# Chamber of Dreams => How it was made...



## HTip

Some of you might have seen the end result of this project here. In this thread I would like to show you how I realized our dream. I started back in 2007 and finished the project last year. So it took me some 3.5 years to complete.

If you have some questions about the choices I made and why feel free...

First of all here are some drawings of the final design.
























Quick design made in Sketchup








Some detail designs
















The remarks are in Dutch. If you need translation, let me know


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## HTip

Our HT is situated in the basement. Before we started it was only used for storage. Everything (floor, walls and ceiling) is concrete so we could enjoy a lot of echo 

Wall where screen was supposed to come. You can see the measurements of possible screen sizes 








Back of the room. That small wall was our first problem.








But problems are there to fix. And a "little" work later...






















After cleaning up we were ready for the next step...


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## KalaniP

Translation of "kabelgoot" and "hoog" probably covers the majority of the labels used in those drawings. 

Keep 'em coming!


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## HTip

KalaniP said:


> Translation of "kabelgoot" and "hoog" probably covers the majority of the labels used in those drawings.
> 
> Keep 'em coming!


 Translation is as follows:
holle ruimte = hollow space
hoog = high
kabelgoot = cable tray

Luckily only the design contains Dutch words


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## HTip

Funny story was when we went to a local woodshop. We only asked the owner if he could deliver some wood according to our design. He started drawing, gave us some tips and said what it would cost. He then said that he couldn't deliver that weekend (3 days later), but on Monday would be no problem. So we went out with the knowledge that only 5 days later the wood would be delivered 

We chose garden wood, because of possible moist in the basement








Of course we were curious of how the podium would look like and if everything would fit.


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## HTip

Next step was closing the door opening in the back and the window at the front.

















After that we filled the podium with glass wool and covered them with black and red carpet


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## HTip

Before sealing the outside wall to prevent moist from coming in we tested out how large our screen should be.

First we drew the different screen sizes on the wall








Close-up of the measurements








At the time we had a Optoma H78 and a Marantz DV9500








We decided we would go for a 100" screen and sealed the wall








Next step was the floor...


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## HTip

No updates because I was ill. I'll speed up the process 

The floor was next, but no different from an ordinary floor so not very interesting. Apart from the symmetry which makes it very to install a center speaker or screen exactly in the middle.

The door opening was to big for a standard door, so I narrowed it. But this is also not very interesting.

Next step was the wall, which was not easy. But with some effort we created a level wall which we needed to board it up. After that the room was transformed into someting completely different.















Our first real challenge was the ceiling. We never done that before, so that was a little scary :scratch:

We could borrow a laser guide from the local DIY-shop. That was a big help. The challenge with the ceiling was the tolerances of only 0.2"  Otherwise the tiles wouldn't fit or fall out. We chose a tile where the rail was invisible and would not distract while viewing a movie.

We started by drawing the lines on the ceiling, where the rails would come...
































We must have done something right 








Most of the railings in place








Then added some tiles... 








...and the room sounded really different already :T


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## HTip

Anybody interested in the rest of the build? I expected questions about the choices we made and why


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## ALMFamily

Definitely interested - been following along so far! :T


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## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> Definitely interested - been following along so far! :T


Ok. I was just wondering, because my room is already finished 

I have forgotten an important piece of the puzzle. The reason for the ceiling. I had someone do a RT60-measurement and he drafted a plan and suggested a ceiling with slabs that could absorb frequencies from 250Hz and up.

Test setup
















Measurement in progress. Blue in that chart is not good 








Result. Average reverberation time is almost 3 seconds :yikes: Target are the red lines...








But with help of the ceiling, the carpet and the other acoustic measures that would change...


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## Prof.

HTip said:


> Anybody interested in the rest of the build? I expected questions about the choices we made and why


Still following..Just waiting on the later stages..


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## HTip

Prof. said:


> Still following..Just waiting on the later stages..


The ceiling was the most important stage of the build. And later on the absorbers and much later on the bass traps. But don't worry, I will continue posting... 

You have to wait though, because tomorrow I'm away and now I have to go to sleep :yawn: It's around 23.00 o'clock here at the moment and I have to get up early. But Monday I'm back. See you all then!


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## HTip

For the lighting of the room we chose 3 lights each side. We found some that were easy to install in the ceiling tiles. For the back wall it looked like this.

























Next was our biggest challenge, the projection wall. It was gonna be an important acoustic measure and it was supposed be to done very accurate. So we started bij positioning the screen exactly in the middle and at the right height.








The design was pretty straight forward, bus not easy to construct.








Every compartment was a separate absorber tuned to a specific frequency. So even behind the screen 3 absorbers would placed. The idea was to integrate the screen into that absorber.


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## HTip

Now we knew where the screen was going to be, we started with the frame.








We needed to make sure there was a little open space between the board and the rockwool.








Filling up the absorbers with rockwool
































With the wooden boards and the Beamax A-velvet in place








Next activity... "Paint it black"


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## HTip

To enhance contrast and picture the whole wall is painted black.

































The end result with the screen in place. Compare this to the picture with original color
















It started to look like a home cinema already...


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## Prof.

The finished result looks very good, but why the timber panels over the rockwool? Surely this will give you a reflective surface that high frequencies will bounce off!


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## HTip

Prof. said:


> The finished result looks very good, but why the timber panels over the rockwool? Surely this will give you a reflective surface that high frequencies will bounce off!


Thanks Prof :T

The timber panels act as a membrane and can flex quite a bit. That is why there has to be a gap between the timber and the rockwool. But you're right that high frequencies will bounce off. The panels are there to handle the low/mid low frequencies (80-250Hz). The ceiling deals with de mid frequencies and above (250Hz-).

Furthermore, a curtain will be used to cover most of the reflective surface when watching a movie or concert. With music the curtain stays closed and therefor covers the whole wall.


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## Prof.

Hmm..Very interesting!..I look forward to hearing your report on how the end result sounds..


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## HTip

Prof. said:


> Hmm..Very interesting!..I look forward to hearing your report on how the end result sounds..


I will do that and I can even show RT60-measurements after treatment phase 1 and the end result.


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## HTip

It's been a while (been a bit hectic here) but here's the next step. Before the RT60 could be executed there was still some work to be done, not all of it cosmetic 

At that time we were very anxious to see the first images on that big screen. So we had to put the projector (Themescene H78) on the ceiling, which didn't have horizontal lensshift. So we created a rail so it could slide a little. It was not very sofisticated but it did the job 









































Adjusting the picture so that it fits. Images probably looks familiar, they're from the DVD DVE from JKP.
You can clearly see what influence the ceiling had on the picture. Besides absorbing sound it also absorbs light :T
























Finding Nemo


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## HTip

One can't have enough connections so I build 4 pillars from MDF to hold 8 sockets

















Fitting with the cinema chairs









Painting it black (again )









Pillars almost ready. In the meantime covered the back wall with red carpet.









Around the podium there is space for cables.
















Podium also covered with red carpet. Carpet is wall to wall, so the cable covers are hidden.









Only thing left were the wall sockets...


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## Prof.

It looks very nice..but carpet on the back wall is not a good idea..It's not a good bass absorber and mainly absorbs mid to high frequencies..
Ideally you need bass traps in the corners and a large 4" thick fibreglass panel with a reflective surface on the back wall.. between the columns 
The mid/high frequencies need to be reflected rather than absorbed..


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## HTip

Thanks for the tips Prof. At that point in time the front wall was our main low frequency absorber. In a later stage the front wall was rebuild to accomodate real bass traps and although that was a major improvement, last year we put an RPG Broadband between the columns in the back. When I come to those stages I will post the RT60-measurements to see the result.


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## bambino

Awesome theater, can't wait to see the finished product.:T


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## HTip

bambino said:


> Awesome theater, can't wait to see the finished product.:T


Thanks for the compliment! :T

The room is actually finished already and this topic is my way to share my building experience and the choices I made along the way.

You can find pictures of the finished room here: http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...finished-rooms-only/54718-chamber-dreams.html


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## gorb

Great looking theater - hopefully that small wall you knocked down wasn't very important to the stability or structure of your home 

I always enjoy seeing photos of the build process, even though I don't understand the reasons behind a lot of design choices or have any idea how to do things like that myself.


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## HTip

To be able to remove the chairs if needed we placed them on a board and painted it black of course 

















It actually fits 









The columns are not only for accomodating the sockets, they're also perfect to hide the cable mess 
































It was now time for the second measurement and the placement of the diffusers...


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## HTip

gorb said:


> Great looking theater - hopefully that small wall you knocked down wasn't very important to the stability or structure of your home


Thanks! Funny you should say that. Before we did some work in the living room it actually was important. After removing a structure which contained a fire place the weight was off that basement wall. We replaced the fireplace by a wood burning cassette.



> I always enjoy seeing photos of the build process, even though I don't understand the reasons behind a lot of design choices or have any idea how to do things like that myself.


If you have any questions please go ahead and I will try to answer them. I didn't know a lot of thing either but learned them as we went along


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## HTip

The second measurement. After completing the most important acoustic measures the diffusers were brought in. Based on QRD but half the depth due to a clever solution made by the professional who is responsible for our acoustics plan. Together with the delivery he performed the second RT60 measurement.

The diffusers and the test system in place.









The master at work 









The result...








We were not quite there yet, but the plan was to have curtains and a rug and that would account for enough extra mid/high absorption. The low absorption however was a different story...


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## HTip

To evaluate the result we put some equipment in the room and for the first time started listening to music. 









We chose some high resolution recordings. We were pretty pleased with what we heard. But we were convinced of needing more measures...









At the same time we had another challenge. The Optoma H78 was white and was sticking out too much. So we made it black. That sounds a lot easier than it actually was. The Optoma disassembled in several pieces.























Using masking tape to keep the text visible






























Reassembled...









... and back on the ceiling (compared to before)
















We were quite proud of our achievement and everything was still working


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## Prof.

Nice paint job..It looks like the real thing!..:T
I have a white Optoma projector as well..I don't know why Optoma make them white! :scratch: Not very practical in a theatre..


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## HTip

Prof. said:


> Nice paint job..It looks like the real thing!..:T


Thanks Prof. It was pretty difficult using a spray can, but with some practice it turned out quite nice indeed.



> I have a white Optoma projector as well..I don't know why Optoma make them white! :scratch: Not very practical in a theatre..


Would be better to have a projector in both black and white. Black for bat caves and white for living rooms. But for some reason I don't know :dontknow: some manufacturers think white is good for all rooms :blink:


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## HTip

Slowly but surely the cinema was taking shape. We were still a long way from a finished room, but the thought of watching a movie was so appealing...

The speaker brand ALR/Jordan is probably not very well known. It is a merger between the German brand ALR and the English brand Jordan. The sound can be characterized as a bit warm with a lot of detail. We chose this speaker blindly in a test with our own equipment set up at a dealer.









