# Opinions on Outlaw Audio



## tango (Feb 2, 2007)

I was originally looking at the separates but then caught sight of the receiver. Looks like a nice unit but only 65 watts. From the reviews I have read though the 65 watts is really all you'll need as it is quite powerful. Any opinions?


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## JCD (Apr 20, 2006)

Let me preface this with: having more clean watts is better -- however, 65watts for most rooms and with most speakers is probably all you really need. Most speakers are using only about 10watts (from what I heard/remember) 90% of the time; therefore, most of the time, 65watts is plenty. All of this assumes that you have a powered subwoofer with a cutoff of 80hz. If you were running your speakers full range, I'd probably change my answer, especially for movies that have a lot explosions as bass frequencies require a lot more wattage to reach the same dB levels.

The other issue I'd point out is that the stated wattage of most commercial receivers is very overstated, so the 65watts from Outlaw (which I understand are fairly conservative) is probably the equivalent of 80-100watts from the other mainstream players.

The last tidbit that I'll add is that the extra volume from increasing the wattage from 65watts to 125watts is less than 3dB. To get to a level that is perceived to be twice as loud as the 65watts, you'd need an amp capable of pumping out 650watts (for a 10dB change).


JCD


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## chas (Jan 28, 2007)

I had a 1070 for awhile, and the 65 watts sounded more dynamic and powerful than the 100-110 watt receivers i've had. I returned it because of the no-audio issues they've had. I know Outlaw has recently issued another software patch to deal with that problem.


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## tango (Feb 2, 2007)

What were the no-audio issues they had?


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## Dbeistel (Dec 31, 2006)

tango,

go to the Outlaw Audio website and go into the hideout and into the forum and there should be post on the issues or concerns from 1070 owners.


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## blownrx7 (Feb 7, 2007)

I fully concur with JCD's comments. That being said, if your room is very large AND you like turning it up for those big crescendo movie scenes or doing some serious headbanging AND you have inefficient speakers then 65 watts (or 125 watts from Sony;-) will NOT do it. 
Be very aware of your speaker efficiency since you can pick up the "doubling of volume" simply by going from 87db speakers to 90 db speakers with the same amp!
I have not personally tried Outlaw since they were not around when I had already moved up the "emptying my wallet" :spend: chain BUT they have a loyal following and that kind of admiration does not come from making subpar products.
So, first, be honest about what will satisfy you decibel-wise, evaluater your speaker requirements and room application and go from there in choosing the correct sized amplification.
HTH


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## Otto (May 18, 2006)

Hi there tango,

I have an Outlaw 990 pre/pro. All in all, it's been an excellent machine, especially for the price. Outlaw has excellent customer support, and they have been responsive to my emails, phone calls and a marginally defective piece (they sent me out a new one, with paid shipping both ways). 

I have never tried any of their amplification devices, but I understand they are well regarded. As noted by someone else, they are also pretty conservative in their stated power ratings. In general, more power is good, especially for high output dynamics, but I would bet that 65 Outlaw watts will be plenty to get you through 99% of what you need, especially if you have fairly efficient speakers.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned here, but that you probably know about already, is their 30-day in-home trial period. As with most of the ID companies, it's their best way to get you to be able to audition their gear. If the piece suits you, I'd suggest giving it a try. If you don't like it, you're out a little for shipping. But if it were me auditioining that piece, I bet I'd end up keeping it.

Good luck either way!


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## tango (Feb 2, 2007)

I'm using Paradigm monitor 11's for the front and ADP370 for the rears. The 11's have a 95db sensitivity and the ADP are 94db. So I should be ok.


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## blownrx7 (Feb 7, 2007)

Agree!!!


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## basementjack (Sep 18, 2006)

Thats killer sensitivity!


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## tango (Feb 2, 2007)

That's why I have always liked paradigm. I also like Klipsch ( also great sensitivity) but sometimes they are just too bright sounding. Great for music, but I d'ont like them so much for movies.


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## srckkmack (Feb 10, 2007)

Tango,
I don't have an Outlaw receiver, but I do own the Outlaw 755 5x200W amp. Outlaw was great to deal with, packages the products very well for shipping, has great products for the price, and has a good warranty. I would definitely do business with them again.

