# Help picking out a receiver



## graydodge14 (Jul 17, 2010)

Im in the process of buying a receiver for my home theater. Until i get my tv and everything i will be using this just for a music setup. My speakers are two PSB Image 65 along with 2 Ascendant Audio Diy subs i just put together. I will be playing them in home but also using them for parties where they will be cranked up to a fairly loud volume. 


i want a receiver with preouts, phono, and has enough watts to power the towers fairly loud until i get an amp for them (which should be easy due to their efficiency).

As long as i have something that will not shut down on me or over heat i will be happy, i dont want to damage my equipment so if yall have any recommendations or suggestions on what to do please let me know.


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## recruit (May 9, 2009)

Hello,

A receiver that I can think of would be the Arcam AVR600 which is superb with music and has plenty of power on tap when needed, I had the 600 in my system for a couple of months and it really is very very good indeed and has pre-outs for power amps also!


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## graydodge14 (Jul 17, 2010)

Thanks for the suggestion i have just bee kinda browsing a few sites. Heres what i have found

Onkyo 708 (i was originally gonna buy)
Onkyo 808
Yamaha RX-V1065
Yamaha RX-V2065
Denon AVR-3311CI
Denon AVR-2311CI

That was just a quick search, i know the prices range a little but dont mind the price i just want quality but need to stay below the highest prices receiver i listed. I also want 3d capable for the future so the yamahas may be out as i could not find if there HDMI was 1.3 or 1.4. I liked the fact on the yamahas though they had preouts for all speakers. But any more suggestions please


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## Ares (Nov 23, 2009)

The Denon 3311 Vs 3310

3310:

24-bit/96-kHz Burr-Brown PCM-1803

Optical inputs: 3

Assignable Digital Inputs: 6

PC Setup and Control Capability: via Ethernet/Web Browser

ABT 2010 Chip for Video Conversion

8-Ch. External Analog Input

HDMI 1.3a Inputs: 5 with 7.1 Uncompressed 24/96 Audio

HDMI 1.3a Outputs: 1

USB Flash Drive Port: Flash/HDD

WPC: 120

Weight: 28.6lbs

MSRP: $1499

3311:

Assignable Digital Inputs 4

True 24-bit/192-kHz Digital Input Capability 

Digital Inputs: Optical 2

Audyssey DXT

PC Setup and Control Capability via Web Browser

HDMI Inputs: 6 x 1.4a

HDMI Outputs 2 x 1.4a

USB Flash Drive Port: iPod Direct/Flash/HDD

WPC: 125

Weight: 26.9lbs

MSRP: $1199

For me personally I would take the 3310 over 3311 just for the ABT chip, weight difference, Burr Brown, and since I won't be doing the 3D thing anytime soon.


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## laser188139 (Sep 19, 2009)

graydodge14 said:


> ... I liked the fact on the yamahas though they had preouts for all speakers. But any more suggestions please


Both of the Denons you mentioned have preouts for all channels. 



Ares said:


> ... For me personally I would take the 3310 over 3311 just for the ABT chip, weight difference, Burr Brown, and since I won't be doing the 3D thing anytime soon.


That's a tough choice. I like the improvement I found moving from Audyssey MultEQ to MultEQ XT, and the 3311 includes the XT version of Audyssey where the 3310 does not. Also, it comes with Audyssey DSX already, which is a purchasable upgrade to the 3310. 

On the other hand, the 3310 supports multichannel analog input, which was dropped in the 3311. And this might matter if someone had an SACD collection, depending on the player. 

Bill


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
I would highly recommend the Onkyo TX-SR876 now that Accessories4less has A-Stock units for 799. MSRP is 1899 and it offers a rock solid Amplifier Section that when been Bench Tested output 130 Watts into 7 Channels. The unit weighs around 55 Pounds. 
They also have B-Stocks for 699.