The SVS 25-31 PC+ placed on an Auralex Gramma









The diffusers are mounted on the wall. The middle is exactly aligned with the tweeter of the fronts. That took a lot of measuring and drawing. Because one diffuser weighs 10kg (22 lbs), mounting is not easy. To distribute the weight evenly we used aluminium chair shaped strips across the entire width. That way we could easily move the diffusers back and forth. Guess what color they're gonna be... 

At that time the fronts were bi-amped with W&M Audio Black Magic. It contains 4 separate wires, so one cable is enough.









After adjusting the setup the best solution was speakers on small and cross over set to 70Hz. Now we were ready for some surround sound... WOW!! This was great and very easy getting used to. We also heard that further measures were still necessary so that was the next step...


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## ALMFamily

So fun seeing the end product 1st, and then seeing it come together! :T

Were the diffusers DIY or purchased? Trying to decide if I should take a crack at doing them myself - yours look very impressive.


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## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> So fun seeing the end product 1st, and then seeing it come together! :T


It's nice for me too to relive the whole process and see all the pictures again :T



> Were the diffusers DIY or purchased? Trying to decide if I should take a crack at doing them myself - yours look very impressive.


I purchased them from the guy who did the measurement. He's a room acoustics specialist and designed them. They are based on a regular QRD diffuser but 35-40% less deep. In my case it's almost 50% and the effect is still the same. If you're interested I can contact him to get in contact with you. He is Dutch, like me


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## ALMFamily

It is quite a while before I get to that point, but I may just take you up on that when that time arrives - they really are that impressive. And, the fact that they weigh half as much is a definite added bonus!


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## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> It is quite a while before I get to that point, but I may just take you up on that when that time arrives - they really are that impressive. And, the fact that they weigh half as much is a definite added bonus!


Thanks! I never heard of them either, but because I hired him for the acoustics he pointed them out. Otherwise I wouldn't have been able to place diffusers. The other diffusers had to be "mobile", cause they would block the door. I will post my solution to that problem later on in the process.

When you come round to that just let me know :T


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## dsully444

That is a bueatiful home theater, I like the way it is coming together. Did you have to do anything special to the walls on the exterior to ensure no water is coming into the theater? Or was it more a sealing the walls on the inside with paint?


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## HTip

Thank you very much. One of the outer walls is sealed on the inside with a 2-component sealant. That wall is sealed with a clear coating on the outside.There is one other wall with exterior contact, but not really. It's a basement were the oil drum lies in the soil. But we are planning to seal that wall anyway.


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## HTip

I have been down with the flu, but now well enough to update my build thread.

Where was I? O yeah, improving the acoustics  But first an overview of the room at that moment.









We focused on the curtains, not only for acoustic purposes but also to protect the screen. It was quite a challenge because we didn't want to see any rails and the ceiling had to be adjusted.

Preparing the ceiling and the cove































I could use a little help with holding up the cove 
















Testrun with the curtains. The rail is automatic by the way.












































Reattaching the ceiling rail









Finished!









Looking at the pictures you can probably guess what the next step was


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## HTip

You guessed right  The cove needed to become black. But not only the cove, also the door and the skirting. We used an adhesive felt. That way it is not only black but also absorbs the light.















The white thing in the corner is the motor for the curtain.

The door in progress. My lovely assistant was better at this 























Before and after
















Skirting to keep cables out of sight
















Finishing the cable tray









To finish the front of the room, we painted the diffusers and the door frame black























It started to look more and more like a cinema :T


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## ALMFamily

All great work - what has really impressed me most about this has been your (and your wife's) attention to every detail. I think that it what makes it look as fantastic as it does - kudos to you both! :T


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## HTip

Thanks for the great compliment Joe! :T I will pass it onto my wife when she comes home.

It's probably also the reason for the long it took to finish the room. We are pretty meticulous when it comes down to DIY jobs and not easily satisfied with the end result 

Grtz, Philip


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## KalaniP

Gorgeous. I'm so jealous! :T


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## HTip

KalaniP said:


> Gorgeous. I'm so jealous! :T


Thanks! But don't be, anyone with a room to spare, some DIY-skills can do this too. Apart from the equipment it is not even that expensive. The acoustic measures cost me the most


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## HTip

Not long after that we got the opportunity to purchase some ex-demo equipment. It started with the Velodyne SMS-1 which we hoped would keep our SVS sub under control.

























The SMS-1 did indeed what we hoped it would do. Our bass response was a lot better and easier on the ears. We tried different positions, but where it stood was pretty good. And with some help with all the different parameters and EQ. At that moment this was my result.









According to the dealer it was a good start, but could be improved. That same dealer also had a JVC DLA-HD1/RS1 on sale. It was ex-demo with full warranty and ISF calibration. He offered to install it and also fine tune the sound, especially from the SMS-1. The dealer is also HAA certified so we didn't have to think twice. 

But to be able to hang up the JVC we had to change our construction. The JVC has the lens in the middle while the Optoma didn't. Because of bith horizontal and vertical lens shift the new construction could be firmly attached to the ceiling









The tiles needed some adjustment also






































Adjusting the image
















Adjusting the bass curve. I forgot to make one of the final result









Finished! :T









You can see that in the mean time we had hung up some racks for DVD's and CD's and placed the rear speakers, but that was not worth photographing


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## KalaniP

HTip said:


> Thanks! But don't be, anyone with a room to spare, some DIY-skills can do this too. Apart from the equipment it is not even that expensive. The acoustic measures cost me the most


So all I need is a new house (no extra room in this one), and the budget for the equipment. addle:

It's fun looking at other people's work, however. :sn:


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## HTip

KalaniP said:


> So all I need is a new house (no extra room in this one), and the budget for the equipment. addle:


:clap: Oh, is that all you need? 

In our previous house we had a "modest" 5.1 setup with a CRT-TV in the living room but still enjoyed the experience of being surrounded by sound. Apart from the projector and screen we actually had everything already, but upgraded anyway, because 1080p sounded/looked so good. So we could have saved a lot on that. My point is that you can build a room as expensive as you let it. The actual cost of the built was not very high. Apart from acoustic ceiling I think we spent some $2000 in materials and tools. I am very grateful to have been able to pursue and realize my dream. Hence the name of the theater :T



> It's fun looking at other people's work, however. :sn:


That's how it all started for us too


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## Prof.

Awesome job!! :clap: It's all looking very nice..
The curtains look very effective..and add to the overall impression of a quality theatre! :TT


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## KalaniP

HTip said:


> :clap: Oh, is that all you need?
> 
> In our previous house we had a "modest" 5.1 setup with a CRT-TV in the living room but still enjoyed the experience of being surrounded by sound. Apart from the projector and screen we actually had everything already, but upgraded anyway, because 1080p sounded/looked so good. So we could have saved a lot on that. My point is that you can build a room as expensive as you let it. The actual cost of the built was not very high. Apart from acoustic ceiling I think we spent some $2000 in materials and tools. I am very grateful to have been able to pursue and realize my dream. Hence the name of the theater :T


Indeed, and you've made those dream come true beautifully. 

Someday, I hope to have a bigger house with a spare room that could be used to create something like this. Meanwhile, I make due with a mixed purpose living room. I do hope to add a projector for the real big screen experience at some point, but at the moment, it's all a contest of wills between my wife's aesthetic needs (as a designer, she's even more stubborn than most on this issue) and my desire for some form of room treatments in our very acoustically-live room...


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## HTip

Prof. said:


> Awesome job!! :clap: It's all looking very nice..
> The curtains look very effective..and add to the overall impression of a quality theatre! :TT


Thanks again! :bigsmile:

The curtains are effective in 3 ways. They protect the screen from dust and dirt. With music you don't get distracted by a large white surface. And last but but not least, they help with absorbing and diffusing some of the frequencies.

And the start of the movie/concert it's just cool when it automatically opens :banana:


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## HTip

KalaniP said:


> Indeed, and you've made those dream come true beautifully.
> 
> Someday, I hope to have a bigger house with a spare room that could be used to create something like this. Meanwhile, I make due with a mixed purpose living room. I do hope to add a projector for the real big screen experience at some point, but at the moment, it's all a contest of wills between my wife's aesthetic needs (as a designer, she's even more stubborn than most on this issue) and my desire for some form of room treatments in our very acoustically-live room...


Thank you :T

Just keep your wish in mind and eventually it might come true. When 10 years ago someone would have said that I would have a home cinema in my basement I would have called him crazy 

And I'm very lucky with my wife. She likes watching movies and listening to music as well and sometimes is more critical over the picture and sound quality. I don't mind that :R


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## HTip

Continuing with the build...

I don't know if anybody is interested in power, but we have a separate audio grade group. This is connected to an audio grade AC power transfer. It was a very good upgrade in both picture and sound. But it was not easy and can be hazardous if you don't know what you're doing. I am qualified to make adjustmenst in my AC lines, so I did this myself.

First connect the group to the line. From there almost 40ft of Belden power cable go to the room and end up in a Rittal power transfer.

Overview of the fusebox. The audio group (Siemens Cylindric Fuse Cartridge) is in the bottom right corner.









In close up









And even closer. Here you can see the fuse, which is a HifiTuning Ultimate II by the way.









The Rittal AC power transfer. Covered in black of course 









With the rest of the Belden cable I made some DIY power cords for the sub and the projector. That saved me a lot of money.


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## HTip

The diffusers by the door need to be at the same height as the other one and it would be nice that we could enter the room 

We came up with a the following solution...

First a construction on the wall
















Attach the 4 difussers in 2 pairs joined by a hinge over the entire length
















The result is this























The log that is supporting the weight has yet to be replaced by something a little more convenient


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## PTAaron

Very cool thread! Enjoying reading about the build, keep up the good work!


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## Prof.

Clever thinking HTip..That should work well..:T


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## HTip

PTAaron said:


> Very cool thread! Enjoying reading about the build, keep up the good work!


Thanks Aaron! Although the room is already finished (at least for now ) I thought it would be nice to show how the room has developed over the years. And the lessons I learned doing so.



Prof. said:


> Clever thinking HTip..That should work well..:T


Thanks! It works well, but it's a little off compared to the rest of the room. I have an idea about how it would work better, but I still have to come around to it. And I like enjoying the room more...


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## HTip

The room was almost finished (or so I thougth at the time) and so we started with the cosmetic finishing touches. We replaces the DVD and CD racks are by stainless steel racks based on an IKEA design which a friend of mine built.


















To avoid flutter echoes the racks are positioned across the gap between the racks on the other side. It works quite remarkable.

We also wanted a small coffee table








This one suits pretty good, but the light reflection during a movie was annoying. So what did we do? Correct, we covered the table with felt 































The result...










The construction for the diffusers needed a bit of black too
















We were happy :T

By the way, if you look closely at the pictures you can see that we did a major improvement. Who can see it?


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## Prof.

That's a nifty idea of covering the table with felt!..:T
Was it the throw rug that's been added? It seems to be in some photos, but not others.. :scratch:


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## PTAaron

Really like the felt covered table and those racks.


