# REW with Foobar



## skootx (Jun 18, 2014)

I just got REW and a UMIK-1 up and running. I playback FLAC files through Foobar. Is there some way to run REW's test sweep using my EQ settings in Foobar? Or conversely, to download some type of EQ file from REW, based on my measurements, directly into Foobar?

Another setup question- I run digital out directly from my motherboard to an external DAC. How can I calibrate the soundcard?


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

skootx said:


> I just got REW and a UMIK-1 up and running. I playback FLAC files through Foobar. Is there some way to run REW's test sweep using my EQ settings in Foobar?


Not directly. First, are you using an add-on parametric EQ? I use the Yohng VST wrapper and the Reaper ReaEQ plugin (free) with foobar.

Here it gets messy. You can simulate the EQ for REW using a virtual audio cable type software audio device to run REW's output to an audio processing engine like Reaper ($$) or Sonar ($$$$), where the EQ takes place, and you have to set it all manually, then transfer them manually to foobar. I have the setup always in place, only use a few EQ bands, so it's easy for me, tough to set up the first time. I do not recommend it for the faint at heart. I threatened to write this up once, but it would take a full day which I cannot spare right now. It works great but is MESSY! If you decide to try it, good luck.

The easier and superior solution is jRiver Media Center - you can run REW through it (I am pretty sure) but still have to enter filter values manually ( I am pretty sure ).



> Or conversely, to download some type of EQ file from REW, based on my measurements, directly into Foobar?


Not aware of a way to do this.



> Another setup question- I run digital out directly from my motherboard to an external DAC. How can I calibrate the soundcard?


Using UMIK-1 and digital output, there is no need to.


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## jtalden (Mar 12, 2009)

skootx said:


> Is there some way to run REW's test sweep using my EQ settings in Foobar?


The method that AudiocRaver mentioned is apparently being used by several REW users here. It is said to be difficult to set up, but once that is done it works just like any standard REW measurement. I have not tried it but it sounds like it is worth the effort if significant REW measurements are needed. 

I have been using another approach that fits my narrow needs; create an REW sweep file, play it back on Foobar to make the measurement.

This method is also very complicated to setup, probably more so than the 1st method. It also has many limitations as to how it can be used. There is no cost involved however. 

The major limitation is that the REW measurement must be made with the exact same settings as was used to create the sweep file is. My current settings are; 44.1kHz sample rate, 16 bit, 12-20k Hz sweep range, 256k sweep length. If we want to change any of those settings then another file needs to be created. REW loopback timing is not possible using this method.

Briefly: (example steps to create a file)
> Use a soundcard or audio interface that has a line out to line in (loopback cable connection).
> Use Audacity to record an REW sweep. 
> Edit the file in Audacity to place 3 tick sounds spaced at 1s intervals ahead of the recorded sweep.
> Edit the file to stereo with one channel silent (or as desired for the intended usage).
> Export the file as a .wav(Microsoft), Signed 16 bit PCM.
[I still get confused in the detail of the process having only done it a couple of times. These are just the major steps I recall so more detail/guidance may be needed to actually create a working file.]

To use the file just play it in Foobar and start the REW measurement roughly 1/4 to 3/4 seconds after the 3rd tick, just comfortably before the sweep starts. Any Foobar setting of EQ, Convolution, or other effects are applied to the sweep so the resulting measurement will reflect their impact.

If someone wants to test it, attached my
View attachment Right 44k 16bit REW 12-20k Sweep.zip
file. All REW settings must be as noted above for this to work correctly when measuring.

I can also create a sweep file to someone's specification and better detail the steps needed if that would be helpful. If there is a need and HTS desires, I could create a small number if these files with different settings that could be placed in the Forum Downloads Area.

REW also has the option to output a PinkPN noise file that can be played back and used with the REW RTA for SPL measurements. That is a 3rd option. It is the easiest and a very good one if SPL charting is the only need.


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

jtalden:

Beautiful. Thanks for the great idea and approach. I will definitely be putting it to use.


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## skootx (Jun 18, 2014)

Thanks, that file got me started. I ended up with a pretty flat response after tweaking a lot, then played some tunes. It almost sounded like certain frequencies were going up and down in volume, not at all good. I'm probably making stupid beginner mistakes- is there a basic tutorial anywhere for this?


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## jtalden (Mar 12, 2009)

skootx said:


> It almost sounded like certain frequencies were going up and down in volume, not at all good. I'm probably making stupid beginner mistakes- is there a basic tutorial anywhere for this?


Can you be more specific? Basic tutorial for; volume going up and down, REW in general, EQ practices, or ?? Is the problem with the REW measurement or the playback of music files or both? If REW measurements only, is it only when using the file I provided or is it with a normal REW played sweep? Help us to understand the situation.

