# SMS-1 or Behringer DCX2496



## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

I've been reading and reading, and my head is absolutely spining!

What I have is a 5.2 system, consisting of:

Preamp-Sherwood P-965
Amp-ATI 1505
Main towers are HTD level 3
Center channel is HTD level 3
Rears are in walls, HTD brand HD-80's
1 HSU VTF3 HO
1 HSU MBM-12

And I also have a HSU VTF3 MKII that isn't being used at all. I'm in the process of trying to figure out if the MBM/VTF3 HO combo is better than running the VFT3 HO/ VTF3 MKII. But thats a whole other thread in itself.

What I want is absolute sound quality(mainly with the subs). Plain and simple. I want to set it all up once, and walk away. As much as I love tinkering with stuff, I seem to mess things up more than help when I get to tinkering :bigsmile:

I have no way to manage my system right now, other than by the Sherwood's auto set up, and by ear. Seems that I'm always having to mess with the sub's settings in order to get thing where I want. 

Will either of these 2 devices(SMS-1 or Behringer DCX2496) help in my situation? If you need more info, please ask. I'm sure you guys are going to need more info from me to help. So please ask.


Thanks, and Merry Christmas!

Nick


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

Hello Nick and welcome to the Shack!

Is there a particular reason you would want a DCX2496... I think maybe you intended to mean the DEQ2496. None the less... a DSP1124P would most likely do all you need and they can be purchased for $100 or less.

First things first though. Check out the REW Forum and read up on it, then download it and measure the response in your room. Let's see what you have to deal with before deciding what you need.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Sounds good.
I started reading up on the REW. But only working off of a laptop, and no mic inputs. Need to get that squared away first I guess. 

Thanks for the reply!


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

Yep... you will need an outboard sound card. There are probably some good recommendations in the REW Forum. You'll also need an appropriate SPL meter and/or mic/preamp setup.


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## Guest (Dec 25, 2007)

What is the Mic in port needed for?


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

It could be used to plug the mic into so that it could read the room measurements, but we generally do not recommend using the Mic input on laptops for REW because it usually doesn't produce accurate results.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Sonnie said:


> It could be used to plug the mic into so that it could read the room measurements, but we generally do not recommend using the Mic input on laptops for REW because it usually doesn't produce accurate results.




So what input do I need to be looking for? I'm starting to look for soundcards now. I am wanting to get this thing set up so I can take some measurements, get them posted here, then get my subs sounding good once and for all :bigsmile:


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## JimP (May 18, 2006)

Nick,

Greetings 

I am very much a tinkerer, but would still recommend the SMS-1 over the Behringer route. By the time you buy the Behringer unit, buy the flat response testing microphone, deal with external sound cards, then preamps(yes Nick, you're going to need a preamp), then cables, cable adapters, then trips to buy this stuff....you're just not that far apart from the actual dollars of a SMS-1(when purchased at the lower end of its price range). In my limited experience doing it both ways, the SMS-1 sounds better(with the latest software). With the Behringer method you will also have to deal with microphone calibration files system files and learning curves with both REW and the Behringer unit.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

I don't know if I'm alowed to post links or not. But would this work for me? 

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...t_shr?_encoding=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&v=glance

Plug the mic directly into this, then use the USB cable to hook up to the computer.


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

If I were going to buy that then I would definitely take Jim's recommendation and buy the SMS-1.



> By the time you buy the Behringer unit, buy the flat response testing microphone, deal with external sound cards, then preamps(yes Nick, you're going to need a preamp), then cables, cable adapters, then trips to buy this stuff....you're just not that far apart from the actual dollars of a SMS-1(when purchased at the lower end of its price range).


That might be a little dramatic and exaggerated. 

There are definitely a couple of choices here... and it boils down to how much you want to spend and what learning curves you are willing to conquer.

The least expensive route is less than $150, considerably less than any price you'll find for the SMS-1... and no need to make any trips anywhere... have it all delivered to your doorstep. :bigsmile:

You don't actually have to have a mic preamp if you already have a Radio Shack SPL meter. If you don't have one, you can order one from SVSound for $44.

You can get the DSP1124P from the Shack Store for as little as $80 used / $88 new.

The USB external sound card that most are using (including myself) is the Creative Sound Blaster MP3+ and you can get it straight from Creative for $10.

You may have some of the cables you need lying around, but it you have to buy all of them, you should still spend less than $20. You can order all of your cables and adapters from Part-Express.

If you wanted a better quality SPL meter you could up the ante to $99 for the Galaxy CM-140 from Musicians Friend... but it not absolutely necessary to spend that much. If you did you'd still come in at less than $225 or so.


If you choose the inexpensive route... you'll have to learn how to use the BFD and REW, which is more difficult for some than others... which is of course one reason we have the forum to help... :T


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Thanks Sonnie,

I placed an order for some of those things already. Seems that most of the people here are using the 1124, and I figure it's only $100, so even if it doesn't do everything I need, It will still provide me with the learning curve that I need. 

One question though, local Rat Shack only has the digital meters. Is this ok to use or should I order the analog meter? 

Thanks!!!!
Nick


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

The digital SPL meter will work fine.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Awesome! Thank you sir!

Jim, no disrespect to your recomendation, but I'm going to take the cheaper way out for the moment. If that doesn't work for me, I may consider the SMS. But at $500, it's going to be tough to swallow. 

Thanks for all the advice! As soon as my orders come in, I'm sure I'll be flooding you guys with questions!

