# Emotiva XDA-1 DAC



## Mike_WI

*Updated:* 12-13-10

*PRODUCT PAGE SPECS:*
Link

*Signal-to-Noise Ratio: * > 105dB (A-Weighted)
*Frequency Response:* 5Hz - 48kHz
*THD+N: *0.001%
*Ground Floor Noise Level: * < 15uV
*Nominal Output Voltage: * 1V RMS
*Peak Output Voltage: * > 12VRMS (balanced)
*Sample Rate: *All standard resolutions are supported up to 192kHz
*Bit Depth:* Standard bit depths up to 24Bit are supported at clock frequencies up to 192kHz
*Inputs: *2 Optical TOSLINK, 2 COAX Digital, 1 AES/EBU, 1 USB
*Outputs: *2 RCA (Unbalanced), 2 XLR (Balanced)
*Internal Volume Control:* Digitally controlled in increments of 0.5db
*Remote Control: *Milled Aluminum Full Function Remote Control
*I/V conversion: *Burr Brown OPA-2134
*D/A conversion: *high performance, multibit Sigma-Delta Burr Brown AD1955 
Data Directed Scrambling with high jitter immunity, and an 8x Oversampling Digital Filter
Fully Discrete Differential Reference™ Output Stage with fully independent balanced and unbalanced drive stages

------------------------------------

*Latest pics and specs on XDA-1*
*6-10-10 update (Emotiva VIP Lounge):* Link

"Some quick specs for you all.

*Frequency response:* 5-50Khz
*S/N:* in excess of 110db
*THD+N:* 0.02%
*Ground floor noise:* 10uV
*Output voltage:* 1V nominal, 12V peak"

...

"We hope to have them in your hands in about 45 days."

...

*Q (TonyMc):* "So would putting the XDA-1 between transport and USP-1 negate the sonic improvements of the XDA-1?"
*A (Lonnie):* "It won't negate the improved sound, but as good as the line stage is in the USP, the XDA by itself is way better."

--------------------------
*UPDATE*
5-18-10
New pic available (see below).
New specs coming in days

----------------------------------------------------------------
4/2/10 Post - LINK -
"They announced in today's webcast 

http://emotiva.com/webcast040210/webcast.shtm 

(section 2 of the webcast) 
that the new physical design on the DAC means it won't be released for another 90 days or so. 
So at this point, the DAC should be available sometime this July."[/B][/COLOR]


*Emotiva XDA-1 digital-analog converter (DAC)*
*Cost:* $299.00

*Specifications:*
(pending)
From Emonatics - http://emonatics.com/XDA-1.shtml
(unconfirmed)...
Inputs (both)
1) AES/EBU
2) Coax Digital
2) Optical Digital
1) USB (Should be PC & Mac Compatible)
-- Post: 10-13-10 @ Emotiva Forum (link):


> I spoke to Lonnie about this when I was at Emofest. Lonnie sent me to Eric in engineering. Eric told me the USB only supported max. 16/48.


Post: 11-11-10 @ Emotiva Forum (roadrunner) - link


> I just got off the phone from speaking with Eric about the XDA-1's USB ports. There has been confusion as to just what the specs for the USB is really capable of handling. Well, now we have the official confirmation from Eric that the XDA-1 DOES handle 24 bit/192 KHz via its USB inputs. Of course it also handles 16/44.1, 16/48, 24/96, etc, etc. It will output whatever you send it without down converting the signal.


Outputs
1) L/R Unbalanced RCAs
1) L/R Balanced XLRs (all outputs are hgh voltage)

Triggers (automatic on/off for amplifiers and XDA-1 itself)
1) 12v output trigger
1) 12v input trigger

Analog Devices AD1955 DAC, with 384k oversampling, and 1V rms (7V peak for extended dynamics), 24-bit, 192 kHz Sample Rate PCM Audio Data, 120 dB SNR/DNR (not muted) at 48KHz Sample Rate (A-Weighted Stereo), -110 dB THD+N (0.0003162%)
Burr Brown buffers coming out of the DAC
6 fully discrete output stages
Selectable inputs
Segmented power supply

*XDA-1 Manual*

*Features:*
- headphone jack
- volume control: digital & global (for all inputs) 
--- therefore, turn volume to MAX for use with pre-amp ????
Post at Emotiva Forum (srb):


> As has been previously mentioned (and both verified by Emotiva and Analog Devices), the on-chip volume control implementation is an analog resistor ladder, albeit digitally controlled, and doesn't use up bits to attenuate.


12-5-10 robdog post
(bold added)


> I called Emotiva on Friday and asked Vincent that same question.
> He said that I should run the XDA at full volume, leaving it at 80, and use the USP-1 to make volume adjustments while listening.
> When I mentioned the high gain on the USP-1 he said that the XDA could be set lower if needed, as it was a *"lossless" volume control and would not cause any loss of resolution, detail, etc.*
> So, I have been using the XDA set at about 60 - 70 and I use the USP-1 for volume adjustment.
> I do occasionally grab the XDA remote for fine volume adjusments when needed - since one push of the button on the USP-1 remote turns it up or down so much.
> Seems to be working well for me that way.
> Anyway, based on my conversation with Vincent, I would suggest starting at 80 on the XDA-1 and working down until you find a setting that works best with the USP-1.


- 6 discrete output stages
- selectable inputs
- segmented power supply

*Other info:*
- 1 RU high
- old name was XDC-1
- Lonnie (@ Emotiva forum): 
"Even though the ERC and XDA share the same DAC, the reason the XDA sounds so much better is because of the discrete output stage. 
In the ERC the design is a straight forward single dif, going to a single stage VAS and output stage. 
The XDA on the other hand uses a Dual dif input stage with crosslinked current sources, Darlington VAS stage and Darlington output stages, so the speed and current it can deliver is like night and day different from the ERC. 
So as good as the ERC sounded (and to be honest I thought it was amazing), the XDA is in a league all its own."

*Future:*
- "At this time I am just working on this one. The baby version is down the road. "

*Links*
Emonatics link
XDA-1 bypass mode??? (Emotiva thread by Kiwi) Link - http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=preamps&thread=11034&page=1

*--[ORIGINAL POST]--*
FYI...
Emotiva XDA-1 DAC update from Admin at Emotiva forum:

*Link* 

---------------------
Actual pics, specs and pricing coming very soon. just waiting on the cosmetic prototype to arrive. 
I have an engineering mule, but it is far from pretty. So if all goes well, maybe in another week I can have them for you. 

BTW, I don't know if I actually posted what it really looks like or not so here it is.

---------------------
Specs are pending but previous comments...

- estimated cost - $300
- 1 RU high
- old name was XDC-1



Mike


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## Mike_WI

*Emotiva DAC "mule" pics*

Emotiva DAC "mule" pics:
*Link*

Features:
- 6 discrete output stages
- selectable inputs
- volume
- segmented power supply


----------



## rygher3

I've been watching the thread over there for a while and am looking forward to hearing how well it performs. I've just always used my receiver for DAC but am interested in a standalone DAC. I wonder what I've been missing


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## Mike_WI

rygher3 said:


> I've been watching the thread over there for a while and am looking forward to hearing how well it performs. I've just always used my receiver for DAC but am interested in a standalone DAC. I wonder what I've been missing


I am no DAC expert, but I think the answer is "it depends".
The HRT MS DAC I added to my laptop made a difference.
I think the major variables are how good your source(s) are, the current DAC, and the rest of your audio chain and speakers.

Full specs & product sound like they should be available soon.

Mike


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## Mike_WI

*XDA-1 DAC update - close but delayed*

From Lonnie (admin) at Emotiva forum today:
*Link* 

"Well I have been a little remiss about getting you up to speed on the XDA and I am sorry.

We got in the final cosmetic sample and have been testing and listening to it extensively. First off let me say that the sound quality is unlike anything else we have done before. It is really something special. The discrete output stages in the XDA are in a league of their own. The discrete output stage we did for the ERC and USP as good as they are can’t hang with this thing. The depth and detail in the music is so deep and accurate it is difficult to describe, so I have no doubt you will love it once we release it.

