# New Setup - No Back Wall?



## Koiios (Sep 20, 2021)

First post, go easy on me please. Bought a new home and it has a unique layout where the main living space is, and I'm trying to determine the best audio setup possible.

Essentially, I want to do in-wall and in-ceiling speakers wherever possible. I have a lot of space next to the tv, so L/R in-wall is perfect. I can add height speakers easily too. I have a brick fireplace (electric so no real heat, and no I didn't build it that way), so I'm not sure what to do with a center channel. I suppose I'll have to mount it on the brick below the tv.

My real problem is with the rear and side channels, to the left of the space is the kitchen so there's no wall there, and behind the couch is the entryway and it opens to the dining room so I can't really have any floorstanding/listener-level speakers. I CAN have as many in-ceiling speakers as I want however, so the question is can I have both my surrounds and rears in the ceiling?

I'd love to take advantage of Atmos, but I'm not sure the upwards-firing speakers can be in-ceiling speakers instead, etc. So it'd be a... 5.1.4 system?


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## Wayne A. Pflughaupt (Apr 13, 2006)

Everything I’ve seen on the subject says that Atmos speakers do not play well when the regular rear channel speakers are also in the ceiling. And you certainly should not have Atmos speakers in front of the regular rear speakers, as you’ve pictured.

If you can’t have the rear speakers at a lower level, then you’re best off just sticking with 5.1. Of course, you can certainly do Atmos, with the rear channels actually at the rear, but Atmos just won’t “pop” as much as it would with proper rear-channel placement.

BTW, do in-wall for the front channels, not in-ceiling.

Regards,
Wayne


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

Koiios said:


> First post, go easy on me please. Bought a new home and it has a unique layout where the main living space is, and I'm trying to determine the best audio setup possible.
> 
> Essentially, I want to do in-wall and in-ceiling speakers wherever possible. I have a lot of space next to the tv, so L/R in-wall is perfect. I can add height speakers easily too. I have a brick fireplace (electric so no real heat, and no I didn't build it that way), so I'm not sure what to do with a center channel. I suppose I'll have to mount it on the brick below the tv.
> 
> ...


Well that’s a tough room!
So imo, the short version is stick to a 5/7.1. You could use phantom center, but for more than one seat that won’t be successful. So as mentioned, you’d have to find a way to mount a CC. And while your top front speaker placement looks fine, I think you’re confused on the terminology. Upfiring( Dolby Atmos enabled or DAE) speakers do not go in the ceiling but usually sit on top of your L and R speakers. 
The other problem is that there will be zero benefits in placing all speakers in the ceiling. Atmos uses the height differential between the bed layer(eat level) and height layer to place some objects into the room with phantom imaging and this can’t happen when they’re all on the same plane. 
Sorry if this reads as a broken message. I’m trying to multitask! 
In short, I’d use a standard in room LCR, and also for surrounds if possible. If not, in ceiling would be my last choice, but seems like it might be easiest.


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## Koiios (Sep 20, 2021)

Thanks for the responses! Seems like you're right Wayne, it would be pretty critical to get the rears to listener level. 

I was doing some reconfiguring/research in the meantime and think I have a better possible setup. It'd be a 5.1.4 atmos setup, and with a combination of in-wall, on-wall, and ceiling speakers I think I can get it pretty close to Dolby's reference guide for 5.1.4. I'm also aware of upfiring speakers but in-ceiling would be better for this setup I think since the Front L/R will both be in-wall. Also easier to get sonically matched sets, I'm looking at the new Polk Signature Elites that were released in the last few weeks. I doubt anyone has had much time to play with them yet so not too many reviews.


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

I think the new diagram looks good, and if you can do the IW and on wall with top speakers IC you should be good. I’m not a fan of DAE speakers so I’m glad you’re not pursuing that.


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## Koiios (Sep 20, 2021)

willis7469 said:


> I think the new diagram looks good, and if you can do the IW and on wall with top speakers IC you should be good. I’m not a fan of DAE speakers so I’m glad you’re not pursuing that.


Awesome, thank you!


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## willis7469 (Jan 31, 2014)

Koiios said:


> Awesome, thank you!


No worries! Glad to help. Atmos is kind of confusing even for veterans of the sport lol. The best part though, is it’s pretty forgiving in that you can waiver from the “guidelines” and still get a good experience. There are definitely things NOT to do like put all the speakers in the ceiling though. I also think Dolby hasn’t helped much by having guides and images that seem contradictory sometimes. I personally like the white papers that are available but harder to find. I think I have a couple saved if your interested.


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