# Emotiva or Marantz Pre/Pro?



## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

I'm looking to upgrade my pre/pro to either the Emotiva UMC-1 or the Marantz AV7005. The UMC-1 seems too good to be true at only $700, less than half of the Marantz that sells for $1500. The Marantz appears to be a great pre/pro as well at that price. I already have a DVDO Edge that handles my audio/video processing but I would consider selling it if the new pre/pro handled that task adequately. Anybody have any thought on either of these pre/pros?
Thanks


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
That is a tough call and all I can say is you cannot go wrong with either. I would also look at the Integra 9.8, 9.9, 80.1, 80.2, and 40.2 SSP's as well.

Another choice is the Denon AVR-4311 which offers a Preamp Only Mode where the Amplifiers are completely shut off and it offers Audyssey MultEQ XT32 which is the latest Audyssey release and is incredible.

I am personally a huge fan of Audyssey which would sway me towards the Marantz, Onkyo, or Denon, but that is just me I suppose.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Tufelhundin (Jan 25, 2010)

I have a friend who just got a Rotel RMB-1095 to power his MTS in place of his NR-807, and we were talking about him getting an AVR as a Pre with XT32 so of course the NR3008 came up....but I brought up the Marantz 7005 and both agreed, that at this time it probably would be better to wait to see if they were going to up the ante with XT32 in their new Series/Model.

Another added bonus for him is that the Marantz is not near as deep. We are both Audy fans as well.


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

The Marantz uses Audyssey, but do they use the new MultEQ XT32?


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## Tufelhundin (Jan 25, 2010)

Gregavi said:


> The Marantz uses Audyssey, but do they use the new MultEQ XT32?


As of right now the 7005 has MultEQ-XT, I love XT but also note that I have an ASEQ as well, so at this time if I had an external amp and didnt have the 1007 and had a depth issue I would jump on the 7005. On the other hand if I didnt have the depth issue then the Onk 3008 would be very, very hard to pass up as a pre.


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## Kevin_Wadsworth (Apr 25, 2007)

I don't have experience with the Marantz, but I jumped ship from the UMC-1 to the Onkyo 1007 and have been very happy with the switch. I've had zero bugs with the Onkyo (after having several with the UMC) and I really like having MultEQ-XT.


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## Anthony (Oct 5, 2006)

Happy Marantz owner for years. Like the UMC, but heard too many buggy stories about it. I've been debating upgrading and always seem to gravitate towards either the Onkyo/Integra or the Marantz offerings.


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## 86eldel68-deactivated (Nov 30, 2010)

+1 to Marantz and Denon.

Aside from its price-point-based limitations (the inability to decode lossless audio AND apply Audyssey EQ-ing; "regular" Audyssey instead of XT; etc.), my Marantz SR6003 has been a terrific and reliable receiver and - once I picked up an Emotiva UPA-5 amp - pre/pro for the past two years.

My buddy's Denon AVR-4310 is a sweet piece of kit, and he's been very happy with its capabilities and reliability since he bought it about a year ago. (He currently has it paired with an Emotiva XPA-3.)


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

At the Audyssey website they list the products that have MultEQ XT32, including the Marantz SR6005. Does anybody know if the SR6005 can be used as a Pre/Pro (Bypassing the Amp section) Like the Denon AVR-4311 supposedly does? Or even better, use it as a Pre/Pro and, at the same time, use a couple of the amp channels to power some extra surround speakers. I know there are, or where, some A/Vs on the market that could do that.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Gregavi said:


> A Does anybody know if the SR6005 can be used as a Pre/Pro (Bypassing the Amp section) Like the Denon AVR-4311 supposedly does? Or even better, use it as a Pre/Pro and, at the same time, use a couple of the amp channels to power some extra surround speakers. I know there are, or where, some A/Vs on the market that could do that.


