# Kinetic River Cinema



## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Ok, so here we go. I decided to scrap my HT & Lounge build and start fresh. I will keep the plans and framing from the rest of the basement. All changes will be in the HT area. The area that I have is contingent on the design i choose. The dimensions will be 16-18' X 20-23'. Attached is the plan I have to work with. There are 3 load bearing poles with the HVAC trunk line that needs to be dealt with.

One thought that I have is to put the screen wall right in front of the poles and that would give me the area under the trunk line/between the poles to put the speakers using an AT screen.

Another obstacle is that I need to have access to the stairs and on the drawing where I have the two doors. I would like to keep access to both but I have to keep it to the door (on same side as stairs)

My soundproofing plan is moving forward as planned with Ted.

I would love and really appreciate and guidance/suggestions. I am going to draw and scan some ideas, I have had enough of my limited abilities w/ software programs.

I am really looking forward to this new plan, even if it is a ton of work. I will now have a true HT...


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I could also put the screen on the wall with the alcove and the seats backed up to the poles.









Has anyone incorporated a design where the poles are actually in the room possibly to the sides of the chairs. I have'nt found much in the way of this.

I still like the idea of using the room under the trunk line and between the poles to be the back of the stage behind the screen.

I really want to maximize my space, and have everything symmetrical so that I can do columns and/or sconces. 

I am also going to do a star ceiling DIY of course to keep costs down.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)




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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

this was the first design I thought of when I decided to go with the dedicated HT and not the open floor plan. I know it is chicken scratch, sorry. 

With this plan the bottom of the stairs would have a small hallway going left and right, this would insure there was only one door leading into the HT.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

The room would be 18ft to the screen wall, 20-22ft to the back of the room (under the HVAC) where the LCR will be. Width would be about 16.5'. This would be more than enough for two rows of three with a riser, steps on both sides.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Does anyone have any suggestions for the size of the star ceiling, I am going to run soffits around the perimeter of the room but would like to have an idea on what size to make them.

My ceiling is pretty decent at 8'7".

Also, I now have two registers servicing the room, straight 10 ft runs right off of the main trunk line. I believe that two will be enough but I do not have a return. Is the purpose of the "dead vent" for the return?


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## bpape (Sep 14, 2006)

I think the beam and poles would be best up front if at all possible. It will pull the screen wall out quite a bit but makes the seating area better IMO. Don't go too far with the soffits - just enough to run what you need to around the room. Maybe leave 1' around the perimeter to the starfield to also allow for some crown mold and uplighting around the perimeter.

Bryan


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Bpape-

I am going with that. I will still have around 16ft from screen to back of room. I just want to make the soffit big enough to hold the pj in back


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Here are the preliminary floor plans. Any and all ideas/comments are welcome.

This is the general layout with chairs. I like the symmetry of two rows of 3. I could get 4 across and still have steps on both sides but that seems a bit crowded. Not sure on the riser height yet, will plan later. 










Here is the layout with columns. I may place the back columns at each corner and make bass traps. I enjoy wood working and am tryiing to figure out a color scheme, probably going to be black and brown(s), the cabinets will be walnut. I have alot of walnut in my father in-laws shop. The stage and screen wall is probably going to be trimmed out in walnut also. Still up in the air. Going with a DIY star ceiling, I am just starting to go thru some threads on folks that have done it and gather some info, soffit will have crown and up lighting. I have two AC supplies which run from the trunk line (to the left of the screen wall) to the back of the room. Dead vent in back right side as a return.









And this is the 1st lighting plan. Not sure yet how I am going to work in the soffit and the can lights up front shining on the stage. To be continued.....









Thoughts/Comments???


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## Ted White (May 4, 2009)

Have we figured out your mufflers yet?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Not yet, I was waiting to chat w/ you. Ill only have email access today. Thanks Ted


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## bpape (Sep 14, 2006)

Keep those seats as far forward as you can without getting into the 40-60% zone. 

Bryan


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## fitzwaddle (Aug 25, 2010)

What type of seating? Just asking because 5' deep riser won't be deep enough for second row to be recliners.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

fitz-

I think the second row will be a couch most likely. That is the only thing my wife asked me to incorporate into the design.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I may go with something like this so that I do not have a hallway at the bottom of the stairs



The two boxes in the adjacent room will be the equipment rack and the blue one is the deadvent. This is an updated room spec



I did not add a door as I was waiting for some guidance on where to place it. Also the seating is still up in the air. I would probably want a couch/loveseat configuration in the rear row and the reclining seats up front.