Now the bad news. We placed the XDA on top of the ERC (we were using it for a transport) and while we were listening to it, we just couldn’t get past the fact that the cosmetics didn’t match and it just didn’t look right. So we have redesigned the front panel to give it a more family look. Unfortunately this will delay the release a little longer, but all the electronics are solid and fully check out. So hopefully this won’t delay things too much longer because I know many of you have been waiting for a while.

I am sorry about the delay but we want you to enjoy the whole experience of the unit and have it match up with all the other gear, so hang in there it is coming."


Mike


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## Mike_WI

*Renderings - XDC-1 (old), XDA-1*

Emotiva DAC render image concepts...

So, we had:
1. XDC-1 renders (full size and smaller)
2. XDA-1 concept render 
3. XDA-1 render (new today)


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## Mike_WI

Other info:
- headphone jack
- volume control: digital & global (for all inputs) 
--- therefore, turn volume to MAX for use with pre-amp

Future:
- "At this time I am just working on this one. The baby version is down the road. "

Mike


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## rygher3

I personally think the new design is much better than the previous ones. It's great to have an update on them!


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## Mike_WI

rygher3 said:


> I personally think the new design is much better than the previous ones. It's great to have an update on them!


Yeah, it looks cool.
Good to have another DAC option (although there are a lot) at a low price point.

Now just need some product, reviews, posts...

Mike


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## Mike_WI

*Update on Emotiva DAC pricing...$299*

Update on Emotiva DAC pricing...

*Link*
"As it is right now, we are looking to release it at 299.00"


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## Cujobob

There are some truly nice offerings around $500, this is an interesting pricepoint...


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## Mike_WI

*HRT Music Streamer II's New 24/96 Hi Res asynchronous USB DAC's*

Off topic (of Emotiva at least)...

*HRT Music Streamer II's New 24/96 Hi Res asynchronous USB DAC's*

*Link* 


*Specifications: Music Streamer II*
Electrical: Full Scale output 2.25 volts RMS
Frequency Response (20 Hz / 20 kHz) 0 dB / -.5 dB
Noise Floor (DC to 30 kHz) 26 uV RMS
S/N Ratio (DC to 30 kHz) 98 dB
THD+N (1 kHz FS) 0.010%
USB to Audio output isolation > 20M Ohm
Interface Data Rate: up to 96 kS/s
Bit Depth: up to 24 bit
Transfer Protocol: asynchronous
USB type 1.1 or Above
Power Requirements (USB buss) 200 mA
Dimensions (L x W x H) 4.1" x 2.1" x 1.2"
*Price $149.95*

New for 2010!! Improved version of the original HRT Music Streamer II, now featuring full 24/96 Hi-Res capability and asynchronous data transfer protocol. Fully compatible with USB 1.1 and above for full bandwidth performance! The Music Streamer II+ is a high performance music interface that allows a computer and a home entertainment system to become perfect partners. With its unique topology, the Music Streamer provides a completely isolated path between the computer and audio system. No more audio contamination by the computer; your music will always sound its best. There are no external power supplies to worry about because the Music Streamer derives its power from the USB buss while completely regenerating power for all its internal circuitry using a sophisticated set of proprietary circuits.

Operation is simple: just plug the Music Streamer into any USB port on your computer and the Music Streamer will install itself and be ready for use in a matter of moments. Connect the other end of the Music Streamer into any analog input and you are ready to stream high quality computer based music. Minimum System requirements Windows XP service Pack 3, MAC OsX 10.3 or newer. Not all MAC Mini's have enough output voltage to power the Streamer in some cases you'll need a powered USB Hub.

The Music Streamer provides full support for applications such as iTunes™, Windows Media Player™ Rhapsody, Napster or anything else! Direct to your home entertainment system, with a level of quality never before possible. You can also use the Music Streamer to listen to internet radio or other music subscription services such as Rhapsody™ or Napster™ in high quality through your Home Entertainment System, Television or Stereo system. High Resolution Technologies Music Streamer, the product for tomorrow, is available today.


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## Mike_WI

*Updates - DAC info / delay until July 2010?*

*DAC updates...*

*4/2/10 Post -* *LINK* -
"They announced in today's webcast 

http://emotiva.com/webcast040210/webcast.shtm 

(section 2 of the webcast) 
that the new physical design on the DAC means it won't be released for another 90 days or so. 
So at this point, the DAC should be available sometime this July."


*- Lonnie (@ Emotiva forum - 4/3/10) - **LINK* -
"Even though the ERC and XDA share the same DAC, the reason the XDA sounds so much better is because of the discrete output stage. 
In the ERC the design is a straight forward single dif, going to a single stage VAS and output stage. 
The XDA on the other hand uses a Dual dif input stage with crosslinked current sources, Darlington VAS stage and Darlington output stages, so the speed and current it can deliver is like night and day different from the ERC. 
So as good as the ERC sounded (and to be honest I thought it was amazing), the XDA is in a league all its own."


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## imported_edward

i will admit i am not up to speed on the DAC players
So what are the main things/specs/etc to look for 
is it the greater the value of the specs the better or is it the lower the better. :crazy::crazy::crazy:
What are Quality components and which are the ones to steer clear of??
anyone care to educate??
:huge:


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## tdog

edward said:


> i will admit i am not up to speed on the DAC players
> So what are the main things/specs/etc to look for
> is it the greater the value of the specs the better or is it the lower the better. :crazy::crazy::crazy:
> What are Quality components and which are the ones to steer clear of??
> anyone care to educate??
> :huge:


Me to, I'm not sure what an external DAC is for other than higher quality sound.


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## dvenardos

That is exactly what it is for. :yes:


tdog said:


> Me to, I'm not sure what an external DAC is for other than higher quality sound.


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## tdog

dvenardos said:


> That is exactly what it is for. :yes:


Thanks


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## Mike_WI

*XDA-1 DAC "final sample"*

From Emotiva thread post:
Link 

"From the podcast: "The final sample, with the revised cosmetics of the XDA, is shipping tonight. Yeah!"

Which I assume means it's shipping from China to Emotiva. So, it's getting closer, but not that close."


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## Mike_WI

Pic update:
*Link *


----------



## Mike_WI

*DAC specs (from Emonatics - unconfirmed)*

*Specifications:*
(pending)
From *Emonatics* - http://emonatics.com/XDA-1.shtml
(unconfirmed)...

*Inputs (both)*
1) AES/EBU
2) Coax Digital
2) Optical Digital
1) USB (Should be PC & Mac Compatible)

*Outputs*
1) L/R Unbalanced RCAs
1) L/R Balanced XLRs (all outputs are hgh voltage)

*Triggers* (automatic on/off for amplifiers and XDA-1 itself)
1) 12v output trigger
1) 12v input trigger

*Analog Devices AD1955 DAC*, with 384k oversampling, and 1V rms (7V peak for extended dynamics), 24-bit, 192 kHz Sample Rate PCM Audio Data, 120 dB SNR/DNR (not muted) at 48KHz Sample Rate (A-Weighted Stereo), -110 dB THD+N (0.0003162%)
Burr Brown buffers coming out of the DAC
6 fully discrete output stages
Selectable inputs
Segmented power supply


----------



## Mike_WI

*More info - output stages, 60-75d, vs. UMC, ERC DACs*

More info from Lonnie at Emotiva 
*Link*

"The output stages in the XDA are in a league way beyond anything an opamp can do. They are fully discrete, think miniature version of an X series amp stage. 
Dual differential input with cross linked current sources, Darlington VAS stage and Darlington output stage. Can we say Bad @$$ "

...

"I still have some testing to do and we need to get schedule production, but a ball park figure woudl be 60-75 days."

...

"The easiest way to discribe this is to start with the UMC and work our way up to the XDA.

The UMC uses a similiar design principle that is used in Pro recording gear. The DAC is run wide open to get the best performace out of it. From the DAC it goes to some very high quality OPAMPs which are used as a gain stage. From there it goes to a digitally controlled, but still analog volume control. From the volume control it goes to another set of opamps which are used as buffers and then to the outputs.