All Receivers with pre outs will allow you to use the pre outs at the same time as using the internal amps, turning off the amps is fairly rare and I think the Denon 4311 is only one of a few that do this.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Gregavi said:


> At the Audyssey website they list the products that have MultEQ XT32, including the Marantz SR6005. Does anybody know if the SR6005 can be used as a Pre/Pro (Bypassing the Amp section) Like the Denon AVR-4311 supposedly does? Or even better, use it as a Pre/Pro and, at the same time, use a couple of the amp channels to power some extra surround speakers. I know there are, or where, some A/Vs on the market that could do that.


Hello,
I do not believe that the 6005 offers XT32 as the upper level 7005 uses MultEQ XT as opposed to XT32. Actually, I believe the 6005 offers just MultEQ and not even XT.

I do think the 4311 would make for a better Prepro as it offers XT32 and Networking Capabilities. And again would give serious consideration to Onkyo/Integra as well.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

So I assume the 6005 has pre-outs. My old Marantz 7000 that I use in my Living Room does.

I guess receiver technology has changed since I last bought one. It used to be, when using the Pre-Outs, that cut off the amp section and it became a true preamp. It makes sense that you now don't have to waste the amps in the A/V if you choose to use a power amp within the system, which I do. I don't really need more amps since my power amp is a 5 channel and I run a 5.1 system with a powered sub, but with extra amps I could bi-amp my main speakers and use the A/V amps to run the rear, and even add some side speakers and do a 7.1 system.

I love/hate it when I have too many options.


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

My mistake. The 6005 does not have XT32 but only MultEQ, so 2 generations behind.


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## digital desire (Dec 17, 2006)

I am considering this instead of the emotiva product.
http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...7ch-3-D-Home-Theater-Surround-Receiver/1.html
Also, the pioneer 1120, the yamaha 800, etc. All at the same price point. The marrantz is appealing due to 7.1 inputs also, which would let me buy a sacd player.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
The Marantz would be a fine choice. I would also check out Dakmart for Refurbished Denon AVR's as well. Getting an AVR/SSP with MultEQ XT and Network Capability is really quite handy.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

I would go with the Denon or Marantz do partially to being a fan but mostly do to the features they both pack compared to the Emotiva.:T


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

I love marantz. I think they have the most attractive chassis' out there.

Yes.... I buy my electronics 50% based on the looks.


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

GranteedEV said:


> I love marantz. I think they have the most attractive chassis' out there.
> 
> Yes.... I buy my electronics 50% based on the looks.


I'm not sure if thats a good or bad thing, i just relized that i do the same thing.:rolleyesno:


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

bambino said:


> I'm not sure if thats a good or bad thing, i just relized that i do the same thing.:rolleyesno:


It's a good thing, it means you don't buy it based on how warm and fuzzy the electrical signal got 

But seriously, marantz makes nice products. Quality components, good build quality, and good software. I don't think an AV7005 is the most advanced pre out there (and would sooner get a denon 4311 or yamaha aventage RX-V3000 receiver) but I also think at the price, it's all a person should need. The curvy sides just let you enjoy it even when you're not using it!


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## gdh (Feb 26, 2011)

I can only comment on the UMC-1 as I've owned one since May. I have not had many issues with mine, every firmware upgrade has been a big step fwd. to deal with any issues that ppl were having. That said I was having cc dropouts with my blueray player when I would start a movie or ff/rw and would have to hit tuner or cable etc. input then back to dvd to get cc sound back. The latest firmware (last wknd) has eliminated this and EMO-Q is giving much more accurate distance results for my speakers other than my sub. In all honesty I can see a few more tweaks coming the UMC-1 way over the next few months but on the whole at the current price/performance I have no problems recommending one to friends and family. I am just trying to figure out the lipsync issue that I am having with Sony S570. 
Again I can't comment on any of the other units because I haven't owned one but if anyone has questions about the UMC I'll be glad to answer them. My previous pre/pro was an Acurus.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Does make me question why a company like Emotiva would release a PrePro into the market with so many glitches, I think its good they do get on a bug fix in firmware updates but you would think after the second "fix" that they would have nailed down all the issues. My understanding is that they have released at least 5 updates to fix what i would call magor issues since its release already?


