# Need a good fullrange 5-6.5 inch 2 or 8 ohm speaker..Please Help!



## jjnyman (Jan 30, 2011)

Hey guys, I am newer to designing loudspeakers and have a certain Idea for a large 2 way speaker. I am looking at running 8 full range drivers for my mid & Highs, and 4 10" inch subs on the lower half of each speaker. This will all be one large speaker, and I will be building a like one for the right channel. My idea is to have a separate chamber for the 8 full range drivers and have the 4 10's on the bottom in a sealed enclosure all combined in one enclosure. I will be using two Behringer cx3400's and 2 undecided 2channel amps. The purpose of these speaker will be 50/50 but their build is more for Stereo listening. The speakers will be 2 way, i could go three way with those crossovers, but I am trying to avoid buying a 3rd amp for highs at this point.

Anyway 8 4ohm drivers for mids and highs wired however you decide ends up being 2ohms (most likely too low for most 2ch amps) or 8 ohms (not getting enough bang for my buck power-wise with most amps).

My idea was to use car speakers since most 5.25" are coaxials, taking care of my lack of funds and not wanting to purchase another amp to separate mids and highs. This presents the 2 or 8ohm issue for my load on the amp.

So, let me know if anyone knows any good, decently priced 5.25-6" fullrange drivers for this project or maybe if looking for a 2ohm stable 2 channel amp would be a better idea!

Thanks, I am going to post a sketch of what I was thinking for speaker design to see what you guys think of all this lol.


----------



## Zeitgeist (Apr 4, 2009)

I seem to recall a number of fairly priced full range speakers at Parts Express..

What price range are you thinking?

I'm curious how it would sound. Seems like it could potentially be less than ideal - since it looks like you're clustering drivers... rather than doing a line array - or something a little more....structured?

I won't try to talk you out of your idea - but you might get better results by using fewer - better quality drivers - rather than sacrificing quality for quantity.


----------



## ISLAND1000 (May 2, 2007)

Your idea is stunning but oh so highly technical. To make all those mid drivers work in unison and mate them as you've outlined to the amp is going to take some engineering.
Good luck. Post pictures.


----------



## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

That will certainly be a unique build.:T You should certainly check out PE as Jim suggested for your drivers they have some new full range drivers out (they are pricey) or they have a ton of other options out there. Looking forward to seeing this build progress, keep us posted and if you need any help thats what we're all here for.:T


----------



## jjnyman (Jan 30, 2011)

"I'm curious how it would sound. Seems like it could potentially be less than ideal - since it looks like you're clustering drivers... rather than doing a line array - or something a little more....structured?"


I was also thinking about separating the mid/hi side of the enclosure right down the middle. The airspace in each would be identical therefore hopefully eliminating some of the issues the unique array would present, almost like having two line arrays of speakers. I am not opposed to going a little more expensive on the drivers, but 8 of anything/speaker will get to be spendy. 

Has anyone heard of any reviews on Behringers new iNuke series amplifiers. They are class D which scares me for doing anything were Sound Quality is wanted. But, they are 2ohm stable which would be perfect for my setup. Otherwise, does anyone have any other recommendations for 2ohm stable amplifiers in the 200+watt rms range x2?

Thanks again guys, and yeah when I get started I will probably start using cheaper ply for prototype then make the real deals out out Baltic Birch..


----------



## jjnyman (Jan 30, 2011)

http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/NU1000.aspx


----------



## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

What kind of budget are you thinking for amplification? Pro-amps are used by alot of folks out there for full-range setups, there are a ton of options out there that will do 2ohms.
Also i'm curious as to what your budget is for drivers maybe we can be of some assista you with your driver choices.:T


----------



## jjnyman (Jan 30, 2011)

Well, I was looking to spend around $300-400/amp, so one for the upper mid/hi part of the speaker, & one for the lower sub part of the entire enclosure. As I stated in my first post I was thinking coaxials, to get full range sound without splitting up mids and highs to avoid buying that third amp. Driver wise I was looking to spend around $100-150/pr of coaxials. For this "ideal setup" thats 8 total PAIRS of drivers just for high end. I was looking to get at least 25 watts rms + per driver if that helps but maybe closer to 50 watts would be more ideal???

Also, I have one more question. If I am going 25+ watts x 8 in one speaker how much wattage would be a good match to power my 4 10" subs down below?

