# You may just cry in shame



## Spuddy (Jan 2, 2010)

So I got some Snell E/IIs for $60 on Craigslist, the knowing that A) they had replacement woofers and B) one woofer was silent, but the tweeters, crossovers, and wiring were all original and in good shape.


Tis' a beautiful thing from the side!












Then I saw the replacement woofers... (bear in mind these speakers costed a grand new in 1984, equating to more than $2k if bought new today, and they are among the last great designs made by Peter Snell himself before he died)












That's right everyone, I currently own a pair of Snell E/IIs being driven by amazing tweeters through hand-tuned and perfected custom crossovers, with PYRAMID woofers (of all things!!!) hacked crudely into the same place that once housed well-made, literally irreplaceable Vifa woofers, undoubtedly thrown away by someone who didn't know a whole lot about refoaming :unbelievable::hissyfit:

And on that note, does anyone know what speakers I should get to fill the spot? All I've been able to find is that they're 8" and 4ohms, and the originals were Vifas that are now discontinued. I'd prefer not to break the bank, but these will likely be the best speakers I have ever heard if all goes well, so if it means a noticeable drop in quality to go with a good cheaper woofer, then I'll do what it takes to get the best replacement. Thanks in advance shackers!


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## Moonfly (Aug 1, 2008)

I know nothing off these, but I would start scouring the net for info on the original drivers, including possibly e-mailing vifa, and trying to find as close a match to the original driver as possible. If all goes well, you could end up with what might be essentially an upgraded vifa woofer over the original.


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## JerryLove (Dec 5, 2009)

I think there's a special hell reserved for people who take works of art and cram awful drivers into them. Good find (reminds me of my $200 Ohm Fs)


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## Theresa (Aug 23, 2010)

Check out Tymphany, SEAS, and ScanSpeak. Madisound may know what is the closest match. I've replaced/upgraded a driver in the past but never did anything as crude as that. I think Vifa was bought by Typmphany and Madisound carries their drivers. You may just need to change the padding resisters to adjust the crossover. Something to keep in mind is even the best drivers of ten years ago fair poorly in comparison with new ones. While Snell was a genius he had to work with what was available.


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## Spuddy (Jan 2, 2010)

Moonfly said:


> I know nothing off these, but I would start scouring the net for info on the original drivers, including possibly e-mailing vifa, and trying to find as close a match to the original driver as possible. If all goes well, you could end up with what might be essentially an upgraded vifa woofer over the original.


I've been looking online, but the problem is that the recommendations I've been able to find are all discontinued now; Emails have been sent though, and my hands are waiting closely by my wallet haha. I'm pretty sure the Vifa NEs are a close replacement, but at $130 a pop I really wanna make sure they're perfect first because that will turn my $60 find into a $300+ find. Granted, that's still a pretty good deal from what I can tell, but it's a lotta money for this poor chap :doh:


JerryLove said:


> I think there's a special hell reserved for people who take works of art and cram awful drivers into them. Good find (reminds me of my $200 Ohm Fs)


I've heard of that circle.. They have lifelike, room-filling screams playing all day through their "unbelievably small and elegant" Bose sound system!  Incidentally there's a circle in wife heaven with the same speakers, but it's just smoke and mirrors to keep the real stuff from being hairy-eyeballed by the nice ladies :innocent:

And $200 for Ohm F's? Nice one, woulda been a deal at 4x that price!



Theresa said:


> Check out Tymphany, SEAS, and ScanSpeak. Madisound may know what is the closest match. I've replaced/upgraded a driver in the past but never did anything as crude as that. I think Vifa was bought by Typmphany and Madisound carries their drivers. You may just need to change the padding resisters to adjust the crossover. Something to keep in mind is even the best drivers of ten years ago fair poorly in comparison with new ones. While Snell was a genius he had to work with what was available.


