# Are We Witnessing The End of Physical Movie Media?



## Todd Anderson

As the new Ultra HD Blu-ray players were announced last fall, I found myself breathing a sigh of relief. Physical media is going to live to see another day, I thought. It’s all in the bag for at least a few more years.

Or is it?

We’ve known for quite some time that the physical media sphere has been shrinking, and each time more evidence bubbles to the surface I cringe. I am, you see, a total home theater snob when it comes to movie content, stuck in a world where Blu-ray rules all. On the most basic of levels, I like being able to see and hold something that I own. And on the most complex of levels, I want a source that delivers optimal levels of video and sound with every film I throw its way. 

Score two for Blu-ray.

The latest and greatest version of Blu-ray players began rolling out earlier this year with the market introduction of Samsung’s UBD-K8500 4K machine. Philips is gearing-up to deliver one of its own, soon, and rumor has it that other companies – including Oppo – will follow suit in 2016. But what does this really mean? Will Ultra HD Blu-ray explode onto the scene and cause consumers to demand content, or is it simply a stopgap as the industry shifts to 4K media servers and streaming services?

If I had to bet my money, it would be on the latter. 

I live in a densely populated region smack-dab in the middle of the Washington-Baltimore metro area. Like the rest of the country, we’ve watched Hollywood Video and Blockbuster literally bite the dust. Next came Blockbuster’s online and kiosk forays, both of which barely existed, and the inevitable shrinkage of movie sections in large stores such as Target and Best Buy. A mainstay, however, for quite a bit of time has been Redbox.

Redbox is simple. You can find the company’s self-serve kiosks outside of convenience stores and double stacked inside of grocery stores nearly everywhere you go. They hardly ever have lines and renting a movie is ridiculously cheap. And while Redbox doesn’t have every new film at release, it has enough to make it an excellent source for renting movies. As it turns out, it’s also an excellent source for taking a pulse of what consumers truly want.

Recently, DigitalSmiths released 2015 data illustrating consumer content consumption, and the results sent a shiver down my Blu-ray spine. It shows that Redbox’s percentage of the consumer’s video consumption market is shrinking right along with the glaciers gracing the glorious terrains of North America’s mountainous lands. At the beginning of 2015, Redbox held a healthy 18.5-percent share of the video market. In fact, Redbox represented the largest single source of any part of the rental segment (which, aside from Redbox, is practically composed of online/streaming options). Turn the page to Quarter 4 and Redbox’s market share had fallen nearly 5-percent to a smidgen over 13-percent.

That’s a fairly steep decline in a rather short period of time.

The year-to-year revenue numbers aren’t any better. Last month, Outerwall (Redbox’s parent company) posted Redbox revenues of $407 million during Quarter 4 of 2015, which was down nearly 24-percent from the year before ($490.7 million). From a pure rental perspective, the numbers look like this: Q4 2015: 135.8 million rentals, Q4 2014: 179.5 million rentals.

Obviously, if you’re a disc lover like me, these numbers aren't what you want to see. In fact, they’re downright depressing. Perhaps they are more indicative of the rental market as a whole, but I have a sneaking suspicion that they truly represent something much larger. If Redbox’s much publisized interest in taking a second stab at the streaming market is any indication, then outlook for disc-based media isn’t good. 

This brings me to a question for you, kind readers. How do you consume your media? Do you have a preference? Are you amendable to a shift to downloadable/streaming media? Are you already practically 100% streaming? I’m curious to see where HTS members fall on this issue.

_Image Credit: Redbox_


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## JBrax

I echo your preference on having a physical disc as I'm a collector. I also agree that physical media is nearing its end of life cycle. It won't be much longer and we'll have no choice but to embrace the world of streaming media.


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## tonyvdb

Absolutely must have physical media, streaming is still lousy (particularly on the audio side) compared to the actual disc. Sure, media takes up space and my collection is growing but I will deal with it.


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## JimShaw

There are two responses above and I echo both.

I am a disc lover


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## NBPk402

I purchase the physical media. I rip all of mine to my NAS... I am not 100% happy with streaming from online as sometimes at the beginning of a movie it is trying to sync the resolution, and sometimes you get minute pauses or pixels. I also want to be able to watch it whenever I want without using all my data (we have a TB limit per month). Right now we don't hit the limit, but if I was streaming movies as much as we watch them I would exceed the cap.


