, 2011)

willis7469 said:


> I'm surprised they won't respond. Even just to say, sorry Charlie. Fwiw my friend had a Marantz with an hdmi board failure. A4L warrantied it but it failed again and marantz sent him a refurb.
> I still think the thx thing is less important now than it was before, but at the time when it mattered to me, as Tony and I mentioned before, it seemed to hold merit in that non thx certified avr's just didn't hold to the power specs. That used to make a big difference since my space is huge and needs power.(and people shouldn't be misled) Nowadays I don't care as much since I have external amplification and adding more external power is much less expensive then buying an avr that benches well. The thx sound modes are useless to me except re-EQ which can tame brightness in a smaller room.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


They did respond with sorry nothing we can do for you. It was then, when he tried to escalate the matter up the chain of command he was ingnored. As to the THX certification like you I don't have any need for it. I'd much rather see that money invested into Q/C, Audyssey, or maybe better internal DAC's.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

JBrax said:


> They did respond with sorry nothing we can do for you. It was then, when he tried to escalate the matter up the chain of command he was ingnored. As to the THX certification like you I don't have any need for it. I'd much rather see that money invested into Q/C, Audyysey, or maybe better internal DAC's.




Or Dirac? I'm kinda mad they dumped audyssey but haven't heard accueq. Maybe Wayne M should test it. Hmmmmm........... Lol


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