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## Anthony (Oct 5, 2006)

Sadly, that is a symptom of the modern firmware based products (insert any number of things here). Since software is easy/easier to update and changing hardware is a non-starter, companies are more than happy to rush out an inferior product just to get it out quickly and then fix the glitches later.

It has me to the point where I will happily buy the last years (or even older) model that already has a v2 or v3 software release and has been established rather than early adopt.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
On the whole, we have all become Beta Testers on most Hifi Components with Ethernet Connections. With the ability to address issues in the field, it no doubt saves Companies money to spend less on Compliance Testing knowing that the Owners will do the same job for free. Much of the blame lies with HDMI and HDCP. Even some non Networked Components have required CD-R/USB Thumb Drive based Firmware Updates to simply function properly.

Emotiva was brave to release an SSP given their size. Modern HDMI SSP's seem to be a nightmare to ensure that there are not Handshaking issues. Some Brands similar to Emotiva in size have cancelled SSP's that had both been announced and had been heavily Invested into such as Outlaw who cancelled their SSP.

When it comes to AVR/SSP's, the large Multinationals have a major advantage when it comes to R&D and being able to recoup the Licensing Fees for things like Audyssey across a large platform of products and with a Worldwide Network of Distributors.
Cheers,
JJ


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## RayoVac (Dec 13, 2009)

I had a UMC-1 from launch... it was a hot mess. I hated being a beta tester for a product launch that could have been handled a LOT better. (Like Oppo delivers their new products).

Needless to say... I had TONs of issues to the point of un-usable frustration and I sold it.

I know they have made great strides with the firmware upgrades and fixes... but frankly at this point, the product is old tech.

I would be much more inclined to look at the Marantz, New Denon's or Onkyos.


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## GranteedEV (Aug 8, 2010)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> On the whole, we have all become Beta Testers on most Hifi Components with Ethernet Connections. With the ability to address issues in the field, it no doubt saves Companies money to spend less on Compliance Testing knowing that the Owners will do the same job for free. Much of the blame lies with HDMI and HDCP. Even some non Networked Components have required CD-R/USB Thumb Drive based Firmware Updates to simply function properly.
> 
> Emotiva was brave to release an SSP given their size. Modern HDMI SSP's seem to be a nightmare to ensure that there are not Handshaking issues. Some Brands similar to Emotiva in size have cancelled SSP's that had both been announced and had been heavily Invested into such as Outlaw who cancelled their SSP.
> ...


Excellent post. I essentially agree. It's not so much that Emotiva doesn't know how to make a good electronic, but when you can't afford big licensing fees you needs to make your own alternatives and that's not as easy for a smaller company.

I think hardware-wise the UMC-1 is really nice. If its firmware is where it's lacking, it's because it was developed in-house, unlike most of the mass-scale brands who outsource or have huge software engineering divisions.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
HDMI has been a nightmare for the High End. It is just now that Theta is rolling out an HDMI upgrade to their Casablanca Processor that was at the apex of pre HDMI era SSP's. Even Lexicon which is an arm of a much larger Company has been far behind offering up to date SSP's. Krell, Mark Levinson et al have been similarly hurt by HDMI. I have huge respect for Arcam for being able to bring fairly up to date HDMI Components to market while Designing In House. I would imaging that Arcam being Manufactured in Asia accounts for them being able to devote so much to R&D.

It is for all these reasons that I have been using an Onkyo AVR as an SSP even though the rest of my gear costs far more than the AVR that is at the heart of my HT. In truth, I could not be happier with the Onkyos I have used. (875/3007)


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## gdh (Feb 26, 2011)

Do you think hdmi 1.4 will make matters even worse then?


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Not so much worse, but a question of how long 1.4 will be the most current version. Especially with High End SSP's, they need to remain on the market for years for the Component to become profitable.