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## Todd Anderson

I'm running under the assumption that the disc will be replaced by giant hard drive that we download to - then watch. Of course, this is already happening...just not on a wide scale. 

My experience with streaming has been subpar to say the least. Acceptable for casual viewing...but the video/audiophile in me cringes while I watch.


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## witchdoctor

100% streaming via Netflix, Amazon Prime, Windows Movies, www.qello.com and www.concertvault.com. I find I rarely watch a movie more than once so buying BRD would just be a waste and there is not much of a selection at redbox.
I have a very high speed connection, use a projector at 1080P and upmix movies to Auro 3D or one of the other upmixers on my Marantz 7702.


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## willis7469

Streaming has been subpar for me as well. For casual viewing it's ok, but if it's demo, or reference it has to be on BD. Besides, does anyone remember liner notes? Love that stuff(of course BDs don't have much). There's just something about being able to hold on to the media.


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## ewardjr69

I buy much less physical media than I used to do. I really only buy movies that I want because of two reasons; I love the movie or it's a great film to flex my home entertainment system. Anything else I'll just stream.


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## Dwight Angus

Living in a rural area my bandwidth strength is not very robust but I have streamed movies with limited success. The video quality contains pixelation while the & audio quality is underwhelming to say the least. My current routine is to buy BD's for the movies I plan on collecting on physical media. All other's are streamed.


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## tcarcio

I too like physical media but if a movie that is a rental for me isn't at Redbox then Vudu usually works well for me. All I can say is that if discs go away then I will buy the leftovers at bargain prices and increase my library. I buy movies to watch of course but I like having them in case I have company over. I let them choose a movie and show off my HT. It is allot of fun.


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## J&D

Just swallowed hard and subscribed to scamflix (I mean netflix) after a three year hiatus. I was one of those loyal long term physical media customers that they decided to give the royal shaft to and more than double my monthly rates in order to continue my subscription. I simply cancelled and vowed never to go back. Now I have two teens in the home that insist on having it primarily for watching on their tiny portable screens. I started streaming a movie in the HT today just to see how it looked. Looks and sounds like crud is about all I can say.

The problem is the majority has no interest in high quality video and audio. That's the really bad news for those of us wanting the best picture and sound we can get on our big screen's. My kids, and even my wife now, are perfectly content to watch on a hand sized display. My daughter has a really nice 32" LCD and Roku in her room but she will still watch most all of her programming on her phone instead. I don't get it and must be weird as I am definitely the odd man out in our household. I pray physical media sticks around for some time to come but if not guess I can turn the HT into a golf/baseball/bowling simulator.


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## JBrax

J&D said:


> Just swallowed hard and subscribed to scamflix (I mean netflix) after a three year hiatus. I was one of those loyal long term physical media customers that they decided to give the royal shaft to and more than double my monthly rates in order to continue my subscription. I simply cancelled and vowed never to go back. Now I have two teens in the home that insist on having it primarily for watching on their tiny portable screens. I started streaming a movie in the HT today just to see how it looked. Looks and sounds like crud is about all I can say. The problem is the majority has no interest in high quality video and audio. That's the really bad news for those of us wanting the best picture and sound we can get on our big screen's. My kids, and even my wife now, are perfectly content to watch on a hand sized display. My daughter has a really nice 32" LCD and Roku in her room but she will still watch most all of her programming on her phone instead. I don't get it and must be weird as I am definitely the odd man out in our household. I pray physical media sticks around for some time to come but if not guess I can turn the HT into a golf/baseball/bowling simulator.


 You've just nailed the big picture problem. We are the minority in wanting the best audio/video experience. It will be there for us but we'll pay a premium. I'm ok with that as long as the experience mimics what physical media provides.


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## NBPk402

Todd Anderson said:


> I'm running under the assumption that the disc will be replaced by giant hard drive that we download to - then watch. Of course, this is already happening...just not on a wide scale.
> 
> My experience with streaming has been subpar to say the least. Acceptable for casual viewing...but the video/audiophile in me cringes while I watch.


I believe that is what is currently being done in Theaters.


