# Tommy's HT In-Progress



## Tommy

*Tommy's HT Room*

Woohoo - first member to start a complete project here. To recap my intro:

Ok to start, I've been framing the basement for weeks, an hour or two per night. Finished basement will have a gym and HT room. I should have got some before pics but I'll get some soon now that I'm thinking about it.

First mistake I made was not calculating how many boards and trips to Home Depot the framing would take. I had an rough estimate but decided to go to HD and pick up like 30-40 2x4's at a time in my Explorer.

Let me say after about 8 trips so far and almost 1k down on wood, it would have been easier and cheaper to just buy it all at once from a lumber yard and have them deliver it.


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## Tommy

Ok most of the walls are framed, I left big gaps for the doors though. Still gotta figure out how to frame them. Low ceiling into the HT (beam going across top of wall) room is going to be a problem.

Started the soffits with 2x4's (ladder type). So far I don't like it, it doesnt seem sturdy enough. 2 of the 3 soffits I have running the basement are going to be like 4 foot wide. I just don't picture the soffits having enough support. Not sure what I'm going to do.

Well that where I'm at with the framing work. Gonna pick up some more wood on my way home from work today. Got reserves tomorrow so that pretty much ruins the rest of my weekend.


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## Tommy

Ok, I'm just sort of bloggin where I'm at up to this point. I'd luv for people to jump in with comments in advice though.

I've been reading all over the web and order a bunch of books and I'm still lost. I tracked down a offical HT type of store about an hour from us so we took a trip out the other week to get some ideas.

They had some rooms made up with all that pre-made acoustic **** and it was all nice and good till we started asking the pricing. The guy said the room would go for about 80k not including any of the actual equipment. And about another 10-15k with equipment. We didnt stay much longer.

I started ordering some HT stuff trying to get a jump on what I'll need. I wanted to order the audio equipment and get it here so I can find out what and how to wire it before enclosing the walls.


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## Tommy

Yes I want to use in-wall speakers (they look better) even though I've been flamed for mentioning it on some sites (not here). I just want decent sounding surround sound and not to disturb the rest of the house. Shoot, I'm still hard of hearing from Iraq anway. Seriously though, just looking to make it as nice as I can but not go nuts over the sound.

So not know what the **** to get I've basically just been googling and looking at others reviews. I've budgeted about 3 - 4 k for audio and components and know I want in-wall speakers. 

I ordered the speakers now mainly just because I want to receive them just to see what type of connections they'll have so I can order whatever speaker wire I need to install in the walls. (Advice appriecated)

Anyway in-wall speakers, in my price range, and with good reviews I found a manufacturer called MTX. For the speakers I ordered:

MTX
8” 3-way - 2 Front Speakers HT8253W 
6.5” 2-way -1 Front Center Speaker HT2625W 
8” Sub Woofer in-wall HTS28W 
8” 2-way surround 2 rear speakers HT825W 
Bi-Pole speakers 2 Side Speakers HT520BDP 

Came out to about 2k


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## Tommy

Also I purchased a slim-rack 5 component shelve. Still waiting for that to come but already regreting it think how I'm still gonna have to frame for the thing anyway. I could have just maded the recessed shelving with no back and saved $500. 

Another purchase has been my receiver. Ok before going any further let me say I dont know much about what the receiver is but to my understanding this will be that everything connects into, all the speakers, the dvd player, the cable box, and the TV.

Wanting to put near 1k towards it, I googled again and found the Marantz SR-7500 in that price range, with 7.1 surround sound, THX select and good reviews so I ordered that for about $800

Total so far blown: $4,500


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## Tommy

My HTR room will be 20' x 14' with 8' ceiling except for a soffit on the one side of the room which will be 1' lower.

I figured around a 60" HDTV flat screen. Yes another thing I've been getting flamed on. Yes I want a nice projector but the wife seems dead set against a projector and wants a flat screen (guess she thinks shes takin it with her if we divorce (I'd wreck it first)) haha

Maybe I'll run a pipe anyway in the ceiling to wire it in the future for a projector. I'll have access to the back of most of the room so running things later is an option.

Ok back to the plasma, I know I want something around 60" for the 20' long room. I'm confused as **** with the HDTV **** and ya think I havent been reading out the a$$ about it.

Anyway ya got HDTV, HDTV Tuner, HDTV Compatible, HDTV Ready etc... Ok I know enough that if you get the wrong one you still have to buy more stuff to make it work. But hey I thought thats why I just spent $800 on a receiver.

I'll try not to bring posts from other sites over anymore (hopefully this will be the only site I need for now on) and limit it to this quote. While asking for recommendations on a 60" flat screen someone commented:

_You can either connect your video sources through your receiver then to your display or directly to your display. Either will work. Your Marantz doesn't appear to have HDMI connections so if you want/need to use HDMI that will have to connect directly to your display._

So now I'm a bit lost if I wasted money or not and what I still need to get and/or send back.
Comments appriecated.


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## NorwegianDawg

Tommy, I built my own HT from the ground up and I'm also a custom HT designer/installer...so I'll be happy to help you out! 

You can check out what I did here: http://www.devotionsbyerik.com/E-Cinema.htm

E


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## NorwegianDawg

Tommy, you did not waste money on the Marantz reciever, I use them in my designs and they're a great product. If you choose to connect HDMI cables from a dvd player, cable/sat box, etc...you will have to go directly to your video source, whether that be projector or plasma. That Marantz model does have componenet video switching which allows you to run three sets of cables to the receiver and one out to your video display. Some receivers over HDMI switching and that is what the previous post was commenting on. Hope that helps.

E


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## NorwegianDawg

BTW...when you say flat screen are you talking plasma or DLP? DLP's in that size are MUCH more affordable than plasma's but they are not as thin and don't hang on the walls. IMHO I would HIGHLY recommmend front projection like you've heard others saying...you'll save money and it will give you a "more realism movie experience." If you have not seen a front projection system, I recommend you check one out!:T 

E


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## JCD

A few comments:

*Re: Video Display*
I second NorwegianDawg's comments on the TV issue. The only reason to go with the Plasma is if you can't use a projector and you want to wall mount the display. If it's possible to put the TV on a stand, the DLP option would be the way I'd go (IMO). It might not have the sex appeal of a plasma, but it'll cost less, last longer and give you a better picture. All of this is moot if wall mounting is what you really need/want though.

Also, I wasn't clear if there was something you were still confused about regarding the HDTV stuff.

*Re: Receiver*
That Marantz is a great piece of equipment. No worries there. The fact that it may or may not have HDMI switching capabability can be problematic, but there are always solutions. I have an older Denon unit -- no switching capability. Fortunately, my TV has 5 inputs to accomodate my various video sources; however, if/when I upgrade to the new DVD format, I'll have to get some other video switcher. Maybe something like this would work well.

*Re: Pipe*
I think the idea about running a pipe for future/potential cables is an EXCELLENT idea. In fact, I'd be doing that for all of the in-wall wiring you're going to be doing, just in case you have to later switch out the wires for something else anyway.

*Re: Accoustic Treatments*
IMO -- very important to improve the imaging/sound/etc of your system. And since you're in the building mode, they're really easy to make, and don't cost a ton of $$. Here are a couple of sites that show you how to build them.
DIY Panels
DIY Panels Also
This second link I think is more relevant -- newer information and it's more specific about the fiberglass to be used -- Owens Corning 703 is the standard, but there are many other manufacturers with the same specs. The trick always seems to be able to find the fiberglass -- it's not something you can generally just pick up at Home Depot.
Also, be warned, too much treatment will kill a room just as bad, or actually worse, than too little. You only need maybe 25% coverage. The spots I'd definitely hit would be the first reflections on the side walls and the first reflections off of the ceiling. If you're willing and able, I can expand on this.

*Re: Room*
That room is REALLY making me jealous.

Let me know if anything above wasn't clear and I'll do my best to clarify.

JCD


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## Sonnie

I agree with E and JCD here... front projection is the bomb! You get so much more picture and for less money. E and I both have the Sanyo Z4.

I have a Toshiba 65" Widescreen RPTV as well, but it don't shake a stick at the Z4.


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## Tommy

NorwegianDawg said:


> Tommy, I built my own HT from the ground up and I'm also a custom HT designer/installer...so I'll be happy to help you out!
> 
> You can check out what I did here: http://www.devotionsbyerik.com/E-Cinema.htm
> 
> E


Hey thanks to both of you and thanks for the offer to help, you may just wind up regretting it.

Ok, I'll keep the receiver and consult everyone here more before proceeding. 

I will talk further with the wife about a projector system. My only reservations about that is that one it's only a 20' room and if the first row is only 10' (center) how big should the screen go.

Unless I'm calculating it wrong from what I'm reading I should be trying for something 45" to 60"

And second is width, the room with is 14' but I will have a soffit about 4' running off the side wall bringing the ceiling there down to 6'8. 

Now I'm thinking in order to put a wider screen such as a projection screen it will now have to go partly under that soffit which may or may not be to low.

And to answer your question I was thinking a flat plasma hung on the wall. I'll try and get some pic's up asap of what I have to work with so far.


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## Tommy

How bout the MX speakers, good / bad choice? 

I couldn't find what type of connections they had on the back and I'm not to sure of what to order as far as wire. 

I've seen things saying I should find out the connection needed and order each wire to the exact size with the spade or banna connection already on it, is that correct?

Oh well, gonna go try and put up another small section of the soffit, then gotta get ready for reserves tomorrow.


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## JCD

TommyW said:


> Hey thanks to both of you and thanks for the offer to help, you may just wind up regretting it.


Naw.. people have helped me, seems only fair that one gives back.




> Ok, I'll keep the receiver and consult everyone here more before proceeding.
> 
> I will talk further with the wife about a projector system. My only reservations about that is that one it's only a 20' room and if the first row is only 10' (center) how big should the screen go.


Has she seen one in person? She might change her mind if she does. I think they're far more unobtrusive (and therefore a higher WAF) than even a plasma. But that's just me. Oh, if you do go the projector route, best place I know for screens is Carada. Relatively inexpensive and (from what I've heard), great customer service.



> Unless I'm calculating it wrong from what I'm reading I should be trying for something 45" to 60"


Try this viewing calculator. It's kind of my reference point for these questions.



> And second is width, the room with is 14' but I will have a soffit about 4' running off the side wall bringing the ceiling there down to 6'8.
> 
> Now I'm thinking in order to put a wider screen such as a projection screen it will now have to go partly under that soffit which may or may not be to low.


I think I may have to see a picture to make any kind of comment related to that. I'm just a typical guy -- very visual  



> And to answer your question I was thinking a flat plasma hung on the wall. I'll try and get some pic's up asap of what I have to work with so far.


Gotcha. Pics are good.

JCD


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## NorwegianDawg

TW, my theater is 12w x 18l x 8h. I have a 92" (40" x 80") Screen. My first row is about at 10'-6"/11' and it's just perfect. In fact, some go even bigger given that distance. The general rule of thumb is 1.5 or 1.8 x screen width. So given my theater, 1.5 x 80 = 120" / 12 = 10'! 

The reason for that ratio is to avoid SDE or screen door effect. But I also run calculations for viewing angle etc...and IMHO any larger than 92" at 10' is too big. You don't want the effect of watching a tennis match cause the screen is too big. I dont' think you'll have a problem at all getting a screen even given your soffit issue.

E


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## JCD

TommyW said:


> How bout the MX speakers, good / bad choice?
> 
> I couldn't find what type of connections they had on the back and I'm not to sure of what to order as far as wire.
> 
> I've seen things saying I should find out the connection needed and order each wire to the exact size with the spade or banna connection already on it, is that correct?
> 
> Oh well, gonna go try and put up another small section of the soffit, then gotta get ready for reserves tomorrow.


I've never heard MX Speakers, so I can't comment on them. In the end, it just comes down to how you like them. 

To find out what kind of connection to get, I'd probably contact MX directly. If the connection is like a "naked" speaker driver, there should be two different spades for connecting the speaker wires like the two in this picture:










They're not always color coded or even the same size, so you'd have to look on the back of the speaker to tell.

The alternative would be a binding post of some sort, like this:










These are pretty standard sized and versatile. If it is like this, any single banana plug would work. If you wanted a dual banana plug, then you'd need to know exaclty how far apart the posts are. I think there is a general standard, but I don't think it's universal. 

Hope I'm helping more than confusing..

JCD


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## Tommy

Yea there contact section on there site doesnt seem to like any of my .net or .mil email addresses and wouldnt let me send the question. Oh well the speakers are ordered and will probably be here within the next few days to see anyway. 

But my real question is, do I have to order each wire already sized, cut and the connectors professionaly put on or is this the type of thing I can buy a spool and a tool and put the connectors on myself?


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## NorwegianDawg

TW, you don't even need to use "connectors" but just the bare wire if you'd like. Just use a good quality 14-2 in-wall CL2 rated wire and you'll be fine. You don't need to buy specific or exact lengths of beautique wires unless you want to...that's all in the eye of the beholder.


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## Tommy

Ok here are the pic's of the framing so far. This first pic is the right wall (right of the screen), Theres a beam a couple of poles I decided to hide in the wall so this was my starting point.

For this wall only, because of the poles and beam, I did to the 2x6 bottom & top plates with 2x4 staggared studs. The front of this wall will also hold the door to the room. Cutting it close since I have no play room with the above beam. 

Also as soon as you would enter the room, 2 ducts will run parrell with this wall which I will have to soffit.


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## Tommy

Next pic is just the back wall. Theres a little space between the framing and the actual foundation wall so I can fish stuff by later if I need too. Also if you can see towards the left of the foundation wall behind the HT room will be closeted space under the stairway, so I do have about 3' space on the left of the wall to connect into that empty space.

Problems would be that above soffit has a height of about 6'8 and with a riser there would put that one spot at just under 6' clearance.


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## Tommy

Next pic is just the rear left wall. Nothing special about it. Now for the left wall, I did frame the wall about 20" out from the foundation wall. It will be tight but I will have room to completly walk behind this whole wall when the project is complete and it will be accesible for making any future changes to the room.


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## Tommy

By the way, my weight bench is my temp home theater chair for the moment. I do have the floor crosshaired if you can see it. The red lines intersect at the room center


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## Tommy

Here's a view of the front wall. I did frame a box roughly the size of a 60" tv and hung it on the wall to get an idea of what it would look like. 

You may see (I'll put up some close up pics of the duct work) the screen is centered to the room but it is very close to the right hand side soffit. If I did move to a project screen as suggested instead of a flat screen, it is going to be wider and hence partially wind up under this soffit. I'm not sure if that will be an obstruction as far as viewing it, just the difference in ceiling.

Behind the front wall is going to be the utility room that will remain unfinished. So this will be another wall I can always do stuff behind it but I will be very close to the heaters and also I'd rather not put much on the front wall besides the screen and speakers.


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## Tommy

Heres just a pic while standing in the utility room looking into the HT room


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## Tommy

Alright here's 2 more of the front wall, just slightly different views.


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## Tommy

I dont have my own forum and there doesnt seem to be sub-threads so this thread is gonna get long and disorganized quick (pages 20+ etc) if it lasts through out the whole project. I know I should probably go ask each individual question in each specific forum but I'd also like to keep everything together in one spot for a full review project review if anyone else is interested in the future. Just to show how many different questions etc come up during a project. 

Alright to start the day, I posted the pics of the framing I have so far. Still waiting on some comments and advice from this point. As for work I know I still gotta finish the soffit, reserves this weekend killed me from getting any work done, and was thinking on a couple more things.

I pointed out that the one wall was done with the staggered stud method but I dont think I stressed that the others are not, there regular 2x4 framming. Out of those 3 walls, 2 are back to the foundation and one back to the utility room. 

Not sure how crazy I need to get with sound proofing and acoustic stuff, my goals are having it sound decent but I'm not fantical as far as it goes as long as it works properly and second is making sure the sound doesnt overwhelm the upstairs. The 1st floor, the room above is hard wood floors.

So suggestions on finishing off the walls are welcome. 


I found an article and some pics of someone elses HT room and love how it looks. It won some type of award for a home theater. The walls were completely carpeted which I thought was a big no no as far as sound?

So the wife and I are still discussing how the walls should be finished but I do like how this guys walls are structured. Columns break up the room and wall sconces and speakers are inside the columns. In between each column is room to hang a poster and recessed lights are pointed on each poster.

As I said I really like how this looks, still not sure if I should do the full carpet thing though or not though but besides looking nice I think it would also help sound proof the room. I do like the columns and posters in between each column it breaks up the room great. I'd like to hear others comments on the carpeted walls.

I'd like to take 2 spots that he has for carpets though and use one spot to make a recessed section in the wall for a component rack, and another section to make a recessed shelving section to hold DVD's. I'll start another post about the component rack though because I'm defintely seeking advice about this. Just wanted to give an overall picture I'm what I'm thinking about so far.

In addition to what I just mentioned the other differences would be, mine would be 2 rows instead of three (shorter room then his) Also I'm not sure how I'm going to do the front wall. I cant believe he went thru all the trouble to put inwall speakers for the sides and rear and for the front there sitting right out exposed. I'd like to put everything in the walls speakers and component rack etc... also i dont think I have enough room for a front stage.

Ok heres the pics


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## Tommy

I may just have to break my questions up and go put them seperatly, I think I may just be asking to much here and gonna wind up getting things skipped over. 

Alright the component rack is really concerning me. I'm going thru all the trouble to put in-wall speakers so I dont want to have a visibile component rack either. I ordered one of those slim rack 5 things and I'm still waiting for it to come but I'm not sure it is what I want.

What I'd like to do is make some sort of recessed in the wall type shelves on the first 5' section of the right wall. The right wall has about 20" behind it and the foundation wall. 

I'd have more accessibility to the front wall but I dont want to look and the component rack while watching a movie.

My problem though, if I'm going thru all the trouble to sound proof the room theres gonna wind up being some type of opening in the wall if the component rack is built into it, right?

I'm gonna have to start on this, this week so suggestions on this would be greatly appriecated.


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## Tommy

If the rack enclosure goes on the front side wall I'll have a max depth of 20", is that enough? 

I can put the rack on the back wall extending into the closet but how difficult does that make wiring anything that has to go to the TV 20' away?


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## Tommy

Don't leave me already guys... :sarcastic: 

Ok I complained to the wife I was getting flamed online about the flat screen, well besides bitching at me for caring about message boards she did cave and I got the "do whatever... go ahead" to go with the projector instead of the flat screen.

So I'm gonna have a bunch of questions about this but starting with how is this gonna look on my front wall with that soffit on the right? Do you think that will block the view at all or should I soffit the whole front of the wall down to that height?

So lets start with that, what to do about that wall and what size screen and how it will go on the wall?

Also I'm still desperate to do something about that component rack. Now I'm not so much worried about how to build it but where to place it. Front wall? Side wall (only has 20" depth but is accessibile) or back wall which will have plenty of room but may be to far to wire things, what do you think?

One more question, does a riser 7' in depth seem to long? I'm trying to figure out my speaker and columns placement and gotta figure out where my back row riser will start. Thinking of running it from the back wall out 7', is that ok or to much?


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## NorwegianDawg

TW...I don't have time to respond right now...hang tight, I'll have time when I get home this evening.


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## JCD

I'd leave the comments about the framing and sound proofing to N.Dawg -- much more of an expert than I. 
That being said, I think if you put regular old pink fiberglass between all the walls and sheetrock the frames you'll be pretty good. The low end stuff is going to pass through the walls, but with distance, that sound will peter our pretty quickly. I don't know what it would take to creat a sound proof room and still have it sound reasonably good. 

Re: the carpet thing: I don't think it's a good idea either. I could be wrong, but I think there are some serious issues with that strategy. An alternative would be cloth coverings on the wall (think movie theater). In particular, one made of natural fibers and an open weave. That's what I plan on doing in my listening room. This might give you the same kind of look that the carpet did.

re: Front Speakers: IMO, the front 3 speakers are the most important for sound, especially for music. With in-wall speakers, there is generally some sonic tradeoff for the ability to put the speakers in wall. It could be that he wanted the stand alones because he liked the sound better and didn't mind having them out.

re: Component Rack: I think if you put the components at the front of the room in a recessed section you'd be ok. I'm sure that if you put some sort door in front of them you'd be fine -- maybe one that is covered by some sort of cloth over a cut out so you can still get the remote control to work. And as long as there is some sort of ventilation and access (again, with a door?) you can box up the equipment rack to stop sound from leaking through. Again, I'd defer to N.Dawg on this one. 
As for the 20" depth -- I don't know.. it looked like you had an open room behind there, so maybe I have the room mixed up in my head. I'm not sure if 20" would be enough or not. Your receiver is probabbly the only thing that will REALLY REALLY need venitlation, so if I'd check the dimensions of that first. You're going to want some space for the air to move around. 
As far as putting the rack in the closet -- I'm sure you can run a cable that long, but it'll probably cost you a bit more (naturally). Also, running speaker wire that long will require a higher gauge and will degrade to some extent. Conventional wisdom says that you should have the shortest speaker wire possible for the best signal to the speaker. The most important speakers are going to be your front three, so ideally, I'd put the equipment as close as possible to the front. That's the ideal, but we always have to compromise in the world of audio, so a long speaker wire run isn't gonna ruin your system, but I would suggest a higher gauge of wire -- 12 gauge?.

Again, I'd defer to N.Dawg on all of this..

JCD


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## Sonnie

lol... my HT construction thread was 117 posts long in the forum I was hangin' out in a couple years ago. Keep in mind though that I may have made a post and it may have been the next day before I got much response. 

I can tell ya a little of what I did. I stagger studded just like you and as JC stated... just use the pink stuff for insulation. I did double 5/8" sheetrock by inside walls and ceiling and single 5/8" the outside walls. On the inside I overlapped the seams and siliconed between layers... more or less running a bead in an X and a couple lines around the edges. This simply to stop any vibrating between sheets. If you look at my HT Construction pics in my Cedar Creek Cinema sig link you'll get some ideas of what all I did... and I pretty much went to the extremes.

On this component rack situation... you got that utility room there behind your front wall. No reason not to take advantage of that. In the utility room you can build a closet to keep closed so that you can access the rear of your equipment. You can fix that closet door where it will seal pretty good. Here's something like what I'm talking about...










This is merely an example... location and design would be to your expectations obviously.

I'll also defer to E (N-dawg) on 99% of this since he does it for a living. Okay... I've done a few, but he's mo-betta wrapped than I am.


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## Tommy

Thanks guy, I know I'm jumping around at the moment just trying to get everything planned out before doing to much else. Thanks for keepin up. I'll try to limit it as I go for here out but I do have a couple subjects to jump still.

As for the 20" space maybe there is some confusion. The side wall (left wall as your facing the screen) is the wall that has 20" space between it and the foundation wall. I was hoping I could put the rack here but I dont know if there's enough space.

The front wall does have a utility room behind it with plenty of room but I'd prefer to not put the component rack where I'm staring at the rack and the screen at the same time specially when I paid extra for the in-wall speakers.