HDMI 1.3 was there for a good amount of time and was the incarnation of HDMI that I had been waiting for as it offered SACD over HDMI and True HD and DTS HD Bitstreamed to the Processor. 

As I have no interest in 3D, HDMI 1.4 does not interest me in the slightest as there are no Audio advancements with 1.4.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Deane Johnson (Sep 18, 2006)

I had two UMC-1 units and returned both of them. There was always a new problem. Purchased an Marantz AV7005 and it's been a trouble free dream.

I thought I was ready to fight the UMC-1 problems due to the low cost vs. features, but it just wasn't worth the battle. That's unfortunate, because Emotiva is to be applauded for trying to get a feature rich product to the market at such low cost. I also purchased an Emotiva XPA-5 200x5 amp and love it. I won't hesitate to purchase Emotiva products again when appropriate.

If the OP will check the Emotiva forum I think they will get a good feel for what types issues people are experiencing. The issues are fewer now, but it doesn't appear to me they're out of the woods yet.

Conversely, the AV7005 thread on the AVSciences forum has over 4000 posts, and I don't recall any relative to a performance issue. Of course, the AV7005 costs about twice as much, so that may not be a totally fair comparison.

Other than cost, the UMC-1 had a feature I like that the AV7005 doesn't. With Emo-Q, you can override the settings manually if you wish. With Audyssey in the AV7005 you can't, other than crossover frequency. It's pretty much take what Audyssey gives you.


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## nholmes1 (Oct 7, 2010)

I've used/installed both units and if you can swing the extra money for the Marantz I say go for it! It is a better product as it should be for a double the cost. The UMC-1 was a great processor for the money, but I would have rather them charge an extra 200-300 and put that cost towards some licensing, its a good product that has its faults, most of which aren't deal breakers now as much as annoyances.


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## Tufelhundin (Jan 25, 2010)

Kal just happened to have a positive review of the 7005 in Stereophile page 57, if I was looking for a "pre-only" at this time I would jump on it without a doubt. On the other hand I already have the ASEQ so waiting to see if a pre with XT32 was coming in the near future would be pretty mute... 


I checked to see if the article above has already been mentioned...if so, sorry for the repeat.


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

Wow, I didn't expect this much activity from my simple question. Thanks to everyone who replied. Because of all the info I have received here, I am now strongly considering going the receiver route and using it as a Pre/Pro. Since I already have a great 5 channel power amp, it gives me the option of using the amps in the receiver for something else, like more surround speakers, or Bi-amping my mains, or whatever.

I have another question about video switching in these new generation pre/amps and A/V receivers:

I now use a "DVDO Edge" by Anchor Bay as my "Hub" for all audio and video processing and switching because my 10 year old Parasound 2500u Pre/Pro has very limited video switching, as can be expected from a 10 YO Pre/Pro. The Edge does a very good job of upconverting video and switching A/V sources. Now for my question:

Do the new generation of pre/amps and A/V receivers do as good, the same, or a better job of upconverting and switching as my Edge? 

I noticed some of the Denon receivers use Anchor Bay technology for their video processing. 

The reason I am asking is, if these new units do as good a job in this department (or better), I would sell my Pre/Pro and Edge and put the $ towards the new receiver. 

I'm guessing they do a better job considering how technology improves at an amazing rate.

Thanks in advance.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

I do believe that there is very little processing of the video needed if your using a BluRay player and an HD capable display. Most receivers in the $600 and up range have very decent video upconversion but that is all mute if the source is already 1080p.
The new Onkyo 609 and up receivers are sad to employ a very good video processor and prior Onkyos above the 87x line used the Raon HQV processor said to be the best. The big advantage to using todays Receivers is the audio processing has come leaps and bounds from where it was 4 years ago.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Tony nailed it. The forthcoming 609 is going to use Marvell Processing which is a big step up from the Faroudja previously used. If you own a good number of DVD's and or other non HD Source Material, the quality of the Video Processor is important.