In the ERC the DAC is run wide open as well. The signal then goes to Burr Browns which are set up at buffers. From the buffers it goes to the discrete output stage. The discrete output stage is a beautifully simple design that uses a single dif input to a traditional VAS and output stage. Basically in terms of sound quality and performace it is a whole order of magnitude beyond that of an opamp.

The XDA is our most advanced design to date. Although it uses the same DAC as in the ERC practically everthing else is all new. From the DAC the signal goes to set of Burr Browns which are used as buffers. From there is goes to the discrete output stages but these are completely different from the ERC. These are like a miniature version of an X series amplifier. They use dual differential inputs stages with cross-linked current sources which then goes to a Darlington VAS stage and then to a Darlinton output stage. So in terms of performace and sound quality, this is a whole order magnitude greater than the ERC.

Hope this helps. 

P.S. it is just my opinion, but if you really want to get the most out of the XDA. Connect it straight to the amp and forget about using a pre-amp. Just playing with it here, we originally had it run into the USP. We could hear a difference and it sounded better than the ERC itself, but it really wasn't a night and day difference. So we decided to connect it directly to the amps and see what that sounded like. Well that was when we realized just how good it really is and it was the night and day difference we were expecting."


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## Mike_WI

*XDA-1 bypass mode???*

RE:
(bold/red added)

From Lonnie at Emotiva... 
Link

"P.S. it is just my opinion, but if you really want to get the most out of the XDA. 
*Connect it straight to the amp and forget about using a pre-amp. *
Just playing with it here, we originally had it run into the USP. We could hear a difference and it sounded better than the ERC itself, but it really wasn't a night and day difference. So we decided to connect it directly to the amps and see what that sounded like. Well that was when we realized just how good it really is and it was the night and day difference we were expecting."

New Emotiva thread:
*XDA-1 bypass mode???*


I'm trying to figure out how this DAC would (or would not) integrate into my current office system.


----------



## Mike_WI

*Latest pics and specs on XDA-1*

*Latest pics and specs on XDA-1*
6-10-10 update (Emotiva VIP Lounge): *Link*

"Some quick specs for you all.

*Frequency response: *5-50Khz
*S/N:* in excess of 110db
*THD+N:* 0.02%
*Ground floor noise:* 10uV
*Output voltage:* 1V nominal, 12V peak"

...

"We hope to have them in your hands in about 45 days."

...

*Q (TonyMc):* "So would putting the XDA-1 between transport and USP-1 negate the sonic improvements of the XDA-1?"
*A (Lonnie):* "It won't negate the improved sound, but as good as the line stage is in the USP, the XDA by itself is way better."


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## Steve_Vai_rules

wow!

maybe i will get an xda for my 2channel setup. i do have lots of digital format audio, and i could get a good transport for my cd's but not worry about the DA performance.... *hmmm*


Matt


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## Mike_WI

*XDA-1 October availability*

Newest Emotiva webcast:
http://emotiva.com/podcast73010/webcast.shtm

XDA-1 production "end of September" and available in October.
"Reserve list" soon (next week? unclear)

Mike


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## Mike_WI

New thread, info, and pics:
http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=preampdac&action=display&thread=12973

Still no pre-order list.

Mike

*Added:*
New *Pre-amp/DAC *section @ Emotiva forum: http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=preampdac


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## Mike_WI

Pre orders starting for estimated Dec 1 shipping.

http://emotiva.com/xda1.shtm

Mike

*SPECS:*
*Signal-to-Noise Ratio:* > 105dB (A-Weighted)
*Frequency Response: *5Hz - 48kHz
*THD+N:* 0.001%
*Ground Floor Noise Level:* < 15uV
*Nominal Output Voltage:* 1V RMS
*Peak Output Voltage: * > 12VRMS (balanced)
*Sample Rate: *All standard resolutions are supported up to 192kHz
*Bit Depth: *Standard bit dephts up to 24Bit are supported at clock frequencies up to 192kHz
*Inputs:* 2 Optical TOSLINK, 2 COAX Digital, 1 AES/EBU, 1 USB
*Outputs:* 2 RCA (Unbalanced), 2 XLR (Balanced)
*Internal Volume Control: *Digitally controlled in increments of 0.5db
*Remote Control: *Milled Aluminum Full Function Remote Control
*I/V conversion: *Burr Brown OPA-2134
*D/A conversion:* high performance, multibit Sigma-Delta Burr Brown AD1955 
Data Directed Scrambling with high jitter immunity, and an 8x Oversampling Digital Filter
Fully Discrete Differential Reference™ Output Stage with fully independent balanced and unbalanced drive stages


----------



## Mike_WI

*USB only supported max. 16/48 (EDIT: or 24/192 via USB)?*

Regarding USB (which I would use from my laptop -- no audio card):

USB (Should be PC & Mac Compatible)
-- Post: 10-13-10 @ Emotiva Forum (link):



> I spoke to Lonnie about this when I was at Emofest.
> Lonnie sent me to Eric in engineering.
> Eric told me the USB only supported max. 16/48.


So, I wonder if the Emotiva DAC would be of any benefit for me in my situation...

*PROPOSED:*
laptop USB -> *Emotiva DAC* -> Emotiva USP-1 pre-amp -> Emotiva UPA-2 & Emotiva sub -> TCA/CHT WAF-1 Ninja mod

*Current:*
laptop USB -> *HRT MS DAC* -> Emotiva USP-1 pre-amp -> Emotiva UPA-2 & Emotiva sub -> TCA/CHT WAF-1 Ninja mod


Mike


*EDIT:*
Links:

*XDA-1 vs HRT Music streamer USB DACS*
http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=preampdac&action=display&thread=13151

Lonnie info 10-13-10: link


> Just for clarification here the XDA will accept 24/192 via USB with no issues provided your computer will send that out.
> Eric had to download some third party software to get his computer to port out 24/192 but once he did the XDA picked right up on it and ran with no issues.


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## Mike_WI

...also for laptop streaming music: 
Pandora One v2.0 outputs at *192kbps**, so how would that work via USB to XDA-1?

eg, would it work natively or need another app?

Thanks,

Mike

* - per this FAQ
http://blog.pandora.com/faq/contents/64.html


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## etcarroll

I'd like to use this for my SB Duet, I just hope that OPA-2134 is socketed for some more op-amp rolling fun. One could even try one of those "discrete" op-amps from Audio-GD or Burson if desired.


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## Mike_WI

etcarroll said:


> I'd like to use this for my SB Duet, I just hope that OPA-2134 is socketed for some more op-amp rolling fun. One could even try one of those "discrete" op-amps from Audio-GD or Burson if desired.


I don't know if you can tell, but there are some internal pics here:
http://emonatics.com/XDA-1.shtml


Mike


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## Mike_WI

Anyone here (CHT) pre-order the Emotiva XDA-1 DAC?

Mike


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## imported_alhull

*on the pre-order list*

I'm on the pre-order list. I currently have Perpetual Tech P1A and P3A combo going into my UMC-1 which feeds into my MPS-1 amp.

I'm getting the XDA-1 just to see if it's DAC does a better job than the P-tech boxes. I don't currently have any digital high-def audio sources to hook up - just traditional CDs, DVD-A and SACD's using my Denon universal player as transport.

At this point I have no idea if trying out the XDA-1 is a waste of my time or the greatest thing since sliced bread.


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## Mike_WI

It looks like the pre-orders are shipping:
http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=preampdac&action=display&thread=14595&page=1

Mike


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## Mike_WI

Well...
Link

Shipping after Turkey Day at least...

Mike


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## Mike_WI

*USB via XDA-1 DAC*

USB via XDA-1 DAC compatibility...

-- Post: 10-13-10 @ Emotiva Forum (link):


> I spoke to Lonnie about this when I was at Emofest. Lonnie sent me to Eric in engineering. Eric told me the USB only supported max. 16/48.