Nick


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## JimP (May 18, 2006)

What, me dramatic????? lol :yay:

Nick.....are you anywhere near Montgomery or Luverne? 

I can't speak for Sonnie, but if you're near Montgomery I can come buy and try to help you get up and going. Maybe Sonnie can do the same if he's closer to you.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Wish I was closer, thats an awesome offer! 
I live in Dallas, Tx. Quite a ways from you. Sure wish I lived closer though


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## JimP (May 18, 2006)

Wish you were closer. We could knock it out in a few hours. :hsd:

The people on this forum are phenominal for being helpful. 

Its best to stay with the same basic setup that everyone else is using so that you don't run into anything weird that no one else has had to deal with.

Best of luck.


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

Absolutely... I'll help anyone close enough. Dallas might be a little out of my reach though. :blink:

We do have about 50 members from the Dallas area... including one of our staff, Ron Carlton (*rcarlton*). Although I'm not sure if he fiddles with any of this or not. If nothing else, when you are done you might call on him for some therapy. :nerd:


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

I really appreciate the offer from both of you guys! That is very generous. Wish we were closer so I could take advantage of it.

I do have another question though. All together, I have 3 subs. So far, only 2 of them have been hooked up at one time. Just got a splitter, and am going to try all 3 together to see how we like them. 
Subs are...

HSU VTF3 HO w/Turbo
HSU VTF3 MKII
HSU MBM-12

The HO w/Turbo, and the MBM are my 2 main subs, and I am going to stick with those 2 regaurdless. My question is, should I add the VTF3 MKII into the mix? I have a total of 6000cu ft of space that these subs have to fill. I did a little research with the subs, and swapped out the MBM and the MKII, and left the HO w/Turbo hooked up. 

The MKII and the HO w/Turbo combo sounded very good! LOTS of deep bass!
The MBM and the HO w/Turbo combo also sounded very good, but was lacking in the deep bass. But the midrange made up for it. Now when I say lacking, obviously it's not lacking that much. The HO w/Turbo is an awesome sub. I guess after I heard how much deep bass I can get with it combined with the MKII, I got spoiled  

My thinking here is add all 3 of the subs, and I can have the good mid bass from the MBM, and also a good amount of deep bass from the HO w/Turbo and the MKII. 

Now there's always a negative with anything. The negative with running all 3 subs is placement. I am attaching a layout of our space. Where the subs are in this layout, is where they will have to stay if I run all 3. Please let me know what you think....


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## JimP (May 18, 2006)

Nick,

Do you have REW setup on a computer?


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

JimP said:


> Nick,
> 
> Do you have REW setup on a computer?




I have it on my laptop, but waiting for the soundcard to get here. Should be here by the 2nd of Jan. As soon as that comes in, I will try and figure out how to work it, and post a graph.


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

Things can get really touchy with three subs scattered about like this, but it may work. I would wait on the soundcard and look at some response measurements to start with.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Sonnie said:


> Things can get really touchy with three subs scattered about like this, but it may work. I would wait on the soundcard and look at some response measurements to start with.


After talking with Pete from HSU. He advised me to move things around a bit. Here is the latest that I plan to try out this evening. As you can see, we've just moved the MBM closer to the HO w/Turbo. I'm not sure how this will look, nor do I know if this will be girlfriend approved. We shall wait and see this afternoon :bigsmile:


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

Keeping them in 2 locations should help. You will probably have to adjust the phase on the pair closest to you.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Sonnie said:


> Keeping them in 2 locations should help. You will probably have to adjust the phase on the pair closest to you.


Few hours of fun in my future for this afternoon  

Hopfully everything will sound good, and the layout will be girlfriend approved.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Did I say this was gonna be fun? 

4 hours later, and I've got very little accomplished. Move a sub, adjust it.....move a sub, adjust it.....move, Adjust, move, adjust. It seems like it's never ending.

Oh well, calling it a night for now. But I'm not giving up yet. Back at it tomorrow. 


Just thought I'd give you an update.

Nick


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

It will be very interesting once you get REW setup and can see the response changes as you move the subs around.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Funny story....not really, but I'm sure you all get a chuckle 

Spent the better part of 5 hours yesterday moving and adjusting subs, trying to get the best sound(by ear). I've been waiting for my new sound card to come in so I could play with REW. Well, UPS delivered it yesterday about 5pm(normal delivery time), but he didn't knock on the door or let me know he made a delivery. Needless to say, I went outside at about 9pm last night, and my sound card was sitting on the front porch 

All that work last night, and my sound card was there the whole time


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## JimP (May 18, 2006)

Just checked my front door and found an Amazon delivery that I've been waiting on too. Wonder how long that's been sitting there.


EVERYBODY......CHECK YOUR FRONT DOORS. :dumbcrazy:


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

I got home last night and had a box sitting outside the garage door that UPS had delivered yesterday. 

Looking forward to seeing those REW measurements.


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Sonnie said:


> Looking forward to seeing those REW measurements.



This will be my first outing with REW or anything like it. So even though I've been reading and reading all I can about it, I'm not sure I'll be doing it correctly. 
I guess I've read all I can, now it's time to actually use the program, and learn. 

Hope to be able to take some measurments this afternoon. Just have to hit up the Rat Shack for some cords


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

Your friend >>>> REW Online Help Files

It will almost hold your hand... :whistling:


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## n737nc (Dec 23, 2007)

Yeah, I've been printing it out this morning. Going to try and start this afternoon when I get home. Home to show my first graphs later today or this evening. 

Thanks for all of your help guys!


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