I've been looking at Vifa and SEAS, didn't know about Tympany and ScanSpeak though, I'm on it ASAP. And spot-on with Snell's genius-fueled perfectionism! I took out the Pyramids to at least give em the dignity (albeit still humbling) of running some 8" B&O drivers I have instead, and these Snell internals make my overbuilt Klipsch guts look like a cheap knockoff- The crossovers take up nearly a square foot of the back panel, the manifolds are well over an inch thick and supported with heavy Oak bracing, and the internal wiring could literally be used quite safely to power my washer and dryer. It's not even the scale that impresses me so much- it's the obvious love and care shown from the builders. They look entirely different from each other on the inside, each hand-tweaked to perfection by the man who ran the whole company.. I'm in awe!


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## Mike P. (Apr 6, 2007)

PYRAMID? Someone actually replaced the original woofers with PYRAMID? That is truly shameful!


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## Spuddy (Jan 2, 2010)

Mike P. said:


> PYRAMID? Someone actually replaced the original woofers with PYRAMID? That is truly shameful!


Not only that, they appear to have been installed brand new, so they could very well have been consciously purchased FOR these cabinets, and while the screws were hacked into place, everything else was done very skillfully.. They were soldered to the wiring _very_ cleanly, and the replacement (at least the electrical aspect) has the feel of being done by someone who really knew what they were doing.

I just don't know what to think anymore, it's such a paradoxical replacement!! It's a pair of speakers usually only owned by people who know what they have coupled with a skillful soldering job and new, purposeful replacements, but the drivers selected are JUNK. I'm gonna stop trying to wrap my head around it haha


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

What a bummer! I'm afraid that you will end up having to spend some money to get them back some of there origionality, what a waste.


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## Mike P. (Apr 6, 2007)

Although Pyramid isn't associated with quality, how do the speakers sound?


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## Spuddy (Jan 2, 2010)

Oh, it's definitely bad. Picture a speaker that reproduces every possible sound in the treble range alone being muddied-up by a 4x10 bass stack running the lead vocals in a jam session. Seriously, it's not even a woofer, it's a _sub_woofer(!)- It's bad enough that rather than unsoldering the wires right away, I instead broke the connecting spades right off the speaker due to it being .01% more convenient at the time :dunno:

Soon people, soon they shall live and play again


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## Spuddy (Jan 2, 2010)

On their way!










https://www.madisound.com/store/product_info.php?cPath=45_228_257&products_id=8771


Just ordered two Scan-Speak Discoveries at the recommendation of Madisound  The basket is a cm larger than OEM so I may have to slightly enlarge the hole, and I may need to tweak the crossovers slightly as well, but they should sound great, especially considering how well their doing with the only random 8" woofers I had in the house (from my B&O S45s) as is  On that note, these sound unbelievable with the exception of having random holes throughout the mid and bass- I can only imagine how they'll do with the right woofers 

More when they're in the boxes and playing!


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## Spuddy (Jan 2, 2010)

:hail::hail::hail: Peter Snell

Speakers are in.. The distance in quality between these and the second best speakers I've ever heard is just as far as the second best is from a science class transistor radio.. Can't really say much more than that :bigsmile:


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## bambino (Feb 21, 2010)

Thats awesome! Glad to hear you found a suitable replacement.:T


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## smurphy522 (Sep 21, 2010)

wow Pyramid as replacements huh . Glad you were able and willing to find a worthy replacement.

The previous owner should get 16 lashes (1 lash for each inch of pyramid speaker) from some 10 gauge speaker wire!


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## hearingspecialist (Mar 15, 2010)

Check out some of the Dayton Reference drivers as well as their classic lines. Affordable, wife friendly, and made by Tang Band :T


pyramid (I don't even want to capitalize the "p")


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## tesseract (Aug 9, 2010)

hearingspecialist said:


> pyramid (I don't even want to capitalize the "p")


Heh, heh... that's funny. :R

Cool speakers, Spuddy. Lots of respect for the late Peter Snell.


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