I also have Paradigm speakers, using the Studio 60's in front. I replaced a set of Klipsch speakers (CF-1) with the Paradigms and noted that the Klipsch were much more sensitive (but not as smooth). Paradigm lists the Monitor 11 as 94dB in room compared to the 60's at 91dB. I don't recall what Klipsch listed the CF-1's at, but they were easier to drive. I think at 94dB you'll be fine with the Outlaw 65W output.

If the Outlaw has all the features you want, I think you'll be fine with 65W driving your Monitor 11's. If you still feel it's underpowered but like the receiver, they have pre-outs that you can use as part of a pre/pro setup. Give Outlaw a try and if it doesn't work out, it will only cost you shipping to return it.


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## Darren (Apr 20, 2006)

I've had an Outlaw ICBM for a number of years and it has served me well. Gives me great control of the crossover frequency of all my speakers.


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## SteveCallas (Apr 29, 2006)

I'll be the opposing voice :R I noticed in the review from hometheatermag.com that the power ratings don't get much higher with two channel compared to full seven channel. This may or may not mean much to you if you don't do a lot of stereo music listening or at least not very loudly.


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## Otto (May 18, 2006)

SteveCallas said:


> I'll be the opposing voice :R I noticed in the review from hometheatermag.com that the power ratings don't get much higher with two channel compared to full seven channel. This may or may not mean much to you if you don't do a lot of stereo music listening or at least not very loudly.


Should you get more power out of two-channel vs. five-channel though? As long as "all channels driven" perform to spec or better, that's good with me. I don't think I'm going to get appreciably more output from my Sunfire Cinema Grand with one channel vs. all five being run...

Isn't that more of a problem with lower-end amps and receivers? They'll spec something for stereo, but you won't get that same value with "all channels driven." Probably because the power supply runs out of steam.

I could be way off....


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## fibreKid (Apr 20, 2006)

Bottom of page.

http://www.audioholics.com/productreviews/avhardware/Denon-AVR3805_review10.php

This isn't all that uncommon. Read the ratings/specs and check any equip you are looking at.

For you Denon fans I'm not bashing, I own one.


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## SteveCallas (Apr 29, 2006)

I looked at some more of the receivers they measured and I guess it isn't that uncommon. I guess I had a Yamaha amp section on my mind, they seem to be able to double up or more in power when only driving two channels :dontknow:


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## tango (Feb 2, 2007)

Thanks to all who replied. After carefully consideration I have decided to go with a Denon AVR-3806. I like the features it had and a big plus was the room EQ mode to help set it up. Hopefully, it was a good choice. The Outlaw is a very nice unit and I would definately put them in the running again if I ever decided to change. 

Thanks again.


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## blownrx7 (Feb 7, 2007)

Tango,
Congrats on the selection.:T 
I feel the big thing going for the Denon is it's connectivity/flexibility and the auto room correction. Built-in hdmi switching (albeit only 2x1) is something you have to pay extra for and the preamp out option allows you to grow if you so choose without having to learn a whole new pre/pro. 
The only thing that may frustrate you is the remote - easily solved by a universal remote.
Enjoy!!!


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## JCD (Apr 20, 2006)

Hey, it's a great piece of equipment! I probably do the same thing as you did.

Make sure you give us a review after you set it up!

JCD


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## Sonnie (Apr 11, 2006)

Yep... nice unit and one I have personally owned... there were absolutely no drawbacks to it for me. The only reason I sold it was to try out the Maestro M2 processor for a while. If I didn't wanna give Yamaha a chance, I would certainly go back to Denon being I can get them at cost.


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## srckkmack (Feb 10, 2007)

Tango,
Congrats on the Denon! I've heard many good things about them, especially the room equilization.

Sonnie,
After you get some time on the Yamaha, could you please post your opinions on the pros and cons of the Denon, Maestro, Yamaha, and any other receiver you may have owned?