@Spaceman - The stage looks great. I love the curved look.

Thanks all for your comments. I will continue to finalize plans and post as I do. Please keep the comments coming,


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

While I am moving forward with the new plans I also started a little demo. I took the riser apart, I managed to salvage most of the treated 2x6's. I don't know if I will need them but I didnt want to just toss them. I cant convey how relieved and pleased I am with the changes. I am just glad it was not too late. The demo...........



I did save all of the fiberglass insulation, that will come in handy real soon.





Tearing this down and moving a wall is going to require that I make some modifications to my electrical runs, but nothing major. I will also have to reposition the ceiling fan in the adjacent room.



More this weekend.


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## Tonto (Jun 30, 2007)

I don't understand why you want the poles behind the screen. I can understand a space for speakers to be behind the screen & out of sight, but if this scetch is to scale, that looks like about 4 feet of space. That is a significant waste when you consider that you need about that much space behind the rear seats acoustically. I think it would be better to turn the room around, if you still want a screen wall you can have one, just doesn't need to be that deep. More sq ft in a theater is always a bonus. Let me know your thoughts as to why you like the room that way.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Tonto said:


> I don't understand why you want the poles behind the screen. I can understand a space for speakers to be behind the screen & out of sight, but if this scetch is to scale, that looks like about 4 feet of space. That is a significant waste when you consider that you need about that much space behind the rear seats acoustically. I think it would be better to turn the room around, if you still want a screen wall you can have one, just doesn't need to be that deep. More sq ft in a theater is always a bonus. Let me know your thoughts as to why you like the room that way.


Hey Tonto, thanks for chiming in. Like you said it comes down to space. If I flipped the room then the seating would be just in front of the poles, there is no logical/aesthetically pleasing way to incorporate the seats in between the poles so that leaves me with a room with 18' length. Add in that I would have to build the stage on the other side where there is no space to place the speakers behind then I would have to come out 2 - 3'. That would leave me with 15 - 16' ft from screen to back wall. That is quite a bit shorter than the plan that I have now, which would place the screen wall right in front of the poles with the speakers in between the poles. That gives me around 17'6", so I gain more length this way.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I got quite a bit done today. First I took some chestnut oak to the sawmill that I use. I may use this for my baseboard in the rest of the basement, not sure yet. 








A little demo as well....





And then a bit of cleaning. I will be framing the theater wall in the a.m.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

A good long day on the basement today. More demo, taking out all of the A/V cable runs. And I finally have an exact room dimension. HT is 19'10" x 16' x 8'8". I had to do some serious calculating to make it work but I didnt want to fall into that width and 2x the ceiling height bpape warned me about. And this gives me plenty of room for the columns on both sides of the room.

This pile got bigger and bigger.....









These are the archways I had in the original plan, I really loved the look but I just knew that I would regret not having a single dedicated room, with all of the acoustic benefits of that room









And then........









And now.....

This is the back wall of the theater, I still have to frame the right wall.









AT screen will go right in front of the poles


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

And now a question....

The two HVAC supplies are running on the outside walls of the HT....
This is the right one









and this is the left









The plan is to drop those into the soffits that will run the perimeter of the HT and run the flex duct to about the middle of the room (at the sides coming out the bottom of the soffit)

Does anyone have any suggestions/comments on how to do this.
the plan is to drop the ducts using flex into the soffits and then make the run to the middle of the midpoint in the soffit and place the register there. I was going to use flex/insulated 8" ducts and then wrap loosely with insulation and wrap with MLV. 

Thoughts?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

A question.....

What are the options of hiding the surround speakers, other than concealing inside of a column. Are there other options and what are their limitations.

This is the theater that I plan to implement, at least very similar to this and I cannot think of how to house the surrounds since the columns will be completely hardwood.


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## fitzwaddle (Aug 25, 2010)

A few options come to mind:

- in-walls behind the wall fabric (assuming it is GOM FR701, or another acoustically transparent fabric)
- hidden in the soffit, pointing down (if the ducting hidden in the soffits leaves you sufficient room to do so)
- transduction devices that turn the wall itself into a speaker - I know very little about them, there was a guy on avsforum who built his entire theater with them, don't recall how they worked out, but they were anything but low end


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Thank you


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

Are you wanting to disguise the shape and size of the surround speakers..In other words, that you don't see little speaker boxes on the walls..or do you want to completely conceal them so the walls have no protrusions?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

completely conceal them


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

In that case, your best choice would be to use in-walls behind the GOM..