If the rack did go on the front wall, wires would still need to be run to the back of the room right. Wouldnt it work the same if I put the rack on the back wall where I still have a closet behind it for access?

Also I got the speakers delivered today but I'll create anoter post for it.


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## NorwegianDawg

TW...quick home work assignment. Can you dimension out your entire room for me, with the soffit drop and everything? Thanks!


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## Tommy

As I said the speakers were delivered today. They dont have connectors like the pics JCD posted. There some sore of push clip type, is this bad?

Norwegian I know you said I can use bare wire but I thought I was supposed to stay away from that if I'm not mistaken.

Basically what I really need to know is if I ordered bad **** and need to send it back right away as far as the speakers and receiver.

Other then that, you all did talk me and the wife into the projector system so I need to know how and what to do with this front wall and where to put the component rack.


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## JCD

> The front wall does have a utility room behind it with plenty of room but I'd prefer to not put the component rack where I'm staring at the rack and the screen at the same time specially when I paid extra for the in-wall speakers.


I still think you can cover it behind a door of some sort



> If the rack did go on the front wall, wires would still need to be run to the back of the room right. Wouldnt it work the same if I put the rack on the back wall where I still have a closet behind it for access?


For me, it's the length of the run. Most of your connections (including the most important) are going to be up front. Shorter runs are going to (almost?) always result in better signals to the end source. The other issue is using your remote. It's very un-intuitive to point the remote backwards when you want to access your equipment.

JCD


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## JCD

TommyW said:


> As I said the speakers were delivered today. They dont have connectors like the pics JCD posted. There some sore of push clip type, is this bad?
> 
> Norwegian I know you said I can use bare wire but I thought I was supposed to stay away from that if I'm not mistaken.
> 
> Basically what I really need to know is if I ordered bad **** and need to send it back right away as far as the speakers and receiver.
> 
> Other then that, you all did talk me and the wife into the projector system so I need to know how and what to do with this front wall and where to put the component rack.


I think I see how it works.. you press the top of the post and stick the wire through the hole. When you release the post, it springs back up pinching the wire? 

If I have it right, that should work fine. My only caution is to make sure that the two exposed wires don't touch each other. It might be a good idea to insert the speaker wire in the front on one side and the back on the other.

JCD


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## Tommy

The room is 20' Long by 14' Wide with an 8' ceiling. 

The soffit runs parrel and next to the right wall (as you look at the front screen) and is about 4' wide. So from the left wall toward the right I have 10' wide with an 8' ceiling and then another 4' wide with a ceiling height a little under 7'


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## Tommy

JCD said:


> I think I see how it works.. you press the top of the post and stick the wire through the hole. When you release the post, it springs back up pinching the wire?
> 
> If I have it right, that should work fine. My only caution is to make sure that the two exposed wires don't touch each other. It might be a good idea to insert the speaker wire in the front on one side and the back on the other.
> 
> JCD


Ok great so the right spool of wire should be all I need to order, right? Should I order that now and test the speakers before running them in the walls?


----------



## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> lol... my HT construction thread was 117 posts long in the forum I was hangin' out in a couple years ago.


I think I'll have ya beat soon, I'm at about a 1/3 of that post count in less then a week now... :dontknow: 

Anyway I finished my soffit tonight in the HT room at least still got the rest of the basement to do. Not sure if this will make any difference or not but I seem to be confusing people with this front wall. So here is another pic of it with the soffit completed and I also attached a drop cloth behind it just for a different view.


----------



## JCD

TommyW said:


> Ok great so the right spool of wire should be all I need to order, right? Should I order that now and test the speakers before running them in the walls?



Except for the gauge of the wire, I don't think you need any special spool of wire. 

Regarding the speaker wire, there are generally two different groups of thought. Group one thinks that the high priced/esoteric speaker wire and interconnects are a bunch of overpriced snake oil. Group two can't believe that Group One can't hear the sonic improvements with the high end cables/wire. I'm a member of Group One. My advice is to just go down to Home Depot/Fry's and get some huge spool of 12gauge speaker wire. Maybe you need something special if you're oging to be going in-wall -- N.Dawg would have more information on that topic.

And I'd DEFINITELY try the speakers out now -- I have no real worries about the wire itself, but I'd break down and cry if everything else was done and one of the speakers was broken when you tried to fire it up for the first time.

JCD


----------



## Tommy

JCD said:


> Maybe you need something special if you're oging to be going in-wall -- N.Dawg would have more information on that topic.
> 
> And I'd DEFINITELY try the speakers out now -- I have no real worries about the wire itself, but I'd break down and cry if everything else was done and one of the speakers was broken when you tried to fire it up for the first time.
> 
> JCD


Ok will do, I'll order whatever wire you guys recommend and I guess hook everything up for a sound test.

(I babble so much I'll put my questions in red for now on)

They are all in-wall speakers so yes all the wire will be in the walls, so what exactly do I need, I'll order it today?

The room is 20' x 14' x 8' what length spool should be enough too?

Also, is it the same type of wire used for the sub too?


----------



## Tommy

Back to my problem with where to put the equipment rack. I'll definetly need to make a decision on this in order to run these wires. Everyone here defintely leans towards the front wall and I'm still just not seeing it.

Short story, we recently moved into a house we had built, the sample house in the development had a dedicated HT room in the basement which gave us the idea to do ours. The did the same as far as leaving a bit of space behind the side wall and foundation but not sure exactly how much they left. Recessed into the side wall they had some type of small cabinet built in that housed the equipment. If possibile I'd like to do something like that on the side wall and out of the way. Unfortunatly I cant go back and take a peek at the sample (not permits for my basement finishing). I'd love to know what the cabinet is so I could just buy it at this point.

If I do put the rack recessed into the front wall as everyone suggest, I guess spacing would need to be figured out before hand right. A decision will be needed in how wide the screen will be, plus I have the in-wall speakers what will take up the space in between two studs on each side of the screen. Whats left over will need to fit the rack? Unless the rack went completly under or over the speaker.

Wall is 14' wide = 168"
Sounds like others are recommending the screen being around 110" wide. - 58"
Leaving 18" (36") on each side for speakers - 22"
About 11" left on each side

Ok if the rack does go on the front wall I would definetly need either a smaller screen or putting the rack under or over the speakers and not to the side of it.


----------



## Tommy

Soffit blogging

Just wanted to babble about the soffits. I put them together using 2x2's and nails according to the basement home finishing books I picked up. But I'm just not thrilled with them, they just dont seem secure enough.

First is that it is covering a double duct which is about 4' wide. This is in the HT room plus the same will be in the other section of the basement which will also be alot longer. Anyway my point is this just seems like its going to be to much weight suspended from the ceiling.

So I'm telling the wife about it and explaining how I just dont think the nails are gonna hold and that maybe I should take it all apart and redo it with screws. So of course what does she do but pulls on it and tears out a good section of it from the ceiling. Felt like hitting her with the **** boards.

Maybe I'll just add some screws to it in place rather then completly taking it down and screwing it all over.


----------



## Tommy

*Columns And Risers*

As I mentioned in a previous post I like how this guy has his HT room setup as far as columns on the wall with spaces in between the columns for posters or whatever. The columns would hold the wall sconces and in-wall speakers where appropiate.










His room is about 10' longer then mine, so I'm thinking of maybe 2 columns per side wall and 2 rows of seats, the back row will be on a riser. Not sure yet if I want to put a column in each corner of the back wall facing towards the room.

So I'm at the point now of having to build the columns in order to start getting ready to wire for the speakers. I dont want to lose a foot or more off the width of my room for people to get by in the aisle, just want to break up the wall into sections and house the side speakers and lights in the columns.

So the framing is a simple 2x4 box with 16" between the two studs. The end result will be the column will be about 17-18" wide and only come out of the wall about 2".

For the back row riser I'm thinking about extending it out from the back wall about 7'. This should be plenty of room for a reclining chair plus I'll be able to place the columns flush with the front of the riser. 

Meaning the riser will not be totally rectangular but 'T' shaped around the column. Doing this will leave about 5.5 feet of space between each column. In between the columns I'd like to put posters with recessed lights pointed on them. Also depending on where the rack goes, 2 spots may be used for the rack and a recessed shelves for dvd movies.

Not sure if I can frame the riser in place before sheet rocking the walls or not. It would be easier if I could though. Still got figure out what wires will need to go to the riser and how too.

My main question about all this though is can I frame the risers in now and sheet rock the walls around it or will I need to wait till after the sheet rocking is done before starting the risers? The risers will be running from wall to wall on the sides.


----------



## Tommy

I'm gonna order the speaker wire, does this sound right and is there anything else I may need to order? 

250ft 12/2 CL2 IN WALL SPEAKER WIRE

cablestogo.com has it for $100 is that a fair price for it?

Do I need any type of connectors for the speakers or the receiver? 

How bout the sub, does that get the same wire?


----------



## Tommy

I also see this monster cable that is 3 times as expensive, is it that much better?

250ft MONSTER 2 COND. 12 GA (UL) CL3 WIRE $300


----------



## JCD

That price is in-line with the cable/wire company that I've used in the past, Blue Jeans Cable. 

I took a quick look at their speaker wire, it was $95 for 250ft of 12 gauge wire. 

They also have subwoofer cables if you wanted to buy them at the same time.

As for the speaker wire connection to the receiver, you can go with a just the plain wire; however, I prefer banana plugs -- if nothing else, it's just easier to hook up (also at Blue Jeans Cable).

As for Monster Products, some will (passionately) say you'll get better performance with the high end cables/wire. I think the wire above will be just as good at a third of the cost.

JCD


----------



## JCD

Oh, and did I see in another thread that we corrup.. err.. changed your mind about the plasma and will be going to a projector?

If so, I'd be willing to bet that if you sent an e-mail to the people at Carada, they'd respond with the screen size they'd recommend. They also have probably the best priced screens out there. Also, everything thing I've heard about their customer service has said they're top notch.

JCD


----------



## Tommy

Dammn I thought I saw something about the sub wire being different. My sub is an in-wall sub and I didnt even take it out of the box yesterday to check what type of connection it has. Guess I'm waiting to go home and check before ordering now... Your leaving me hangin though on whether or not to get the monster wire 

And ya were all in for the projector now. My 8yr old daughter is thrilled, ya would think she is one of you all the way she keeps going on about the projector is going to be better then the plasma.

Ok, I'll start on screens and projectors with you guys soon enough, I need to figure out what I'm ordering here before I jump on that.


----------



## JCD

Tommy said:


> Your leaving me hangin though on whether or not to get the monster wire


It was in there.. but, I personally don't think you get any improvement from "Monster" wire or interconnects. Others may disagree and maybe they can chime in. 



Tommy said:


> And ya were all in for the projector now. My 8yr old daughter is thrilled, ya would think she is one of you all the way she keeps going on about the projector is going to be better then the plasma.


<Evil Laugh :devil: > 
All kidding aside, I think you'll be happier with the projector.



Tommy said:


> Ok, I'll start on screens and projectors with you guys soon enough, I need to figure out what I'm ordering here before I jump on that.


I'm sure you can get some good feedback here..

JCD


----------



## Tommy

Ok gonna go with the cheaper wire unless anyone speaks up against it. Will use bare wire for the speaker connects and maybe get the screw on banana clips for the receiver end of the wire. I open up an check the sub speaker before ordering the wire for that just in case the connection may be the same as the other speakers.

Guess I really aint got much framing left to do except the decrative columns and recessing the rack cabinet before calling in the electrician. Gonna need him to pre-wire the whole basement is there anything special I need to request for the HT room? Should I have him wire anything like the projector and speakers?

I peeked at that screen link ya gave me, wow different ratios and ****, more stuff to hurt my head...


----------



## Tommy

Hey I got home and opened the subwoofer box and the connection on it is the same as the other speakers except theres two sets on this speaker. Now this defintely doesnt look like the subwoofer cable being sold, is this connection normal?

What do I order and how does this get wired?


----------



## JCD

I tried to find a manual at MTX's website (here), but didn't see one. Was there one included in the box? Also, was there an amp included?

JCD


----------



## Tommy

JCD said:


> I tried to find a manual at MTX's website (here), but didn't see one. Was there one included in the box? Also, was there an amp included?
> 
> JCD



Amp??? I thought that was the point of the receiver.


----------



## JCD

Since most subwoofers these days are powered, modern receivers don't generally power the sub. 
So the "Sub Out" on the back of your receiver is just a line out, i.e., no amplification. It looks like you'll need some sort of external amp to power the sub. 

I'm assuming that there was no manual included with your sub? I would assume MTX may have some solution for your situation already.

N.Dawg (or others) may have some suggestions (or corrections) regarding the above info.


JCD


----------



## Sonnie

Did I miss something here Tommy? What were your reasons for going all in-wall?

I guess what I'm saying is I can usually see this in a room that is shared... say a great room with a home theater room. The wife don't want speakers sittin' all around, which was my case. That was one of the major reasons for building my HT room... so I could get the goods to produce without having to worry about momma saying anything.

Is momma still talkin' ya down on this stuff?


I agree 100% with Jacen... the receiver won't do suggest for your sub.


----------



## Fincave

Just a little more to confuse you:devil: When I was trying to decide on screen size etc I used this site http://www.projectorcentral.com/projection-calculator-pro.cfm It really was invaluable to me and very easy to use. I remember reading somewhere as well that the screen should be placed so that your direct line of sight is in line with a point about 1/3 from the bottom of the screen, not sure where I read this, nor how true it is! Once you have your projector I would just hang a sheet up, or a piece of board and play around with different screen sizes for a week or more. Once you have found the right size for you then either buy a screen or go DIY. As to connectors, banana plugs are more convenient to use, BUT some people recommend that the best connection is no connector, just bare wire. I tried both and could hear no difference at all.


----------



## Tommy

JCD said:


> Since most subwoofers these days are powered, modern receivers don't generally power the sub.
> So the "Sub Out" on the back of your receiver is just a line out, i.e., no amplification. It looks like you'll need some sort of external amp to power the sub.
> 
> I'm assuming that there was no manual included with your sub? I would assume MTX may have some solution for your situation already.
> 
> N.Dawg (or others) may have some suggestions (or corrections) regarding the above info.
> 
> 
> JCD



Oh great more components to buy... as I said, I thought that was the purpose of a reciever that it was an amp and processor combined. Assuming there like everything else HT and range from cheap to expensive, how much am I looking at paying for an amp now?

And you are correct, there was no manual just instructions on how to mount it to the wall.

If NDawg was local I think I'd just hire him to come do the work at this point... :help:


----------



## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> Did I miss something here Tommy? What were your reasons for going all in-wall?
> 
> I guess what I'm saying is I can usually see this in a room that is shared... say a great room with a home theater room. The wife don't want speakers sittin' all around, which was my case. That was one of the major reasons for building my HT room... so I could get the goods to produce without having to worry about momma saying anything.
> 
> Is momma still talkin' ya down on this stuff?
> 
> 
> I agree 100% with Jacen... the receiver won't do suggest for your sub.


Actually I can't blame this on the wife, although I'm sure she agree's with me on it. Not sure if its the military in me or what but I cant stand the sight of the speakers sitting all around the room. I understand if someone doesnt have a way to hide them but dont see why if building the room not using the opportunity to hide the speakers.

And yes I do want nice sound but cant picture the in-wall speakers degrading the sound that much and I'm definetly not as fantical about the acoustics as everyone else, I just want everything to work.


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## Tommy

Fincave said:


> Just a little more to confuse you:devil: When I was trying to decide on screen size etc I used this site http://www.projectorcentral.com/projection-calculator-pro.cfm It really was invaluable to me and very easy to use. I remember reading somewhere as well that the screen should be placed so that your direct line of sight is in line with a point about 1/3 from the bottom of the screen, not sure where I read this, nor how true it is! Once you have your projector I would just hang a sheet up, or a piece of board and play around with different screen sizes for a week or more. Once you have found the right size for you then either buy a screen or go DIY. As to connectors, banana plugs are more convenient to use, BUT some people recommend that the best connection is no connector, just bare wire. I tried both and could hear no difference at all.


To take another step backwards again... :duh: Ok this goes back to more what I was originally thinking that the screen size should be around 60-65 inches for a plasma.

Everyone talked me into a projector system and said I the screen size will more likely be up around 110". 

The room is 20' long with the projector going somewhere around 12' from the front as Sonnie suggested. Putting that into the link you provide suggests a screen size of 65-69" (diagnal). 

If the projector system is gonna be around same size as the plasma tv I think I'd rather change my mind again and go back to a plasma. One of the main reasons for choosing the projector over plasma was the bigger picture it would provide.


----------



## Fincave

Hi,

What projector do you have in mind, I can then have a look at the calculator page. Also bear in mind that the various sliders on the page can be adjusted and using the zoom on the projector you will get a bigger picture. My projector is about 3.5m (11ft) from the screen and the screen is about 100", measured diagonally.


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## Fincave

Just had a quick look at the calculation page. Using the Sanyo Z4 as projector and a throw distance of 12ft it gives screen size as 106" diagonal with zoom set at 1.79


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## Tommy

Work Update

Last night I fixed up the soffits in the ht room and went an put 2.5" sheetrock screws in all the joints of the 2x2's along with the existing nails. It feels much more stable now. 

I still have the soffits outside the HT room to do but its amazing how the HT room has all my attention and I keep neglecting the rest of the basement that is also getting finished.

I put up four coulmns in the HT room as described yesterday, two on each side wall. Still havent decided on whether or not to put them on the back wall till I decide it the component rack should go in that one corner or not.

The slim 5 rack came yesterday but I havent even opened the box yet. At this point I picture I'm still gonna have to frame the recessed enclosure for the rack anyway so at the point why would I need to put the shelving system into the enclosure rather then just screwing wood shelves into it, so I may see about sending that back.

Bloggin a Rant:

Ok I'll have to admit I'm just completely frustated with the project at this point. I researched everything, selected my price range for each part of the project and selected products by recommendations on the web in those price ranges.

I've already spent 5 grand on building materials, speakers, shelf, & the receiver.

At this point I dont know if what I ordered was good or not, not sure if I can send it all back for a refund, finding out that I have more stuff to order then I thought I did. Not sure if money has been wasted and how much more is needed etc...

Originally I didnt have the builder finish the basement because I though he was price gouging for it, now I'm regretting just not having it done. I've been the same about the HT room worried if I hired a professional that he would over charge and I would get more for my money if I did it myself. Although it would be great to always know that I did it myself.

At this point I need to consider if I should hire someone to come and finish everything. I feel lost with the equipment and what exactly I need and worried I might spend a ton of money just to wind up having to redo it all.

Ok no real need to comment on this but figured I would add it for others to see if they reach the same point as me during there projects.

End Rant


----------



## Tommy

Fincave said:


> Hi,
> 
> What projector do you have in mind, I can then have a look at the calculator page. Also bear in mind that the various sliders on the page can be adjusted and using the zoom on the projector you will get a bigger picture. My projector is about 3.5m (11ft) from the screen and the screen is about 100", measured diagonally.


Thanks bro, ummm no clue about what type of projector I want yet... havent even got that far yet. When I do, I'll let you guys know what I can afford and take your recommendations on it. But basically I know we were budgeting around 7k for the plasma so that should be enough for the projector and screen, right?

Right now i'm still stuck on audio. How to wire the surround and where to put the rack and what components I need etc...


----------



## Fincave

7K!!! You can definitely get a projector for that price. I have the Z3 which set me back about 1200$ and it has come down in price since then. My DIY screen probably cost 120$ and that included me buying some tools and also having the MDF board cut to size.


----------



## Tommy

Trying to finish the framming for the room

Riser:

As another subject jump though, I'd also like to ask advice about the riser. Can I frame my riser now before the walls are sheet rocked and then sheet rock around it?

The riser would be from wall to wall so if I frame it now that bottom part of the wall will not be sheet rocked but the risers will be insulated and carpted etc... 

I got the feeling I should wait till after the walls are sheet rocked but I'd also like to get it done now so all the framing for the room would be completed (beside the rack and door). Also it would be open and in place for any wiring that needs to be done when the electrician comes in.

Door:

Ok I still need to frame a door into the room. I left a 33" wide spot for it right at the front of the right wall (as you face the screen) but if can be changed if necessary. I know I need some type of solid door and I have seen at least one post somewhere suggesting that masonite type of door but I saw the masonite doors at home depot and although solid, they seem rather thin. Is there a recommended type of door to look for besides this?


----------



## JCD

The amp you'd need can be relatively inexpensive -- you might even be able to go with a Pro Audio amp (as opposed to a regular home audio amp). They're generally noisier, but since you can put this pretty much anywhere you want, the noise factor should be a problem. If you go the Pro Audio route, you can get this for only $100

Another alternative would be a plate amp. Plate amps are super cheap too. This one  is only $128.

I think both of those amps have enough power for those speakers. Maybe someone else can comment. They're not super high quality amps -- but I would think they're totally fine for sub duties.

With either amp, your wiring I think should be pretty straightforward:

sub out from your reciever to the amp to the speakers which would be wired like this.

All that being said, I'd still contact MTX to get their suggestion. The brand seems to be geared for professional installers, so that might be why the documentation is a little light. 

As for the construction questions -- that's DEFINITELY out of my league. Poinding nails I can do -- actually knowing what the **** I'm doing I don't.

JCD


----------



## Tommy

JCD said:


> The amp you'd need can be relatively inexpensive -- you might even be able to go with a Pro Audio amp (as opposed to a regular home audio amp). They're generally noisier, but since you can put this pretty much anywhere you want, the noise factor should be a problem. If you go the Pro Audio route, you can get this for only $100
> 
> Another alternative would be a plate amp. Plate amps are super cheap too. This one  is only $128.
> 
> I think both of those amps have enough power for those speakers. Maybe someone else can comment. They're not super high quality amps -- but I would think they're totally fine for sub duties.
> 
> With either amp, your wiring I think should be pretty straightforward:
> 
> sub out from your reciever to the amp to the speakers which would be wired like this.
> 
> All that being said, I'd still contact MTX to get their suggestion. The brand seems to be geared for professional installers, so that might be why the documentation is a little light.
> 
> As for the construction questions -- that's DEFINITELY out of my league. Poinding nails I can do -- actually knowing what the **** I'm doing I don't.
> 
> JCD


Thanks bro. Well a few hundred I'm not worried about (thousands is another story) more worried if I got the wrong receiver or something since I thought it was supposed to have an amp built in.

Completly confuse about how to wire it but not worried about that at the moment, still just trying to figure out what I need to buy and order.

As you can see the MTX site is a bit off as far as the manuals, there not there for all models and the ones that are there just show how to attach it to the wall but nothing about the wiring. 

I did email them yesterday and I'm still waiting on a response.


----------



## JCD

Tommy said:


> Thanks bro. Well a few hundred I'm not worried about (thousands is another story) more worried if I got the wrong receiver or something since I thought it was supposed to have an amp built in.
> 
> Completly confuse about how to wire it but not worried about that at the moment, still just trying to figure out what I need to buy and order.
> 
> As you can see the MTX site is a bit off as far as the manuals, there not there for all models and the ones that are there just show how to attach it to the wall but nothing about the wiring.
> 
> I did email them yesterday and I'm still waiting on a response.