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## tango (Feb 2, 2007)

On the Denon, If I route the HDMI cable through it will I "honestly" lose any picture quality? I am going with the Toshiba HD-XA2 for the 720p upconvert. I assume the onscreen setup will work with the HDMI cable? It would save me from having to run an S-video for the onscreen setup guide.


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## blownrx7 (Feb 7, 2007)

I'm using an Oppo with the Denon and I did not see any degradation.
It is operating as a pass-thru switch, no conversion going on inside the Denon, so it should have no opportunity to degrade the digital signal


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## tango (Feb 2, 2007)

Just wondering, My (POS) AVR7000 HK saw some degradation of the signal. Just more connections where it is possible. Thanks.


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## srckkmack (Feb 10, 2007)

HDMI carries purely digital signals, so there should be no degredation. With HDMI there is no D/A and subsequent A/D conversion necessary, thus no errors introduced by each of the conversions.


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## blownrx7 (Feb 7, 2007)

Tango,
You do bring up a good point. I did have a combination where I was using a Monster DVI to HDMI adapter with a 3ft hdmi cable and I got a nasty picture. Now I had used that same cable in another location with no problem. I changed to a cheap dvi to hdmi cable (no adapter) and that solved the problem.
Now, I was using that same adapter in another setup that had a 35ft run with no problems. Never figured out why the adapter worked in one setup and not in the other. Go figure...
At any rate, beware of adapters and extra connections. 
So whenever you have a problem, always suspect connections first, then cables, then the equipment.
Oh yeah, operator error is usually the VERY FIRST problem source to suspect (at least in my case:blink: )


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## Guest (Apr 8, 2007)

I've never owned an Outlaw receiver, but I've had their 950 pre/pro for almost 3 years and love it. It's now a little behind the times, but still does everything I need. Outlaw's customer service is great. When my unit first arrived the power cord didn't fit real tight, I called and 2 days later I had a replacement. For awhile my remote was missing, so I called Outlaw for a replacement. What suprised me was they wanted my invoice number. I didn't have it when I called, but I kept giving them information about when I purchased and the address it was shipped to and they found my order. They wouldn't sell a remote without having proof of purchase. This was because of theft and something the thieves leaving the remote behind and them called for a replacement. Now that make me feel better.

Also, don't forget the 30 day inhome trial. All it'll cost you if you don't like it is some shipping.


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

I've been thinking about the 7125 Amp, and it's nice to hear some very positive things about the company. I think when the time comes I'll give them a shot. The only lousy thing for me is that the shipping to Canada (and duty, etc.) is killer. I wish they had a Canadian distributor.


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## Bob_99 (May 8, 2006)

I currently use the Outlaw 990 with the 7500 and while I never had a chance to do an A and B comparison with other amps and pre-amps, I would like to speak to the company itself. You simply will not find better customer service anywhere. I could come up with a long list of superlatives to describe them but the bottom line is, they are probably the best. I am extremely pleased with my dealings with them and would recommend them any time.

:T :T :T 

Bob


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## phogandive (May 3, 2006)

SteveCallas said:


> I'll be the opposing voice :R I noticed in the review from hometheatermag.com that the power ratings don't get much higher with two channel compared to full seven channel. This may or may not mean much to you if you don't do a lot of stereo music listening or at least not very loudly.


Hi,
Getting substantially more power in two channel than in multi-channel is typically a sign of a sub-par power supply. It can drive two speakers ok, but has trouble maintaining output with all channels driven, hence the lower power/channel.

The cheaper receivers are notorious for this, I read a review of a cheap Sony rated at 110 w/ch that dropped to 34 w/ch (!!!) when driving all channels.

HTH,
Peter


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## beyond 1000 (Aug 28, 2008)

Love their quality and service. I just bought their model 7500 multichannel amplifier and I am very pleased with the quality and performance of the unit.


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## Steve. (Oct 26, 2007)

I had their 1050, it was OK a little quirky but sounded really good. Then I picked up a 990 and it's been great up until last week when it died... I guess I'll really find out how their service and support is... I'd really like to upgrade but they haven't had a new pre-pro since I bought the 990 amost 5 years ago. What gives Outlaw ? No new product since 2005 ? Any news on the 998 or 997 or whatever it will be called if someday if and when you release a new prepro?