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Agree with Fitz and Prof - really the best solution IMO.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Thanks, I am really trying to avoid in-walls. I may just have to make some type of compromise and use the columns to house the speakers.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

I would suggest taking a look at a few other builds - I had originally thought about doing wainscoating, but after looking at some other builds, I became much more comfortable doing columns that used GOM and putting the surrounds there.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Almf-

I agree even though I really love the wainscoting I almost have to lean towards gom fabric.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

A small change in plans, all of my beautiful DRY walnut is now going to become our living room and hallway floors! So says the wife... Now I am scrambling around to get all of the oak that I have, dried. I suppose I will end up kiln drying it if I need it sooner rather than later.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Decided that I am going to build the dead vent inside of the room, in the back corner. this will be behind the screen wall here









Does anyone have any suggestions on where to put the return in the front of the room so it is inconspicuous.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Still planning my HVAC runs..

I now think the way forward will be the two supplies in the rear of the room venting through the bottom of the soffit. I will build 2 dead vents in the front of the room behind the screen wall and the vents will be under the soffit.

A question....

I want to construct a hush box just in front of the rear soffit. Does anyone have a build that goes into detail concerning the venting inside the hush box. I have an idea but would like some more information.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Check out Moggie's build thread at AVS - he did a fantastic hush box design. Wish he would move it over here - it is a remarkable HT.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Great thread ALM, thanks.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

QUESTION..............

Lutron grahic eye - I am wiring my HT now. My question is how do I wire the graphic eye. do all of my home runs for the circuits I want to control terminate at the graphic eye or should those home runs go to my panel and then wire the graphic eye reaching back to the panel. I looked up and down on the lutron site and could not find an explanation, and I cannot read wiring diagrams to well. Thanks.


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## jgourlie (Jun 16, 2012)

I am liking the progress...can't wait to see it all done


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

fax6202 said:


> QUESTION..............
> 
> Lutron grahic eye - I am wiring my HT now. My question is how do I wire the graphic eye. do all of my home runs for the circuits I want to control terminate at the graphic eye or should those home runs go to my panel and then wire the graphic eye reaching back to the panel. I looked up and down on the lutron site and could not find an explanation, and I cannot read wiring diagrams to well. Thanks.


All of your runs get wired to the Grafik Eye - then you run one run to your breaker box.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Thanks ALM. That is what I suspected but just wanted to make sure. Surprisingly there is not a whole lot on wiring it up. At least not that I can figure out.

I picked up the rest of my oak today. I will use this for trimming out the rest of the basement, only walnut in the HT.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

fax6202 said:


> Thanks ALM. That is what I suspected but just wanted to make sure. Surprisingly there is not a whole lot on wiring it up. At least not that I can figure out.
> 
> I picked up the rest of my oak today. I will use this for trimming out the rest of the basement, only walnut in the HT.


Full disclosure - I had a sparky wire mine up. I ran all the outlets and what-not, but I had him wire the Grafik Eye and all the connections to the box. Working in the breaker box just makes me plain nervous..... :R


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I am not going to tie in the home runs to the CB panel. I am just doing all the wire runs. My cousin is an electrician and is going to wrap everything up. I just wanted to make sure that I was making the runs right, so I dont have to redo them.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

16 hours over the weekend. I actually got a lot done but it sure doesn't look like it. 

I finished up all of the electrical runs in the basement, not the HT. 
I build the last wall for the theater, now it feels more like a dedicated room, and I know it will even more when the drywall goes up in the next few weeks.


This is a shot from the back looking at the screen wall

I am going to build 2 dead vents behind the screen wall, one on each side in the corner. These two will serve as my returns.

I am also trying to finalize my star ceiling dimensions. The plan is for the soffits in the front and sides to run in 2', the rear soffit a bit more because it will also house the hush box. This will give me a star ceiling of 12x10. But nothing concrete yet. My concern is that the only size sheets of MDF I can find are 4x8 and 4x10. I would really like to avoid a bunch of seams up there, but we'll see.