 No prob.. 

As for the amp, I'd like to see if anyone else has some alternatives. I haven't actually used either amp, so I can't confirm good or poor performance.

As for the wiring, when it comes time, I'm sure we can help out with better, more explicit instructions -- it may depend on the amp you get though.

Oh, and the receiver is totally fine. I'm sure there may be some, but I can't think of any receivers that power the sub line out.

JCD


----------



## Sonnie

I know of an sub manufacturer that uses this amp as an option in their subs. It's in the same area that Jacen listed the one he referred to at Parts Express. I think they'll be the least expensive place to buy it. It cost $298 but it's a little more power and has a pretty good design.



Going back to the projector... as Fincave later pointed out, you will be more than fine with a 100" screen with a Z4 hung at 12' back... or for that matter, most similar projectors in that range. His suggestion of projecting the image onto a sheet (or a white unpainted wall) to start with will help you decide how big you want it. I did the same thing. I hung the projector, left the front wall unpainted and decided I liked the 97" diagonal screen for the distance I was sitting. Some will like 110" and some will like 84"... it's all up to what you want. But I believe you'll want more than 60-65" in that room.


----------



## Tommy

Everyone here is so great!!!

Ok I'm a bit better now that I made a little progress at least. I talked it over with Sonnie and decided to jump ahead and put the riser in before sheet rocking the walls. So tonights progress report is about the riser installation.

I decided to use 2x10's for the frame and figured I would need 20 boards at 8' long. Home Depot had them for $7.50 for the regular ones and $12 for the treated ones. At almost double the price per board for the treated boards I decided to be cheap and get the regular ones (I'm sure that will probly come back to bite me in the a$$ in the future.) So another $150 spent on wood for the day... 

Installation was easy and a nice tight fit. It seems weighted well and its also nailed to the surrounding walls. Still considering putting some floor plate boards in and power nailing it to the floor too. Any thoughts if that is needed or not?

I've seen different things on the web about what to put as the floor for the riser as far as one or two sheets of 3/4 plywood. What do you guys suggest as far as that goes?

I'll ask later but will need to know what wiring I'll need to do to the riser. For now what I have left to do as far as framing 

- the plywood floor for the riser
- put the door in
- frame for the equipment rack
- frame a recessed dvd rack

Oh and still gotta frame a bunch of soffits in the rest of the basement. After that I guess its time to call an electrician. Havent decided yet if I should do the sheet rock or have someone else do it.

NDawg suggested I send the sub back, not sure what the return policy is or not but I'm gonna send it back if I can.

I'll finish off tonight with a few pic's of the new riser. It does eliminate my thoughts of putting the equipment rack in that back corner though. After seeing the space with the riser and the low ceiling there, I think thats being designated the kiddie corner of the room...

I'll have to measure everything out on the front wall as far as screen size, plus the in-wall speakers on the sides and see whats left over and if theres even enough space left at that point to put the equipment rack there.


----------



## Tommy




----------



## Tommy




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## Tommy




----------



## Sonnie

Okay... showing off the yardrats! lol I bet they can't wait for you to get finished.

As far as the riser is concerned, I glued or maybe I used liquid nail and then I think I pre-drilled holes and screwed it down, a sheet of 3/4" MDF for the floor. Then I treated it with Thompson water seal. Then padded and carpeted as normal. I think you'll wanna put a step there... that's a pretty big step up. Either a small width step on each side or one all the way across. In that step up you may want to consider a phone jack, computer connections such as a ethernet jack and maybe a port for games, and at least one electrical outlet. 

Erik might be able to hook you up with a good sub... not sure if he can do mail order or not, but he could at least point you in the right direction. Another consideration there would be IB... which I know nothing about other than I know some folks who have done it with a utility room behind the front screen wall similar to what you have. You simply mount a sub in the front wall and the utility room is the volume of the box. Again, I'm not well versed in this area so I'll stop there.


----------



## Tommy

The kids I was using as a comparision for measuring. You can see that corner and the available height clearance because of the soffit for my 8 & 12 yr old (it is now labeled the kiddie corner). And of course everyone wants the room done by next week right... lol

Sonnie, so one sheet of 3/4" plywood or MDF should be enough? I've seen others saying use 2 sheets and was wondering if one sheet was to unstable or anything. You treated the top of it with waterseal??

I was originally thinking of 2 side steps but put that on the back burner since I dont know the width of the seating row yet. 

Shoot, I wish I would have remembered about it and put more thought into it. The riser is 7' in depth I should have included the second step into that total depth. I dont want to push the front row up any further.

I will probably stop and get the plywood today on my way home. Is there any difference selecting the MDF over the plywood? Also you've mentioned previously, I should extend the plywood about 2" past the riser for a lip for the light, correct?

And ya I know I have some planning / questioning to do about wiring for the riser but trying to put that on hold for now so I'm not overwhelming everyone here with to many different questions at once.

As for the sub, I emailed the company this morning to see what there return policy is (I know too late right, should have checked that before ordering 2k worth of **** from them).

Anyway I'm waiting to hear what the response is to see whether or not I'll get a refund or store credit or if I'm stuck with what I got. There response may determine or at least limit the choices of what I am able to get.


----------



## Sonnie

Tommy said:


> Sonnie, so one sheet of 3/4" plywood or MDF should be enough? I've seen others saying use 2 sheets and was wondering if one sheet was to unstable or anything. You treated the top of it with waterseal??


I think one sheet is plenty, but you can use two if you want to. I treated the top simply because it's MDF and if for some unforseen reason it got wet... well you know what happens with wet MDF... it swells. Of course we are very cautious with drinks in our HT room, and it would take a lot to soak it enough through the carpet and padding, but you just never know.


Tommy said:


> Shoot, I wish I would have remembered about it and put more thought into it. The riser is 7' in depth I should have included the second step into that total depth. I dont want to push the front row up any further.


Go ahead and measure the width of your seating and just put the minimum width you can get by with on each side. If you are going to have separate seats then figure about 2-3 inches between seats.


Tommy said:


> Is there any difference selecting the MDF over the plywood? Also you've mentioned previously, I should extend the plywood about 2" past the riser for a lip for the light, correct?


I used MDF because plywood has been known to separate and might somehow cause some vibration in the layers. Just an extra precaution. And yes, a couple of inches extension over the front of the riser should be plenty. I actually don't have lights there myself and never had a problem seeing the step... nor has anyone else. The lights are on until everyone is seated and then I hit the button on my remote to turn them off. If someone needs to get up during the movie we usually pause it, raise the lights and go, or the movie screen will also put off enough light most of the time... if you don't want to pause it. It's just never been a problem for us, but I've still got it setup to install lights under the lip of the riser if ever need be.


----------



## JCD

Tommy said:


> Oh and still gotta frame a bunch of soffits in the rest of the basement. After that I guess its time to call an electrician. Havent decided yet if I should do the sheet rock or have someone else do it.


My suggestion here would totally depend on what you're going to do with the walls. If they're going to be painted or covered by something. Hanging the actual sheetrock is not terribly difficult. Taping the seams well is a fine art that borders on magic from what I've been told. So, if you're going to cover them with something, do it yourself. If not, maybe hand the sheetrock and get someone to tape it -- that's what I did at my previous house.




Tommy said:


> NDawg suggested I send the sub back, not sure what the return policy is or not but I'm gonna send it back if I can.


I'd agree with that as well. 
However, that leads you to a new dilemma, what sub are you going go with this time? Are you still going to go for an in-wall setup? Or a standalone? The standalone is the easier way to go, but you'd end up with a box sitting in a corner..

Decisions, decisions, decisions.. :devil: 

JCD


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## Tommy

Ok I got the MDF flooring. I actually got 16 boards (1' wide x 8' long sections) the 4x8's wouldnt have fit in the explorer... lol 

I cut it and fitted on the riser but didnt nail it down. I'll wait till after insulating, wiring etc for that.

I still have to make two riser steps but since we havent purchased the actual seats yet I'm hesitent on guessing how much room I will need for the seats. The width of the room is 168" and it looks like the average 3 seat recliners are about 110". Guessing at leaving 10" extra for space leaves me room for a 2' wide step on each side. 

I think that autta be wide enough but sheetrock, carpet the seats all taking up inches of space could wind up throwing me off or limiting our selection for the seats. 

I put together the midatlantic slim 5 rack frame. Made an 3/4 pine enclouse for it. Gotta start framing it into the wall and put a rear door on it tomorrow. Gonna make a recessed DVD shelving unit too.

I had a sheet rocker come out for an estimate today. He looked over everything and will give me a quote soon. Let me ask a couple questions about the sheet rock though.

I did a bunch of research on the sound proofing and see people going way overboard on the walls. I was gonna overstuff it with insulation, and put the 2 sheets of rock up, plus carpeting the walls.

Well we changed our minds about carpeting the walls and just want to paint now. Also I've beeb hearing others say the 2 layers of sheetrock isnt noticably different then one layer. I'd like to hear opinions about this and see if its worth it or not?

Im definetly no audiophile and acoustically probably will never hear the difference that most seem to sit there and make never ending adjustments for. My main concern is that it sounds decent and isnt disturbing the upstairs. 

By the way, how long does it take for someone to say sheetrock the basement and ceiling? This guy estimated 2 weeks, that seems kinda long to me for a professional.

I got a reply back from the store and they ok'd the return for the sub. They didnt mention store credit so I think I'm free to select whatever is recommended.


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## JCD

> how long does it take for someone to say sheetrock the basement and ceiling?


That seems like a long time to me too.. unless he didn't have the time to do it for 2 weeks. Seems to me that I put up sheetrock with another friend and it took about 1-2 hours to do the ceiling -- which was vaulted. That didn't include the taping which I had done -- that took less than a day. I would have guessed a day for hanging the sheetrock and a day to tape it up if you know what you're doing. But then, it was a long time ago, so maybe it took longer than I thought.



> I got a reply back from the store and they ok'd the return for the sub. They didnt mention store credit so I think I'm free to select whatever is recommended.


Good news! 

If you're going to be concerned about the outside noise factor, I'd think you'll be "stuck" with a free standing sub (as opposed to an inwall). If so, there are two companies I HIGHLY recommend:

SVS and Hsu. Both are internet only companies and both offer unbeatable deals on their subs. I know that if you e-mail the people over at SVS with the proper information, they'll give you the sub they'd recommend -- which is often a smaller sub than you'd expect. I e-mailed them for a friend, and got a recommendation the same day. I'm sure Hsu does the same, but I haven't personally tried.

In either case, you'll be MUCH happier with a sub from either one of these vendors than with the one you had.:T 


JCD


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## Sonnie

Good news on the sub!

Brian, *bricor*, (member here) did something pretty cool with subs in his HT room if you wanna get them out of the room area. Only problem is his are in the ceiling, which may not work for you, but you could do what he did on one of your walls. He may could tell you about the outside noise. PM him and see if he'll share with you. OR as Jacen suggested... go for SVS or HSU.


Again... as Jacen says... 2 weeks for that sheetrock is way too long. A day to hang it and screw it at most. First mud and tape another day. Second mud and tape another. Another mud day. Sand and finish touch up mud day. 5 days would be max if he works every day. Of course not all sheetrockers are dependable. As is the case with many contractors it seems... but not all.


I wouldn't pack the walls with insulation, just the normal amount. For stagger studded 2 X 4's on a 6" plate, R-13 on each side is fine. I believe uncompressed is better for performance. Two sheets vs. one sheet... don't know... I went with two sheets of 5/8" on the inside walls and ceiling and my room is extremely well soundproofed. I just took no chances. Also look at my entrance door on my HT Construction pages. Two solid core doors and they are hard to shut due to the air tightness on them.


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## Tommy

Yea I was thinking that was kind of long. Although keeping in mind that he would be rocking my whole basement about 1,700 square foot plus the ceiling and the soffits. Also I threw in for him to rock my garage. For some reason in the newly built house they only rocked half the garage, they say they only finish whatever walls are actually touching the house.

As I said my house is a new house and its still a devlopment site with over 100 more houses that are being built. Trying to find the **** little helpers they use to rock the houses and see who works on the side... but **** I aint even seen them yet, they hide good.


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## Tommy

Weekend update:

Made some good progress but not as much as I would have liked. I finished the wood enlosure that will house the midatlantic rack and framed it into the wall. It looks real nice and the room is actually starting to take on an appearance of an HT room even though its just studs at the moment.

Also I made a DVD shelves/cabinet that I am also going to recess into the wall. I made it 27x40 so once its in it will be basically the same size as the movie posters that will go on the wall. I still have to remove a stud and frame it into the wall though.

I picked up 3 doors for the basement, on of which was for the HT room. Where the HT door is though is directly below a beam in the ceiling. The highest I could frame for that spot only left me 80" so I had to hack an inch of the bottom of the door. It was a solid door so it cut nice though.

Other then that I hung the other door and started the third both of which are in the basement but not part of the HT room.

Nothing worth take new pics yet but I will once I get the rest of the HT framing done. Only got to put in the dvd cabinet and make 2 steps for the riser and I think that phase will be done. As for the rest of the basement I have 2 soffits about 40' long each that I gotta frame and then that will be done too.

Not sure if I can get that much done in a week or not but I dont think it will matter. I have reserves again next weekend so it will be atleast 2 - 3 weeks before I can get an electrician in unless I start missing work and getting done during the week. That blows that I am gonna get slowed up on this part.


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## Tommy

Time to start actually selecting and ordering the rest of the equipment though. I was putting it off only for fear of starting this whole thing and then not completing it.

Alright now its time for me to start selecting projectors screens etc. I have the speakers and reciver and nothing else so throw out all your suggestions. Is there really any noticable differences/options in the projectors? I have read several books on this subject but sort of skipped over the projector sections all the time since we intially were set on doing a flat screen tv instead.

So I know I need a projector, screen, sub anything else? What are all those component pieces I see on HT sites about bass shakers, butt kickers etc... Not that I know much about it but it seems like nolvety type items but if there decent the kids might like it.


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## Tommy

Oh yea I need seats and accessories and that stuff too. Of course this non-essential stuff is more entertaining to the wife then the rest of the project combined.

I already know she's impressed with those corny movie wall sconces at almost $200 each... Also she's hinted at those carpets. 

No forums like spamming / promoting retail sites but if there are any recommendations for this type of stuff I'm sure it would be helpfull for others in addition to myself.


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## Tommy

Wiring the risers:

Sonnie pointed out some suggestions/options for this to get wired in the riser. Now that thats actually getting closer can we get a bit more detailed about that. I have to find the post and re-read it again to see all that you suggested but off the top of my head I do have a question about the rope light. I believe it was NDawg's site that directly wired there rope lights though.

I'm thinking of two dimmer switches for the room, one for the wall sconces and the other which will be recessed lights directed onto the posters on the wall plus whatever extra recessed lights are needed for the room.

Should the rope lights for the risers be tied into one of these switches or something different altogether?

Also if there are suggestions for anything different or anything I may be missing please let me know.


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## Sonnie

If the rope lights are the same type lights as your sconce lights then you can connect them in with the dimmer if you want to, but if I'm not mistaken you have those so you don't have to cut the other lights on. Not sure if Erik has his on a switch or not.

As far as projectors... start a thread in the Display Devices forum requesting info on a projector. Make sure you let us know how much you are willing to spend.

I'm not really familiar with bass shakers... other than the two subs I got... they do plenty of shakin' without anything added. It's my understanding that they are added to your seats to give you more vibration.


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> If the rope lights are the same type lights as your sconce lights then you can connect them in with the dimmer if you want to, but if I'm not mistaken you have those so you don't have to cut the other lights on. Not sure if Erik has his on a switch or not.
> 
> As far as projectors... start a thread in the Display Devices forum requesting info on a projector. Make sure you let us know how much you are willing to spend.
> 
> I'm not really familiar with bass shakers... other than the two subs I got... they do plenty of shakin' without anything added. It's my understanding that they are added to your seats to give you more vibration.


How can the rope lights be the same as the wall sconces? But you are right, while the sconces and the recessed lights will need to be dimmed the rope light will be on. So should this be put on a third switch?


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## Sonnie

You have different dimmers for different type lights. Unless the technology has changed, you have to have a dimmer for flourescent lights and a different dimmer for incandescent lights... and I don't thing they make one for neon lights. 

Correct... I'd probably put the rope lights on a separate switch, no dimmer really needed for them.


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> As far as projectors... start a thread in the Display Devices forum requesting info on a projector. Make sure you let us know how much you are willing to spend.


Ok I started the thread


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## NorwegianDawg

I'd dim the rope light as well...in a completely dark room...depending on how/where they're installed...can be quite bright! 

E


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## Tommy

NorwegianDawg said:


> I'd dim the rope light as well...in a completely dark room...depending on how/where they're installed...can be quite bright!
> 
> E


Should it be a seperate switch altogether or tied in with either the recessed lights or wall sconces?

Do they even sell 3 switch dimmers?


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## Sonnie

I have three dimmer switches in my wall plate. Each switch is rated to handle so many watts... I believe mine are like 600 or 800 watts. Add up the wattage you want on each switch and buy the appropriate size switch.

Here's a really bad blown up pic of my switches... I don't have a close up so I tried to blow it up as much as possible... these are the rocker style with the smaller sider rockers next to the big rocker.










Looks like this and is remote controllable:










Except there's three:


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## Tommy

Thats cool. I know an electrician that I will probably use, he's a friend of the family so I'm not worried about him ripping me off or anything like that. Only problem is hes on vacation now, and then he's also a reservist and are weekends conflict so it may be 3-4 weeks before I can even get him to come out to my house. I wouldnt be able to talk to him for another week just to make arrangements.


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## Tommy

Oh well last nights update:

Besides visiting with an installer to see what he would charge for the HT installation I hung the last door in the basement and also removed a stud in the HT room and put in framed the recessed dvd shelves/cabinet I made.

Overall it looks nice as far as its the appearance I wanted for it. Unfortunatly there were a few mistakes and I think I'm gonna tear it out and start it over. Not terribly bad but it sticks out past the studs by 1.25" instead of the 1/2" I was planning for the sheet rock. I measured the spacing in a different spot then where it winded up going and there was that difference in space with the foundation wall behind the studs. Also the bottom shelf split when attaching it to the frame.

Again it looks ok and I probably could fix it and no one else would know but at this point it would probably be better to spend the extra couple hours and do it right, it's my own house right...

Dont know if I'll be able to run to home depot tonight and get more wood to start it tonight or not though.


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## Tommy

Update:

Ok the dvd shelves sticking out a half inch further then they should and the wood splitting on the one spot annoyed me already and I did I ripped the whole thing out and did it over.

Other then that no new milestones were met, I finished the shelves, hinged the door on the rear of the equipment rack and cut a few inches from the bottom of it for room for cords and air. 

Also I put in the steps for the risers. I left 2" on the lip on the steps & riser for carpet and then the rope lights, it looks like the lips to big though. For anyone else who has also done the rope lights what size lip did you use?

I had 4 installers come in this in the last 3 days and didnt actually get an estimate from any of them yet but waiting to see what they have to say. But basically I got a few ideas which I was hoping for and unless one comes back with an unbelievable low installation price will probably finish the job myself.

Sheet rock guy called with his price, he wanted 3k to rock the basement and the garage and said that was just labor and didnt include material. So I guess I'm rocking myself too. Not looking forward to trying to do that myself...

As far as framing is concerned, the HT room is done! 

I still got soffits and columns/poles and **** in the rest of the basement to do though. Not sure how long that will take.

Still looking for an electrician and someone to do the duct work. God only knows how long thats gonna take or how much theyll over-charge for that. But I have reserves this weekend & my kid's bday next weekend so Im hoping this all doesnt get pushed to far back. 

So next steps are 
- finish soffits/columns in rest of the basement
- get hire electrician & hvac guy
- start ordering equipment

Any last comments / suggestions as far as framming for HT room goes?


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## Sonnie

I didn't mind hanging the sheetrock... it was the mudding I was dreading, so I hired that part out. Cost me about 200 bucks.


Sounds like you got the framing figured out pretty well. Keep us posted on your progress.


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## JCD

Maybe it's in another thread, but I thought I'd drop a line and see if there has been any progress lately?

JCD


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## Tommy

10 days since my last update hmmm... Sorry all, I havent dropped off the earth and my lack of an progress update was just because there hasnt been any new milestones to report.

The work I've put in lately has been with framing the rest of the basement so havent much new to say about the HT room. Still got another week or two on the rest of the basement because I havent got a full day to put towards it yet, just an hour or two per night.

Out of the 4 installers that came out a week and a half ago, I havent received any written quotes from any of them yet. I did get a couple calls though asking if I'd consider sending everything I purchased so far back. I think there mainly interested in the money they make for the sales of products and not so much the installation part.

However we did make an appointment and went to the one guys showroom yesterday. The wife was really impressed with the demo the guy put on and loved the projection system and sound. The room he had was actually a couple feet shorter then what we got, so we got a pretty good overall picture.

The projector he used was a Mitsubishi DLP projector, I dont know what model but he said it was around 4k. The picture looked great but I really dont have other projectors to use as a comparison. I looked real hard for that rainbow effect but couldnt see it. He said I wouldnt with this high of a model. I could see the screen door effect if I walked up close though. Again I dont know what to say because I dont know if it is better or worse to lower priced models. Has anyone have any opinions on the mitsubishi projectors?

He suggested I do either one large sub woofer or two smaller ones for my room. What do you's think one large one or two smaller ones? Also suggested I fill my risers with a fine gravel or sand (I think the insulation will be enough though). His demo room was on a second floor so it was great with the floor boards vibrating with the demo. 

One of the things we discussed though and I'm debating on now is that **** soffit in the HT room. The one side of the screen will go under the soffit. He suggested I put a filler soffit straight across the room so that the whole screen would be under it.

I'm not sure if the sceen view is going to be disturbed or not if left as it. Also if I bring the soffit out 4' like he suggests I lose that section of wall that I was atleast planning on putting up a poster or something.

The pics are up on this room, what do you's think, should I run a soffit across the front of it?

Of course he also went thru the whole reflection **** about why that would be wrong for us to put up posters at all but that was the look we were going for, two columns on each wall with a movie poster between each.


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## JCD

To answer your questions:

re: Mitsubishi projectors
No experience. I haven't seen them much in the professional reviews or with the online/forum reviews. I don't know if no news is good news or if a lack of information is because others were found other brands to be better for the same price. I will say that in the past (and it may not be the same now) that Mits rear projection tv's were more expensive than other comparable models from other brands. That was a long time ago and I don't know if that price variance still stands.

re: one sub vs 2 subs
well, for me it would all depend on which subs you're talking about. If you're going to go with a free standing sub, I really really really would go with a SVS sub. We have Tom V drop by occasionally, I think his opinion would be a good one to solicit. Without getting too much into it, I'd guess that one big sub would be your best bet for the same $$ outlay.

re: Soffit
I'm not that good with my imagination to see what the finished project will look like -- however, I can tell you that symmetry is high on my list of aesthetic needs. It might bug me if the room was irregular in this kind of way. But, then again, this is one area where I might be a little ****. 