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## lovinthehd

I've resigned myself that the discs will disappear in the not-so-distant future when once I thought hey not in my lifetime! Streaming quality isn't quite bluray quality for me, but most times it's pretty good but I'd still rather use a disc. Been with Netflix since the beginning of disc rentals, wonder when they may draw the line and just support their streaming, obviously they were getting ready to a while back when they split the site. Will optical discs later get a revival like vinyl for nostalgia's sake?


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## MatrixDweller

Most of the disc rental places in my medium sized city have disappeared. There is one left. Biggest thing killing it, is the potential for late fees. I hate paying $10 for a movie I watch once. You don't have to worry about that with streaming. Of course I always question the quality of streaming though. The absolute worst thing about streaming is when you run in to network/buffering issues. Nothing is worse that having a movie stop and go for 15 minutes or even once during a critical scene. Then theres the issue of actual ownership, like with iTunes songs. You can't resell or trade them and in the event of your death they disappear into the ether that is the internet locked to your account.


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## gurot1

I prefer owning the physical media. Having said that, lately I haven't had the opportunity to really sit down and watch a movie in quite a while. For optimal sound and picture, disc is definitely needed. The problem for me with owning media is that most movies I will only ever watch once, thus renting is nice (but not as easy to find a place as it once was). I do buy animated movies in a semi regular basis because we all know kids can watch the same movie a hundred times!
If it is a nice 'audio' movie and nice picture, I have to watch it from physical disc.
Streaming(when working smoothly) does have the benefit of conveniece to watch it wherever and not having to have the disc with you to watch it.

I think previous posters have hit the nail on the head with the issue of ownership. With all this streaming, if the streaming service goes down, you have nothing to watch. Same thing with music with all these streaming services, etc....u don't own the music. 

I am far from an audiphile or videophile, but I know a lot of people aren't as concerned with quality. Look at all the people not bothered by watching standard definition tv channels on their 65 inch and bigger screens! Or blaring their soundbars and speakers to distortion. 

Physical media for me...but I feels like its time is limited. Everything is moving to being 'data' transmitted via IP. Maybe soon in the future the internet infrastructure will allow for everyone to get full quality BD, 4k content at the same quality as physical disc.


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## Todd Anderson

A lot of comments - kids that only care to watch content on their phones and tablets...etc - resonate in my world.

Truth be told people will chose convenience the vast majority of the time.


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## willis7469

Todd Anderson said:


> A lot of comments - kids that only care to watch content on their phones and tablets...etc - resonate in my world.
> 
> Truth be told people will chose convenience the vast majority of the time.



I think for many this is true. I also think it's unfortunate. IMO, there's a fine line between convenience and laziness. If There's a title I'm interested in, I will drive to town 15 minutes away, to get a rental on redbox vs renting on satellite or streaming. I also make sure my kids pay attention to the reasons why I would do that and why it's worth it for them to do the same. OT: I also don't allow music blasting from cell phone speakers. It has to be plugged in, or via AirPlay or PS3. :nerd:


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## NBPk402

Todd Anderson said:


> A lot of comments - kids that only care to watch content on their phones and tablets...etc - resonate in my world.
> 
> Truth be told people will chose convenience the vast majority of the time.


Isn't that the reason we all have CDs vs vinyl?


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## Tonto

Physical media for me when I want to watch the latest movie out. I do use Netflix to watch TV shows & some older movies. Very little plain TV.


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## Picture_Shooter

JBrax said:


> I echo your preference on having a physical disc as I'm a collector. I also agree that physical media is nearing its end of life cycle. It won't be much longer and we'll have no choice but to embrace the world of streaming media.


This is going to be the day sometime soon, and to be this really sucks cause I do not care to stream and if I can get away and just pay for a $40 time warner internet cable bill @ 10mbs/15mbs I will, but this is not really the best plan to stream movies in HDX or basic HD as my kids do get on the internet w/ their school work and playing online with the tablets / phones. To me, this is a low blow to a consumer like me that does not want to be relying on cloud / database servers to store my collection.

Not only that, the acct can be hacked, password changes and you lose your vudu acct. Yes I know I can go call, cry and plead innocent to get my vudu acct back but what hassle that would be to get things straighten out.

I really enjoy my original bluray discs onhand and ready to play my movie w/o depending on my internet to watch a movie.

Really sucks if it comes to it.


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## MatrixDweller

One thing we haven't really seen yet is a major streaming service go out of business. What happens to the media they say you own when that happens? Most likely it will be unavailable and basically lost to you.