Post: 11-11-10 @ Emotiva Forum (roadrunner) - link


> I just got off the phone from speaking with Eric about the XDA-1's USB ports.
> There has been confusion as to just what the specs for the USB is really capable of handling.
> Well, now we have the official confirmation from Eric that the XDA-1 *DOES handle 24 bit/192 KHz via its USB inputs. *
> Of course it also handles 16/44.1, 16/48, 24/96, etc, etc. It will output whatever you send it without down converting the signal.



Mike


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## Mike_WI

*Shipping 11/30/10. Next shipment 2 wks.*

From an Emotiva email:
(bold added by me)



> Greetings Lounge Lizards!
> 
> I just wanted to give you a few quick updates on some of our products:
> 
> - You guys bought all of our UMC-1s!!! Not to worry, though - Big Dan is FLYING in some more and we expect them to be here and shipping out by 12/08/10 - if you've been considering and would like to get one with the holiday deal ($100 in Emobucks and FREE shipping) then you better reserve one (or two or three) soon.
> 
> - Black Trim for your Emo gear is officially back and available in the online store.
> 
> - We are expecting the Ultra Sub 10 and Ultra Sub 12 with satin lacquer finish to be here and available for purchase within the next couple of days. You will be able to choose which finish (black ash or satin lacquer) you would like in the store upon checkout.
> 
> - As most of you already know we did *start shipping out the first of the XDA-1s today. *
> *We are completely sold out on the first shipment - the ETA of the second shipment is about 2 weeks.*
> 
> Thank you so much for all your support!
> 
> - Your friends at Emotiva -


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## HuskerOmaha

Are DACs mainly utilized the best for CD playback only? If you upload all of your CDs onto a hard drive, I'm assuming computers may be even worse for playback?

So, how will I know I need/WANT a DAC?

My Slim-5 Rack is starting to look really small......


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## Mike_WI

HuskerOmaha said:


> Are DACs mainly utilized the best for CD playback only? If you upload all of your CDs onto a hard drive, I'm assuming computers may be even worse for playback?
> 
> So, how will I know I need/WANT a DAC?
> 
> My Slim-5 Rack is starting to look really small......


I'm not a DAC expert, but a CD vs a lossless copy on a hard drive should be similar digital copies.

A bad DAC (I would say "cheap", but even good DACs are relatively cheap -- eg $5 range, it is more the implementation of the DAC) doesn't convert that digital signal into an analog signal as well as a good DAC.

A good CD player or receiver may already have good DACs.
Computer "audiophile" sound cards may also have good DACs, but the integrated sound capability in most computers is likely not good.

Mike


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## HuskerOmaha

Mike,

These are not implemented in HT, right?

This is just for stereo playback I'm assuming...

Emotiva really seems like a best buy for many things.....


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## Mike_WI

*Dac*



HuskerOmaha said:


> Mike,
> 
> These are not implemented in HT, right?
> 
> This is just for stereo playback I'm assuming...
> 
> Emotiva really seems like a best buy for many things.....


There are DACS in any digtial to analog conversion -- eg SACD/DVD-A 5.1 or 7.1 sound, but most of the time stand alone DACs are 2 channel.

If someone is more knowledgeable about this, feel free to chime in.

Emotiva seems to have great amps, but their electronics have had issues in current and previous generations.

I haven't hear a lot about their speakers.

Mike


----------



## Mike_WI

*Gain / volume control (analog or digitial)*

There are a lot of posts on the XDA-1 gain and volume control.

There are so many fragmented posts on the Emotiva Forum that I have trouble following it.

I initially thought this 

volume control: digital & global (for all inputs) 
--- therefore, turn volume to MAX for use with pre-amp

Howevever, there was this recent post...
Post at Emotiva Forum (srb):


> As has been previously mentioned (and both verified by Emotiva and Analog Devices), the on-chip volume control implementation is an analog resistor ladder, albeit digitally controlled, and doesn't use up bits to attenuate.



Can any DAC gurus that have been following this help explain the situation?

Thanks,

Mike


**EDIT**
12-5-10 robdog post
(bold added)


> I called Emotiva on Friday and asked Vincent that same question.
> He said that I should run the XDA at full volume, leaving it at 80, and use the USP-1 to make volume adjustments while listening.
> When I mentioned the high gain on the USP-1 he said that the XDA could be set lower if needed, as it was a *"lossless" volume control and would not cause any loss of resolution, detail, etc.*
> So, I have been using the XDA set at about 60 - 70 and I use the USP-1 for volume adjustment.
> I do occasionally grab the XDA remote for fine volume adjusments when needed - since one push of the button on the USP-1 remote turns it up or down so much.
> Seems to be working well for me that way.
> Anyway, based on my conversation with Vincent, I would suggest starting at 80 on the XDA-1 and working down until you find a setting that works best with the USP-1.


**EDIT**
Emotiva Forum Poll Link - 12-9-10

Poll
So far...


> *Is the XDA-1 Volume Control an issue for you?*


30% -- No, I'm running into a Pre/Pro
16% -- No, I'm running direct to power amp
*54% -- Yes*, I'm running direct to power amp


----------



## Mike_WI

*"SQ is definitely better"*

Another good post pulled from the Emotiva forum...
12-4-10 sharkman post:
(bold added)



> *I was also concerned about the gain level of the XDA, and just received it today. *
> With uncertain expectations, I connected my ERC via coax, then RCA's to my XPA-3. After testing it with a dozen cds of different recording levels/quality, including HDCD and XRCD,* i can say I'm not concerned about the gain levels.* With typical cds I have usable volume up to 22 or so on the XDA, which is 44 volume options.
> At this level I'm measuring 90-92DB peaks, so some could happily go higher.
> 
> On HDCD cds, it's around 16 or so on the volume level.
> But I haven't tried USB inputs.
> *It seems like the gain of signals going into the XDA might vary greatly, thus making it more difficult to have a volume range that would be a perfect match for each. *
> 
> *At any rate the SQ is definitely better than with the ERC alone.
> Right across the frequency spectrum, everything is cleaner, more transparent and a little more defined.* You can color me happy!


12-5-10 honk:


> Sorry to say it again, the gain of the XDA1 is simply a joke! I don't care if it's linear instead log., or if it's better working with AVs in between, or with some additional resistors to the XLR inputs.
> 
> NO! The XDA-1 should work excellent and practically with the XPA-1, if it doesn't, the target CLEARLY failed.


12-5-10 dickk post:


> Level 4.0 played CD's at moderately high (85-90 db range) volumes.
> 
> Possible solutions:
> Pad down the inputs (with a resistor voltage divider).
> Change the digital output.
> Change the volume pot to a logarithmic taper.
> 
> Perhaps the gang at Emotiva could suggest a fix.


Mike


----------



## Mike_WI

*DAC Shootout*

*DAC Shootout*
Link
by jlafrenz



> I recently received the new XDA-1 and thought it would be fun to see how it compared against my other DAC's so I did some comparison listening today and thought I would share my thoughts.
> 
> The 4 DAC's I compared were:
> 
> *NuForce uDAC (original) $99
> Jolida Glass FX $120
> Music Hall 25.2 DAC $600
> Emotiva XDA-1 $300*
> 
> **Please note that this was not a blind test as I did not have a helping hand and my review is purely subjective based upon my tastes and system.
> I did try to be as honest as possible and avoid any bias toward one unit.
> To make it as fair as possible, I used USB connection on all the units because it is the only connection that all of them had in common.
> As well, they were all connected with the same RCA cables to my passive preamp.
> I also played pink noise and measured it with an SPL meter to try and make sure they were all playing at the same volume. **





> At first this unit did not knock my socks off. Let me explain that before everyone ends up on my doorstep with pitchforks.
> I think there was quite a bit of hype around the unit and there were lots of positive reviews. I am only assuming that for many, this might have been their first DAC.
> The initial step into the world of DAC's does have a nice wow factor, but I have already had that moment and it seemed more like a lateral move to me.
> Off the bat with some casual listening it was a bit mushy in the bass and lacking some mids.


See Emotiva Forum for full review and comments...