Good luck on the rest of your project. I'm sure the final project will be worth the wait.

JCD


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## Tommy

Ok JCD made me feel like I've been neglecting on my updates, so I'm gonna jump back to my blogging here in a second.

re: Mitsubishi projectors
I havent heard anyone recommend them either except for this installer. No clue which model except the price range though, I'll have to find out. The one Mitsubishi review I just looked at in that price range was 2.5 stars out of 5, scarey - I want 5 out of 5 stars for that much money

re: one sub vs 2 subs
Yea it will not be an in-wall sub. I'll get which sounds best for the room, one or two.

re: Soffit
Ok maybe I'm doing a bad job of explaining it, I'll try again plus I'll put up some pic's. The room has a soffit on the right hand side if you look thru the pics that are already posted. When we decided to do the projector instead of the plasma I realized the bigger screen will now partially be under the soffit on the one side of the screen.

I cant decide if that will distract the viewing area or not with the screen partially under the soffit. I do agree in symetry and think extending the soffit across the front of the room so that the whole screen is now under the lower ceiling may solve the problem.

This however brings up two possibile issues, first will it be distracting with the whole ceiling that low above the screen? The soffit height will be about 81"

Second smaller issue is that it takes away from the side wall where I did want to put a poster.


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## Tommy

Ok here are pics of the rest of the basement, you can see I ran a 45' long soffit run out there and have another one still to do plus frame around the poles


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## Tommy

Here is the framed equipment rack, recessed dvd shelves, riser & steps


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## Tommy

Ok here's a few different pic's of the soffit I was trying to explain in the front of the room.


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## JCD

I think I've got it now.. so, is the question if you should run another soffit along the left hand side of the room?
Something like this?








JCD


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## Tommy

JCD said:


> I think I've got it now.. so, is the question if you should run another soffit along the left hand side of the room?
> Something like this?
> View attachment 89
> 
> 
> JCD


Actually no! Sorry if i'm communicating this badly.

Here is the original picture with the soffit only on the right side of the room










With deciding to use a projector instead of a plasma, the screen size enlarged so that about 1 to 2 foot of screen is now going to be under that soffit on the right.

My question really was, what is better just leaving it be that the one side is under the soffit or like I did today and extend it across the front so that now the whole screen is under the soffit.

I just hate wasting all that space if that one soffit may or may not be a future distraction to the viewing area.


----

Aside I have also thought of a possibile tray ceiling as you mentioned but dismissed the idea because to be even it would take up to much of the room. The soffit on the one side is 4.5' so to match I would be losing 9' of ceiling on and only have a 5' center.


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## JCD

No, if there is someone a little slow on the uptake, I'm sure it's me. :blush: 

I'll take another stab at it. Is this what you're talking about?









JCD


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## Tommy

Well the screens in the right spot... :laugh: 

The soffit you have drawn in on the left side of the screen is wrong. I wanted to know if I should put a soffit across the front of the room or not (which I already did but debating on whether or not to take it down. Here is the before and after pic

Before - without soffit across the front










After - with soffit on front wall


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## bricor

Tommy,

I have the Mitsubishi HC3000 myself and have installed at least 10 of them for other customers. Not sure which model you saw (the hc3000 is $2500 list) but it's a great projector for the money. It's quiet, puts up a great pic after some basic calibration and has been very reliable.


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## Tommy

bricor said:


> Tommy,
> 
> I have the Mitsubishi HC3000 myself and have installed at least 10 of them for other customers. Not sure which model you saw (the hc3000 is $2500 list) but it's a great projector for the money. It's quiet, puts up a great pic after some basic calibration and has been very reliable.


Hi Bricor:

I didnt get the exact model from him but he said it was around 4k. So either he's quoting a high price for the HC3000 or he's talking about another model. The next model HC4000 I see is selling for 4k but is listed for business and not HT.

For the 2,500 range I think its an excellent pick but for the 4k range I would like to find something better. I just wasnt thrilled with it. 

As someone who has compared different projectors, what is your recommendation in the 5k range for DLP projectors?


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## JCD

Tommy said:


> Well the screens in the right spot... :laugh:
> 
> The soffit you have drawn in on the left side of the screen is wrong. I wanted to know if I should put a soffit across the front of the room or not (which I already did but debating on whether or not to take it down.)



AHHHH!!! Finally I think the light went on! :duh: :blink: :duh: 

Now to answer, hmm.. that's a tough one. If I had to guess, I'd say the current soffit across the front will be better than without. I might consider a small run along the left side as well. You wouldn't have to go the entire run of the room, but maybe 8ft or so. Your attention is going to be concentrated at the front of the room so keeping the front symmetrical would be important for me.

But like I said, I'm **** that way.. 

JCD


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## Tommy

JCD said:


> AHHHH!!! Finally I think the light went on! :duh: :blink: :duh:
> 
> Now to answer, hmm.. that's a tough one. If I had to guess, I'd say the current soffit across the front will be better than without. I might consider a small run along the left side as well. You wouldn't have to go the entire run of the room, but maybe 8ft or so. Your attention is going to be concentrated at the front of the room so keeping the front symmetrical would be important for me.
> 
> But like I said, I'm **** that way..
> 
> JCD


Right thats why we were thinking we needed the soffit across the front so that the whole screen is under the soffit and not just part of it.

As for running in the left of the room, this would be nice but causes 2 more problems. First is the soffit on the right hand side is 4.5' wide, so the left would need to be the same. This of course doesnt leave much room in the middle.

The second is the soffit is real low 6' 8" and a foot lower on the riser.


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## Tommy

Not to much new to write about, Monday night a guy came out to give an estimate on doing the sheet rock (he was supposed to show on the previous friday though). Still waiting for him to come back with a quote.

Hey when I did the floor for the riser, I used that wonderboard or whatever the **** its called because the HT guy said it would be better for sound. The carpenter suggested scrapping that and using plywood saying that it will warp. Thoughts?

Gonna strangle the wife... Ok we started this project with the intentions of putting a 60" plasma screen in this room and eventually changed our minds (hometheatershack's fault) from that to a front projector. So now not only am I pulling my hair out trying to select from projectors that I cant see before hand but now am told she still wants a large plasma tv for the living room besides the projector for the HT room.

I'm like what the **** we putting all this money into for this HT room if your gonna get a new plasma tv for the living room. Seems like we should do one or the other but not both. 

Anyway we went out to local stores last night to start looking at Plasma tv's. From what I read on reviews Pioneer seems like the best. But of course out of the 3 stores we went to, there was a total of 2 pioneer tv's between them all. Its amazing all the other brands they carried but hardly any pioneer at all.

The wife was ewwwing and awwing everything saying look how pretty... Me, I swear researching this HT stuff has ruined me watching anything at all. Now all I do is pic out the flaws in the screen picture etc...

They did have one front projector at Tweeters, the thing was huge so I'm assuming it was old. It was a yamaha, dont know what model but it had an awful picture to it, the worst I have seen yet.


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## Fincave

For the record, I know nothing about plasma televisions! Here is a link to a single post from another forum regarding plasmas, just something more for you to think about http://www.nextlevelav.com/forum/showpost.php?p=8510&postcount=1


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## Tommy

Fincave said:


> For the record, I know nothing about plasma televisions! Here is a link to a single post from another forum regarding plasmas, just something more for you to think about http://www.nextlevelav.com/forum/showpost.php?p=8510&postcount=1


Interesting post, thanks. I still wonder why most of the stores were going to are not displaying pioneer. 

We went to another audio/video place last night, all Sony's, mostly lcd. 

They were really against plasma in the TV sections and against DLP in the projection side. Sony LCD was there TV recommendation and Sony LCOS for there projectors.

My Sony VPL-VW100 review:

MSRP $ 9,999 
Projection 0.6" SXRD 
Bulb Replacement $800

- Picture was great
- Machine was huge but virtually silent
- No visibile SDE even walking up close

Well the price for this one is higher then I was looking for anyway and I still dont know enough about these projection types to trust them. But this was definetly one of the better demos we have seen.


----------



## Tommy

Update for the week :yawn: 

------------------------

HT Installers

One of the HT installers called back so far, havent heard from the rest. The one that did send out an estimate rated everything from 15-20k and of course wants me to send everything I bought back and buy thru him.

The projectors he's offering are two vidikrons, the one is 3,500 the other 5k. I havent seen either displayed so I dont know what there picture looks like. As for the rest though, I just cant picture it being 10-15k to install the projection and speakers specially when the walls are open at the moment. I would like to call and ask to see the projectors but I dont think I should if his prices are that high and Im not gonna choose him anway.

Most of his pricing looks based on light dimming options blah blah blah. But really I could care less if the light is on a remote or not, it will be like 5' from me. 


So as I said from the begining, I'll get the HT guys estimates and if any were fair, say 1-2k to hook everything up right plus me paying for the equipment of course then I would get them to do it. 

If there gonna charge 10-15k for wiring I think it would be worth me struggling thru it myself (with everyones help here) and putting the extra money actually into the room. And then paying for someone to calibrate it.


---------------

Duct Work

Besides that I had some friends come over on Sunday to take a look at doing the duct work. Sheesh, union guys... I figured they would just cut a few grills into the sides of the ducts and it would be done. They spent hours plotting out how there gonna re-run all the duct work in the basement and sceduled to do the work in a couple weeks.


-------------

Sheet Rock

I'm still waiting for the sheet rock guy to call back with a price. First guy gave me a price of 3k and told me that didnt include the material

------------

Electrician

An old friend of mine is coming out this weekend and gonna do the wiring for me. Or atleast what he can get done in a day I guess. This I could use advice on, is there any special wiring I need him to do for the HT room? Any special lines for the equipment rack or anything like that?

Sonnie, I know you mentioned a bunch of ideas for wiring the riser in the past and I said I'll hit ya up for more details when it gets closer, it's time.  

I'm thinking 3 switches on the wall, one for the wall sconces, one for the recessed lights in the ceiling and one for the rope lights on the riser like Sonnies suggested to me already. Besides that one electric socket for the equipment rack, one for the projector itself and a socket to each of the areas where the sub's will be. Am I missing anything else?

-------------

HT Equipment:

I've seen a few different displays in the last week or two. A couple places each only had that Sony to display. So far the mitsibisui one I've seen actually had the best picture for the money but I just wasnt thrilled with it. Not that I'm gonna sit that close but the SDE stuck out way to much when I did walk by it and also the picture was perfectly clear but very dull. That may be able to be fixed with a different calibration but im assuming they had it up as bright as it would go.

Anyway that BenQ projector Ive been researching and mentioned already, I'm gonna get to see it tonight. Since no one yet on this board has this projector I was forced to ask around other sites to see who has it and what they thought of it. Someone that lives in my state (about an hour - hour and a half from me) says they have it, love it and invited me over to see it.

The drive is gonna suck but I guess its worth a few hours before I spend that much money on something to see if I like it or not.


----------



## Steve Williamson

Tommy, I think you are better off doing the wiring yourself, at least you will know where it all is and it is done properly.

The attached image shows an in floor (riser) box housing sockets and av inputs, this way you can wire up any electric recliners, butt kickers, playstations/xbox's etc with having the sockets on show all the time.

Make sure that you have a detailed plan of the room showing every item, if you want to put lightboxes up for movie posters etc, it helps to know where any cables are.

Have you ruled out the Z4 or Panasonic projector, personally, I will not have a DLP projector. Even if I cannot see the rainbow effect, I know that one of my visitors will (not pleasant if you are vunerable to it)

Don;t rush the sheetrock, mock out where every item will be going before you put the stuff up.

Can't think of anything more! good work so far.

Oh, this is where I stole the photo from to give the guy recognition: http://theater.stevejenkins.com/gallery/complete/


----------



## Tommy

Tommy said:


> Anyway that BenQ projector Ive been researching and mentioned already, I'm gonna get to see it tonight. Since no one yet on this board has this projector I was forced to ask around other sites to see who has it and what they thought of it. Someone that lives in my state (about an hour - hour and a half from me) says they have it, love it and invited me over to see it.
> 
> The drive is gonna suck but I guess its worth a few hours before I spend that much money on something to see if I like it or not.


I went to the guys house last night, the projector was great! :yes: Wow I was definetly impressed, basing it against the other projectors Ive been going to see in the last few weeks. Someone would definetly have to show me something else and prove me wrong in order to say that this isnt the best one in the under 10k range. Shoot I actually liked it better then the 10k Sony I viewed.

Not sure if I should rush to buy it right away though or should I wait till after the room is finished. Is there any benifit as far as roughing in the room to having it now? 

It'll probably be another month or two till the room is actually sheet rocked and painted etc should I wait till after that before ordering?

I'm thinking if I get it now, I know exactly what I'm wiring for but do I really need that or is it generic? If I wait, the prices may come down or I may actually be proven wrong in that time and find something else.

By the way, I invited Jason the guy that let me come to his house and view this projector over to hear, so hopefully he'll be here soon


----------



## JCD

That's awesome that you were able to find someone to give you an in-home demonstration. Even better that you liked it.

As for getting it now or later.. that's a tough one. You may find something you like better before you're ready to install, but the projector may become discontinued between now and when you're ready to buy. If you wait, prices may come down. If you buy now...

All that being said, if you've done your due diligence, and this is best you've found, I'd probably buy it. If nothing else, you can hang a sheet on one of the walls and watch a few movies until the room is completed.

JCD


----------



## Tommy

Finally a new milestone,

I ordered my projector today. I got the BenQ PE8720 the stats on it are amazing.

I made sure the model will come with the latest firmware which they said was good that I asked specfically for it. It was at a fair low price for an authorized dealer. Plus I got the ceiling mount and a dvd player thrown in for the same price.

Also I ordered my screen from another dealer. It's an Stewart FireHawk 110" screen.

Both should take about 2 weeks to get here.

Ok now Im gonna need some help with what to order as far as wiring etc...


----------



## Sonnie

Congrats! You are gonna love that big picture... :yes:

The biggest thing is a good quality HDMI cable on the wiring for the pj. Measure how far and order up. I'll try to find where I got mine from (can't remember)... it's a heavy duty cable.... very nice and wasn't all that expensive.


----------



## Tommy

Electric Wiring:

Ok my buddy is coming to help me tomorrow with wiring the basement. This wont be the pj or the speakers, it wil be more the lights, switches and electric boxes. Let me throw out what I was thinking of telling him for the HT room and hopefully you all can advice and throw out some suggestions/corrections before tomorrow.

*HT Room

Lights*
4 lines for the wall sconces going in each of the 4 columns
6 small recessed ceiling lights, one between each of the columns (will shine on a poster between each column)
2-3 in the front soffit in front of the screen. (maybe this should be on a seperate line so I can shut the front lights off but still keep the poster lights on and dimmed.
2-3 Back wall. Not sure if any should go on the back wall or not but if they do they should probably be on the same line as the ones on the front wall. 
1 Possibly put an additional light or two on the back wall but in the soffit pointed on the equipment rack. This would be on the same line and the others on the back and front wall.
1 seperate electric line to the riser and riser steps to control rope lights

*Electric Sockets/Lines*
1st line
- socket for the equipment rack
- socket for the projector
- 2 sockets for the subs

2nd Line
- whatever additional sockets the electrician thinks it will need. Possibley putting more in each of the columns.

_*Wall Switch/Control*_

Do they even sell a 4 switch dimmer type control? I know Sonnie pointed out 3 dimmer controls which we may have to use.

1 - dimmer switch will control the wall sconces
2 - will control the side ceiling lights for the posters
3 - will control the front and rear wall ceiling lights which I'd like to control seperate so I can shut them off during a movie
4 - dimmer switch will control the rope lights on the riser & steps

Did I miss or forget anything?


----------



## Sonnie

I would want to be able to turn off all the lights during a movie... so why not just go ahead and put 2 and 3 on one dimmer switch. I don't think you'll poster lights on either, not during a movie. Or 1 and 2 together.

Looks like you got it all.


----------



## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> I would want to be able to turn off all the lights during a movie... so why not just go ahead and put 2 and 3 on one dimmer switch. I don't think you'll poster lights on either, not during a movie. Or 1 and 2 together.
> 
> Looks like you got it all.


It would depend on whether the poster lights were a nuisance during a movie even while dimmed. I figured if there not reflecting then they could stay on but to a dimmed level in which case I would need the front lights not to shine on the screen but you may be right.


----------



## Tommy

Quick update for the moment. We laid most of the wire for the HT room yesterday but did not connect it to the breaker box. I'll detail it more later. Gonna go do some more work now.

Also we bought a 42 or 43 inch pioneer plasma for our living room (not the ht room) this weekend. The picture looks great but during the day the ambient light is still washing the picture out.

So 2 questions, what were those disks or software stuff I've seen previously mentioned around here for calibrating displays and can it be used for both the plasma tv and the projector? 

And any suggestions for adjusting the display to see it better during the day? I have two side by side rooms both with 25' wall of windows its like a green house on the first floor even with blinds.


----------



## fibreKid

Two popular ones.
Avia
DVE

They both have their pros and cons. Avia is simpler to use if you haven't done it before, DVE is a little harder to navigate.

Enjoy 

-john


----------



## Tommy

Are the pro versions of these worth the expense?


----------



## Tommy

Ok to detail a bit more (now that Im at work) the progress over the weekend.

We ran all the wire for the HT room over to the breaker box but did not connect anything yet. We ran everything to be controlled by 4 switches on the wall.

1) will control 4 wall sconces
2) will control recessed ceiling lighting on the sides of the room
3) will control recessed ceiling lighting in the front and rear of the room
4) will control the rope lighting for the riser and steps

Besides that we ran a dedicated line to be used by the equipment rack, projector and sub(s). 

For the projector we ran the wire over to where the socket will be for the equipment rack and were thinking about putting a plug on the wire this way the projector can get plugged into the surger protector with the other components. 

I havent heard anyone mention doing anything like this but would think everyone has some type of protection for there expensive projectors. If I'm wrong let me know I can still connect it back into the line itself.
Also we ran some regular electric sockets.

Also we ran all the speaker wire for the 7.1 system except for the sub(s). I had purchased a 250' spool of 12g-2cl wire. After wiring 20x14 room I only had about 30' of extra wire so that was a pretty good guess for what I needed.

Surprisingly the most discussion was spent on how to wire for the rope lights for the riser and steps. Something about not being able to splice under the riser unless I put in an access panel or some ****.

My thoughts are run the wire down the column that winds up at the edge of the riser on both sides, splice for 2 branches in the column - one for the riser and one for the step and if an access panel is needed I'll put it in the column. Anything wrong with this?

About the rope lighting itself, I doubt I'll find any that are the exact lengths I need, is there any way that I'll be able to cut them to size?

Next steps, I still have to run line for the sub(s) and also whatever cables are needed for the projector and also start the insulating. I also have a ton still to do in the rest of the basement as far as framing which I've been neglecting in favor of the HT room.

The projector should arrive sometime next week so I'd like to get it set up and test it all before actually starting the sheetrock.


----------



## fibreKid

Not unless you have the expensive equipment to use them. Avia is about $40 and the DVE is about $25.


----------



## brucek

> For the projector we ran the wire over to where the socket will be for the equipment rack and were thinking about putting a plug on the wire this way the projector can get plugged into the surger protector with the other components.
> 
> I haven't heard anyone mention doing anything like this but would think everyone has some type of protection for there expensive projectors. If I'm wrong let me know I can still connect it back into the line itself.
> Also we ran some regular electric sockets.


Your proposal to put a plug on the end of the branch circuit to the projector is not allowed. You must continue the dedicated circuit at the equipment receptacle box over to another ceiling box and receptacle near the projector. You would then plug the projector into this receptacle.

The best method to protect your equipment and projector would be to install a 'whole house' surge arrestor at your service panel. They're quite cheap (<~$150) and you can usually purchase them from home depot.. I would continue to use the local surge protector you have at your rack for added equipment protection and if for nothing else a convenient place to plug everything into.

Note that a dedicated circuit is simply that and not to be branched to wall receptacles or anything else other than its dedication to your equipment rack. If you will be locating your single sub (recommended) in the front corner of the room, then you should branch your dedicated circuit to that single receptacle only. Alternatively, you could also add another dedicated circuit for the sub. Ensure when adding a second dedicated circuit that it is connected to the same leg of the service panel as the first dedicated circuit.

brucek


----------



## Guest

Or he could just plug the sub into one of the utility outlets. But running a branch of the dedicated rack circuit up to the front of the room isn't a bad idea. No telling what it might be useful for someday. 

When using dedicated (or different) circuits in the same room, I color code the receptables. E.g. white receptacles for the dedicated electronics circuit, black receptacles for the utility outlets (which are in combo with some other part of the house), and grey for the decidated amp circuit. The theater lighting circuit isn't exposed.


----------



## Guest

Tommy, don't forget that you need the light at the rack *behind* the rack. One in front of it illuminates the knobs and dials, but is dead useless for swapping cables. I put a utility light (cheapo recessed) at the rear of my A/V niche (ex-fireplace) with a switch on the side wall and it has proven to be invaluable. 

Also, since plasmas run hot, you might think about putting an extractor fan above it. I don't have a clear answer on the best way to do that. The quiet fans they sell are $100+ and standard duct fans are way too noisy. I'll probably end up using a 12VDC computer fan driven off the amp trigger circuit. But my ducting is in so I can do it later. If your ventilation is good enough this may not be an issue, but few people put a thermostat in the HT room and fewer still make it a full-fledged A/C zone. With the plasma, several people, and your amps etc. the heat can build up in a hurry.


----------



## brucek

> Or he could just plug the sub into one of the utility outlets.


I guess my feeling was that it's the very use of a utility circuit, (specifically if it's on the opposite electrical leg) that causes ground loops. Subs are so nicely equipped to amplify these hum frequencies. If he extends his dedicated circuit, it should reduce the ground loop possibility.



> I color code the receptables



Yeah, great idea. When I added my two dedicated circuits directly beside two utility circuits, I coded them by positioning the ground lug down as opposed to the up position as it was in the rest of the house. You can also identify the dedicated circuit by the big monster 10 gauge cab tire AC cord that I have plugged into them... 