I cannot tell you just how rare that is. 97% of AVR's do not come close to meeting the Rated Output. Many are pathetically off. One of the most egregious is Sony's 2000 Dollar STR-DA5400ES. When Bench Tested, it output 39 Watts into 5 Channels and 37 Watts into 7 Channels:http://www.hometheatermag.com/receivers/sony_str-da5400es_av_receiver/index3.html

Even Onkyo's TX-NR5007 output 68 Watts into 5 and 7 Channels. Given the large Toroidal Transformer and high levels of Capacitance, I do wonder if there was a problem with the Test Unit or if the Tester set it to the 4 Ohm Setting as this setting greatly reduces power output.

With the 876, you get THX Ultra2 Plus Certification, Audyssey MultEQ XT, Reon HQV Video Processing, the ability to bridge the Front Channels if not using 9.2, and about every Processing Mode out there.

Biggest omissions are Internet Radio and Audyssey DSX. However, for pure Sound Quality, it really is impossible to beat for the money.
Cheers,
JJ


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Good reccomendation for the money JJ, especialy if it is true to it's numbers, the only other brand i can think of that stays close is Marantz which also has supurb sound quality, but i'm not sure if you can get those numbers for the money.:T


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Here is the Bench Test for the TX-SR805 which uses the same Amplifier Section: http://www.hometheatermag.com/compactspeakers/208bwonk/index5.html
Finding Bench Tests on these Models is getting harder as Websites have been taking them down. Sound & Vision has the Review for the 875, but the Bench Test disappeared last month.
Absolutely fantastic measurements. AVR's that cost 2-3 thousand Dollars do not measure as well.

Here is a Review of the TX-SR876:http://www.avguide.com/review/tested-onkyo-tx-sr876-thx-ultra2-plus-certified-71-channel-av-receiver
Here is an Article about the stellar Reon HQV Processor in the 875:http://www.hometheatermag.com/receivers/608recfeat/index4.html
Cheers,
JJ


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> AVR's that cost 2-3 thousand Dollars do not measure as well.
> Cheers,
> JJ


I don't understand that either as the reviews of both the new upper end Denons made my stomach sink with how low the multi-channel wattage is.:scratch:


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Ever since Denon 05 Series, they have been plummeting in weight while raising their prices. You have the AVR-4310 costing 2000 Dollars while weighing 34.8 Pounds. For references sake the AVR-3805 cost 1200 Dollars and weighed 37.5 Pounds.

In years past, Denon offered several THX Certified Models. Now, only the 5500 Dollar AVR-5803 is THX Certified. I honestly do not think the 1500 Dollar AVR-3310 would pass THX Select2 Plus Certification.

For 100 Dollars more MSRP (less on the Street) Onkyo's TX-NR1007 offers THX Ultra2 Plus Certification, weighs almost literally twice as much (50 Pounds), and 9 Channels of Amplification and Dual Subwoofer Inputs with independent Audyssey Calibration for both. Sadly, the 1006 weighs 11 Pounds less, no longer is Ultra2 Plus Certified (Select2 Plus), and no longer offers MultEQ XT. It is 200 Dollars less however and at least offers THX Processing.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Ares (Nov 23, 2009)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> Ever since Denon 05 Series, they have been plummeting in weight while raising their prices. You have the AVR-4310 costing 2000 Dollars while weighing 34.8 Pounds. For references sake the AVR-3805 cost 1200 Dollars and weighed 37.5 Pounds.
> 
> In years past, Denon offered several THX Certified Models. Now, only the 5500 Dollar AVR-5803 is THX Certified. I honestly do not think the 1500 Dollar AVR-3310 would pass THX Select2 Plus Certification.
> ...


So even the High End Denon's have dropped weight, I knew the 1900 series has dropped weight with an average of one or two pounds per model year. I know Secrets of HI-FI did a bench test on the 3310 but it didn't give an all channels number just what it could do with two channels. Just something I noticed it seems that Denon has lost more weight than most of it competitors does anyone know the reason behind this.


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## recruit (May 9, 2009)

Maybe they are using ICE power rather than conventional class A/B which puts the weight up by quite a bit, but I have not seen it any where in the specs???

Edit: Or another type of Class D amplification.