For 10" sub drivers I am looking into that last, as it should be the easier side of this equation...


----------



## fbov (Aug 28, 2008)

jjnyman said:


> Hey guys, I am newer to designing loudspeakers ... I will be using two Behringer cx3400's ...The speakers will be 2 way, i could go three way with those crossovers, but I am trying to avoid buying a 3rd amp for highs at this point....


You're new to speaker design, so you jump into array designs and active crossovers. Bad move; learn to swim first. 
- If you're truly interested in designing loudspeakers, you have a long, initially steep learning curve ahead of you before you'll create a quality design. 
- If you just want some good DIY speakers, find a "proven design" that's already been built by lots of folks.
- If you just want to make some noise, have at it. You will succeed, but at a price.

My question is what you are trying to achieve. Room size, target SPL, speaker placement, preferred program, etc. are all inputs, as well as your own inclinations and interests. There are a bunch of options, it's just a matter of finding what best suits you, and that's your call. 

HAve fun,
Frank


----------



## jjnyman (Jan 30, 2011)

I was looking at some of the proven designs on partsexpress and a few of them did catch my eye. I will be doing a 7.1 system off of a pioneer VSX-1014, older receiver but I like it for now until I upgrade to the VSX-1020 or 21 when it comes out. Really my goal is to have a decent home theater which will be listened to at not over the top levels with the Fiance, and a killer ability for music and LOUD music at that for parties and such. Hence the two giant fronts I am determined to build with active crossovers and amps. 

I am "truly interested in learning to build loudspeakers" since I am looking for a new hobby to fill my time rather than negative things I was doing before. I did a lot of sub enclosure and system design in cars around 5 years ago, but it's been a while.

Regardless, I would like to do the amp and crossovers no matter what I do because it takes care of future upgrades and makes for easier tweaks.

I also need to make a sub for this system. I have a JLw7 12" that I was going to put in a 7Cu enclosure tuned to 18HZ, but I was thinking possibly looking to get an 18" tuned nice and low for the home theater of side of things and maybe keeping the JL for the music side of things. Can you mix and match subs like this in HT, I know it is really hard to do in Car Audio and is not generally recommended.

Yes lots of things to learn for me, but I am a very curious one ha!


----------



## fbov (Aug 28, 2008)

The idea behind the proven designs is that someone who knows what they're doing:
- measured driver frequency response and impendence of drivers in controlled conditions
- modeled the effect of a free-standing/pedestal enclosure
- combined enclosure effects with driver response to create crossover inputs
- designed a crossover that uses the combined FR and impendence to combine the driver outputs for flat FR, minimal phase shifts and not-too-low minimum impedence. 
... and a bunch of people have built it, and been happy they did. It's low risk and minimum cost. 

Somehow, this is one that comes to mind given your initial design and party intentions. I will admit it's high on the DIY scale, but I suspect you may enjoy this group development project. 
"eWave is a pre-engineered high-frequency "module" for building 2-ways comprising an inexpensive compression driver, modern constant-directivity waveguide, and a crossover incorporating the requisite compensation. Mate it with any woofer and cabinet of your choice which will play competently through its 1.6 kHz crossover region. The builder is responsible for optimizing the lowpass filter for the specific combination they use; a generic one is suggested as a starting point, and many have found that to be adequate for constructing a successful project...."
http://audiokarma.org/forums/showpost.php?p=1856214&postcount=228

You can do the same XO work actively, but then you're also going to need a measurement system, or a very good ear, to help you set both the XO points as well as the filters and contours required to flatten and extend response. In a 7.1 system, you'll also need 14-21 amps. Granted, the smaller drivers don't need the wattage of the mid/woofs, but it's still a lot of complexity that's only really necessary when conditions are constantly changing, like pros moving to new venues every night. As always, YMMV. 

As for subs, 4 of the same in the corners, or 2/4 in the middle of front/back or left/right walls are the two easy optima that came out of the Harman sub optimization work (Google Harman Welti for details). There are complex sub optimization programs that might need 5-10dB less output at one or another location, but the easy solution is 1-3 more of the 12's. Infinite baffles have their fans, too. I like sealed with some EQ, and a lot of room gain; deep extension with a bit more control. 

Have fun,
Frank


----------