Volume up and down at certain freqs may not an issue with REW. At least I have not see anyone describe a problem this way. We do want to be sure that there is no feedback occurring from any setting in the computer OS sound device settings. There are numerous cases where this causes measurement problems. 

General comments:
> The REW help has lots of general setup info.
> The forum sticky threads have additional info including a YouTube tutorial. 
> You may want to search for recent posts by EarlK as he has helped with many REW setup problems.
> Search for answers to your questions both on this forum and the web.

Unless you have narrowed it down to REW settings you may want to also web search to find if others are having similar problems with Foobar or the EQ add-in you are using.

In order for more specific advice on a problem we need to understand the problem, the basic hardware in use and the REW settings being used.

Just thoughts in case they help.


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

Skootx:

Beg pardon if I missed this, but what kind of EQ are you using? Parametric EQ? The graphic EQ that is built into foobar? If parametric, what VST plugin are you using?


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## skootx (Jun 18, 2014)

I'm using the graphic EQ built into Foobar. That's where the problem seems to be- right in the 110-400hz range, I needed to boost the EQ for some of those very high, which seems to cause the volume fluctuations, if I can even call it that. It almost sounds like Foobar is clamping down on the frequency after it starts. When I switch Foobar's EQ to less aggressive correction the problem goes away.


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## jtalden (Mar 12, 2009)

Yes, there is some overload happening as a result of the aggressive boost.

All the advice I have ever seen, is to limit the range of EQ boosts/cut. Graphic EQ (GEQ) is best used for gentle shaping of the response. Parametric EQ (PEQ) is needed to better target the specific problems. Even using PEQ I typically limit myself to a 12 dB total range (±6dB). Others may use a significantly wider range, but it is best avoided. There are usually other issues that need attention in that case. REW normally guides us with a good recommendation in the EQ graph panel if we leave the default settings, although I haven't used the GEQ option in the EQ panel. 

We cannot significantly boost nulls so we shouldn't try to EQ those. Some EQ to bring up a broader dip is fine.

If you post a .mdat of your measurements with the EQ filters selected. One of us will offer an opinion and recommendation.

A good reference for some the problems that can occur are offered *here* .


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

There may be some automatic limiting built-in. Often when applying EQ, one needs to reduce the overall signal level somewhat so clipping or limiting will not occur.

A couple of general guidelines. When applying EQ: 
*Less is usually better, think like a minimalist.
*Avoid boosting. If you must, only in small amounts, and only in broad bands, never narrow bands.
*Try to attenuate primarily in broad band terms, use narrow bands sparingly and mainly on low frequency peaks.
*If you do any boosting, reduce overall gain to avoid clipping/limiting.

You might consider adding the Yohng VST Wrapper, and the Reaper ReaPlugs, specifically for their ReaEQ parametric EQ. Both are free. If you are only looking for broad strokes changes, the graphic EQ can be effective. But once you have gotten used to parametric EQ, you will never go back. With ReaEQ you get as many or few bands as you want, and can target your changes more precisely.

Edit: jtalden pretty much covered all this and his post. Thanks.


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## skootx (Jun 18, 2014)

OK, I have the VST wrapper installed in Foobar but I can't figure out how to get ReaEQ working. I copied reaeq.dll to foobar/components but I'm not seeing it in the DSP manager. How do I access ReaEQ from Foobar?


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

I made some notes on that process. Let me clean them up and I will post them shortly.


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## skootx (Jun 18, 2014)

Wow, thanks. I found nothing when searching for it web-wide. Reaper and Foobar would likely welcome that info too.


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

skootx said:


> OK, I have the VST wrapper installed in Foobar but I can't figure out how to get ReaEQ working. I copied reaeq.dll to foobar/components but I'm not seeing it in the DSP manager. How do I access ReaEQ from Foobar?



Copy the unzipped dll to components directory, i.e. *foo_dsp_vstwrap.dll* gets copied to (typically) *C:\Program Files (x86)\foobar2000\components.*
In Foobar2000, open Preferences (Ctrl-P), click on Playback, click on DSP Manager, click on *George Yohng's VST Wrapper* in the right column (Available VSTs) and press the arrow to move it to the left column (Active DSPs).
Install ReaPlugs to c:\Program Files (x86)\VSTPlugins.
Restart Foobar2000.
Click on the grayed-out VST icon in the notifications area, click on VST Setup, Add *C:\Program Files (x86)\VSTPlugins* to the VST Subsystem Configuration box.
Click on the grayed-out VST icon in the notifications area, click on Bypass to UnBypass, if necessary.
Click on the VST icon in the notifications area, click on Use VST Effect, select *reaeq-standalone.*
Click on the VST icon in the notifications area, click on *Show/Hide Plugin Editor* as needed to view the ReaPlugs panel.