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## HTip

Prof. said:


> That's a nifty idea of covering the table with felt!..:T
> Was it the throw rug that's been added? It seems to be in some photos, but not others.. :scratch:


Thanks! We just don't like light reflection  

The rug was added too, but not the major improvement  But you have to look really close to probably spot it 



PTAaron said:


> Really like the felt covered table and those racks.


Thanks Aaron! Felt is a great material and with some care it sticks to almost anything. I also use slim line BD-boxes which are only 7mm. A great way saving space and getting more BD's into that rack


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## HTip

I admit that the change is not easily visible, but here it is 

Before








After








The improvement is awesome. I went from a Beamax A-Velvet 100" to a Screen Luxus Deluxe Screenwall 110" with Studiotek 130G3 :TT
























Besides the size, the picture quality improved dramatically. The image was sharper, colors were more vibrant and more uniform across the screen. The screen was ex-demo so the price was real good with full waranty. We were very happy.

The only problem was that the screen didn't fit into the space of the previous screen and the curtains couldn't close. So it was back to the drawing board...


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## HTip

But first we had to solve another problem, which was preventing bugs and insects coming into the room. We looked for nice looking grates, but none were to our liking. That left only one option, DIY 

It was pretty easy compared to other activities...

First you make square wooden panels, in our case MDF. You drill a hole the size of the opening.









Then you have your wife  paint it, in our case... uhm black 


















and you cover it with the same material used in insect screens









And then you come up with this









The result in the room









I noticed that I got the order wrong, because in the last picture we had the old DVD-racks still


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## Prof.

I have a floor vent in my room..behind the screen and I had to do the same thing! 
We have a big problem with millipedes here..and they were crawling up through the vent! The flyscreen covering stopped them in their tracks..


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## PTAaron

Do your vents open to the outside?


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## Prof.

The floor vent draws cool air from under the house into the theatre..


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## PTAaron

Prof. said:


> The floor vent draws cool air from under the house into the theatre..


Oh ok, I haven't seen that before.


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## Prof.

Some of our homes down here are on stilts (raised above the ground), to allow air flow and water flow in the event of a flood..
The bonus of that is that you can draw in cool air from under the house..


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## HTip

Prof. said:


> I have a floor vent in my room..behind the screen and I had to do the same thing!
> We have a big problem with millipedes here..and they were crawling up through the vent! The flyscreen covering stopped them in their tracks..


I sometimes wonder why insects even exist besides being a pest for humans. Our basement can be moist so we have to open small windows for venting and that attracts bugs from everywhere. Even insects I had never seen before. We are going to deal with that in the future, but for now the flyscreens do the work :T


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## HTip

Before we started with the redesign of the front wall we upgraded the speaker cables from W&M Audio Black Magic (a German bi-amping cable) to inakustik Referenz (also German )

If you're wondering... this is not our garden hose 



























The cable covers came in very handy :T


















The difference in sound was incredible. More detail but not tiring, tight bass reponse and great dynamics. We were happy (again)


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## HTip

With the redesign of the front wall we decided we would try to handle the bass problem in the room. So we asked the acoustics specialist for advise again. His plan was to integrate real bass traps together with the panel absorbers. That meant that the whole wall would have to be rebuild from scratch.

It was quite a challenge to build this so I started drawing again


















And in 3D you get a feel of the problems I would face.


















The problem was the position of the bass traps and that the lower absorber had to be wall to wall with as much free space behind it as possible. Also the membrane should only be attached at the sides.


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## HTip

The bass traps are based on the Helmholtz resonator.









The trap can be tuned to a specific frequency by varying the different parameters. In my case, the slot width was 3mm with a 0,1mm variance. So not much room for error 

Based on the design I calculated the size of the trap and the number of slats I needed. Because of the variance I handed the calculation over to a professional. This is what was delivered, just 2 large 30mm MDF boards, sawed up into little pieces. It didn't look that much, but looks can be deceiving 









Same package but now divided into 2 bass traps. A friend of mine advised me to divide the bass trap into 3 pieces, because of the weight. So I did and he was not kidding. Those things are heavy!









To make sure the gap is exactly 3mm I did some tests with different materials. Hardboard looked to be a good way, but when I added the weight the gap started to shrink.









I eventually ended up with aluminium.









One third of the first one ready









The hard part of 3 different elements is maintaining the gap









Can you imagine the weight of this structure?









First one "finished"









Onto the next...


----------



## ALMFamily

Now that is quite an undertaking!

How many people did it take to lift and carry it into place?!


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> Now that is quite an undertaking!
> 
> How many people did it take to lift and carry it into place?!


It really was. You probably don't believe this but apart from the top one, just me. And I don't even look like Hulk Hogan  If it had been in one piece I probably would have needed a fork lift  My wife helped me with the heavy top one.

Also the construction in the room helped me, but I will come to that later.


----------



## HTip

The second one was a little easier too handle. Mainly because the slats were less deep.





















































And done!









In real time it took just a bit longer


----------



## HTip

Now comes the hard part. We wanted to reuse as much as possible, but how do you do that when everything is glued together... Luckily we had used a silicone based glue which is elastic.

First the front of the room had to be cleared. I removed the electronics out to the living room, but sadly I had no room for the speakers. The ceiling is very fragile, so I had to be extra careful not to damage it.

















Disassembling the front wall









It all went very well









Ready for the rebuild









But first I had to check something... onder:


----------



## Prof.

HTip said:


> Before we started with the redesign of the front wall we upgraded the speaker cables from W&M Audio Black Magic (a German bi-amping cable) to inakustik Referenz (also German )


What is the difference in the construction of the two cables? Do you know why the new cable is so much better?
I'm curious as speaker cable is normally just multi-strand (non shielded) copper 16g. or 14g. wire!


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> What is the difference in the construction of the two cables? Do you know why the new cable is so much better?
> I'm curious as speaker cable is normally just multi-strand (non shielded) copper 16g. or 14g. wire!


I'm not that technical but it has something to do with preventing EMI/RFI interference. I have some technical documentation of the inakustik cables. If you like I can post some pieces here (I have to look for them though) and some comparison pictures between the two.


----------



## ALMFamily

If you would not mind, I would very much like to see that as well. I have always assumed - and the reading I have done since - that cables were cables and any manufacturer that tried to say differently was just selling snake oil.


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> If you would not mind, I would very much like to see that as well. I have always assumed - and the reading I have done since - that cables were cables and any manufacturer that tried to say differently was just selling snake oil.


I don't mind at all, but I'm a bit reluctant to start a discussion on the subject. I've seen these discussions end badly. But in my opinion cables sound different. I have done some ABX tests in the past and our conclusion was that we, my wife too , hear differences.

A big factor is the acoustic situation of our room. Sound is very detailed, even the subtle ones don't go unnoticed. We have so little reverb that details don't get lost in the mix of sounds.

This is, again in our opinion, also the case with interlinks and power cables. But don't take my word for it. I suggest you try it yourselves and if you don't hear the differences, then it's not worth spending money over.

I have looked up some technical documentation which in a way explains what the difference is between their cables and others. It's not very objective of course, but that's with all brochures.


LS-1202 - Technical details
inakustik Referenz catalog
This is a picture of one of our tests









Here you can see the difference in diameter. In case of the W&M cable has only 1 stranded wire per terminal. The inakustik has a lot of single stranded wires which are combined per terminal.
















We have this cable for the center and rears. It is the LS-1002.









Both cables spread out over the floor. The gray/white is the LS-1202 and the black/white is the LS-1002.









Bottom line is that we hear the differences. We were able to test different cables in our own room and we ordered the one we liked the most. The others we send back  I wrote a review report in my Dutch blog and I can translate it so I can post it here if it's appropriate. Once again I'm not looking to start a believer/non-believer discussion :innocent:


----------



## PTAaron

Those are some serious looking cables!
The important part is that YOU are happy with your choices and YOU feel that it has helped your system. There are some really bitter disputes about the topic though... some people don't seem to be able to accept the choices of others


----------



## HTip

PTAaron said:


> Those are some serious looking cables!


They are and sound great too. 



> The important part is that YOU are happy with your choices and YOU feel that it has helped your system. There are some really bitter disputes about the topic though... some people don't seem to be able to accept the choices of others


That's exactly why I don't wanna go there. You couldn't have said it better. It's all about respecting choices and opinions. There are no right and wrongs.

On the Dutch HTforum some people got banned because they didn't respected others and it got real ugly. It's my hobby and if it gets stressful it's no fun anymore. I get that enough at work


----------



## Prof.

I bought some special speaker wire many years ago..It was quite similar to the one you show in the photo..
It consisted of 8 individually bundled groups of wire with 60 strands in each bundle..Each separate wire was about the thickness of a hair!

According to the manufacturer, this multi grouping of very fine wires was supposed to give better transient response..and it seemed to do just that when comparing it to normal 14g. speakers wire!..
Overall the sound felt tighter..so I guess it's similar to what you're hearing..

The only reason I stopped using it was that it's fearfully expensive and having to run 6 x 15M. lengths of it my current theatre, was out of the question..


----------



## ALMFamily

Yeah, if it bothers you at all, we don't need to go there. I thought I would ask the question as I feel certain that you would provide us with your honest take and not try to sell anything. Sorry for the tangent - back to the build!


----------



## PTAaron

HTip said:


> They are and sound great too.
> 
> That's exactly why I don't wanna go there. You couldn't have said it better. It's all about respecting choices and opinions. There are no right and wrongs.
> 
> On the Dutch HTforum some people got banned because they didn't respected others and it got real ugly. It's my hobby and if it gets stressful it's no fun anymore. I get that enough at work


I hear you on that. I run a bodybuilding forum with a friend of mine - and you want to talk about drama? Unbelievable...  Luckily over there I just ban the people that can't be respectful! :T


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> I bought some special speaker wire many years ago..It was quite similar to the one you show in the photo..
> It consisted of 8 individually bundled groups of wire with 60 strands in each bundle..Each separate wire was about the thickness of a hair!
> 
> According to the manufacturer, this multi grouping of very fine wires was supposed to give better transient response..and it seemed to do just that when comparing it to normal 14g. speakers wire!..
> Overall the sound felt tighter..so I guess it's similar to what you're hearing..
> 
> The only reason I stopped using it was that it's fearfully expensive and having to run 6 x 15M. lengths of it my current theatre, was out of the question..


I had the same issue, invest the money or leave it. Because the equipment is in the back (I hate to see LED's and displays when I'm watching a movie ) I need quite a lot of speaker cable. In my opinion if you have thousands of $ worth of equipment with standard wiring the set in out of balance and you might not hear the full potential. Same is the case for interlinks and power cables. And we don't mind, cause every hobby costs money :spend: and we only live once


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> Yeah, if it bothers you at all, we don't need to go there. I thought I would ask the question as I feel certain that you would provide us with your honest take and not try to sell anything. Sorry for the tangent - back to the build!