Mike


----------



## Mike_WI

*Emotiva Forum Poll Link - 12-9-10*

Emotiva Forum Poll Link - 12-9-10

Poll
So far...


> *Is the XDA-1 Volume Control an issue for you?*


30% -- No, I'm running into a Pre/Pro
16% -- No, I'm running direct to power amp
*54% -- Yes*, I'm running direct to power amp


Mike


----------



## dvenardos

Unfortunately that just reinforces my bias that emotiva is a good dollar value, but not anywhere near the last word in quality...



Mike_TX said:


> *DAC Shootout*
> Link
> by jlafrenz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See Emotiva Forum for full review and comments...
> 
> Mike


----------



## Mike_WI

*Singapore XDA-1 / USP-1 testing gig*

*Singapore XDA-1 / USP-1 testing gig*
Emotiva Forum 12-8-10 - luoco73 Link


> Four gentlemen got together today for a very long lunch at Singapore's biggest Emotiva fan's place (wizardofoz) to check out the XDA-1 with a combination of amps, transports, pre-amps and speakers.
> I'm going to summarize the tests we performed and our findings, of which we all concurred.
> 
> Standard disclaimer about these opinions being subjective from four gentlemen using the equipment at hand. Your mileage may vary!


<See Link for great pics>

(bold added)


> The first test we did was to compare the following two paths:
> ERC-1 -> Coaxial -> XDA-1 -> Balanced Connection -> UPA-1
> ERC-1 -> Optical -> XDA-1 -> Balanced Connection -> UPA-1
> 
> *We all found that the coaxial connection offered a fuller and warmer sound, that we preferred over the optical connection.*
> 
> The next comparison was of the following four paths:
> ERC-1 -> Coaxial -> XDA-1 -> Balanced Connection -> UPA-1
> ERC-1 -> Coaxial -> XDA-1 -> RCA Connection -> UPA-1
> ERC-1 -> Coaxial -> XDA-1 -> RCA Connection -> USP-1 -> UPA-1
> ERC-1 -> RCA Connection -> USP-1 -> UPA-1
> 
> *None of us could discern a difference between these paths. *
> This is with one of us switching the two switches on the back of the UPA-1s simultaneously, so there was an immediate change.
> 
> The next comparison was with the older Oppo DV-983's analogue output from an SACD:
> Oppo -> RCA Connection -> USP-1 -> UPA-1
> ERC-1 -> RCA Connection -> USP-1 -> UPA-1
> 
> We found the analogue output of the Oppo to be quite harsh compared to the ERC-1, with the highs being too forward and intense.
> The bass with the ERC-1 was much better and the overall sound was warmer and more relaxing to listen to.
> 
> Next was my personal test to see if the new XDA-1 could compete with my now quite old (5 years) Benchmark DAC-1.
> ERC-1 -> Coaxial -> XDA-1 -> Balanced Connection -> UPA-1
> ERC-1 -> Optical -> XDA-1 -> RCA Connection -> UPA-1
> ERC-1 -> Coaxial -> Benchmark -> Balanced Connection -> UPA-1
> ERC-1 -> Optical -> Benchmark -> RCA Connection -> UPA-1
> 
> *This was quite an amazing result for the new XDA-1 where there was no detectable difference between any of the above combinations.*
> I have to add a caveat that we used the variable output of the Benchmark, which I consider to be inferior to the constant output.
> We will be testing the XDA-1 at my place to compare with the Benchmark's more favourable setup soon.
> 
> We also tested the performance of the UPA-1s vs a UPA-2 and we all agreed that using the UPA-1s resulted in more detail, clarity and headroom.
> 
> As for the speakers at hand we had Klipsch KG4.5, Plutos (made by wizardofoz), Emotiva ERM-1s and some Bose cubes (for the fun of it). For some more fun there was a car subwoofer, powered from a UPA-1, used to give the smaller speakers a bit of oomph.
> 
> If you listened to the Plutos without hearing the Klipcsh you would be impressed by the sound stage and clarity. It's only when you switch to the Klipsch that you realise the difference in bass response. The four of us all appeared to be bass junkies and therefore preferred the Klipsch speakers overall.
> 
> The ERM-1s are not too bad for their size and their price, but clearly lack the bass response that we all love and were outclassed in this company.
> 
> The Bose - well they sounded ok if you don't mind vocals with no warmth, no bass response, and no highs.
> 
> As always, it's great to meet fellow forumers and Emotiva fans.
> We had a great time comparing our experience with different gear and listening to the equipment at hand. I highly recommend everyone to do this more often!


wizardofoz 12-10-11 - Emotiva Forum


> From my perspective, based on the initial tests, I think if someone needs a DAC then the XDA-1 offers great value for money.
> 
> If you already have a DAC then I think reading what other people with your DAC have said about the XDA-1 would make sense.
> If you are lucky to be in the USA you can always use the 30 day period to evaluate it.
> 
> Once we have done further testing in my own environment then I'll have more to say on the final word against the Benchmark.
> Even then, you are paying a fraction of the cost for the XDA-1 to get something with equivalent or near equivalent performance to the Benchmark (based on our tests so far). That's a pretty good deal.


----------



## Mike_WI

dvenardos said:


> Unfortunately that just reinforces my bias that emotiva is a good dollar value, but not anywhere near the last word in quality...


I haven't tested it, but wouldn't disagree with you.
I added links and quotes from another shootout (in Singapore).

Mike


----------



## Mike_WI

*Another mini-review...*

*Another mini-review - 12-10-10*
Link

See link for pics
(reformatted, bold added)


> I finally got the XDA into my system today!
> It arrived three days ago but I've been waiting for my cables to arrive.
> So a little history, built my own speakers about a year ago, these were driven by a Denon two-channel amp putting out 40W/channel.
> 
> I decided this needed to be upgraded so I bought myself two UPA-1's.
> And for a while I ran these straight from my soundcard which is an Asus Xonar D2, I've been pretty happy with this, but that was before my XDA-1 came into play
> 
> So I hooked everything up a few hours ago, optical toslink from my PS3 into the XDA-1, then balanced XLR into my UPA-1's.
> 
> *What can I say...the sound is amazing.
> I understand the upgrade was pretty big, but didn't expect it to be this big.
> The soundstage is huge, the instruments and vocals are spot on.
> And the dynamics...never heard so much slam from my speakers before, it never misses a beat this DAC.*
> 
> Been listening the whole evening, everything from Pearl Jam, Pink Floyd to Metallica and Pantera, some acoustic music and much more.
> My jaw dropped when I heard "Sad but True" with Metallica for the first time since the XDA came into play. The drums are brutal!
> 
> Oh well, the *only negative stuff I have to say about is the volume*, as others have mentioned.
> Depending on CD I can turn it up to a maximum of 10.
> I'm planning on buying a pair of attenuators if nothing happens, or maybe a XSP


----------



## Mike_WI

*Another XDA-1 review...*

*Another XDA-1 review*
12-9-10 - shawmcbigdis

A short segment from long post #1:
(reformatted, bold added)


> Short answer, I'm probably sending the XDA back.
> *Not that there is anything wrong with it, I just can't hear a tangible difference between it and my Onkyo. *
> Honestly I'm very surprised with my own assessment.
> Perhaps there's a problem in my system, or with my ears, but to me the XDA doesn't add enough to be worth the money.
> Which is not a knock on the XDA, I believe that there isn't a DAC on the planet that would add enough to make it worth $300, based on what I've heard about it versus other DAC's, and how it performed in my system.
> 
> So here's the long answer to my listening procedure, and how I came to this conclusion.
> 
> ...


There are multiple posts and commentary after that post...