As most TV's have subpar Processing to upsample to the TV's Native Resolution, using an AVR with a quality Processor can truly make a big upgrade as it can send all Source Material to 1080p or whatever the TV's NR is. The Reon is fantastic as well.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

What about 2 channel musical sound quality in comparing these new receivers with my, at the time, top quality Pre/Pro? I just don't want to take a step backward in sound quality.
Thanks


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

If anything you will have better sound as most new receivers have a pure direct mode that turns off all non essential processing.


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

I was considering the forthcoming Onkyo 609 as a pre/pro because of the aforementioned Marvell processing but noticed from a photo of the back of the unit that it only has 1 pre out jacks. I checked out the Onkyo 3008 rear side and it has pre outs for every channel. Does any one know if the 609 will work as a multi channel pre/pro, and if so, how with only 1 pre out jacks. I'm assuming it will not work as a multi channel pre/pro. What would be the purpose of 1 pre out?
Thanks


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

Gregavi said:


> I was considering the forthcoming Onkyo 609 as a pre/pro because of the aforementioned Marvell processing but noticed from a photo of the back of the unit that it only has 1 pre out jacks. I checked out the Onkyo 3008 rear side and it has pre outs for every channel. Does any one know if the 609 will work as a multi channel pre/pro, and if so, how with only 1 pre out jacks. I'm assuming it will not work as a multi channel pre/pro. What would be the purpose of 1 pre out?
> Thanks


One pre out? What is it labeled?


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

No, the 609 does not have pre outs so hooking up external amp/s will not be possible.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
I am guessing that the 609 might have a Multichannel Analog Output which can look identical to Preamp Outputs, but the 600 Series has never offered Preamp Outputs.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Tufelhundin (Jan 25, 2010)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> I am guessing that the 609 might have a Multichannel Analog Output which can look identical to Preamp Outputs, but *the 600 Series has never offered Preamp Outputs*.
> Cheers,
> JJ


Pity too....

6XX Series always have the most options for a budget/beginner system however the lack of pre amp to me is a way they get to sell 2 AVR's instead of one....

I have a 601, I ended up getting a 1007...I wanted pre outs..dont use em, but I have them.:rolleyesno:


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
It is a cruel irony that the AVR's that would always most benefit from the addition of an outboard Amplifier are always the ones lacking Preamp Outputs.

I am really impressed with the forthcoming TX-NR609 offering the Marvell Video Processor and THX Select2 Certification, and now even Network Connectivity. That is going to be a segment buster as I cannot fathom anything near its price offering this combination of Features.

Still lacking are Preamp Outputs and MultEQ. With 2EQ, there is no Processing on the Subwoofer Channel where Audyssey is especially helpful.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

After looking at it again (you can see a detailed photo of the back of the 609 on Amazon) in the "Pre Out' section toward the bottom, there are 2 jacks one above and one below. The bottom one is labeled "Pre Out" and the top one "Sub-Woofer". The "Pre Out" has a different "background" than the "Sub-Woofer" so I assumed it was not affiliated with the Sub-Woofer Out. So there are 2 Subwoofer Outputs. My mistake.

So the search continues. What I'm looking for is, from either Marantz/Denon or Onkyo/Integra in a AVR that has:
Either MultEQ XT or MultEQ XT32 (preferably 32), Marvell or equivalent video processing, Pre Out, some sort of pure direct mode, networking, and at least 6 HDMI inputs with 1 of them in front, all for around $1500. Is that too much to ask for? I think the Onkyo 3008 fits the bill.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
The 3008 fits your criteria to an absolute tee. I could not be happier using a 3007 as an SSP and the 3008 adds XT32.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

The 3008 uses the HQV Reon-VX video processor. The other one I'm considering is the Denon 311 ci, which uses Anchor Bay ABT-2015 video processor. How do these rank against each other and among other video processors? The Denon can be had refurbished for under $700. That's substantially less if the only real difference is XT against XT32. I wouldn't pay an additional $5-600 for just XT32. Any other significant differences?