And Lastly....I HAVE got to find a better home for my tools. I dont want to run up in the garage every time I need something, but this is getting ridiculous


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Great progress! :T I remember feeling the exact same way when I had the walls studded out - it really felt like a room for the first time. And, you are spot on - when the drywall is up, you can really feel the room a whole lot more.

I have to remind myself how lucky I am that my workshop is in the basement as well - right outside the HT door. 

As far as the star ceiling, are you planning to cover the panels with cloth / felt?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Going with cloth and the FOSI illuminator. I just ordered one a few days ago. I have looked at so many builds with star ceilings and the most realistic ones are FOSI setups IMO. I dont want anything super bright but I want something that looks very realistic. And they have a drill template which will save a ton of time.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

A drill template - that sounds grand. I think I will have to check them out - I know Moggie used the FOSI as well. Do you know how big the "light box" is?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I'll have to look it up, let me see if I can find it. I do know that it will fit in a soffit without a hitch


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Got a few things done tonight. Installed my sub panel


And the UPS man brought me my drywall assistant


Hope to start dry walling in the next two weeks!


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I got a bit done today. I framed my equipment closet which sits right outside the theater. 



Nothing fancy, I just didnt want a block closet


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

I see a vent up there - is that a feed for cooling that closet?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

That vent is actually going to drop and take a 90 degree turn to the left into the HT's rear soffit. It will be one of the two supplies for the HT. But I still have to build the joist muffler and replace with Acoustic flex duct.

As far as the equip closet. I will put an inline fan in the top of the closet to vent the air into the adjacent room. The rack will have cooling fans within.

As far as HT returns. I am building 2 dead vents, one each in the front two corners of the room behind the screen wall. Havent decided yet whether to vent from there or run those in the two side soffits and vent about half way down. Still deciding, but I wil have 2 supplies, and 2 returns for the room which is 19'10" x 16 x 8'8"


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

fax6202 said:


> That vent is actually going to drop and take a 90 degree turn to the left into the HT's rear soffit. It will be one of the two supplies for the HT. But I still have to build the joist muffler and replace with Acoustic flex duct.
> 
> As far as the equip closet. I will put an inline fan in the top of the closet to vent the air into the adjacent room. The rack will have cooling fans within.
> 
> As far as HT returns. I am building 2 dead vents, one each in the front two corners of the room behind the screen wall. Havent decided yet whether to vent from there or run those in the two side soffits and vent about half way down. Still deciding, but I wil have 2 supplies, and 2 returns for the room which is 19'10" x 16 x 8'8"


Excellent! I also did an in-line fan to vent to an adjacent room - works extremely well. And, I was able to hide the return vent for the closet pretty well so it was not overly visible.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Question.....

Does anyone have any recommendations on an In-Line exhaust fan. I need one to vent my hush box. Fan will reside outside the room inside the equipment closet. I would also like to get a fan that could possibly vent both the hush box and the equip room, versus having two. 

Thoughts..........


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Here is the fan I am using to vent my equipment closet:

In-line fan

It cannot be heard from about 5 feet away and the air draw is pretty significant. As far as one that could do both areas, hopefully someone else has some experience with something like that.......


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I was actually checking that fan out not to long ago. I might just go with that. Exhaust is a given for the hush box, but what about any type of supply. Is that being built into the boxes or are they just vented out.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

I am sure they are vented in some fashion, but I have not done much research that way as of yet - I would check Moggie's design to see what he did........


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

will do, thanks


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Tonight's issue I had to find a solution for. The two load bearing columns under the I-Beam in this picture


Now I could have just framed them and tied them into the soffit above, but i wanted to do a bit more. I didnt want any part of the framing to come in contact with the columns. I started by just putting up some blocking above and to the sides of the columns


I used angle brackets to attach the 2 2x4's to the blocking. 


This enabled me to just let them hang from the soffit with about 1/8 gap at the bottom.


I then used 3/4 OSB to attach each side



I stuffed the cavity with fiberglass insulation, but made sure not to compact it.


And just sealed it up


This may all have been a bit of overkill, but I am not taking any chances with acoustics. With the column framing just hanging from the soffit there is no contact with the column itself. The insulation inside should keep it from making contact. Next I will hit the seams with some acoustic calk and also around the edges at the bottom.

And then it will get the full treatment of channel, OSB, DD, GG along with the rest of the room.