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## tcarcio (Jun 27, 2007)

Well I have to put in a good word for Pioneer. I have the 81 txv Elite and it has plenty of power and has performed flawlessly for me. Pioneer just came out with some new models that are all up to date including HDMI 1.4a so upgrading to 3d later is easy. Also as far as power goes whether or not the reciever has 90wpc or 120wpc is not going to make much of a difference since you need to at least double the power to get a 3db gain in spl so don't get to hung up on that especially if you are going to be adding an amp.. Check out this new model, http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...hJHOCw&usg=AFQjCNHZOVOi41DUW2e4lKfdA-LRPKvrWg


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

recruit said:


> Maybe they are using ICE power rather than conventional class A/B which puts the weight up by quite a bit, but I have not seen it any where in the specs???
> 
> Edit: Or another type of Class D amplification.


Hello,
Sadly, no. Denon is still using Class AB Amplification. I wish that were the reason why the weight has dropped.
Pioneer's ICEPowered AVR's weigh more than all but the 4810 and 5803 I believe.
Cheers,
JJ


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## recruit (May 9, 2009)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> Sadly, no. Denon is still using Class AB Amplification. I wish that were the reason why the weight has dropped.
> Pioneer's ICEPowered AVR's weigh more than all but the 4810 and 5803 I believe.
> Cheers,
> JJ


:scratch: something definitely not right then?


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## Ares (Nov 23, 2009)

Here is a little info I have gathered just on the 1900 series going back to the 1905, and I agree John something is not right the info was pulled from their manuals.

Denon AVR 1905 WPC [email protected] ohms, weight 26.2 lbs

Denon AVR 1906 WPC [email protected] ohms, weight 25.8 lbs

Denon AVR 1907 WPC [email protected] ohms, weight 26 lbs

Denon AVR 1908 WPC [email protected] ohms, weight 24.7 lbs

Denon AVR 1909 WPC [email protected] ohms, weight 25.4 lbs

Denon AVR 1910 WPC [email protected] ohms, weight 23.6 lbs

Denon AVR 1911 WPC [email protected] ohms, weight 20.4 lbs

I don't know if Onkyo follows the same pattern but their models seem to be a lot heavier at the same price point. If Denon is still using Class AB then all this weight that's coming off would most logically be coming from the amp section right? 
​


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## laser188139 (Sep 19, 2009)

Ares said:


> ... Denon AVR 1911 WPC [email protected] ohms, weight 20.4 lbs ...


Did you accidentally pick up the 1611 info instead of the 1911 info? On the Denon site, it shows the 1911 at 90watts, 22.5 lbs. 



Ares said:


> ... If Denon is still using Class AB then all this weight that's coming off would most logically be coming from the amp section right? ...


What I've noticed is that Denon is reducing the number of rear connections. Between the 1910, which I used to own, and the 1911, there is now only one component input, no component output, no EXT.IN multichannel analog input, no Sirius connection, no B speaker output (which cuts out a pair of amplifier channels), only one digital and one optical input. So weight reduction may be coming from ancillary functions.


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## Ares (Nov 23, 2009)

You know your right I took the info from the wrong manual it should be 90WPC @ 8 Ohms weight: 22.7 lbs:doh:
Nice catch Bill, that could be a possibility but from the 1905 to the 1911 were talking about 3.5lbs of lost weight. :unbelievable:


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
Well, I am now officially in the market for an AVR/SSP. Today, I sold my TX-SR875 to my Landscaper. He has actually built a great HT from many of my former Components. He has Paradigm Studio 100 V.2's, Studio CC V.2, Studio ADP V.2's, Paradigm PW-2200, Denon DVD-2910, Parasound CDP-1000, Marantz MA-700, and I am sure I am leaving something out. Pretty much any and all of my old gear. The guy is in his 70's has a BMW Z4 with the M Package with 3000 Miles on it and still Works as a Gardener/Landscaper.