I was also noticing that tommys equipment was located at the rear of his theatre. He will likely need an IR receiver system. I installed one of these and it works quite well. It allows your equipment to be hidden with a single IR receiver at the front of the room or somewhere you can hit easily with your remote. I mention this because a wire would need to be installed in the walls before the gyproc went up. I bought my Xantech Hidden Link system from from here. The receivers are never plasma friendly, but you don't need to install it that close to the actual display. It can go anywhere because it's so **** sensitive. No more having to point directly at the device with the remote.













brucek


----------



## Tommy

fibreKid said:


> Not unless you have the expensive equipment to use them. Avia is about $40 and the DVE is about $25.


ok, I ordered the $40 version


----------



## Tommy

DMF said:


> Tommy, don't forget that you need the light at the rack *behind* the rack. One in front of it illuminates the knobs and dials, but is dead useless for swapping cables. I put a utility light (cheapo recessed) at the rear of my A/V niche (ex-fireplace) with a switch on the side wall and it has proven to be invaluable.
> 
> Also, since plasmas run hot, you might think about putting an extractor fan above it. I don't have a clear answer on the best way to do that. The quiet fans they sell are $100+ and standard duct fans are way too noisy. I'll probably end up using a 12VDC computer fan driven off the amp trigger circuit. But my ducting is in so I can do it later. If your ventilation is good enough this may not be an issue, but few people put a thermostat in the HT room and fewer still make it a full-fledged A/C zone. With the plasma, several people, and your amps etc. the heat can build up in a hurry.


What plasma???

Am I mixing everyone up, I have two different rooms. One is the dedicated home theater that I am building that will have a front projector. 

I recently purchased a plasma tv for my living room that is seperate from the ht room. 

As for the duct work, I got to friends in the sheet metal union that are supposed to be doing the work (hopefully next week). I'm not sure of all there doing but they spent a couple hours already planning it all out and sound like there gonna do it first rate.

I can add a fan if needed though.


----------



## Tommy

Not much gonna get done this weekend, going away for reserves again...

The screen and some other stuff are due to arrive today and I let my son stay home from school to wait for it... But the shipping companies started calling yesterday, no one can find my house since its not on any maps yet...


----------



## JCD

Tommy said:


> Not much gonna get done this weekend, going away for reserves again...
> 
> The screen and some other stuff are due to arrive today and I let my son stay home from school to wait for it... But the shipping companies started calling yesterday, no one can find my house since its not on any maps yet...



That's got to be painful.. a brand new toy and you won't be able to play with it.

And the "not on any maps" thing is kinda funny.. as long as they can eventually find it of course.

Good luck.

JCD


----------



## Tommy

JCD said:


> And the "not on any maps" thing is kinda funny.. as long as they can eventually find it of course.
> 
> Good luck.
> 
> JCD



Ya, not to funny if they cant find it and my stuff gets returned :rant:  :rolleyesno: 

Its a new housing development and since there not dedicated streets yet it will be a year or so before they show up on any maps.

But my son did just call, the screen arrived at least. There were supposed to be some smaller packages coming today too but they havent showed yet.


----------



## Guest

brucek said:


> I guess my feeling was that it's the very use of a utility circuit, (specifically if it's on the opposite electrical leg) that causes ground loops.


No, that's not what causes ground loops. A bad ground connection allowing one amp ground to float at a different potential from another is the chief cause. That's possible - albeit less likely - in a single circuit. Since neutral should be at zero (ground) potential, the leg shouldn't matter either. Ground loops are nearly always due to a wiring fault. I prefer to find the fault and fix it rather than to avoid the possibility of discovering it.

In my own case, I have both subs on the utility circuit which also drivers some incandescent and MLV lighting (temporarily). No noise issues.


----------



## brucek

> No, that's not what causes ground loops. A bad ground connection allowing one amp ground to float at a different potential from another is the chief cause. That's possible - albeit less likely - in a single circuit. Since neutral should be at zero (ground) potential, the leg shouldn't matter either. Ground loops are nearly always due to a wiring fault. I prefer to find the fault and fix it rather than to avoid the possibility of discovering it.


We may have to agree to disagree.  
Neutral isn't an issue with ground loops - it's the third wire safety ground at fault. More often than not it has nothing to do with a bad connection - it's the nature of the beast.

Even though the safety ground is a cold conductor, it can and usually does, develop a small potential, through mutual inductance, wire resistance and various other reasons that can be quite different at each receptacle in your house. 

When you plug a power amp into one receptacle and a preamp into another receptacle, the metal cases of these two units can have a small potential difference in their safety grounds which means that these equipment's metal cases are at a slightly different potential. When you connect a single ended (RCA) cable between these two devices, a small AC current can flow in the shield because of the potential difference. This unwanted signal is in the signal loop circuit and can cause a hum. An interconnect circuit has a loop path (completed circuit) that flows through the centre conductor of the interconnect cable and back on the shield. If there is an AC signal on the shield flowing because of the ground difference potential, you'll hear a hum. Breaking the safety ground of one of the two devices removes the potential and the path for the unwanted signal flow...

Exactly the same situation can occur, except usually worse, when you introduce a new ground into the system from cable TV or a satellite. Their ground on the shield may possess a different potential than the ground in your system and current will flow in all the interconnects. Usually by centralizing and bonding all external grounds to the common house ground you're at least giving yourself the best chance of reducing this problem. Using a dedicated circuit can also reduce ground loops.

(As an aside), when you use a dedicated circuit, and noise is introduced on a different circuit in the house, even though they return to a common point at the loadcentre, this noise tends not to travel down your dedicated circuit because of the extremely low source impedance of the mains at the panel. It acts like a pass filter to this induced noise.
If you place a particularly noisy light dimmer circuit on the opposite leg of your load center you can increase the noise rejection even further.

When you use two dedicated circuits you do have the added possibility of ground loops. The best solution for this is to run the two circuits from a common leg together so they are identical lengths and paths traveled. This helps to ensure the potential of the safety grounds are at the same potential. The loop is caused by a difference in the safety ground potentials in the system. Breaking the safety ground almost as often clears the problem, and that is why it goes away with the use of two prong power cords or with the use of cheater plugs. This easy fix is obviously tempting, since it's so easy, but it's extremely dangerous and not recommended unless you enjoy getting a shock.

brucek


----------



## Guest

We agree. No cheaters! 

Recall that I said that a front outlet for the dedicated electronic circuit is a good idea. What I don't agree with is avoiding the utility circuit altogether. Odds are very good that there won't a problem. 

Once the room is built and the acoustics established, you can work on sub placement. Fixating on a single outlet means you'll never try it in other locations, potentially giving up optimal placement. 

If possible, test for ground loops on the utility circuit while you have the walls open.


----------



## Tommy

*Progress Update:

Screen: *

The screen arrived Friday as I already mentioned. I put it together yesterday and hung it on the studded wall to see how it looks. That fr*gg*n soffit pushes the bottom of the screen to within 20" of the floor. How low do some of your screens go? Make me fell better and lie here if you have too..

I think putting an extension on the mount will lower the projector and angle everything correctly (hopefully) to display under the soffit but my bigger concern is the screen may be to low altogether. I dont know if the second row on the riser will have trouble seeing the whole screen or not.

Below is a pic with the screen. Any advice/comments on this would certainly be appriecated.










*Projector:*

The projector came yesterday (looks pretty haha) but I still have to wait for some other stuff to come before I can test it. (mount, cables etc...)

*Avia*

The avia software came too but havent had a chance to give it a run on or plasma tv yet

*Subwoofer*

The subwoofer came yesterday too, wow that thing is big. Sonnie how the hell do you fit two of them in a room? Really its about twice as big as I thought it would be.

Sub - SVS PB12-Plus/2
Size - Size: 19" wide, 26.5" tall and 28" deep. 
Weight - 140 pounds










*Cables*
Most of the cables came, except the hdmi cable which I'll have to check on. That reminds me, I still have to wire for the comcast.

*Construction*

As you can see most of my progress this week has been ordering equipment. I did finish framing around the poles in the rest of the basement. As for framing I should just have some touch up spots to go and add some more studs just for sheetrocking purposes and then thats done.

I'm gonna try and get the ductwork and electrical finished this weekend but friends are doing it, so i'm at the mercy of there time schedule.


----------



## JCD

Dude, I'd be beside myself with giddiness with all of that equipment you've got laying around. That screen looks great, the sub is AWESOME -- remember with subs, all things being equal, bigger IS better. You will be SO much happier with the sub you have now than the one you sent back. :T 

Now, regarding your screen.. I think you may still be ok with the location of the screen. 20" isn't a lot, but I think it'll work. If the back rows can't see normally, raise them up so they can.

If the screen IS too low, and the riser thing can't be done, then how about:
1) making the soffit smaller -- is that even possible?
2) mounting the screen before the soffit. Maybe even put them on hinges so you can swing it up and fasten it to the ceiling to get it out of the way when needed.

In the end, I think you can make the current setup work.


JCD


----------



## Tommy

No matter what the screen will be under the ductwork on the right hand side.


----------



## Sonnie

I'm concerned myself about the screen location. I never even thought about that soffit possibly being in the way. As low as it is I think you are gonna have problems with the rear seat seeing the bottom portion of the screen very well. Hopefully I'm wrong.

It doesn't look like the screen goes under the right soffit very far... is there any possible way to narrow up that right soffit so that you can do away with the front soffit and raise that screen on up to about 6" below the ceiling... anyway at all?


----------



## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> I'm concerned myself about the screen location. I never even thought about that soffit possibly being in the way. As low as it is I think you are gonna have problems with the rear seat seeing the bottom portion of the screen very well. Hopefully I'm wrong.
> 
> It doesn't look like the screen goes under the right soffit very far... is there any possible way to narrow up that right soffit so that you can do away with the front soffit and raise that screen on up to about 6" below the ceiling... anyway at all?


Unfortunatly the screen extends under the duct work about 2 foot or so, I'd have to measure it to be exact though (its probably about 20" offset)

The only things we could do 
1- are original plan of using a 60" plasma

2 - or moving the screen so that it is not centered on the wall. It can fit between the far wall and soffit but you can see how many problems that would cause including watching the whole movie at an angle. 

3 - even if I moved to a smaller screen the most Im gonna get is another 5" height.

I'm still going to search for a solution here and do whatever I can but at the same token I have asked around on different boards and have actually found some others that all have there screen that low. And although I dont think this is optimal it doesnt seem to be a train wreck either.

I made the riser out of 2x10's so it will be about a full foot when done so hopefully thats enough height. I really cant go much higher though because I have the same problem in the back, between the soffit and the riser will be less then 6' in height on the one side of the wall.

At the moment Im hoping that will be tall enough and I can offset the seats so the back row viewing area is between the front row seats.

Below is a pic a guy posted that shows his screen at 20" off the floor.


----------



## Guest

Check with your ductworker friends. They make flat duct that will fit between joists (or the guys can make it themselves). Your soffit looks wide enough that the duct cross-section will be enough. 

Or you could pop it into the other room and back out.


----------



## JCD

I think if the back rows are on risers like the picture you'll be fine. Maybe not optimal, but definitely workable. However, if there is anyway to modify that soffit like DMF suggests, that obviously seems like the way to go.

As I was typing this, a thought occurred to me -- if you ever decide to upgade your speakers, will you have some sort of solution for non-inwall speakers? Even just a blank plate that you can undo if you decide to go that route? It'll be SO MUCH easier now than figuring it out later.

BTW, I'm still jealous as can be about your HT.

JCD


----------



## Tommy

Moving the trunk line and the return trunk isnt really an option. 

JCD, Hopefully I wont have to worry about upgrading the speakers for some time but i dont think patching the spots will be a problem whether its sheetrock or some type of plate to cover the spot. Do you have pic's of your room to see?


----------



## Josuah

I've got a 92" screen and it sits about 22" inches off the floor. I actually lowered it to this height so that my eye position would be ~1/3 of the way up in the front row.


----------



## JCD

Tommy said:


> JCD, Hopefully I wont have to worry about upgrading the speakers for some time but i dont think patching the spots will be a problem whether its sheetrock or some type of plate to cover the spot. Do you have pic's of your room to see?


I hope you don't get a case of upgraditus as well, but I thought it would be one of those things that would be easier now than later..

As for my room... sigh... it's still in the preliminary stages. We have a room mate, and until she moves out, there is just too much "stuff" in the garage to do what I want. I'll definitely be doing a blog like this one once I start construction.

JCD


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## Tommy

Josuah said:


> I've got a 92" screen and it sits about 22" inches off the floor. I actually lowered it to this height so that my eye position would be ~1/3 of the way up in the front row.


Josuah that sounds great, how is the view from your second row and is the second row on a riser?


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## Tommy

JCD said:


> I hope you don't get a case of upgraditus as well, but I thought it would be one of those things that would be easier now than later..
> 
> As for my room... sigh... it's still in the preliminary stages. We have a room mate, and until she moves out, there is just too much "stuff" in the garage to do what I want. I'll definitely be doing a blog like this one once I start construction.
> 
> JCD


Looking forward to seeing it.


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## Tommy

*Weekly Update:*

*WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!* :hail: :yes:  

I tested this week and had everything up and running.

Ok to back track for a second. Electrician and sheet metal friends postponed for another 2 weeks so that sets me back a few weeks and possibly into sheet rock guys summer vacation. So that wasnt actually great to plan on.

So I started to insulate the HT room. I purchased the R-19 acoustic insulation. I think it was around $35 per pack of 8 pieces. I bought 7 packs so far for the room so that was about $250 for the room. That was way higher priced then I thought it would be. In know way did I plan to spend 500 - 1000 on insulation for the whole basement.

Anyway the 7 packs were enough to do the walls in the HT room and most of the riser on the floor. Atleast for one piece in each spot. I've been hearing different things about whether I should double pack everything or not. I still have to do the ceiling and rest of the basement but will probably wait till after the duct work is done.

Ok I wanted to do this anyway but specially re-considering my timeline for completing the basement I wanted test all of the HT equipment in case anything has to go back. I could only imagine if I wait another 2 months and then realize something never worked and I waited to long to send it back.

So I brought everything downstairs, attached all the in-wall speakers and just sat them on the floor. The 140 lb sub was truly a pain in the a$$ to bring down. I put the projector on a tv tray/table (still waiting on the ceiling mount to be delivered) and put the receiver and dvd player in the rack.

It took me and the wife a while to figure it all out, and still have more to learn I bet but eventually we got it all working. But all I can say is I am so thrilled I spent countless hours here online researching everything. Everything was super impressive and I can only imagine it getting better later after everything is fine tuned and calibrated.

The picture was unbelievable. The BenQ projector reviews say this projector comes close to perfect right out of the box for calibration and they weren’t lying the picture was awesome. No SDE, I could put my face inches from the screen and hardly see it. RBE bothers me and I couldnt notice it on this 5 speed - 8 segment dlp. After everything is done though I'd still like to have a professional calibrate it just to see what improvements are possible.

The audio was excellent! I spent a long time researching good in-wall speakers which was hard because all you hard core audiophiles are so against in-wall speakers. But I found the MTX in-wall speakers that had good reviews from multiple sources and ordered them. 

I started worrying since I first ordered them though, its now been a month or two now hanging around on these boards and I havent seen anyone else using this brand. I was already starting to make up excuses in my mind of how Im gonna tell the wife I have to order new speakers... Luckily I was worrying for nothing. These speakers were truly amazing during the tests. I'll judge again once there in the walls to see if there is any difference.

The SVS subwoofer was of course the centerpiece of the room. How can it not be, its still huge. Sonnie, I still cant picture you having two of them. And also I cant believe you all suggested I get two, just the one was vibrating my whole house.

Now I have not gone messing with any of the settings or anything like that yet. I just plugged in the power and connected it to the receiver and it was working so I left it at that.

GregBe gave a link in another thread to download some demo clips. THX demos and movie clips etc. Thanks GregBe they were excellent for testing and I hope we can get something like that going here on this forum soon. I’d also like to say how excellent hometheatershack is that it does not censor posts that point to other boards.

So we tested everything with a bunch of clips from different movies. The detail and coloring were phenomenal specially the black detail. Over the last few months I’ve tried to see as many different projectors as I could and this one was really one of the best I have seen.

After that we camped out in the current pathetic décor of my ht room. We put out a couple fold out chairs, and spread some blankets on the concrete floor. And there sat me the wife, my son & daughter and the puppy in the middle of all that insulation and watched movies for the rest of the weekend. The puppy trying to eat the insulation the whole time. 

And I’ll have to say when the demo kicked off and the explosions really showed what the sub could do, the puppy instantly pee'd right there on the floor she was so scared. Not that we were happy with that of course but it was a good sign of how the audio was working.


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## Tommy

On another topic that adds to my weekend that I left out from the above. I posted this on another thread here but I'll add it here since it does go along with building my room

Toshiba HD-DVD

Well I was gonna wait a bit before jumping into the hd-dvd players but b-day is this week and the wife was still searching for something to get me when she decided on this yesterday. Unfortunately we went to about 4-5 different stores to get it and no one had it in stock. 

Another thing that really gets my goat is all these stores wanting to pay for things that they don’t actually have. Really now if I wanted to order it, I didnt need to come to the store then. How bout you stock the items that you want to sell so that when a customer hands you money they can actually leave with it.

Anyway now that I would like to order the hd-dvd, I don’t trust any of the places online that say "In Stock".

Does anyone know a reputable store that actually has it and will send it out immediately? I'm having company next Saturday and would like to have it before then.


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## JCD

Dude, that is so awesome! I'm glad it meets/exceeds your expectations!

Nuthing else needs to be said.

JCD


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## Tommy

Ok the ceiling mount finally came yesterday, almost 3 weeks since my order. I added the extra back boarding to the joists, drilled the holes, connected the mount to the ceiling and went to connect the projector to the bottom plate when I realized it didnt fit, they sent the wrong mount.

Wow I was mad, not just at the fact it took almost 3 weeks to get but also the fact that I didnt check before starting to install the whole thing. I drilled these big holes right in the joist that may cause problems if the new stand comes and the screws are smaller now.

Anyway im back to waiting on the right mount being sent again. 

Other then that, I may be getting my Toshiba HD-DVD tonight. A store a little distance from here supposedly has it and is holding it for us, the wife is stopping tonight to pick it up.


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## Tommy

I didnt (and still dont) think the equipment rack being behind us is a problem. I mean how lazy do ya have to be to not want to turn slightly and use the remote at the begining of the movie.

Well from only having/testing the equipment for only two days now I saw the wife constantly point the remote at the screen and pushing buttons. I kept having to remind her that she needed to point the remote towards the back rack.

Anyway this is starting to change my mind on whether or not I should atleast wire for the IR stuff. So what type of wire do I need to run and is it just one run to the front room or multiple sensors that will need to be installed.

Also the kits that I need for it, do I need to research which one works differently or are they all basically the same?


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## Sonnie

I don't rightly remember if you have acquired a universal learning remote or not. Have you and if so what kind?

The Home Theater Master MX-800 which I have, can be purchased with an optional MRF-250 Single-Zone RF Receiver. This also has IR sensors that you can run to your components. For my projector I took one of the sensors and extended the wire on it to about 25' and fished it thru my pipe to my projector. In your situation... you'll have the RF Receiver up front and the equipment in back... so you'll have to extend several of the IR sensor wires. It comes with about 8 or so sensors.

This is the only remote I'm familiar with that comes with the RF Receiver and sensors... there may be more.


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> I don't rightly remember if you have acquired a universal learning remote or not. Have you and if so what kind?
> 
> The Home Theater Master MX-800 which I have, can be purchased with an optional MRF-250 Single-Zone RF Receiver. This also has IR sensors that you can run to your components. For my projector I took one of the sensors and extended the wire on it to about 25' and fished it thru my pipe to my projector. In your situation... you'll have the RF Receiver up front and the equipment in back... so you'll have to extend several of the IR sensor wires. It comes with about 8 or so sensors.
> 
> This is the only remote I'm familiar with that comes with the RF Receiver and sensors... there may be more.


No we havent looked into any type of universal remote yet. The remote that comes with the BenQ is excellent but I may need to get something universal just to eliminate the extra remotes.

I was just talking to E in email earlier and he was recommending almost the same thing but the 850 model. The way he made it sound though was that with this remote and base I wouldnt have to run any sensors or wires.

But if I do need to, let me know what type of wire so I can do it now while the walls are unfinished.


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## Sonnie

You don't have to run the wires if the RF Reciever has a good line of sight to the equipment. The wires are used when your equipment is behind a door or located where the Receiver can't get the signal to the equipment for whatever reasons. Your chairs or bodies might be in the way of a good signal path. IR is line of sight. In my situation... the Receiver would sometimes trigger the projector and sometimes it wouldn't. I went ahead and ran the sensor wire and eliminated the problem. I only use the Receiver for the projector.


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> You don't have to run the wires if the RF Reciever has a good line of sight to the equipment.


Well if it had a good line of site I wouldnt need to be putting any type of IR remote system right? :scratch: :rofl:


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## Sonnie

Actually, if you had good line of sight you wouldn't need an RF Receiver... you might very well still want an IR remote. People with a good line of sight use IR remotes all the time.

I think you are misunderstanding me here... I am referring to the line of sight between the RF Receiver and the equipment... not the actual remote control and the equipment. The remote transmits to the RF receiver and the RF receiver transmits either via IR or via the sensors to the equipment.

The RF Receiver is of course Radio Frequency so you don't necessarily have to place it in front of you in order for it to receive signals from your remote control. You could place it near your equipment as long as the IR sensor on the front of the RF Receiver has a line of sight to your equipment. However, the RF Receiver is then behind your projector. If your projector has an IR sensor on the back and the RF Receiver can see it, then you are good to go. But if your projector only has an IR sensor on the front which faces the screen... the RF Receiver has no line of sight... in this case you need to use one of the wired sensors from the RF Receiver to the sensor on the projector and stick the wired sensor on top of the projector sensor.

Here's the rub... if you set the RF Receiver on top of your equipment or in the cabinet with your equipment, its IR sensor doesn't see your equipments IR sensors. Chances are you won't have enough room in the front of your equipment to place the RF Receiver to where the front of it faces the front of the equipment. If you do get it facing the equipment somehow, then its probably not going to be facing the projector where the sensors between the RF Receiver and projector see each other.

Your best bet might be simply placing the RF Receiver on top of you eqiupment or somewhere near your equipment and not worrying about line of sight. Use the wired IR sensors for everything. The only one you would need to extend would be the one to the projector.


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## Josuah

Tommy said:


> Josuah that sounds great, how is the view from your second row and is the second row on a riser?


The second row is fine. It's on a riser about 13"-14" high, with the distance between the front of the second row seats and the back of the front row seats being a little under 2', I think.

The only issue is that some people in the second row really like to slouch, like putting their head where their butt should be, and then if someone is sitting up in the front row the front row head will block the rear person's sight. But they shouldn't be sitting with their head where their butt should be anyway.  A 13" riser for the second row is already higher than most people do.


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## Tommy

Josuah said:


> The only issue is that some people in the second row really like to slouch, like putting their head where their butt should be, and then if someone is sitting up in the front row the front row head will block the rear person's sight. But they shouldn't be sitting with their head where their butt should be anyway.  A 13" riser for the second row is already higher than most people do.


That sounds good then. I used 2x10's for the riser base and the plywood, padding, and carpet will add a couple more inches to it. The rise is 7' in depth so there should be some excess room between the rows.


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> Actually, if you had good line of sight you wouldn't need an RF Receiver... you might very well still want an IR remote. People with a good line of sight use IR remotes all the time.
> 
> I think you are misunderstanding me here... I am referring to the line of sight between the RF Receiver and the equipment... not the actual remote control and the equipment. The remote transmits to the RF receiver and the RF receiver transmits either via IR or via the sensors to the equipment.