Thanks Joe, for the vote of confidence. I have no problem to talk about it here if everybody is respectful about it and I trust you not to ridicule me, even if I am a little :coocoo:, but aren't we all who build a dedicated cinema 

So if you want I can translate my review (is good for my English ). I describe the effect the cables had on several songs and why we chose that particular song. I like to experiment with tweaks, cables, etc. and when I do a test I write a small review in my blog. It did so with the my interlinks and power cables. So if you're interested I can translate them as well.

Don't hesitate to ask me questions about my quest, I'm happy to answer them if I can :innocent:


----------



## HTip

PTAaron said:


> I hear you on that. I run a bodybuilding forum with a friend of mine - and you want to talk about drama? Unbelievable...  Luckily over there I just ban the people that can't be respectful! :T


Good for you! It's a shame that you have to spend time moderating like that, but it's sadly necessary in our time.


----------



## HTip

HTip said:


> But first I had to check something... onder:


Remember this post? 

I had to check if the screen would fit between the bass traps. I was of course hoping that it would. It meant carrying the bass traps into the room and carefully place the screen in between.









Sadly it didn't and at that time I was very happy that we had chosen a click board solution with flexible wooden frame. We can remove the wall panels quite easily.























I have no idea how these screws are called but the DIY-shop named them Jamo screws. It has 2 threads separated by a smooth space. The link is in Dutch, but you don't need the text, the pictures tell the story 
http://www.wurth.nl/assy/assy/pdf/07-jamo-jamo-plus.pdf

I can vary the distance of the slats with a turn of the screw. Therefor it was relatively easy to move the wall back a little bit.
















As you see can I'm not very meticulous 

Putting the panels back. It's just like laminate but for walls.
















It fits :yay:









Now I could start with the assembly of the bass traps...


----------



## PTAaron

I'm sure you will get to this, but it looks like the bass traps will stick out past the screen - did you have to do anything for light reflections?


----------



## HTip

PTAaron said:


> I'm sure you will get to this, but it looks like the bass traps will stick out past the screen - did you have to do anything for light reflections?


I indeed will get to this, but if you look at my 3D-design you can see that the front of the bass traps and the screen should align. In fact it was not easy, especially because of the width of the screen but I found a solution to accomplish it.


----------



## ALMFamily

I would be more than appreciative of any reviews of cabling you could provide - I really like hearing people's experiences so I can make a more informed choice for my own space.

And, what a great concept on the wall build - it really maintained good flexibility for adjustments. I keep seeing corner bass traps - this is the first I have seen of something that is flat. Was there a noticeable improvement in acoustics?


----------



## HTip

To get the very heavy bass traps in position I needed a very stable and rigid construction without disrupting the panel absorber. I came up with sort of tables with legs at strange places. The slats are reused material of the previous absorber construction.









Looking if the table would suffice with all the weight leaning on it. The aluminium rail in front is to hold the mineral wool plates in place.
















Like I previously said, the tolerance in distance of the slats was very small. So we dedided to fix the slats.









The problem with a Helmholtz resonator is the need for the construction to be air tight. So all gaps and joints have to be filled in some way. I used mineral wool and silicone glue to accomplish that.









Second issue is that right behind the slats a layer of insulation needs to be placed. Normally you use mineral or glass wool, but you have to wrap in melton which is not easy. So we used 50mm Akoterm in black of course 
















The bass traps got a top plate to seal them
















Stage 1 complete









Onto stage 2 and the answer to Aaron's question...


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> I would be more than appreciative of any reviews of cabling you could provide - I really like hearing people's experiences so I can make a more informed choice for my own space.


If you put it this way how can I refuse?  It will take some time for me to translate, but keep an eye out in this thread 



> And, what a great concept on the wall build - it really maintained good flexibility for adjustments.


Thanks Joe! It was recommended to us by the local DIY-shop. We're very greatful for that. It was a little bit more expensive, but it was so much easier to build. No sanding, sealing, painting, etc. Just the frame which had to be perfectly level and attach the panels.



> I keep seeing corner bass traps - this is the first I have seen of something that is flat. Was there a noticeable improvement in acoustics?


The advantage of a corner trap is the ability to handle more than 1 frequency. This is because of the variation in depth which determines the handled frequency. The higher the depth the lower the frequency. The efficiency of the trap is determined by volume. The higher the volume the higher the efficiency. You can imagine that de outsides of a corner trap have little depth and volume so are less efficient. Manufacturers like Auralex solve that by making the material more dense, which make it more expensive.

A flat bass trap can be meticulously tuned to only 1 frequency and because of the even depth and volume handle that very efficiently. The problem is that you can handle only one frequency so you need more measures to insure a large range. That's where my panel absorbers come into play and of course the ceiling.

And to answer your last question, there was a significant improvement in acoustics. I will post the last RT60-measurement when the wall is finished, so you can see the difference.


----------



## ALMFamily

Thanks much - I will keep on following - as if I could really stop now! :bigsmile:


----------



## therick83

Sick build...might have to do something half this in the future.


----------



## HTip

therick83 said:


> Sick build...might have to do something half this in the future.


I guess "sick" is a compliment, so thanks for that. If you get the chance don't hesitate and go for it. Having a dedicated room where you can retreat and be totally cut off from the world is heavenly.

One time we had watched a movie and when we came upstairs it was terrible weather with heavy storm and rain. Garden furniture lay in the garden and it was soaking wet. We didn't have a clue when we were in the basement


----------



## HTip

PTAaron said:


> I'm sure you will get to this, but it looks like the bass traps will stick out past the screen - did you have to do anything for light reflections?


Part of the design of the front wall was that both the screen frame and the front of the bass traps were aligned. This was in fact crucial for the absorbers to function as calculated.

First we build a frame. The long slat where the screen would rest on was a big challenge. The slat had to be exactly the same thickness as the bass trap stand and should be in one piece. The local woodshop made it for me out of a large beam that was considered scrap from another build. So I got that almost for free.









The top absorber had to be only 10cm deep. So I had to think of something to get the wall closer to the absorber. In the picture my third hand is visible  The bottom absorber is, apart from the membrane, ready.









I filled up the frame with mineral wool.









And covered up it up with scrap MDF board.





















































Now all that was left was the assembly of the 3 panel absorbers behind the screen...


----------



## PTAaron

Very cool!


----------



## HTip

Thanks Aaron :T

The final assembly of the panel absorbers started with the nasty job of mineral wool again. As you probably know by now, a gap between the front plate (membrane) and the mineral wool is necessary.

















































Applying the membranes. They can only be fastened at the sides, so they can move freely.


































The inky black material above the bass traps is again Akotherm to close the gap between the ceiling and the bass trap.


----------



## HTip

With a little help I returned the cove for the curtains






















All that was left to do was to paint the visible parts of the absorbers. I chose not to paint the boards behind the screen.









The Stewart screen back in place. It fits perfectly :T
















And with the curtains closed
















Ready for the speakers to return









Everything back in place.
















Ready for a big upgrade...


----------



## HTip

During the build of the bass traps I got the chance to become the owner of a Velodyne Digital Drive Series. Because the new version would be introduced soon (it was the summer of 2010 and actually it was almost a year later ) the "old" DD-subs were very nicely priced.

I asked the distributer/dealer is the delivery could be postponed until I was finished with the last acoustic adjustments and that was no problem and a motivation for me to finish the build as soon as possible. So, I sold my SVS and Velodyne SMS and ordered the Velodyne DD18, which as you might figure is still the sub I have today :T 

Although the dealer is 250km away he would bring it and install it properly with the Velodyne MIC-5 kit. This was all included in the purchase, so I was very anxious for the day to finally arrive. The box was so big that it couldn't go through the door 









So we carefully unpacked the sub and carried it inside where it was placed on an Auralex Great Gramma. The normal Gramma is lying next to it. You can see the difference in size.









Installation underway. One preset is for only the front row occupied. And another when the back row is also occupied.



























The DD18 is a big sub, but somehow blends in better than the big SVS cylinder.


















The actual build was finished at that moment. But was that also the case for the equipment? I guess you can answer this question


----------



## PTAaron

Looks great. That Velodyne system looks confusing!


----------



## PTAaron

Is that silver stand under your THX sign one of the "now playing" DVD stands? 
Where did you find that one? I've been looking at the ones they sell at StargateCinema - but I'm not sure they are quite what I'm looking for.


----------



## Prof.

Very nice sub HTip..:T I don't think I would want to be sitting in that front right chair though!! :yikes:


----------



## HTip

PTAaron said:


> Looks great. That Velodyne system looks confusing!


Thanks Aaron. The Velodyne system is great for custom installing but not easy to master if you haven't done it before. But when you do the result is super. Perfect integration of the sub in the overall sound stage.


----------



## HTip

PTAaron said:


> Is that silver stand under your THX sign one of the "now playing" DVD stands?
> Where did you find that one? I've been looking at the ones they sell at StargateCinema - but I'm not sure they are quite what I'm looking for.


That's correct. I have two, they're made of stainless steel and where custom made by a member of the Dutch HTforum. He organised a power buy for members and so I got two stands. One with "Now Playing" which I use for BD, DVD and DVD-A and another with "Now Listening" for CD, SACD, etc.


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> Very nice sub HTip..:T I don't think I would want to be sitting in that front right chair though!! :yikes:


Thanks Prof :T Actually it's my place and it's almost the best place in the room. My wife's seat is slightly better in bass response. The worst seat in the room is the back right chair 

By the way the sub can be very subtle but also :hsd:


----------



## PTAaron

HTip said:


> That's correct. I have two, they're made of stainless steel and where custom made by a member of the Dutch HTforum. He organised a power buy for members and so I got two stands. One with "Now Playing" which I use for BD, DVD and DVD-A and another with "Now Listening" for CD, SACD, etc.


That is awesome. Would you mind posting up a clearer picture of it?


----------



## HTip

PTAaron said:


> That is awesome. Would you mind posting up a clearer picture of it?


Sure, no problem. I will see if I can take pictures for you to be able to reconstruct them.


----------



## PTAaron

HTip said:


> Sure, no problem. I will see if I can take pictures for you to be able to reconstruct them.


Thanks! I have a friend that does metal working (as an artist) and has access to laser cutters and things - so maybe I could give her a "project" to work on


----------



## ALMFamily

So, if you don't mind me asking, what exactly do they display? Is it set-up to display whatever is currently playing?


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> So, if you don't mind me asking, what exactly do they display? Is it set-up to display whatever is currently playing?


Sure I don't mind 

They are just stands where I place the case of the BD, DVD, CD, etc. on which is being played at that moment. Actually they are quite interactive :heehee:

Here the stand is empty









Here Iron Man is in the player









Here it is Monsters Inc 









Etc, etc...


----------



## therick83

That is cool. sick=super cool btw. haha. Sorry, I'm a child of the 80's, we don't use groovy or shiznizzel, sick was kind of a transitioning term. Love the room, but I'm too lazy for the traditional movie seats, although they look AWESOME. Is it better for sound reproduction when the speakers are out front of the screen like that, seems like it might be distracting...