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## skootx (Jun 18, 2014)

Thanks! I figured it out and have been playing around with measurements and corrections. . Just listening to tunes now, this is unbelievable! THANK YOU!


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

One bit of annoying detail you run up against is that some filter plugins use Q and some use BW (Bandwidth). A resource which shows the conversion formulas and gives an online conversion calculator and a conversion chart is here.

And here is a copy of their conversion chart:

```
BW in		Filter		BW in		Filter		BW in		Filter		BW in		Filter
octaves	Q		octaves	Q		octaves	Q		octaves	Q
-------	-------	-------	-------	-------	-------	-------	-------
1/80 		115.4 	 1 		1.41 	  	4 		0.267 	7 		0.089
1/60 		86.6 	  	1 1/4 	1.12 	  	4 1/4 	0.242 	7 1/4 	0.082
1/50 		72.1 	  	1 1/3 	1.04 	  	4 1/3 	0.234 	7 1/3 	0.079
1/50 		72.1 	  	1 1/3 	1.04 	  	4 1/3 	0.234 	7 1/3 	0.079
1/40 		57.7 	  	1 1/2 	0.92 	  	4 1/2 	0.220 	7 1/2 	0.075
1/30 		43.3 	  	1 2/3 	0.82 	  	4 2/3 	0.207 	7 2/3 	0.071
1/25 		36.1 	  	1 3/4 	0.78 	  	4 3/4 	0.200 	7 3/4 	0.068
1/20 		28.9 	  	2 		0.67 	  	5 		0.182 	8 		0.063
1/16 		23.1 	  	2 1/4 	0.58 	  	5 1/4 	0.166 	8 1/4 	0.058
1/12 		17.3 	  	2 1/3 	0.56 	  	5 1/3 	0.161 	8 1/3 	0.056
1/10 		14.4 	  	2 1/2 	0.51 	  	5 1/2 	0.152 	8 1/2 	0.053
1/8 		11.5 	  	2 2/3 	0.47 	  	5 2/3 	0.143 	8 2/3 	0.050
1/6     	8.65 	  	2 3/4 	0.45 	  	5 3/4 	0.139 	8 3/4 	0.048
1/5     	7.20 	  	3 		0.40 	  	6 		0.127 	9 		0.044
1/4     	5.76 	  	3 1/4 	0.36 	  	6 1/4 	0.116 	9 1/4 	0.041
1/3     	4.32 	  	3 1/3 	0.35 	  	6 1/3 	0.113 	9 1/3 	0.039
1/2     	2.87 	  	3 1/2 	0.33 	  	6 1/2 	0.106 	9 1/2 	0.037
2/3     	2.14 	  	3 2/3 	0.30 	  	6 2/3 	0.100 	9 2/3 	0.035
3/4     	1.90 	  	3 3/4 	0.29 	  	6 3/4 	0.097 	9 3/4 	0.034
												10	 	0.031
```


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## skootx (Jun 18, 2014)

I'm having an issue now with my reaeq preset not saving. I go through REW measurements, make my tweaks to my reaeq file, save it with a unique name and continue. The next time I load that preset, none of my previous adjustments are there- just the default 4 bands.


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

skootx said:


> I'm having an issue now with my reaeq preset not saving. I go through REW measurements, make my tweaks to my reaeq file, save it with a unique name and continue. The next time I load that preset, none of my previous adjustments are there- just the default 4 bands.


Interesting. I have not tried to do what you are doing. It would be nice to get figured out.

It almost sounds like something about the file format changes when you add the preset and save, so it is not recognized as a valid preset file. Then the plugin re-creates the default preset file. Maybe the end of line CR-LF characters should be something else.

I will see what I can figure out.


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

It works for me, but it did not at first. I created 2 presets, "Preset01" and "Preset02" but they did not show up in the dropdown list.

Then I quit foobar and started it up, and now "Preset01" & "Preset02" do show up in the dropdown list.

For each preset created, there is a .fxp file being created in the following dfirectory:

*C:\Users\my_user_name\GeorgeYohngVST\Plugin Presets\reaeq-standalone\*

So I now have files
Preset01.fxp
Preset02.fxp
in that directory. Unfortunately, they are binary files and cannot be edited manually. Probably would not hurt to go there and back them up once in awhile.

Hope that helps.


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## AudiocRaver (Jun 6, 2012)

skootx said:


> ...make my tweaks to my reaeq file...


What exactly do you mean? Edit a config file directly? Enter the values into the reaeq gui and save the preset? Just trying to follow how you are going about it. Thanks.


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