I was making a joke brother... :laugh: You work to hard, go watch a movie or something... 

Anyway there should not be anything blocking between the seating and the equipment rack and just thinking about making it easier as far as pointing the remote at the screen rather then turning around and pointing it at the rack, not that turning slightly is that big of a deal.


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## Tommy

Ok I rant, raved and complained to the store about the mount and the new mount _should _ be here by this Friday.

I got the Toshiba HDA1 HD-DVD Player last night and we gave it a try. I'm sort of cross over what to say about it. 

It looks fantastic, I say it improves the overall picture quality about 5-10%. If you look at a side by side demo you definetly can see the difference and the details in the HD that are just not there in a regular DVD.

I was debating over if I should wait till this whole format war plays out or not. But for as much as I'm investing in the overall HT room, for a few hundred dollars more I can improve the quality of what we watch even if its only for a year or two I think is worth it. 

At this point theres not to much more I can do for the room until the electician and duct work guys get there stuff done which wont be for another week or two. So maybe I'll invest the time in tinkering with the receiver and projector and post the results up here. 

I guess I can give that AVIA software a try. Asking anyone that has used it, can you tell me how much of a difference it makes?

I dont want to mess with the sound and speakers yet even though Im sure the sub iteself could keep me busy for weeks but I'm assuming it wont be worth messing with till after the sheet rock is up. At this point I'm sure it sounds different then it will after its completed.


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## bobgpsr

Avia does both video and sound cal. But personally I like the THX test tones that you can find on many SD DVDs that use THX. Pirates of the Caribbean for example. Are you going to use the analog outputs of the HD-A1? Sometimes it is a bit tricky to get the right LFE boost for the analog (6 ch direct) path with an AVR. You have to basically repeat the sound cal process just for the Tos player source that you had to do before for the AVR/Pre-Pro. Best to move further discussion of this to the Toshiba HD DVD player owners thread if you need help or want advice.

Good Luck!
Bob


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## Tommy

Me and my son sat and watched Serenity in HD last night, the picture was excellent I cant wait for the room to be completly done.

I was able to get a bit off on ordering the theater seats yesterday. Someplace was having a closeout special. The prices seemed cheaper then the HT type places I researched it but cant say I extensively checked smaller places to see if anyone else might be as cheap.

Anyway I put the order in for the seats. There will be two rows, 3 seats in the first row witch will be straight and the second row will have 4 seats and be curved.

It should take an average of 4-6 weeks before there delivered. So at this point Im more hoping that the room will be done before they get here and also slightly disappointed realizing it will be that long before my room could possibly be completed.

The seats are Berkline 090 series.


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## Sonnie

Those are some nice lookin' seats. :T


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> Those are some nice lookin' seats. :T


Thanks Sonnie. Not sure if I could have gotten them cheaper somewhere else or not but it basically came out to 500 per seat.

Let me ask you this, the guy was really trying to push getting the motorized reclining seats. I just couldnt picture spending that much more for something I can do manually with my recliner now. He made it sound like there would be problems controling it manually, is that true with these chairs?

Also should I pay the extra for those buttkicker things?


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## Sonnie

That doesn't really sound that bad on the price. I paid like $240 each for my low end La-z-boys. 

Don't know about the motorized seats. Seems to me that you'd have more problems with motorized than you would manual, but who am I to say for sure. My La-z-boys came with a lifetime warranty on the mechanism... I though Berkline did too.


Buttkicker and shakers have never impressed me enough to get them. My subs shake my butt enough without anything else. :dontknow:


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## Tommy

I figured it might just be the salesman trying for some extra but figured I would check if something might be different about the theater seats that I might no about. 

He made the manual recline on them just sound like it wouldnt work and that I would be crazy not to get the motorized seats.

But I do agree with you, I can picture it as something else that could/would break and not work.

How generally are these seats delivered? Do they come assembled as the row or will I have to assemble everything?


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## Josuah

Manual recliners are fine. I can't imagine them being ****** for the Berklines, since those are such a popular brand. I ended up buying my seats for about $500/seat at Levitz. Manual recline for the two end seats, not so for the center two.

For the second row, I would like to buy some cheapo seats. I found an online place that would be about $300/seat but the link is at home and I'm at work right now. I may never get around to actually doing that because $1000 can always be spent in ways that benefit me instead of my guests. 

When my seats were delivered, each was single with little hooky things on the sides so I just lined them up and hooked them together.


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## Tommy

Thanks Josuah

Levitz huh, I dont think I'd buy anything else from them ever again. When we bought this house 5 months ago, I ordered all new furniture for the house most of which was from Levitz. All with perfect timing of them going bankrupt, it took forever to get the furniture one piece at a time and weeks on end on the phone complaining for it.


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## Tommy

Had a late house warming party yesterday, first time my relatives got to come and see the new house even though we've been here about 5 months now. Anyway they got to see a partially finished HT room. Atleast the equipment was up and running to show them what it can do. They were really impressed and I think they'll be considering HT in the near future now.

I'll post a few pic's of the room as it is now. I was having trouble turning the flash off on this camera so I'll have to wait till later to take some good screen shots of how the picture actually looks. Dont mind the one in the below photo, I had the lights on plus the flash on the camera.


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## Tommy




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## Tommy




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## Tommy




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## Tommy

.Oh I did have a bit of small progress in that the correct mount for the projector was delivered on Friday and I got it all mounted. The projector angles alot so I may put it up higher then it is right now though.


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## JCD

Maybe it was in another post, but how does the screen height work? Do you think it's too low?

JCD


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## Tommy

It looks ok now but worried more about after we get the seating if the back row can see the full screen over the front row. I did however read of many other people with the screen at the same height so that lessened my worries. I figured I'll staggered the seating and if its still to bad that I might have to trade for a smaller screen but I'll leave it as is and wait and see I guess.

What you mentioned in the other thread with the rear speakers being right next to each other is the first I've heard that. I'm gonna have to look that up and see about moving them now if I have too.

Other then that, the guys are supposed to do the duct work this weekend, not sure about the electrician yet.

Also seeing things like my new hd-dvd player needing to be hooked up to the internet this week in order to be updated has me wondering if I should run a ethernet wire from my upstairs office to my equipment rack now before sheet rocking.


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## JCD

Tommy said:


> It looks ok now but worried more about after we get the seating if the back row can see the full screen over the front row. I did however read of many other people with the screen at the same height so that lessened my worries. I figured I'll staggered the seating and if its still to bad that I might have to trade for a smaller screen but I'll leave it as is and wait and see I guess.


I'm sure it'll be alright, but I can totally understand your apprehension.



Tommy said:


> What you mentioned in the other thread with the rear speakers being right next to each other is the first I've heard that. I'm gonna have to look that up and see about moving them now if I have too.


That was a first for me too. I would have thought having them spaced out would be better as well. Did you look in the owner's manual for the receiver? I'd probably follow the advice it gives.



Tommy said:


> Other then that, the guys are supposed to do the duct work this weekend, not sure about the electrician yet.


Well, at least you got the duct guys coming in..



Tommy said:


> Also seeing things like my new hd-dvd player needing to be hooked up to the internet this week in order to be updated has me wondering if I should run a ethernet wire from my upstairs office to my equipment rack now before sheet rocking.


I think I'd have ethernet run in to ANY new room I was building. Too much "stuff" wants to be connected to the internet these days already.

JCD


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## Sonnie

You know... I thought that was kind of strange to mount those two rears side by side like that. Seems like to me it would be no different than 6.1... obviously there could be no separation between left and right. 

I wonder how that's gonna work anyway with the sides of the DVD cabinet being there to more or less separate the two speakers.


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## Tommy

Progress Update:

Well at least some progress was made this weekend. I had to take all the equipment out of the HT room so it wouldnt get filled with dust while further work was being done.

Saturday the electrician came around 2:30 pm to start. I would of course prefered if he came earlier but when friends are doing the work you have to go by there time schedule I guess.

So we started a bit late and worked till almost 11 Saturday night. Most of the HT room was already wired but we had to do the rest of the basement before the sheet rock starts. We seperated the current lighting system which was a one switch at the top of the steps operates the whole basement.

The stairway is now on a seperate switch from everything else. We removed the ceiling light from the HT room. Added a light to the closet under the stairs which will be for the back of the equipment rack, Added 12 recessed lights to the main room in the basement and seperated the lights in the utility room.

Finance wise we spent another $150 on material in addition to about $1,000 I previously spent on the eletric materials. I also gave the guy $500 at the end of the night for all the help. So I guess all said and done the electric cost for the whole basement is gonna be somewhere around 2k.

The duct work guys cancelled on Saturday but came first thing in the morning on Sunday. They worked from about 9 am to almost 8 pm. Unfortunatly I guess its only about half done. 

When I started this I never gave much thought to the duct work being a major project of finishing the basement. I figured at most they would just have to cut grills into the sides of the trunk lines and that would be that.

But these guys are busting there buts to make sure everything is right and runing everything they can, branches and drops and all that. A couple spot in the basement the existing branches would dip under the ceiling to come up in another spot. They removed these spots and re-routed it so I wouldnt have as many boxed out areas on the ceiling.

Surprising how much sheet metal costs. I spent $400 on material this weekend and probably got to spend as much again before its done. I wrote a check for 1k for the material and payment. They are supposed to come back next Saturday to finish.

So this weekend cost me $1,650. I'm gonna have to go over my finances later but Im really starting to get close to my buget limit now but I think I got all the main things covered and still have the sheet rock money put away. I know I'm gonna cry when I figure this all out and see how much I spent on this so far.

Worst is that I was trying to get this work done by this week so the sheet work guy could do his thing before he starts his vacation in mid July. So this pushes things back by a few weeks atleast.

Next weekend the duct work guys will hopefully finish. The week after I have reserves again. The week after that the sheet rock guy is on vacation. I dont know how long he'll be gone or when he is free after that.

So where I was planning on getting the sheet rock done next week, may be pushed back a month. But at least the project is moving forward and something got done over the weekend. Of course now I'm tired and falling a sleep at work already.


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> You know... I thought that was kind of strange to mount those two rears side by side like that. Seems like to me it would be no different than 6.1... obviously there could be no separation between left and right.
> 
> I wonder how that's gonna work anyway with the sides of the DVD cabinet being there to more or less separate the two speakers.


I dont think thats to much a problem. From what someone else posted by THX rules they could be 2-3 foot apart. But I do think I am going to leave them the way Dolby sugested which is pretty much were they are now.

I could move the Left back speaker over one stud bay to be perfect but if I am leaving myself the room to hang something on the wall there equal in size to the dvd cabinet. 

By the way I made the cabinet 40 x 27 or whatever it is which is equal in size to a movie poster. This way when I hang the posters it will all be the same size as the posters and spaced equally through out the room.


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## Sonnie

Tommy said:


> By the way I made the cabinet 40 x 27 or whatever it is which is equal in size to a movie poster. This way when I hang the posters it will all be the same size as the posters and spaced equally through out the room.


Did you figure this out by yourself... that's pretty ingenious. :R


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## Tommy

:yes: 

haha I was more trying to explain that there will be a poster equal in size besides the cabinet and that is why the left back speaker is more to the side....


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## Tommy

*Progress Update:*

It took another 10 hours of work but the duct work was completed on Saturday. When starting this project I didnt think that the duct work would be that big of a deal. The two friends helping me are part of the sheet metal union so of course they didnt want to do anything the easy way with the flex duct... anyway its finally finished and I can move on to the next step.

I just have to finish insulating now and some last minute small things to do and it will be ready to sheet rock. Unfortunatly though I have reserves next weekend and I believe the sheet rock guy starts his vacation the week after so it looks like I'm put off for at least the next 2-3 weeks.


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## Guest

wow, I can't wait to see photos of the finished product!


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## Sonnie

Tommy said:


> I was more trying to explain that there will be a poster equal in size besides the cabinet and that is why the left back speaker is more to the side....


Surrrre. :laugh:


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## Tommy

Progress Update:

Ok I had to remove all the equipment out of the room in order to continue working in there so no more movies for a couple of week I guess.

I finished insulating the ceiling and some last minute things that need to be done in the room.

The sheet rock was delivered yesterday and they should start rocking tonight. Will probably be 2-3 weeks till its done since they will only be working a few hours each night.

I still gotta get in there to fix the wiring where the rope light will be. Hope I can get in there without getting in the rockers way.


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## Guest

Very nice, Tommy! Looks like you could do an IB sub there!


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## Tommy

IB sub?


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## Guest

Infinite Baffle Subwoofer. 

Here, check this out. Essentially turning an adjacent space into a HUGE subwoofer!


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## Tommy

How does this differ from just an In-Wall subwoofer?

I originally ordered an In-Wall sub but these guys here talked me into returning it before I even got it out of the box and also convinced me to order the SVS sub.

Just to note, I'm thrilled with the new sub so far and to this point I havent even tried to adjust any of the settings. Waiting for the sheetrock to get done before I worry about all that.

Anyway what I was getting at though is I thought it was explained to me that the sub being in the wall was not optimal and this is why I needed to send the In-wall back.


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## Tommy

Ok the sheet rockers started last night but didnt stay long. The guy is an union carpetner so hes picking to pieces all of my framing at the moment. He kept pointing out one wall he did sheet rock and saying do I see the waves and I kept saying no it looks fine...

Long story short its gonna cost me extra for him to straighten out my framing where he doesnt think its perfect... :sad:


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## JCD

Tommy said:


> How does this differ from just an In-Wall subwoofer?
> 
> I originally ordered an In-Wall sub but these guys here talked me into returning it before I even got it out of the box and also convinced me to order the SVS sub.
> 
> Just to note, I'm thrilled with the new sub so far and to this point I havent even tried to adjust any of the settings. Waiting for the sheetrock to get done before I worry about all that.
> 
> Anyway what I was getting at though is I thought it was explained to me that the sub being in the wall was not optimal and this is why I needed to send the In-wall back.


For the most part, I was concerned with the driver being used by your in-wall unit. As I recall, they were dual 8" drivers. It's just too small to go low. 

I think we did discuss a possible IB setup in your room, but there weren't any good places to set up for the rear wave of the drivers. No attic space, and there wasn't enough room on any of the sides of the room except the one that opened up to your workout(?) room.

JCD


----------



## Guest

Tommy said:


> Ok the sheet rockers started last night but didnt stay long. The guy is an union carpetner so hes picking to pieces all of my framing at the moment. He kept pointing out one wall he did sheet rock and saying do I see the waves and I kept saying no it looks fine...
> 
> Long story short its gonna cost me extra for him to straighten out my framing where he doesnt think its perfect... :sad:



Tell him you meant to do that on purpose for sound diffusion reasons! :joke:


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## Tommy

hahaha


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## Sonnie

Absolutely... I agree with nobbie here. You don't want it perfectly square. 

Ask him don't he know anything about acoustics. Ask him if he is doing the TPX484 vertical acoustical wave transform wedge with the sheetrock... when he says, "huh"... say, "that's what I thought, now get busy hangin' sheetrock and leave the framing to me when it comes to home theater rooms." Then casually walk away with a slight dip and drag strut.​
:joke:


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## Guest

Okay, the slight dip and drag strut had me bustin' out laughin'!!! Good one!


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## Tommy

Not much to news to report for the week, 

Monday he didnt show up with any help and I helped carry in half of the sheetrock
Tues he showed up with help carried in the rest and started
Wed he adjust some of the framing
Thur he was scheduled off
Fri he no-showed... :rolleyesno: 

Not sure if he's gonna show tonight yet or not


----------



## Matteo

Tommy,
Looking great. I haven't read your entire thread (9 pages) but skimmed a lot and looked at the pics. Looks great. You mentioned having your back rears close together and being a bit worried about it. If you haven't sheetrocked everything, I would suggest running extra speaker wires to a more lateral portion of the wall, just in case. When doing my HT, still currently underway, I ran extra wire everywhere. I ran 3 front left, 3 center, 3 right, 2 pairs to each side and back, and 2 more pairs on the rears. You never know if those sheet-rockers are going to hit a wire with a nail or something. Also, not sure if you have figured out your sub yet. I know you talked about SVS or in-wall, but here is another suggestion. 
http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/subwoofers/999-riser-sub-new-forum.html#post7119
I am building a sub under my riser, which you could do if ceiling height permits. I am told it should reach astronomically low levels. I should have it running this week if time permits. Good luck with the rockers.
Roly


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## Tommy

*Progress Update:*

Sheet rock guy showed last night (with no help again), this is the first time he's been back in 2 weeks now.

Wed July 19th was the last he did any work, then said he would be off for the rest of the week for vacation. Then pulled a no-show for the next 2 weeks on me... 

As far as the HT room, Everything is sheetrocked except one soffit & the door will need to re-hung. So hopefully that will be completed tonight. 

Unfortunately there’s still alot of sheetrock for the rest of the basement to complete and the garage so I dont know if he'll have someone start mudding the HT room till its all completed or not.

------

The theater seating was delivered on July 21. 7 Berkline sets (090 I think) 3 straight config row to be used for the first row and 4 curved config for the second row. 

The seats remain boxed up and sitting in the garage at the moment until the basement work is completed.

------

Home Depot had a 10% off weekend last week so I went ahead and purchased the paint. So thats ready to go as well as soon as the room is finished being sheetrocked and mudded

----

I ordered wall sconces twice now from two different places. Both companies, after waiting a month each for them to be delivered, then notified they dont have them in stock. So I'm still searching for wall sconces

----

Other then that I think the only other large expense and item that still needs to be ordered is carpeting & trim materials. I'm kinda waiting till the sheetrockers are done though to see how much I get charged in "extras" before ordering the carpeting.

We did look at some samples though and got a couple of quotes. The one carpet place which has one of those home theaters theme carpets quoted around 1,300 - 1,400 for everything installed. Second selection was a plainer carpet from HD that came out to about $900 for everything installed. I'll wait to see how much is left in my budget before deciding on which carpet. 

As far as the trim work for the base of the walls in the room should I put that in before or after it is carpeted? If before the carpet should I raise it off the floor a bit?

---

As far as equipment the only new items I've added recently is that I'm starting to build up my new HD DVD movie collection. I have 14 titles so far and looking to add another 5 - 10 titles sometime in the next couple of weeks.

I am very impressed with the HD DVD so far, it was certainly a great purchase. Right now we have it temporally hooked up to the Pioneer plasma tv in our great room. I think after we move it to the HT room though, I may have to go purchase a second one to put permanently in the great room


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## Tommy

rolyasm said:


> Tommy,
> Looking great. I haven't read your entire thread (9 pages) but skimmed a lot and looked at the pics. Looks great. You mentioned having your back rears close together and being a bit worried about it. If you haven't sheetrocked everything, I would suggest running extra speaker wires to a more lateral portion of the wall, just in case. When doing my HT, still currently underway, I ran extra wire everywhere. I ran 3 front left, 3 center, 3 right, 2 pairs to each side and back, and 2 more pairs on the rears. You never know if those sheet-rockers are going to hit a wire with a nail or something. Also, not sure if you have figured out your sub yet. I know you talked about SVS or in-wall, but here is another suggestion.
> http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/subwoofers/999-riser-sub-new-forum.html#post7119
> I am building a sub under my riser, which you could do if ceiling height permits. I am told it should reach astronomically low levels. I should have it running this week if time permits. Good luck with the rockers.
> Roly


They better not hit any wires...  

Your Sub riser looks great! I'm thrilled with my SVS sub though and will live with that for the forseeable future


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## JCD

Hey, it's great that at least you're making progress, despite the best efforts of your sheetrocker.

I hate it that construction guys can get away with business practices like that. If I were to pull something like that, I'd be out of a job.

Good luck and thanks for the update.

JCD


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## Sonnie

I believe I might just not pay him and hire someone else... or maybe subtract whatever someone else quotes you from what he quoted you and tell him he can take a permanent vacation from your place. I think you've been rather patient.


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## JCD

Any progress? Have you been able to get that no-good low down sheet rocker to come over and do his job?

JCD


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## Sonnie

Yeah... are we taking a vacation or something? Seems to be going around.


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## Tommy

He showed last Thurs & Fri night but without any help. I wasnt home Friday night but the wife said he mainly just spent time cleaning in the basement which I guess needed to be done but wasnt productive as far as getting closer to completing everything. He was supposed to show on Saturday and work a full day but pulled a no show again. 

He's sheetrocking the HT room along with the complete basement & ceiling, my garage. The biggest problem really is that he keeps jumping around from one room to another rather then finishing the HT room so I can proceed with the rest that needs to be done while he does the rest. Atleast as far as the HT room goes, the sheet rock in there is done. He just needs to re-hang the door and mud everything.

His original game plan was to compelte all the sheetrocking before having someone else come in to do all the taping and plastering. I guess just because of lack of help for the rest of the basement though on Monday he started taping the HT room. So hopefully if he finishes that before jumping back to another room atleast the HT room can proceed.

My son has been away for the summer visiting family, he comes home on Saturday. I was originally hoping to have the room done before he got home. 

I guess soon as he's done the room I can put the trim up and then paint. As far as putting the base board and trim and tips/advice is appriecatetd. I'm going to need baseboard around the bottom of the walls plus trim for the door, equipment rack & (HD) dvd shelves.

What do I need and how do I need to cut the angles for all the trim at the corners? Should all the trim be the same of should the trim on the door and walls be different from the baseboard?

Its just about time to call the electrician back to hook up all the lights and connect everything. Unfortunatly I'm still having problems trying to find wall sconces that I like. I found this one but have not been able to find anyone that has it in stock. I ordered it twice so far only to have it never get delivered.

http://www.csnlighting.com/Progress-Lighting-P7103-31-15092PG4139.html

Trying to find ones that shine thru the top and bottom but not thru the sides


----------



## Sonnie

> What do I need and how do I need to cut the angles for all the trim at the corners? Should all the trim be the same of should the trim on the door and walls be different from the baseboard?


There is "baseboard" and there is "door casing" and then "crown moulding" for the ceiling. Your lumbar/hardware store can show you some samples. I did not go the conventional route because I was not looking for fancy or traditional trim... although I did use the standard door casing trim.


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## Tommy

Progress Update:

I finally got around to taking some updated pictures of the room to post. The sheet rock in the room and spackling are finally complete. Just need to re-hand the door and start putting in the trim work and can hopefully start painting. Gotta make arrangements for the electrician to come back and install the lights and wire everything up to the box.

After months of trying to get the walls sconces I wanted from several places I finally gave up and ordered ones that look similar but are from a different manufacturer and are white. Hopefully I can paint them.

Ok here are the pic's


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## Tommy

Part of basement outside of the HT room


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## Tommy

Back of the equipment rack


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## Tommy

View of the rear of the HT room


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## Tommy

View of the rear and part of the right wall (right when your facing the screen)


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## Tommy

View of the right wall (right when your facing the screen) from the doorway to the back of the room. Room length is 20' long, room width is 14'


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## Tommy

View of the riser. It is made of 2x10 base with 3/4" plywood. 2 - 2x4 steps, one on each side of the room. Riser depth is 7' from the back wall and starting at 13' from the front wall. Inside the risers are stuffed with insulation.


