# Need advise for a good Amp for LS50.



## shkumar4963 (Nov 16, 2014)

Amplifier measurement that determine amplifier quality
We all know RMS power capacity, dynamic power capacity, frequency response, current capacity, output impedence and distortion are important measures.

What else is important in an amplifier. How can we tell an amplifier is of high quality based on hard engineering measurements.

I know that auditioning is needed to detect finer points of amplifier design. But here I am looking for things that can be objectively measured.

What can we measure in NAD and Parasound that is not available in Yamaha, Denon or Onkyo.


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## ajinfla (May 10, 2009)

shkumar4963 said:


> What else is important in an amplifier.


Price
Looks
Street cred/bragging rights/pride of ownership
Cognizance it's part of a system, including loudspeakers
Your preferences



shkumar4963 said:


> I know that auditioning is needed to detect finer points of amplifier design.


Not for all of us, but if that floats your boat, please correctly state it as "experiencing", since your eyes will be open and for humans, that has consequences.



shkumar4963 said:


> But here I am looking for things that can be objectively measured.


You mentioned most, then there's low level linearity, PowerCube performance, etc.
However, *your* subjective preference is not objectively measured and in the end, that's all that matters in these discussions.



shkumar4963 said:


> What can we measure in NAD and Parasound that is not available in Yamaha, Denon or Onkyo.


The brand names with our eyes.

Your amp options for the LS50s will depend in some part on objective measures and some part on you. Price range? How loud do you listen? What dynamic range music? What size room? Black or Silver? Small or large?

cheers,


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## ilok (Jul 20, 2013)

Your ear. Trust nothing else.


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## Phillips (Aug 12, 2011)

ilok said:


> Your ear. Trust nothing else.


Yep, and in your room, not in a showroom.


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## pxj (Jun 10, 2011)

I have a pair of the LS50's. I used my Quicksilver Mid Mono's (40watts), sounds great, I've used my Vincent Sp331MK (150watts per) sounds great, I've used my Pass Labs 30.5 sounds great. My room 14x12x10. I don't play my music are loud levels 70-85db is about it for my taste for average listening. Jazz, smooth jazz, classic rock, blues, some classical. Source Apollo R, or Micro Seki BL91, or a Teac UD501 dac. 

Get a pair in your home and listen.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Given the LS50's amp requirements are 25-100watts and their frequency response is only 79Hz - 28kHz. Your not going to need alot of power. Are you looking for something warm sounding? Look at getting a nice tube amp. If you want traditional power the options are endless. Emotiva, Yamaha Samson, QSC, and the list goes on. 
The Emotiva XPA 200 would be a very nice choice.


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## shkumar4963 (Nov 16, 2014)

tonyvdb said:


> Given the LS50's amp requirements are 25-100watts and their frequency response is only 79Hz - 28kHz. Your not going to need alot of power. Are you looking for something warm sounding? Look at getting a nice tube amp. If you want traditional power the options are endless. Emotiva, Yamaha Samson, QSC, and the list goes on.
> The Emotiva XPA 200 would be a very nice choice.


I currently have a Yamaha RX-V800 HT amp with stated power of 100 wpc with very low distortion and very flat frequency response. I don't know if I should change. My deer says that LS50 are demanding speakers and should be paired with 1500+ amps. All reviews also say the same thing. Let me know how I decide if I should change and if yes will Emotiva xa 200 be good upgrade.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

shkumar4963 said:


> I currently have a Yamaha RX-V800 HT amp with stated power of 100 wpc with very low distortion and very flat frequency response. I don't know if I should change


In my opinion it would do just fin with those speakers. Im asuming your going to use a sub with these?


> My dealer says that LS50 are demanding speakers and should be paired with 1500+ amps. All reviews also say the same thing. Let me know how I decide if I should change and if yes will Emotiva xa 200 be good upgrade.


Hogwash! Its obvious he wants you to buy something he sells. The LS50s are 85db efficient at 8ohms (dips down to 5ohms) and they will sing with a 150watt per channel amp like the Emotiva. No need to get more power than that, they are not large floorstanders.


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## pxj (Jun 10, 2011)

I've even used the LS50 with my Denon 4311. I say get you a pair and enjoy the speakers.


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## shkumar4963 (Nov 16, 2014)

I am currently using my Yamaha with LS50. They sound fine. But of course I don't know if bass will be even better with a parasound A23 or Emotiva or Krell. I do not have a sub yet. But selecting that is another topic that requires some discussion.


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## ilok (Jul 20, 2013)

The LS50 have no mid and no bass, buy a tower instead because the money on the amp will be wasted with the LS50.


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## pxj (Jun 10, 2011)

ilok said:


> The LS50 have no mid and no bass, buy a tower instead because the money on the amp will be wasted with the LS50.


I use mine with a Rythmik F12se and it works great. It really depends on where you use your speakers. I have towers but in my small area the kefs and the sub work great and sound great.


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## shkumar4963 (Nov 16, 2014)

ilok said:


> The LS50 have no mid and no bass, buy a tower instead because the money on the amp will be wasted with the LS50.