Thanks so much guys.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
The 3008 does have a stouter Amplifier Section as well and Audyssey DSX. If you are not using any of the Amplifier Channels from the AVR, then perhaps saving the money would be a good call.

Also, Accessories4less has been selling 3007's for around 850-900 Dollars which would somewhat split the difference. Though it too lacks XT32....
JJ


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

I probably will use the amps in the AVR for something, but they are not crucial since I have a very high quality 5 ch. power amp.

I was reading some reviews on the 311ci and some of them were not very impressive. Sounds like they had problems with the network cards along with some other issues. Apparently made in China with cheap parts and labor. Where are the Onkyos made?


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Up until 2008 they were made in Japan but Onkyo moved there operations to Malaysia


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Gregavi said:


> I probably will use the amps in the AVR for something, but they are not crucial since I have a very high quality 5 ch. power amp.
> 
> I was reading some reviews on the 311ci and some of them were not very impressive. Sounds like they had problems with the network cards along with some other issues. Apparently made in China with cheap parts and labor. Where are the Onkyos made?


Hello,
Just to make sure we are on the same page, you are talking about the AVR-3311CI? As far as Network Card failures, it happened primarily on the AVR-3310. I do think Denon has been on a Cost Cutting footing since they were Sold and merged with Marantz, Snell, McIntosh, and a few others. Though Denon charges a premium, I believe the are doing so from past glory when they made rock solid Components.

Onkyos and Integra are now made in Malaysia. So far, there has not been any issues and they have been doing this since the x06 Series so I am not concerned and purchased a 3007. 

I noticed your Amplifier in your Signature, but did not know if you were planning on selling it. The 3008 is simply a much more substantial AVR than the 3311 and weighs 20 Pounds more. In addition, it offers THX Ultra2 Plus Certification and has 3 Power Transformers. It simply looks and feels like a much more expensive AVR than the 3311.
JJ


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

I have no intention of selling my power amp. I love it. Talk about substantial, it weighs in at about 135 lbs. American made. It sounds amazing. It is why I'm not too concerned with the power section of the AVR that I would be using as a SSP. Of course, with the AVRs on the market, the ones that have the features I'm looking for also have relatively high power as well. I was considering buying an actual pre/pro but it cost less to get an AVR with as many, if not more features, plus you get 7 or 9 amps along with it. I'm not sure who would buy a pre/pro unless it's the extreme high end like Linn, Proceed, Krell, Meridian etc.

I did see some complaints about the network cards with the 3310 but there was also 1 or 2 complaints about the network cards in the 3311. That's an indication of cheap parts and/or labor.

I'm leaning toward the Onkyo 3008.


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## Tufelhundin (Jan 25, 2010)

Yummy...a Cinenova owner.:hail:


You running it our of a standard 15 amp or 20? Can you give me some pros/cons that you have experienced with it? Other than weigh & price...but I guess if you figure both you are getting a pretty good deal per lb.

I have always pined for one but dang....maybe one day...just maybe. 

Having the large wooden crate delivered to my house is worth price of admission.:yikes: HA!


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

I'm using a dedicated 20 amp. I was running it on a non dedicated 15 amp for a couple of years with no problem, but when I built my home theater, I wired everything from scratch, so I gave it a dedicated 20A because I could.

It is quite simply the best piece of equipment, audio/video or whatever, I have ever owned. Amazing sound quality, build quality and yes, "The Crate". Still have it. My brother has the newer version with balanced inputs. He doesn't use the balanced yet, but plans to at some point. He loves his too. It is amazingly quiet. Between songs there is nothing but silence. I could go on and on about how great a power amp it is. I have many jealous friends. So, absolutely no cons.
I have seen these on ebay for $1800-2000. Worth every cent. I had a much easier time justifying buying an expensive power amp than an expensive pre/pro. I'm pretty sure I'll keep the Cinenova for the rest of my life. Can't say that about any other piece I currently have, had in the past or will have in the future. I say, you only live once, go for it.