----------



## HTip

therick83 said:


> That is cool. sick=super cool btw. haha. Sorry, I'm a child of the 80's, we don't use groovy or shiznizzel, sick was kind of a transitioning term


I thought as much. I'm a little older lddude: and probably mist that part in my education 



> Love the room, but I'm too lazy for the traditional movie seats, although they look AWESOME.


Thanks! The chairs are actually quite comfortable and if we want to can place some benches to place our feet on 



> Is it better for sound reproduction when the speakers are out front of the screen like that, seems like it might be distracting...


I used the ITU 5.1 guideline with placing the speakers. Due to the limitations of the room the position was a bit of a compromise. The speakers are a little bit (really not much) further apart at the moment and the front sound stage sounds a lot better.

This is how I planned the positioning









FL and FR are on the edge. Ideal is 25-35° (30° is the guideline). That's the case for SL and SR also. Ideal is 110-120° (110° is the guideline).

When playing a movie the speakers are not in view. Even the gloss finish is not a problem. Sometimes with subtitles the center is a bit of a problem, but not much.


----------



## raZorTT

Fantastic work HTip. I only just stumbled onto your thread! :T :T :T

I'm looking at putting up a curtain in my HT (it'll happen one day!) and like the cove you have made :T

Cheers,
Simon


----------



## HTip

raZorTT said:


> Fantastic work HTip. I only just stumbled onto your thread! :T :T :T
> 
> I'm looking at putting up a curtain in my HT (it'll happen one day!) and like the cove you have made :T
> 
> Cheers,
> Simon


Thanks for the compliment Simon! :T

You're welcome to "steal" my idea. The cove is pretty heavy and made up out of two pieces 22mm MDF and is mounted directly to the ceiling. If you would like more info please let me know.

Cheers,
Philip


----------



## HTip

Now all acoustic measures where realised it was time for the final measurement. It was performed during a Meet & Greet, which I organise regularly with some HT enthousiasts from Holland and Belgium. The specialist had only heard 100dB pink noise :yikes: in the room and never music or movies. So it was nice to see him enjoying himself. But before playing work had to be done  He thought it was a good idea to perform the measurement in an empty room with just him and later on with 5 more people, to see what the effect was of people in the room, whom as you might know absorb quite a lot of energy.










The result is best judged with both previous measurements. So in chronological order...
















The final result









I was pretty happy with the "final" result and he congratulated me with this result but also had some remarks concerning the bass response in the low regions. Also the reverb times were sometimes a bit too low. So he suggested a last measure which was the RPG Modex Broadband, but at that time we decided we would first listen and enjoy the sound and postponed the decision to implement the RPG module and other adjustments.


----------



## HTip

After the last measurement we got the opportunity to test a RPG Modex Broadband in our HT. We decided to give it a try, knowing that the effect would be undoubtful positive and would require another investment.

It was quite an event to get that 100lbs construction into the room.

Picture's will follow...


----------



## HTip

Pictures speak louder than words... 

First you need a large car (according to European standards )









The trap standing in the room. It consist of 2 parts, the metal shell and the absorber plate.


















Needless to say the bass response was so much better, especially in the back row. And the trap was just standing in the room. Price was right too, so you can guess what happened...










It was not easy, but eventually mounting was succesful









Everything back in place









The only problem was the color of the RPG. But since it is behind us we don't see it anyway. Maybe in the future we will give it another color. By the way, if you look real close there's something real significant missing in front of the RPG


----------



## Muser

HTip:
Great work. :clap: Thanks for sharing your work.
Larry


----------



## PTAaron

That panel is huge! Did you get some "after" measurements of the room?

Is the projector being replaced next?


----------



## HTip

Muser said:


> HTip:
> Great work. :clap: Thanks for sharing your work.
> Larry


Thanks Larry :T



PTAaron said:


> That panel is huge! Did you get some "after" measurements of the room?


It is! It's 150cm heigh and 100cm wide, so it's not something you pick up easily  

I didn't know how to do measurements myself, but I had some friends set me up with REW. I have to look for the graphs, but I will post them here.



> Is the projector being replaced next?


Sharp eye! :TT I sold the JVC DLA-HD1/RS1 and bought the ex-demo projector of the same dealer who sold me the SMS, Stewart and Velodyne. So I got a great price with full warranty and custom made mounting support. I couldn't believe we would get the JVC DLA-HD950/RS25 :sn: And you only live once, so you better do a good job 

But I had to wait until the new JVC's were delivered and that took a while, but it was worth the wait. And since I was :spend: anyway and another "giveaway" was in the making I first went for something else...


----------



## Prof.

Even at that size, that's a lot of weight for an acoustic panel!! How thick is the metal plate? Is it an aluminum construction?


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> Even at that size, that's a lot of weight for an acoustic panel!! How thick is the metal plate? Is it an aluminum construction?


The housing is metal and only a few mm thick. Most weight is in the absorber, which consists of a 10cm thick very dense foam covered with a thick metal plate. That last one is the heaviest.

In this PDF you can see how it works. My version is newer and has more and much smaller holes and therefore has a greater frequency efficiency of 35-5000Hz.


----------



## Prof.

The RPG bass traps would appear to be very efficient, particularly in the lower register..However, all the photos I've seen show them mounted on flat walls!..
They would appear to be ideal as corner bass traps, except for their size..They would be too wide for many corner installations..

With them mounted flat on the wall and up against a corner, it seems they are only absorbing in one axial mode while the near adjacent wall has virtually no sound absorption..
They obviously would work very well as acoustic wall panels, but I don't see how they would absorb corner bass resonances..:scratch:
Am I missing something?


----------



## HTip

Ideally I had to place 2 modules on the back wall. One on the far left and one on the far right. I didn't have room for that so we placed only one in the middle instead. According to the specialist the absorbers at the front did most of the work so the RPG was only for the really low frequencies.

At places outside of the 5 seats the bass is terrible, so that might be caused by the absence of corner traps. But when you sit on one of the 5 seats it's fine. We have programmed two presets in the Velodyne, one for only the front row occupied and one for someone sitting in the back row. If you sit in the back row and the Velodyne is set for the front row it's not nice either


----------



## Prof.

HTip said:


> Ideally I had to place 2 modules on the back wall. One on the far left and one on the far right. I didn't have room for that so we placed only one in the middle instead.


That would also be very expensive to follow their recommendations! 



> At places outside of the 5 seats the bass is terrible, so that might be caused by the absence of corner traps. But when you sit on one of the 5 seats it's fine. We have programmed two presets in the Velodyne, one for only the front row occupied and one for someone sitting in the back row. If you sit in the back row and the Velodyne is set for the front row it's not nice either


If you could incorporate basic front corner traps somehow, that would probably improve things considerably..


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> That would also be very expensive to follow their recommendations!


You have no idea  But seriously, it would have never sounded this great without them :T



> If you could incorporate basic front corner traps somehow, that would probably improve things considerably..


Because of the curtains I have no room for corner traps anymore. But it already sounds great. I can turn up the volume quite high without any distortion whatsoever.

Too bad I can't let you hear how it sounds over the internet and you're a little bit too far away


----------



## Prof.

HTip said:


> Too bad I can't let you hear how it sounds over the internet and you're a little bit too far away


Yeah..That's one of the disappointing things with the forum! You see all these really nice theatres, but you never get to hear them..living on the other side of the world!


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> Yeah..That's one of the disappointing things with the forum! You see all these really nice theatres, but you never get to hear them..living on the other side of the world!


So true! Nice thing though is to get to know people from all over the world :T


----------



## HTip

HTip said:


> And since I was :spend: anyway and another "giveaway" was in the making I first went for something else...


I got the chance to get a Oppo BDP-83SE modified by The Upgrade Company for "a steal". I had to drive 3 hours one way to get there, but it was definately worth it. It replaced both my Marantz DV9600 and Panasonic BDP-35

On top of the rack my Pana. But not for long  The Oppo already took the place of the Marantz.









A little bit closer









New layout of the rack









In the rack are 3 items that I didn't properly introduce 
- PS Audio Powerplant Premier
- Nanotec Systems Nespa #1
- Sennheiser HD600

Each is great in their own way :T


----------



## jfrances

Great job! You have given me a lot of ideas.


----------



## HTip

jfrances said:


> Great job! You have given me a lot of ideas.


Thanks for the compliment! :T

I noticed it's been a while since I was online here :rubeyes:

There are some stages in the build left that I am yet to post here. And some new plans, but I will come to that. I will take a look where I left of and continue my posting...


----------



## ALMFamily

Looking forward to the continuation of your thread Philip! :T


----------



## erwinbel

Impressive! I am very much interested in acoustics myself but in never saw bass trapping been done so scientificaly in a real build such as you did. Cool room. Black rules!

My build is with a whole house et all, so I will take even longer than 3 years (more like 6)...

Since I am in BE also, I will probably give Toine from SoundScapeS a call sooner or later. Seems like he is the daddy. 

If you allow me two things as a negative: 

1/ Am I correct that you only use one sub? The Harman Kardon white papers clearly show two is far better and four as good as it gets. Also see Audioholics, Lars Mette from Area DVD etc. And obviously HTShack is the place to be for all subwoofer nuts! Build one extra yourself...

2/ Have you seen what TUC actually does to the devices? Go to AVS and do a search but be warned, it's not pretty! I have a BDP83SE myself, which I won right here at HTShack! I had it sent to NuForce for their treatment in 2ch mode (CD's) before shipping it to me. So I know how good this thing is. CineMike also seems to do good things. 

Must meet sometime!

Salukes!


----------



## NBPk402

ALMFamily said:


> So fun seeing the end product 1st, and then seeing it come together! :T
> 
> Were the diffusers DIY or purchased? Trying to decide if I should take a crack at doing them myself - yours look very impressive.


I built some years ago... It was quite a bit of work but the results were def worth it, especially when you price them out purchased.


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> Looking forward to the continuation of your thread Philip! :T


I will try to update the process this week. Thanks for your patience, Joe


----------



## HTip

erwinbel said:


> Impressive! I am very much interested in acoustics myself but in never saw bass trapping been done so scientificaly in a real build such as you did. Cool room. Black rules!
> 
> My build is with a whole house et all, so I will take even longer than 3 years (more like 6)...
> 
> Since I am in BE also, I will probably give Toine from SoundScapeS a call sooner or later. Seems like he is the daddy.


Thanks Erwin! Nice to know you're from Belgium too. Toine has done some impressive work so you will definately not be disappointed if you let him help you. The sooner you include him in your plans the better he can help you btw. If you are still able to change the ratios of the room you can prevent standing waves from occuring.



> If you allow me two things as a negative:
> 
> 1/ Am I correct that you only use one sub? The Harman Kardon white papers clearly show two is far better and four as good as it gets. Also see Audioholics, Lars Mette from Area DVD etc. And obviously HTShack is the place to be for all subwoofer nuts! Build one extra yourself...
> 
> 2/ Have you seen what TUC actually does to the devices? Go to AVS and do a search but be warned, it's not pretty! I have a BDP83SE myself, which I won right here at HTShack! I had it sent to NuForce for their treatment in 2ch mode (CD's) before shipping it to me. So I know how good this thing is. CineMike also seems to do good things.


