# 720p or 1080p



## Rhuarc (Feb 5, 2010)

H


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## Guest (May 13, 2010)

1080P. Not that 720 doesn't/can't look nice, but they are fading away. What once cost a ton is now 2K and under. 1080P is now an affordable standard and it would be foolish to go backwards at this point.


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## chadnliz (Feb 12, 2010)

If your on a budget get a used 720p or even a clearance unit, I just found a Sony and a Panasonic 720p model and bought both for under $500 for friends wanting to get into the game. Its not a step backwards if its your first step, if you have the cash get 1080, if not go 720 because either way you will be all smiles. I go 1080 simply because I got a deal I couldnt pass up but was equally happy with 720, well the 1080 is just better all around so thats not true but it has zero to do with 1080.
I challenge most to tell me what is 720 and what is 1080 when they see it, so dont think its night and day difference because its simply not the case.


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## Guest (May 13, 2010)

Where did you find such great deals? Ya, 720p can be underrated, but if you want to take full advantage of 1080p and 24 fps (some can do 2.35:1 zoom), those prices have come WAY down. I'm having trouble finding the owners manual online for the Mitsu HC3800, but I've read/heard that it too can zoom out the bars for 2.35:1 and its on sale for 1200ish right now. I have to save a few more pennies and finish some more audio stuff this year, but I'm hoping to be able to snag something like the Mitsu or Panny.


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## chadnliz (Feb 12, 2010)

Oh I use Audiogon and Videogon only for my purchase ideas. I got those 2 units for $500 and hooked up friends new to Projectors, a month or two ago I got a Sony VPL100 "Ruby" with 180 hrs on it for $750, not bad for a 3 yr old $10,000 unit........1080p to boot and it looks amazing besting my Mitsubishi 6500 1080p that is all but brand new, only 75 hours on it. 
Scout deals marked "OBO" and hit them when they have been up a couple weeks to catch folks who are fed up and just want to get rid of it. In 2 months I boughr 3 units with a MSRP of $15500 for $750, all have under 500 hours so the deals are out there if your patient.


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## Spuddy (Jan 2, 2010)

Check out eBay and you'll see 1080p projectors that are dirt cheap- I got mine for $280 shipped because it had no HDMI port, but all I had to do was get an HDFury3 VGA-HDMI converter for $300, and now I have an amazing 1080p picture for under $600  Just make sure the listed projector can do SXGA video and has a VGA port, and it should work incredibly for the price (mine was $2,900 when new in 2002, I got it for $280)


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## SteveCallas (Apr 29, 2006)

I agree with Generic, 1080p is the standard, no reason not to go 1080p.


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## lcaillo (May 2, 2006)

But 1080p is not really a standard. It is accepted as a defacto standard by many, but for many applications it just is not a large benefit. With respect to projectors, the difference is easier to see as you get to large sizes, but as pointed out above there are still some 720p projectors out there that look great as long as you don't use too large a screen and sit too close.

Many projectors, players, and processors are quite good at scaling these days, making the native resolution more a matter of being able to see the matrix. The Panasonics are particularly good across most of their products.

Of course it is preferable to have the capability to do 1080p and 24fps, and the projectors have come down in price, but saying that 1080p is the standard is simply incorrect and can be misleading. Chadnliz is a perfect example of how people can get everything they need from a 720p projector. We have lots of clients out there still using them who are happy with them after years of seeing the prices drop on 1080p products. I service systems with them all the time that look great compared to newer ones. Proper setup, environment, screen selection, and calibration can all make a good 720p projector look better than a poorly done 1080p system.


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## SteveCallas (Apr 29, 2006)

You didn't provide one compelling reason to go 720p vs 1080p :dontknow:

1080 is the standard assuming you want to be able to display all of the picture information on a blu ray, hd dvd, many video games, or certain hd programs (basically 70%+ hd media).