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## barbarajon (Jun 25, 2012)

fax6202 said:


> Here are the preliminary floor plans. Any and all ideas/comments are welcome.
> 
> This is the general layout with chairs. I like the symmetry of two rows of 3. I could get 4 across and still have steps on both sides but that seems a bit crowded. Not sure on the riser height yet, will plan later.
> 
> ...


You have done a nice job of having pictorial representation.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Well this weekend sucked. I had planned to get a lot done. NOPE. I spent almost all day Friday cleaning up, which was way overdue. I have to say that I became a bit more motivated with a clean area to work from. Yesterday I spent half the day at the sawmill looking for the Amish guy who hooks me up with hardwood, At least I did pick up some really good walnut, but its still green. Now to a question......

I am trying to figure out how to make my transition from the hvac trunk line into the theater. The plan was to run it down the joist and drop it down 12 inches at 90 deg and through the wall into a soffit. Not exactly sure how I am going to go about it. I dont want to much resistance from having turns and a long run, and end up getting too little airflow. Here are some pics

The duct will run the length of the joist and then turn 90 at some point


Here is another picture with the equip closet on the right. One plan was to run down the joist until it got to the closet and then turn 90. The only issue with that is, i will have an inline fan in there already to vent the hush box.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

When I switched my HVAC lines over to flex to reduce sound transmission, I did not notice any significant reduction in air supply. There were two lines I replaced and both were in the neighborhood of 20 feet. One of them takes 2 90 degree turns and feeds my kitchen.

I would suggest doing the same - using flex duct will help reduce any sound transmission to other rooms as well as gives you some ability to turn it to meet your needs.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Thanks ALM, thats a relief. I was really concerned about the length of the runs. The soundproofing I have down, but I was afraid of losing air flow. And you are not using an in-line fan, right, just the 20ft duct run and 2 90's. good enough


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Correct - no in-line booster fan.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

If anyones interested................

Just got off the phone with the Nailor Rep. I am trying to figure out which diffuser to use for my supplies. After pouring over an Air flow calculator and referencing a post by DE, its determined that I need a diffuser size that gives me an FPM(ft per minute) of 200 - 250. I found that a diffuser that is rated for 384 CFM(cubic ft per minute) will turn out a FPM of 240. The size is 48" x 4". Anyone that has experience with this, please chime in if I am off.

Bottom line, I need a 48" x 4" diffuser. Had the hardest time finding one for sale online, so I called a distributor and he's sending me a quote shortly. Will post when I get that email.

FWIW I was told this diffuser has an NC of 17.


NOW.....I am going to need a transition from my duct to the diffuser. I doubt Lowes has a 6" round to 48"x4" transition, so my first thought was i need to get one fabricated.

If anyone has done this before, please drop a post on how. I may have to go with insulated rectangular duct. Not sure yet.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

2 things I figure out tonight on my maiden voyage with GG. 1. That stuff is sticky. And 2. DD/ GG treatment in between the joists is no fun at all.....


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Oh boy, I remember when I did it. I was so happy when I finished that part!

I do not know if we talked about this before, but have you considered switching your rigid duct in between the joists over to flex duct? It would reduce your potential for sound transmission as well as allow you to do drywall in that joist run.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I have on one side, just haven't got to that one. To answer your question, yes I am changing out the duct runs that directly service the theater. The runs that do not service the theater I am wrapping in MLV with some light insulation around it. But I really want to get this over for sure.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Next on the list, backer boxes for in-wall speakers. The idea that I have floating around is to make the boxes as big as I can so that I will leave myself open to upgrade/change speakers in the future. I was wondering if any have done this specifically and want to weigh in. I have to keep the box decoupled from the framing but I also want to have some type of cross bracing or blocking within the box to house the speakers I am getting, which are the Klipsch R-5502-WII. I am really trying to think on this one as it is not something i can easily go back and change after the fact


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

also looking at the Triad surround bronze speakers. Still on the fence


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Speaker Backer Box 1 is complete. Only 3 more to go for surrounds and 1 deep box for the second sub.

All I can say is....they are easily 35lbs each















If anyone is interested.....

Each side is 3 layers of .50" MDF. Green Glue between each layers. Screwed and Glued together, and Green Glue acoustic calk on the seams.

The reason I made them so big was to future proof for different types of speakers. I am 99% sure that I am going with the Triad silver or bronze surrounds. They are about 13" x 13". Most other are a bit taller. I just wanted to leave my options open.

