# HT room layout advice?



## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

Hi...new & first timer.
Finally finishing the last room in my basement...the much awaited HT. It is a DIY project, although I have spent time in the trades so the construction part is second nature stuff.
It is framed but lacking the electrical, HT wiring & sheetrock.
At this point, after reading a lot on this forum this weekend, I am already much further along in knowledge...but one of my basic assumptions about screen orientation is in doubt.
I am attaching a quick sketch of the room as it is set up.
There are no windows. The hall door and main entrance both come off a large rec room, which does have windows on the other side. Those windows are north facing...so it's not a bright basement.
Anyway, I had always assumed that you would enter and be at the back, facing the screen.
But with this situation, should I instead have the screen on the wall that the entrance is on?
A few other details...
Planning on a projector...have not put much thought into that part yet (things like screen size, etc) but that's where my head is...since it could be a totally black room the brightness should not be an issue.
Ceilings are 9', although there will need to be a central soffit to enclose ductwork running the entire 21' dimension. The height under the soffit will be 8'.
My reading on this site got me thinking about a platform, which got me thinking about changing the orientation....
I am probably missing details...ask away.
Hoping those with more knowledge can offer some advice.
Thx.


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

Welcome to The Shack Steve...

I would place the screen on the wall furthest from the entrance door, for several reasons..
Firstly, you will have a better placement for the front speakers, with side walls equidistant from the sides of the screen..
Secondly, anyone coming into the theatre won't be walking in front of seated people..
And thirdly, it will just look nice to see the whole theatre layout as you walk through the entrance door..

If you are having two rows of seating, you will be able to fit a riser at the back next to the entrance door..
Also,one of those closets would make an ideal equipment rack..

I hope that is of some help..


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## John Simpson (May 10, 2007)

Sounds like a good idea Prof. I would've said the same.


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

I appreciate the replies and advice...
Next question, then, is about screen size and seating for this area.
We are unlikely to have big groups frequently, but for the same reason as we have two guest rooms, it's nice to be prepared.
I also was thinking about a small bar area along the back wall (~7 feet of counter/cabinets centered on the 9-foot stretch of wall between the back doors. 
Or do I need to forgo that to get two rows? And if I don't want the true theater-style seating in rows, what do folks usually do instead?
Is all that related to how big I want to go on the screen? If so, what are the typical considerations (and is here where I need to head to another part of the forum?)
Again, Thanks.
Steve


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## yourgrandma (Oct 29, 2007)

Hello Steve, 

I agree with the others on the general layout. One must also consider what type of system it's going to be before other desisins can be made.

Do you want to go for a 7.1 ch setup? What level are you aiming for in your sound system? Do you want to hide your speakers or do you like big honking speakers all over (like me!!)?

I think a bar between the doors on the back wall would be cool, and could be made to work, as the room is a pretty good size.

Do you plan on building a stage or just wall mounting the screen? This will affect screen size as well as the general feel of the room (living space versus dedicated theater).

There are a lot of informative threads on screen size, and the general concensus seems to be that it's best to start big and go smaller if you don't like the results.


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

yourgrandma said:


> Do you plan on building a stage or just wall mounting the screen? This will affect screen size as well as the general feel of the room (living space versus dedicated theater).


Yes..Your first consideration is whether you plan to have a screenwall..with your speakers hidden.Or whether you are going to have the screen mounted on the front wall..
If it's the former, then you will lose 2-3' out of the length of the room..
Then you will need to decide on what size screen you are going to use, to determine seating distances, and whether there will be enough room for a bar on the back wall..


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## Guest (Jan 28, 2008)

I am a newbie at this home theater building but i can give you a generalization what I am doing and it sound a little like what your going thru I am puttin my screen on that wall furthest away from your doors and then putting in one set of seats(only three people who live in my home) behind the seating there will be two long pub tables with bar stools behind them so in case there are more people invited that they can have a decent view and a close to correct sound field since they will be right behind there seating section to where your closet is I have an antique bar where you have the wall at the back of your room in between your doors is the entrance into my theater. this way things seemed to work out closer to what ive been reading tp an accurate layout. Dimensionally our rooms are very similar. And i situated mine this way to keep as much light away from the screen when people may come in and for better placement of speakers


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

Prof-
Ok...basic question then...is a screenwall just a false wall used to hide speakers? 
If so, I probably would not do this since the space is just studs now and I can easily work speakers into the build.
Screen size? I probably need to do more reading before I dive into it, but my inclination is as big as possible w/out sacrificing a quality picture & viewing experience...100"? 110"? 120"?
What little reading I have done raises far more questions...just saw your thread on the build of your HT and the mention of 2.35:1... I assume only certain projectors do that aspect ratio?
Steve


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

In re-reading, I guess it was not your build, but you commented on the thread...
Steve


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

Shakster-
Thanks for the insight...and I like the idea of the pub seating.
The more I am reading this site, the less I seem to know!
In all seriousness, I am just beginning to realize how much research I have to do.
Steve


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

sns said:


> Ok...basic question then...is a screenwall just a false wall used to hide speakers?
> If so, I probably would not do this since the space is just studs now and I can easily work speakers into the build.