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## Picture_Shooter

J&D said:


> The problem is the majority has no interest in high quality video and audio. That's the really bad news for those of us wanting the best picture and sound we can get on our big screen's. My kids, and even my wife now, are perfectly content to watch on a hand sized display.


 these millennials..... :coocoo: ........

I could be an automotive tire salesman and if one of these millennials comes I could tell them that 1 tire is bad, but you need all 4 new tires cause you have almost 500 miles on it. They'd bite and I get nice commission.


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## Picture_Shooter

MatrixDweller said:


> One thing we haven't really seen yet is a major streaming service go out of business. What happens to the media they say you own when that happens? Most likely it will be unavailable and basically lost to you.


Easy, look up to the 'Cloud'


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## NBPk402

MatrixDweller said:


> One thing we haven't really seen yet is a major streaming service go out of business. What happens to the media they say you own when that happens? Most likely it will be unavailable and basically lost to you.


I am assuming that it will be gone, just like if you stop paying for a service where you downloaded a song. I can't remember which Company it was, but I dumped them as soon as I saw that you had to maintain a membership to access the downloaded music on your HDD.


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## Talley

IF the push it towards streaming than the internet providers will start capping data bandwidth. Comcast in some markets limits the amount to 350gb and charges 10 bucks for each additional 50gb used if I remember right.

This will keep the media going strong imho... if the providers start charging for data beyond an initial bulk. Right now I'm averaging some 500gb/mo on my data.... this would quadruple with UHD!


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## NBPk402

Talley said:


> IF the push it towards streaming than the internet providers will start capping data bandwidth. Comcast in some markets limits the amount to 350gb and charges 10 bucks for each additional 50gb used if I remember right.
> 
> This will keep the media going strong imho... if the providers start charging for data beyond an initial bulk. Right now I'm averaging some 500gb/mo on my data.... this would quadruple with UHD!


We get 1TB a month in our plan...if I was to stream all my TV, and movies that would be used up fast. If they go to all streaming...the Internet needs to get faster, no caps, and cost no more than it does now IMO.


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## willis7469

ellisr63 said:


> We get 1TB a month in our plan...if I was to stream all my TV, and movies that would be used up fast. If they go to all streaming...the Internet needs to get faster, no caps, and cost no more than it does now IMO.



I think caps are a form of extortion. We have 50mb up/down fiber for 50 bucks a month. They offer up to 1gb up/down. But that's 250 bucks. Yikes. 
Oops....no cap. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## robbo266317

Talley said:


> IF the push it towards streaming than the internet providers will start capping data bandwidth. Comcast in some markets limits the amount to 350gb and charges 10 bucks for each additional 50gb used if I remember right.
> 
> This will keep the media going strong imho... if the providers start charging for data beyond an initial bulk. Right now I'm averaging some 500gb/mo on my data.... this would quadruple with UHD!


Wow! Just Wow...

I am currently on 20Gb + @ 20 Gb off prime time for au$60 per month.... You guys have it so good!


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## lovinthehd

I couldn't remember what mine was. Just chatted online with a CenturyLink rep, as there's absolutely nothing in my account pages that specifies anything about an amount of data up or down, who says when I get there (to the limit) they'll send me a message asking me if I want extended plan coverage...I said when will that occur....he thinks its 350GB.....then says maybe its 250. Their computers were down so no real info. Great stuff. This is USD60/Mo. The 250GB sounds a bit low if I get crazy on watching videos, and I'm not even capable of the highest speeds (dsl service 12Mbps).


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## Mike Edwards

lovinthehd said:


> I couldn't remember what mine was. Just chatted online with a CenturyLink rep, as there's absolutely nothing in my account pages that specifies anything about an amount of data up or down, who says when I get there (to the limit) they'll send me a message asking me if I want extended plan coverage...I said when will that occur....he thinks its 350GB.....then says maybe its 250. Their computers were down so no real info. Great stuff. This is USD60/Mo. The 250GB sounds a bit low if I get crazy on watching videos, and I'm not even capable of the highest speeds (dsl service 12Mbps).