Why has the posting in this forum slowed to a crawl?????


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Summer - we are all bogged down with outdoor work - at least us folks north of the equator that is! :bigsmile:


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## fitzwaddle (Aug 25, 2010)

+ some folks got smacked pretty good by the recent heatwave, so maybe didn't feel like working on their builds, so nothing to post?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Now to the speaker backer boxes. Using IB3 clips to decouple the boxes from the framing cavity in the wall









Due to the weight of these boxes, which are well over 45lbs., I decided to use 3 clips for both the top and bottom and one clip each for the sides to stabilize. 

First I measured the top side of the box + 3/4" on each side of the 2x6. The 3/4" on each side will provide enough of a gap so that the side IB3 clips will fit.









I decided to go with one clip on the back, and one each on the sides of the 2x6. To create more stability I attached the side clips a little to the front to form a type of triangle pattern.

I marked out the exact locations of the clips









Then attached the clips in a triangle pattern









Fastened the 2x6 to the top of the backer box

















Again, there was a 3/4" gap on each side of the box so that the side clips could be attached. The 3/4" gap was just enough to fit the IB3 red gasket into. In this picture you can see all 4 sides are attached. The sides have one clip. The top and bottom have three clips, the one visible on the back and one each on the sides.









For position of the side surrounds I want the front row to be the money seats so I placed the boxes about 5 degrees back from the listeners head position of each side wall. I have the center of the backer box right at 6.5'. To ensure all boxes are exactly the same height all around the room I used my laser level

















From this picture you can see that all sides are completely decoupled from the 2x6 framing









And the finished box









The rational behind the depth of the box is this; Each box is 7" deep. I have a 2" gap from the rigid foam to the 2x wall. So that 2" + 3.5" (2x4) = 5.5". That leaves 1.5". Clips, channel, and DD is 1 5/8", That gives me within 1/8" of the finished wall. That small seam will be sealed with acoustic caulk. Acoustic treatments will be 2", so this will give me 2" from the speaker to the GOM fabric. Right where I want to be. The boxes are very stable in the wall. I will most likely fill some of the box with Polly-fill. In previous posts I went into the design of the boxes. The front cover will be a custom template for each speaker to fit into. Each Triad will fit into the 1/2" MDF front. That 1/2" cover will sit flush. If I want to change speakers out in the future I will just rip another 1/2" MDF cover front template


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Speaker backer boxes are done. I am very pleased with how everything turned out, but am glad this step in the build is done. Was definitely a pain.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Nice job - looking good mate! :T


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

One down......Four to go


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Took off from work an hour early, got home and worked for about 4.5 hours and.......Clips and Channel are done!

After the ceiling was done it went fairly fast. Once I had the back wall done I just used the laser level and it went flying by.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Nice mate! Good luck on the walls!


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

The walls with the backer boxes look great. Very nice job on the build work there, and I like your idea for the replaceable faceplates in case you change speakers down the road. Clips and channel everywhere looks like a lot of work, but the results are very impressive, even before the drywall goes up.


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## jgourlie (Jun 16, 2012)

Wow I am liking the way this is progressing....really nicely done


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## mcascio (Dec 5, 2010)

Looking great...keep up your aggressive pace and you'll be done in no time.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Thanks Mario...

btw....your room turned out perfect....you should be very proud of the HT you built.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

My wife's 18' x 13' x 8' walk in closet is finished. This is a surprise, she has no idea that I am building this room out for her; I mean where else is she going to put her 200 pairs of shoes (not joking at that number).....closet, bathroom, and two rooms to go!


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

14 hour day today. Six of us got all the drywall hung, everything but the inside corners taped. More mud tomorrow, skim coat Saturday, sand on Sunday. Here is how everything went down......I decided to sub this portion out, and then the contractor who is also someone I know fairly well had to postpone for a month. So I decided to just do it myself. But then my brother, dad, and three buddies decided to lend a hand. None of us does this for a living, but we are all very handy and some of us have worked in various trades in college and when younger. 

Today went great....we got a ton finished. The sooner I can get all this done the better. I really want to devote my time to the HT.

Will post some pics when my camera gets charged. Nothing exciting at all just another room w/ drywall. This is more for my own documentation of the entire project.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Drywall is the rest of the basement is done. 4 days, 40 + hours.

OSB now completely installed on the ceiling. 
I really took my time and got a really tight fit for my hvac runs.