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## Tommy

View of the front wall 14' wide, 8' height to the ceiling. Height from floor to the bottom of the soffit is a little less then 7'


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## Tommy

View of the front, right wall & doorway


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## Tommy

View of the left wall. 2 columns are on each side wall. Each column will get a wall sconce, rear colums will have in-wall surround speakers below the sconces. In between the colums will have recessed lights shining on wall posters.


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## Tommy

Just another view of the front wall


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## Tommy

View of the right & rear wall, wanted to show the nasty soffit needed on the right hand side. It is about 4.5' wide. Height from on top of the riser to the bottom of the soffit will be a little less then 6'. Couldnt be advoided because of the duct work. Fortunantly there should only be about 1 rear seat that will be under the soffit (designated the kiddie corner)


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## Tommy

Seating remains boxed up and sitting in the garage for the moment till the room is ready for them. There will be 3 seats in the front row in a straight config and 4 seats in the second row on the riser in a curved config. The seats are Berkeline and provided by Roman who advertises here at Home Theater Shack if anyone is interested.


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## Tommy




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## Tommy




----------



## Guest

Good looking room Tommy!

I tried to get caught up on the 10 pages of posts, so I may have missed something, let me know if I have.

As for the trim, someone mentioned the difference between baseboard, casing and crown. That is really personal preference. As for when to install it, most of the time the trim goes in first, and carpeting is last. Once again, some people do it differently. In my basement we did trim, and still have yet to do carpeting. We also painted the trim before carpet as well, helps to alleviate the potential for paint ruining your carpet. Yes, the guys installing the carpet will scuff/scratch the baseboard with the carpet kicker, but it is much easier to touch up baseboard after carpet is in, then paint it completely after carpet.

Your equipment cabinet, has a rear door on it, are you putting a front door on it at all? With an open faced equipment cabinet, there is the introduction of noise and heat into the theater, especially with a closed back cabinet. Someone had mentioned fans and cooling back on page 6 I think. You can use a hole saw and cut a couple of 4" holes in the top of the cabinet and install some fans, if the fans aren't very quiet, you can run some of the flexible dryer ducting and remote the fans a few feet away to help with fan noise. Also, if you install fans directly on the enclosure, you can use some rubber feet in-between the fan and wood to cut down on vibration. 

Trying to recall if there were any other questions you had. Did you get the screen and projector mounting issues worked out? The dropdown of the projector in relation to the screen, I don't know what the Benq vertical offset is. Does the mount you have use standard 1.5" NPT pipe thread or is it a proprietary pole?

Good work, and look forward to the updates!


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## Tommy

I havent decided on a front door yet or not. There will be a midatlantic shelving inside the cabinet so I can add a door to it if neccessary. I'll wait and see how it all works first.

Mounting issues were worked out and tested fine before I took it all back down to sheetrock. I would like to hang it higher to the ceiling though (already bumped my head on it a couple times) but not sure if offsetting it more (even if it is capable of it) produces any disadvantages.

Mount manual suggested ordering there extension pole for it but I used a regular 1.5" pipe I got at Home Depot.


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## Sonnie

Well it's looking like you at least got the mud work done and get on with things now.

My thinking is once you get the seating in there you won't be able to bump your head any more since the seating will most likely be in the way of walking or standing up directly under the projector, unless I've got the distances off.

Nice looking piece of furniture.


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## Tommy

Progress Update:

The sheet rock guy showed most of last week, he was supposed to work thru the weekend on Fri and Saturday but pulled a no-show on both of those days again. He did show back up on Monday night though. According to him I should be able to start painting the HT room next weekend now. Guess I’ll hold my breath and see though. He’s was still spackling in there again yesterday. The trim still needs to be put in and the door re-hung, plus the sanding.

My electrician friend showed on Sunday and we got all the lights and outlets installed and working in the HT room. So that was a big plus in progress. The recessed lights came out nice, shining right on the areas where I wanted them too. The sconces look great too but I took them back down in order to paint them.

Installed were 4 wall sconces ( one on each of the columns ) , 8 recessed lights ( 2 on front wall, 2 on each side wall in between the columns to shine on posters and 2 on the back wall), plus the rope lights. 

Since I will be using in-wall speakers, the side surround speakers are acting as the access panel for wiring of the rope lights. So I cut the wholes in the side walls for these two speakers, we wired the rope light and then installed the 2 speakers which I taped and covered with plastic afterwards.

4 dimmer switches were used, one will control the wall sconces, one for the 4 recessed lights on the side walls, one for the front and back wall and one for the rope lights. 

We ordered a carpet last night, one of those HT themed carpets but the carpet place only had it in a bright color we didn’t want so there gonna check today to see if they can get the black background one. If not we may just go with a different carpet altogether.

At least it finally starting to feel closer to complete with having walls and lights up. The Mrs. is getting excited and the wheels are spinning as far as decorating goes. She’s already suggesting a popcorn machine and one of those custom intro dvd’s, themed pillows, blankets, wall hangings etc… ( I left one of those HT Market catalogs around ). She’s really getting into all that themed stuff.

She’s used to the HD DVD player being hooked up in the living room now, don’t know if I’m gonna be able to get it back for the HT room. May have to go and buy a second one.

I’m anxious to get the seating placed down there just to see if everything fits ok but will wait till the work is done, hopefully there wont be any lapse time as far as getting the carpet in.


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## Sonnie

Cool... glad things are moving along.

I guess you already know Roman has popcorn machines and he's probably cheaper than anyone else.


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## Tommy

Really, I'll have to check that out...

Wonder why I'm not receiving an email when someone has responded to this thread


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## Sonnie

Did you unsubscribe to it by chance? Check the Thread Tools at the top part of the page just above the first post. Check your junk mail too.... maybe it got canned. I'm getting notifications fine.


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## Tommy

I'm subscribed, and this is a web mail account with no junk filter. I did however get a notice for your last post but it does seem to skip sending some of the notices.

Anyway, maybe this will help push the sheetrock guy along into finishing... I went down and put the first coat of primer on in the room last night. He still has to put up the baseboard, trim, & door for the room.

Do you think the dust from completing the rest of the basement will mess up the HT room if I paint in there before the whole basement is done?

Carpet place called, they couldnt get the black HT themed carpet we wanted. So were back to looking for carpets again


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## Sonnie

If the room is sealed off good then there shouldn't be any way for dust to get in there.


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## Tommy

Progress Update:

Ok another week went by shafted by the sheet rock guy... :hissyfit: 

Supposedly the room was supposed to be done last week including trim & door. I was told I put up one coat of primer and then he would re-sand any spots that needed it and I would be able to paint the room by the weekend.

He showed up on Monday & Tuesday last week. I put up the first coat of primer on Wed but the guy has been a no-show for the rest of the week again... I'm really regretting the fact that I already paid him most of the money for the project


----------



## Tommy

*Progress Update:

Friday: *

Sheetrock guy was a no-show again

*Saturday: *

Sheetrock guy showed up for about 20 minutes and then we had a black-out and he left

*Sunday: *

He no-showed yet again. All he has left in the HT room is to put the trim and baseboard in. He was supposed to fix & sand some rough spots but never did. I would have been better off doing all the work myself. Anyway I decided to start progressing on the project myself and if I need to re-do any of the walls later, I'll worry about that later, I want the **** thing finished now. 

I cut the holes in the walls and installed all the remaining in-wall speakers. All 7 in-wall speakers are in now. I covered all the speakers with plastic and taped them up. Also taped the room so I could start painting.

*Monday:*

We put up 2 coats of maroon paint on the sides and rear wall. It looked great but I'll wait till later to decide if we should do a 3rd coat or not. Will let that dry for a day or two and then get ready to paint the ceiling, front wall, columns and trim work black. I took some pictures while it was being painted, I'll try to post them later.

Still searching for a carpet. Unfortunatly we havent been able to find any local carpet place that has any of the themed carpets in the colors we selected from online.

Its starting to wrap up, but my up coming Army reserve schedule may have me away for the next 2-3 weeks. Although I'm trying hard to get out of it all and have my doctor notes ready...

Ordered a bunch of posters for the room too. I still have to go and get the poster frames though.

Other then that I found some one line that is local and has a ISF certification so I'm discussing with him now what it would cost to have him calibrate the HT room and my living room plasma when its all done.


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## Sonnie

Sounds like you are getting really close... :T


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## bobgpsr

Tommy said:


> ...Ordered a bunch of posters for the room too. I still have to go and get the poster frames though...


Have you considered possibly making those posters into room treatments? I've read that treating first reflection points can really help the acoustics and get more of a level/flat middle to high frequency response.

Already you have a very impressive theater. Congratulations. :T 

Bob


----------



## Tommy

Hmm, I never got an email of your responses... sorry for not responding.

*Weekly Progress Update:*

Sheet rock guy no-showed most of the week again... I think he showed up on Monday & Tuesday last week and I havent seen him since. I'd fire him if I didnt pay him so much money already but at this point it just aint worth it. 

As far as him and the HT room, he only has to put up the trim around the equipment rack and the dvd rack and thats it, so I'm surprised he's still no-showing rather then just finishing. Not sure if he has more sanding and plastering to do or not in the rest of the basement, plus he still has my garage to sheet rock.

What he did do for the room for the week though was re-hung the door and put the baseboard around the room.

Anyway back to the HT room, he messed up a bit of the one wall that I already painted but it shouldnt be to bad to sand and re-paint. The back wall has a big spackle spot thats sticking out though that wasnt apparent when I primered the wall and only become noticeably visibile after we painted. Not sure if we should sand the whole thing down and start over or not.

On Saturday, I re-taped the room to put up the next bit of paint. I put up one coat of black paint on the ceiling, columns and front wall. Plan on adding a second coat this week and possibly a third if needed after that. After which I will put up the third coat of maroon on the walls.

So basically 1 more coat of paint for the room and the painting should be done. Gonna go try and order a carpet tonight. We picked a plain one from Lowes since we couldnt find a themed one in the area in the darker background colors. The capet we picked is mostly black with some colors blended into it. Not thrilled with it but for lack of finding something else that is more impressive it looks like were gonna get it.

Other then that not much was done for the week. The posters I ordered came in. Wife was mad that I didnt let her help pick the posters but oh well. Gonna go to Michaels and pick up some frames for them still. Bob, what do you mean about making them into room treatments?

My HD DVD collection is still growing. I'm up to 36 movies including titles I have pre-ordered. I'd have at least another half dozen on order if Amazon ever fixed there site and actually offered some of the movies that about to be released, like Troy for tomorrow. Guess I will try and pick it up at a store tomorrow instead.


----------



## JCD

Tommy said:


> The posters I ordered came in. Wife was mad that I didnt let her help pick the posters but oh well. Gonna go to Michaels and pick up some frames for them still. Bob, what do you mean about making them into room treatments?


So what movies did you pick? And what movies would she have picked?

Regarding the room treatment thing, he's referring to accoustical treatments -- which I think we discussed earlier in this thread. If not, THE authority on the subject is Ethan Winer. He may go a bit far, but he does have some good information.

Unless I misunderstood bobgpsr's suggestion, I'd have to disagree about using the posters in conjuction with treatments. Too much sound is going to bounce off the glass or even paper before it gets down to the absorption material to be effective. However, if he meant to stagger the treatments with the posters (i.e., one poster, one treatment, one poster, etc), that could work for both aethestic and functional reasons.

In any case, you must be pretty excited that it's coming together finally -- despite the best/worst efforts of your sheet rocker.

JCD


----------



## Tommy

Ya, I'm anxious to get the HT room done now but at the same time, since the rest of the basement is still a construction mess, worried about finishing the HT room and getting any dust from the rest of the basement into the HT room.

Did you mean movies or posters? She was mad about the posters. ::shrugs:: I figured she could care less what posters I got but I guess she just wanted to have her say. Its not like I got any big bossomed actress posters (because I couldnt find any...). Anyway the posters I got were King Kong, LOTR, Harry Potter, Master & Commander & Braveheart. Need one more, more or a rectangular one though then tradional size. I dont think she wanted anything specific, just wanted to be part of it. (the nerve of her)

If you were talking about the actual movies, I guess I can list the HD DVD ones I got so far.

1.	Last Samurai, The 
2.	Million Dollar Baby 
3.	Serenity 
4.	Apollo 13 
5.	Swordfish
6.	Jarhead 
7.	Training Day 
8.	Full Metal Jacket 
9.	Unforgiven 
10.	Bourne Supremacy, The 
11.	Chronicles Of Riddick, The: Unrated Director's Cut 
12.	U-571 
13.	Van Helsing 
14.	Constantine 
15.	Perfect Storm, The 
16.	Rundown, The 
17.	Kiss Kiss Bang Bang (DVD Combo) 
18.	Dukes of Hazzard, The (Unrated) 
19.	Friday Night Lights 
20.	Pitch Black (Unrated) 
21.	Lara Croft: Tomb Raider 
22.	Four Brothers 
23.	We Were Soldiers 
24.	Aeon Flux
25.	Italian Job, The
26.	Bone Collector, The
27.	Spy Game
28.	Lethal Weapon 2
29.	Backdraft (Anniversary Edition)
30.	2 Fast 2 Furious
31.	Fast And The Furious, The
32.	Dirty Dozen, The
33.	Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines
34.	Army of Darkness
35.	Mission Impossible: Ultimate Missions Collection
36.	Poseidon

Still need to find some info on Popcorn machines, I would like to order one but would like to find a recommend good one. Sonnie, you said Romain sells them? I dont see anything on the site about it. I also wrote on one of his threads requesting info but didnt get any reply

By the way, Sonnie - how is your HD collection coming along?


----------



## Tommy

Oh I did forget one thing, I found an ISF calibrator online that is local to me and discussed him coming out and calibrating everything.

He estimated around $700 for video calibration & full audio calibration with HD sources (player & cable box) for the HT room plus video calibration for my plasma tv in the family room.

This seem like a good/fair deal? Also is there anything else I should be asking him to do?


----------



## JCD

I feel your pain regarding the wife -- same thing happens to me all the time.

Also, that's quite a collection of movies you've got there. Have you watched them all already?

As for the popcorn machine, can't help you much there either, but is somethign like this what you're looking for? or this?

JCD


----------



## Tommy

JCD said:


> I feel your pain regarding the wife -- same thing happens to me all the time.
> 
> Also, that's quite a collection of movies you've got there. Have you watched them all already?
> 
> As for the popcorn machine, can't help you much there either, but is somethign like this what you're looking for? or this?
> 
> JCD


As far as the HD format goes, its a start. Watched most of them as they came in. Theres a couple I havent seen yet though and the ones that are still on pre-order. Wasnt planning buying to many of them till I see which format wins the war but the pile keeps growing... 

As for the popcorn machine, yes that what Im looking forward but wanted to make sure I get a good one that someone recommends.

Oh well, I'm home and guess what no sheet-rock guy... :explode: 

Waiting for the wife to get home and then were supposed to go and possibly order the carpet tonight. Between tonight and tomorrow hopefully I'll get some more of the painting done too.


----------



## bobgpsr

JCD said:


> ...Unless I misunderstood bobgpsr's suggestion, I'd have to disagree about using the posters in conjuction with treatments. Too much sound is going to bounce off the glass or even paper before it gets down to the absorption material to be effective...


I was thinking of Tommy having a place do a transfer of the print from the poster to soft loose weave muslim which IIRC others have done. Then have the printed muslim serve as the cover for semi-rigid fiberglass insulation per Ethan Winer's recommendations. I'm thinking that one of those places that take photos and print t-shirts might be able to do it. That would be the only way I could sneak room treatments in and pass WAF. Agreed that the paper of a poster covering the fiberglass insulation would reflect too much of the sound. I need to get off my rear end and do something like that someday for more treatments to my upstairs system's room. :daydream: I do have a big 2' x 4' framed krull embroidery piece that works as a treatment.

Bob


----------



## Sonnie

Tommy said:


> Still need to find some info on Popcorn machines, I would like to order one but would like to find a recommend good one. Sonnie, you said Romain sells them? I dont see anything on the site about it. I also wrote on one of his threads requesting info but didnt get any reply


He's got them up on his site now. He is also about to do a power buy here pretty soon. We'll post that in his section shortly. I don't think you'll beat his prices.



Tommy said:


> By the way, Sonnie - how is your HD collection coming along?


Slowly... but it's coming. I don't have near as many as you, but I'm only getting the must haves for now and later when they hopefully put some of those on sale, I'll pick up a few more.


----------



## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> He's got them up on his site now. He is also about to do a power buy here pretty soon. We'll post that in his section shortly. I don't think you'll beat his prices..


Found it. Ya he did reply to that thread, I just never received an email that he replied...  Something is weird with that, I'm not getting all the emails I should for thread replies. Anyway the prices did look good and I picked out one I like, just gotta show it to the wife now.



Sonnie said:


> Slowly... but it's coming. I don't have near as many as you, but I'm only getting the must haves for now and later when they hopefully put some of those on sale, I'll pick up a few more.


I wasnt planning on so many but with amazons pre-orders the prices are a bit lower, plus the 10% off discount for a year, plus free shipping adds up to a whole bunch of $20 movies...


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## Tommy

I forgot to post the pictures that I said I would previously. Ok here are the pictures, this is after we put up the primer and while we were begining to paint the HT room.


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## Tommy

This is just a picture of the sheetrock in the rest of the basement to show how much of a mess I still have outside of the HT room itself...


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## Tommy

Ok the carpet installer came last night to measure and said he'll get back to me in a couple days with the total and it would take about 3 weeks to order the carpet. :hissyfit: :wits-end: :crying: :waiting: 

We selected the carpet from Lowes, I figured they would either have it in stock or it would take maybe a day or two to get, not 3 weeks. I was hoping they would be able to install it within a week. I'm really disturbed thinking this is going to go on at least another month before the room is done now.

Should this be faster to get? I may just go to another installer if I can get it done faster somewhere else, any thoughts? I would have ordered it so much sooner if I thought it would take so long. I figured it might if we picked a themed carpet but not a plain regular carpet from a major retailer.

I was kind of waiting for the carpet before putting in the theater seats and setting everything up. Should I go ahead and set it all up anyway and worry about removing everything in three weeks for the install?


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## Tommy

*Progress Update:*

Ok the carpet is ordered as I already mentioned, should be 2-3 weeks till it comes in and gets installed.

Sheet rock guy finally completly finished at least in the HT room... :clap: :hail: :jump: 

I got a bit done this weekend, I put up another coat of paint in the entire room and put the sconces and socket covers and all that good stuff in and then did any last touch ups that were needed. So the painting is finally done!

The wife and I moved the 7 HT recliners from the garage down to the basement. They'll sit right outside the HT room till after the carpeting is done but atleast there all downstairs now.

Only thing left is putting the screen, projector and rack components back now and then we can start watching till the carpet comes in. After that we just gotta put the recliners in the room.

I'm gonna be admitted in Walter Reed for the next couple days but hopefully will be back on Wednesday. Hopefully I can have all the equipment up and running for next weekend.


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## bpape

Hope all is well - get out of the hospital soon.

Bryan


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## Sonnie

What? You are going to the looney bin??? 

Just kidding... hope every goes well.

Looks like you are coming right along with things... won't be long.


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## khellandros66

Wow, I haven't chimed in a few months and alot is done. I love it, make the misses and runt do the work while you stand there taking pictures HAHA

~Bob


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## Tommy

bpape said:


> Hope all is well - get out of the hospital soon.
> 
> Bryan


Messed up my leg in Iraq, there gonna test me and then decide if I'm going to be medically discharged or not from my reserve unit. At this point I only have 5 months left on my contract but a medical retirement will give us some extra benefits...


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> What? You are going to the looney bin???
> 
> Just kidding... hope every goes well.
> 
> Looks like you are coming right along with things... won't be long.


Naaa I go to the looney bin back home...


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## Tommy

khellandros66 said:


> Wow, I haven't chimed in a few months and alot is done. I love it, make the misses and runt do the work while you stand there taking pictures HAHA
> 
> ~Bob


Coming along, a lot slower then I would have liked though but its finally winding down. Shoot they probably only helped while I took the pictures and then dissappeared and I got stuck with the rest...


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## Tommy

*Progress Update*

Ok I passed a few milestones this week and we are now close enough that I can actually set a date that the project will be completed. Of course the same applies that I have read on every HT project blog I have ever seen that they are never actually completed and will continue to be improved upon so I guess I should say were are scheduling the grand opening instead.

As for the work for the week, sheet rock guy was a no-show for the entire week again. Fortunatly he is done in the HT room so that no longer is holding me up. I am about to fire him though.

*Popcorn Machine*

On Friday our popcorn machine that I purchased from the group buy here on HTS was delivered to our house. I gotta say wow... the family and I were defintely impressed. Took about a week from purchase till it arrived. It only took minutes to unpack and put together. The directions for use were simple and we were up and runing with it right away.

I'll have to say the machine is a great addition to the HT room, it adds to the whole ambience of a home theater. The kids were thrilled just seeing the machine and just watching there faces while the popcorn was being made and then filling there movie theater style popcorn boxes was just something that couldnt have the same effect with microwave popcorn. As I said, its just all those little extras that makes the room from a tv room into an actual Home Theater. I'd recommend anyone interested to check out the Group By while it lasts here on HTS.

*Room Progress for the Week*

Ok besides popcorn we got all the equipment back in, installed and up and running. Projector, screen, receiver, HD DVD player etc... I hung 4 27 x 40" posters on the walls and we temporially put folding chairs in the room and watched our first movie, Serinity on HD DVD. I've seen it previously but it was the first the wife got to see it, she wanted to wait and see most of the HD's on the projector rather then the TV.

Our carpet that was ordered has arrived at the store and there scheduled to install the carpet next Tuesday October 3rd. So after that its just a matter of putting the seating in the room and were good to go besides some last minute hook ups and having someone come in and calibrate everything.

So that weekend after the carpet is installed will be our Grand Opening (even if it is just us but your all invited :bigsmile: ) Friday October 6th. Which will be great because I have about a half dozen new HD DVDs I'm expecting to receive later this week.

*Questions*

As for the last few things I still need to hook up let me ask here, besides the HD DVD player that I already have installed, I want to connect a second dvd player into the set up. 

01) My HDMI connection to the pj is already used by the HD player, should I just use component to the pj for video? 

02) Also how do I hook up the audio to the receiver? I dont want to be unpluging and re-plugging different wires each time I used a different source.

03) Additional component, I also still need to call and get a new cable box for the HT room. Same questions as the above players, what additional wiring will I need to do to have everything running? Can I have everything connected at the same time for video and audio or will I constantly be needing to change wire connections for audio & video

04) Calibration, I already found an ISF calibrator that I plan on using but have some questions about what I should do before calling him. While researching my specific projector on different forums I've seen some commong settings that owners make such as some changes in the service menu. I'm worried the calibrator not having specific knoweledge of this projector may and may not know of these settings. Should I go an apply these settings before he comes for the calibration?