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Hello,
I am quite fond of Outlaw. I do believe that their Amplifiers are especially good.
They recently had an SSP that ended up not being released due to HDMI issues. 

It was actually going to share a great deal with the latest Sherwood/Newcastle AVR and have Trinnov Room EQ. Last I checked, they were still working on a SSP, but I have huge respect for them not releasing an SSP that was not ready for prime time.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Owen Bartley (Oct 18, 2006)

Yeah, I really wanted to see them come to market with a great product, to keep Emotiva honest, and give a good alternative to the usual B&M brands. Unfortunately for them it just didn't come together, but I will give them a ton of credit for deciding to scrap the project (and all of the time invested in development) rather than shoving it out the door anyway hoping to recover some of the cost.


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## Steve. (Oct 26, 2007)

I waited so long for the new prepro that I didn't care that the 990 died and actually connected my cable box's digital output to my 2 channel preamp. It actually sounds great through my 2 channel system... I am in no hurry to replace the 990, it's been connected like that for a month, I just haven't had time to box it up and call Outlaw. It's a shame because I would upgrade in a minute, they just don't have a replacement. I'll probably just put a 5005 in my HT loop, I used to be huge into the hobby but waiting and waiting more or less made me shift gears toward my other hobbies.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Steve. said:


> I waited so long for the new prepro that I didn't care that the 990 died and actually connected my cable box's digital output to my 2 channel preamp. It actually sounds great through my 2 channel system... I am in no hurry to replace the 990, it's been connected like that for a month, I just haven't had time to box it up and call Outlaw. It's a shame because I would upgrade in a minute, they just don't have a replacement. I'll probably just put a 5005 in my HT loop, I used to be huge into the hobby but waiting and waiting more or less made me shift gears toward my other hobbies.


Hello,
When properly setup, 2 Channel Systems sound amazing. Until about 4 years ago, I too had a dedicated 2 Channel System. However, I was using Martin Logan Aerius i's and the more I listened to them, the more I wanted to put together a 5.1 Martin Logan HT. 

However, when I combined my Systems, I spent countless hours on Speaker Placement on my Vantages so that they would still excel when listening to 2 Channel. This includes the Vantages being around 5 feet from the Wall, well in front of the TV, and several feet from the Sidewalls.

There have been countless times I have forgotten to reengage from Pure Audio and gone sometimes days only listening to my Vantages. So I can completely understand how content you would be with a solid 2 Channel rig.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Steve. (Oct 26, 2007)

It's sad because I really want to have a surround setup but at this time my priorities have changed. It's not just Outlaw, the Parasound and Emotiva units were all on my short list but only one made it to market and honestly I don't even think I would mind the quirks as long as it sounded good. I don't even own a Blu Ray, most of my content is HD cable. With the 990's lack of HDMI and anticipation of it's replacement that never materialized I just never felt compelled to run out and get one. And in the mean time I invested thousands that I had earmarked for audio in a clutch and tranny upgrades for my car along with a few other hobbies that my son and I enjoy. Horsepower costs money so it's real easy to blow 2 or 3 grand ... money that I had been holding onto for a new pre pro. I know it's dumb but I'm more of an audiophile anyway. Plus I'd have to spend big bucks to rival my main system across seven channels. That said maybe it's best I just get a Marantz 5005 and a decent BR machine.


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## Jungle Jack (Jul 28, 2009)

Steve. said:


> It's sad because I really want to have a surround setup but at this time my priorities have changed. It's not just Outlaw, the Parasound and Emotiva units were all on my short list but only one made it to market and honestly I don't even think I would mind the quirks as long as it sounded good. I don't even own a Blu Ray, most of my content is HD cable. With the 990's lack of HDMI and anticipation of it's replacement that never materialized I just never felt compelled to run out and get one. And in the mean time I invested thousands that I had earmarked for audio in a clutch and tranny upgrades for my car along with a few other hobbies that my son and I enjoy. Horsepower costs money so it's real easy to blow 2 or 3 grand ... money that I had been holding onto for a new pre pro. I know it's dumb but I'm more of an audiophile anyway. Plus I'd have to spend big bucks to rival my main system across seven channels. That said maybe it's best I just get a Marantz 5005 and a decent BR machine.