From the screen wall looking toward the rear









Front right corner, you can also see where I decoupled the framing around the support poles with IB3 clips. I am still going to GG drywall to the boxed framing


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

Great progress... it must be nice to have such dedicated volunteers helping you! Out of curiosity, what does the room 'sound like' now? I guess what I mean is now that the OSB is up and the room is insulated, have you noticed it being quieter than other rooms you have been working on? I know its early, and you probably don't have a door to close, just wondering if the work you have done so far makes a noticable difference. I would think it would?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Owen-

Yes it is nice, howevery they have left. I suckered them into helping me drywall the rest of the basement, I am on my own in the HT. Having a panel lift makes life pretty easy however.

To answer your question, yes I can already tell a noticable difference with just the ceiling up. I know once I GG and add the 5/8 drywall it will be extremely quiet. We have hardwood above and I can hardly hear anyone walking around directly above me.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

After some re-configuration (taking down the ceiling to add more clips and change the spacing) I have righted the ship once again.....

First off, I apologize for the dump of a work space. I cannot seem to keep the HT organized while finishing the rest of the basement simultaneously. Some boring pics anyways.

Very close to finishing layer number 1.


















Did manage to get a very tight fit around the speaker backer boxes. They are really starting to come together!


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Looking good! Make sure to listen to something in the room after you have the 1st layer up - and then traipse upstairs and see how much it cuts the noise down.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I can already tell a huge difference and I am not even close to sealing it up


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I finally started on my journey to fill my room and rack with equipment. I started my build with no equipment, and I have never had any. The plan was to start adding A/V equipment when I hit the halfway point of the build. I just got there and happened to find a good deal on 2 Triad In-Room GOLD power Subs.

I will use both subs up front as part of a baffle wall, the Porcella design to be exact.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Just picked up 2 Silver Surrounds today. Now have 2 Gold subs and a pair of silver surrounds. Im getting excited


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I did a ton today in the HT. I took the day off, got up early and starting hanging rock with my father and a friend. Was a very successful day, except an injury and a ton of green glue everywhere. 

We finished all the hanging and got the taping done as well. Will be blocking tomorrow with Durabond 45, giving it an hour or two and then we'll start the skim coat.

Today's festivities......


















A shot with all the backer boxes for the 4 surrounds 









I am pleased with my measurements of depth for the backer boxes. They ended up being right on the money and flush with the first OSB layer. Even though this will all be behind fabric.










Almost to the half-way point in my build, the fun is about to begin. CANT WAIT


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Wow - great work! :T That looks really clean!

Hope the injury was not too bad......raying:


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I have not been to good with pics. So here are the last of the room construction photos, boring but it is nice to be done with this point. FUN STARTS NOW.

Drywall done in the rest of the basement









Drywall completely done and sanded in the HT


















Screen wall









I did have a chance to work on the door frame today. Frame is 6.5" wide. Like everything else in the HT, it is Walnut.

Sanding the door frame


















Walnut is really one of my favorite hardwoods. I have a good stock of mahogany, cherry, oak, and maple as well but walnut is my choice. I just love the color and grain.









Next up is the baffle wall and platforms for the two subs.


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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

fax6202 said:


> 2 things I figure out tonight on my maiden voyage with GG. 1. That stuff is sticky. And 2. DD/ GG treatment in between the joists is no fun at all.....


Why the drywall in between the joists?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Drywall between the joists is that extra mile. I have hardwood floors above and this completely eliminates footfalls. So know I have hardwood, sub-floor, drywall, green glue, drywall, insulation, channel/clips, OSB, green glue, and drywall. This adds to the total isolation. All seams are caulked in the joists as well. I can tell you that as soon as i put this up I could immediately notice a significant difference.


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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

fax6202 said:


> Drywall between the joists is that extra mile. I have hardwood floors above and this completely eliminates footfalls. So know I have hardwood, sub-floor, drywall, green glue, drywall, insulation, channel/clips, OSB, green glue, and drywall. This adds to the total isolation. All seams are caulked in the joists as well. I can tell you that as soon as i put this up I could immediately notice a significant difference.


Good to know... I will have to do this when I convert my garage to a HT since the Master Bedroom is right over the garage (I can always hear the dogs playing when I am there now).


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

It was a pain for sure, but well worth it.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Added to my speaker shopping spree....