1/ Indeed I use only one sub. I'm aware that 2/4 or even 8 :gulp: subs are better, but I only have room for one, but it is very well integrated in the sound. I don't think I have the capabilities for building my own sub. Respect for all that can and do!

2/ I have an acquintance who made pictures from inside the Oppo. It certainly doesn't look pretty, but somehow my Oppo sounds great. I read the threads on AVS a little late so in hind sight I would probably not have chosen a TUC modified Oppo. Moreover my last experience with TUC was not a good one. I'm going to confront Dave with what I found out in the past months, but that is something for later 



> Must meet sometime!
> 
> Salukes!


That could take some time, but if you're patient who knows... 

Salukes!


----------



## erwinbel

HTip said:


> I don't think I have the capabilities for building my own sub.


Don't be modest, we're not among other Belgians here.:boxer: (note to others: self-relativism is our national disease)
Building a sub with help from the HTShack friends is easy compared to what you already completed. 

And it don't need to be a cubic box, you can change the shape to fit in your space. But liters rule ofcourse.


----------



## ALMFamily

I agree with Erwin Philip - I think you are selling yourself short. I plan on tackling one and if I can do it, you sure can!


----------



## erwinbel

Isn't there a free spot next to the entrance?:devil:


----------



## HTip

Thanks for the vote of confidence guys :T It could be that you're both right that if I take the time I can build my own sub, but at the moment that is not where my interests lie. And by the way I have a great sub which is more than sufficient to the job :hsd: Next to the entrance is a possibility but then I don't have room to move 

Now for something completely different. We are looking into the possibility of expanding our basement to accomodate a garage for our second car. And if all goes well we need to do some work in the room in front of the HT to be able to access the garage from the inside. I'm fiddling around with Sketchup to see how it's all gonna look.

Present situation. For security purposes I will only show the basement 









Future situation.









Very exciting prospect :TT


----------



## erwinbel

Oké, cool, but it's not about SPL and not even about headroom (although it doesn't hurt) but about evening out the modes...

Download the 4th pdf here if you want:

http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurCompany/Innovation/Pages/WhitePapers.aspx?CategoryID=White papers

Building a carport is not a (cheaper) option, instead of a extented basement? Doesn't seem like an easy entrance for a less confident driver... My wife would never dare to park in there because of the combination of slope + curve. Then again, maybe your wife is Vanina Ickx?

BTW: I mailed Soundscapes the details of the HT. His vacation must be about over now. I very much like the look of the QRD diffusers he always seems to use. Form-Follows-Function to the max. Can't wait to build some. My bet he is going to put many on the ceiling. Yummie! 

I went to Halford site and my room ratio is 1:2.63:3.27 which is one of the "best" ones. I guess I am lucky!
http://www.acoustics.salford.ac.uk/acoustics_info/room_sizing/?content=best
The rest is up to Soundscapes..


----------



## HTip

erwinbel said:


> Oké, cool, but it's not about SPL and not even about headroom (although it doesn't hurt) but about evening out the modes...
> 
> Download the 4th pdf here if you want:
> 
> http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurCompany/Innovation/Pages/WhitePapers.aspx?CategoryID=White papers


Thanks for the link. It's very informative! Unfortunately the position of my sub is not covered. Nevertheless very thorough study.



> Building a carport is not a (cheaper) option, instead of a extented basement? Doesn't seem like an easy entrance for a less confident driver... My wife would never dare to park in there because of the combination of slope + curve. Then again, maybe your wife is Vanina Ickx?


 Carport is certainly cheaper, but not as functional as a garage. Moreover the garage is a good emergency exit from the HT. It will probably be my garage and I'm not afraid of driving down hill backwards. I've had some practice 



> BTW: I mailed Soundscapes the details of the HT. His vacation must be about over now. I very much like the look of the QRD diffusers he always seems to use. Form-Follows-Function to the max. Can't wait to build some. My bet he is going to put many on the ceiling. Yummie!
> 
> I went to Halford site and my room ratio is 1:2.63:3.27 which is one of the "best" ones. I guess I am lucky!
> http://www.acoustics.salford.ac.uk/acoustics_info/room_sizing/?content=best
> The rest is up to Soundscapes..


Certainly good conditions for creating a nice room. And with Toine you can get the most out of it. I saw you found the room of Jan in Holland. On that same forum I have my thread too. It's a little longer than mine at HTS


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> Looking forward to the continuation of your thread Philip! :T


I left of with the new JVC projector. That was the only thing missing and it was definately worth the wait. I thought the HD1/RS1 already produced a good image, but the HD950/RS25 was something else.

It's fully ISF calibrated so color reproduction is exactly as the director wanted it to be. I made some screenshots at the time, but it's very hard to photograph what we see.

Iron Man. Look at the detail in the white scarf of Jeff Bridges. 
















The Dark Knight






























The first movie we watched with our new projector was Avatar. What a picture!


----------



## ALMFamily

Wow - great picture! :T

I have thought long and hard about what the first movie I will watch will be. I decided I would do a LOTR marathon - 12 hours straight! :gulp: :bigsmile:


----------



## JBrax

ALMFamily said:


> Wow - great picture! :T
> 
> I have thought long and hard about what the first movie I will watch will be. I decided I would do a LOTR marathon - 12 hours straight! :gulp: :bigsmile:


Sounds like you better do some serious stretching before you hunker down for that sensory assault!


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> Wow - great picture! :T


Thanks Joe! :T In reality it's even better. We bought the projector ex-demo with full warranty and ISF calibration so we were lucky to get this awesome projector. If you get the chance to buy a RS25 and you don't need 3D it's the best picture you can get. In the near future it's time for the ISF-recalibration...



> I have thought long and hard about what the first movie I will watch will be. I decided I would do a LOTR marathon - 12 hours straight! :gulp: :bigsmile:


We had the same plan, but as soon as the EE we watched it in 3 nights straight. 12 hours is a really long stretch and we probably would not be able to do it. But like Jeff said, maybe with enough excercise you can pull it off


----------



## HTip

To be able to easier control all our equipment I decided to buy a new universal remote. I already had the Marantz RC5400, so I knew what I was getting into. I stayed with Marantz and got the RC9001, which is equal to the Pronto 9600.










Now I only needed to reprogram it


----------



## HTip

Programming a Pronto is not easy, but you can do almost anything with it. The home screen is our house, and when you tap the basement you get the following screen.









When you tap the curtain, it opens...









Choosing if 2 or more seats are occupied sets the presets of the Velodyne DD18

When you tap the picture beneath the center speaker you get...









Tap on the DD18 and you get full control over de sub...









Tap on the rack...









... and you can choose and control every component.

This was the first step. I wanted to fully automate the functions of watching a movie or listening to music, but that would come later.


----------



## Prof.

Looks like a very nice remote! :T
Are you able to transfer commands over to the new model from the previous one..like you can on the Harmony remotes?


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> Looks like a very nice remote! :T
> Are you able to transfer commands over to the new model from the previous one..like you can on the Harmony remotes?


Thanks Prof :T

There are several ways of programming the remote. One is to directly transfer commands from any model remote with the learn function. Another is to use Pronto Edit (Professional). In the old versions (prior to 2.0) you had to create dummy screens for holding the component controls. From version 2.0 a database was included with most equipment. You can use the default components and controls or modify to your specific need. Or even add your own components, like curtains, lighting, etc. My config cannot be created without PEP.

My current config is much more sophisticated with a lot more macros for controlling curtains, lighting, picture, etc. And activities like "watch a movie", "listen to music" and "play a game". Even my wife can easily control the total set when she wants to watch a movie with her girlfriends, so I don't need to be in the room


----------



## Prof.

That's one of the things I don't like about my Harmony remote..I can have any number of macros, but I'm limited to 5 sequences in each macro command! :thumbsdown:
I have three separate lighting sequences which only leaves two other commands!! I need seven to be fully automated!.. But then I guess your remote costs a lot more than mine did!


----------



## HTip

Because of the possibility to fully customize everything I choose the Pronto/Marantz. I don't know which Harmony you have, but I got my RC9001 for a "steal". MSRP was $1299, but I got it for less than $400, because it went out of production. The Marantz software was terrible, but the RC9001 is fully compatible with PEP 2 and that does the job!

If you like, I can make some screenshots of my current config and post them here.


----------



## Prof.

That would be interesting to see!
My Harmony One would not be in the same class as your RC9001 which obviously gives you more flexibility than I can achieve with the Harmony..


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> That would be interesting to see!


Sometime this weekend I will make the time to make screenshots... So keep an eye on my thread :wave:



> My Harmony One would not be in the same class as your RC9001 which obviously gives you more flexibility than I can achieve with the Harmony..


Flexibility comes at a price, not only in $ but also in time spent. It took me quite some time to get it the way I liked it. And still it is not finished... And with using I noticed some improvements to be made. Now I only need to find the time


----------



## HTip

HTip said:


> Sometime this weekend I will make the time to make screenshots... So keep an eye on my thread :wave:


A little overdue 

With this config I rarely use the component screens. I integrated the lighting in the macros.

The opening screen hasn't changed









After the curtain opening the main menu appears









When you want to watch a movie or concert you're guided through the process... Turn on projector, open the real curtains and turn off the lights.









Which preset in the Velodyne?









All functions for watching a movie/concert. A button with yellow text contains a macro. For the subtitle shift I still need the Oppo remote.









Shutdown the system









For listening to music the sequence of events is somewhat different, of course without picture  I will post them later on...


----------



## Prof.

That's very nifty! Is that image of the speakers and the photo of your theatre actually on the remote screen!!?



HTip said:


> When you want to watch a movie or concert you're guided through the process... Turn on projector, open the real curtains and turn off the lights.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So on this screen, are you saying that you press a button to turn on the projector..Then press another button to open the curtains..and another button to dim the lights!?
> 
> All functions for watching a movie/concert. A button with yellow text contains a macro. For the subtitle shift I still need the Oppo remote.


When you press the macro button PAUSE, what commands does this send?


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> That's very nifty! Is that image of the speakers and the photo of your theatre actually on the remote screen!!?


Thanks Prof! Pictures are indeed actual pictures of my HT. It gives the remote a personal touch but takes a bit more time  The whole config is picture driven. That way is much easier to navigate.



> When you press the macro button PAUSE, what commands does this send?


We just used it this evening  First the picture is muted (projector in hide mode), the Oppo is paused and the light sequence is executed. When I press "Verder" (Resume), the sequence is reversed.


----------



## Prof.

HTip said:


> Thanks Prof! Pictures are indeed actual pictures of my HT. It gives the remote a personal touch but takes a bit more time  The whole config is picture driven. That way is much easier to navigate.