Mike


----------



## Mike_WI

*XDA-1 Manual*

*XDA-1 Manual*

(originally posted on Emotiva forum - link)


----------



## Mike_WI

*Mini-review (comparison w/o DAC and w/ Bel Canto DAC3)*

*Emotiva Forum - 12-13-10 - joe - thread*

(reformatted for easier reading, bold added)


> Hey guys. This is my first official post here. Hi!
> 
> Anyways, I picked up a pair for UPA-1's a few months back to power my new Vanderteen 2CE Sig2's. I was previously using a Pioneer VSX-1014TX reciever. After hooking up the monoblocks to my pre-outs of the Pioneer I immediately noticed a difference. My Vanderteens now seemed effortless and the soundstage was huge in comparison to the Pioneer. I couldn't be happier with what these emo monoblocks brought to my system. However, the Vandersteens blew me away at the local audio shop but still didnt quite wow me in my own home even with the emo amps. I was quick to blame the DAC on my Pioneer reciever which really is the only bottleneck that I could see in my system. The guy at the local audio store agreed with my assumption and *lent me a Bel Canto DAC3 (with built in volume attenuator just like the XDA-1). *As soon as I hooked up the* new DAC I was absolutley floored. It easily was the greatest thing I've ever heard.* My speakers literally disappeared and there was a tremendous warmth brought to system. I could listen and listen for hours and just enjoy the music. The soundstage was so detailed and it felt as though I could pin point every single location of the performers. It simply blew my mind.
> 
> So with the DAC question out of the way, I returned the $3500 DAC and ordered the E*motiva XDA-1*. After a month or so of anticipation it finally arrived at my door.
> Within 20 Minutes I had it all hooked up to my system with a pair of Emo X-Series XLR cables and Emo Toslink cable directly into my PS3. I am using the XDA-1 as a preamp as well, plugged straight into my UPA-1's.
> The first thing I noticed was that it *sounded much better than my Pioneer DAC*.... BUT.... and its a big BUT.
> It sounded nothing like the Bel Canto DAC3.
> Now I understand I'm comparing a $300 DAC with a $3500 dollar one.
> *But I expected much more from the XDA-1. I experienced the volume problem just like everyone else. *
> 
> Thank god I read this board first because *I would have blown my speakers if I didn't know it turned on at max volume of 80!!! *
> The Bel canto DAC defaulted to 30 when u turned it on and it was a very safe level. I find on the XDA-1 that 4.0 is a loud but comfortable volume .... 4.0 out of 80!
> Crazy! lol. However I can easily live with it. 0.5 is far too loud for background music but it's not horrible. I can deal with it.
> *What really bothered me was how bright and forward this DAC sounds. *
> *I can't listen to music for more than 5 minutes without ear fatigue and a headache (at any volume). *
> My room is full carpet and I have a sectional suede couch and ottoman... lots of pillows thrown about. It really isn't my room. Its the XDA-1.
> I tried swapping out the X-Series XLR cable and the brightness went away quite a bit but the soundstage was absolute garbage and it wasn't nearly as open sounding.
> I tried adjusting the treble and midrage controls on my Vandersteens but it only subdued the effect slightly.
> All I know is I can't listen to music without getting a massive headache and I'm very disappointed.
> Do you guys have any suggestions or know something I can do to make this thing sound... listenable?
> My speakers also do not disappear at all. You can easily isolate them even in the dark.
> Nothing like the Bel Canto DAC. I am thinking of just biting the bullet and saving for the Bel Canto.
> 
> I think I just want a DAC that sounds warm and completely transparent.
> This XDA-1 really is the furthest thing. I tried so hard to like this DAC.
> I've been playing it for 72 hours to see if it will "break in" but no such luck.
> *It still sounds brittle and cold.* I don't know what else to say.
> 
> Here are my system specs:
> Playstation 3 (WAV files ripped from CD saved to the HDD) > Emotiva 1 metre Toslink Cable > XDA-1 > Emotiva X-Series 0.5 metre XLR cable > Emotiva UPA-1 (x2) - 8ft Bi-wired Kimber Cable > Vandersteen 2CE Sig2 (positioned properly and not toed-in).


*ADDENDUM 12-17-10:*
*joe link (Emotiva Forum)*
(bold added)


> Okay guys. *Got it all sorted out. The PS3 was at fault. *
> I plugged in my trusty old WDTV Live from upstairs. It no longer sounds Bright and Forward.
> I loved it when I heard the first note of Linkin Park - Robot Boy.
> The soundstage is just how it should be and my speakers disappeared again.
> I listened for 6 hours straight enjoyed every second.
> Not bright at all. If anything it's a bit laid back which I dont mind at all. **** Playstation!!!!
> Thanks for everyones help!
> The XDA-1 aint no Bel canto DAC3 but it sure sounds good and it'll serve it's purpose to let me enjoy music until I can save up for the DAC I really want.


----------



## gonk

I was looking at the specs for this DAC, and had a question. They list the DAC chip as a "Burr Brown AD1955" on their site - but last time I checked, Analog Devices was not owned by TI (Burr Brown's parent company for many years now). I thought Analog Devices and Burr Brown/TI were competitors? What's up with that?


----------



## Mike_WI

*Analog Devices AD1955 DAC*



gonk said:


> I was looking at the specs for this DAC, and had a question. They list the DAC chip as a "Burr Brown AD1955" on their site - but last time I checked, Analog Devices was not owned by TI (Burr Brown's parent company for many years now). I thought Analog Devices and Burr Brown/TI were competitors? What's up with that?


Good question.

Some info:

Analog Devices AD1955


> The AD1955 is a complete, high performance, single chip stereo digital audio playback system comprised of a multi-bit sigma-delta modulator, digital interpolation filters and a continuous-time differential current output DAC section.
> Unique to this audio DAC is the separate SACD (super audio CD) bit-stream and external digital filter interface, which allows users maximum system flexibility.
> The AD1955 supports 24-bits, 192 kHz sample rate and is designed for use in high-end SACD players, DVD-audio, home theater, automotive audio, digital mixing consoles, digital audio effect processors and sampling musical keyboards.
> 
> *Applications*
> High-End DVD-Audio, SACD, CD, Home Theatre Systems
> Automotive Audio Systems, Sampling Musical Keyboards, Digital
> Mixing Consoles, Digital Audio Effects Processors


AD1955 - High Performance Multibit DAC with SACD Playback - Analog Devices -- datasheet
PDF

DAC comparison testing

*From Emotiva Product site:*

Main text:


> Designed around the acclaimed Analog Devices AD1955 DAC operating in a fully differential mode, its differential output is then coupled to a digitally controlled, lossless volume control stage.


Specs:
(bold added)


> D/A conversion: high performance, multibit Sigma-Delta *Burr Brown AD1955*
> Data Directed Scrambling with high jitter immunity, and an 8x Oversampling Digital Filter


Mike


----------



## Jed M

Thats not a very flattering review. I hope to see some more info. It would be nice if a product at that price point lived up to the hype. I could be interested in something like.


----------



## Mike_WI

*DAC comparisons*



Jed M said:


> Thats not a very flattering review.
> I hope to see some more info.
> It would be nice if a product at that price point lived up to the hype.
> I could be interested in something like.


I agree.
I was highly interested in buying (hence starting thread), but held off.

Some people love it.
A very good point was made that determining its value needs to be made in the context of comparison without a DAC (at least a stand alone DAC) and vs. other DACs at various price points.

Mike


----------



## gonk

Mike_TX said:


> Good question.
> 
> Some info:
> 
> Analog Devices AD1955
> 
> 
> AD1955 - High Performance Multibit DAC with SACD Playback - Analog Devices -- datasheet
> PDF
> 
> DAC comparison testing
> 
> *From Emotiva Product site:*
> 
> Main text:
> 
> 
> Specs:
> (bold added)
> 
> 
> Mike


Your links and info match what I found. I still can't figure out why they have "Burr Brown" in the specs for the DAC. I guess if I really want to know, I'll have to hit the Lounge or email them. I'm surprised it hasn't been discussed more in their forum before now - some searches turned up exactly one post (from back in October), and it received no response from anyone. Seems sloppy...


----------



## Mike_WI

gonk said:


> Your links and info match what I found. I still can't figure out why they have "Burr Brown" in the specs for the DAC. I guess if I really want to know, I'll have to hit the Lounge or email them. I'm surprised it hasn't been discussed more in their forum before now - some searches turned up exactly one post (from back in October), and it received no response from anyone. Seems sloppy...