Centurylink has an official "soft cap" of 250 gigs... it's there but they really don't enforce it too much.......for NOW


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## lovinthehd

Mike Edwards said:


> Centurylink has an official "soft cap" of 250 gigs... it's there but they really don't enforce it too much.......for NOW


Yes, he used the term soft cap but without a definition, had to press him to come up with a number....which he wasn't sure of (or is it specific to area served?). The ISPs are just holding Damocles sword over our heads....


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## Mike Edwards

lovinthehd said:


> Yes, he used the term soft cap but without a definition, had to press him to come up with a number....which he wasn't sure of (or is it specific to area served?). The ISPs are just holding Damocles sword over our heads....


yeah, I've worked with them before. Basically they have an OFFICIAL cap of 250 gigs but really don't bother people for going over unless they're big users who do terabytes a month... they're reserving the right to crack down anytime they want to but aren't really doing much about it now. I live in one of the "test" areas for Comcast and they do have a 350 gig a month HARD cap and if you go over they charge you $10 for every 50 gigs increment you use.


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## thrillcat

I'm able to see the best of all worlds. I don't want the physical disc to go away, but I also have a great internet connection and take advantage of streaming too. I have about 1000 vinyl records, about 50 CDs, and 25K songs in my iTunes library. 

There are some films I just want to have on a disc - the best of the best, basically. I like to have the best quality audio and video for these. The great audio mixes, the reference quality video deserve the physical media. But other films that I thoroughly enjoy aren't necessarily a/v blockbusters, and I'm perfectly content to stream them. Not unlike the fact that there are some films I want to own, and others I'll happily rent on blu-ray or streaming, or wait until they're available to stream on Netflix.

When I first switched over to purchasing blu-ray discs, there were several titles I owned on DVD that I saw fit to repurchase on blu-ray for the quality bump. For the rest of my DVD library, well, I still wanted HD versions, but didn't see the need to drop another $20+ on a disc. For these, I used Vudu's disc-to-digital and did 10 at a time for $2.50 each, upgrading the SD DVDs to HD digital files and storing the DVDs in the attic.

I don't have cable or satellite, but I have Netflix and Hulu for casual viewing. I use Vudu and the iTunes store for occasional rentals and purchases, or watching titles I own. I also have Amazon Prime, since I love the free 2-day shipping, and I watch some of their content as well. The one service I don't really use is Redbox, and I'm not sure why. It never really caught on for me, but my girlfriend uses it all the time. I prefer going to the actual video store when I rent. I like to help keep them open since their selection is much better, and I also like perusing their racks of titles for sale. I've actually bought quite a few films from their 'previously viewed' section for $5 each.

Everything has a place. When The Force Awakens is released, I'll buy that blu-ray. But I'll probably just rent Daddy's Home via Vudu.


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## NBPk402

willis7469 said:


> I think caps are a form of extortion. We have 50mb up/down fiber for 50 bucks a month. They offer up to 1gb up/down. But that's 250 bucks. Yikes.
> Oops....no cap.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


We have 100gb download, and 20gb upload with a 1TB limit per month for about $80 with taxes.


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## willis7469

I can't believe they cap you. I always thought it was only cell phone companies. In my area, none of them do. I can't imagine how fast a couple nights of "call of Duty", or need for speed would kill a data limit!


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## JBrax

willis7469 said:


> I can't believe they cap you. I always thought it was only cell phone companies. In my area, none of them do. I can't imagine how fast a couple nights of "call of Duty", or need for speed would kill a data limit! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 ^^^This! Google Fiber coming your way to save the day.


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## NBPk402

JBrax said:


> ^^^This! Google Fiber coming your way to save the day.


I wish we were on the map for Google Fiber...we live 40 miles from Google in the Silicone Valley, and we are not included.


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## JBrax

ellisr63 said:


> I wish we were on the map for Google Fiber...we live 40 miles from Google in the Silicone Valley, and we are not included.


 Their choice of initial locations was a little odd to me. The expansion will continue and force competitors to raise their game. https://fiber.google.com/newcities/


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## Lumen

I've always wrestled with physical media vs. available space, and the media always won. It's just a priority of mine to be able to hold and admire packaging, artwork, and liner notes. Yet as my collection expands to fill all discretionary space, I yearn for a bigger and better mousetrap. Ripping to HD is one solution, but the startup complexities are compounded by cataloging and hardware/software maintenance issues I'm unwilling to endure, even though I'm PC-literate. 