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

Spuddy said:


> Check out eBay and you'll see 1080p projectors that are dirt cheap- I got mine for $280 shipped because it had no HDMI port, but all I had to do was get an HDFury3 VGA-HDMI converter for $300, and now I have an amazing 1080p picture for under $600  Just make sure the listed projector can do SXGA video and has a VGA port, and it should work incredibly for the price (mine was $2,900 when new in 2002, I got it for $280)


It's not a native 1080p projector. Not that it would look terrible since the video master is what determines quality, but still you can't get a true 1080p projector for 300 bucks. 

I suggest you get a Sanyo PLV-z60. It's an excellent 720p model and will save you a bundle. The video master has a lot more to do with quality than even the projector in my experience. Not saying 1080p isn't nicer, but for most people my tv is better than any of the others they've seen. I imagine this is because most people perceive size as the main ingredient in great movie watching.


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## Guest (May 15, 2010)

lcaillo said:


> But 1080p is not really a standard. It is accepted as a defacto standard by many, but for many applications it just is not a large benefit. With respect to projectors, the difference is easier to see as you get to large sizes, but as pointed out above there are still some 720p projectors out there that look great as long as you don't use too large a screen and sit too close.
> 
> Many projectors, players, and processors are quite good at scaling these days, making the native resolution more a matter of being able to see the matrix. The Panasonics are particularly good across most of their products.
> 
> Of course it is preferable to have the capability to do 1080p and 24fps, and the projectors have come down in price, but saying that 1080p is the standard is simply incorrect and can be misleading. Chadnliz is a perfect example of how people can get everything they need from a 720p projector. We have lots of clients out there still using them who are happy with them after years of seeing the prices drop on 1080p products. I service systems with them all the time that look great compared to newer ones. Proper setup, environment, screen selection, and calibration can all make a good 720p projector look better than a poorly done 1080p system.


I guess a standard can be subjective. 1080p is the standard for blu-ray and the 720p stuff is fading off the available products. When everything is moving to 1080p, then doesn't the market set the standards? Just because 720P can look great, doesn't mean that it isn't already getting dated. Next year, their might not be any 720p stuff on the market.

I guess if someone doesn't care about 1080p and 24fps, then going used or finding a sale would be the way to go.


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

SteveCallas said:


> You didn't provide one compelling reason to go 720p vs 1080p :dontknow:
> 
> 1080 is the standard assuming you want to be able to display all of the picture information on a blu ray, hd dvd, many video games, or certain hd programs (basically 70%+ hd media).


Because over the course of 30 years he could have 90k instead of a bunch of dead outdated projectors. Consider that a comparable 1080p projector to the Sanyo PLV-z60 is around 2k. That's 1300 bucks more than the Sanyo street price. This means you can upgrade your projector sooner because you saved money. Not to mention the return you can get for investing the difference. With the average 10 percent rate of return over time you'd have 1730 in 3 years. 

Accumulate this over the course of 30 years saving 433.33 of the cost of the tv over time investing it. And in 30 years you'd have over 90k. :T

I think that's the most compelling argument.


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## lcaillo (May 2, 2006)

SteveCallas said:


> You didn't provide one compelling reason to go 720p vs 1080p :dontknow:
> 
> 1080 is the standard assuming you want to be able to display all of the picture information on a blu ray, hd dvd, many video games, or certain hd programs (basically 70%+ hd media).


The compelling reason would be to save some money if you were using a small enough screen size or a long enough viewing distance that the difference was not meaningful. Chadnliz is an example of someone who is perfectly happy with this situation. It may not be what you nor I would consider ideal, but it may be a very acceptable solution to many. All of the picture information may well be displayed by a 720 system, even on a blu ray in the context of an environment where one is viewing the image on a small enough screen from a distance so that the added information provided by the greater resolution is not useful.

1080p is not a standard. It is one resolution that is becoming the most common for display purposes and for blu ray, true enough. It is in common use. If you talk about standards you need to define the context so that people are not mislead with respect to whether it is required or not for their particular application. Choice among options and the meaningfulness of the difference are subjective matters. Standards are established by organizations such as ITU, ATSC, SMPTE, NIST, or EBU and are not subjective. 