Very nice! That makes the Harmony remote look a bit ordinary!  But then there's a BIG difference in price!




> We just used it this evening  First the picture is muted (projector in hide mode), the Oppo is paused and the light sequence is executed. When I press "Verder" (Resume), the sequence is reversed.


My PAUSE sequence operates in a similar manner, except I'm not able to put the projector in hide mode!.. I just pause the BD player..I don't have the RESUME sequence in there yet, but I will be putting it in..


----------



## ALMFamily

That looks really amazing Philip! How long did it take to program all that?


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> Very nice! That makes the Harmony remote look a bit ordinary!  But then there's a BIG difference in price!


Thanks! The big advantage of the Harmony is the easy setup and equipment database support. The big advantage of the Pronto is the flexibility and to be able to control almost anything that uses RF. And the price... oh well you only live once 



> My PAUSE sequence operates in a similar manner, except I'm not able to put the projector in hide mode!.. I just pause the BD player..I don't have the RESUME sequence in there yet, but I will be putting it in..


If the code for hide mode is not in the database you can let Logitech know. Probably they add it to their database. You can check the existence here.


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> That looks really amazing Philip! How long did it take to program all that?


Thanks Joe! I really don't know how may hours it took. The easy setup requires almost no programming, but when you want someting like me then it takes quite some time. One time I was ill and I made some good progress  By the way, it's still work in progress. When you use the config you know what you have to tweak. I.e. yesterday with watching a movie I had to change the lipsync. No problem really, but getting back to the control screen was not that easy. So a change is coming up


----------



## 95silverstallion

Ive searched both of your threads and unless im totally blind I dont see anywhere where you posted the overall dimensions of your room. Would you please let me know the dimensions?


----------



## HTip

95silverstallion said:


> Ive searched both of your threads and unless im totally blind I dont see anywhere where you posted the overall dimensions of your room. Would you please let me know the dimensions?


Good one and you're probably right. The dimensions of the bare room are 13.3' by 18.1'. Ceiling height is 7.2'. But after (acoustic) treatment the current dimensions are a bit smaller , 13' by 17'. I lowered the ceiling so al that is left is just under 7 feet. With the riser even less room (6.3 feet) is left.

So in summary 
bare room: l*w*h = 18.1 * 13.3 * 7.2 feet
finished room: l*w*h = 17 * 13 * 6.3 feet


----------



## HTip

It's all in Dutch, so if you need some translating just let me know, and dimensions are in meter (metric) but this is my design to plan where speakers, beamer and seating will be positioned.


----------



## 95silverstallion

HTip said:


> Good one and you're probably right. The dimensions of the bare room are 13.3' by 18.1'. Ceiling height is 7.2'. But after (acoustic) treatment the current dimensions are a bit smaller , 13' by 17'. I lowered the ceiling so al that is left is just under 7 feet. With the riser even less room (6.3 feet) is left.
> 
> So in summary
> bare room: l*w*h = 18.1 * 13.3 * 7.2 feet
> finished room: l*w*h = 17 * 13 * 6.3 feet


Thanks for the info. I was curious because my room will end up really close dimension wise and I was just trying to get an idea of how stuff will fit. I plan to use real theater seating as well.

My room will end up around 17' x14' with a ceiling height of just under 8'.


----------



## 95silverstallion

How far apart are you 2 rows of seating...like how far is it from the back edge of the front row to the front edge of the back row?


----------



## HTip

95silverstallion said:


> Thanks for the info. I was curious because my room will end up really close dimension wise and I was just trying to get an idea of how stuff will fit. I plan to use real theater seating as well.
> 
> My room will end up around 17' x14' with a ceiling height of just under 8'.


Those are nice dimensions. You can check what possible problems you're going to encounter when you enter those in a room mode calculator. There's a program somewhere on the web which does that. Could be that it is favourable to change the dimensions with a lowered ceiling or wall panels.

I used Visio to plan the room in detail and scale. It really helped me during the build. And Sketchup to get an idea how it looks in 3D.


----------



## HTip

95silverstallion said:


> How far apart are you 2 rows of seating...like how far is it from the back edge of the front row to the front edge of the back row?


I don't know exactly, but I will take measurements this evening and get back to you on that...


----------



## HTip

HTip said:


> I don't know exactly, but I will take measurements this evening and get back to you on that...


It took a bit longer, cause I was organizing a meet & greet. We had a great time by the way :TT

Distance between the two seating rows is about 19" which is enough to hve sufficient leg room and place to sit down.


----------



## 95silverstallion

Hey, thanks alot for the dimensions. I am tempted to go to a real theater and measure their row spacing as well. lol


----------



## HTip

95silverstallion said:


> Hey, thanks alot for the dimensions. I am tempted to go to a real theater and measure their row spacing as well. lol


 It will depend on the theater I guess. The room I have is sufficient because no one needs to pass one another. Otherwise it might be too small.


----------



## HTip

Where was I? Oh yes, the remote... 

I made a snapshot of my remote development environment. The squares are the areas you need to touch to go to the component.









I showed some of them. One I particularly like and that is the cleaning screen. Only the OK-button works and so cleaning the remote is a breeze...









And just for fun...









I can go on and on, but I guess this is about all you guys can take


----------



## PTAaron

Your remote is amazing! Definitely makes my Harmony 1100 look outdated.


----------



## Prof.

That is some remote!!!!


----------



## HTip

Thanks guys, but I'll stop with showing off my remote  If one of you ever buys a Pronto or something similar and you would like my config just let me know.

This weekend my picture gets an upgrade in the form of a ISF recalibration. It's a bit overdue, but at over 700 hours it's probably a noticable difference. I am entitled to 3 recalibrations, at 200, 600 and 1000 hours. I'm curious whether we'll notice the difference.


----------



## HTip

I just have a couple of things left which I didn't show here but I have in my current setup. I was a bit unhappy with the stereo performance from my set. After a bit of reading and advice from some Dutch audiophiles I was looking for a stereo integrated amplifier with the ability to be seemlessly integrated in the surround bubble.

A Dutch forum friend was kind enough to bring his amp to me so I was able to hear the difference in my own HT. Needless to say that it was just the addition I was looking for. A few months later I bought the same amp, albeit a special edition.

I chose the Marantz PM-15S2 Limited Edition.









Settled in between the Oppo and the receiver









And in close up









Besides looking very good (display can be dimmed, the blue lights I turned on for the picture ) the amp sounds great. The sound stage is wider, there's more air between the instruments and I can do without the sub.

It also meant I had to integrate my new toy in the remote config. That was easier said then done, but it works like a charm at the moment. I can choose between stereo and surround. In stereo I don't need the sub playing so I turn off the receiver (which turns of the sub via the trigger mechanism) and get a new screen for listening. The only downside to this amp is the inability of remotely changing the mode from integrated to power amp. But I'm not complaining, it gets me out of my chair


----------



## HTip

Something recent in between. Last week the JVC projector was recalibrated. You can only dream of these settings. Everything (gray scale, temperature, color) is spot on. I'll post the result some time this week.

I had to drive 250 miles for it, but it was well worth it :T


----------



## BD55

That, my friend, is dedication! I am thoroughly impressed with your theater (and driving 250 miles (was that one way???) to recalibrate your projector!) Awesome build! :T


----------



## Prof.

I'm glad it was worth the trip! I don't think that I would travel anything like that distance, just to get the projector calibrated!! :rolleyesno:


----------



## HTip

BD55 said:


> That, my friend, is dedication! I am thoroughly impressed with your theater (and driving 250 miles (was that one way???) to recalibrate your projector!) Awesome build! :T


Thanks for the compliments :T 250 miles gladly was round trip 



Prof. said:


> I'm glad it was worth the trip! I don't think that I would travel anything like that distance, just to get the projector calibrated!! :rolleyesno:


It was definately worth the trip. The thing is there aren't that many ISF certified professionals in Holland and Belgium. And when I bought the ex-demo JVC projector 3 recalibrations were included. One at 200, 600 and 1000 hours. The one at 200 hours was performed when the dealer delivered and installed. The one at 600 hours I forgot and was performed last weekend at 740 hours. So in about 300-400 hours I can go back.

Because of the excellent calibration possibilities of the projector (ISFccc) almost perfect values were achieved. As the result shows...

Ideally all values are situated around the center (like here )









When values (blue line) lie somewhere between 6000 and 7000K then it is good already. 6500 is ideal.









Same for colors, but then between 90 and 110%. 100% is ideal with all lines as close as possible to each other.









And with a slightly higher contrast (+2) and brightness (+1) the picture has more depth and detail. Iris is completely open, so maximum light can reach the screen. You can imagine we are very happy campers with this result. So was the calibrator by the way


----------



## Prof.

The results look excellent!! :T
So these 3 calibrations were included in the price of the projector!? That's unreal!! :unbelievable:


----------



## HTip

Prof. said:


> The results look excellent!! :T


The calibrator was not easy satisfied and went back and forth with the primaries and secundaries. With this result he was finally satisfied 



> So these 3 calibrations were included in the price of the projector!? That's unreal!! :unbelievable:


I thought it was a great deal also. Ex-demo projector with 175 hours, full 2 year waranty and 3 calibrations with 45% discount :sn:
It took quite a large chunk out of our savings :spend: but it was well worth it :T


----------



## HTip

Yesterday I had a great day with 3 enthousiastic quys. Spend a good 12 hours listening to music, viewing concerts, playing games (GT5) and watching movie scenes and a full movie to end the day on a high.

It was my 12th Meet & Greet in 3 years and still everytime it feels great to do :T


----------



## ALMFamily

Ooooo - a trip to Belgium and a chance to see your HT in person - what a vacation that would be! :T


----------



## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> Ooooo - a trip to Belgium and a chance to see your HT in person - what a vacation that would be! :T


 You would me most welcome Joe! :T I only need to know that you're coming


----------



## HTip

I have been (and still are) busy with construction work in around the house, but to all members of this great forum...










:yay:


----------



## ALMFamily

To you as well Philip!


----------



## HTip

It's been a while but I can report a change in my setup. Since last weekend I have a plate from CA Electronics underneath my Oppo. It's pretty heavy and decouples the Oppo from the rack and shields it from EMI and RFI signals from the immediate surroundings.

My first impression is a good one. It's an improvement, that's for sure. I'll post some pictures soon.


----------



## cavchameleon

VERY nice build!!! Thanks for all the details!


----------



## HTip

cavchameleon said:


> VERY nice build!!! Thanks for all the details!


Thanks for the nice compliment Ray! :T

I just saw I promised some pictures of the rack with the CA plate. This weekend I have the opportunity to check out what the effect is of more plates. I will make some pictures of that too...


----------



## HTip

I have been neglecting my topic again... :unbelievable:

The last time I talked about being able to test more plates in my setup. Well that test was more than succesful. I was able to test 4 different kind of plates, which all sounded differently. I wrote a review in Dutch and when I have some spare I will try to translate it so you all can understand it too.

In the mean time I promised some pictures...


