# No center choice to match Behringer 2030p?



## alewisdvm (Jul 8, 2010)

Hello, 
With everyone's assistance, I was narrowing down speaker choices to:
Behringer 2030p, CBM-170's, Infinity Primus P162.

I was just about to go with the Behringer's but read some other posts (not in this forum), indicating that some modifications needed to be made to them to prevent motion, etc...That was back in'08. Is that still a problem for these speakers?

Also, they offer no center channel? I really want a center to go with whatever I get?


----------



## DanTheMan (Oct 12, 2009)

Are you sure about the 2030? the 2031 is still cheap and has more bass and more output.


----------



## Guest (Jul 10, 2010)

Motion? 

Just use a single behringer as a center.


----------



## alewisdvm (Jul 8, 2010)

Oops..No, I do mean the 2031p. Currently my subwoofer may be insufficient, so would rather have the extra low end. 

What do I do about the center?

Also, can I run the JBL PS120 sub and another sub together? If so, how. Does the Onkyo 807 have 2 plug ins?


----------



## Guest (Jul 10, 2010)

DanTheMan said:


> Are you sure about the 2030? the 2031 is still cheap and has more bass and more output.


For stereo music I would choose the 3031 over the 2030, but it more bass needed with a 80hz AVR crossover to the sub?


----------



## alewisdvm (Jul 8, 2010)

Not for much music. Mostly for HT where we watch movies. Advice on 2 subs? What to do about a matching center?


----------



## Guest (Jul 10, 2010)

Their is no "matching" center, but a center doesn't need to be a MTM configuration. A TM bookshelf works really well. The downside, doesn't look as nice around a TV.

Fits under a projector screen just fine. :bigsmile:


----------



## alewisdvm (Jul 8, 2010)

Well, then I guess I may have to go with the CBM 170s. Quite a few posts on here were pretty adamant about matching L,C,R


----------



## DanTheMan (Oct 12, 2009)

Generic, do you know where there are measurements posted on the 3031. I gotta admit after seeing what its cheaper version can do, I'm curious. I think they only make an active version though.

Dan


----------



## DanTheMan (Oct 12, 2009)

For strictly HT, maybe the Primus as they'll have the most output and their polars IOW imaging should also be good. You could easily upgrade their internals to match the quality of the Behringers at a later date.


----------



## Guest (Jul 10, 2010)

DanTheMan said:


> Generic, do you know where there are measurements posted on the 3031. I gotta admit after seeing what its cheaper version can do, I'm curious. I think they only make an active version though.
> 
> Dan


I'm not sure off hand where the posted measurements are, but the 3030p looks really flat. I would expect the same thing for the 3031.

They do have a passive version, but it seems to be a 4ohm speaker. Not a problem if you have a amp that can support that, but a lot of AVRs don't.

http://www.amazon.com/Behringer-B20...?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1278765333&sr=8-22

To get full specs, look at the documentation. http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/B2031P.aspx I don't know why, but they seamed to have made the 3030p 8ohm and the 3031p 4ohm. The 3030p should work fine for HT with a 80hz active crossover and a sub.


----------



## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

The 2030p's are the correct choice for a system with a subwoofer. You can use a single behringer 2030p as a center either vertically or on it's side if necessary. I'd figure out a way to make the 2030p's work since it's least expensive option and there is already a list of mods to make them hifi quality if you are so inclined. The Ascends and Primus don't offer a step up in performance only a step up in aesthetics. The quickest mod to improve any of these speakers would be to remove the lining and replace it with 2" thick mineral wool. 

The 2030p's have been measured and verified to be good speakers by speaker expert.(Chris) Their performance has been verified further by many happy customers.


----------



## ironglen (Mar 4, 2009)

As far as the LCR conundrum, just use a matching bookshelf of your choice-that's what I've done. If it's a decent set, you won't have any concerns with the C. In fact, it will *perfectly* match your LR in sound. Cheapest reputable place I saw them in the past was b&h photo...

On the dual subs, just use a y-splitter, or as I did, a solid splitter. If it's a long run to the amp, get a shielded rca cable at the same time to reduce noise potential. The splitter may be 5-10 bucks, easy connect, and you're good to go :T


----------



## alewisdvm (Jul 8, 2010)

Well,
The pic of the back of an 807 shows to pre-outs for subs. So, I am assuming I don't have to split?

Ironglen:
I wasn't sure what you meant by just using a matching bookshelf of my choice.
I really didn't want to just lay a behringer on its side to be the center, and that product has no matching center.