Context matters a great deal in making decisions of this sort.


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## SteveCallas (Apr 29, 2006)

lsiberian said:


> This means you can upgrade your projector sooner because you saved money.


Upgrade it to what? A 1080p projector. Just get it to begin with and now you aren't doing any upgrades until the next resolution increase.



lcaillo said:


> The compelling reason would be to save some money if you were using a small enough screen size or a long enough viewing distance that the difference was not meaningful


Within a certain type of technology and a certain brand's models, how much are we even talking about? I'm seeing projectors from BenQ, Epson, Optoma, and Panasonic where the 1080p model of a line is within a few hundred dollars of the 720p model. 

I'm not saying someone can't be hapy with 720p, I'm sure plenty of people are. I'm sure there are also people satisfied with their 480i television sets. The thing is the industry has moved up to 1080p, and if you are going to sink a grand or two into a projector today, you may as well spend an extra few hundred dollars to have the ability to display what most HD media is in or is moving to.


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## lcaillo (May 2, 2006)

Read Chad's posts, Steve. He has bought several nice projectors for under $500. I have seen them for well under that price as well. We don't disagree on the value of going 1080p, but it may not be the choice that some have that want to get into a projector cheap. If one is going to use a relatively small screen at a distance, the difference is very hard to determine anyway.


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## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

SteveCallas said:


> Upgrade it to what? A 1080p projector. Just get it to begin with and now you aren't doing any upgrades until the next resolution increase.
> 
> 
> Within a certain type of technology and a certain brand's models, how much are we even talking about? I'm seeing projectors from BenQ, Epson, Optoma, and Panasonic where the 1080p model of a line is within a few hundred dollars of the 720p model.
> ...


A 720p set only costs 700 bucks while a comparable 1080p set costs at least 1500. I don't think the increased resolution is a big enough deal to justify the excess cost. I'd rather spend the extra on my audio system.


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## Spuddy (Jan 2, 2010)

lsiberian said:


> It's not a native 1080p projector. Not that it would look terrible since the video master is what determines quality, but still you can't get a true 1080p projector for 300 bucks.
> 
> I suggest you get a Sanyo PLV-z60. It's an excellent 720p model and will save you a bundle. The video master has a lot more to do with quality than even the projector in my experience. Not saying 1080p isn't nicer, but for most people my tv is better than any of the others they've seen. I imagine this is because most people perceive size as the main ingredient in great movie watching.


My Blu Ray player says it is transmitting a 1080p signal, and regardless of whatever the technical jargon is over the specifics, I have a 110" picture that blows away any significantly smaller 1080i picture I've ever seen- They aren't even in the same league. 720p would be a downgrade in my situation (especially with the screen size and my 20/10 eyesight) and besides that, I'm not even in the market; I just mentioned how it'd be worth looking into getting a used SXGA projector on eBay to couple with a HDFury 3 because I got some great results for $600 that way


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## Guest (May 22, 2010)

chadnliz said:


> Oh I use Audiogon and Videogon only for my purchase ideas. I got those 2 units for $500 and hooked up friends new to Projectors, a month or two ago I got a Sony VPL100 "Ruby" with 180 hrs on it for $750, not bad for a 3 yr old $10,000 unit........1080p to boot and it looks amazing besting my Mitsubishi 6500 1080p that is all but brand new, only 75 hours on it.
> Scout deals marked "OBO" and hit them when they have been up a couple weeks to catch folks who are fed up and just want to get rid of it. In 2 months I boughr 3 units with a MSRP of $15500 for $750, all have under 500 hours so the deals are out there if your patient.


I've checked out some of the deals, and some of them look good. I got a newb question though. Does HDCP only have one version? A lot of the used projectors are DVI and I was wondering if blu-ray updates can ever bypass the first version of HDCP where a HDMI to DVI cable can't work with the latest and newest movies? Another way of asking is, with all the updated versions to HDMI and 1.4 on the horizon, do they all use the same HDCP as DVI did? Is the content protection the same version and standard that was on the very first DVI displays and can it every change?


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