# Best LED TV bang for the buck



## alewisdvm

Hello, 
Second post regarding Samsung led. I have been looking at the Samsung 55" 6300 model. It's about $1999 now. Probably drop another few hundred by thanksgiving. Great tv. Just wondering, for an equivalent model, is there anything out there a bit cheaper. 

Also, I don't see much advertised about the 60" model of the 6300 series?

At a viewing distance of 12-13 feet, what do you think?


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## Alan Brown

The imaging scientists and engineers who designed the HDTV system conducted extensive human perceptual factors research to determine the optimum viewing angle for a 1920 x 1080, 1.78:1 aspect ratio screen. Their recommendations are based upon average human visual acuity, and at what distance a certain pixel size starts to become detectable to the viewer. The goal is a smooth, sharp, natural looking image without revealing the component parts of the display. That viewing distance is approximately 1.5 x the diagonal measurement of the screen. This works out to a 30 degree viewing angle. Such a distance is a good starting point for determining what works for any individual viewer, using a particular display technology.

There are differing recommendations quoted by some sources. Frequently, they inappropriately base their opinions on film projection technology. Video is not film and digital video displays cannot be equated to projected film imaging characteristics.

Best regards and beautiful pictures,
Alan Brown, President
CinemaQuest, Inc.
A Lion AV Consultants Affiliate

"Advancing the art and science of electronic imaging"


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## eugovector

Alan's telling you that you should either scoot closer, get abigger TV, or not worrying so much about picture quality because at that distance, it will be hard to see. And if he's not, I am. If your getting into LED because of the energy savings or slim design, I say go for it. Otherwise, get a less expensive LCD or Plasma, and save your money for your cable bill.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## videobruce

1. For all intents and purposes, there is _*no*_ such thing as a "LED" TV. It is a LED _*driven*_ LCD TV.
2. Those thin 'Edge Lit' sets suffer from hot spotting or the 'flashlight effect'. They have lower power consumption than full backllit sets, but at a viewing cost.


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## alewisdvm

So, it sounds like you are saying it may be preferable, and probably at "less" cost to go with a "full" back-lit LG. I may have to anyway for matte finish?

in that case:
Super confused between what a LG5400 offers and I think the LH90. The LH90 is 240hz, but I think is actually "older" than the 5400????


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## eugovector

As said before, LEDs are great for a slim form factor and energy savings. Full backlit-array LCDs (the kind with the LED lights across the entire screen, not just the edges) also offer higher contrast ratios at the expense of panel thickness and the potential for a lit halo effect around bright images on dark backgrounds.

In other words, unless those things are important to you, you could buy a bigger traditional LCD or Plasma.


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## alewisdvm

Okay.
Could you compare these for me:
Super confused between what a LG5400 offers and I think the LH90. The LH90 is 240hz, but I think is actually "older" than the 5400????


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## lsiberian

240hz is a gimmick IMO. Just get a solid TV.


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## videobruce

> LEDs are great for a slim form factor and energy savings.


You can't put "LED's" into one broad category. The "slim form factor" TV's are only the Edge Lit sets. They give you a 'greener' solution, but this comes at another expense other than the purchase price as I stated.

I have read it over and over in many reviews and forums regarding this hot spotting which I thought was somewhat exaggerated, along the the 'soap opera' effect of the faster refresh rate (which is another, separate problem), until I was in a friends home and saw it myself the second the set was turned on with a black background, I was surprised it was that bad.


> the potential for a lit halo effect around bright images on dark backgrounds.


This is a problem with any of the LED back lit sets with "local dimming". Where areas of the LED's are turned off to increase the contrast ratio and give you 'blacker blacks' at this expense (halos).
There is no free ride. Most of this 'stuff' is marketing. :devil:

I'm not 'bashing' LCD's TV's , (I own a 32" for out bedroom), but I would bet 80-90% of the public has no idea these 'problems' exist. They can't see past the 'artsy fartsy' look of hanging a TV on a wall. 


> 240hz is a gimmick IMO.


Thank you.


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## eugovector

Ditto, I'd get whichever one was cheaper, and with a new one, you'd also benefit from an additional year of R&D on a relatively new consumer tech.


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## Alan Brown

Eugovector is correct. At a viewing distance of 12 to 13 feet, you would need a screen approximately eight feet diagonal to enjoy all the detail in a 1080p image. As the screen size gets smaller, less detail will be visible at that distance. I don't recommend any consumer LCD over a plasma unless for a very specific reason that is of higher priority than image fidelity. Consumer LCDs have certain advantages over plasmas, but not when it comes to delivering the best overall picture quality.