For the most part it is...But it can also hide speaker cables, and has an aesthetic appeal as well, taking on that more theatre look, as opposed to just having a screen on the wall with speakers either side..
But it does come down to personal preferences..


sns said:


> What little reading I have done raises far more questions...just saw your thread on the build of your HT and the mention of 2.35:1... I assume only certain projectors do that aspect ratio?


All projectors are capable of projecting 2.35:1..What you probably read was about Anamorphic projection, which gives a full image (no Black bars) on a screen that has an AR of 2.37:1..
This can be achieved with a native 16:9 projector with an anamorphic lens fitted..


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## yourgrandma (Oct 29, 2007)

Hey Steve, where in MN do you live?

All your layout and setup questions will become much easyer to sort out once there is a theme set. If you want a dedicated cinema, the bar will be less likely because you wont want lights and rattles and other distractions. If you want a multi purpose room , you can do whatever, as long as it doesnt mess too much with speaker placement and seating. 

Your theme will also dictate your budget and the kind of equipment you'll be buying.


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

Randy...East Twin Cities...Afton. You?
As far as themes go, it is a dedicated room. So I am thinking curtains and dark paint...everything oriented towards it being a very comfortable theater.
I'm not the kind of guy who is going to notice the difference between B level and A+ sound systems, but the video is another story. And the projectors seem to come in a remarkably wide variety of performance & price levels.
Much learning to do....
Steve


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## kjgarrison (Nov 17, 2007)

sns said:


> Randy...East Twin Cities...Afton. You?
> As far as themes go, it is a dedicated room. So I am thinking curtains and dark paint...everything oriented towards it being a very comfortable theater.
> I'm not the kind of guy who is going to notice the difference between B level and A+ sound systems, but the video is another story. And the projectors seem to come in a remarkably wide variety of performance & price levels.
> Much learning to do....
> Steve


Full disclosure: I have not built a HT.

Nonetheless, I have spent many hours researching the layout for a (problematic) space I have in my basement. Here are a few links that influenced my thinking.

http://www.thx.com/home/setup/speakers/71.html
http://www.thx.com/home/setup/speakers/dolby.html
http://myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html <--best
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=940648
http://www.projectorcentral.com/Panasonic_Home-PT-AE1000E-projection-calculator-pro.htm

There is another link I can't find, but the main points of it are that for *sound propagation purposes and to minimize nulls at your listenting position*, your theater should be oriented on the *long axis* of your room (as you are), and that the best places for your *primary seating is either 38% of the length of the room from the front wall or 38% of the length of the room from the back wall* (and a few inches off center, L&R).

So my conclusion, and this is the first time I have posted it anywhere that knowledgeable readers can critique it (gulp), is that to get to your best screen size, you need to work backwards. Room length dictates seating postion for audio purposes. Distance from seating position to screen dictates screen size for video purposes, or at least a range of screen sizes. Even your projector's specs will depend on screen size, gain, distance, and probably a number of other things I haven't thought of.

I worked on a spreadsheet trying to make a "calculator" for this, using the formuale and numbers coming from the posts I listed but it is too crude to offer it up.

I would have expected such a calculator to already exist, and maybe it does and I haven't found it.

Good luck with your project. Mine is on "hold" until I can convince my wife of the importance of it all... heh.

We are over in Wisconsin, near Rice Lake.

edit: I looked at your diagram again, and your room size is almost identical to mine. My problem, however is my ceiling height is only 7.5 feet.


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

Rice Lake is a great area...
Did you ever come up with a target screen size for your future HT (since it is of a similar size, I am certianly curious...)
Steve


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## kjgarrison (Nov 17, 2007)

sns said:


> Rice Lake is a great area...
> Did you ever come up with a target screen size for your future HT (since it is of a similar size, I am certianly curious...)
> Steve


Yes, but it's been a couple of months. I think it was something around 100 - 105" screen *width*. That gave me a viewing angle within specs for THX and put the distance so that primary seating was acoustically right (38% of length of the room from the back wall). If I used 38% from the front wall, the screen would have been so small I could have just gone with a flat panel. My room isn't exactly the same as yours, but I do think it was `22' long. I need to see if I have the numbers around.

Of course the bigger the screen, the farther away the projector is, and the dimmer the light is unless you pay more. So there are buget related issues here as well. When you think you have your seating location and distances all penciled in, you have to go to the link where all the projectors specs are shown. You can plug your numbers in and see how any given projector will work for you.