Tufelhundin, how do you like your Onix Rockets? I was sad to see them go under.


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## Tufelhundin (Jan 25, 2010)

I was very sad to see them go as well. I found a speaker I really like and now I will never be able to get any support for them if ever needed. I was hoping that the Co. would keep going "under new management" but no such luck. 

As for the Rockets I really do like them and they are beautiful. I may actually try to get a set of RS850's when I get back to the States. They are easier to drive then my 450's and will be able to fill a larger room a little better. One of the main reasons I went with the Rockets was due to the center channel, it is awesome.

As you can see from my post here on the Shack I'm pro SVS speakers as well, but I have no desire to replace my Rockets but I guess if something was to ever happen to them "mainly" the center then I may go that route as well....another speaker that is hard to drive...hence the reason I was asking about your amp.

I have seen few Cinenova's come across Audiogon still in the "crate" and I keep thinking I may have to just do it one day.

Thanks for the reply.


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## eyecatcher127 (May 9, 2006)

If emotiva had audyssey I would own one. I'm now waiting for Outlaw. However, I would think you should be considering the Onkyo 3008/5008 or the Denon 3311/4311. I had the Marantz 7005 in the mix but I wound up settling for the 3008 as most bang for the buck because I wanted XT32. I'm very pleased with the XT32 as this is my first audyssey unit. Overall performance is very very good. Two channel stereo mode leaves something to be desired on the 3008 for some reason imho, although the thx dolby music mode sounds sweet. It is very awesome for home theater, i've been using audyssey dynamic eq and thx cinema mode. I'm not very impressed with the streaming Internet Radio sound either. Some how pandora sounds awesome via my samsung blu ray, must be the ess sabre dac.
At this price break I'm very curious how the denon would perform, I have a feeling the Marantz may be solid contender doesn't have 32 audyssey, and probably outpeform the others for 2ch audio they both have hd radio, but no thx.


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

eyecatcher127 said:


> Two channel stereo mode leaves something to be desired on the 3008 for some reason imho, although the thx dolby music mode sounds sweet.


I'm surprised you don't find the 2 ch. music mode to be very good. Are you using Direct Mode or Pure Audio Mode when listening to 2 channel? Does THX Music Mode simulate surround from 2 channel material or just duplicate the fronts to the back,... or something else?


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## JimP (May 18, 2006)

eyecatcher127 said:


> If emotiva had audyssey I would own one. ...snip...



I would at least wait until they had a stable product. Would you rather enjoy it or not enjoy it for firmware fixes that may never come around?


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## eyecatcher127 (May 9, 2006)

I have bookshelfs with a sub so direct or pure mode do sound good for 2ch but my speakers aren't full range i can only get the sub working with stereo mode. I find Stereo mode sounds pretty good with Audyssey Dynamic EQ on.


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## gdh (Feb 26, 2011)

It's been a few months since my last post and the UMC-1 has been very good with the latest firmware upgrade. Many are having issues with the upgrade process but once it is done the results are excellent. The Sony 570 has also had its fair share up updates and with turning all auto function off the issues that I had experienced are now a thing of the past. I have no cc dropouts and lipsync is much better. Again I do not have any other prepro to compare it to, I did prefer the stereo sound on my old Acurus pre over the UMC-1. I do however use my old Conrad Johnson and Acoustic Research gear for serious 2 channel listening but that is in my studio when I need to sit back and clear the head. Would I be one to jump in on the new XMC-1 as a beta tester if I didn't have the UMC - that would be a tougher decision as you all have talked about just how good the Maranz is and the price differential btn the XMC is not that big so likely I wouldn't. (That 40% discount is a good mktg. plan though)


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## Warpdrv (Mar 3, 2007)

JimP said:


> I would at least wait until they had a stable product. Would you rather enjoy it or not enjoy it for firmware fixes that may never come around?


I agree 100%

All the hype and nothing but disappointment for way too many people, some people are fan boys and want to endure the pain, but ultimately deserve better. 