Are you suggesting that a DAC should have an accurate listing of the internal DAC that is being used?
:sly::snaggletooth:

Mike


----------



## dvenardos

The Channel Islands VDA-2 is the DAC that I use with my SB3. I really love it. It was a night and day difference between the analog out of the SB3, but it is also twice the cost of the XDA-1 (I got a demo unit from Music Direct).
http://www.ciaudio.com/products/VDA2

I may pick up a XDA-1 just to do a comparison...


----------



## Mike_WI

*Cia vda-2*



dvenardos said:


> The Channel Islands VDA-2 is the DAC that I use with my SB3. I really love it. It was a night and day difference between the analog out of the SB3, but it is also twice the cost of the XDA-1 (I got a demo unit from Music Direct).
> http://www.ciaudio.com/products/VDA2
> 
> I may pick up a XDA-1 just to do a comparison...


Cool.
I added the CIA VDA-2 to this DAC list...
http://www.hometheaterspot.com/showpost.php?pid/868857/

Mike


----------



## lonewolf

From the product page

•I/V conversion: Burr Brown OPA-2134


----------



## Mike_WI

*Burr Brown AD1955"*



gonk said:


> I was looking at the specs for this DAC, and had a question. They list the DAC chip as a "Burr Brown AD1955" on their site - but last time I checked, Analog Devices was not owned by TI (Burr Brown's parent company for many years now). I thought Analog Devices and Burr Brown/TI were competitors? What's up with that?





Mike_TX said:


> Good question.
> 
> Some info:
> 
> Analog Devices AD1955
> 
> 
> AD1955 - High Performance Multibit DAC with SACD Playback - Analog Devices -- datasheet
> PDF
> 
> DAC comparison testing
> 
> *From Emotiva Product site:*
> 
> Main text:
> 
> 
> Specs:
> (bold added)
> 
> 
> Mike





lonewolf said:


> From the product page
> 
> •I/V conversion: Burr Brown OPA-2134


I/V = Current to voltage?

So, you think the "Burr Brown AD1955" was just a typo/mashup of two different processors?
Product link:
(bold red added)


> *-* *I/V conversion: *Burr Brown OPA-2134
> *- D/A conversion:* high performance, multibit Sigma-Delta *Burr Brown AD1955 *
> Data Directed Scrambling with high jitter immunity, and an 8x Oversampling Digital Filter


Good catch by gonk.
I wonder why someone didn't catch it before -- or more people comment on it -- given how techy the DAC world is.

Burr Brown OPA2134 PDF for operational amplifier:
http://www.datasheetcatalog.org/datasheet/BurrBrown/mXrtrsq.pdf

Mike


----------



## Mike_WI

*DAC1 vs XDA1 preliminary*

*"DAC1 vs XDA1 preliminary" mini-review/comparison*
Emotiva Forum - 12-15-10 - navman

*(excerpts... ; bold added ; rearranged for clarify)*

*navman:*


> With a bit of cable swapping, I did compare the Benchmark DAC1 vs the XDA1. Both of course were with the XLR outputs.* I didnt level match.*
> 
> I played track 7 "Mobasa" from the Inception score.
> 
> The Benchmark was a wee bit smoother on top and the bass seemed to go lower.
> On the other hand the XDA seemed to have better etched out notes and details/defination was a little better.
> 
> In a way I suppose the XDA was a bit more analytical in that midbass was easier to define and seperate when the track gets busy while the Benchmark seemed to present the music in that region as a combined whole.
> 
> *I really dont think one is necessarily better. Mostly a matter of taste. *Certainly for the money the Emotiva is the way to go.
> _Plus the connectivity and ability to connect more to it makes it very worthwhile.


*Ajani:*


> Interesting findings... I find my Benchmark sounds better than the XDA-1 in all areas... It is more detailed and not bright (the XDA is really starting to sound bright to me)...
> 
> Did you try adjusting the internal attenuators on the Benchmark from -20db to 0db? If not then that might explain why your results were so close....


...

*navman:*


> I say its a matter of taste which one is better, but if I were to pick which one is better I think the Benchmark is.
> The XDA can be fatiging comnpared to the DAC1 but I could imagine some would like the more defined edge that the XDA has.
> 
> For the price, the XDA1 is excellent, and for the time being is the one I will live with. It is very musical.
> 
> I did switch the attenuaters on the Benchmark to 0db.


...

*hokienation:*


> *Great thread. In my experience the difference between dacs at the end of the day seems to be minute.
> Try level setting in a blind comparison and it's really tough to distinguish well engineered dacs. *
> 
> I was salivating over the bryston as a benchmark owner.
> I purchased the bryston and right out of the box it was lift off as the Bryston sounded more alive with better imaging and dare I say "musical".....that is *until I pulled out my trusty spl meter.
> I think the bryston puts out double the voltage if memory serves.*
> 
> *When properly matched, the advantage was almost null. *
> Apart from a slightly more forward presentation with the BM, I could not consistently tell them apart in a blind listening test (thanks to my wife for putting up with that).
> If emotiva has engineered a solid product at a fraction of the cost of most high end dacs then they should clean up and allow for more budget toward speakers and headphones.
> That's where I can hear night and day differences sq.
> 
> Just my 2 cents as an amateur dac/2-channel enthusiast.


...

*lynxo*:


> if the outputs on the XDA-1 are cap coupled, give it some more time. if it sounds the same after a month or so, it's a bright sounding DAC.
> 
> how do you like the depth, sound stage on the XDA-1 vs. the DAC1, subtle differences?
> 
> What attracted me to the XDA-1 is of course the price and that is has built in volume control to connect directly to the XPA-1's, bypassing a preamp.
> I just hope it's not a bright sounding DAC like you are experiencing.



Mike


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## Mike_WI

*XDA-1 gainproblem solution? Revised code*

*XDA-1 gainproblem solution?*
*Revised code...*

*Lonnie:*
Link

(bold added)


> Hello one and all,
> 
> Well we finished the testing of the *revised code which will change the taper of the volume control from linear to log. *
> We realize some of you would prefer this to give you better low level volume control over the DAC as it steps off from the 0 point.
> So we have decided to offer this as an alternative code set anyone who would like it. What you will need to do is call and get a RA#.
> Send it in so we can* re-program* and test it and we will ship it back to you.
> 
> For our international customers, we haven’t forgotten about you.
> At present we don’t have everything worked out as to the best way to take care of you, but we will make it as painless as possible.
> For the time being, please just send an email to [email protected] and tell them you want to get on the list to change the volume control on your XDA-1.
> Once we have it all worked out, we will contact you and let you know.
> 
> As always, thanks to everyone for their support and feedback.
> 
> Lonnie


*Lonnie*


> No change in the specs or sound quality.
> Just a different taper on the volume control.
> 
> The re-programming offer is pretty much open ended.


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## gonk

lonewolf said:


> From the product page
> 
> •I/V conversion: Burr Brown OPA-2134


That is an opamp, and Burr Brown does make the OPA2134. My problem is with the line after that in the spec:



> *D/A conversion:* high performance, multibit Sigma-Delta Burr Brown AD1955
> Data Directed Scrambling with high jitter immunity, and an 8x Oversampling Digital Filter


The AD1955 is not made by Burr Brown (one of the most recognizable DAC chip manufacturers, which is why TI's kept the name even though they've owned the company for many years now). There are posts by Emotiva that specifically mention Analog Devices (the actual maker of the AD1955). The description above the feature list even says:



> Designed around the acclaimed Analog Devices AD1955 DAC operating in a fully differential mode, its differential output is then coupled to a digitally controlled volume control stage.


It's just sort of weird that the wrong manufacturer is listed alongside the most critical single chip in the whole product.


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## gonk

Mike_TX said:


> Good catch by gonk.
> I wonder why someone didn't catch it before -- or more people comment on it -- given how techy the DAC world is.


It is odd. I found one post on Emotiva's forum about it (post here from back in October), but that's all I've seen.