That is why I was considering going with the CBM-170's instead?


----------



## DanTheMan (Oct 12, 2009)

the 303X series does not have passive versions according to Behringer. The 2030P (8ohm)and 2031P(4ohm) have been measured, both are great sounding, the larger version just has more output and bass for a little more money. I got mine for $152 shipped. Best speaker I've ever heard or measured. Sad but true, they are easily the cheapest I've ever owned. Disgusting really. The 2030Ps should sound similar and I think they can be had for under $130. The Primus can be had for $164 and easy to drive bass similar to the 2030, but more output capability.

Dan


----------



## Kal Rubinson (Aug 3, 2006)

alewisdvm said:


> What do I do about the center?


The ideal center is whatever you are using for L/R.


----------



## eugovector (Sep 4, 2006)

Yes, if you are okay with the aesthetics of laying a 2030p on it's side, go with that. I'd just place it so the tweeter is dead center as those are going to be the most directional frequencies.


----------



## ironglen (Mar 4, 2009)

I just mounted my bookshelf vertically beneath my tv: it just looks different than the 'typical' center. Sounds great, and I used 80 cent angle brackets on the top and bottom to mount it there. Met WAF.


----------



## DanTheMan (Oct 12, 2009)

Here's some vertical polars on my personal pair of B2031Ps. I measured both from the "factory matched pair" and gotta say they are for all intents and purposes identical.
Toward the woofer, on axis, 11.25 degrees off axis, and 22.5 degrees off axis:








Toward the tweeter, on axis, then 11.25, 22.5, 33.75, and 45 degrees off axis:









So basically you want the center of the 2 drivers a bit below ear height of the tweeter is mounted on top, or a bit above ear height if the tweeter mounted in the bottom. I have mine below with the tweeter on top.

This vertical polar plot shows these to be an excellent center channel b/c they can be mounted with the tweeter on top beneath the TV and get the best part of the response right to your ear.

Dan


----------



## needspeed52 (Aug 2, 2008)

lsiberian said:


> The 2030p's are the correct choice for a system with a subwoofer. You can use a single behringer 2030p as a center either vertically or on it's side if necessary. I'd figure out a way to make the 2030p's work since it's least expensive option and there is already a list of mods to make them hifi quality if you are so inclined. The Ascends and Primus don't offer a step up in performance only a step up in aesthetics. The quickest mod to improve any of these speakers would be to remove the lining and replace it with 2" thick mineral wool.
> 
> The 2030p's have been measured and verified to be good speakers by speaker expert.(Chris) Their performance has been verified further by many happy customers.


Isiberian, where can I get the 2" rock wool? Very interested in finding this stuff. Thanks my friend.
Jeff


----------



## needspeed52 (Aug 2, 2008)

alewisdvm said:


> Well,
> The pic of the back of an 807 shows to pre-outs for subs. So, I am assuming I don't have to split?
> 
> Ironglen:
> ...


I would just use 3 2030p's on your front setup, angle the center speaker with the tweeter fireing up to ear level, I recommend keeping the center channel tweeter 18-24 inches below or above your mains tweeters, hope this helps.


----------



## eugovector (Sep 4, 2006)

Actually, you should have all the tweeters as close to earlevel, and each other, as possible. If that means 18 inches, so be it, but you should get them closer if possible without setting you TV too high or low for comfortable viewing.


----------



## Guest (Jul 15, 2010)

Ideally, the center channel should be in the middle of the screen. Proper placement of the center channel is the conundrum that floods the market with horizontal MTM center channels.

If it were me, I would probably mount a flat panel TV just a little higher and put the speakers below it. That is how I want to set up my projection screen anyway.

A 2030p could be set on its side above or below (I think dolby labs recommends below) and getting heavy duty speaker brackets and angling the speakers should work too if you want to go above the TV. IMO, having the center just a little off from the L/R doesn't ruin the sound. With a TV in the way, you kind of have to decide if you want to optimize the picture or the sound. Something needs to be sacrificed just a tad. Perfect screen placement, or perfect speaker placement.


----------



## needspeed52 (Aug 2, 2008)

Generic said:


> Ideally, the center channel should be in the middle of the screen. Proper placement of the center channel is the conundrum that floods the market with horizontal MTM center channels.
> 
> If it were me, I would probably mount a flat panel TV just a little higher and put the speakers below it. That is how I want to set up my projection screen anyway.
> 
> A 2030p could be set on its side above or below (I think dolby labs recommends below) and getting heavy duty speaker brackets and angling the speakers should work too if you want to go above the TV. IMO, having the center just a little off from the L/R doesn't ruin the sound. With a TV in the way, you kind of have to decide if you want to optimize the picture or the sound. Something needs to be sacrificed just a tad. Perfect screen placement, or perfect speaker placement.