I would pick something far more established, and there are many products avail. Marantz, Integra, Anthem !!

Anything with a well established room correction system would be my first choice !


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## Gregavi (Sep 22, 2009)

Warpdrv said:


> I agree 100%
> 
> All the hype and nothing but disappointment for way too many people, some people are fan boys and want to endure the pain, but ultimately deserve better.
> 
> ...


Sure, the other choices are no doubt superior pre/pros, but all of the above are more than twice the cost. The Anthem is 4 times the cost (or more). So I fully understand the attraction to the Emo. A better debate, IMO, would be, what's as good or better than the Emo in it's price range. I don't think there is anything close. Maybe the Outlaw? I don't think it's fair to compare the Emo with the others mentioned. It's like comparing a Miata to a Testarossa.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
My younger brother just received his Marantz AV7005 and is quite impressed though he is an audio snob and remarked his TT Cartridge cost more than the SSP. He had been using a Parasound Halo C1 for years though I had implored him to get an Audyssey MultEQ XT equipped SSP for years. The Marantz is an awesome value and the Reviews have been uniformly positive.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Theresa (Aug 23, 2010)

Anthony said:


> Happy Marantz owner for years. Like the UMC, but heard too many buggy stories about it. I've been debating upgrading and always seem to gravitate towards either the Onkyo/Integra or the Marantz offerings.


Depends on how patient one is with the bugs. I doubt very much that they will ever get the firmware/software in the UMC-1 fixed. The drop out problem is the most annoying. I would either wait for the XMC-1 or get the Marantz, I've often wondered why I didn't do that. Hopefully the XMC-1 will be suitable for prime time given its taken so long to get to market.


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## JimP (May 18, 2006)

Consider their perdicament.

They go ahead and release it and then try to fix the bugs, its a UMC-1 disaster. If they don't release it until they get most if not all of the bugs fixed such as the XMC-1, its late to market. 

Frankly, given the problems with the UMC-1, why would anyone take a chance on the XMC-1 until its proven itself?


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
It really seems HDMI is the worst thing ever to happen to small volume Specialist AV Manufacturers. I too would wait until the water is just right so to speak before purchasing an SSP just released. Especially if the immediate predecessor had many issues with HDMI.
Cheers,
JJ


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## LeeH (Feb 18, 2011)

Maybe I missed it in the seven pages but the Marantz has balanced outputs and the Emotiva does not (while their amps have balanced inputs - which I think is a little odd in itself). 

If you have an amp with balanced connections, wouldn't you want to use them?

Lee


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## Theresa (Aug 23, 2010)

LeeH said:


> Maybe I missed it in the seven pages but the Marantz has balanced outputs and the Emotiva does not (while their amps have balanced inputs - which I think is a little odd in itself).
> 
> If you have an amp with balanced connections, wouldn't you want to use them?
> 
> Lee


The Emo has one balanced output and I only use one pro amp which is for the subs so I use that one with a balanced miniDSP. As for the other amps, its not necessary to use balanced so why bother? My cable runs aren't so long as to need them.

I will take a chance on the XMC-1 because I'll be able to get it at 40% off and I don't have a lot of money.


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## JimP (May 18, 2006)

I don't think the Marantz has fully balanced outputs. Seems like that was asked and answered over at AVS.


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## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

JimP said:


> I don't think the Marantz has fully balanced outputs. Seems like that was asked and answered over at AVS.


This silliness never ends. The outputs are *fully *balanced. It is the internal circuitry which is not fully differential and very, very few are in consumer electronics. In fact, the advantages of the two are different so that the fully balanced output of the Marantz is as capable as that of fully differential devices.


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## Dale Rasco (Apr 11, 2009)

Have you checked into the Integra DHC-40.2?


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## Theresa (Aug 23, 2010)

The Integra is only available from B&M stores and I don't frequent them.


Edison stole all of his so called inventions. He then defended them in court with his deep pockets.


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