Tomorrow, I am picking up either a TX-NR3007 or TX-NR5007. Considering I will not be using the Amplifier Section in either, I probably will go with the 3007. Advantages to the 5007 are the Toroidal Transformer (both have 4 Transformers), an additional HDMI Input, Front and Rear USB Input for iPod Connection (3007 has Front USB), and 192 kHz/32 Bit Burr Brown DAC's. (3007 uses 192kHz/24 Bit Burr Brown DAC's)

The 32 Bit DAC's are making the decision difficult. However, it is a fairly high surcharge for the DAC's and other assorted Features. Shame I am relegated to 5.2 due to the size of the Speakers I use as Audyssey DSX looks like a wonderful Feature. It will be nice to have Internet Radio, Dolby Volume, Audyssey Dynamic Volume, Audyssey EQ, etc.

If I did not have 9 Channels of outboard Amplification, I would get the TX-SR876 without even thinking about it. I truly believe short of the Denon AVR-5803, it is the most powerful AVR that you can still find Brand New.
To be able to get it for 799 Brand New or 699 B-Stock makes it an absurd value. If I was using any other Speaker than Martin Logans, I would have no qualms about using the Amplification in the 876. Wow, AC4L also has New TX-NR906's as well. So I guess I must rephrase my prior statement and say the 876 is one of the most powerful AVR's currently available Brand New. The 906 is 1200 A-Stock/1100 B-Stock which is not nearly as good of a value.

You do get Internet Radio and a Toroidal Transformer with the 906, but I really do not think it is worth the 4 or 5 Hundred Dollar difference. You could almost afford an Emotiva XPA-2 for the difference and have some serious headroom.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

laser188139 said:


> Did you accidentally pick up the 1611 info instead of the 1911 info? On the Denon site, it shows the 1911 at 90watts, 22.5 lbs.
> 
> 
> 
> What I've noticed is that Denon is reducing the number of rear connections. Between the 1910, which I used to own, and the 1911, there is now only one component input, no component output, no EXT.IN multichannel analog input, no Sirius connection, no B speaker output (which cuts out a pair of amplifier channels), only one digital and one optical input. So weight reduction may be coming from ancillary functions.


Hello,
I really think that Denon is really resting on the perception of being a Premium Brand while not offering the Parts Quality and Features befitting a Premium Brand. I have owned many Denons over the years (AVR-2600, AVR-3600, AVR-4800) and thought greatly of them. The AVR-4800 even most controversially was on the Cover of Stereophile. Wow, did that cause a great deal of derision. Here's the thing, they used to offer heavy duty Amplifier Sections and cutting edge Features for competitive prices.

Now, their pricing has gotten way out of line for what they offer. The AVR-3600 and AVR-4800 were both THX Ultra Certified and cost around 2000 Dollars. They both weighed around 50 Pounds as well and only had 5 Channels of Amplification. Now for 2000 Dollars, you get the 34.8 Pound AVR-4310 that lacks THX Processing and Certification. I truly prefer Denon's GUI and Industrial Design, but the value quotient is far askew.

It is only at the Entry Level where competition is fierce would I advocate their wares. However, if planning on spending around 1000 Dollars on up, they really are lacking in Power and Features until you get to the 5500 Dollar AVR-5803.
Cheers,
JJ


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Can't go wrong with Emotiva, especially when on a budget. My XPA2 will be here tomorrow! I can't wait to get off work. I'm curious to see if i'll hear a differance in that and the XPA5.:bigsmile:


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
I really think you will notice the extra power in the XPA-2. By using the same size Toroidal Transformer as the 5 Channel XPA-5 and having more Capacitance per Channel, it really is a much more powerful Amplifier.

I look forward to reading your findings and hope you love it. The XPA-1 and XPA-2 are the Emotiva's that I care for the most. By far.
Cheers,
JJ


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Jungle Jack said:


> Hello,
> I really think you will notice the extra power in the XPA-2. By using the same size Toroidal Transformer as the 5 Channel XPA-5 and having more Capacitance per Channel, it really is a much more powerful Amplifier.
> 
> I look forward to reading your findings and hope you love it. The XPA-1 and XPA-2 are the Emotiva's that I care for the most. By far.
> ...


I'll post what i find in my Emotiva thread.:T
I know now looking back that i wish i would have gotten a couple of each (XPA1&2) for my system after my findings of the capacitance differance of those and the XPA5 but it is still a night and day differance then the inboard amplificaion i was using before.

Looking forward to posting!:sn:


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