The first thing to figure out is where you will be sitting. There are basically two acoustically "best" places in the room to sit, and therefore 2 "best" sizes of screen.

*I'm hoping some of the experts here will say whether I have this right or not.*

In any case you really need to figure pretty much the whole thing out in advance. Everything is related and there are big cost differences.

And I didn't even mention screen ratios. There will be black bars, one way or another.


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

I continue to be amazed at all the nuances of the whole HT project and am realizing that there is a very, very large amount of planning required to do this properly.
Has anyone compiled a planning checklist or any other organizational / general tools to help avoid the pitfalls?
I feel like I could forge ahead, researching heavily here, but still easily overlooks things that will bite me later...when I have to tear out finished sheetrock, for example.
Anyone have any ideas?
Steve


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## John Simpson (May 10, 2007)

There's always something that comes up that you've either forgotten, or technology has leap-frogged your intial ideas.

Research is the key. For each part of the HT, scour the forums using keywords (eg: "conduit", "wallplates", etc) -- ever single piece of opinion will give you a new and (perhaps) better idea.

Finally, visit as many working HT rooms as you can (dealers, friends, Shack-mates). I was worried about the size of my new screen, but seeing it in action in a similar sized room made me realise it was exactly what we were looking for!

Checklist... hmmm. Not a bad idea. I see some good book-writing potential there...


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

You write, I'll buy.
Appreciate the tips...
Steve


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## yourgrandma (Oct 29, 2007)

Hey Steve,

I haven't checked this thread in a while, so I missed your local.

I'm way over in the western suburbs, about 35-40mi west of Mpls.

Sounds like you're on the right track with figuring out audio before video. (That's how my priorities work)


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

Back-to-basics question...
On my diagram of the room layout at the top, I show a closet...the right-most one (closest to the screen) does not yet exist.
I happen to have the extra cherry door to match the rest of the home, and thought this would be a good use.
Prof had suggested using it as an equipment closet (makes perfect sense, it would be sized nicely for that) but....do I need to rethink the door thing? I assume I need remotes to work with that equipment...and a solid wood door may be unkind to the signal...
Thoughts?
Steve ps Randy...funny, we are in the same metro area, but probably 60-70 miles apart!


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

There's a few things you could do for the equipment cabinet..

Have a door, and just open it for remote operation when you're projecting.. or
Don't put on a door and have your equipment on show..or
Make a new door that is covered with grill cloth, that your remote will work through..

Which ever appeals to you the most...


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## sns (Jan 27, 2008)

Back armed with less knowledge. Or maybe a little more.
Want an opinion on a change, and on seating layout.
I am heading towards 7.1 surround using in-wall speakers, and still think I can do a fairly big screen in the 100-115 in. class that will be a fixed wall-hung screen.
I have not picked a projector but am sure it will be a 1080 HD model...the Panasonic PT-AE2000U looks interesting...
Based on the location of the front speakers, I am coming up with something around 11-12 feet back for the eyes of the first row. 
And I am less certain about the second row...what are the norms for planning space between rows? 
Probably relevant is the fact that I will likely be doing two sofas, rather than the berklines or other individual seating. Little kids and all...wife wants it that way and I must agree that until the kids head off to college, that is the better solution. (Twins are just a few weeks old, so that will be a while.)
I happen to have some very nice extra kitchen base cabinets that I am considering using in this room in the back...but had been thinking I did not quite have enough room length to pull it off.
Since the rock is not yet hung, and since I have a bit of space I can steal, I may make a change. See diagram.
So...am I nuts? Do I have enough room as is for two rows and the cabinetry (think countertop for microwave for popcorn, mini fridge, that kind of thing...)
Or do I need to bump those cabinets back (I get exactly one foot more.)
Or am I still shy of having enough room?
Thanks,
Steve


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

The spacing between the first and second row will depend on how you plan to use it..
You mentioned using sofa's...There are two ways of providing spacing for this type of seating..
You can have the seating arranged that people in the back row will need to sit upright on the sofa, which only requires enough room to walk between the rows..

If you want to have it that they are able to stretch out, then you will need more space between the rows..probably about 4'..

With that scenario in mind, you will have about 3' (depending on how deep the sofa is) between the back seating and the cabinet..
If that's not enough room, then you will need to move the cabinet further back..


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## salvasol (Oct 31, 2006)

Prof. said:


> ...You can have the seating arranged that people in the back row will need to sit upright on the sofa, which only requires enough room to walk between the rows..
> 
> If you want to have it that they are able to stretch out, then you will need more space between the rows..probably about 4'..
> 
> ...


If you use two rows ... don't forget that maybe you'll need a riser for the second row :dontknow:

My room is 9' x 18' x 8' ... I have two rows, but I'm using recliner seats, and the space between seat and back wall is about 1' ... this means, you will get at least 4' like the prof.. said ... :yes::yes:


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