I agree Generic, I use a conventional Tweeter-Mid speaker for the center, I have located it above and below the TV with very good results, I have the center above my TV now and inverted it with the tweeter on the bottom angled at my listening spot and also found out it does not have to be centered in relation to TV. As long as I keep the center tweeter within 18" of the mains tweeters and somewhat behind them, it seems to blend well with the mains, I have the mains out into the room so that TV and rack are behind the mains and this somewhat eliminates having components in the space between the L&R speakers. Idealy I'd like to mount TV on the wall and move the entertainment rack on either the left or right wall. Listening to music I place a blanket over the TV and this seems to help with early reflection problems. Again as you said there is a trade off or sacrifice. Thanks for listening.
Jeff


----------



## DanTheMan (Oct 12, 2009)

NeedSpeed52, just noticed where you are from. Next time you are in Beaver, go to Mario's and get some pizza or spaghetti(all homemade noodles, breads and sauces and Pizzas are wood fired in an oven imported from Italy). Best Italian food I recall ever eating and great people.

The vertical polars will tell you what height/angle you should position your speakers for optimal results. You can almost bet that these little studio monitors will have a response made to minimize reflections from a mixing board--any competent design will. IOW tilted toward the tweeter. That's good news for us HT people as they should be able to be placed under a TV in a typical orientation.

Dan


----------



## lsiberian (Mar 24, 2009)

I think what hasn't been mentioned is the fact that the Behringer has exceptional off-axis response for the tweeters. Below the TV you probably don't need to angle it at all. Above it I'd flip it over and angle it with a bracket from monoprice.com. The center channel is the bane of our existence as audiophiles


----------



## DanTheMan (Oct 12, 2009)

+1 on that Isiberian.


----------



## needspeed52 (Aug 2, 2008)

DanTheMan said:


> NeedSpeed52, just noticed where you are from. Next time you are in Beaver, go to Mario's and get some pizza or spaghetti(all homemade noodles, breads and sauces and Pizzas are wood fired in an oven imported from Italy). Best Italian food I recall ever eating and great people.
> 
> The vertical polars will tell you what height/angle you should position your speakers for optimal results. You can almost bet that these little studio monitors will have a response made to minimize reflections from a mixing board--any competent design will. IOW tilted toward the tweeter. That's good news for us HT people as they should be able to be placed under a TV in a typical orientation.
> 
> Dan


Hey DanTheMan my man, how are you? How do you know about Mario's being from CA. I happen to be of Italian heritage and make my own sauces, noodles and meatballs. I never eat Italian food out because I was raised not to and just ate what we made. I see that place all the time and always blew it off as just another Italian knock off, but from your experience and good taste, I'm going to try it out, matter of fact I just told my wife about what you said and she wants to go now. So, thanks my friend for the heads up. I'll let you know how it turned out.
Best regards, Jeff


----------



## DanTheMan (Oct 12, 2009)

Hey Jeff! I'm well. You? 

I grew up in your neighborhood and actually I'll be back there in a few days. Even lived in Beaver for a few years. I'll stop by Mario's for sure in a couple days. Having eaten in many Italian homes, this is the only restaurant I'd recommend. Hopefully you go on a night that Mario is working. He's just better than any of the hired help.

Mario was born and raised in Italy. He's a good guy and a great cook. He'll tell you that his food is just OK, but he's too modest. He says his Grandma was much better than he is and that in Italy you can easily do better than what he's serving. I'm certainly hoping to find out someday! It's not expensive at all and quality is top notch--even the Gelato is better than any other I've tried. He does get that from somewhere else though. Last time I was home I didn't have time to go and I'm still kick myself in the butt for it. The Italian food out here doesn't compare no matter the cost. I won't say it'll be better than homemade, but it is definitely good stuff and a great environment. Now I'm hungry. He always let my BMOB and at night would share his personal supply of Peroni with me. We'd clown around while he cleaned up. He's truly an outstanding person--very hospitable as have been all of my Italian friends and their families. Since eating there and many Italian homes in your neck of the woods, I've taken to making my own as well, but I haven't equalled his or many others' Grandmas. I NEED good food, and nothing quite satisfies like great Italian food as I'm sure you know. I do mean nothing--but don't tell my Grandma. :bigsmile:

Take care,

Dan


----------