Picked up another two silver surrounds and silver L and R channel.

That brings it to:
Triad Silver in-room LCR - 2
Triad Silver in-wall surrounds -4
Triad Gold Power Subs - 2


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

fax6202 said:


> Next up is the baffle wall and platforms for the two subs.


Nice choice on the timber! :T
Are these two separate timber platforms for the subs as opposed to a front stage?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Thanks prof. Platform will be from baffle wall to real front wall. Very small. Just using for platform with some mass and an attachment point under the baffle wall. Not doing a stage. Not really my thing. Sorry for grammar n response typing from phone.


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

Sounds good, providing the the sub platforms are totally non resonant..ie sand filled..otherwise if they are tied to the baffle wall, they will resonate the wall which you don't want..


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Yes sir. Sand to the top and mass vinyl or similar under layment. Top will be osb - gg -osb -- gg -- osb


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## Prof. (Oct 20, 2006)

Looking forward to seeing your baffle wall construction..


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I will document in detail. More so now that I have built out the soundproof shell. Now every thing becomes fun.


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

Big thumbs up for the execution so far. Nice walnut for the door frame, and I'm glad you saw results with the drywall-between-joists application, because that was something I was thinking about doing as well.

Did you manage to put drywall up in the joist cavities where the ducts ran too, or just skip those ones?


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Thanks Owen

I did all of the joist cavities. I actually cut out all of the rigid duct, treated and then installed the duct again. I really wish I had just put some drywall up on the spots that I could. It was probably more work than what it was worth. I couldnt tell you if that extra step makes a noticable difference, but the treating of the joists in general does. I had my two boys go right above me (which is the kitchen) and jump up and down, stomping their feet. I could barely hear them stomping. I cannot hear any walking or running across the floor above at all. I have been extremely pleased thus far with the sound isolation. The only noise that escapes the room right now is through the door rough opening and through the HVAC which I havent treated and ran through the soffits yet.

Hope this helps.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

When you took out the rigid duct, did you replace it with flex? That was the only reason I put mine in all the joists - I swapped all my rigid that ran through the room over to flex to make sure I had no vibrations from the rigid.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

No, i left them rigid per Ted's instructions because they were not servicing the room. I did not want to restrict airflow to other rooms in the house. between the joist treatments and sub-floor above along with the clips and channel shell, isolation was pretty good.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Interesting - none of mine service that room either. I have not noticed a significant difference in airflow or cost to cool the house. I wonder if there is a good way to test it out.......

Good to hear that you got the isolation you were looking for! :T


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

I may have never noticed a difference to be honest. I just knew that with the added resistance of the ribs inside flex duct could possibly make a difference. Like I said, probably didnt but since i got the thumbs up from the oracle himself i went with it. thanks for following along.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

And, I forgot to put it in the first post, but I am LOVING the walnut! :T


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

Then you will be pleased to know that I have been experimenting with types of finish over the last few days.

First I am dead set against staining naturally dark woods. All of my lumber has a nice deep color now because it is not steamed like most distributors have.

But I do want to bring out the beautiful grain and make it pop. and i think i may have found the answer.

That is a 1st/base coat of Walnut Oil or Tung Oil, and then finished off with an dewaxed shellac. I will keep that tone and really bring out the grain.

More to come.......


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Warning - incoming noob question!

When you stain, do you use a rag or a brush? I tried both and like how the rag looked, but this is my first real attempt at staining so I am curious what others are using.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

the answer is yes...lol

I use both, each have their uses. If I had to choose between the two I would use a rag to rub it in. I am fortunate enough to have access to some really fine hardwoods so i dont do alot of staining, just finishing. Can i ask what wood you are staining?


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

I am using a pre-sanded oak with a red mahogany stain - I really liked how the stain brought out the contrast - almost a black in some places and a dark red elsewhere.

For me, the brush just seemed to leave too much on - it seemed like I should wipe it with a rag anyway.


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## fax6202 (Apr 5, 2012)

A rag would be just fine. As you know I'm sure, its really just trial and error. Just use some scrap and go to town. Also, if you want a great book/reference on finishing get: Understanding Wood Finishing (Bob Flexner). It wont disappoint.


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## ALMFamily (Oct 19, 2011)

Yep - there are quite a few stained scrap pieces dotting my wood bin at the moment. 

Thanks for the reference - I will definitely see if I can find it.


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