# How do I know?



## rpearson (Jul 9, 2013)

Does anyone know the ohm rating for the woofer found in B&W's AWS2000?


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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

rpearson said:


> Does anyone know the ohm rating for the woofer found in B&W's AWS2000?


Isn't this a powered sub?


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## rpearson (Jul 9, 2013)

ellisr63 said:


> Isn't this a powered sub?


yes i am considering driver replacement and i am being told to replace it with a woofer with the same as factory.


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## NBPk402 (Feb 21, 2012)

rpearson said:


> yes i am considering driver replacement and i am being told to replace it with a woofer with the same as factory.


Oh... Have you tried calling the Manufacturer, or maybe a local repair shop that really knows their stuff? If you put in a speaker that is not the same as the factory did I think you might get into having to tune it.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

You would need to replace it with the same b&w driver as any other driver will have different characteristics and won't preform well in that box.


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## fmw (Aug 11, 2013)

The nominal impedance isn't the main issue. More important are the Thiele-Small figures around which the enclosure was designed. So you don't want to put a different driver in a ported box. The box will not be tuned to the new driver.

Two things you might do. One is to seal the ports and you can then get away with most drivers of the same size. The problem here is that you will need more power so the stock amp may be inadequate to drive a sealed unit. I drive my 15" sealed unit with 350 watts and it is more than adequate. I would guess 200 watts would drive most 12" sealed units without issue.

The second is to build yourself a DIY sub from a driver and a flat pack designed for the driver. The flat packs are all precision cut. You just glue the pieces together to make an enclosure. You just need to cut a hole in the back of the box to mount the amp. The results are likely to perform significantly better than your B&W sub did. My B&W A6 has been relegated to the bedroom system after I replaced it with my DIY subwoofer.

It might be possible to luck out and find a driver that is happy in the size enclosure you have. Then you would just need to recalculate the proper port dimensions and make a new port to tune the system properly.


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## rpearson (Jul 9, 2013)

fmw said:


> The nominal impedance isn't the main issue. More important are the Thiele-Small figures around which the enclosure was designed. So you don't want to put a different driver in a ported box. The box will not be tuned to the new driver.
> 
> Two things you might do. One is to seal the ports and you can then get away with most drivers of the same size. The problem here is that you will need more power so the stock amp may be inadequate to drive a sealed unit. I drive my 15" sealed unit with 350 watts and it is more than adequate. I would guess 200 watts would drive most 12" sealed units without issue.
> 
> ...


I like the make it work approach but only without performance compromise. I was able to confirm the fact that it is the driver and not the amp that is faulty. How would one go about making sure the box is properly modified to accommodate the new Woofer? I was leaning towards the Dayton Reference 12" offering but am open for suggestions.

I am not completely against new box and woofer but I would like to keep the Amp as it is supposed to be a well made offering. I found a replacement Amp and Driver and the Amp is $1399.00 and the driver is $700.00. I am told that a better amp would be hard to find but that most high quality after market woofers are better than the OEM. 
Thanks for the input.


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

Well, I don't know if I would go so far as to say the B&W driver is not a high quality part.
The B&W sub is quite small dimensionally and regardless of the driver you put in the box that will be hard to overcome as far as frequency extension and SPL capabilities are concerned.
The amplifier will also be tuned specifically for the box and the driver so you may not get lower frequency extension with it by putting it in a larger box with a 12" driver.
I am not saying it won't work but there's more to building a successful subwoofer than just throwing parts together and hoping for the best.
There are some good reasons that the number of subwoofers that can actually play 20Hz with meaningful SPL are relatively few and far between.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

chashint said:


> There are some good reasons that the number of subwoofers that can actually play 20Hz with meaningful SPL are relatively few and far between.


And even fewer that are sealed that can play that low.


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## rpearson (Jul 9, 2013)

chashint said:


> Well, I don't know if I would go so far as to say the B&W driver is not a high quality part.
> The B&W sub is quite small dimensionally and regardless of the driver you put in the box that will be hard to overcome as far as frequency extension and SPL capabilities are concerned.
> The amplifier will also be tuned specifically for the box and the driver so you may not get lower frequency extension with it by putting it in a larger box with a 12" driver.
> I am not saying it won't work but there's more to building a successful subwoofer than just throwing parts together and hoping for the best.
> There are some good reasons that the number of subwoofers that can actually play 20Hz with meaningful SPL are relatively few and far between.


All good but back to my question, Is there software etc.. that is used to configure the different caraturestic of a sub? Seem like one would have cross reference to compatable drivers etc. You say the sub is quite small in regards to the drivers size? If this is true I would hate to see one in an ideal enclosure. This thing would make a good end table and is much larger and heaver than most others I've ever seen. Not to pretend that size matters or anything. LOL May be I should just stick to plan A and have the driver repaired. 
Thanks for the input, REP


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## fmw (Aug 11, 2013)

chashint said:


> There are some good reasons that the number of subwoofers that can actually play 20Hz with meaningful SPL are relatively few and far between.


Which begs the question how much content do you have that requires 20 hz at a meaningful SPL? 20hz isn't even audible. In my view, 30hz is enough for almost everything available.