05) Is there anything else I need to ask of him such as gettings all the new settings in writing?

Answers for the questions will be appriecated and just think pretty soon all these long winded posts that no-body is reading anyway will soon cease :bigsmile: 

To end this post I'll add a pic of the new popcorn machine and you can take a little peek at the back wall of the room and how it looks now. I'll wait till after the carpet is in before adding pictures of the finished room.


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## Steve Williamson

You will need to run the HD DVD HDMI to the PJ with the audio to an unused input on the AVR, then run the other players into the AVR as normal, i.e. DVD component into back of receiver with audio to that specific input, carry on for the rest of the inputs.

Component out from AVR to PJ for other sources.

The only problem is that you will have to switch the input to the PJ when you change from HD DVD to inputs on AVR, however, as long as you choose the unused input you put the HD DVD audio into, then the audio will play back through your speakers when playing HDMI on PJ as well as component in.

Hope this makes sense without a diagram, its late.


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## JCD

Hopefully the following makes sense and that I got everything right. I'm sure if I missed something or got something wrong, someone will chime in. Anyway, here are my thoughts:


1) If I understand everything, yes. If I remember right, your receiver is capable of video switching component signals. Assuming that, you can connect your sources (i.e., DVD player, HD cable box, etc) directly to your receiver and run just one component cable to your projector. All audio connections should be made to your receiver. As you choose the source on your receiver, it will switch both the audio and video automatically. You will need to change the "source" on your projector only when you switch between your HD DVD's and everything else.

2) All audio for all sources should be hooked up directly to your receiver. The best connection would be either a digital coax connection or optical. That will be the only way to get DD or a DTS signal. Again, as you change the "source" on your receiver, it automatically changes the signal that it will use. 

3) See 1 and 2 above.

4) I'd be inclined to make any adjustments before the calibrator comes out if for no other reason than to make the picture as good possible until he does make it out. As for the calibrator not having specific knowledge of the projector, I don't know if that would be required. He's going to be adjusting the picture to a standard -- color saturation should be "X", Brightness should be "Y", Contrast should be "Z", etc. Also, I'd make the adjustments so you have a better idea of what the picture should look like. I've heard that a properly calibrated picture is not what think it should be at first -- for example, it's MUCH darker than most people are used to. Once you get "used" to it, then you understand.

5) I would go ahead and get the settings in writing, assuming he doesn't give that to you automatically. The "problem" is that many of the adjustments that he will make are only available in the service menu -- i.e., those that can not be accessed by the normal controls. Other than that, I can't think of anything I'd ask other than if there are any periodic "tuneups" he would recommend.

And that popcorn machine looks great -- congratulations on the new purchase. Finally, I've read your story from beginning to end. It's been a fun journey for someone who hasn't had to deal with sheet rock guys that no show.

Good luck.

JCD


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## Tommy

Last weekend my 3 nephews/nieces stayed over along with my 2 kids. This is the first time they spent the weekend at my house with out constant running around. I think they stayed watching movies from Friday night till Sunday night...

They really broke-in the new pop-corn machine. I think I made something like 8 - 6oz portion packs over the weekend.

*Progress Update:*

Last weekend was a good test for the equipment. Yesterday however was our last major milestone, the carpet finally got installed and I finally got to put the HT recliners in the room and see how they look. Big thanks to Roman for the seating & popcorn machine.

This weekend will be our offical opening of the room (of course we still plan to do more improvements) but the room is finally done. Just a couple small things left like tacking up the rope lights to the carpeted risers and thats it.

I still plan on getting everything calibrated & adjusted (BTW thanks all for the above info on it all) but I have read a couple things that may make me want to wait a bit before doing it.

First was someone told me that I should wait till the bulb life reaches 200 hrs because begining bulb life is brighter then average bulb life span. Also Amazon is now taking pre-orders for the new DVE HD DVD disk.

So I was thinking about getting this disk first and doing some tinkering on my own before the calibrator comes out. Just to have a better understanding of all the options and settings and also to see how much of a difference the calibrator makes.

I'll wait till after the weekend to make a final summary of my construction thread and post up the pictures of the completed room.


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## JCD

I don't how I can be so excited/happy for you and so amzingly bitter/jealous of you at the same time.

In any case, I'm glad your long tortuous journey is about to come to an end. I'm looking forward to your completed pictures. Also, I'd like to hear

how you like the video and audio of your system
what you might do differently if you were going to start over
what you think went well and what went poorly
Someday, I'd like to be able to do exactly what you did and would love any advice you might have.

JCD


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## Tommy

I still owe pictures of the finished room... I'll get'em soon

Anyway just wanted to update and say the cable guy came out yesterday and I now have the HD cable box hooked up in the HT room and on my plasma in the living room. The HD looks great. 

Also my HD DVD collection is growing rapidly, I now own 40 HD DVD's and have like a dozen on pre-order.

To answer JCD's questions:

_01) how you like the video and audio of your system_

Everything looks and sounds great! I played with some of the video settings but dont want to do to much and hope to get everything calibrated sometime soon. As for the audio, I know nothing about audio so everything is still set to what it came with out of the box. It sounds great & I'm not messing with any of the settings, the calibrator should adjust it when he comes though

_02) what you might do differently if you were going to start over_

Not a **** of a lot, I researched everything pretty good and everyone here has been a great help. 

A couple things I might have changed are I should have just did the sheetrock myself, this guy took 3 months and came out a bit rough, I could have done that much and saved myself several grand.

Other then that I think the only thing I would have changed was with purchasing the equipment. I was unsure at the time as to if I had to run different types of cables and stuff depending on what I purchased so I purchased everything at the begining of the project.

They were excellent choices, I researched everything thourghly before hand so I dont think I would have chosen differently but the project did take a lot longer then I expected. So besides a quick test everything stayed boxed up for about 4 months before I got to use it. If I had to do it over, I would look up what I want but wait till the end before purchasing. Things change in 4-6 months with technology, I may have chosen something else or just plainly got the same items for cheaper by this point. I did have a week or two while framing when I tested it but besides that if something didnt work at this point, its pretty far past the 30 day return window. 

One add-on I would have done is this, even though I didnt get any motorized chairs I should have atleast ran an electric outlet over to where each of the rows of chairs sit. I'll have a work-around if I need them but it would have been easier to do it from the start.

03) what you think went well and what went poorly

As far as poorly, I would only say I had problems with the sheet rock guy and should have either done all myself of let a contractor do all from the start. Other then that the only thing I wish was different in the room is removing the soffits but thats not really anything I could do about that one, environment dictates.

As far as what want well, I got to learn alot and meet some great people here on HTS & AVS. The projector looks great, I'm glad I spent the time to not only research reviews but find demos of each of the projectors and travel to go see them.


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## Steve Williamson

Have you got the latest photo's yet? Can't wait to see the finished article


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## Tommy

Steve Williamson said:


> Have you got the latest photo's yet? Can't wait to see the finished article


Opps sorry, Ive been enjoying the room. 

I'll try and get the pictures up this weekend


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## Sonnie

Uh-huh... get your room all done and then ignore us... shame on you... :nono:


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## Tommy

Sorry, I did take some pic's but didnt like how they turned out so I was waiting to take some more. Screen shots of a movie playing come out horrible on the camera, how does everyone else take such nice pictures of a movie playing?

Gonna resize the pics now and upload them...


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## Tommy

Ok here they are:


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## Steve Williamson

Looking good, how are the in-walls coping? What size room is it again (i'm lazy and can't look)


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## brucek

> how does everyone else take such nice pictures of a movie playing?


You need to pause the scene, and then the camera has to be on a tripod and no flash with a long exposure to pick up enough light from the display...................

brucek


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## Sonnie

Agree with brucek... no lights on in the room... just light from the screen. Try different exposure lengths.

The room looks really nice Tommy... you guys did very well. :T 

You might upload a few of those photos to our Photo Gallery.


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## Prof.

A very nice looking theatre...Well done..
Your surrounds appear to be very low down...Any particular reason for this?
I'm about to set up my 7.1 system and I planned to have the surrounds about 2' above ear-level. Should they be lower?


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## Rodny Alvarez

Very NICE.....:T : utstanding: :5stars:
I like that red color, I've thinking about painting my red.:R


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## Tommy

brucek said:


> You need to pause the scene, and then the camera has to be on a tripod and no flash with a long exposure to pick up enough light from the display...................
> 
> brucek


Ahhh thats what I wasnt doing, pausing the movie...


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## Tommy

Steve Williamson said:


> Looking good, how are the in-walls coping? What size room is it again (i'm lazy and can't look)


The in-walls sound great. I tried them previous to actually putting them in the walls and havent heard any noticable difference after installing them in the walls.

The room is 20' in length by 14' wide


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## Tommy

Prof. said:


> A very nice looking theatre...Well done..
> Your surrounds appear to be very low down...Any particular reason for this?
> I'm about to set up my 7.1 system and I planned to have the surrounds about 2' above ear-level. Should they be lower?



The surrounds are above ear and seat level of the first row seats and around ear level for the second row. Appearance is a little deceiving since right there they are above the riser which raises the floor about a foot also right there on the one side I have a soffit for the duct work which lowers the ceiling height there by a foot. Clearance on that one side (on the riser and under the soffit) is barely 6' but not much I could do about that with the existing duct work.


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## Tommy

Rodny Alvarez said:


> Very NICE.....:T : utstanding: :5stars:
> I like that red color, I've thinking about painting my red.:R


The camera flash has it looking a bit more red then it is, it's actually a dark maroon color.


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## bobgpsr

Very impressive outcome! :T I would like to do something like that but the wife would never understand. Anyways the only place in my house that would do for a theater is holding the household goods of my stepdaughter and husband while she is doing a postdoc in Europe. So I have a couple of years to wait for front projecters to get better and less expensive. I lust for a Pearl and THX reference sound levels.raying: 

Bob


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## JCD

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHH... I hate you, hate you, hate you, hate you! :hissyfit: :explode: :hissyfit: 
That room looks awesome -- you did a great job. I am totally green with jealousy right now.

But seriously, great work. You earned it.

But I still hate you.

Not really.

Well, a little.

Ok, not really, but I am jealous.

JCD


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## khellandros66

:raped: :raped: 

Wow Tommy, that is fantastic looking. The color is great, I love accents and everything. 

Bet you find easy to forget about the local multiplexes now huh?!

~Bob


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## Sonnie

BTW Tommy (we think you are now a ghost :whistling: ) ... just how many movies have you watched since you got it all installed?


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> BTW Tommy (we think you are now a ghost :whistling: ) ... just how many movies have you watched since you got it all installed?


Hi Sonnie: 

Sorry I should be posting more but theres not much left for me to say about my room and I have no clue about anything to do with the subwoofer which seems to be the main topic here on the site. I do have to start posting more though... 

Not sure how many movies I watched yet but I can say theres about 200 hrs on the bulb so far and I now have something like 53 HD DVD movies and I know I watched all of them along with some of the regular dvds.


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## Sonnie

You been busy then... that's for sure. Sounds like you're getting good use out of it. :T

You watching all those movies, maybe you can either do some movie reviews for us and/or chime in on any that already have reviews posted. :huh:


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## Steve Williamson

Can we start a "Where's Tommy" campaign?


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## Tommy

Steve Williamson said:


> Can we start a "Where's Tommy" campaign?


Hi Steve:

For awhile I was having problems receiving any emails from this site to any of the threads I was subscribed too. I was receiving some randomly but for most of them I wasnt receiving any notifications at all. I just sort of gave up. I was kinda surprised this morning when I received this message so maybe everything is working again


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## Steve Williamson

Welcome back, how is everything going with your new cinema?


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## Tommy

It's going well, I added a Blu-ray player to the theater in addition to the HD DVD player and have quickly been building a new collection of high def movies. I also had the audio and video in the room ISF calibrated right before the holidays.

I'm itching to upgrade the projector already to a 1080p pj but the loss I would take for my projector that still has less then 300 hrs on it is alot.


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## Sonnie

He's Alive :raped:

Hey Tommy... good to hear from you. Not sure what's up with the notifications... I always get mine. :huh: No reason to give up on us though... not after this long thread... addle: 

What kind of Blu-ray player did you get? Maybe you can tell us about it and give us a user's comparison between the two over in the High Def forum... :yes:


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## Tommy

Hiyya Sonnie:

As for the Blu-ray player I bought a Pannasonic. Right now I'm up to about 89 movies for my HD DVD collection and 53 in my Blu-ray collection. The Blu-ray is mainly just so I'm not left out of any exclusive HD movies, I'd have to say I am much happier with the HD DVD format.


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## JCD

Tommy said:


> Hiyya Sonnie:
> 
> As for the Blu-ray player I bought a Pannasonic. Right now I'm up to about 89 movies for my HD DVD collection and 53 in my Blu-ray collection. The Blu-ray is mainly just so I'm not left out of any exclusive HD movies, I'd have to say I am much happier with the HD DVD format.


Does that mean the HD movies are better looking?

JCD


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## Tommy

JCD said:


> Does that mean the HD movies are better looking?
> 
> JCD


You serious or joking?

Very much so, it has an outstanding picture. As you can see I spent about 4k this year on just the players and movies so far. If I had to do it over though I think with the exception of a few movies would get all the HD DVD ones again. 

The Blu-ray format though would be a big change. First I dont know if I would get on the bandwagon at all if I had to re-do it. Between the picture quality for the format being inconsistent (1 movie will look great the next one having a recall) and they have not finished creating the specs and moved the deadline back from Jun till Nov already plus all the promised movies from Fox never came and Fox has now went 7 months so far releasing zero movie per month plus another 2 months only releasing one each... 

So now with Blu-ray I wait till after the movie was released and I have read several reviews before choosing if I will order the movie. Unless its something from Disney and the wife and kids want it no matter what the quality...

Oh wait... Ummm.... I change my mind...

It is a great format with perfect quality, anyone out there want to buy it all from me at around half price? $1,800 for the Panny and 53 movies...


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## JCD

Tommy said:


> You serious or joking?


I was referring to the difference between Blu Ray and HD.. I haven't been keeping up with the two formats and didn't know if one was supposed to be better than the other.

Interesting to note that the bluray has been inconsistent in the quality of its movies.

JCD


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## Tommy

JCD said:


> I was referring to the difference between Blu Ray and HD.. I haven't been keeping up with the two formats and didn't know if one was supposed to be better than the other.
> 
> Interesting to note that the bluray has been inconsistent in the quality of its movies.
> 
> JCD


Some of the BR titles can look excellent but I think the majority do not and vice versa for HD DVD. I can rant on and on about it but bottom line, even with my bias towards favoring HD I am always willing to keep an open mind and willing to do things such as blind test and comparisons etc


I think I dislike the smear campaign and misinformation BR spreads in the news the most. Such as more disc capacity (when most of there movies released are 25g not 50) or more studio support (both are within 10-20 movies of each others released) 20 times the amount of players for BR then HD (which is true but there both almost dead even in movie sales so which format do you think owners like most)

And if you research note that most of there movies that have high reviews for picture quality are usually cartoons and/or around 90 minutes in total length on a 50g disc. They have the room to crank up the bit rate on these shorter movies but not movies 2 hours plus long... 

I purchased my Panny for 1k under the impression they were gonna release TrueHD and DTS-HD support which they promised. What they finally delivered was a lesser version for DTS-HD and claimed semantics in the wording...

Blu-ray has also done the same and still has not completed the specs for there language. Profile 1.0 is out not, profile 1.1 due out in Nove and profile 2.0 still without a date. So what that means is you will have to keep upgrading your equipment in order to keep using the features they already promised in advertising...

Put it altogther and it is very dissapointing to me at least but as you can see Im a hypocrite and will continue to buy movies until HD DVD somehow gains Disneys support


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## Tommy

And to attempt to add a actual answer to your question, yes HD DVD does have higher picture quality.

I have taken the PQ reviews from sites such as HDD and average the results out. Consistently since launch HD DVD has had the higher review ratings. And fair to mention BR has had the higher AQ ratings.

I do think things are slanted however in BR's favor but at the same time HD still has the higer ratings.

I digress and will happily rant along in the Hi def forum. Other then that I'll limit my discussion here about it to how it affects my room as a whole such as equipment etc..


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## Tommy

Anyone following this thread all the way can see I love my BenQ 8720 pj but have been itching to upgrade to a full 1080p for awhile now. Fornutaley for me, the low end 1080's and even the Ruby and Pearl did not show enough of a PQ difference with my BenQ, enough to justify the difference in price.

Recent reviews on sites such as projectorreviews recently claimed the JVC DLA-RS1U as surpassing the other 1080p projectors under 10k; causing even the reviewer himself to replace his own personal BenQ with the new JVC.

Between the upgrade bug, the reviews, a sale price on the JVC and also all at the same time I was expecting some money to come in that the wife didnt know about yet....

The money hit my bank account yesterday at 9am, wife found it by 11:30 :holycow: but she didnt even get out the door before I had I placed the order :whew: 

I now have the JVC DLA-RS1 enroute; ETA: Friday :bigsmile:


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## Sonnie

Cool... now we can look forward to a review of it... :T


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## Tommy

Sonnie said:


> Cool... now we can look forward to a review of it... :T


Better yet, I'll host an HT Meet. Your all invited over Friday Night :bigsmile:


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## Sonnie

I'm game... :bigsmile:


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## JCD

> The money hit my bank account yesterday at 9am, wife found it by 11:30 but she didnt even get out the door before I had I placed the order


You're a brave man or she's a forgiving wife! 

That being said, that's awesome! As with Sonnie, I'm looking forward to your review.

JCD


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## Tommy

JCD said:


> You're a brave man or she's a forgiving wife!
> 
> That being said, that's awesome! As with Sonnie, I'm looking forward to your review.
> 
> JCD


hehe she certainly aint forgiving, I'm sure I'll pay for it down the line still...


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## Tommy

Now for the really hard part, selling my beloved BenQ. 

Considering I've only used the pj for about 6 months (less then 500hrs on bulb) plus original cost, acessories & recent ISF calibration I figure I'll probably lose 3-4 thousand dollars selling it compared to what I paid for it and hopefully it wont be more then that...


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## mechman

Hey Tommy,

Where did you get your movie posters from? Someplace online? Thanks!


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## Tommy

mechman said:


> Hey Tommy,
> 
> Where did you get your movie posters from? Someplace online? Thanks!


Hello:

Yes it was a place called allposters.com, I didnt really comparison shop when I got then so there may be better deals elsewhere. I know the wife doesnt like a couple of the ones we have and wants me to replace them already. Are there any specific ones your looking for?


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## mechman

Tommy said:


> Hello:
> 
> Yes it was a place called allposters.com, I didnt really comparison shop when I got then so there may be better deals elsewhere. I know the wife doesnt like a couple of the ones we have and wants me to replace them already. Are there any specific ones your looking for?


Not really, I haven't talked to the boss about it yet so....:whistling: I would have just done it but I've seen what your wife says and that's making me think "This may have to be a team decision".:bigsmile:

I was just looking for a recommendation. My walls are a bit bare at the moment other that some Minnesota Wild Hockey memorabilia. Plus I've seen a lot of people do this and I've always thought it looked cool.


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## mechman

Tommy,

Were the frames a lot cheaper at Michaels? I should be in bed and I'm looking at movie posters!!


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## Tommy

mechman said:


> Not really, I haven't talked to the boss about it yet so....:whistling: I would have just done it but I've seen what your wife says and that's making me think "This may have to be a team decision".:bigsmile:
> 
> I was just looking for a recommendation. My walls are a bit bare at the moment other that some Minnesota Wild Hockey memorabilia. Plus I've seen a lot of people do this and I've always thought it looked cool.


Oh ya she was ****** (about that too) when I ordered the posters and didnt ask her which ones she wanted. I was like do you even care about movie posters and got the whole it would have been nice to ask type ****... As you can see, I'm a firm believer in the "its easier to as for forgivness; then it is to ask for permision" philosphy :bigsmile:

Frames can get very expensive, and I dont see much reason to paying more for them. Plus delivery on line for something that big coule be very expensive. I would definetly suggest the cheaper frames at Michaels. They usually go on sale for like 50% off once a month, wait for then... 

As I said the wife wants to change a few of the ones in are room so if ya want to trade for something (movies or what ever) let me know. I know she doesnt like the king kong one and also the braveheart one. I remember buying a fifth one also that is still in the tube but cant even remember what it is at the moment


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## mechman

I'm thinking along the lines of like a Casablanca, Star Wars, Gone with the Wind, etc. What I'd really like is that Jack Nicholson - The Shining Poster. But I know momma won't like that...:huh:

May be a week or so, before I converse with my better half and get back to you, but I'll let you know one way or the other regarding King Kong and Braveheart.


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## Chinadog

Hey Tommy, new to the shack and your thread, so I just jumped from the beginning of your thread to the end to check out the finished product. Nice job! Bet you're logging a lot of hours on that lamp. Congrats!


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## Tommy

Thanks Bud

wow 114 pages on your thread. That certainly has humbled this old thread 

I started to look but dont have that much time today. Is there a summary some where  I would like to get a chance to though, I am interested in doing something almost exactly similar to your ticket window pictures. Did you do it from scratch or was it a kit to be ordered?

I'm not sure if I've blogged this here previously or not or if you have already completed something like this yourself. But I did create a light box, similar to your theater picture on your first posts to your thread and hung it above the door outside the HT room. It came out really good and only took perhaps an hour or two and 30 bucks.


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## Chinadog

Hey Tommy. That thread took on a life of its own!

If it helps, I went back and created an index for my thread in the first post. There are some links there in regards to the ticket window. I built it from scratch, no real plans, except for a basic layout in MS paint and the dimensions for the plexiglass. I did however take a bunch of pictures as I built it and put it in an album that may help you. I've done a few poster lightboxes myself and they're in the same album as the ticket window.

http://public.fotki.com/bketterl/early_construction/blazing_ridge_cinema-1/ticket_window_and/

Happy to help with anything, let me know if you have an questions.


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## Tommy

Getting that upgrading itch and looking for what to add/replace in the room...


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## IDSkoT

Great build, man. Looks amazing. I bet it's awesome.


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## Tommy

Update Bug:

01)
Ok I decided to add faceplates to my equipment rack. It winded up being a bit expensive but it definitely looks a lot better then before. The faceplates only work with a specific type of shelf (of course not the ones i already had on the mid atlantic rack) so I winded up replacing the shelves too, plus added a couple of slide-out drawers. Not including the rack itself, just the new items came out to around $800; plus im still wating to finish off one of the shelves since they dont currently have the faceplate for my cablebox in stock.

02)
My harmony 880 univeral remote died recently. Well it just sort of stopped working if not used within 1' of the component its controling. Bday & fathers day coming up so the wife say she would put money towards a new remote, so I ordered the Harmony 1100 model which hopefully will be delivered today. To compliment the new remote, this morning I also ordered the wireless extender & ps3 adapter.

Before:









After:


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