I have spent close to a month with LS50. What I see is extraordinary clarity and uniformity. So far I have not used a sub but it sound good. I am afraid that if the sub is not of good quality and is not matched well in volume and phase, it will take away from incredible clarity, imaging and uniformity. 

For the first few weeks I was wondering what was all the fuss about in all magazine reviews. But after 30 days, I now see why all the magazine were raving about it. For casual listener, who is looking for bright peaks, extraordinary amount of bass or deep low end, it will disappoint. But if you are a long term listener, especially listening to jazz and vocals, the clarity and uniformity will amaze you.

We can say that it excels in quality at the expense of quantity (of bass or sound level).


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## class a (Oct 22, 2010)

I've heard the LS-50's w/a Prima Luna Prologue Premium Integrated and found it to be a great match. Unlike solid state you can change flavors. The Premium takes a wide variety of tubes. You can use EL-34's, KT-88's or KT-120's. :T


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## shkumar4963 (Nov 16, 2014)

I have a new ls50 and am also looking to purchase an amp. I have one used available herefrom a private party and wanted to see if anyone has used it with LS50. The amp is Yamaha M-70. 

Also if someone has some pointers on how to check it out before purchase, love to hear that as well.


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## jb5200 (Aug 20, 2010)

FWIW,

My brother has the white ls50 and he uses a denon X4000 with an Emotiva UPA - 200 (Only b/c it's the only amp that would fit in his cabinet) with a REL T5 sub in a room 34x38 with a 22' ceiling and that thing cranks! Completely blown away! Those speakers are labeled as nearfield monitors but we were standing 25' back and they sounded amazing. I was not expecting them to fill the room but all I can say is WOW! Simply impressive!


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## shkumar4963 (Nov 16, 2014)

Thanks jb. I have heard a few people praise rel t5. Although it is only 8 inch driver with 125 watts, it somehow produces very musical low end. Can someone explain why?


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## jb5200 (Aug 20, 2010)

I can't explain it - I am dumbfounded! The T5 is this tiny little cube but it fills his room just right for music. Speaking of music it is extremely musical as all Rel subs are. They are not a subwoofer as a dealer tried explaining to me - they are a sub speaker they connect directly to the binding posts and play the same signal as your speakers get and just carry the signal down below where your speakers can't play so it is pretty much seamless. Not sure on how they do it, all I know is it sounds outstanding for what it is and the size it is!


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

shkumar4963 said:


> Thanks jb. I have heard a few people praise rel t5. Although it is only 8 inch driver with 125 watts, it somehow produces very musical low end. Can someone explain why?


Here's a mainstream review that does a good job.

I have a T-9 in a smallish ~10x13 home theater setup. Incredible impact and realism for movies. Proper positioning really does get the room pressurized instead of just full-of-bass. You can actually feel a movie explosion hit you in the chest. The T-Rex from _Jurassic Park_? Yup, feel its footsteps through the concrete slab that is my floor. The T-9 is not in my main music-listening system, but I do play music videos and the occasional CD/SACD. 

Integrating the sub correctly is not as easy as the (somewhat) vague instructions in the user manual would have you believe. If you do it by ear, use a variety of test and demo material for setup, and take your time with lots of breaks to avoid listener fatigue. If you have the equipment and experience, then integrate it using acoustic measurement software such as REW and room correction such as Dirac Live.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

jb5200 said:


> *They are not a subwoofer* as a dealer tried explaining to me - they are a sub speaker they connect directly to the binding posts and play the same signal as your speakers


I think this explains it about as best you can get. REL is a "musical sub" it is not good for anything but that. Even the T-9 only goes down to 28Hz and thats already down -6db according to the specification sheet.
If you use them for home theater be warned that are missing out on alot of the real impact of the soundtrack.


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

tonyvdb said:


> I think this explains it about as best you can get. REL is a "musical sub" it is not good for anything but that. Even the T-9 only goes down to 28Hz and thats already down -6db according to the specification sheet.


Yes, but it still sounds very, very good (on movies) to this beginner who's trying to break out of the audiophile mold. I think it's a little harsh to say it's not good for movies at all. Thanks for raining on my parade, pal. :crying:



tonyvdb said:


> If you use them for home theater be warned that are missing out on alot of the real impact of the soundtrack.


When I thought I had finished upgrading, I knew it was too good to be true. What you're saying makes sense, and you now have my attention. But where do I start? I've been eyeballing the DIY subwoofer thread, but that seems really intimidating. Can't hijack the thread here, so think I need to start my own or do some more research.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

There are lots of subs that dig down to at least 20Hz before rolling off. Of course budget is a big part of it but you can get into this range for under $450 without DIY


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

Thanks, Tony--gives me hope as my budget is slim-pickin's right now (stupid Plasma) :whistling:. I'll head on over to the purchased subs section for some pointers and ideas for better questions. Thanks again.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

Start a post over there and I will help you find something :T


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## Lumen (May 17, 2014)

Deal! :T


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## shkumar4963 (Nov 16, 2014)

Thanks Tony. As you mentioned there are subs at $500 price that go to 20 hz and there are subs that go to only 32 hz and cost $1000 or more. It is not practical to set up various subs with my system to test which one sounds the best as each set up may take long time even with measurement equipment. I will take it up again when i have a month or more to test a few subs.


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