Hello,
You have a number of choices. You could always spend around 400 Dollars or less used and get an Onkyo TX-SR805. This AVR is truly a classic and was Made in Japan. It offers well in excess of 100 Watts into 5/7 Channels, offers Audyssey MultEQ XT, THX Ultra2, all the latest Lossless Surround Codecs and much more. You might be even able to find a used TX-SR875 for not that much more that offers Silicon Optix's HQV Reon Processor. Unless 3D is important, there really are amazing AVR's that offer the power of a Flagship AVR for 1/10 of the price.
Cheers,
JJ


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## Steve. (Oct 26, 2007)

Thanks for the reply, I think at this time I'm going to send it in. The person at Outlaw seemed "surprised" at my symptoms but wasn't real convincing. In fact I have read a number of posts on theirs and other forums with the same exact symptoms... powers on, no display, blue standby light on, then powers off. Anyone here have this problem and if so what was the cause ?


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## htaddikt (May 14, 2007)

It's a good brand, slowly slipping in oblivion it would seem. I had a 950 and it never gave me a bit of trouble. Last thing I bought from them was my LFM1-EX sub, I plan to keep that a while. Their subs are Hsu based designs, and now OA is an outlet for Marantz electronics. They seem to have very little to call their own anymore. Says a lot about the times we live in. I am glad Oppo Digital has been successful so far.


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## jmschnur (May 31, 2011)

htaddikt said:


> It's a good brand, slowly slipping in oblivion it would seem. I had a 950 and it never gave me a bit of trouble. Last thing I bought from them was my LFM1-EX sub, I plan to keep that a while. Their subs are Hsu based designs, and now OA is an outlet for Marantz electronics. They seem to have very little to call their own anymore. Says a lot about the times we live in. I am glad Oppo Digital has been successful so far.


Their amps are quite good. I have one of their original 5 channel amps. It is still going strong. I also have one of their newer ones in my prime listening location. It serves very well. Their preamps have not been in the same class.


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## htaddikt (May 14, 2007)

That's what I've heard. At the time I had my 950 I was driving a B&K mch amp. The Outlaw amps can probably be picked up pretty cheap now.


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## koyaan (Mar 2, 2010)

I've run an Outlaw 990 processor and 770 amp for some years now and have been very pleased with both.
I've heard nothing that can compete with either of these units at thrir price, though the 990's feature set is a bit outdated now.


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## beyond 1000 (Aug 28, 2008)

koyaan said:


> I've run an Outlaw 990 processor and 770 amp for some years now and have been very pleased with both.
> I've heard nothing that can compete with either of these units at thrir price, though the 990's feature set is a bit outdated now.


Which is why I just bought an Outlaw 7500 amp for my home theatre. My "flagship" receiver when cranked up is a Prius trying to pull a boat out of the water compared to the Outlaw. The Outlaw corporation makes excellent products which is why I bought their amplifier. :clap:


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## Barumba (Aug 16, 2009)

I waited way too long for their latest pre-pro. Gave up after they gave up on the 992. I was hopeful for the 978, but still have not released it. I bought their 7125 amp three years ago, in anticipation of the 992. Well I still haven't plugged it in. But, my wait will soon be over. I will take delivery of the Marantz av7005 in about 2 weeks. tick-tock, tick-tock, watches clock.


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## jmschnur (May 31, 2011)

Barumba said:


> I waited way too long for their latest pre-pro. Gave up after they gave up on the 992. I was hopeful for the 978, but still have not released it. I bought their 7125 amp three years ago, in anticipation of the 992. Well I still haven't plugged it in. But, my wait will soon be over. I will take delivery of the Marantz av7005 in about 2 weeks. tick-tock, tick-tock, watches clock.


My outlaw 5 channel amps are still doing well. One is 10 years old. The other 5 .


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## DqMcClain (Sep 16, 2015)

I've got a 975 pre/pro... the menu system and interface are spartan at best, but it is extremely functional and flexible. I'm very happy.


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