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## Mike_WI

gonk said:


> That is an opamp, and Burr Brown does make the OPA2134. My problem is with the line after that in the spec:
> 
> 
> 
> The AD1955 is not made by Burr Brown (one of the most recognizable DAC chip manufacturers, which is why TI's kept the name even though they've owned the company for many years now). There are posts by Emotiva that specifically mention Analog Devices (the actual maker of the AD1955). The description above the feature list even says:
> 
> 
> 
> It's just sort of weird that the wrong manufacturer is listed alongside the most critical single chip in the whole product.


gonk -
Just to clarify, I have agreed with everything you've said.:salute:
I was trying to figure out where the error was and why.
Thanks.

Mike


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## Mike_WI

gonk said:


> It is odd. I found one post on Emotiva's forum about it (post here from back in October), but that's all I've seen.


*autocrat (Emotiva Forum) 10-11-10:*


> I thought the AD1955 was Analog Devices, not Burr Brown (TI).
> Has there been more "consolidation" in the industry?


Interesting that only he and you have caught that and commented on it.
Why hasn't anyone else noticed?
Usually the first question from people about a DAC is what the internal DAC is.

Mike


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## lonewolf

Just curious. Is this an issue? I think we've seen errors before. If folks google AD1955, they will get the info.


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## Mike_WI

lonewolf said:


> Just curious. Is this an issue? I think we've seen errors before. If folks google AD1955, they will get the info.


I guess that depends on the consumer/user.
Most people missed it completely.

However, that is a vital "tech spec" for a very technical piece of gear.

You may imagine that if CHT had tech specs that were inaccurate and required people to do their own google searches to figure out what it meant that the whole AV community would be up in arms.

The fact that there has been lack of clarity about the XDA-1 USB port tech specs and the volume control suggests that this isn't just an incidental lapse.

You can check out the issues in the many, many threads over months on the Emotiva Forum.

Since I was considering buying an XDA-1 and initiated this thread, I thought it would be helpful to consolidate what is/was going on with the XDA-1.

If it isn't useful to you -- don't read it.

Looking at the number of thread reads would suggest that some people find it useful, even if they aren't posting.

Mike


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## gonk

lonewolf said:


> Just curious. Is this an issue? I think we've seen errors before. If folks google AD1955, they will get the info.


I agree with Mike - it isn't technically an issue, but it is an error on the most important single component in the product and that doesn't reflect positively on the company. If OPPO Digital were to list "Gennum VXP ABT2010 video processor" as a feature for a player on their website, I'd want to know why they did it and how quickly they planned to fix it. After all, it's one of the most significant components in the product, and getting it listed right in the specs is important.


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## lonewolf

Mike_TX said:


> I guess that depends on the consumer/user.
> Most people missed it completely.
> 
> However, that is a vital "tech spec" for a very technical piece of gear.
> 
> You may imagine that if CHT had tech specs that were inaccurate and required people to do their own google searches to figure out what it meant that the whole AV community would be up in arms.
> 
> The fact that there has been lack of clarity about the XDA-1 USB port tech specs and the volume control suggests that this isn't just an incidental lapse.
> 
> You can check out the issues in the many, many threads over months on the Emotiva Forum.
> 
> Since I was considering buying an XDA-1 and initiated this thread, I thought it would be helpful to consolidate what is/was going on with the XDA-1.
> 
> If it isn't useful to you -- don't read it.
> 
> Looking at the number of thread reads would suggest that some people find it useful, even if they aren't posting.
> 
> Mike


Mike: 
Relax. I'm not starting an argument. I'm just asking if this is really an issue to be concerned about. Isn't the AD1955 a well know DAC chip?
Don't sweat the small stuff. Give the XDA-1 a try and see if you like it.


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## Mike_WI

lonewolf said:


> Mike:
> Relax. I'm not starting an argument. I'm just asking if this is really an issue to be concerned about. Isn't the AD1955 a well know DAC chip?
> Don't sweat the small stuff. Give the XDA-1 a try and see if you like it.


The AD1955 is a well known DAC.
As can be seen by my DAC posts on this thread (and forum) and other forums, I've been interested and following for a while.

What is holding me back:
- volume control issues (see threads above and at Emotiva)
- USB output (this is for a work laptop w/o dedicated audio card) capabilities -- still not clear to me
- benefit over ERC-1 or no DAC or my current HRT MS USB DAC


It would be fun to play with, but given that this is one computer audio setup at work that I'm at a minority of the time it doesn't seem like now is the time to jump on this. I will continue to watch the progress and see if a v2 is sorted out more completely.

Mike


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## lonewolf

gonk said:


> I agree with Mike - it isn't technically an issue, but it is an error on the most important single component in the product and that doesn't reflect positively on the company. If OPPO Digital were to list "Gennum VXP ABT2010 video processor" as a feature for a player on their website, I'd want to know why they did it and how quickly they planned to fix it. After all, it's one of the most significant components in the product, and getting it listed right in the specs is important.


The only thing I would want to know is which video processor chip they are really using. I don't think there is really a question of what DAC chip is being used in the XDA-1. It's an AD1955.
And I do think it should be corrected.


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## Mike_WI

*VP?*



lonewolf said:


> The only thing I would want to know is which video processor chip they are really using. I don't think there is really a question of what DAC chip is being used in the XDA-1. It's an AD1955.
> And I do think it should be corrected.


Video processor?

This isn't an AVR, just an audio DAC unless I'm missing something?
*XDA-1*
:scratchchin:

Mike


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## rygher3

I don't remember where on the forum I read it, but Emo is allowing for a change from linear volume to log. That should fix the low volume issue.

Still from what I've read, the XDA-1 seems to have been overhyped.


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## Mike_WI

*Revised code for volume issue*



rygher3 said:


> I don't remember where on the forum I read it, but Emo is allowing for a change from linear volume to log. That should fix the low volume issue.
> 
> Still from what I've read, the XDA-1 seems to have been overhyped.


Yes.
I consolidated some post info *here*.

Mike


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## gonk

lonewolf said:


> The only thing I would want to know is which video processor chip they are really using. I don't think there is really a question of what DAC chip is being used in the XDA-1. It's an AD1955.
> And I do think it should be corrected.


We agree that it should be fixed. The actual chip listing is correct, but the surrounding details are wrong and need to be revised. It's a pretty gross error to get the wrong manufacturer listed for the most important single piece in your product.



Mike_TX said:


> Video processor?
> 
> This isn't an AVR, just an audio DAC unless I'm missing something?
> *XDA-1*
> :scratchchin:
> 
> Mike


He was referring to my example - of what if OPPO had the wrong chip manufacturer listed next to the video processing chip for a player.


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## Jed M

Its kind of like a car dealer trying to sell as Mustang as a Chevy Mustang. Sure, it may be a Mustang, but it makes you seriously question about what is going on at the dealership. Mistake, intentional, don't know, but it seems like a strange error, and especially considering how fast it would take to correct it given that they have known since October.


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## imported_Benson

Has anyone had any listening experience with the device? There was one (maybe 2) for sale at the EMO forum.

I am on the pre-order list but I think officially you can't buy it (yet). I am on the fence of getting one to replace my Pacific Valve NOS DAC and couldn't find anything better in this price range judging by specs.


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## Mike_WI

Benson said:


> Has anyone had any listening experience with the device? There was one (maybe 2) for sale at the EMO forum.
> 
> I am on the pre-order list but I think officially you can't buy it (yet). I am on the fence of getting one to replace my Pacific Valve NOS DAC and couldn't find anything better in this price range judging by specs.


There are multiple links to shootouts and reviews in this thread, but I don't think anyone at CHT Forum has posted on their listening comments.

Mike


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## Sparky14

Early reviews are mixed on the Emo DAC.

I'd also check out the audio-gd DACs. They are working on some nice ones....although actually getting one is a bit challenging.


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## rygher3

I have the option to purchase one now for the $299 price (is going to $349 later). I am debating on whether to try it out or not. Anybody here try it and have any feedback?


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## jackfish

Mike_WI, don't you think you should change your avatar for this weekend?


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