I've had both horrid and excellent streaming experiences on Netflix, but know little of other options. If that's the best currently offered, I prefer to be labeled "old school" and stick to hardcopy media (even DVD's, which my player upscales quite nicely, thank you)! lddude:


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## J&D

Glad to hear I may not be the only one with internet bandwidth issues. We are a bit remote but luckily just close enough to at least get DSL into the neighborhood. Centurylink has done a pretty good job of incrementally upgrading the service over the last 15 years and I now have 25MB down and 2MB up. We can stream ok here but when the entire neighborhood is online the network cannot deliver full BW to everyone. No way I could scrap the dish for TV viewing. Streaming is just not reliable and fast enough to our home yet.


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## FargateOne

Physical media for me all the way for bothe movies and music.
I have used streaming once in the last 5 years !


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## willis7469

J&D said:


> Glad to hear I may not be the only one with internet bandwidth issues. We are a bit remote but luckily just close enough to at least get DSL into the neighborhood. Centurylink has done a pretty good job of incrementally upgrading the service over the last 15 years and I now have 25MB down and 2MB up. We can stream ok here but when the entire neighborhood is online the network cannot deliver full BW to everyone. No way I could scrap the dish for TV viewing. Streaming is just not reliable and fast enough to our home yet.



This was me too. Rural area, 15 miles to either city north or south. Our IP was clearwire.(shudder). The best they could offer was 1.5mb and many times when I'd speed test I was in the 700kb range. Satellite IP was not in my cards since we game online and latency is way too high. THEN, our locally owned IP got a grant to plow fiber in, and boom! Life is good! 


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## Savjac

Now this is a posting group that I can surely identify with. I love having the Blu-ray movies and there is at this time nothing that I feel keeps up with that belief. I do watch a goodly number of movies over streaming services mainly Netflix and Amazon however I have found that the Apple TV bests them all. The downside of course is that Apple TV charges for everything and Amazon charges for a good bit of the products we want to watch except for the prime offerings and Netflix doesn't really provide the new in the best of all it's my understanding that they are offering 4K downloads of which I have not yet seen. So this is quite a conundrum and that I really want to watch the discs. I do think that there will be a time like someone mentioned above will be able to download large files in way of movies store them on some sort of storage product and then be able to plant and anytime.


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## chashint

JBrax said:


> Their choice of initial locations was a little odd to me. The expansion will continue and force competitors to raise their game. https://fiber.google.com/newcities/


The deployment locations may have as much to do with the existing franchise rights other carriers have with the cities as anything else.


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## b bos37

If movie studio can sell soft copy of the media safely without being hacked, physical media would have died long ago.


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## Utopianemo

I'm about 70/30 Blu-Ray/Streaming, although most of the streaming is from my kids and wife. I watch mostly Blu-Rays. No data cap as far as I know. 

And I'm almost certain that Blockbuster and Hollywood did not literally bite any dust......


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## Defcon

I will agree with everyone else, physical media is the best and online streaming is a poor substitute at best.

IMO the problem is people don't care for high quality in audio or video anymore, its about convenience, short attention spans and complete lack of quality. Its why physical magazines died and the quality of journalism went way down, and in the same way the quality of movies these days is not really that good.


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## FargateOne

Defcon said:


> I will agree with everyone else, physical media is the best and online streaming is a poor substitute at best.
> 
> IMO the problem is people don't care for high quality in audio or video anymore, its about convenience, short attention spans and complete lack of quality. Its why physical magazines died and the quality of journalism went way down, and in the same way the quality of movies these days is not really that good.


Totally agree. :T


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## Talley

simple math:

lord of rings trilogy & hobbit trilogy both extended additions in 4K = 1TB worth of data in 4K true quality media (110Mbps)

so... for people like me who like to do mini trilogy marathons in a weekend.... data caps would be horrible in a months duration. I'm currently around 500gig/mo without major streaming... throw movies in their at 4K and man I'd be at some 2-3 TB worth of data.

Media > *


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## willis7469

Data caps are extortion. And I wave the number one at them all. 


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## Savjac

They are extortion. After thinking more about this, I think that physical media will stay in play for a very long time, mostly because of the math Talley mentioned. People are watching more and doing more online that will bring them closer to the cap long before the month is up. Therefore the truly HQ stuff will have to remain on disc or we will lose the HQ movies and music.


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