Videobruce is also correct. There are LED displays available, but they are extremely bright, very large, and super expensive at HD resolutions. You may have seen them used as outdoor daylight viewable electronic signs, sporting event scoreboards, "jumbo" video displays, etc.


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## eugovector

videobruce said:


> You can't put "LED's" into one broad category. The "slim form factor" TV's are only the Edge Lit sets.


Samsung's 8500 series was full array and only 1.5" thick. Maybe not under an inch like it's edgelit, but still thinner than it traditional LCDs.

Even with Full-array, many LED will be thinner than Traditional LCDs and Plasma.


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## videobruce

The 8500's are this years entry?


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## alewisdvm

Okay...well, bang for your buck then....

Still uncertain on which LG model to go with, regardless of which is back or edge-lit and regardless of 120vs 240?


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## eugovector

Nope, last year. I don't think samsung has a full array this year, but I could be wrong.


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## glaufman

Time for me to learn something...
Marshall, are you saying you think all of Samsung's offerings this year are edge-lit?


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## musicfan

Hello,

My contractor who's doing the audio/video wiring in our new family room is recommending the Samsung 8500 series LED TV mentioned above. I confess that I have only begun to consider which TV, so I'm not completely knowlegable, and am open to any decent option (LED, LCD, Plasma) for a family room 5.1 set up that will be our main viewing location. Is the Samsung 8500 backlit or edgelit? What LED options are the most recommended? 

Thanks, Mike


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## eugovector

Yes, from their web site, it appears that all of Samsung's current gen LED are edgelit. Does anyone see anything to the contrary?


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## eugovector

As previously mentioned, Sam 8500 is full array, not edgelit.


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## videobruce

Someone really needs to change the misleading title of this thread. Just because Samsung is deceptive, doesn't mean it should extend here. These are still LCD TV's.

After all, who else will educate the unsuspecting other than in forums as this?


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## eugovector

It's time to let that one go Bruce. True LED Tvs are years from the market, if ever, so there's really no confusion here. Should these be called "LED-Backlit" instead of just "LED"? Yes, but that marketing ship has sailed.


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## videobruce

> but that marketing ship has sailed.


That doesn't mean it can't sink.


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## alewisdvm

I am dying over this.
I still can't clearly decide. I have seen the Samsung UN55C6300 (although I would be buying the 60") versus the pana 58V10. 

A lot of the viewing would be of cox cable high definition stations, perhaps some netflix once setup, some bluray DVD's.
I have windows directly behind sofa (albeit blinds can be closed).
I have a kitchen to the right of livingroom. Now, there can be lights on in there, and a chandelier about 6 feet to the right of the sofa position. (I can post a pic of that later as well).

I am assuming that 6300 display still looks a bit more appealing because the brightness jumps out at you. It does look good!

i couldn't quite get that appearance out of the V10. Even with contrast at 100% and brightness up to a setting of 65 (which started to gray out picture a bit).

So, excluding whether the picture is more natural or not, I am confused on the better contrast? picture quality of the V10 plasma versus the Samsung 6300.

With my livingroom arrange, which way to go?
Certainly, the Samsung is a 60". But, I think i'll have to drop another $700 to get it over that pana 58V10, unless someone wants to recommend a different plasma for about same price?

help


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## eugovector

Plasma should give you a better picture, but won't be as bright at an LCD based set. If you need brightness, go with LCD/LED.


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## alewisdvm

Thanks Eugo and others for responses.

Any comment on the LG 60Pk550. Got decent reviews and for a 60" is a killer deal?


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## glaufman

All the LGs would have been on my list of Tvs to consider had I not stumbled across a left over Pio Elite at half price when I started shopping. 
As I understand it: LG's have good calibration controls. That's important to me. The higher level offerings from LG include a better filter for better blacks, contrast, and glare. LG recently had at least 1 firmware problem, which they at least said they were going to fix, I'm not sure if they did or not. This is important to me as well as I know of another MFR with something that should've been fixable in firmware that opted not to fix it. 
So at this point you may want to find a good place to view a few sets side by side with identical content in good viewing conditions, to see how that LG compares to plasmas from other MFRs also in your budget. If you choose carefully, you may get lucky and find a place that calibrates their sets, or at least sweet talk the salesperson into handing you the remotes to adjust pictures as well as can be done by eye to get as close to an apples-apples comparison as you can.


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