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## HTip

No time yet to translate the review and automatic translation? Well... 

In the mean time I had to change the rack to accomodate the plates, which are about 2.5" thick. Luckily I could order other tubes. But that meant a complete rebuild of the rack 

The problem was the length of the different cables. I wanted to change as little as possible but had the following options:
1. Nothing changes. 3 pairs of interlinks need to be replaced between the SR9600 and the Oppo.
2. Oppo and PM15 change place. Color scheme stays the same. Only one pair of stereo interlinks is needed for the pre-amp configuration. Possible problem is the length of the speaker cables.
3. SR9600 and PM15 change place. Only one pair of stereo interlinks is needed. But color scheme would be silver, black, silver and black. I didn't know how that would look. Possible problem was the flexibility of the speaker cable which isn't very good 

All that was left to do was try option 2 and 3, cause option 1 was too expensive. At first that meant dismounting the rack. It turned out that option 3 was the most viable.


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## HTip

To prove that it really happened 

*Before*









*After*









I had to get used to the new color scheme, but actually it's not so bad.


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## HTip

To accomodate a plate underneath the center speaker I had to replace the stand. I found a stand which is 4" lower which is perfect. The Atacama CC-01 which I will partially fill up with Atabites.

Assembling the stand



























Atabites are very small



























Filled up with Atabites


















Ready!









For comparison


















How it looks at the moment...


















Another advantage is the center speaker will be less visible with full screen images and subtitles :T


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## ALMFamily

Every time I see new pictures of your room Philip, I am newly struck by just how great it looks......

An interesting stand - how tall is it? And, I forgot - did you build the previous CC stand yourself?


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## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> Every time I see new pictures of your room Philip, I am newly struck by just how great it looks......


Thanks Joe! :thankyou: You've got a very nice room yourself :T



> An interesting stand - how tall is it? And, I forgot - did you build the previous CC stand yourself?


The stand is available as 8", 12", 16", 20" and 24" with a choice of base plate of 16" and 20". So choice enough I would say  I chose the 8" version with 16" base plate.

My previous was from Canadian company Woodtech and was the lowest I could find at that time. Turns out it can be even lower. Atacama, btw, is UK Based.


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## HTip

I also did some cable management to decouple power and speaker cables from the concrete floor and each other. Both power and signal cables in one cable channel is not favorable. We made some DIY cable elevators.

*Front of the room*
Underneath the podium









On their way to the cable channel









Hidden behind the channel


















Opening for speaker cable
















Next up was the back of the room...


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## HTip

I have some great news (for me ) Next Saturday the Chamber of Dreams goes Diamond :T The CA Diamonds will be delivered and installed. I'm very excited already. This time I will report on my experiences with this remarkable product...


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## HTip

A bit quiet here 

The rest of my cable management project...

*Back of the room*
Cable channel in the back podium









Floor boards in place









Behind the seats 









The puzzle for the saw 









DIY cable elevator









Everything in place


















Cable channels closed and everything connected again



























Only 5 days until the plates arrive... :T


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## ALMFamily

That turned out great Philip! :T

And, have you taken some kind of photography course? The pictures look amazing..,


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## HTip

Thanks Joe! :T

I have a nice DSLR and a tripod for starters. A good objective and a flexible body helps too  I didn't follow any course but thanks to the internet and magazines learned a few things.

A tip for natural colors is to set the white balance manually. I take a blank piece of paper and photograph it. In my lighting conditions that comes down to 2700K. That way my red carpet and chairs appear not too bright or over saturated.

BTW: Thanks for featuring my theater in the April news letter. I'm honored :TT


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## euroTuned88

I love the look of your theater, it's given me a lot of inspiration for when I build my own..when I have the money :sad: I find your German ingenuity very impressive with your attention to detail. Very nice work!


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## HTip

Thanks for the compliment! :T

You don't have to be rich to build your own dedicated home theater. Including acoustic measurements and treatment it cost me around €3500. That is excluding the equipment of course, but you also need that in another living situation and you can go as extreme as you'd like 

By the way, I'm Dutch and live in Belgium


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## sga2

HTip said:


> The log that is supporting the weight has yet to be replaced by something a little more convenient


And black?

Great build. Just saw this thread today and can't put it down. You two did a wonderful job.

Regards,
sga2


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## HTip

sga2 said:


> And black?
> 
> Great build. Just saw this thread today and can't put it down. You two did a wonderful job.
> 
> Regards,
> sga2


Thanks for the compliments sga2 :T I will pass it on to my wife too 

The log is black at the moment. When you take a look at the pictures in my thread "Finished Room" in my sig you can see that I coated the log with black filt. It's still not the permanent solution but that will have to wait until the build of the foyer/bar...


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## HTip

Tomorrow is going to be an exciting day for me. My 10 CA Diamond plates will be installed. If I can (technically) manage it I will perform a measurement with de DD18 before and after.

At first I will place the plates underneath the components and the front speakers and then listen in stereo. When everything is going according to plan the rest is placed as well so I enjoy surround.

To be continued...


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## HTip

It's been a very nice weekend for me. The weather was great but even more so, the sound was great too. The CA Diamonds were/are a great success. Hard to describe how I experienced that day... One thing's for sure, this is a wonderous but at the same time wonderful addition to the Chamber of Dreams.

I made some pictures...

All plates scattered on the floor









The plates underneath the speakers at the front









Note Center









Note 7 (FR)









DD18


















The rack and rear right speaker









Note 5 (SR), PPP and PM15S2LE









SR9600 and Oppo 83









Note 5 (SL)


















I also made some pictures of different measurements with the Digital Drive software of the DD18. I need to analyse the pictures and match them with my documentation before I can post them. Keep an eye on my topic for the next update...


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## ALMFamily

Very nice Philip!

By the way, I just noticed the Argonath figures on the front stage. Where did you find those?!


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## HTip

Thanks Joe! I found The Argonaths on Dutch eBay a long time ago. They were pretty hard to find at that time. The other figures (Gollum and Minas Tirith) were in abundance 

I just looked on eBay US and you've got choice...


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## ALMFamily

HTip said:


> Thanks Joe! I found The Argonaths on Dutch eBay a long time ago. They were pretty hard to find at that time. The other figures (Gollum and Minas Tirith) were in abundance
> 
> I just looked on eBay US and you've got choice...


Thanks Philip - just found the set...


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## HTip

You're welcome, Joe.

I have sorted out my measurements. All from the same position, middle front row with the microphone from the DD18 (Behringer ECM8000) and the Digital Drive software.

*Settings (unchanged)*









*September 30th 2011*
Without the plates, Preset 5 (volume 16) 









*April 13th 2013*
3 CA Plates underneath PPP, PM and Oppo. Preset 5 (volume 16)









Preset 4 (volume 11)









+ CA Diamond underneath DD18, Preset 4 (volume 11)









CA Diamond underneath everything, Preset 4 (volume 11)









I also got the chance to, once again, test an experimental plate which, unfortunately, had to leave...
+ experimental plate underneathPPP, Preset 4 (volume 11)









CA Diamond underneath everything, Preset 5 (volume 16)









+ experimental plate underneath PPP, Preset 5 (volume 16)









The frequency chart doesn't show the more fluid the sweep sounds. In the ultra low frequencies the bass sounded muddy and the door would tremble. Now the bass was tighter and the door kept quiet. I thought that was impressive already.

This is, by the way, just the effect between 10 and 200 Hz. I have to do it again with REW, but I lack some of the equipmemt.

Finally...
The surround bubble sounded not quite as it was supposed too. So took my dB meter and a calibration DVD and yes, it was a little off. I had to raise the master volume by 0.5 dB, FR +0.5dB, SR -1.0dB and SL +0.5dB. Now it sound homogenous again and I was satisfied. Now I have to change the setup for the sub, which is something for the weekend...


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## cavchameleon

Wow! Incredible work. Thanks for sharring. Such a beautiful setup. Enjoy!


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## HTip

Thanks Ray! :T We enjoy it even more with all the plates installed :TT


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## pdfamily

What type material did you use for the "filler" of your seating platform?

How did you do the carpet work on the seating platform?

Please keep in mind that I am not technically or mechanically savvy.

Thanks...


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## HTip

We filled the podium, which is made from timber used in gardens, with glass wool. The carpet is the kind you can cover stairs with, so when you bend it the white underlining doesn't show. With glue especially for thick carpetring it is attached to the OSB-plates.

For pictures see these posts:
http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...54859-chamber-dreams-how-made.html#post496917

http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...54859-chamber-dreams-how-made.html#post506222


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## AlphaPie

This is amazing.


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## HTip

Thanks for the compliment!


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## HTip

I have bought the miniDSP UMIK-1 calibrated microphone to be able to do some measurements of my room. I'm reading a lot about REW so I can begin measuring...

Tomorrow I'm gonna test the new development of the CA Diamond-2. Maybe even do some measurements when there's enough time


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## HTip

The new D-2 plate was a great success. I don't how they did but they managed to improve the sound quite a bit. Speed combined with superior dynamics and detail. In a couple of weeks I expect to receive them.


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## ALMFamily

HTip said:


> The new D-2 plate was a great success. I don't how they did but they managed to improve the sound quite a bit. Speed combined with superior dynamics and detail. In a couple of weeks I expect to receive them.


A great theater gets even better! Great to hear Philip!


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## HTip

ALMFamily said:


> A great theater gets even better! Great to hear Philip!


Thanks Joe! In hopefully a few weeks I can show the new plates.

Something else: Last month I was interviewed by a Dutch forum called Tweakers. The fun part was that I was filmed. It's all in Dutch offcourse, but maybe you can enjoy the video :T

http://tweakers.net/video/8061/gathering-of-the-tweakers-de-thuisbioscoop-van-htip.html


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## ALMFamily

HTip said:


> Thanks Joe! In hopefully a few weeks I can show the new plates.
> 
> Something else: Last month I was interviewed by a Dutch forum called Tweakers. The fun part was that I was filmed. It's all in Dutch offcourse, but maybe you can enjoy the video :T
> 
> http://tweakers.net/video/8061/gathering-of-the-tweakers-de-thuisbioscoop-van-htip.html


Very cool - thanks for the link!


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## HTip

I have been away for a short holiday without internet. That was a strange feeling :whistling:



ALMFamily said:


> Very cool - thanks for the link!


Thanks Joe! I have received a lot of nice reactions so that feels good. And now you know how I look like


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## MVG

Hi HTip, 

i see you also have a very nice topic here a the shack! Beautiful pictures of a stunning set up! Lucky me! :yay: I've seen and heard it in real life!


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## HTip

MVG said:


> Hi HTip,
> 
> i see you also have a very nice topic here a the shack! Beautiful pictures of a stunning set up! Lucky me! :yay: I've seen and heard it in real life!


Hi Maarten,

You are a shackster too. Great to see you here! :wave:
Thanks for the compliments and yes, you are one of the few shacksters that have seen the Chamber of Dreams for real :T

Good luck with your own dedicated home theater :hsd:


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