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## tonyvdb (Sep 5, 2007)

fmw said:


> Which begs the question how much content do you have that requires 20 hz at a meaningful SPL? 20hz isn't even audible. In my view, 30hz is enough for almost everything available.


I can think of many many many things that go deeper in movie soundtracks. Most movies have information down to 15hz and makes a great difference if your sub can reproduce it at at least 75hz music I agree not much meaningful below 30hz but with today's uncompressed audio on movies 20hz is an ideal level to reach with SPL of at least 90db

Here is an older list of many many movies with deep bass well below 20hz
http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/databass-movies-deep-bass-dmdb/


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## fmw (Aug 11, 2013)

tonyvdb said:


> I can think of many many many things that go deeper in movie soundtracks. Most movies have information down to 15hz and makes a great difference if your sub can reproduce it at at least 75hz music I agree not much meaningful below 30hz but with today's uncompressed audio on movies 20hz is an ideal level to reach with SPL of at least 90db
> 
> Here is an older list of many many movies with deep bass well below 20hz
> http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/databass-movies-deep-bass-dmdb/


Since those low frequencies are inaudible the best you will do is feel them. Regular movie LFE is already startling in most movies and sensationally easy to feel. I don't think going below 30hz is an issue for me. I think more important than how low the sub will go is how much air it will move. A larger driver with good Xmax is the key for me.


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

rpearson said:


> All good but back to my question, Is there software etc.. that is used to configure the different caraturestic of a sub? Seem like one would have cross reference to compatable drivers etc. You say the sub is quite small in regards to the drivers size? If this is true I would hate to see one in an ideal enclosure. This thing would make a good end table and is much larger and heaver than most others I've ever seen. Not to pretend that size matters or anything. LOL May be I should just stick to plan A and have the driver repaired.
> Thanks for the input, REP


There is software but I do not know what it is.
I did not know B&W made subs that are end table size.
All of their subs I have seen are pretty decorator friendly and for the size perform pretty good.
I also thought B&W subs were sealed subs.
Parts Express probably has recommended box dimensions and port tube diameter/lengths for all of the Dayton drivers.
You may find a direct drop in replacement.
If that's the case you will get out of this for very few $$.


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

Did not mean to start a subwoofer frequency debate, lets not bog this thread down with it.
But if the merits (or lack of) of 20Hz performance is something y'all want to discuss someone start a new thread and I will play.


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## rpearson (Jul 9, 2013)

chashint said:


> There is software but I do not know what it is.
> I did not know B&W made subs that are end table size.
> All of their subs I have seen are pretty decorator friendly and for the size perform pretty good.
> I also thought B&W subs were sealed subs.
> ...


Yea, I guess I should have mentioned that my gear was 15 years old. My N805 still can make a grown man cry. So inside area and vent tube info and I have a chance. I'll give it a try.


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## tesseract (Aug 9, 2010)

rpearson - Have you priced a B&W replacement driver? That might be the most economical solution, and we already know it will work with the box and amp.

15 years out of that sub is a pretty good run. I do wonder how much life the amp has left in it.


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

tesseract said:


> 15 years out of that sub is a pretty good run. I do wonder how much life the amp has left in it.


Good point.


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## rpearson (Jul 9, 2013)

tesseract said:


> rpearson - Have you priced a B&W replacement driver? That might be the most economical solution, and we already know it will work with the box and amp.
> 
> 15 years out of that sub is a pretty good run. I do wonder how much life the amp has left in it.


You might need to clarify this one, I had know idea that there was a life to consider that is unless we are talking tube type amps. Or perhaps you are referring to the life of capacitors of which are one of the cheaper components to have to contend with. While on the subject I have located a factory new replacement woofer for my ASW2000.
Thanks for all your input.
REP


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

Good find on the driver, that really is the best replacement part.
Do you know what made the original driver fail?

While I agreed that the amp may have limited life left, if the new driver is not overly expensive I would probably go ahead and just replace it.
The caps are usually the components that fail strictly due to old age.


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## rpearson (Jul 9, 2013)

chashint said:


> Good find on the driver, that really is the best replacement part.
> Do you know what made the original driver fail?
> 
> While I agreed that the amp may have limited life left, if the new driver is not overly expensive I would probably go ahead and just replace it.
> The caps are usually the components that fail strictly due to old age.


Right you are; further good luck is that I have talked the B&W and am shipping my amp off to them for full service and replacement of all consonants that might age or wear. 
Thanks for your help.


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## chashint (Jan 12, 2011)

Very cool.
You will have a brand new subwoofer.
My brother recently refurburished a pair of speakers he bought in 1987 and he is tickled pink.


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## rpearson (Jul 9, 2013)

chashint said:


> Very cool.
> You will have a brand new subwoofer.
> My brother recently refurburished a pair of speakers he bought in 1987 and he is tickled pink.


Yeah, I really could not stay married and spend enough to afford a new sub with all the component upgrades of late so I am feeling pretty good about it. The ASW2000 hits a good lick when it is at its full ability. I will be looking for a good smaller tighter sub before long to fill the gap between my N805's and the ASW2000 though.


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